To add a bit more info: IRST tracks the heat signature. This means that IRST won´t be affected by chaff, but it can be affected by flares. It will not "elevate" the lock on low flying targets, but it will also lose targets behind cover much quicker. Probably the biggest disadvantage is, that you always need to look at your target directly to gain a lock, you can no longer use your search radar and directly get a lock, so you may see on you search radar in which direction the traget is, but you have to find out yourself how high it is.
as an SPAA main, this is something i alrrady knew, but its very good to see yhis becoming more known. also, you should always check out if your SPAA can have an increased search range and, on rare occasions, different radar scopes. for example: the roland SAM (all SPAAs with the roland turret) have the search radar at 10km as default, but it can go up to 16km if you want.
Its always been a thing but for spaas without it you can still trick planes if you use radar to detect some spaas can still maintain a lock without radar so turn off your radar and then optically lock onto them using your target lock key binding now they wont get a rwr ping or know your tracking them till your too late works on most spaa at 8.0 or higher with a visible gunners optic
Then you only turn off your search radar, it will still give RWR tone to the target if your tracking "radar" is radar based and not IR or optical tracking. So if you do this on a gepard, it doesnt do anything usefull, but if you do this on an ADATS then you eliminate the search ping on RWR but you wouldn't give them a tracking tone anyway.
Zen only mentioned vehicles that track with radar by default that can switch to IRST, but there are a bunch of other ones with IRST+Radar/Only IRST. Radar + IRST: ADATS (M113 as well), ZA-35, PGZ04A, and ASRAD-R IRST Only: Ozelot, Stormer HVM (These 2 have an IRST tracker as well), Type 93, SIDAM 25 (And Mistral), Roland 1 (The French one), Lvrbv 701, and Machbet The ITO is the only SAM without an IRST mode, but hey 12km range missiles plus a giant radar balances that out. (Also helis with MAW are still gonna detect missile launches but IRST usually doesn't lock flares so whatever)
@@lynnmei4346 ADATS has IRST. It literally says so if you hover over the tracking device. In terms of game files, the ADATS uses exactly the same stuff as like the Tunguska. "band": -1 "visibilityType": "infraRed" ADATS is not optical tracking in terms of game files. What optical locking would look like if it were (taken from the TV guided muntions): "visibilityType": "optic" You can look through the public datamines yourself if you want to know more. I don't think I can post a link or YT will delete my comment.
It's also worth noting that the PGZ04A uses an opto-electrical tracking system which doesn't give a radar tone either. Remember to fold radars when you acquire a target too
Perhaps you can do a video showing exactly how far off axis you need to shoot a missile to avoid activating missile warning systems on helicopters. Nothing would delight me more than seeing more people learn how to ruin p2w ka50, ka52, and mi35's day :)
As soon as the missile is headed towards the heli it gets a warning. Also of the 3 you mentioned, only 1 is premium. You're also missing the Sweedish Mi-28 and that one Apache prem with early game ATGM apparently...
@@TheNicestPig Not true, because I can aim my missile 10 degrees off axis and they still do barrel rolls and dive for cover. There is an angle you can fire at without them knowing. Then afterwards you estimate their range and only aim at their helicopter at the last moment. Virtually nobody is grinding out the ka52 or mi35 without spending money on the game. And I am specifically targeting these 3 because of their spam and how easily they wipe teams early on.
@@darthclide Yeah it's damn near impossible to do it since missile manueverability stops you from going off bore far enough so they don't get a warning. I grinded out both the Ka-52 and Mi-28NM with no Ka-50, although i can't say i'm the majority. (400+ battles in Mi-4AV pain lmao) Mi-28As is below SAM BR and carries 16 ATGMs, demolishes anything at that BR and is arguably better for its tier since all the prominent Russian Helos sit at or above 10.7 All Helis spawn way too easily imo, you cap a point with a yeeter and you can bring them in with ATGMs
@@TheNicestPig "near impossible" is why my OP asks for testing to be done Note I did not say "bought KA-50" I said "spend any money". This includes premium time, buying crew points, or using golden eagles to buy modifications. Further, these vehicles are "p2w" in the sense that on release they were imbalanced, and still ar today. Plenty of countries in this game where almost nobody will grind any helis as they are useless in top tier tank battles (bruce is the exception, not the rule) And how do you mean below sams? 10.0 brings you plenty of roland type missiles. I guess if you get downtiered it can be OP. But speaking from experience I almost never get downtiers at anything 9.0 or above. And your final point is related to fomo around top tier helicopters. Why would Gaijin fix something like that, if it spurs people on toward spending money and joining the ranks of toxic early heli ATGM spam?
IRST and Tracking radars are independent from the search radar, however, gaijin is weird and sometimes you loose your IRST lock after folding your search radar, be aware of that
You also forgot to mention that it tracks a lot better especially barely above the horizon, but has little bit worse range in normal weather and a lot more worse in rain.
IR track has some cons to be considered such as in normal track a tree won't break the lock but with IR track one tree is enough to break the lock, in normal you won't be able to track flare but in IR you will, IR search also will ping starshell in night battle. So overall IR track is good if you want to engage enemy quietly, but if there is one tree, building, etc that will covering your track your IR track will break. I almost forget IR track also have less range than normal track
PGZ09 with IRST at 8.3 is complete overkill lmao, very nice for shooting at helis between trees at ground level though because it mostly gets rid of ground clutter.
IDK if anyone in here playing Highfleet too or not but in that game most of the time i always turn off the radar and rely on IRST to detecting hostile without revealing my position because with radar you can see the enemy but so does the enemy too.
And RWR range is a lot longer than radar range is, so the enemy might know where you are before your radar even spots them. Only times you should turn your radar on in HF is when you have powerful enough ships to take on SG's and their cruise missiles, or if you need to make use of fire control radar, which you should shut off once you're done guiding your munitions to target.
There are some issues though (OTOMAGIC, FlaRakRad): - for me IRST acquisition bracket is a smaller; - loses track much easier; - used to generate a lot less "camera spin", but no more; - and the worst - I believe in the past you could use it without having search radar on? Now you have to keep search radar enabled, meaning you pop up on RWR.
This all seems so interesting, but I can’t use any of these tips. I’m a Japan main and the only tech tree I’ve finished is Japan. Chū-MPM, Type 03 Chū-SAM, Type 11 Tan-SAM Kai II, or even the Type 81 Tan-SAM when? Guess I’ll keep running around an drifting in my Toyota.
Speaking of SPAA, is the SIDAM really an 8.3 material? Stock grind is HE belt. Runs out of ammo fast. Gepard/Type 87 with search and track radar is at 8.0. VADS M163 and Hovet is 8.0 ZSU-23-4 is at 8.0 Falcon and Chieftain Marksman at 8.0
Hard to say, altough i would rather use it at 8.3 than the pgz with its pathetic 440 max ammo count, 0 or 2 degrees of gun depression and a radar so hopeless that it loses tracking while im staring at a stationary heli in an open field. God its horrendeous, and just a straight up downgrade from the 305
@@AveragePootis while the gun depression on the pgz sucks it's superior to the SIDAM in every way 1-Much better chassis with actual mobility 2-Better ammo count, the SIDAM has 4 barrels so you end up with less ammo overall than the PGZ 3- Way better Antitank, on the PGZ you get a much better APDS round plus you have AP in the normal belt 4-Search Radar 5-NVDs with thermals If you're having trouble with the lock switch to IRST like this video says, you'll get the same radar quality as the SIDAM plus the benefit of having thermals to scan the sky with
noooooooo, why are you making this video?!!!! Now my secret is out :'( Won't matter tho, people will still fly straight right after spawning a plane in GRB xD
But it doesn’t do the radar tone when locking. Just the search beep, the other thing you hear is MAW which detects missile launches and tells the helicopter the direction the missile is coming from. That part cannot be hidden.
@@justaguy2289 Unless you want to track a plane trying to climb onto space it doesn't really matter much, most SAMs don't go beyond 10km anyway. Unless you're talking about search radar then it does matter there.
switched off after hearing the music... People are searching these "How To" videos for help and the music is distracting when your trying to make sense of the help...
![[#2024MAMA] G-DRAGON - 무제(Untitled, 2014)+POWER+HOME SWEET HOME+뱅뱅뱅+FANTASTIC BABY | Mnet 241123 방송](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Ox29z5Nf1Uk/mqdefault.jpg)
To add a bit more info:
IRST tracks the heat signature. This means that IRST won´t be affected by chaff, but it can be affected by flares. It will not "elevate" the lock on low flying targets, but it will also lose targets behind cover much quicker. Probably the biggest disadvantage is, that you always need to look at your target directly to gain a lock, you can no longer use your search radar and directly get a lock, so you may see on you search radar in which direction the traget is, but you have to find out yourself how high it is.
Did not know this was a thing thanks for the info, time to smack more planes with my otomatic
I thought the exact same thing, guy's a total legend
as an SPAA main, this is something i alrrady knew, but its very good to see yhis becoming more known.
also, you should always check out if your SPAA can have an increased search range and, on rare occasions, different radar scopes.
for example: the roland SAM (all SPAAs with the roland turret) have the search radar at 10km as default, but it can go up to 16km if you want.
Did I just read SPAA main
@@essiac6697 Poor guy...
i respect him though
@@essiac6697 I'm an Otomatic main
KNEEL
The Gepard has that same change of the radar scope, from 10km to 13 I remember, but the freaking tracking is horrendous, it's just so glitchy..
@@essiac6697 * laughs in ADATS *
Its always been a thing but for spaas without it you can still trick planes if you use radar to detect some spaas can still maintain a lock without radar so turn off your radar and then optically lock onto them using your target lock key binding now they wont get a rwr ping or know your tracking them till your too late works on most spaa at 8.0 or higher with a visible gunners optic
Then you only turn off your search radar, it will still give RWR tone to the target if your tracking "radar" is radar based and not IR or optical tracking. So if you do this on a gepard, it doesnt do anything usefull, but if you do this on an ADATS then you eliminate the search ping on RWR but you wouldn't give them a tracking tone anyway.
They removed that
@@Elaina_The_Ashen it still works try it in testing or in rb
@@jmaddy3 I have, it doesn’t work for me
You're turning off your search radar but not your track radar, still gives tracking ping
Zen only mentioned vehicles that track with radar by default that can switch to IRST, but there are a bunch of other ones with IRST+Radar/Only IRST.
Radar + IRST: ADATS (M113 as well), ZA-35, PGZ04A, and ASRAD-R
IRST Only: Ozelot, Stormer HVM (These 2 have an IRST tracker as well), Type 93, SIDAM 25 (And Mistral), Roland 1 (The French one), Lvrbv 701, and Machbet
The ITO is the only SAM without an IRST mode, but hey 12km range missiles plus a giant radar balances that out.
(Also helis with MAW are still gonna detect missile launches but IRST usually doesn't lock flares so whatever)
ADATS (M113) is IRST if i remember right, cause you have to look at the target in 1st person to be able to lock
No ADATS is not IRST. Its optical locking.
IRST cannot provide leader for gun when lock on.
@@lynnmei4346 ^ Logged in just to check and IRST is definitely not a thing on the ADATS
@@lynnmei4346 irst and electro optical tracking work the same in game
@@lynnmei4346 ADATS has IRST. It literally says so if you hover over the tracking device.
In terms of game files, the ADATS uses exactly the same stuff as like the Tunguska.
"band": -1
"visibilityType": "infraRed"
ADATS is not optical tracking in terms of game files. What optical locking would look like if it were (taken from the TV guided muntions):
"visibilityType": "optic"
You can look through the public datamines yourself if you want to know more. I don't think I can post a link or YT will delete my comment.
MY FLAK BUS HAS HAD IRST THIS WHOLE TIME????
It's also worth noting that the PGZ04A uses an opto-electrical tracking system which doesn't give a radar tone either. Remember to fold radars when you acquire a target too
And here I was switching to IRST to see if I could hit flares in night battles, good to know it doesn't trigger lock warnings!
Perhaps you can do a video showing exactly how far off axis you need to shoot a missile to avoid activating missile warning systems on helicopters. Nothing would delight me more than seeing more people learn how to ruin p2w ka50, ka52, and mi35's day :)
As soon as the missile is headed towards the heli it gets a warning.
Also of the 3 you mentioned, only 1 is premium.
You're also missing the Sweedish Mi-28 and that one Apache prem with early game ATGM apparently...
@@TheNicestPig
Not true, because I can aim my missile 10 degrees off axis and they still do barrel rolls and dive for cover. There is an angle you can fire at without them knowing. Then afterwards you estimate their range and only aim at their helicopter at the last moment.
Virtually nobody is grinding out the ka52 or mi35 without spending money on the game.
And I am specifically targeting these 3 because of their spam and how easily they wipe teams early on.
@@darthclide Yeah it's damn near impossible to do it since missile manueverability stops you from going off bore far enough so they don't get a warning.
I grinded out both the Ka-52 and Mi-28NM with no Ka-50, although i can't say i'm the majority. (400+ battles in Mi-4AV pain lmao)
Mi-28As is below SAM BR and carries 16 ATGMs, demolishes anything at that BR and is arguably better for its tier since all the prominent Russian Helos sit at or above 10.7
All Helis spawn way too easily imo, you cap a point with a yeeter and you can bring them in with ATGMs
@@TheNicestPig "near impossible" is why my OP asks for testing to be done
Note I did not say "bought KA-50" I said "spend any money". This includes premium time, buying crew points, or using golden eagles to buy modifications. Further, these vehicles are "p2w" in the sense that on release they were imbalanced, and still ar today. Plenty of countries in this game where almost nobody will grind any helis as they are useless in top tier tank battles (bruce is the exception, not the rule)
And how do you mean below sams? 10.0 brings you plenty of roland type missiles. I guess if you get downtiered it can be OP. But speaking from experience I almost never get downtiers at anything 9.0 or above.
And your final point is related to fomo around top tier helicopters. Why would Gaijin fix something like that, if it spurs people on toward spending money and joining the ranks of toxic early heli ATGM spam?
In my experience, IRST works better than radar except max search distance
Quick note, but you can turn your search radar off and still use IRST, and emit no ping at all to a target's RWR.
IRST and Tracking radars are independent from the search radar, however, gaijin is weird and sometimes you loose your IRST lock after folding your search radar, be aware of that
You also forgot to mention that it tracks a lot better especially barely above the horizon, but has little bit worse range in normal weather and a lot more worse in rain.
IR track has some cons to be considered such as in normal track a tree won't break the lock but with IR track one tree is enough to break the lock, in normal you won't be able to track flare but in IR you will, IR search also will ping starshell in night battle. So overall IR track is good if you want to engage enemy quietly, but if there is one tree, building, etc that will covering your track your IR track will break. I almost forget IR track also have less range than normal track
ADATS also has IRST. it actually ONLY uses IRST for tracking if i remember correctly
PGZ09 with IRST at 8.3 is complete overkill lmao, very nice for shooting at helis between trees at ground level though because it mostly gets rid of ground clutter.
8.3 with thermals and irst while gepard doesn't even have a rangefinder (I think)
I always do this with my Tunguska. Just turned off the radar and use thermal + IRST and let people think that there's no SPAA
Yea but if you enable IRST, you can't use auto search radar lock if i remember correctly.
@@rasmusuhrskov2795 you're right. But you can auto lock with radar then swap to IRST, tricks them into thinking the lock was lost
@@Dominator2930 how do you enable auto search radar lock?
@@dragonegglol Its just the default radar lock key bind, I think its alt+F. It should try to lock whatever the selected radar target is.
all of my time in war thunder and i now learn this, thank you for telling the wourld :-)
IDK if anyone in here playing Highfleet too or not but in that game most of the time i always turn off the radar and rely on IRST to detecting hostile without revealing my position because with radar you can see the enemy but so does the enemy too.
And RWR range is a lot longer than radar range is, so the enemy might know where you are before your radar even spots them. Only times you should turn your radar on in HF is when you have powerful enough ships to take on SG's and their cruise missiles, or if you need to make use of fire control radar, which you should shut off once you're done guiding your munitions to target.
Lvkv9040C also have IRST/Optical tracking, as it works the same in game.
It might just be an old glitch but i could've sworn the gepard has something like this.
Launch RWR still kicks in tho at least that was my experience a month ago when I found this setting.
There are some issues though (OTOMAGIC, FlaRakRad):
- for me IRST acquisition bracket is a smaller;
- loses track much easier;
- used to generate a lot less "camera spin", but no more;
- and the worst - I believe in the past you could use it without having search radar on? Now you have to keep search radar enabled, meaning you pop up on RWR.
on tunguska set the radar at 18km, switch IRST and wait ...you will see the plane when spawning
That means now simply that the opponent is no longer warned when he is targeted?
It'll be like "hey, I know you're there, but am I targeting you? That's for the missile to find out."
yes because IRST is tracking the Enemys Heat signature similar too Heat seeking missles
finally i can understand this, thank you very much !!
the french Roland SPAA has only IRST available, his radar is search only
Roland 1 and the Italian SPAA's as well as the ASRAD have it by default
hey zenturion you should make a video covering all the functions since i get confused at times
I thought that the ADATS had it, but that it was its only tracking mode it had
Funny to post this after current patch, they pretty much ruined IRST, previously it was much more consistent.
Nice video as always but should have shown that you need to be looking at the target from the gunner sight to lock the target with IRST
The Roland 1 and Ozelot got IRST too (im atleast sure the Ozelot got it)
HEYYYYY that's pretty good
Greatttttt now more people will know about this and I’ll get bullied more in my A-10
대공특:남이 하는 대공:백발백중
내가하는 대공:개**
Hmmm... Yes.
This all seems so interesting, but I can’t use any of these tips. I’m a Japan main and the only tech tree I’ve finished is Japan. Chū-MPM, Type 03 Chū-SAM, Type 11 Tan-SAM Kai II, or even the Type 81 Tan-SAM when? Guess I’ll keep running around an drifting in my Toyota.
bruh so many stuff to learn to survive some stupid missile , i get mixt of flares but i always die when i try to cas with guided on ground rb smh
You sure about Roland ? Cuz flarakpz 1 and XM975 are very similar systems
PGZ04도 IRST가 있읍니다
기본모드가 IRST라 사람들이 잘 모를뿐
Mh yes, but does the IRST make the PGZ-09s radar actually capable of tracking and providing lead?
Yes, very good at br with thermals to help looking for planes and helis unlike similar vehicles at br (gepard)
The ZA-35 has IRST too
That was useful af dude 👌
The Roland doesn't have it but the FlaRakPz does? Weird. Anyway, this is useful!
Speaking of SPAA, is the SIDAM really an 8.3 material? Stock grind is HE belt. Runs out of ammo fast.
Gepard/Type 87 with search and track radar is at 8.0.
VADS M163 and Hovet is 8.0
ZSU-23-4 is at 8.0
Falcon and Chieftain Marksman at 8.0
No it's 8.0 material at best but Gaijin's balancing ruining minor nations is a normal part of the game these days
Hard to say, altough i would rather use it at 8.3 than the pgz with its pathetic 440 max ammo count, 0 or 2 degrees of gun depression and a radar so hopeless that it loses tracking while im staring at a stationary heli in an open field.
God its horrendeous, and just a straight up downgrade from the 305
@@AveragePootis while the gun depression on the pgz sucks it's superior to the SIDAM in every way
1-Much better chassis with actual mobility
2-Better ammo count, the SIDAM has 4 barrels so you end up with less ammo overall than the PGZ
3- Way better Antitank, on the PGZ you get a much better APDS round plus you have AP in the normal belt
4-Search Radar
5-NVDs with thermals
If you're having trouble with the lock switch to IRST like this video says, you'll get the same radar quality as the SIDAM plus the benefit of having thermals to scan the sky with
Stormer is also irate only
noooooooo, why are you making this video?!!!!
Now my secret is out :'(
Won't matter tho, people will still fly straight right after spawning a plane in GRB xD
Ooohhh, OTOMATIC has it, I'm gonna have some fun when or if I ever decide to fucking stock grind my Italian 10.7 lineup.
I thought I saw the adats getting irst. I may be wrong tho
You have revealed an important secret. we have located you >:(
Ozelot has IRST but that’s it’s only search mode so does that count?
일부는 아예 탐지만 레이더고 추적은 irst로만 돼어있던데
IRST triggered RWR on modern choppers ,even YAH-64 has RWR
But it doesn’t do the radar tone when locking. Just the search beep, the other thing you hear is MAW which detects missile launches and tells the helicopter the direction the missile is coming from. That part cannot be hidden.
shame that the ADATS doesn't get it, even though it's a top tier SPAA...
It only has IRST for tracking, radar is only for searching
ADATS has irst but with limited FOV I think 45°. I detect air targets by radar then turn it off and start tracking with irst to maintain surprise.
well thanks for ruining the A-10 CAS for me, i trusted you :(
Pain, not available for ADATS
I believe the adats only has IRST
Why did you have to expose the secret?
thanks man
doesn't radar have longer range?
same range
In Tunguska the IRST is 10km while radar is 20km
@@justaguy2289 Unless you want to track a plane trying to climb onto space it doesn't really matter much, most SAMs don't go beyond 10km anyway. Unless you're talking about search radar then it does matter there.
@@mystier3423 tbh i was mentioning it as i was confused as why it wasn't included in the video
Thank you
What about the adats?
switched off after hearing the music...
People are searching these "How To" videos for help and the music is distracting when your trying to make sense of the help...
irst인지는 모르겠지만 ZA-35도 광학 추적 됨
Does nobody realise that there is a D point here? 0:19
Does the ITO have IRST?
all this and they stil wont use aa lol
dont need to worry about dis, will never get in toptier lol
irst has way better tracking
Thanks
ADATS 는 상시 irst지 않나요
*ADATS* :D
:D
TIL
"distinctive sound" any sound gets drowned in obnoxious music int he video...yeah..that was helpful...not