COLD START: Big Cam Cummins-Swapped 935 Versatile Tractor
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- Опубликовано: 30 июл 2024
- Filthy Rich cold starts his first Cummins conversion, a 935 Versatile with a 14L 850 Big Cam. It's the end of winter, so we're starting it up for the first time in 5 months. More Tractor Videos: • Tractor Vids
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We are putting a 855 into a 900 versatile now. After a bunch of measuring of the tractor and measuring a neighbors 850 we have found the frame of the 6 cylinder tractors are the same as the V-8 tractors with the difference being the placement of the mounts. I will have videos on the project by mid summer.
We have a 855 in our 895 versatile and it has around 12000 hours on it with no issues
thats what i thought that they were the same. i have a 875 and 850 with 855 in it. he just made way more work out of the project
Rig up a chain sprocket system to run the fan that's what I do to save fan belts
That's a good idea. The chain could be pretty light too.
I haven't gone through a single chain
Since you have so much battery storage an electric fan would be ideal.
@@bobbyharvill4225 a mechanical one is just easier. Starts spinning with the engine and stops with it.
@@bobbyharvill4225 There is a reason why 3/4 ton and up pickup trucks with diesel engines use a fluid-clutched or direct drive radiator fan. An electric fan puts too much of a strain on the electrical system to eliminate all that heat, but a direct drive fan can rob 3-4 horsepower for cooling purposes without straining anything.
My grandpa used to say that grease paid for that car always remember him saying that and laughing about it.
nice job. we did similar thing to a massey with the 903 over twenty years ago , put in a 12.7 detroit, runs cool,lots of power and cheap on fuel
12.7 Detroit S60 is an EXCELLENT motor.
The farm I grew up on did the same swap. 903 V8 to 855 inline 6 with a frame extension. It was a 935 Versatile too I believe.
Nice!
Seeing inside that tractor's cab really took me back. I was in love with our 935 as a kid. It seemed ridiculously huge. I even got to try my hand with the 10 furrow plow behind it when I was about 9 or so. Thanks for the trip down memory lane!
@@DEBOSSGARAGE what is the horsepower of this engine??
@@giwrgoskalfountzos5972 He said it went from around 180 to high 200 horsepower
That looks completely OE! True engineering at it's best, if I didnt know better I'd almost think it came from the factory like that. Very impressive!
That's amazing work Rich!! On a massive scale when compared to cars and pickups I work on.
Almost done putting a 855 in a 900 Versatile. Same frame as a 850, right fit still no need to stretch it.
Our Versatile, 1976 has a 850 Cummins i6, 13000+ hours. I think it had an in frame once, wicked awesome tractor we still use it as our main tractor to farm 1800 acres!
CANADIAN :}
is that an Oldsmobile steering wheel? lol good ol saginaw steering columns they used them in literally everything.
they came that way. that is just a gm steering column.
big benefits for putting in that 6 cylinder, fuel use and reliability wise. i lived through the era v8's in big tractors. we were surrounded by 4wd John Deeres in the 80's and its too bad because the only way to get big HP during those years was from the v8 in the 8850. nice work.
You can go as fast as you can stay in the seat.😂😂😂😂 that killed me
You did a great great job on that one!!
It looks stock and reliable!
More awesome work!! 4 years later still runs great!!
Reminds me of our 895 versatile with the 855 Cummins. Love that thing
WOW - you look like you're 12. Interesting to watch this 7 years later.
Nice work Rich! I Love it! Thank you for sharing these videos!!!
That Turbo housing could use a turbo blanket.
the whole point of a turbo blanket is to not heat up the engine bay as much as possible but when there is no engine bay a turbo blanket is pointless.
the whole point of a turbo blanket is to not heat up the engine bay as much as possible but when there is no engine bay a turbo blanket is pointless.
the whole point of a turbo blanket is to not heat up the engine bay as much as possible but when there is no engine bay a turbo blanket is pointless.
@@phalanx3803 Is there an echo in here?
@@3Sphere no it's some stupid glitch with RUclips and I can't delete them either. It only happens every now it doesn't happen on mobile
Like Yogi said, it's a Cummins 903 V-8. A really good engine, although a little bit hungry for the day. The trouble the truckers had with them was that the average (Untrained) mechanic turned them down to 2100 rpm like the six cylinder engines instead of around 3400 rpm like Yogi indicated. A 300hp - 450hp 903 engine turned down to 2100 rpm IS A DOG like Dalekrueger indicated. The 903 Cummins V-8, 3408 Cat V-8 and the Mack V-8 all more or less were shut down in the states due to fuel mileage issues and the advances of the inline 6 engines, so the major American truck dealers all standardized their frame width to take the inline 6 engines and were too narrow for the V-8's after about 1974. In the late 1990's or early 2000's the US Military used 903's in their Armored Personnel Carriers running between 500hp and 600hp.
Ole'man Sailor you can not get a 450 hp 903 I think 375 or so was the max rating unless you play with pump
Ole'man Sailor. Your an Aussie aren’t u
Vt9-oh-nothing.
USNavy
The V903 is currently produced at 675 HP. It's been in production since the 60's starting with 295 HP naturally aspirated. It's a beast of an engine currently in use by the U.S. Army, Marine corps, and the U.S. Coast Guard.
How have they cranked out this good of videos for 5yrs now with under a half mil subscribers?
I'm thinking on doing this on a mass 4 wheel drive that has a 903 in it.
yes, stay away from a low flow.
looks good, i wouldn't have noticed it wasnt made that way.
Tough oldie! Greetings from Portugal.
Luís Nunes Thanks! My wife and I went to Portugal a few years back. Beautiful country with some of the most hospitable people I have ever met. My uncle just moved there from the Netherlands last year and I hope to visit him soon!
Versatiles are excellent tractors. A local farmer had a 900 go over 80,000hrs. Just kept rebuilding the motor. I think he only swapped the transmission once.
GREAT! This is the kinda stuff, me n me boys r dealin with for bout 25 years now👍 Exept we have to deal with our beloved TÜV too 😂😂 Greetz from Krautland!
Just a few thoughts. The old engine was a 903 cummins. And they were rated at anywhere from 300 to 360 hp. They were actually a really solid motor but as he said , parts are hard to find anymore.
As of 2021, Aftermarket parts are still available for the Cummins V & VT903 , not plentiful but still available. The VT903 is still used in some older Military troop transport & airport firefighting vehicles . Turning that screw on the pump does NOT increase HP, it only alters 'throttle "leakage" You must change the fuel "button" INSIDE the pump to increase HP. Ive done the same conversion on a 950 Versatile & did NOT cut the frame, only altered the engine mounting ears but as you mentioned it becomes a turtle on the road. More common swap was a C series Cummins 8.3 , to replace either V504 & V555 used is Versatile 500 & 555 models
What an absolute tank
You ought to team up with Welker Farms to help them find a trans for their Versatile tractor. They bought it for the engine after the trans blew up... Used the engine in a Big Bud...
I had a 9-0-Nothing in a cabover Freightliner.Cool video.
We used to run Ag Chem 2505 Terra Gators with the 903 Cummins . Every one that let go got the same conversion. The 903 just became a money pit to rebuild when operators wouldn't even pull the stick or climb their obese asses up and open the Rad cap. I believe some of my hearing loss comes from running the old pigs. Our 903's all had straight pipes on them. The thud of each TDC let out a rap unlike any other engine I have heard. The comments below are right on the money. They could take a shitload or RPM's compared to the inline oil burners. The Terra Gators with 903's had a hand governor next to the seat, any mechanical governors on the engines were not an option if I remember right. Great Video , thanks again gear head.
Wow...amazing work.
I hear the best thing to do is get rid of the low flow cooling system.
I know the 500 versatile came with a cummins diesel as well. There is a 500 sitting and rotting up the road from me, sad to see....
Erated78 all did except the first few I believe
I used a 1981 950 with a 903 in it and also run several 875 with inline 6's and never realized had different length front ends, also a 945. they were good tractors.
timbertrans the Versys were all the same. Don't know why guys think they have to stretch the frame to install an 855.
100% correct @@thevox1075!! all same frame geometry, different length output driveshaft
Nice job guys. U saved an old girl!!!!
How does this guy not have a million or my subscribers?
You Kinzie Repowerd it basicly. The picture for my profile is my Grandpas 8650 Kinzie Repowered with an 855 Big Cam Cummins. Basicly the same story. Real cool to see!
Would like to see more videos of these kind of conversions as well :)
I did this swap before we started the channel
Well that went well!
Oh, that sounds nice.
That motor you can put springs and button in the back off the pump to turn up.
You should talk to Welker farms about their Versatile. Be a neat project to do.
You can clean the grease off of the seat with brake clean and she will be happy again
nice tractor and job Kudos
Trun fule up roll cole this is awsome tractor
Nice work. 903 Cummins were weak especially on hills. Some liked them but not if they knew anything about the 855 6 banger. You made a pos into a pulling beast
"You mean to tell me a low flow coolant system wasn't a good idea?!" - a college educated diesel engineer.
They actually worked fine...
alna1287.... don't take Everything he says as "gospel truth". It seems these days, that anyone who has a "YT Channel", seems to think that, that makes them a the final word "expert" on whatever their base subject is for the existence of their channel. I'm certainly Not saying he (or any other "youtuber") is wrong on Everything.... just that not necessarily everything they say, should be taken as the final word regarding truly expert advice.... such as you would from, say... a 4 year degree'd mechanical engineer involved in Diesel or gasoline engine R&D work, or fluid engineering involved with (ie:) cooling systems of various types and configurations.
Myself... I have a 4 year degree in Diesel Engine Design & Theory, specializing in 2 cycle design... graduating in 1967... and nothing has really changed since then, with the exception overly complicated & computerized fuel control systems, along with equally overburdened exhaust "management" systems which are mandated and enforced by people who would be hard-pressed to change the spark plug in a lawn mower engine.
Of course, their ultimate goal... beginning with their new "2nd round" of emissions mandates beginning with the 2021 model year engines.... is to completely rid the world of internal combustion engines altogether, at least as far as the smaller "land based" engines are concerned.... after their proclaimed "Final Phase - Tier 4 Regulations" would be, just that... the "Final Phase".... Pathological Liars, at best, not to mention Hypocrites... considering that Detroit Diesel is Still, to this day - manufacturing the 2 cycle 6V53TA, 6V92T/TA and the 8V92T/TA engines for US (and other countries) Military use.... apparently, their own mandated diesel emission laws do not apply when it comes to government use.
The issue mechanics have with engineers, is that you see the beginning. We see the end results. On paper and computers, it makes sense and it "should" work. We see them fail in the field and can tell you with hands on experience that they absolutely don't work. I can tell you any trucker that drove a low flow will have complaints because I have talked to many. I fix their trucks and ask questions. I can tell you that this farmer has complaints. I can tell you that low flow engines were not around for many years because the low flow is a poor system. You can have as many degrees behind your name as you want. Experience is the best teacher. In my experience of building this tractor, using a low flow engine was a bad idea. You show me dirt under your fingernails and it will mean more than any ring.
@@DEBOSSGARAGE SEMPAI NOTICED ME!!
Yeah, I feel you man--pretty much exactly the point I was attempting to make. Love the channel!
@@DEBOSSGARAGE thank you so much for your comment on the subject, nothing can replace real experience.
There was a company my brother and I worked for dirt construction, and they had a 621 scraper that had a some sort of a Detroit diesel from a semi I forget wtf it was it would self load it wasn’t even a twin engine It hauled serious ass in our case dirt lol but ya this is cool
the 935 had the VT903 AKA nineonothin Cummins, truckers said you drove one like you hated it
When I worked at Cummins we called the VT903 the drivers dream and the mechanics nightmare. Great engines unless you had to work on it.
Rich did the low flow radiator come off the concrete truck too or was it original to the tractor, never heard of a low flow radiator before today.
could you convert from low flow to non? course coolant hoses might be an issue amongst other things.
It's up in noellville Ontario now. I actually run it for someone with a plow and cultivator on it
Hows it holding up? Still overheating?
@@DEBOSSGARAGE it was when we first got it then our mechanic rerouted some hoses from the top of the radiator and into the filter block it seems ok after that. It starts hard but that's mostly because of bad battery's but once it runs it's strong
@@benjaminnoordam7707 love that the swap worked out.
That was crying out for a Detroit Diesel :D
I never realised that 935's came with a V8 at all......... i wonder if that was a north America model only? or just an early one? my family still has one on the farm down here in Australia, that one is an inline six (330HP turbo Cummins with the 360HP "upgrade" that they all got back in the day) it hasn't been the main tractor for many years now but it still earn it's keep and other than the newer Case being more comfortable and a bit quieter they are essentially the same thing in terms of what it can pull and the operating costs. Great tractor, absolute mountain of torque even at idle, just goes and goes and goes.....
The cockies across the road from us in West Aust had a 935 Versatile with a 903 V8 cummins. It went really well as I recall. They added a 3408 powered John Deere pivot steer later, but kept the Versatile.
Why couldn't you just use a Case IH or NH coolant system off a tractor of the same time period as the engine? Also from what little I know there is an Ag cooling system and a truck application for that era too I think...
Hey take a look at Welker farms 1150 versatile maybe you could help them.
steering wheel looks like the one in my 74 olds toronado.
Yes, '71-'79 Olds tilt and travel wheel. Not cracked. Worth a few bucks.
Fred Nissen all the versatiles from that time had Oldsmobile steering wheels. They still had the olds emblem on them in the middle
@5:45 music to my effing ears. Rich is #canadian jesus
Found your channel from the old Minty Zip Ties and Bias Plies! Lol! Fuckin Mint!
855 big cam is a great engine
me i just want a pickup truck with one of those in it lmfao mo power
Smart ass F$$$ . I love it 👍 all day boyzzz
Either he's done the dirty rich routine before I've seen this video
Tractor is for sale now
Ive run a lot of 935 Versatiles, but i only seen them with I6 cummins. Were V8's common on these?
Yes most of the 935s came factory with a 903 Cummins v8
The V8s in them Versatile tractors were not the right power plant for a big pulling tractor like that. the 900 series of versatiles all had the V8 Cummins, only the V8s usually cratered from the farm work they were expected to do. That’s why the next 900 models (designation 6) all had the 855 big cam V6. Most guys just swapped out the V8s when they cratered and put the reliable pulling V6s in the 900s because it’s far more dependable. I guess it’s sort of like versatile’s version of what ford had with their 6L powerstrokes.
What do I need to put a diesel a cat or a Cummings instead of 86 f250 4x4 speed manual
Back in the later 80s low flow cooling almost bankrupted Cummins.... no joke no laughs that almost happened to the diesel giant we know them as today
Low Flo Antonio?
Ether triple nickel cummins or 3208 cat? For original v8
Theone Theonly nope no cats were in a Versatile. The triple nickle was only in the triple nickle versatile. It was a 903 or in trucking terms a 90nothing
It was a v8 cummins, check tractordata.com, i forget the exact specs but it wasnt a 3208. If it was a 3208 it would still be running strong
Versitile was low bid. Didnt spend money on claterpiller.
Im doing the same swap now but in an 8560 John Deere, did you change the govenor or leave the truck one?
In 1978 I was sent from the UK to Nigeria to oversee the commissioning and distribution of thirty-five Versatile 750's plus a vast array of farm implements under a Canadian Aid scheme needless to say the project was a complete failure, but thats another story.
what? really
8v92 all day!!!
Anybody know what kind of torque these are making?
I am guessing 1100 to 1500 lb ft(1500-2000nm). Might be wrong, because I couldn't find excact specs. Also wheel torque is much more.
That's the same motor in my ram 2500
Rich, Thats absolutley NOT how you turn up the power on a 855 Cummins
Keith Dickie I do not have much experience with the on-road engines but a good buddy of mine worked with them all his life. When we first put it to work it was gutless. I asked him for help and he went right over to the cover, removed it, cracked the lock nut loose and turned the bolt. We had a boost gauge on it and saw results instantly. It does idle rough but were told that is normal and it evens out when under a load. How would you do it? Anything we missed? I thought turning the bolt allowed the fuel rack to travel more and seemed to work... Thanks for you input
take the PT pump to an expert. They will set the internal springs up to give the right pressure at the right rpm.On the NT series, the formula 350hp setting at 1800 rpm was the best for fuel economy and pulling power. The PT cummins pump ( and injectors)is the simplest,cheapest and most reliable fuel system ever made.
+DEBOSS GARAGE u can turn it up there but it will only give you twenty or thirty more horse n timing advance u can only get like a maximum of fifty horse u have to change the governor springs on the inside to get best performance out of it but the correct sizes for the two engines u swapped are 903 Cummins v8 n 855 Cummins i6 ours had a 903 Cummins v8 with twin turbo factory but we have changed it to a cat 3408 we wanted to be different lol were going to be doing another swap or two the farmer wants a sixty series Detroit installed most cheapest n fuel efficient big truck engine but anyway that was sweet how u made it look so close to a factory engine setup keep up the good work
@@wazza33racer, they're great, but Detroit unit injectors are simpler, less expensive, and just reliable😉
@@DEBOSSGARAGE the upper screw is only low rpm fueling. the bottom screw is the one for the max fuel but so far. there is a part in the pump you can put in that gives it way more. you can go up to 360 hp really easy. so way did you didn't change the low flow to standard flow? all you need was threastate housing and piping.
That's a 444 cummins you installed in that tractor.
just fucking loyal.
Car steering wheel ????
tsimmons1974ts yes! You are correct it is a car steering wheel, i forget which automaker it was but versatile bought a lot of car steering wheels from them, maybe Oldsmobile, (I know more about the tractors than the cars) and used them on their tractors for a few years, not sure what year this one is but we use a 1979 875 Versatile and it has this same steering wheel. Kind of strange to have a wheel like that in such a big tractor haha. (Edit I now know it is from an Oldsmobile they, still have the Oldsmobile logo on the middle of the wheel)
Dr Chanda
855s sound damn good. We get those on our local rail DMUs. They run a pair of NT855s hooked up to Voith hydraulic transmissions. This video amazes me every time I watch it; the EMD and carriages these things push out of the way weigh a hell of a lot more than the entire set of DMUs, but nope, it don't give a damn...
ruclips.net/video/T4MeMrPM1Lk/видео.html
903 to 855
You could have converted the engine to high flow m. Not hard.
How do you do that? They only made them for one or two years so it was hard to find any info on them.
Not exactly sure but my brother just did it for a guy that was sick of the overheating issue. I know he switched the aftercooler, oil cooler and themostat housing . The rest I'm not sure of.
TrueBlue Farmer I mean, it might be insanely hard and your brother is just a genius.
TrueBlue Did you ask you brother what it took to do it? Maybe you should take a cell phone camera and film it with him explaining Just like Rich did here. A Lot of people would appreciate your effort to help a guy out on the farm whos trying to do the same conversion. You got to see Riches' job now its your turn to add to the pot.
@@DEBOSSGARAGE Did you receive an answer to the question?
hydraulic fan out of a bus
Welkers made me end up here
903 cummins what was in it, and you put a 855 cummins not a 850 cummins
I do not know why people stretch the damn frames. they are identical. looks like shit. relocate the motor mounts and move the radiator and coolers forward. the only thing different is the hood is shorter and cowl is longer on the 935 and 950. my opinion. we specialize in versatile.
Your dropping from 2400 rpm to 2100rpm. road speed is gunna be slower. have to change 4 gears in tranny to get more road speed. put some older style planetaries on it like off of 145-900's. upto 1976. and get ur road speed up to 18-19 mph.
Yeah, no need to lengthen the frame same as the I6 tractor frames.
looks like a 855 to me
On one has made a good V8 Diesel...
Can anyone help me with my truck? It’s a 2000 dodge dakota v6 it’s overcooling I’ve replaced the thermostat and water pump and fan idk what it could be I’m lost. Any help would be appreciated.
Justin Leo just get rid of it I dumped so much money into my old dodge and it still was never reliable
Jeff Anderson Thanks for the reply I actually ended up trading it LOL so happy now
Justin Leo lol good call
i always find it funny how diesels have such low horsepower but such massive amounts of raw power
"yah we bumped it up from 180hp to high 200s" but has more torque than 5 gassers of the same horsepower
It's all about the torque. The NTC 350 Cummins has around 1300 lb/ft of torque.
@@tutekohe1361 the Russian V2 V12 has like 500hp and ~3,000ftlb torque lol. Crazy numbers
As mechanics we need to have a little more respect for our self’s we don’t need to always be dirty wrecking our wife’s vehicles losing tools in engines and bumping our selfs on junk laying around in our shops,,,, I realize we’re all busy but we need to be respected ... for more then our miracle working abilities
it was a 903 made by Cummins not a 902 and you put an 855 not an 850, the low flow radiator system is good when it worked I got one in a cabover Freightliner and it works great that truck runs cool as hell. That 855 will last forever plenty of parts. Its either a 350hp or a 400hp my guess a 400.
903 not a 902 lol
greg nunn I joined the project after the engine was already scrapped. Its the only Versitile Ive ever worked on! Love it when customers get me to join in halfway!
God damn ear porn lol
903
You think 10°c is a cold start, thats cute😂
a very big tractor just for 200 ponies
Well it has more than 200 hp
Lol. Nothing wrong with the NAVISTAR international 6.0l. I love mine. My dad has one. Good trucks. Just delete the egr cooler and don't run shitty tunes. Change oil. Use OEM parts only.
Jimmy Sturdevant dont forget head studs gaskets, oil cooler, fluids etc.
don't make it seem so trivial.
Jimmy Sturdevant I agree. not hard to get many many reliable miles out of a 6.0. stock tune with egr delete or a very mild tune and it will run forever
Jimmy Sturdevant where the fuck does he talk about a 6.0 in this video?
2:20
Only takes ten grand, removing the cab, and tearing half the engine apart to make it as reliable as it should have been to begin with.
935 was 330 hp and 950 was 350 hp