The WORST thing to say to someone in a narcissistic relationship "YOU'RE BOTH CRAZY"
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- Опубликовано: 29 июн 2024
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Labeling you equally at fault as the abuser is siding with the abuser.
I agree, I was talking to a "friend" who said it was my fault, and I never felt the same about them after they said it.
💯
@@ericawarren, that's not a friend. They do that to you? That's not a friend...
@@ericawarrenno accountability. Always somebody else’s fault.
Oh my gosh, yes!!!!!
"Do not invalidate the experience of people in these relationships so you can make sense of the world that you want to live in. We don't live in that world". Very good point and well said Dr. Ramani!!!
My family did that all the time!
@@diornotwar2356 well said!
Ah yes and “it’s your fault for picking him”!
Or "I never really liked him."
Haha. I always have blamed myself for getting in all my horrible relationships. I always said I had a bad picker. I didn't realize until much later that my toxic family had set me up. I would never say that to another victim, though.
Yeah, that is gross 😝
@denisedevoto5703 Someone told me that red flags are my "normal." Cover them with love-bombing so that I can't see the toxicity, and it feels like "home." They warned me that if I felt an immediate deep connection with someone, that was a red flag that I was missing red flags.
You need to be careful who you tell about the Narc in your family lest telling them WORSEN the situation for YOU.
Yes. A family like that is not a family; it's a cult.
He picked me...I didn't pick him. But stayed 50yrs ... finally free for 6 yrs. And loving my life now! Especially when I go to bed and can relax!
Lundy Bancroft has more than 30 yrs experience researching abusive men. He says the Family Court system are the biggest enablers of abuse today. We need serious change ASAP!
And then some men complain about women having it better. They are blind and popular media pushes this lies.
He came to do a lecture at my work several years ago, it was SO good. I had just read his book and found the information invaluable!
@@debperkinswhitney7736 His book, "Why Does He Do That?" helped save me from my DV marriage. He is amazing.
yes. my enabling mother would say that about my narcissistic brother and i. as if i'm supposed to have zen master levels of self control no matter how much i was being abused, provoked and mistreated. "your emotions control you! who cares what he says or does! you need to learn to brush it off", while saying nothing to my brother
Hard to do being narcs are full blown emotional predators . I slip up to much but getting better when triggered
My mother used to say, just ignore him & he'll go away. My brother abused me & my sister verbally & physically. There was no ignoring him. He was a large, angry, young man. We were just kids, I was the youngest. She also told me that I caused it because I didn't think before speaking.
Same here!! Somehow it was my obligation to be sooo much more mature and patient than him AND her. Crazy
They definitely don’t bring out the best of you. and you can definitely lose who you really are. It just takes a long time to heal depending how long you’ve been in the relationship
That happened to me
Whole my life
The first was my mom second - my ex.
She gaslighted me and made me do horrible uncharacteristic things and pointed her finger and said “ see you are a monster”…Not only did i hare her for 8 long years, I hated myself….taken me 5 years to heal, getting remarried in the fall to the kindest sweetest woman Ive ever met, her name translates to Angel 👼
I didn't feel that therapy was what I needed...
I hated the narcissist by then and repairing
the relationsh*t was a joke. So I left.
Same. The therapist was convinced I really was the problem because I didn’t want to participate.
@@nopereradicator Same. All my therapists were like that.
Me: "I don't need to do the work, I need to be safe."
Therapist: *rage, denial, fleeing, ghosting*
Do not ever go to couple's therapy with a narcissist!
@@carriemccurley-th8gn TRUTH!!!
The family court system is notorious for doing this and narcissistic people are masters at exploiting it.
So are lawyers, parental evaluators, divorce coaches, police officers, CPS, etc. An abysmal lack of education and training. And sometimes out and out hostility and vindictiveness and narcissism themselves.
@@phoenixrising5338 My parents are "narcs" and laywers. F*ck me.
When the first thing the court asks you to do is tell the truth then proceeds to ask your residential address, if you divorce and go back to your former name they want you to announce it in front of the narcissist why wouldn’t they exploit it? The court is the ultimate enabler. And you’re in contempt the moment you try to save yourself.
Been there
And my ex knew that I'm sensitive to it and dragged me thru courts endless times
The Worse Thing To Say To Someone That’s In A Narcissistic Relationship The Most Important Thing Is Being Sensitive.
And Never Discount Their Pain!!
My least favorite was “you need to look at what’s wrong with you that you tolerated it”
“Wrong” is not a good word, it is true though. I know that my mistake was buying into the narcissist fantasy and signing a covert contract with her. Now I know that she is a narcissist, she will never change and I can’t do anything about it. I also know that I will never play a hero or a saviour and I will never accept invitation to a narcissist fantasy again. I learnt my lesson. If you don’t admit your part you will never learn and something like this can happen again with another narcissist. Obviously I’m talking about relationships between two adults, not between narcissistic parents and a kid who has no choice.
So frequently hurled at me!! By supposedly close friends and relatives to boot...
This always feels like in Yu-Gi-Oh when the main character was like "YOU JUST ACTIVATED MY TRAP CARD" to me
What was wrong with me? I was 9 and unable to leave, and when I asked for help they believed the abuser and blamed me just like you're doing now.
most people only tolerate it because others(Society, your parents ect.)teach you to tolerate it.
@@stevenhuntley8706EXACTLY!! Same thing they did to me. It's NORMAL to end up blaming yourself *if that's what the world around you pushes you to do*. It's protective.
When criticism is now leveled at me about the marriage.... small community... my favorite response.... did you eat with him,sleep with him,drive with him, live with him?? No?? Then you don't know either of us and or the marriage
Yeah, I've had people say that it was my fault for having married him. Their apathy is cruel and the rejection of others, (and especially of counselors), has become a trauma of its own.
That's insane and fucked up 🫂
I do hear you, and I feel you and understanding....
I’ve heard many times “you’re both toxic.” I’m toxic cuz I stay with or keep going back with him.
That sounds like what I say about myself. My toxic mistake was marrying him in the first place.
I have been called crazy, difficult and other hurtful things for finally standing up for myself to exert healthy boundaries. It’s been hurtful but I will not be silenced anymore. I will protect myself and loved ones from abuse. Making sure I do not believe their lies. Focusing on truths and my life. Thank you Dr Ramani ❤
Same. I was diagnosed as crazy and given antipsychotics for 6-7 years, starting age 17, for asking for help about my parents abuse.
I don't think I'll survive the them, honestly.
@@BL-sd2qw hang in there! Don’t give up! It’s not your fault and you are not alone! You are loved ❤️
@@costelloandlizzievolk2233 Yeah, I don't appreciate these comments anymore.
People telling me what to do or telling me to have hope but not helping me in any way, not wanting to help me in any way and not giving me any reasons to believe that things can improve are the reason why I'm in such situation. If you wanna help, go somewhere and start helping. If you wanna be a toxic positivity heroe, don't come near me. I'm allergic to that.
One often hears the comment " well, it takes 2 to 'dance' " and I have Always said " when One of the parties is deliberately lying, triangulating, gaslighting, manipulating With Intent to decieve Or destroy That is Not the other person's fault !" Not when One is 'Predator' and the Other is ' prey'..!
Dr. Ramani, Please, PLEASE, talk about adult COVERT narcissistic children disrespecting, mistreating a parent, turning their spouse and children against their own mother!! I am 81 years old.
❤❤❤
I’m sorry 😢❤
I am so sorry I feel your pain. Going a bit through that myself. So much of your grandchildren’s loss😢narcs don’t care who they hurt . Including their own children. Have you looked into parental alienation on RUclips?
I second that also !!
I agree. This is one area that there is very little information on and in my opinion is the most horrific. Sending you hugs!
In a narc relationship, there are two sides to every story. One who is lying and one who is telling the truth.
Exactly!
I tried to tell people that my wife was emotionally abusing me. They didn't listen to me because I was diagnosed PTSD, depression, Autism, and ADHD. They kept on telling me that I'm a difficult person to deal with when that wasn't true. I literally have a friend since I was in 2nd grade. I greatly value deep friendship bonds. I only have a few number of friends but have close bonds with all of them. I never could get a close bond with my wife because she was abusing me.
I had to record my wife's rage event towards me before people started to listen to me. To this day, I'm having a hard time trusting in people that dismissed my plea for help and people in general.
That sounds just like what Johnny Depp went through. I'm sorry you weren't believed when you should have been. No one deserves to be treated like that.
My aunt did this. Flying monkey. Took her brother’s side and told me I was equally as narcissistic as my father. Effectively she abandoned me with him, a total psycho, when I needed her help. She gave him all credit.
They take your money and hide theirs.
I get this so much, thank you for being our voice dr. Ramani.
Yes finally a voice for all the sh#t we as victims have had to endure ❤
I concur
Regularly ‘dismantled’ - that word sums up the turmoil and confusion these narcs put us through, completely! It’s true, others only see what they think is petty stuff, and if we react upset or annoyed, it is the accumulation of abuse, we aren’t robots ….. and sometimes its over a prolonged period of years too, not to mention we are the ones living in this unhealthy situation. I’d like to see those who judge or enable the narcs, cope as well as we do without falling flat on their faces, hmm 😔
Right???❤❤
Reading words like this is so empowering to finally be able to learn more words to put to experiences that I just didn't have the words to talk about before but reading these stories is helping me linguistic cognitive empowerment
🌎 ❤ 🌻
Well said! Thank you! ❤
THANK GOD YOU UNDERSTAND, OMG❤❤❤❤❤❤ It's as if nobody can actually understand the Truth about the absolute craziness of narcissist relationships!!!!! Have heard the detached responses from outside folks, it's so hard!!!!
Thank you Dr Ramini ❤
My ex lives very nearby ,therefore there are the odd interactions with him, usually leading to me wondering ' what just happened?'
It's so easy for him to push my buttons.. but I'm definitely getting better at grey rocking him and not falling for his tricks. It's a hard task avoiding all contact, but I'm stronger now than 6 months ago that's for sure!! xx
Don’t ever go back!!!
🍀
This is so real for me. So often my normal human reaction, even just having less Than positive emotions about the dynamics in one of many relationships like this, has been met with so much of the blame game. I'm so tired of folks focusing on the reaction, normal or even triggered, instead of the abuse that caused it.
💯
Yes. This entire video is so relatable that I almost cried watching it...cried out of frustration and devastation. I've never tried so hard at anything in my entire life as I tried to make my last relationship work. I had two great individual therapists over the course of the relationship, neither of which thought I was pathological, and both of which were quite pointed in telling me that what I was experiencing was, indeed, abuse. But at the same time that I was in individual therapy, we were in couples counseling together, and I did react poorly and had a hard time regulating during those couples sessions. There were times I did look like a crazy woman. It was like that one hour a week was the only time that I could bring up topics that were routinely swept under the rug, dismissed, or that he would become angry about if I brought them up. So I was trying to cram so much into that little hour of time each week, as I knew it would be my only opportunity until the next session, a week later. So no, I'm not proud of how I acted. Sometimes I would cry my eyes out during a session as I tried to speak, very embarrassing. Other times I would find myself getting worked up and tried to "rapidfire" so many things, because couples therapy was literally the only time I could do so. Any other time I tried to talk about any of this, I would be shut down And made to regret having brought it up. Things were good if I just shut up, agreed with him fully, spoke only positively, even if he was in a negative mood, never complained, didn't ask for much of his energy/attention/time--that was when he was the happiest with me. But that wasn't sustainable. I would "break" like your client in the story you told during therapy sessions, and sometimes outside of them, because it was just impossible for me to remain small and quiet 100% of the time. Couples therapist thought we were both awful. And a lot of mutual friends who obviously liked us both and didn't want to take sides would also reiterate that "there is always fault to be had on both sides" "it takes two to tango" -- to the point where, as you say, I started to really believe I was an inherently terrible partner. i'm still not certain that my last partner was/is an actual narcissist, like NPD, but he sure does act like it. Everything was made worse spite his substance use and drinking, no doubt, but regardless, I guess I will never know for sure.I just feel like such a big failure though. And wish I had done things differently.
Don't feel that way!!!
🍀
Oh no, you did the best that anyone could in that situation. You didn't fail at all. If he acted like a narcissist I'm sure he was. Especially with the substance abuse and drinking. You must have gone through hell. I know people like that can also be so charming and fun on the good days which makes you doubt yourself and even blame yourself, but they also choose to pair up with empathic partners because they are narcissists. If you managed to get out of it give yourself a big pat on the back. You did great! You gave yourself the rest of your life to enjoy instead of having to walk on eggshells for your entire life.
I have spent my entire life having others blame me for my mother's behavior. She will create a bad situation and convince well educated people that I am responsible for why she made the situation untenable. I am therefore, expected to take the blame and to fix the situation that she created. I'm sick of people not listening when I try to tell them I cannot control my mother's mind or her behavior and to expect that I could is absolutely bizarre.
I have a coworker who's husband is a narcissist and they have children together. I was shocked when she told me she actually studied narcissism to better get along with her husband. And that she keeps quiet at home so that they don't have a fight. Or rather to have less fights. I've told her that my mother is a narcissist and that, from experience, I know she won't change. And that her husband won't change. But I know she has to make the decision that she and her children deserve better.
People who try to “both sides” it and say we’re both crazy make me want to show that person what crazy is
Thank you, Dr. Ramani.
For the people who’ve been made to look like they’re crazy when they’re suffering with narcissistic abuse.
Sexlessness. Sharing a bed with someone who doesn’t acknowledge you are a sexual being hurts so much. I was in a sexless marriage for years. Being a woman with a high libido, I felt inadequate. Worst I feel invisible. The man who was “supposed” to want me, just didn’t. We talked about it many times, more than I can recall now. It was always me. I wanted too much - once a week was too much for him. I didn’t initiate - he was always complaining of headaches, stomaches, always stressed, always tired. I was too sexual - when being subtle doesn’t work, what is next? Explicitly saying I wanted sex. Oh but then it was not appropriate. Conversations would end up with him saying he didn’t feel desired or I made him feel emasculated because he didn’t want sex as much as I did. Yeah, it was always me. I could never win. While we were dating we would have a decent amount of sex, it was good. The first huge red flag was not having sex in our honeymoon - which I ignored. It rapidly decrease to once a week, then every other week. Years gone by it was months in between, by the time we divorced it was over a year with no sex. I cried myself to sleep more times that I can count. I didn’t understand what was wrong with me. Was I that undesirable? Was I repulsive? After those conversations, I just stopped trying, initiating, mentioning sex. We were still loving - holding hands, hugging, kissing - but sex was off the table. He then cheated on me. Swore he had sex only 4 times in a year (or more) long affair. It didn’t matter. For years my self worth was damaged by him, years of low self esteem, years of feeling less of a woman, the marriage that was more than over, waiting in hospice, really ended. Funny how things are, I asked him for a divorce, he manipulated me into staying, next day his infidelity came to light. I was out as soon as I could. Best thing of my life. Additionally, That feeling when your partner cheated and you don't have the courage to leave him / her so you just death with the pain and live everyday asking questions about your worth. This pain is different from the cheating one_living and seeing him everywhere anticipating when he or she do it again. The best thing is to hire a private investigator digitalinvestigate@gmail.com to help you spy on their cellphone remotely just like he did for me...
I relate.
This is a spam comment that has been copy pasted on various videos on this channel. Wtf is that elaborate story just to promote/trick people into contacting that shady email address.
@@ZephyrinSkies omg I replied then deleted. Thanks, I didn’t read to the end. That’ll teach me 🙏🏻
Nobody can consent to abuse. If you consent it’s not abuse. Nobody is responsible to abuse
Right! And no one wants abuse. Some people say, "You want to be abused or you'd leave." No, a thousand times no!
Yes absolutely!!!!!
I was always dismissed & told we were just a “crazy couple”
Thank you so much for exposing this ideology for the invalidation it truly is 😌🙏💜
I believe this is just another symptom of not judging one’s behavior that has become pervasive and extremely destructive. No responsibility. Equality gone wild.
"Don't judge" only applies to the original offense, never to the reaction, society fully expects you to judge the reaction, just not the crime.
@@stevenhuntley8706Exactly. They judge you for how you react, but they don't judge them for what they did to you.
Yes, I have heard that comment and several others even more hurtful. I have even been Blamed for and accused of " allowing " him to " get away with" so many treacherous little secrets he was involved with that I didn't even Know about At The Time !
"She's her father's daughter!" (The one time I reacted in protest to my narcissistic father.)
So unfair.
I had an individual therapist who wanted me to take my narcissist then-husband on a couples retreat to "rebuild the relationship." I was telling her I was leaving because of abuse and she suddenly suggests a couples retreat "to do trust exercises." My response was, "Are YOU insane?!" She was replaced quickly. The level of sheer stupidity among people who should know better is astonishing. I really think we should start being able to bring professional complaints or even lawsuits against anyone in therapy or the family court system for this kind of thing. If there isn't some sort of teeth put into some consequences this isn't going to change.
Absolutely! Therapists giving abusive "feedback" should be illegal.
My former therapist doesn't understand toxic relationship dynamics. I fired him as soon as he talked about repairing a relationship. I hadn't even said I wanted to improve it. Obviously, he didn't listen to me at all. 💢
I also got rid of an ex-friend who said, "It's up to both of you." No. I wasn't responsible at all.
This is why I work hard to control myself and my actions. Even if you rightfully react to their abuse/bullying/lies etc. then they get to see "it's both our faults."
Even if you're mildly annoyed. "Why are you so defensive?"
If you're too calm: "What are you? A psychopath?"
Thank you! ❤ I’m so tired of the labels and the emotional abuse from OTHER people, friends family “therapists” who label you with “crazy” “damaged” “”codependent” etc to slander you and make you look and feel guilty for ever having been in an abusive relationship. It’s actually abusive when people do this and they are just as guilty of abuse and slander as anyone else. They’re actually a stumbling block for victims trying to reach out for help and get out of an abusive relationship z
I grew up in a difficult family situation, which got worse when I was in my teens. The abusive parent was very good at convincing his/her new 'friends' that I was the problem. People who I had never met before would suddenly lecture me about what a 'difficult' life the abusive parent had and how I (still a child) should be supporting him/her. I used to go wooden (which I suppose was the freeze response.) Even a member of the extended family would sometimes tick me off. In every case, these new 'friends' would quickly disappear, never to be seen again, and not one of them ever apologised to me for misunderstanding the situation and taking the abuser's side without even asking me what was going on. To add insult to injury, the extended family member treated me in adult life to a lecture about how badly my abuser had treated HER, expecting me to sympathise. What hurt the most though was close family members trying (in my opinion) to score points by saying '*You're as bad as each other*,' forgetting or ignoring the fact that I was the child in this situation. Both of them in adult life complained TO ME about how the abuser treated them, expecting sympathy, but I had no words. When I was growing up I don't think anyone remotely understood just what I was going through. My abuser was excellent at putting on a saintly act for just long enough to temporarily convince outsiders. I have diagnosed complex PTSD.
If it helps any, just know that I feel for you and empathize with you. You were an innocent child and you were treated horribly. I'm so sorry you had to go through that.
@@mellie5899 Thank you.
I'm so glad you are going to England to offer them help. They seem to be ahead of the USA in realizing humans are being manipulated by lying Narcissistic Government Operations & I'm concerned about them now.🕵️💓🙏
North Carolina is a big state. You’ll be close to South Carolina.. Awe Mother Nature❤
Narcissists projection brings out the worst in someone. All the stuff someone had already got under control before they met the narcissist.
My couple therapist said that whether I was a victim of narcissistic abuse depended on how I vented. It was outrageous that I was almost pushed to depression and got told I was the problem. So careful with your choice of therapists - some of them are really incompetent
Yes, yes, and yes.
I think the stigma of mental illness is still very prevalent in today's society and feeds into what Dr. Ramani is talking about.
It's almost as if when someone seeks professional help for their emotional issues, the system and the court of public opinion works against them in the worst ways imaginable.
Having treated patients in Psychiatry, I found a good majority of my patients were the victims of Narc abuse. If we could start getting justice from narc abuse, then maybe we could stop medicating most of this, and end the mental health crisis. It's truly so sad and you're right, it just fuels the courts bias about the victim.
This resonates a lot. I often got told "You are both wrong", "You both need to work your issues out", and "I am not interested in hearing this" while always listening attentively to the narcissist. It was harmful and crushing to bear. Narcissists deserve each other and should belong together
I was the crazy. The reactive abuser. He was the passive aggressive covert narcissist. He baited and I reacted. 7 therapists in 14 years. He looked like the paragon of virtue. I looked like the nut job. The 8th therapist saw it all April 2016. Divorced and left June 2017
Yes, Ive heard that.
Same
Dr Ramani you never fail to make me feel validated and seen, thank you. 🙏🏼❤️
Most people don’t want to know and would not want to ‘take sides’. That’s fair enough, just do not share with them. Find your tribe and only trust those who can validate your feelings with compassion.
THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR WHAT YOU DO❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤ VERY GRATEFUL ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
People that have never been thru a narcissistic relationship have zero idea of the mental gymnastics that the abused go thru just to not trigger a narc. So when it becomes too much and we blow; we are looked at as crazy. My most hated piece of advice is to use the "I feel" preamble with a narcissist...yeah like they care how I feel...using "I feel" just gives the narc extra time to formulate a dismission response.
Yes! Saying, "When you do ........, I feel............" only works if the person has empathy to begin with. And don't try explaining feelings to a true narcissist. They don't understand or care to understand.
Yes, if you say something like that to a Narc, they will make you feel like you stupid, sensitive. That's one more excuse for them to leash out on you. And after that you learn not to complain or expose your feelings anyways.
Shout out to Dr. Ram for going above and beyond with the volume of content you have been posting! I can't wait until you get the opportunity to be on The JRE.
He will platform you and we all would love to hear a raw and uncut conversation of y'all.
You wanna know who's really crazy? The people out here calling people in relationships with narcissists "crazy."
Be careful what you tolerate, you are teaching people how to treat you.
G'day Dr Ramani. Thanks for sharing.🐨
Yes. In a Bible class of all scenarios. My father in law pointed a comment at me in response to something the teacher had said regarding marital difficulties. He said, ‘yeah because one of them is crazy, or maybe both of them.’ Daddy has always been number one in my marriage, and I’m not very religious anymore.
It ran me up out there of religion too. They love hiding behind a bible.
Lots of fake Christians aka wolves in sheep's clothing. They say they are Christian to cover their wicked deeds. If it was popular to be Satanic then that's what they would become. Whatever mask is needed to get their desires fulfilled. Satan loves these people. They discredit Christianity while at the same time are able to inflict massive damage to people, families, and society unnoticed.
People don't read the Bible nowadays. They rely on what so and so told so and so that they saw on a video recommended by so and so. The power to defeat these fake Christian narcs is right there in the Bible. Quote some verses out of Proverbs to your "Christian" dad and watch him act the way a demon would at hearing the word of God IN PROPER CONTEXT.
Satan twisted scripture to tempt Jesus. He has his minions do the same to people. "Judge not". Yeah what about the rest of that verse? Judge not for in the same manner you judge it shall be meted back unto you. In other words, the standard you judge others by is the standard they will judge you by. Modern people think "judge not" means they can judge others and say the most vile filth then squawk "judge not" when the person presents their rebuttal.
YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!👍👍 Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you!!!!!!❤❤❤
Yep. I def heard that multiple times because he was good at making promises in private and breaking them in public. And so my reactions to things seemed unwarranted because no one knew that what he was saying to me in private was totally different compared to what he was telling them and what was actually happening in public.
I didn't understand why other people acted like I was the bad person until years later when I realized what they were being told.
I haven't heard "you're both crazy", but I've felt labeled as toxic. My spouse once had to explain to a mutual acquaintence about how I had gone no contact with a sibling. Their response was "Oh, my husband's family is like that too, they're always not speaking to each other", in a that's crazy, ir you're one of those kind of people tone of voice. It's very hurtful because it took me almost 60 years to reach the last straw.
damn 40 years of shutting up and shutting down , sssssssssooooooooooooooooooooo much compound scarring
Dr.Ramani,I have heard this recently and it was so 🤕 hurtful.
Brilliant. You keep it so real and relatable, Dr. Ramani, and you have a fantastic base of experience to draw from. My family dismisses this way a lot.
Oh yes. Heard it many times. I just accept it now...
I was the target of the narcissist. The jealousy was palpable. She consistently went after me to separate my son and I, and when I broke, I was the bad person. He can’t see it ! Thank you for helping me to understand.
Yes, my Narc family all said that it was my fault for 'choosing' the Covert Malignant Narcist husband monster, but they were so happy with him at the wedding!
& They would compliment him!
After he stole & abandoned & left me in debt, they all said that they never liked him. So convient after the fact.
& Then when I said that I wished that they had told me that they didn't like him, they would respond by blaming me, they said 'you wouldn't have believed me', or 'I thought that you were smart enough to figure it out on your own'
& now that the Monster Narc ex is trying to take what little I have left, my family says things like 'well, why wouldn't he take your stuff', no normal responses like "that's terrible '
No wonder I ended up with a monster.
Yes definitely been told I was crazy and found out I was not
I'll be honest. At the end of the day, I don't care if they are "crazy" or not. If they are harmful and vile to me while they are in the relationship with the narcissist, but refuse to take accountability for their actions or use the relationship as an excuse for their sh*tty behaviour, I don't have to forgive them or feel sorry for them. I absolutely refuse to be maltreated by anyone, ever again. It may seem like an extreme boundary, but I won't play those games. Being in an abusive relationship may be the reason why you use and abuse other people, but it is not an excuse. It doesn't make it okay. Until I feel like the apology is genuine and heartfelt and the accountability has been taken, I won't even consider it.
That being said, I don't use the word crazy to describe people. I would never tell someone that I thought they were "crazy!"
Our adult children do this... but I get it, they love their father. I don't want them to love him less. They don't want to see him as abusive. I get it. They shouldn't have to choose. But he does things around them that if I react to, they respond that I'm taking it wrong and being reactive... later he uses what they say like a hammer against me. It's worse because recently deconstructed my former high demand religion. Now I don't have a community. I don't want my children to be my go to. My mother did that to me... so I'm isolated. It doesn't help we both recently lost jobs. I want to leave, but I would lose everything...
I get this too, it’s hard when you see how impacted and confused your kids become as they reach adulthood, not so obvious when they were younger 😢 Part of us wants to let out all the years of abuse their dad has done to us, but then we don’t want to upset them and make them feel they have to choose, nor do we need their invalidation too 😔
Mentally physical, I was exhausted. Try to make her happy nothing would never work is harder when nobody believes… no matter how much you try and never see you happy it is the worst pain somebody can feel when you love a person so much and they treat you like garbage because of you watching your videos. Answer all my questions. You are the best doctor ever thank you for saving my life
Not just other people, but narc does it too. The narc man I married 25yrs ago, any time I would confront him about his disregulated man-child behavior, he NEVER wanted to own it and take sole responsibility for it. Instead he was determined to manipulate and gaslight me into believing I was always equally to blame for HIS behavior. That coupled with an occasional 3rd-party opinion saying the same thing would make me believe the illusion! Thanks to Dr Ramani, I know better now. :)
I have dissociative disorder and was in a relationship with a narcissist who made me realize I have a pattern of picking men who are very much like my parents. This narc though was far worse in that his career has to do with mental health and the mental abuse was so much more along with the physical and sexual stuff. But it made me realize I should not try to be in relationships.
Thank you for your gratefulness in navigating this subject matter, Doctor Ramani Durvasula
I've had a judge tell myself and my narc ex in a custody hearing " I don't like either one of you, you both seem crazy" I replied " I don't like you either" I couldn't help it! I spoke my mind. 😊
You help me so much you made me realize the true your videos are inspiring. I’ve been a victim for 13 years my life got better. You’re amazing.
"Everybody calls ex a narcissist in divorce" - my ex was a borderline and I didn't say, ex didn't call me narcissist despite me having a psychopathic defense mode active (over now) - had she called me a narcissist that would have made CPS screen me bypassing waiting lists
"both have issues" - recent PTSS is very curable thank you very much, and ADHD didn't traumatize me the abuse did that
If your attorney doesn’t understand complex PTSD or narcissistic abuse. I asked my former attorney in great detail how she would handle him. She said she had experience. Not. I was the “difficult” client. I always request that people representing me to get some information. It’s always you. People representing me rarely get the information and I get screwed. I think it should be understood that your attorney is taking control over your life as well. Attorneys representing any victim of narcissistic abuse must understand that the attorney is controlling your life as well. What they argue, what documents are requested, etc. any attorney going against a narcissist must listen to their client even more because the client knows the strategy. The client where to hit a narcissist and when not poke the bear. Attorney’s must understand they are representing you which means you gotta take the hit. You were hired because I don’t have the emotional strength to fight. Attorney snowflake know your client. I wish attorneys would sign an agreement with me spelling out my disability, C-PTSD, and what to expect
Some Couples Therapists start with premise that both people involved in a conflict are equally at fault. I wish they would start with an individual questionnaire.
I may have had some issues before I met him, but he's done everything he can to make those issues worse and add to it!
As I heard many times while I tried to explain the situation with my vulnerable narcissistic husband is: „it takes two to tango“! No, it takes only ONE!
Yes, I definitely heard that. 😢
Such a great video! Thank you for all you do!!
This situation was the topic in a domestic violent group therapy where mostly all the women had similar experiences of being ranted & raged at , boundaries thrashed & some of the women had to contact the police
and by the time police arrived the Narrcissist appeared cool calm & collected and the survivors clearly frantic and beyond consoling appearing like the ones unhinged
Very difficult for those police to understand NPD
I was told my narcissistic Mother told same words to people re myself & ex malignant narcissist while knowing i suffered violent behavior from him & terrorised my young children
It sure was a solo & tough journey going through the legal systems for security orders & eventually ending in divorce
It was a lonely journey as people do not want to believe just how horrific narcissistic abuse can be
Its easier for them to think & say " there was two of them in it" when that is most certainly not the case and we all know by now that
" Its Not You"
Im therapy and healing and absolutely no forgiveness granted as what happened to me was totally unforgivable
Thank you for your unwavering support Dr.Ramini I am forever grateful
I love how Dr Ramani has exactly the right perspective on these things. It takes a certain mind to observe this stuff as the way it is. No, they weren't showing their true colors, nor were they slipping up really, they were reacting to something that's actually important and/or reacting to a catalyst that unleashed mountains of piled up abuse.
This is actually something I kind of fear now. I totally agree with the saying that "if someone shows who they are, trust them the first time" but at the same time, I recognize that everyone can slip up sometimes and act way out of the ordinary for them. Maybe you should look for repeated patterns of behavior after all, just don't wait too long to recognize the pattern.
I am glad spots are still available for the November retreat, because I’m trying to work out a way to go.
Yes and this hurts tremendously….. after years of this abuse from my spouse and I began to realize it was uninformed, lack of understanding people that said this to me… I decided to distance myself from these idiots.
Because I've spoken my truth and own vulnerability I have often been accused of being Narcissistic by Narcissistic people. They all start to Gome out of the woodwork once we have boundaries. 🍒
Oh my gosh thank you thank you thank you no words more true have ever been said that the world just wants this to go away or to make sense of it and it's so misunderstood
Thank you for articulating everything I needed to keep my feet on the ground. ❤
Not that, but categorizing me in with the person who is saying that me and the other person are not getting along. I'm like, me and that other person are not "we".....I am not engaging with that other person like that. I'm not participating with them like they are with me.....like how you have said about having a different experience than the other person.
The narcissistic boy friend had power and bullied me. He was so abusive. I paid for half and he acted like he supported me but irrespective of that he still didn't have the right to bully me. The narcissist, who tortured me, has cancer. I am neutral. I feel nothing. I don't care one way or the other. The "marriage councilor" took his side and was charmed by him. I stopped right away.
The more I read about people's experiences with marriage counseling and therapy the more I know it's not about them as people. There is a huge hole in their education. The whole system of educating therapists needs to be overhauled. How can they help survivors of narcissistic abuse if they either fall for the charm of the abuser or think both parties are equally to blame. It's sick! Good for you for having the wherewithal to stop right away!
Spot on Dr Ramani. Thank you 😊
Excellent video! I suspect in “they’re both crazy” scenarios, more often than not, the narcissistic person comes out on top . . .
People will only talk about how you reacted but not what caused it.
After you've escaped from Hell, you don't want to go back there.
True! ❤
Until one is gaslighting: it is abuse.
Until you know the whole truth: you can't understand the whole picture.
I was just not believed, full stop. After nearly 4 years after leaving a 36 year marriage, I still don't feel believed.