Dear HH speedrunners, please throw in your demo runs to give Capcom a false impression of how strong HH is so we slip under the radar and don’t catch any nerfs please and thank you
@@crimsoncrown2326 hopefully not! In Rise they mentioned wanting to make it more popular. Here, they're talking about making it STRONGER. That might be a good sign
8:09 The Gunlance's Wyvern's Fire hits for 64x4, or 256 damage in the Gamescom demo. As a Gunlance main, agree to keep both our voices down around Capcom?
Maybe they decided to not have the TCS be the meatiest hit in the game due to how easy it is to aim and land your TCS now, which will skyrocket GS's dmg output
I'm super excited about this new game. Every trailer, gameshow, and dev interview just piles onto the excitement. I can't wait to bash in a monster's skull and then play a jaunty tune to mock them when they're down.
Pretty clear that bubble placement is going to be a hallmark of what makes a good HH user, glad to see a new mecjanic being introduced that significantly adds to the already complex horn play. I can totally understand those who are wary of the horns complex base gameplay (especially new players) but the charge blade is popular enough and more difficult to manage correctly, so heres to hoping that our fun "niche pick" of weapon becomes enjoyed by even more people like similarly skilled weapons.
Yeah the skill ceiling is definitely going up right along with the damage ceiling. If you want the full results out of Wilds HH, the new mechanics will really make you work for them.
Every bit of Horn stuff that I've seen from Wilds has just made me more excited to give it a go myself; there are just a lot of interesting new mechanics to the weapon. And all of them feel like natural extensions and evolutions of HH's older kits. Like the new echo bubbles being a fusion of Iceborne bubbles and Bead of Resonance for example. Or special performance being an extension upon the regular song list and kind of an evolution of echo songs, being in some way set apart from the rest of the songs (echo songs in Iceborne requiring echo notes, and special performances being literally set apart from the regular song queue). I'm also happy to see recital mode looking like it's where our main damage lies like in base World rather than the echo spin in Iceborne. I like the echo spin but it was just a bit too good of a move sometimes making more optimized play feel very one-note (HA!).
100% agree on all points. Shoot, I got to play it and it's not enough still lol, now I just want to see what the full game tools are like! What we've seen so far just meshes so well with the weapon's theme and gameplay; I can only imagine what else we're gonna get...
If they nerf our DMG I will absolutely riot! They have the Overpowered LS, the CB, the DB, the insane HBG, all of wich are cranking out insane Numbers, but are still getting buffed. Why nerf the HH after finally being able to somewhat compete...
I doubt their gonan nerf it, all the weapons have been being lifted to pretty similar dps levels so meta chasers can finally have nothing to demean plays for, and if it does get nerfed it would likely be to become comparable with the other weapons not nerfed below them
The ONLY reason that's been there in the past is 'because multiplayer utility'. HH is the only weapon that's had its balance mainly considering team settings. Now though, I think they've hit a sweet spot: we'll potentially be cracked solo, but in multiplayer we probably won't be able to hit the same levels of bubble shenanigans and the unpredictability will naturally dial us back (unless you get lucky or have a really coordinated group)
@@Willowsworldx3do you actually see people demeaning others for playing non-meta anything? Because as much as I see people bringing it up I don't think it happens nearly as often...
I hope im not the only one here who wants the Sonic Barrier melody to return. I always felt like that song would be a lot stronger on World/Wilds Horn. It just feels nice being able to reliably keep you and your team buffed up while staying aggressive.
I can't wait to cut tails With Hilt stabs and Echo Waves and then stunlock it with Echo wave blunt. Partbreaker will be a MUST for (me, personally) Horns now. And swapping between Bubble buffs is gonna be fun too. I can only repeat myself if i say i can't wait for the demo.
@KPlaysHere I can't wait to see how high our skill ceiling has risen to. No other weapon could dream of the skill required to juggle 2 of the same weapon that couldn't be more different from each other. And yet, it doesn't alienate new players in learning just one. It basically replaced the Charge Blade in being the most technical weapon now. Yet i think beginners will have a good time learning it. However... Mastering it will be a whooole new level compared to all earlier games. God damn do i get an itch in my fingers just thinking about it.
@@SilverTwinkle yeah, the great thing is that if you don't get any of the new mechanics at all, you can still play it like an upgraded World HH. If you have a basic understanding, you can use the new tools to push your results some. And if you master them? WHEW 🥵 There's something to gain at every skill level
@KPlaysHere Only critique i have are the requirements. I really hope they will work on the promised optimization. Having to use Frame Generation is the worst thing for a game that needs precision inputs. (For those that don't know Frame Generation literally uses ai to generate fake frames. It causes your input to be delayed to the real frames, which might mess up your timing.) Tough i did JUST order a new machine that's quite a bit above the recommended specs thanks to a few friends giving me recommendations and financial help. I'm so thankful to have them, and i can't wait to hunt at their side.
It most likely won't be as bad as it sounds lol, especially in solo. Just look at that Rey Dau fight as an example of multiplayer uptime though: kinda chaotic fight, but the HH user still got some use out of them
@@KPlaysHere If the rest of the kit has good damage, then having 3 bubbles that actually do damage will be beyond broken and will be nerfed (possibly), but if we need 3 bubbles to stay on par with dps, then that means the rest of the kit will not be very strong and it will DEMAND setup. There is no win here man...
@@deyzunasbunker problem is, if the bubbles did low damage, not nearly as many people would utilize them. It'd be Bead of Resonance all over again. The basic kit also got some improvements, so Bubbles give you straight bonuses rather than just bumping HH up to on par DPS. It might be a little hard to say whether they're an outright advantage or something to help HH keep up though because we don't know how everything matches up just yet...other weapons also got a bunch of crazy tools too, remember that
@@KPlaysHere If it's something that does low damage but not too big of a commitment (like they should be), then good players will still use it to optimize and there's nothing wrong with that. Some tools need to exist to just be used by people that know how to use them, that's basic RPG expression, that's what gives weapons depth and personality, not be stuck doing a gimmick, that's why people loved the horn before and shows how much basing anything off popularity alone is a BEYOND atrocious line of thought as a designer.
These bubbles seems nice but then I think about fast monsters like AT velkhana which doesn't stay in one place and have short openings after every attack. I'm just afraid of wyrmstake blast situation for HH
What may help in situations like those is the fact that if JUST a wing/tail tip grazes the bubble AoE, it counts. Monsters can't 'dodge' around the bubbles either; they may just not sit still but they'll still have moments of good enough bubble uptime. Plus, HH also has some strong tools not tied to specific positions that it can use to deal with more mobile targets
just imagine for a second. damage boost bubble effect, palico with trap tools of some sort, and teammates that keep the monster near the bubble. I'd be in heaven.
See, idk just yet whether or not I want to see a damage boosting Bubble...cuz on 1 hand, it'd always be nice to see HH deal more damage lol, but on the other that'd be just as optimal choice affecting as Attack Up (doubly so if a HH ever had both)
The likelihood of having 3 bubbles down on a monster is going to be very difficult. It's going to be easy on early game monsters but it will get more difficult on late game monster unless Horn Maestro increases the bubble radius/cast time. Still a significant damage increase though.
Yeah, I think the more common scenario will be decent uptime on 1-2, with 3 mainly on incapacitated monsters or right at the start of the hunt. Really got my fingers crossed for a skill to make bubbles bigger for more range
I'll argue the HH requires more positioning and set up to reach those high numbers, which is never a guarantee in a real hunt (monster moves too much, targets teammates, attacks relentlessly, etc) So I believe there's no concern for nerfs.
yea the time to get a move off that took more than 3 seconds in world was not even an option most of the time till you knew how to abuse a monsters attack. it's easy to think that it's op when seeing a hunter stand still for 10 seconds whacking on a monster trying to lick them the whole time.😂 but the punish for a downed monster on the other hand is a whole different story
one thing i need to know more about it the earth shaker focus strike. from what i've heard there's an element of timing, and im inclined to belive that because every time i see someone use that move it looks nothing like how it looked in the weapon trailer.
@@thequasipancake4303There is a timing aspect, yeah. You have to input notes right when the Horn flashes and you do the air guitaring animation, or else you don't get the extra waves or the built up damage on the final big hit
I think there's always huge overstatement in terms of horn damage in the demos. The problem of horn wave damage is that it doesn't scale from anything beside pure raw, making it strong option early, but weak endgame when players can multiply their raw with crit and other modifiers (like sharpness)
@@milt3k I mean yeah, it'll scale down in the full game, but doing 40-60% of your damage before considering all the damage multipliers with just ONE of a special ability you can triple up on us 1 hell of a starting point I'd say. And sound wave damage mechanics change from game to game too. They've never benefited from affinity, but element and sharpness multipliers aren't totally off the table as a possibility
my thing with bubble effects they need to be useful WHILE being inside. so anything that restores (health stamina sharpness) or applies a active buff persisting a bit longer than now based on our skills (speed+evasion we know, affinity, defense, if sonic barrier then it needs to add dmg reduction) because much as evasion/speed is great itd be great to be something that persists longer than a few seconds after leaving bubble
@@derandi2324 I mean, I guess that the thought process with Movement+Evasion Up is that if you drop multiple bubbles you've got a sort of mini arena where you're more mobile and harder to touch so you can be more aggressive...but I kinda feel like it'd be better as a regular song instead. Increased movement in a restricted area seems a bit contradictory if you ask me. We'll see how useful it ends up being in the long run I guess. Something like healing, damage reduction, or a damage boost (although I'm personally hoping there are only utility effects, not offensive ones) will probably end up more popular overall
@@KPlaysHere generally i feel pure offense songs raw ele status should remain full songs but you never know whatll happen. and tbh yeah speed evasion should be full too like ya said kinda contradictory, maybe it gets changed/buffed yet. but if you have a area with the bubbles you want that to be your stronghold. your stage so youd want effects provided to synergise perhaps a evasion bubble horn that has bubbly dance on itself paired with coalescence further giving emphasis to the dodge zone xD idk. one way or another im excited to see how my favorite world borne notes look red green. smth i love using is vaal essence safi for resentment solid base skills for raw and ridiculous hp recovery
As a Gunlance main, Hunting Horn and Gunlance are looking to do crap tons of damages ! I suspects than not all weapons would be able to "pack hunting" monsters specialy the bow?, Insect glaive?, SwordnShield?, Hammer? and Greatsword?. Mainly because how single targets are most of their moves. Those weapons? got gimmicks that can maybe make up for it but for now that uncertain. When you look closely all weapons were balanced to work in a "multiple monsters fight" setting and this how i plan to play on release.
I think in a lot of cases you'd want to do the dung pod/lure pod thing to break up groups, but I've noticed that those aren't an instant fix. Sometimes packs disperse but end up running off in the same direction so you end up back at square 1 for example. But I guess you've got a point: weapons with AoE potential could be useful for attacking the whole pack at once
@@alexandregalanth5195 if they split up and attack you off screen, or end up being more dangerous than Doshaguma? Probably. Multi monster hunts have usually been utter chaos lol, and that's back before monster ai was smart enough to actually cooperate in groups
A lot of people felt that it was arguably TOO good, to the point where you wanted to do it much more often than just the usual HH stuff (building and playing songs)
@@KPlaysHereYeah I’m not a fan of that move tbh. It’s just too spammable and doesn’t gel with what I like about the moveset (picking the optimal swing for where you want to hit). The spin to win does good damage and has quite a large hitbox that works in most situations. Only downside is commitment and sharpness loss where the latter can be mitigated.
@@KPlaysHere It’s like if the wide sweep became the most optimal attack on lance over the pokes. Shifting the HH’s power budget to the main focus of the weapon, playing songs, is the best direction and I’m really glad they’ve gone this way.
Paralysis hunting horn is definitely gonna be top again. Bring that second hunting horn to buff the status etc. Bubbles are going to be so helpful and dynamic, justlikeour different offset attacks. I'm willing to bet there's also another type of offset attack on a hunting horn we haven't seen yet.
@@CreatureOfH4bit did it have a top game before? Last time I remember using an endgame para HH was maybe...Yama, in FU? Ah wait, technically relics in 4U too if you could snag a good 1. Sad, cuz it's super fun. Can't wait to hopefully change that! I'm interested to see how different Special Performances make different Horns play. I can already see where things would change from having a quick burst damage+Offset counter, so not having that could pull things in an entirely new direction
@@KPlaysHere Najarala hunting horn for previous gen and Safi for World we're great for team play. Najarala hh had op songs and sharpness and Safi's you could even change the songs available. CC is one oh hunting horns most underrated utilities and deserves consideration. If you get a chance in MHWorld, run an armor set with whatever skills you want but make sure KO, Stamina Thief and Paralysis Up are on there. Watch even tempered monsters drool and fall over, get paralyzed then mounted then thrown in a trap etc. No it's not dual blades level of application but you'd be surprised if you built your set for it and know the paralysis timings. So if I haven't paralyzed the monster but I've hit it a bunch already I'll pop a trap or a wall banger. Then hold off on striking the monster and let your team go in. When it's coming out then you spin-to-win/DPS to apply the paralysis. You don't want to apply paralysis right as it's KO'd or just un-mounted. Normally the monster would come out of all this by raging and it might but if you're smacking the face it should be panting now, slowed down or...all out raging. If it rages just a few more face smacks until it's drooling. Also I have a few different flavors of paralysis hunting horns I use depending on the weapon icons of my teammates. DB, IG, Hammer and bow get stamina for example. If a monster is known for roaring like Nerg I might bring one with earplugs. No my damage doesn't equal that of a fatalis hh but my utility/CC I believe exceeds that. *(In multi-player)
@@CreatureOfH4bit ah, I forgot about those, and what's funnier is that early IB had another good option with the best raw HH (Acidic Glavenus) being able to awaken para too. That's exactly the kind of niche I'd love to see HH able to fill though. No stand back and buff, you're putting monsters in a chokehold so you and your team can wail on them lol
Im really hoping they keep it as is. Seems like a nice trade off where HH requires more setup, but the potential damage if everything goes right is quite high.
I'm already seeing a possible trend between veteran doot stick users and newer ones, where some newer folks might obsess over their bubbles a bit too much, kinda like the sonic blooms in MHR. not a negative per se, I just like trying to predict trends!
@@blakehelwig6731 I see something like that too honestly. Can't focus on gaining damage so much that you lose it y'know? There'll be lots of benefits to gaining experience with these new tools
Nice video! From watching all the japanese streams from the TGS, it seems the balance between the different weapons is now much better than the previous games. I feel the overall DPS is pretty balanced across the board, even considering weapon-specific gimmicks (HH has the echo bubbles to play around, bow has the evade, etc).
Would be great if we could see a game where there's a relatively even power spread instead of certain usual suspects being over/under tuned compared to the rest. Super excited to see speedrunners get their hands on this game and show everything at 100% potential
8:08 definitely says 127, so with three bubbles the hunter would actually be doing more damage than that final hit of TCS, sheesh! Side note, going frame by frame on that TCS hit the number goes absolutely ballistic hahah. The initial shake on the number seems to be higher than other hits, and then it bounces around like a loose fire hose from the screen shake! lol
@@WGzombie 127+the 10 from the 1st slash, but yeah that's barely much extra lol. Definitely seems like they do a bit of extra with the numbers on certain attacks, which on 1 hand is a neat visual effect but on the other kinda makes it hard to make them out for math
@@RedflameBlazze9 there are slight differences, like 2 hit attacks (Flourish, Superpound, etc) no longer doing 2 sound hits, but other than that they seem like they're filling a similar niche. Here's to hoping!
Man, you couldn’t find out about the quick notes(or what you called “insta-notes🎶)? Man that sucks 🙂↕️ I guess I’ll just have to see myself when I get my hands on the demo. Thanks for at least giving my suggestions a try from back then.
i heard from some GS players that TCS dmg numbers got nerfed pretty hard, probably cause they added ability to turn 180 mid TCS so dunno how legit it is to compare HH dps to wilds GS dps now, at least as "extreme comparison" :thonk: also like i said in one of the comments here if luring pods will actually work very good then u should not have much problems with keeping monsters in your bubbles. also worth noting that devs said that elder dragons are not a priority in this game so u will be able to trap and stunlock a lot more monsters in your "danger zone"... sounds kinda bonkers
I think people might be reading a bit too much into that whole Elder Dragons thing. I heard that more like "they won't be the story focus like in World", not "there'll be little to no Elders in Wilds. We'll see though. But that aside, I didn't know about any GS nerfs, that's interesting. Like you said it is getting some crazy positioning control, so maybe that's a compensation change...or maybe there'll be a new playstyle they're trying to push?
@@KPlaysHere i kinda understand that info as "there might be bit less elder dragons overall and they might appear later in the story"... but in the end i guess we will see what will actually happen when game will be out lel. when it comes to GS... no idea. my knowledge about that weapon is far too small to predict anything when it comes to big playstyle changes and stuff... but if they buff middle of the combo and nerf end of it then i guess they might want to lure players into doing full charged combo instead of constantly skipping to TCS with tackles and side slapping
so just to throw my brainrot idea for an echo bubble buff here: imagine a rocksteady bubble. Imagine how many people in Multiplayer that coudl get killed. it would be glorious and they would never do it right?
I mean, you joke, but it'd probably actually work pretty well. Just give it damage reduction too and give us some form of active healing (health augment, healing songs, etc) and you'd be golden. Without that...yeah it'd 100% be a trolling tool lol
it would work well its just that before you get a decent ammount of healing or on a non healing horn it can absolutely work against you. greatsword players would drool at it though. rocksteady also doesnt protect against status ailments outside of stun so that has some balancing effect as well and rise did have the sonic barrier song which just gave everyone a hit of armour for 3 seconds.
Honestly though the thing I am most interested in will be new notes. there do seem to be some song changes but at least from what I could see from the demo they havent really touched the songlists and those are IMO one of the bigger issues of horn balancing. 20% more damage is a crazy buff on any weapon and considering its a partywide buff it probably is the main reason horn has been held back so much and moreso been pushed into element if you wanted to do optimal damage lategame. Outside of attack up though most songs are actually kind of really bad. most of the elemental defense songs you can find strewn around on songlists that have no real use or worse are on horns with that same element which 10/10 horn design there, and other songlists are just straight up way too good. Shout out to the red/blue note combo getting health up, attack up L and defense up L which makes it the perfect songlist for progression. Genuinely the echo bubbles seem a good way to finally get AWAY from balancing around attack up XL being on a horn though I do get the feeling it will remain the main song horn wants to have, meanwhile all the elemental defense songs give 7 elemental defense when encored which confuses me because defense up XL is just a 20% boost to defense so I would expect the elemental defense buff to be a bit bigger. It is nice that they finally addressed the universal issue of attack endlag which made HH and gunlance so clunky to use, but the song buffs still need to be touched up a lot since the elemental defense buffs are pretty much worthless since they are often not part of the red note songlist, and also just 7 elemental defense, which again why bother unless its on a horn you want to use anyway. The yellow note is genuine bait and should be abolished with its damned sonic bomb effect because most of the songlists its part of are the worst on the game except for the one it gets with red note because the rednote gets exclusive rights to attack up XL for some reason. On the other hand also there are like 2 songlists total (in world, because wilds seems to be using world as base) that have elemental attack up, and a single one for status. Those I believe add a flat 30 per level of the song played which I believe is nerfed from Old world where it was % based I believe, though only stuff I used it on got status/element capped. Element/status up are just worse then attack up XL unless you have a squad of like 3 DBs or elemental guns and even then the element cap can screw you. Status horn is kind of a meme but the 1 songlist that gets status up I believe is actually pretty amazing so that is actually worth using as support or heck even damage. also genuinely most of the other song buffs are pretty situational. the healing songs I can see why they stay so low in power because there the potential is literally 4 horns using those songs nonstop to achieve immortality but the flipside is that horns with the healing songlist kinda just have low damage anyway? Also you can still achieve immortality by simply doing enough damage that the monster cant act which is very much possible so my best guess is that they keep those songs garbage so that new players dont abuse them to not have to use potions and stuff which I guess is fair. Problem is that healing (s) is one of the more common songlists and utter garbage to use once you get out of LR, the healing (M) song exists for some reason and is coupled with antidote which is not only weird but also extremely rare and the healing (L) songlist is genuinely the rarest songlist in the game maybe next to the healing (M) songlist which confuses me greatly considering HH is supposed to be a "support" weapon. all the other songs btw ranging from no stamina drain, which is pretty worthless on horn but I guess DBs will love you for it, to knockback resistance, again pretty decent in MP so that LS and DBs dont bully you, to earplugs and the wind resist songs are all nice songs to have but they are just that. NICE. They will not change your playstyle much they will not affect you or your party much they are nice incidental buffs that you probably get credited for because lets be honest there will be a longsword player and he will bully the poor lance and the lance player will love you for every single second of knockback resistance you can get him. but they arent build or even playstyle defining. at best you get a matchup like wind resist vs kushala or the status horn actually vs chameleos because the status songlist gets status immunity which is hilarious. But those are the best case scenarios and they dont exist for some songs. Again the element resist songs give 7 elemental resist when encored for 1 element. who is this helping. Who are all the buffs for that get stuck to eachother when there is no main buffing song on the horn list. Why bother using a horn that has 2 songs to heal you with and a song that boosts your natural recovery when its statline is middling and you are doing something a wide range set nowadays can do better. If you want me to play a song either make the buff it gives worth having like actually preventing a damned elemental blight for instance, having gradual healing that extends past red health, or give me frontier horn where they jsut said fck it and gave you attack up XL as a base song. Give me songs that have actual impact and not have me note its existence before scrolling past a horn on the forge tree because there will inevitably be horns stuck with healing only songlists. Most importantly please get rid of songs being stuck to certain notes, fck blue note being the defense note and red being the offense note so many horns just die because they get stuck with certain note colours and please just make individual damned songlist. Also screw the yellow note, its just a noise maker. No I wont tell you how long this took me to type.
The reason I chose hunting horn as my first weapon was because the base weapon was third in overall damage and had the ability to apply buffs to myself and possible team mates. But now it can hit harder while still applying buffs. How soon before HH becomes mainstream?
I don't know that I want HH to become mainstream. I feel like a hero when I show up with a weapon that few hunters use. And those rare and odd occasions that 3 or 4 HH hunters converge are all the sweeter. Of course, I'm not even sure that it would become mainstream even if the damage was in the top 3. Its design is simply seen as "user-unfriendly" to many. And that's kinda a beautiful thing. Because when you can wield it properly, it feels great. All I want is for the developers to give it the love it deserves. Ideally it does not need to exceed, but instead be on par with other great options.
Are there going to be different sized bubbles? I only ask because all the ones from the gameplays I've seen are smaller than the one in the HH trailer.
I might have to rant a little. I have literally no idea what they're trying to do with Great Sword. They nerfed TCS considerably (it now only does 15% more damage than Strong Charged Slash compared to its previous 100% in Iceborne), possibly to compensate for the fact that you can basically do a 180 degree turn after the first hit of TCS, which honestly does not make sense to me. I can't imagine many greatsword mains even wanted to be able to turn around in the middle of a True Charged Slash. People argue that Capcom wants to combat TCS spam, but then why did they buff it in Iceborne? Also, now that (like in Rise) you can't chain Strong Wide Slash into Strong Charged Slash anymore, you are literally forced to finish with TCS. And I don't even want them to buff Charged and Strong Charged Slash, I don't want all 3 main charged slashes to feel same-y.
From comparing damage numbers against Doshaguma, the Offset Follow-Up might actually now have the highest motion values in the GS moveset. If Great Sword doesn't have the biggest single motion value out of all weapons anymore, I'm seriously considering switching mains for good
I only now just got to the part of the video where you mention damage output similar to greatsword and honestly... yeah that checks out considering all the bewildering changes they've made to GS
I wasn't aware that they'd tweaked GS numbers along with the other changes they made with it. That's... definitely interesting in an odd kinda way if true. Usually they just build straight onto GS gameplay, not adjust how you approach it
Even if horn users decided to speedrun shit before the games even out in the demo. I doubt that capcoms gonna nerf it because the directions wilds seems to be going is by spitting in the existing meta crowds collective face and going with makeing all the weapons collectively viable, and swamping us with options, so figurieng out "a meta" is gonna be an obnoxious chore for the cultists to strive for so thats hype worthy honestly
That crowd'll be fine as far as I've seen. Metas will always be able to be found out before long. Weapons each usually have their own, and then they get compared to each other pretty much ONLY when it comes to speedrunning
@@KPlaysHere I think what ever meta is developed is going to be easily disputed by the sheer variety of combos / builds available. And what ever eventually is decided as the best will be easily throw out when considering less then peak play compared to other strategys which the players have figured out works for themselves and their playstyles
@@Willowsworldx3 there's usually a ton of variety regardless, but eventually the best combination of things is usually figured out. There'll still end up being a BUNCH of options for people that just want to do their own thing. 2 separate worlds with 2 different approaches to the game if you ask me. If you're not usually worried about minmaxing, I wouldn't be too concerned with whatever the meta may be
i was in the believe that the monster only gets damaged by one bubble at a time. So more bubbles only increases the likelihood for a monster standing in it. But not the damage. Correct me if there are different infos out there
@@firemage8707 oh no, multiple bubbles=multiple instances of damage. You can actually see it happening in the HH teaser trailer, and a few times early in that Rey Dau fight I'm talking about in this video
@@KPlaysHere hmm yea look like it. crazy. if that stays that way I can already see me getting annoyed trying to setup optimal damage (3 bubbles)... will be very rare xD
Sounds bad but honestly I agree, locking a large portion hunting horn damage behind the target being stationary is a horrible way to design the weapon. Flying and mobile monsters are going to feel terrible, and trap spam was something I already disliked playing with in other titles. Nerfing or even removing bubble would go a long way to making the weapon better.
@@failfist9308 stationary is a bit of an on paper situation. In practice you'll probably just be doing what they did in the Rey Dau fight and shifting the bubbles around to just net some extra damage, and in solo it'll become easier than most expect it to keep up. On 1 hand I get how it could look bad to have so much damage 'locked' behind these, but on the other they kinda have to be strong or you probably wouldn't be encouraged to bother with them much. Just look at how little Bead of Resonance was used, despite literally giving Attack Up to every HH. They've already added them to the game and built the weapon around utilizing them so removing them is out, and nerfing would really just be a net negative
Dear HH speedrunners, please throw in your demo runs to give Capcom a false impression of how strong HH is so we slip under the radar and don’t catch any nerfs please and thank you
@@Sethg98use Echo Wave OR Bubbles, 2 bubble maximum, and space em out a little k thanks 😂
Base Rise demo HH nerfed PTSD
Ikr they nerfed HH so badly in Rise. I know they're gonna do it again for Wilds.
@@crimsoncrown2326 What? Hunting Horn dishes out some of the highest DPS in Rise lol.
@@crimsoncrown2326 hopefully not! In Rise they mentioned wanting to make it more popular. Here, they're talking about making it STRONGER. That might be a good sign
Was playing world yesterday and thought to myself, "An echo bubble would be so useful right now"
@@voicelessmango5362 absolutely itching to get my hands on that sweet DAMAGE
8:09 The Gunlance's Wyvern's Fire hits for 64x4, or 256 damage in the Gamescom demo.
As a Gunlance main, agree to keep both our voices down around Capcom?
@@gamecavalier3230 hmm...deal! I'll even buff your shelling as a freebie lol
Shhh why are you outing us? Looks like I’m gonna main Gunlance and Hunting Horn in this game again. So happy with both of their changes.
Don't worry. The only weapon they nerfed in Rise was Hunting Horn. No other weapon gets this treatment.
Maybe they decided to not have the TCS be the meatiest hit in the game due to how easy it is to aim and land your TCS now, which will skyrocket GS's dmg output
@@-dash. I get that impression too, even just on the GS, the damage gap between TCS and Strong Charge Slash seems much smaller than before.
I'm super excited about this new game. Every trailer, gameshow, and dev interview just piles onto the excitement. I can't wait to bash in a monster's skull and then play a jaunty tune to mock them when they're down.
everyone's like 'oh just be quiet about our new skills teehee'
brother. you do realize *why* we are getting these...right
@@Not.A.Heretic of course lol, that's the joke 😉 cuz when does HH EVER get this much potential power?
@@KPlaysHere when the bosses are here to hurt us 🙂↔️
Gawd dayum, my beloved horn is pumping out damage like crazy. Looks like the weird band kid finally started hitting the gym.
As a former band kid (not weird tho, who said weird, YOU'RE weird lol) that also took up competitive martial arts, I vibe with this comparison HARD😂
I’m still a little sad about losing the directional encores😔 imagine how satisfying the forward one would be with the echo bubbles.
my god the potential... this HH iteration seems to be gold!
Pretty clear that bubble placement is going to be a hallmark of what makes a good HH user, glad to see a new mecjanic being introduced that significantly adds to the already complex horn play.
I can totally understand those who are wary of the horns complex base gameplay (especially new players) but the charge blade is popular enough and more difficult to manage correctly, so heres to hoping that our fun "niche pick" of weapon becomes enjoyed by even more people like similarly skilled weapons.
Yeah the skill ceiling is definitely going up right along with the damage ceiling. If you want the full results out of Wilds HH, the new mechanics will really make you work for them.
Every bit of Horn stuff that I've seen from Wilds has just made me more excited to give it a go myself; there are just a lot of interesting new mechanics to the weapon. And all of them feel like natural extensions and evolutions of HH's older kits.
Like the new echo bubbles being a fusion of Iceborne bubbles and Bead of Resonance for example. Or special performance being an extension upon the regular song list and kind of an evolution of echo songs, being in some way set apart from the rest of the songs (echo songs in Iceborne requiring echo notes, and special performances being literally set apart from the regular song queue).
I'm also happy to see recital mode looking like it's where our main damage lies like in base World rather than the echo spin in Iceborne. I like the echo spin but it was just a bit too good of a move sometimes making more optimized play feel very one-note (HA!).
100% agree on all points. Shoot, I got to play it and it's not enough still lol, now I just want to see what the full game tools are like! What we've seen so far just meshes so well with the weapon's theme and gameplay; I can only imagine what else we're gonna get...
If they nerf our DMG I will absolutely riot!
They have the Overpowered LS, the CB, the DB, the insane HBG, all of wich are cranking out insane Numbers, but are still getting buffed.
Why nerf the HH after finally being able to somewhat compete...
I doubt their gonan nerf it, all the weapons have been being lifted to pretty similar dps levels so meta chasers can finally have nothing to demean plays for, and if it does get nerfed it would likely be to become comparable with the other weapons not nerfed below them
The ONLY reason that's been there in the past is 'because multiplayer utility'. HH is the only weapon that's had its balance mainly considering team settings. Now though, I think they've hit a sweet spot: we'll potentially be cracked solo, but in multiplayer we probably won't be able to hit the same levels of bubble shenanigans and the unpredictability will naturally dial us back (unless you get lucky or have a really coordinated group)
@@Willowsworldx3do you actually see people demeaning others for playing non-meta anything? Because as much as I see people bringing it up I don't think it happens nearly as often...
@@KPlaysHere luring pods forced aggro?
@@Zamoxino I used those and they worked pretty well in the demo
I hope im not the only one here who wants the Sonic Barrier melody to return. I always felt like that song would be a lot stronger on World/Wilds Horn. It just feels nice being able to reliably keep you and your team buffed up while staying aggressive.
Nah, I'm hoping for it too! It'd have some pretty cool uses if they included it into the Wilds toolkit
After what they did to rise HH imma just say im excited to play doots
@@coraline2770Monster Hunter Wilds: The Hunting Horn Apology Tour 😂
The hammer user posted this hunt as well. Its also a really good video
I can't wait to cut tails With Hilt stabs and Echo Waves and then stunlock it with Echo wave blunt.
Partbreaker will be a MUST for (me, personally) Horns now.
And swapping between Bubble buffs is gonna be fun too.
I can only repeat myself if i say i can't wait for the demo.
@@SilverTwinkle so many things to try in the full game!
@KPlaysHere I can't wait to see how high our skill ceiling has risen to. No other weapon could dream of the skill required to juggle 2 of the same weapon that couldn't be more different from each other.
And yet, it doesn't alienate new players in learning just one. It basically replaced the Charge Blade in being the most technical weapon now.
Yet i think beginners will have a good time learning it.
However... Mastering it will be a whooole new level compared to all earlier games.
God damn do i get an itch in my fingers just thinking about it.
@@SilverTwinkle yeah, the great thing is that if you don't get any of the new mechanics at all, you can still play it like an upgraded World HH.
If you have a basic understanding, you can use the new tools to push your results some.
And if you master them? WHEW 🥵
There's something to gain at every skill level
@KPlaysHere Only critique i have are the requirements. I really hope they will work on the promised optimization. Having to use Frame Generation is the worst thing for a game that needs precision inputs.
(For those that don't know Frame Generation literally uses ai to generate fake frames. It causes your input to be delayed to the real frames, which might mess up your timing.)
Tough i did JUST order a new machine that's quite a bit above the recommended specs thanks to a few friends giving me recommendations and financial help.
I'm so thankful to have them, and i can't wait to hunt at their side.
"Get in the habit of repositioning your bubbles" OH BOY THAT'S GONNA BE SOOOOOOOOOOO FUN 💀💀💀💀💀
It most likely won't be as bad as it sounds lol, especially in solo. Just look at that Rey Dau fight as an example of multiplayer uptime though: kinda chaotic fight, but the HH user still got some use out of them
@@KPlaysHere If the rest of the kit has good damage, then having 3 bubbles that actually do damage will be beyond broken and will be nerfed (possibly), but if we need 3 bubbles to stay on par with dps, then that means the rest of the kit will not be very strong and it will DEMAND setup. There is no win here man...
If bubbles only did a lil bit of damage, all would be fine tho
@@deyzunasbunker problem is, if the bubbles did low damage, not nearly as many people would utilize them. It'd be Bead of Resonance all over again. The basic kit also got some improvements, so Bubbles give you straight bonuses rather than just bumping HH up to on par DPS. It might be a little hard to say whether they're an outright advantage or something to help HH keep up though because we don't know how everything matches up just yet...other weapons also got a bunch of crazy tools too, remember that
@@KPlaysHere If it's something that does low damage but not too big of a commitment (like they should be), then good players will still use it to optimize and there's nothing wrong with that. Some tools need to exist to just be used by people that know how to use them, that's basic RPG expression, that's what gives weapons depth and personality, not be stuck doing a gimmick, that's why people loved the horn before and shows how much basing anything off popularity alone is a BEYOND atrocious line of thought as a designer.
Imagine the HH + lance or gunlance combo.
HH puts down 3 bubbles, Lance throws a luring pod and stands in the middle, profit.
These bubbles seems nice but then I think about fast monsters like AT velkhana which doesn't stay in one place and have short openings after every attack. I'm just afraid of wyrmstake blast situation for HH
My concern as well!
What may help in situations like those is the fact that if JUST a wing/tail tip grazes the bubble AoE, it counts. Monsters can't 'dodge' around the bubbles either; they may just not sit still but they'll still have moments of good enough bubble uptime. Plus, HH also has some strong tools not tied to specific positions that it can use to deal with more mobile targets
just imagine for a second. damage boost bubble effect, palico with trap tools of some sort, and teammates that keep the monster near the bubble. I'd be in heaven.
See, idk just yet whether or not I want to see a damage boosting Bubble...cuz on 1 hand, it'd always be nice to see HH deal more damage lol, but on the other that'd be just as optimal choice affecting as Attack Up (doubly so if a HH ever had both)
The likelihood of having 3 bubbles down on a monster is going to be very difficult. It's going to be easy on early game monsters but it will get more difficult on late game monster unless Horn Maestro increases the bubble radius/cast time. Still a significant damage increase though.
Yeah, I think the more common scenario will be decent uptime on 1-2, with 3 mainly on incapacitated monsters or right at the start of the hunt. Really got my fingers crossed for a skill to make bubbles bigger for more range
After 9:00 is the monster altering the terrain! That sounds Awesome!
Pumping numbers
I'll argue the HH requires more positioning and set up to reach those high numbers, which is never a guarantee in a real hunt (monster moves too much, targets teammates, attacks relentlessly, etc)
So I believe there's no concern for nerfs.
True, true. The super situational nature of it SHOULD be the 'balancing factor' that lets them leave it as is
yea the time to get a move off that took more than 3 seconds in world was not even an option most of the time till you knew how to abuse a monsters attack.
it's easy to think that it's op when seeing a hunter stand still for 10 seconds whacking on a monster trying to lick them the whole time.😂
but the punish for a downed monster on the other hand is a whole different story
one thing i need to know more about it the earth shaker focus strike. from what i've heard there's an element of timing, and im inclined to belive that because every time i see someone use that move it looks nothing like how it looked in the weapon trailer.
@@thequasipancake4303There is a timing aspect, yeah. You have to input notes right when the Horn flashes and you do the air guitaring animation, or else you don't get the extra waves or the built up damage on the final big hit
Very exited to get back to doing my real life job while hunting., haven't been a HH main since 3U because of gunner armor.
I hate the visual pollution
I think there's always huge overstatement in terms of horn damage in the demos.
The problem of horn wave damage is that it doesn't scale from anything beside pure raw, making it strong option early, but weak endgame when players can multiply their raw with crit and other modifiers (like sharpness)
@@milt3k I mean yeah, it'll scale down in the full game, but doing 40-60% of your damage before considering all the damage multipliers with just ONE of a special ability you can triple up on us 1 hell of a starting point I'd say. And sound wave damage mechanics change from game to game too. They've never benefited from affinity, but element and sharpness multipliers aren't totally off the table as a possibility
I hope that if when you summon npc hunters we can choose their weapons. I want a full band to hunt with
my thing with bubble effects they need to be useful WHILE being inside.
so anything that restores (health stamina sharpness) or applies a active buff persisting a bit longer than now based on our skills (speed+evasion we know, affinity, defense, if sonic barrier then it needs to add dmg reduction)
because much as evasion/speed is great itd be great to be something that persists longer than a few seconds after leaving bubble
@@derandi2324 I mean, I guess that the thought process with Movement+Evasion Up is that if you drop multiple bubbles you've got a sort of mini arena where you're more mobile and harder to touch so you can be more aggressive...but I kinda feel like it'd be better as a regular song instead. Increased movement in a restricted area seems a bit contradictory if you ask me. We'll see how useful it ends up being in the long run I guess. Something like healing, damage reduction, or a damage boost (although I'm personally hoping there are only utility effects, not offensive ones) will probably end up more popular overall
@@KPlaysHere
generally i feel pure offense songs raw ele status should remain full songs but you never know whatll happen.
and tbh yeah speed evasion should be full too like ya said kinda contradictory, maybe it gets changed/buffed yet.
but if you have a area with the bubbles you want that to be your stronghold. your stage so youd want effects provided to synergise
perhaps a evasion bubble horn that has bubbly dance on itself paired with coalescence further giving emphasis to the dodge zone xD
idk.
one way or another im excited to see how my favorite world borne notes look red green.
smth i love using is vaal essence safi for resentment solid base skills for raw and ridiculous hp recovery
As a Gunlance main, Hunting Horn and Gunlance are looking to do crap tons of damages !
I suspects than not all weapons would be able to "pack hunting" monsters specialy the bow?, Insect glaive?, SwordnShield?, Hammer? and Greatsword?.
Mainly because how single targets are most of their moves.
Those weapons? got gimmicks that can maybe make up for it but for now that uncertain.
When you look closely all weapons were balanced to work in a "multiple monsters fight" setting and this how i plan to play on release.
I think in a lot of cases you'd want to do the dung pod/lure pod thing to break up groups, but I've noticed that those aren't an instant fix. Sometimes packs disperse but end up running off in the same direction so you end up back at square 1 for example. But I guess you've got a point: weapons with AoE potential could be useful for attacking the whole pack at once
@@KPlaysHere Oh do you think that fighting multiples monsters at once would be to difficult ?
@@alexandregalanth5195 if they split up and attack you off screen, or end up being more dangerous than Doshaguma? Probably. Multi monster hunts have usually been utter chaos lol, and that's back before monster ai was smart enough to actually cooperate in groups
The hunting horn spin in world was so good I'd hate to let it go
A lot of people felt that it was arguably TOO good, to the point where you wanted to do it much more often than just the usual HH stuff (building and playing songs)
@@KPlaysHereYeah I’m not a fan of that move tbh. It’s just too spammable and doesn’t gel with what I like about the moveset (picking the optimal swing for where you want to hit).
The spin to win does good damage and has quite a large hitbox that works in most situations. Only downside is commitment and sharpness loss where the latter can be mitigated.
@@MyCoolHistory exactly, unless it's a question of committing to the animation, you'd want to use it over EVERYTHING else in the kit
@@KPlaysHere It’s like if the wide sweep became the most optimal attack on lance over the pokes.
Shifting the HH’s power budget to the main focus of the weapon, playing songs, is the best direction and I’m really glad they’ve gone this way.
Paralysis hunting horn is definitely gonna be top again. Bring that second hunting horn to buff the status etc.
Bubbles are going to be so helpful and dynamic, justlikeour different offset attacks. I'm willing to bet there's also another type of offset attack on a hunting horn we haven't seen yet.
@@CreatureOfH4bit did it have a top game before? Last time I remember using an endgame para HH was maybe...Yama, in FU? Ah wait, technically relics in 4U too if you could snag a good 1. Sad, cuz it's super fun. Can't wait to hopefully change that!
I'm interested to see how different Special Performances make different Horns play. I can already see where things would change from having a quick burst damage+Offset counter, so not having that could pull things in an entirely new direction
@@KPlaysHere Najarala hunting horn for previous gen and Safi for World we're great for team play. Najarala hh had op songs and sharpness and Safi's you could even change the songs available. CC is one oh hunting horns most underrated utilities and deserves consideration.
If you get a chance in MHWorld, run an armor set with whatever skills you want but make sure KO, Stamina Thief and Paralysis Up are on there. Watch even tempered monsters drool and fall over, get paralyzed then mounted then thrown in a trap etc.
No it's not dual blades level of application but you'd be surprised if you built your set for it and know the paralysis timings. So if I haven't paralyzed the monster but I've hit it a bunch already I'll pop a trap or a wall banger. Then hold off on striking the monster and let your team go in. When it's coming out then you spin-to-win/DPS to apply the paralysis. You don't want to apply paralysis right as it's KO'd or just un-mounted. Normally the monster would come out of all this by raging and it might but if you're smacking the face it should be panting now, slowed down or...all out raging. If it rages just a few more face smacks until it's drooling.
Also I have a few different flavors of paralysis hunting horns I use depending on the weapon icons of my teammates. DB, IG, Hammer and bow get stamina for example. If a monster is known for roaring like Nerg I might bring one with earplugs.
No my damage doesn't equal that of a fatalis hh but my utility/CC I believe exceeds that.
*(In multi-player)
@@CreatureOfH4bit ah, I forgot about those, and what's funnier is that early IB had another good option with the best raw HH (Acidic Glavenus) being able to awaken para too.
That's exactly the kind of niche I'd love to see HH able to fill though. No stand back and buff, you're putting monsters in a chokehold so you and your team can wail on them lol
It's time to master the horn! (talking about myself)
Im really hoping they keep it as is. Seems like a nice trade off where HH requires more setup, but the potential damage if everything goes right is quite high.
Exactly! If it takes extra steps and ideal conditions, you can set the damage ceiling wayyy higher
I'm already seeing a possible trend between veteran doot stick users and newer ones, where some newer folks might obsess over their bubbles a bit too much, kinda like the sonic blooms in MHR. not a negative per se, I just like trying to predict trends!
@@blakehelwig6731 I see something like that too honestly. Can't focus on gaining damage so much that you lose it y'know? There'll be lots of benefits to gaining experience with these new tools
Nice video!
From watching all the japanese streams from the TGS, it seems the balance between the different weapons is now much better than the previous games.
I feel the overall DPS is pretty balanced across the board, even considering weapon-specific gimmicks (HH has the echo bubbles to play around, bow has the evade, etc).
Would be great if we could see a game where there's a relatively even power spread instead of certain usual suspects being over/under tuned compared to the rest. Super excited to see speedrunners get their hands on this game and show everything at 100% potential
Doot doot! Now I can help DPS, too, doot.
@@joethelesser you always could! Now we'll be giving others some GOOD competition!
8:08 definitely says 127, so with three bubbles the hunter would actually be doing more damage than that final hit of TCS, sheesh!
Side note, going frame by frame on that TCS hit the number goes absolutely ballistic hahah. The initial shake on the number seems to be higher than other hits, and then it bounces around like a loose fire hose from the screen shake! lol
@@WGzombie 127+the 10 from the 1st slash, but yeah that's barely much extra lol.
Definitely seems like they do a bit of extra with the numbers on certain attacks, which on 1 hand is a neat visual effect but on the other kinda makes it hard to make them out for math
Id be very suprised if those echo bubbles dont function almost exactly like silkbind shockwave bubbles
@@RedflameBlazze9 there are slight differences, like 2 hit attacks (Flourish, Superpound, etc) no longer doing 2 sound hits, but other than that they seem like they're filling a similar niche. Here's to hoping!
Man, you couldn’t find out about the quick notes(or what you called “insta-notes🎶)? Man that sucks 🙂↕️ I guess I’ll just have to see myself when I get my hands on the demo. Thanks for at least giving my suggestions a try from back then.
Yeah unfortunately I wasn't able to find much on those 😩 some things we're probably gonna need untimed demo access or the full game to figure out
i heard from some GS players that TCS dmg numbers got nerfed pretty hard, probably cause they added ability to turn 180 mid TCS so dunno how legit it is to compare HH dps to wilds GS dps now, at least as "extreme comparison" :thonk:
also like i said in one of the comments here if luring pods will actually work very good then u should not have much problems with keeping monsters in your bubbles. also worth noting that devs said that elder dragons are not a priority in this game so u will be able to trap and stunlock a lot more monsters in your "danger zone"... sounds kinda bonkers
They turbo buffed the 2nd Charged Slash that GS has too though
@@Hectic2525 oh thats interesting. so now u rly want to hit as many charged attacks as possible huh
I think people might be reading a bit too much into that whole Elder Dragons thing. I heard that more like "they won't be the story focus like in World", not "there'll be little to no Elders in Wilds. We'll see though.
But that aside, I didn't know about any GS nerfs, that's interesting. Like you said it is getting some crazy positioning control, so maybe that's a compensation change...or maybe there'll be a new playstyle they're trying to push?
@@KPlaysHere i kinda understand that info as "there might be bit less elder dragons overall and they might appear later in the story"... but in the end i guess we will see what will actually happen when game will be out lel.
when it comes to GS... no idea. my knowledge about that weapon is far too small to predict anything when it comes to big playstyle changes and stuff... but if they buff middle of the combo and nerf end of it then i guess they might want to lure players into doing full charged combo instead of constantly skipping to TCS with tackles and side slapping
You can super dive while your weapon in out. Why is no one talking about that. That's a big change
Wait, how, where did you see that?
@@Hectic2525 1:27 in the video
@@houseofthehuntinghorn1433 Oh! He was tripped by the longsword user there I'm pretty certain.
@Hectic2525 i don't think so that's not the first time I've seen it. It's in alot of the videos. The showed it in the very first video
@@houseofthehuntinghorn1433 I'd check the stamina. Doesn't seem like they lost any
so just to throw my brainrot idea for an echo bubble buff here:
imagine a rocksteady bubble.
Imagine how many people in Multiplayer that coudl get killed.
it would be glorious and they would never do it right?
I mean, you joke, but it'd probably actually work pretty well. Just give it damage reduction too and give us some form of active healing (health augment, healing songs, etc) and you'd be golden. Without that...yeah it'd 100% be a trolling tool lol
it would work well its just that before you get a decent ammount of healing or on a non healing horn it can absolutely work against you. greatsword players would drool at it though.
rocksteady also doesnt protect against status ailments outside of stun so that has some balancing effect as well and rise did have the sonic barrier song which just gave everyone a hit of armour for 3 seconds.
@@lucasmueller5038 oh yeah, Sonic Barrier was the same way. Especially before they added the damage reduction
Honestly though the thing I am most interested in will be new notes. there do seem to be some song changes but at least from what I could see from the demo they havent really touched the songlists and those are IMO one of the bigger issues of horn balancing. 20% more damage is a crazy buff on any weapon and considering its a partywide buff it probably is the main reason horn has been held back so much and moreso been pushed into element if you wanted to do optimal damage lategame.
Outside of attack up though most songs are actually kind of really bad. most of the elemental defense songs you can find strewn around on songlists that have no real use or worse are on horns with that same element which 10/10 horn design there, and other songlists are just straight up way too good.
Shout out to the red/blue note combo getting health up, attack up L and defense up L which makes it the perfect songlist for progression.
Genuinely the echo bubbles seem a good way to finally get AWAY from balancing around attack up XL being on a horn though I do get the feeling it will remain the main song horn wants to have, meanwhile all the elemental defense songs give 7 elemental defense when encored which confuses me because defense up XL is just a 20% boost to defense so I would expect the elemental defense buff to be a bit bigger.
It is nice that they finally addressed the universal issue of attack endlag which made HH and gunlance so clunky to use,
but the song buffs still need to be touched up a lot since the elemental defense buffs are pretty much worthless since they are often not part of the red note songlist,
and also just 7 elemental defense, which again why bother unless its on a horn you want to use anyway.
The yellow note is genuine bait and should be abolished with its damned sonic bomb effect because most of the songlists its part of are the worst on the game except for the one it gets with red note because the rednote gets exclusive rights to attack up XL for some reason.
On the other hand also there are like 2 songlists total (in world, because wilds seems to be using world as base) that have elemental attack up, and a single one for status.
Those I believe add a flat 30 per level of the song played which I believe is nerfed from Old world where it was % based I believe, though only stuff I used it on got status/element capped.
Element/status up are just worse then attack up XL unless you have a squad of like 3 DBs or elemental guns and even then the element cap can screw you.
Status horn is kind of a meme but the 1 songlist that gets status up I believe is actually pretty amazing so that is actually worth using as support or heck even damage.
also genuinely most of the other song buffs are pretty situational.
the healing songs I can see why they stay so low in power because there the potential is literally 4 horns using those songs nonstop to achieve immortality but the flipside is that horns with the healing songlist kinda just have low damage anyway? Also you can still achieve immortality by simply doing enough damage that the monster cant act which is very much possible so my best guess is that they keep those songs garbage so that new players dont abuse them to not have to use potions and stuff which I guess is fair.
Problem is that healing (s) is one of the more common songlists and utter garbage to use once you get out of LR, the healing (M) song exists for some reason and is coupled with antidote which is not only weird but also extremely rare and the healing (L) songlist is genuinely the rarest songlist in the game maybe next to the healing (M) songlist which confuses me greatly considering HH is supposed to be a "support" weapon.
all the other songs btw ranging from no stamina drain, which is pretty worthless on horn but I guess DBs will love you for it, to knockback resistance, again pretty decent in MP so that LS and DBs dont bully you, to earplugs and the wind resist songs are all nice songs to have but they are just that.
NICE.
They will not change your playstyle much they will not affect you or your party much they are nice incidental buffs that you probably get credited for because lets be honest there will be a longsword player and he will bully the poor lance and the lance player will love you for every single second of knockback resistance you can get him.
but they arent build or even playstyle defining.
at best you get a matchup like wind resist vs kushala or the status horn actually vs chameleos because the status songlist gets status immunity which is hilarious.
But those are the best case scenarios and they dont exist for some songs.
Again the element resist songs give 7 elemental resist when encored for 1 element. who is this helping.
Who are all the buffs for that get stuck to eachother when there is no main buffing song on the horn list.
Why bother using a horn that has 2 songs to heal you with and a song that boosts your natural recovery when its statline is middling and you are doing something a wide range set nowadays can do better.
If you want me to play a song either make the buff it gives worth having like actually preventing a damned elemental blight for instance, having gradual healing that extends past red health, or give me frontier horn where they jsut said fck it and gave you attack up XL as a base song.
Give me songs that have actual impact and not have me note its existence before scrolling past a horn on the forge tree because there will inevitably be horns stuck with healing only songlists.
Most importantly please get rid of songs being stuck to certain notes, fck blue note being the defense note and red being the offense note so many horns just die because they get stuck with certain note colours and please just make individual damned songlist.
Also screw the yellow note, its just a noise maker.
No I wont tell you how long this took me to type.
The reason I chose hunting horn as my first weapon was because the base weapon was third in overall damage and had the ability to apply buffs to myself and possible team mates. But now it can hit harder while still applying buffs. How soon before HH becomes mainstream?
@@purpleslushie hopefully February 28th, 2025? Or whenever they finally drop that demo lol
I don't know that I want HH to become mainstream. I feel like a hero when I show up with a weapon that few hunters use. And those rare and odd occasions that 3 or 4 HH hunters converge are all the sweeter. Of course, I'm not even sure that it would become mainstream even if the damage was in the top 3. Its design is simply seen as "user-unfriendly" to many. And that's kinda a beautiful thing. Because when you can wield it properly, it feels great. All I want is for the developers to give it the love it deserves. Ideally it does not need to exceed, but instead be on par with other great options.
Guess we wait for the Downloadable Demo. More people playing gives out more video to analyze.
@@rustybucket164 really wish we got access to that training barrel. We'd be able to get SO much info using that
Do you know if the effects of more than one hunting horn players STACKS???
if it's the same kind of song, it won't stack (so multiple HH players providing attack up will not stack)
Are there going to be different sized bubbles? I only ask because all the ones from the gameplays I've seen are smaller than the one in the HH trailer.
@@marmyeater I'm guessing/hoping that that's an effect of Horn Maestro
I might have to rant a little. I have literally no idea what they're trying to do with Great Sword. They nerfed TCS considerably (it now only does 15% more damage than Strong Charged Slash compared to its previous 100% in Iceborne), possibly to compensate for the fact that you can basically do a 180 degree turn after the first hit of TCS, which honestly does not make sense to me. I can't imagine many greatsword mains even wanted to be able to turn around in the middle of a True Charged Slash. People argue that Capcom wants to combat TCS spam, but then why did they buff it in Iceborne? Also, now that (like in Rise) you can't chain Strong Wide Slash into Strong Charged Slash anymore, you are literally forced to finish with TCS. And I don't even want them to buff Charged and Strong Charged Slash, I don't want all 3 main charged slashes to feel same-y.
From comparing damage numbers against Doshaguma, the Offset Follow-Up might actually now have the highest motion values in the GS moveset. If Great Sword doesn't have the biggest single motion value out of all weapons anymore, I'm seriously considering switching mains for good
I only now just got to the part of the video where you mention damage output similar to greatsword and honestly... yeah that checks out considering all the bewildering changes they've made to GS
In that regard, I wouldn't even call TCS "one of the strongest hits in the game" anymore. It's just pitiful
Like, I already wasn't missing very many of my TCS. So my damage output will be massively decreased by this. Thanks
I wasn't aware that they'd tweaked GS numbers along with the other changes they made with it. That's... definitely interesting in an odd kinda way if true. Usually they just build straight onto GS gameplay, not adjust how you approach it
Even if horn users decided to speedrun shit before the games even out in the demo. I doubt that capcoms gonna nerf it because the directions wilds seems to be going is by spitting in the existing meta crowds collective face and going with makeing all the weapons collectively viable, and swamping us with options, so figurieng out "a meta" is gonna be an obnoxious chore for the cultists to strive for so thats hype worthy honestly
That crowd'll be fine as far as I've seen. Metas will always be able to be found out before long. Weapons each usually have their own, and then they get compared to each other pretty much ONLY when it comes to speedrunning
@@KPlaysHere I think what ever meta is developed is going to be easily disputed by the sheer variety of combos / builds available. And what ever eventually is decided as the best will be easily throw out when considering less then peak play compared to other strategys which the players have figured out works for themselves and their playstyles
@@Willowsworldx3 there's usually a ton of variety regardless, but eventually the best combination of things is usually figured out. There'll still end up being a BUNCH of options for people that just want to do their own thing. 2 separate worlds with 2 different approaches to the game if you ask me. If you're not usually worried about minmaxing, I wouldn't be too concerned with whatever the meta may be
@@KPlaysHere i addmitly agree with everpart of your previous comment
i was in the believe that the monster only gets damaged by one bubble at a time. So more bubbles only increases the likelihood for a monster standing in it. But not the damage. Correct me if there are different infos out there
@@firemage8707 oh no, multiple bubbles=multiple instances of damage. You can actually see it happening in the HH teaser trailer, and a few times early in that Rey Dau fight I'm talking about in this video
@@KPlaysHere hmm yea look like it. crazy. if that stays that way I can already see me getting annoyed trying to setup optimal damage (3 bubbles)... will be very rare xD
Hoping bubbles get nerfed into the ground
I will fight you lol
@@VerbalusKlumpus all 15 of us will
@@londorsblade7241 oh, so you don't like getting song buffed, huh...
Sounds bad but honestly I agree, locking a large portion hunting horn damage behind the target being stationary is a horrible way to design the weapon. Flying and mobile monsters are going to feel terrible, and trap spam was something I already disliked playing with in other titles. Nerfing or even removing bubble would go a long way to making the weapon better.
@@failfist9308 stationary is a bit of an on paper situation. In practice you'll probably just be doing what they did in the Rey Dau fight and shifting the bubbles around to just net some extra damage, and in solo it'll become easier than most expect it to keep up. On 1 hand I get how it could look bad to have so much damage 'locked' behind these, but on the other they kinda have to be strong or you probably wouldn't be encouraged to bother with them much. Just look at how little Bead of Resonance was used, despite literally giving Attack Up to every HH. They've already added them to the game and built the weapon around utilizing them so removing them is out, and nerfing would really just be a net negative