Planning on re-enforcing my loft, not for living space, just to store and use weights up there. This is without question the most useful video I've seen, especially using the packers, many thanks.
Thanks for the feedback and best of luck with your project. Just remember to use the right material for the packers. I used plywood which is compressed so has structural strength under load but some soft woods wouldn't be suitable.
The diagram on the scrap cardboard was immaculate, along with the commentary this has to go down as RUclips at its very best! Totally raw but quality viewing 👍 Bravo that man👍👍
Thanks for making this video, currently renovating our 2up/2down and want to do something like this to make an occasional room in the loft. Your videos are helping me understand the process better.
Nice, i notice a lot of companies propose always using steel beams to run the length of the building rather than relying on joists. into the side such as you have.
Very clear explanations with updates as you go along, brilliant video. It gives me the confidence and the understanding to carry out this job now. Thank you.
Excellent video, thank you massively for the effort making it. Question please: you said you didn't want these joists pushing down and cracking the ceiling, why not hang a ceiling on these joists? I have joists holding up a floor on top and a ceiling underneath. Just wondering why you didn't opt for this
Good ambitious project. Sliding bevel to get the birds mouth cut would be less fiddly to prep your template. You've got good problem solving process there.
Good video, one small complaint: please normalise the sound. The voice is too weak and the music too loud, have to keep fiddling with the remote control volume buttons so I don't wake people up (it's midnight)... Thanks!
Luc - Why are you up so late?! Only joking, apologies for the sound. I will try to get the balance better next time. Unfortunately the editing takes a long time to make a video that is educational, and hopefully enjoyable to watch. I usually have hours of footage chopped down to 10 - 15 minutes. Then adding music etc, my ears are probably tired. To add to this I just use free basic editing software which is very restrictive with what I can do. Part 3 is now available to watch. Please watch it and see if the sound is any better. Thanks for the feedback and thanks for watching!
Thanks for uploading these videos,iv been looking into doing my loft myself and with your help i feel like i cant take it on,think im gonna be running the new beams alongside the old beams because of the height,I was planning on cross beaming you see.
Best of luck with it. Don't forget to calculate the size of the joists required. To do it as a 'habital room' you will need to apply to your local authority building control department and they can advise on the correct way to construct it and comply with fire regs. If it's just for a storage room then no need. Thanks for watching.
Agree with Luc about uneven noise levels, trying to watch quietly in bed with the boss asleep and then BOOM the music kicks in. Otherwise a good and clear informative video but one safety point with the bench saw. The blade should only be up just enough to kiss through the top of the timber; if it is higher than that then fingers are at risk but worst of all the chances of "kickback" incease and you could get a piece of 3 x 7 in your face! Good job, thanks for the effort.
What’s the head height like seems tight? Nice work though. Although I would have probably notched out the noggins to fit vertically. Would be much better at stopping the twisting of the timbers. But should be fine anyway.
Should get about 2 meters when finished. Stair height will exceed this but as you say it's not a tall loft, but it'll still be a nice space with a bit of character when done. As for the twisting of joists - the joist I used are shorter but wider than standard, and don't forget they will have floorboards screwed into them and verticals down off the purlins (all will be revealed in future videos). Trust me, if you stand on them they are solid as a rock. I've screwed them to the rafters as well. Thanks for the feedback, part 3 now available. Thanks for watching!
Good job,Jst one thing why have you not placed your floot joist noggings up to the actual joist level (Floor level) That way you can use them as extra places for the floor board screws?
Hi Pouse... you use two pieces of joist, overlapping; so are the joists still square as one side will hit the rafters in a different place? Hope not a stupid question
Correct, square joists, one joist sat away from rafters so I used a piece of timber to bridge the gap then screwed them all together. You can see that in a later video. Thanks for watching
Hi. Which kind of joist should be installed when building attic floor( Joist size & joist thickness?) How to installed them in old house? If u can please answer my question?
It depends on what you're doing in loft and what the span of the joists is. If it's a proper loft conversion then you need to speak to building control in your local authority. Hope that helps.
I'm guessing you have a load bearing wall, the full span of your house? What would you have done if the internal load bearing wall only went 3/4 of the house span?
You've done really big overlaps over the central load bearing wall, is that compulsory, or can I just rest the end of my joists on the load bearing walls (I have one either side, as only doing the middle of my attic) as long as the whole width of the brick is covered? Wondering why you need noggins as my existing 1940's joists don't have them? Anyone who knows, I'd really appreciate your opinion...
Firstly I would like to thank you , your videos are very informative and the way you have done them in different parts for different stages makes the whole project a lot easier to digest, and not as overwhelming as it could be. I am hoping to do my attic the way you have done yours either doing bits myself or project managing the job to save some cash . I have a few quarries and Would be extremely great full if yourself or anyone else with loft conversation experience could help with . As yourself I live in an older house 1930s. A semi detached With a tradition gable roof . I have an internal supporting wall running right up the house . This puts my span from internal supporting wall to external walls at 12 ft. ( 3.66 m ) I don’t want to lower ceilings in bedrooms below for obvious reasons . I am planning to use c24 timber 75x 147 at 400 m centres . Would this be ok with building control . I don’t want to put steel in due to now having much head height ( 220 from top of ridge board to ceiling joists . If building control would be happy with the same set up you have done, 18mm packers on wall plates then 147x75 c24 joists at 400 mm centres . That would give me very close to my 2m head height when finished . I want a dorma at the rear of my roof , coming off the wall plates Any help guidance would be greatly appreciated
You would need to speak to building control and check. I had a structural engineer calculate what joists I needed and I supported my dormers off the joists and rafters as they are pitched roof but this was all calculated. If you are having a flat roof dormer then you would need your current ridge board to become a ridge 'beam' as this will need to support the vertical load of the dormer roof so you will probably need a steel or some large timbers for a beam. If you are happy with the roof being lower than 2 meters then even if it doesn't meet building regs you can still have it as a space that is structurally sound (use correct joists, beam etc) but with less head room. It just means it won't be classed as an official habitable room so you couldn't sell the house as having an additional bedroom. Worth doing the planning first as it's a lot of work to do if you're not happy with the end result. Hope that helps and best of luck with it.
Great video the joists can be overlapped across load bearing wall and bolted together? building regs were ok this? How did you arrive at 400mm centres for joists?
I know this is a very old video now but I still can't quite believe this was signed off by building control. The requirements say that any overlap of joists should be limited to 100mm to prevent canterlevering and that the noggins have to be at least 1/2 depth of the joist. It doesn't seem you meet either of these criteria???
Hi Adam… I’m looking too do this to my loft and was wondering if there was such a need for a massive overhang,can you explain abit more about the noggins have to be 1/2 inch depth of the joist…?? Many thanks👍
Really impressed with your work and I have a very similar loft to this, given me a lot of ideas and I am more confident to take the project on, thanks keep ul the good work 😁
Glad you find the vids useful. Obviously it's not a one size fits all and you will need a structural engineer and building regs if you want it to be a 'habital room'. Best of luck and thanks for watching!
The existing joists are not strong enough. When you have a loft conversion you are creating a new usable floor. A structural engineer will do calculations for you and determine what size joists are required.
Just a quick one. Been reading building regs on noggins / supports. Ard they not supposed to be 75 percent of depth of joist? I have the same issue and putting them on the side doesnt cover 75 percent of my depth. Did this meet building regs?
My inspector was happy. These joist are shorter and wider so less chance of twisting maybe but in reality, once floor boards are screwed on and all joists screwed to wall plates and rafters it isn't going anywhere but you have to discuss that with your inspector. Some re more square than others!! Best of luck with it.
Yeah my thoughts exactly, nothing is going anywhere but dont want a picky inspector. Didn't want to put in and then told dont meet regs. Other thought was to do lengthways and notch out the original joist. Thanks for the reply.
I noticed the 7x3 timbers your putting in are tight up to roof rafters when your sitting them onto the wall plate? I'm doing this myself as a i just wondered or can they sit between as well?
You can sit them wherever, but I fixed my joists to both the rafters and wallplate to ensure the roof couldn't spread as there had been small movement previously where the rafters has slipped slightly, but the roof is over 120 years old! Thanks for watching.
Great video! few questions. I saw you fixed the joists to the rafters one side when they butted up, what was done on the opposite side as i assume the joist were only butted up to the rafters one side as they would sit out 75mm due to the overlapping on the spine wall? Where they over lap on the spine is it worth fixing these together with a bold and dog tooth connector similar to building a double trimmer?
I used timber to fill the gap then screwed them all together. Think I showed that in a later video. Bolts are always good as more robust if you want. You just have to be careful not to knock the old timbers around too much as they will have been settled for years. Thanks for watching.
@@POUSEaroundtheHOUSE Brill that was exactly what i was planning on doing. Where the joists overlap on the supporting wall did you fix them at all or are they just braced by the noggins? is it worth bolting them with a dog tooth joiner?
No, my house is victorian, all solid brick walls from foundation right up to loft. The span between walls is short enough for joists to span with joists sat on existing wall plates across to center wall. A few people have said this but remember newer build house often have no solid wall in the middle, and have a trussed roof structure that needs completely replacing with steels. My house has thick rafters with huge purlins supported of the solid brick walls. Thanks for the feedback and thanks for watching.
Hi first of all brilliant job. Question is did you use any pilot holes or clearance holes at least in either the joists or noggins prior to driving the screws in?
Was this inspected by building control? My wall plates are about 2.5” out of Level from one side to the other. Plywood is a great idea to bring up the level.
Hi @Pouse, will this pass building regs in 2023? Anything I need to change ? Id like to use 175x75 as height issues, someone mentioned overlapping over 100mm?
To do a proper loft conversion you need a structural engineer to calculate the strength of the joists required based on the span and load to the floor. Hope that helps.
@@POUSEaroundtheHOUSE Yeah i've been reading up on it but there seems to be a lot of conflicting information. Some say you must use RSJ, others say you can sister, others say you need to use new joists (the thickness calculated by a structural engineer for all of them of course), confusing stuff. Anyway thank you for the videos, helpfull stuff :)
Please advise if this method is still possible in a 1930s hip roof, I'm sure the end of my rafters are notched out to sit direct and sail straight over the edge of the house wall.. so I think I haven't got enough height in the pitch of the roof in this area to leave enough strength in the new joists after shaping to fit under the roofs slope. Any feedback would be much appreciated cheers 🙌🏻
As I'm doing a proper loft conversion I needed new joists to take all the new loads and they are supported on load bearing walls. The existing joists are not strong enough for this. They are only designed to hold the ceiling below. A proper loft conversion requires building control sign off which mean all these things are calculated correctly. Hope that helps. Thanks for watching.
hi , nice work, Building reg question,, how did you calculate the size of your new joists, you said you went for less depth and fatter joists ,, did you have to get that signed off for BC before hand.
You can search for 'floor joist span charts' online. My house is 4.2m span, so according to the chart for current building regulations, I have used 9"x2" C24 grade joists, at 400mm centres. I've overdone it with blocking, but there's no issue with that. I spoke with the local councils building control to begin with, yes they do need to be notified, they will come look, advise, and you invite them back at various points of the build, about 3 times. It cost a certain amount to get it signed off, not as much as private building control firms. I'm aware of some strange stories of private company standards for a pass, and was wary of them, but the council seemed more stringent, which is what they should be. I'm converting it for my daughter's bedroom, I want it 100% correct and safe, no half arsing anything. The person with the clip board shouldn't accept anything less than correct.
great video. I have plans to board out my loft and have been advised to fit joists across existing joists for insulation reasons. is there a reason you fit the new joist in the same direction as existing joist or would it still be ok to fit in opposite direct and sit new joist across existing. hope that makes sense :D
My joists are structural for a floor in my loft conversion, so I've placed them on load bearing walls the same as my original smaller joists. What you are doing is fine assuming it's just for storage. If you were making a structural floor then they would need to be supported on something that can take the load. Hope that helps. Thanks for watching.
Great video mate, i've rewatched waay to many times! Could be a daft question this.. what's the easiest way to draw out a template to cut the joist for a snug fit ontop of wall plate. I assume i'll need an angle finder to get the pitch degree?
Yes it helps. I used cardboard and then offered it up each time. Trimmed it back until it fitted snug. Obviously if using this method just make sure you have enough of the joist sat on wall plate. Some roofs don't allow this and then joist hangers might be the only option or steel beams which will then support the joists. Best of luck with it.
Hey, I couldnt tell in your video if you did it or not, but did you sister the new joists to the originaly (2x4?) joist at all or did you keep them seperate?
The old joist are over 120 years old and imperial size so more like 2 x 3 half I think. But I kept them separate where I could so not to cause the downstairs ceiling to crack if there is any movement. What I did do was screw and nail all the new joists to the wall plates in a later video to help strengthen the whole roof structure. Thanks for watching.
hi mate l need replace a joist in a small flat blahblah .. could you tell me the right name of the wood for the joist. MY base is in London and t the moment in B&Q , Selco, Builderdepot they have whitesof wood l think it is foor roof , but l want for joist!! is hard for me find the proper name of the joist.. can you tell me how i can order the wood for joist correctly. Thank
You need a structural engineer to calculate the size of joists if doing it properly to building regulations. This is based on span, deflection amongst other things. The strongest timber is usually C24 graded timber but width and depth depends on span. Mine were 3.5 x 7.5 inches. Hope that helps. 2 x 9 inches is also common.
Normally the ceiling joists from the first floor are only designed to take a little weight and the plasterboard from the bedroom ceilings. They are normally as little as 4x2 timbers. Floors need to take a heavier load. The trick is knowing if you can use timber floor joists. Pouse has his resting on an internal load bearing wall meaning he doesn't have to span a large distance. If he didn't have that wall there he would need a large steel to span the full distance and then the new floor joists would be hung from the steel
Hi… I love your videos, simple and I’ve watched all your videos on loft conversation,,, I’m a pretty handy diyer, but some times underestimate my self (so my wife says) …. Please don’t take this question as any sort of insult … I just want to know will all this advice on the loft conversion get passed off by building regs?? Reason I ask is I’ve just moved in to new home (1930,s) semi…. And after watching your videos I feel more than confident taking on the job but I’ve been reading that if building regs ain’t signed off then it could void home insurance 😭😭 any advice is greatly appreciated, brilliant videos keep up the good work, 👍🏴 from a fellow Welsh man 🏴🏴
Hi there. I want to convert my loft in room and I find it’s the best way to do so, but I have a question that in the ground floor I have load bearing steel beam between the two rooms as it has no wall between the rooms!! If I use this middle wall to support the joist in the loft, would that beam be able to bear the load of the new joist ceiling ?? Please let me know. Thanks
I hope Papa Pouse give you the back of his hand for taking the piss! Great Vids Taffy, I have been thinking of using I beams and you have inspired me to do it the same way. Thanks very much for uploading.
I'm using screws, but nails can also be used. It depends on your set up I guess. In a later video (not uploaded yet) when the slates are off you can me screwing through the joists into the wall plates. Hope that helps. Thanks for watching.
Hi Matty, even if it wasn't a hipped roof it didn't require steels as it's an old house with e load bearing walls across it. Also the use of steels would have meant the beams would have filled my cupboard space which I specifically wanted for storage.
Structural engineer name their own price according to what is involved.Building control is a set fee based on what category the work falls into. Check your local authority website, they will have tables explaining this. Then as I previously said speak to Building Control to confirm. It's different in different local authorities.
Great series of videos, the right balance between the informative and the entertaining. One question, did the existing ceiling joists have binders on top, if so did you just remove them to fit the new joists in?
There were two I think, and not doing a lot! I removed them but I redid all the ceilings with plasterboard years ago so I know they wouldn't shift. If you have the head room you can sit your joists above them with packers? Best of luck and thanks for watching.
Completey depends on the span of the joists. You need to either employ a structural engineer, or as a quick go to, check the joist span tables available on line. Hope that helps. Best of luck!
3 load bearing walls. Front and back wall of house and a middle load bearing wall. The house is Victorian so all solid brick walls. Thanks for watching.
Get a structural engineer to work it out for you. It depends on many things. There are tables on the internet that will give you a rough idea if your just looking to work out a rough cost but building control will want to see your calculations.
The joists are supported on 3 load bearing solid brick walls. The house is Victorian so no stud walls at all, all brick from the ground up to roof level. Hope that helps. Thanks for watching!
@@POUSEaroundtheHOUSE hi. Thanks for the reply, i was talking generally as i am currently looking to support the joists in my loft but there only seems to be stud walls on the first floor
It's hard to say because it depends on work you need done. In my example I just used timber joists but you may need calculations for steels etc. Also depends on where you live. I imagine a structural engineer in London will cost a lot more than one in South Wales as he needs to pay for his more expensive bills! Just ring a few and get some quotes. Best of luck with it.
Speak to a structural engineer and your local building control officer for your area. They are very happy to help and know the most up to date info / regs etc.
Great video! Can I borrow your old man, I have a project I want to string out for a year or two ;-) Only joking. Was this done to building regs? Is there a rule for noggins to conform to regs I.E. one every X cm's or something?
Yes building regs but best to speak to your local officer. Mine was very flexible and pragmatic and I just rang him if I came across any issues. He was really helpful. You can find a lot of info on the .gov website regarding loft conversions, fire safety, joists, stairs etc, well worth a read. Hope that helps.
A very interesting project, and plenty of hard graft ahead :) Just subscribed so I can follow along. I must also add my two penn'orth about the need to normalise the sound on these videos. The music is so much louder than your speech that it prevents me just sitting back and enjoying them because I've got to keep one hand on the volume control. :)
I didn't think you were allowed to reduce the height of the joists at the wall plate. My roofer is going to put the 2x2 battens (required to thicken the rafters to allow for the insulation and air gap) ontop of the existing rafters to raise the felt and tiles to allow clearance for the ridiculous 9x2 joists which BC say is necessary. Edit - just noticed that its only half the joist which sits on the wall plate which has been reduced.
Also, my joists are 75mm x175mm so shorter but wider than yours. This was to add a bit of headroom by keeping the joists lower. So when you trim a bit off at the wall plate, they are still 3 inches wide and very solid. More expensive than the 9x2 joists though.
@@POUSEaroundtheHOUSE Thanks for that. I never got the option of wider joists so I'll have to have a word with building control on that one and see if I can use those instead.
Planning on re-enforcing my loft, not for living space, just to store and use weights up there. This is without question the most useful video I've seen, especially using the packers, many thanks.
Thanks for the feedback and best of luck with your project. Just remember to use the right material for the packers. I used plywood which is compressed so has structural strength under load but some soft woods wouldn't be suitable.
The diagram on the scrap cardboard was immaculate, along with the commentary this has to go down as RUclips at its very best! Totally raw but quality viewing 👍
Bravo that man👍👍
Thanks for the kind words.
This is terrific. I've been looking a a lot of loft videos and this is the most comprehensive and well explained of the lot.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Poppa Pouse is a boss!
He's not my boss!
Thanks for making this video, currently renovating our 2up/2down and want to do something like this to make an occasional room in the loft. Your videos are helping me understand the process better.
Glad to have helped!
Great video can't wait for part 3,having some great weather ideal for dormer,roof work.
Part 3 now available!
So good to see a table saw with a gaurd
Best to avoid taking my arms off!
Nice, i notice a lot of companies propose always using steel beams to run the length of the building rather than relying on joists. into the side such as you have.
Superb videos. At 8:20 looking at the antenna's elements to the right side i try to understand what kind of tool is!
Very clear explanations with updates as you go along, brilliant video. It gives me the confidence and the understanding to carry out this job now. Thank you.
Thanks for the comment and good luck with your project.
Great video mate. Super clarity and really practical. Love the attention to detail and fact you show the work in progress. Di Iawn Brwd
Excellent video, thank you massively for the effort making it.
Question please: you said you didn't want these joists pushing down and cracking the ceiling, why not hang a ceiling on these joists?
I have joists holding up a floor on top and a ceiling underneath. Just wondering why you didn't opt for this
Good ambitious project. Sliding bevel to get the birds mouth cut would be less fiddly to prep your template. You've got good problem solving process there.
Thanks for the feedback David, and thanks for watching. Part 3 now available.
Good video, one small complaint: please normalise the sound. The voice is too weak and the music too loud, have to keep fiddling with the remote control volume buttons so I don't wake people up (it's midnight)... Thanks!
I agree with this 100%
Luc
Yes, please. I had to keep adjusting the sound.
Luc - Why are you up so late?! Only joking, apologies for the sound. I will try to get the balance better next time. Unfortunately the editing takes a long time to make a video that is educational, and hopefully enjoyable to watch. I usually have hours of footage chopped down to 10 - 15 minutes. Then adding music etc, my ears are probably tired. To add to this I just use free basic editing software which is very restrictive with what I can do. Part 3 is now available to watch. Please watch it and see if the sound is any better. Thanks for the feedback and thanks for watching!
Martin - Apologies, I will try to improve this in next video but for more info see my message to Luc. Thanks for the feedback and thanks for watching!
oltedders - See message above, thanks for the feedback and thanks for watching!
Thanks for uploading these videos,iv been looking into doing my loft myself and with your help i feel like i cant take it on,think im gonna be running the new beams alongside the old beams because of the height,I was planning on cross beaming you see.
Best of luck with it. Don't forget to calculate the size of the joists required. To do it as a 'habital room' you will need to apply to your local authority building control department and they can advise on the correct way to construct it and comply with fire regs. If it's just for a storage room then no need. Thanks for watching.
Great vid mate. Can I ask did you get building control in for this or is it just for storage
Excellent videos, I hope to raise the funds to get ours done in a couple of years.👍
Thanks for the feedback and best of luck with your project when the time comes.
Agree with Luc about uneven noise levels, trying to watch quietly in bed with the boss asleep and then BOOM the music kicks in. Otherwise a good and clear informative video but one safety point with the bench saw. The blade should only be up just enough to kiss through the top of the timber; if it is higher than that then fingers are at risk but worst of all the chances of "kickback" incease and you could get a piece of 3 x 7 in your face! Good job, thanks for the effort.
Hi Gareth, this was an early loft video, I think I've sorted the sound now. Thanks for the feedback and thanks for watching.
What’s the head height like seems tight? Nice work though. Although I would have probably notched out the noggins to fit vertically. Would be much better at stopping the twisting of the timbers. But should be fine anyway.
Should get about 2 meters when finished. Stair height will exceed this but as you say it's not a tall loft, but it'll still be a nice space with a bit of character when done. As for the twisting of joists - the joist I used are shorter but wider than standard, and don't forget they will have floorboards screwed into them and verticals down off the purlins (all will be revealed in future videos). Trust me, if you stand on them they are solid as a rock. I've screwed them to the rafters as well. Thanks for the feedback, part 3 now available. Thanks for watching!
Good job,Jst one thing why have you not placed your floot joist noggings up to the actual joist level (Floor level) That way you can use them as extra places for the floor board screws?
I tried to center them to help with strength. Thanks for watching!
Great work, thanks for sharing your project. Good bit of graft ahead for you but worth it once you get it finished. Good luck
Thanks James, yes hard work but looking forward to the finished space. Thanks for watching!
Really great diy videos very useful thank you for your time .... more on the loft conversion please
Plenty more to come!
Hi, good video. What's the white stuff at the end of of the joists (at 0.44). Thanks.
Think it's just light from outside shining up between two layers of roof felt.
Hi Pouse... you use two pieces of joist, overlapping; so are the joists still square as one side will hit the rafters in a different place? Hope not a stupid question
Correct, square joists, one joist sat away from rafters so I used a piece of timber to bridge the gap then screwed them all together. You can see that in a later video. Thanks for watching
Well done Pouse. Look forward to part 3 👍
Thanks for the feedback Richard. Part 3 now available. Thanks for watching!
You and me with the same wickes spirit level who would of thought
Hi. Which kind of joist should be installed when building attic floor( Joist size & joist thickness?) How to installed them in old house? If u can please answer my question?
It depends on what you're doing in loft and what the span of the joists is. If it's a proper loft conversion then you need to speak to building control in your local authority. Hope that helps.
I'm guessing you have a load bearing wall, the full span of your house? What would you have done if the internal load bearing wall only went 3/4 of the house span?
Ask the structural engineer for options! Thanks for watching.
You've done really big overlaps over the central load bearing wall, is that compulsory, or can I just rest the end of my joists on the load bearing walls (I have one either side, as only doing the middle of my attic) as long as the whole width of the brick is covered? Wondering why you need noggins as my existing 1940's joists don't have them? Anyone who knows, I'd really appreciate your opinion...
Are the new joists bolted to the rafters? And os there any need to do that?
Yes, I screwed them together to help make the existing roof more rigid and solid.
Making progress. Great video
Thanks for the feedback and thanks for watching.
Thanks for the feedback and thanks for watching.
You have used 175mm x 75mm joists. What is the other size we can use please? Thank you
Firstly I would like to thank you , your videos are very informative and the way you have done them in different parts for different stages makes the whole project a lot easier to digest, and not as overwhelming as it could be.
I am hoping to do my attic the way you have done yours either doing bits myself or project managing the job to save some cash .
I have a few quarries and Would be extremely great full if yourself or anyone else with loft conversation experience could help with .
As yourself I live in an older house 1930s. A semi detached With a tradition gable roof . I have an internal supporting wall running right up the house . This puts my span from internal supporting wall to external walls at 12 ft. ( 3.66 m ) I don’t want to lower ceilings in bedrooms below for obvious reasons . I am planning to use c24 timber 75x 147 at 400 m centres . Would this be ok with building control . I don’t want to put steel in due to now having much head height ( 220 from top of ridge board to ceiling joists . If building control would be happy with the same set up you have done, 18mm packers on wall plates then 147x75 c24 joists at 400 mm centres . That would give me very close to my 2m head height when finished . I want a dorma at the rear of my roof , coming off the wall plates Any help guidance would be greatly appreciated
You would need to speak to building control and check. I had a structural engineer calculate what joists I needed and I supported my dormers off the joists and rafters as they are pitched roof but this was all calculated. If you are having a flat roof dormer then you would need your current ridge board to become a ridge 'beam' as this will need to support the vertical load of the dormer roof so you will probably need a steel or some large timbers for a beam. If you are happy with the roof being lower than 2 meters then even if it doesn't meet building regs you can still have it as a space that is structurally sound (use correct joists, beam etc) but with less head room. It just means it won't be classed as an official habitable room so you couldn't sell the house as having an additional bedroom. Worth doing the planning first as it's a lot of work to do if you're not happy with the end result. Hope that helps and best of luck with it.
Dude you are amazing, great video God bless you.
Great video the joists can be overlapped across load bearing wall and bolted together? building regs were ok this? How did you arrive at 400mm centres for joists?
I know this is a very old video now but I still can't quite believe this was signed off by building control. The requirements say that any overlap of joists should be limited to 100mm to prevent canterlevering and that the noggins have to be at least 1/2 depth of the joist. It doesn't seem you meet either of these criteria???
Hi Adam… I’m looking too do this to my loft and was wondering if there was such a need for a massive overhang,can you explain abit more about the noggins have to be 1/2 inch depth of the joist…?? Many thanks👍
Really impressed with your work and I have a very similar loft to this, given me a lot of ideas and I am more confident to take the project on, thanks keep ul the good work 😁
Glad you find the vids useful. Obviously it's not a one size fits all and you will need a structural engineer and building regs if you want it to be a 'habital room'. Best of luck and thanks for watching!
Great videos
And I like that screwfix pencil
Thanks for the feedback.
I'm confused as to why you could not board the existing old joists? were they not supported enough to take the weight?
The existing joists are not strong enough. When you have a loft conversion you are creating a new usable floor. A structural engineer will do calculations for you and determine what size joists are required.
Just a quick one. Been reading building regs on noggins / supports. Ard they not supposed to be 75 percent of depth of joist? I have the same issue and putting them on the side doesnt cover 75 percent of my depth. Did this meet building regs?
My inspector was happy. These joist are shorter and wider so less chance of twisting maybe but in reality, once floor boards are screwed on and all joists screwed to wall plates and rafters it isn't going anywhere but you have to discuss that with your inspector. Some re more square than others!! Best of luck with it.
Yeah my thoughts exactly, nothing is going anywhere but dont want a picky inspector. Didn't want to put in and then told dont meet regs. Other thought was to do lengthways and notch out the original joist. Thanks for the reply.
Love you tube and you thanks this is really good video.
Thanks for the kind words!
I noticed the 7x3 timbers your putting in are tight up to roof rafters when your sitting them onto the wall plate? I'm doing this myself as a i just wondered or can they sit between as well?
You can sit them wherever, but I fixed my joists to both the rafters and wallplate to ensure the roof couldn't spread as there had been small movement previously where the rafters has slipped slightly, but the roof is over 120 years old! Thanks for watching.
@@POUSEaroundtheHOUSE ok thanks for that.
@@JohnUk65 no problem.
Great video! few questions. I saw you fixed the joists to the rafters one side when they butted up, what was done on the opposite side as i assume the joist were only butted up to the rafters one side as they would sit out 75mm due to the overlapping on the spine wall?
Where they over lap on the spine is it worth fixing these together with a bold and dog tooth connector similar to building a double trimmer?
I used timber to fill the gap then screwed them all together. Think I showed that in a later video. Bolts are always good as more robust if you want. You just have to be careful not to knock the old timbers around too much as they will have been settled for years. Thanks for watching.
@@POUSEaroundtheHOUSE Brill that was exactly what i was planning on doing. Where the joists overlap on the supporting wall did you fix them at all or are they just braced by the noggins? is it worth bolting them with a dog tooth joiner?
No need for steel beam to pick up floor joists?
Look forward to part 3
No, my house is victorian, all solid brick walls from foundation right up to loft. The span between walls is short enough for joists to span with joists sat on existing wall plates across to center wall. A few people have said this but remember newer build house often have no solid wall in the middle, and have a trussed roof structure that needs completely replacing with steels. My house has thick rafters with huge purlins supported of the solid brick walls. Thanks for the feedback and thanks for watching.
Good video for beginners or DIY ERS very well explained .
Thanks for the feedback.
well done, very good and helpful video, thanks
Thanks for the feedback.
Hi first of all brilliant job. Question is did you use any pilot holes or clearance holes at least in either the joists or noggins prior to driving the screws in?
Yes! Although not really necessary with right screws on joists that thick.
Have you had to do trimmer joists around the loft hatch? Can you show us in the next video as I want to do the same
Hi there, haven't got that far yet but will try to show in future videos. Thanks for the feedback and thanks for watching!
Was this inspected by building control? My wall plates are about 2.5” out of Level from one side to the other. Plywood is a great idea to bring up the level.
Yes, the project is inspected at set stages. Thanks again for watching.
Yes, the project is inspected at set stages. Thanks again for watching.
How much would something like this cost to raise the beams?
Hi @Pouse, will this pass building regs in 2023? Anything I need to change ? Id like to use 175x75 as height issues, someone mentioned overlapping over 100mm?
You’ve made a great start 😃👌👏👏👏
Thank you 😁
Am curious,why don't you replace the existing joists and not lose the ceiling height by another joist on top?
Brilliant job enjoyed that 👍
Thanks for watching Jay!
Currently trying to learn more about this subject. Does anyone know why you can't just sister the joists?
To do a proper loft conversion you need a structural engineer to calculate the strength of the joists required based on the span and load to the floor. Hope that helps.
@@POUSEaroundtheHOUSE Yeah i've been reading up on it but there seems to be a lot of conflicting information. Some say you must use RSJ, others say you can sister, others say you need to use new joists (the thickness calculated by a structural engineer for all of them of course), confusing stuff.
Anyway thank you for the videos, helpfull stuff :)
Please advise if this method is still possible in a 1930s hip roof, I'm sure the end of my rafters are notched out to sit direct and sail straight over the edge of the house wall.. so I think I haven't got enough height in the pitch of the roof in this area to leave enough strength in the new joists after shaping to fit under the roofs slope. Any feedback would be much appreciated cheers 🙌🏻
You're a hard worker. Looking forward to part 3 :-)
Thanks for the feedback Maria. Part 3 now available!
POUSE around the HOUSE Already watched it - I really look forward to your videos. There's nothing you can't do :-)
Can you use the existing beams? Or lay them on the beams?
As I'm doing a proper loft conversion I needed new joists to take all the new loads and they are supported on load bearing walls. The existing joists are not strong enough for this. They are only designed to hold the ceiling below. A proper loft conversion requires building control sign off which mean all these things are calculated correctly. Hope that helps. Thanks for watching.
hi , nice work, Building reg question,, how did you calculate the size of your new joists, you said you went for less depth and fatter joists ,, did you have to get that signed off for BC before hand.
You can search for 'floor joist span charts' online.
My house is 4.2m span, so according to the chart for current building regulations, I have used 9"x2" C24 grade joists, at 400mm centres. I've overdone it with blocking, but there's no issue with that.
I spoke with the local councils building control to begin with, yes they do need to be notified, they will come look, advise, and you invite them back at various points of the build, about 3 times. It cost a certain amount to get it signed off, not as much as private building control firms.
I'm aware of some strange stories of private company standards for a pass, and was wary of them, but the council seemed more stringent, which is what they should be.
I'm converting it for my daughter's bedroom, I want it 100% correct and safe, no half arsing anything. The person with the clip board shouldn't accept anything less than correct.
great video. I have plans to board out my loft and have been advised to fit joists across existing joists for insulation reasons. is there a reason you fit the new joist in the same direction as existing joist or would it still be ok to fit in opposite direct and sit new joist across existing. hope that makes sense :D
My joists are structural for a floor in my loft conversion, so I've placed them on load bearing walls the same as my original smaller joists. What you are doing is fine assuming it's just for storage. If you were making a structural floor then they would need to be supported on something that can take the load. Hope that helps. Thanks for watching.
POUSE around the HOUSE how do you know if the walls can hold the weight
Great video mate, i've rewatched waay to many times! Could be a daft question this.. what's the easiest way to draw out a template to cut the joist for a snug fit ontop of wall plate. I assume i'll need an angle finder to get the pitch degree?
Yes it helps. I used cardboard and then offered it up each time. Trimmed it back until it fitted snug. Obviously if using this method just make sure you have enough of the joist sat on wall plate. Some roofs don't allow this and then joist hangers might be the only option or steel beams which will then support the joists. Best of luck with it.
@@POUSEaroundtheHOUSE top man, cheers mate
@@adamdowney9423 no problem. One more thing, knee pads might help your knees and stop you moaning every time you stand up later that evening!
Hey, I couldnt tell in your video if you did it or not, but did you sister the new joists to the originaly (2x4?) joist at all or did you keep them seperate?
The old joist are over 120 years old and imperial size so more like 2 x 3 half I think. But I kept them separate where I could so not to cause the downstairs ceiling to crack if there is any movement. What I did do was screw and nail all the new joists to the wall plates in a later video to help strengthen the whole roof structure. Thanks for watching.
hi mate l need replace a joist in a small flat blahblah .. could you tell me the right name of the wood for the joist. MY base is in London and t the moment in B&Q , Selco, Builderdepot they have whitesof wood l think it is foor roof , but l want for joist!! is hard for me find the proper name of the joist.. can you tell me how i can order the wood for joist correctly. Thank
You need a structural engineer to calculate the size of joists if doing it properly to building regulations. This is based on span, deflection amongst other things. The strongest timber is usually C24 graded timber but width and depth depends on span. Mine were 3.5 x 7.5 inches. Hope that helps. 2 x 9 inches is also common.
@@POUSEaroundtheHOUSE Thank all the best
Does every conversion need new joists installed into the loft ? How do you know if the old ones aren’t up to it
Yes I'm also curious about this. Loving the videos.
Normally the ceiling joists from the first floor are only designed to take a little weight and the plasterboard from the bedroom ceilings. They are normally as little as 4x2 timbers. Floors need to take a heavier load.
The trick is knowing if you can use timber floor joists. Pouse has his resting on an internal load bearing wall meaning he doesn't have to span a large distance.
If he didn't have that wall there he would need a large steel to span the full distance and then the new floor joists would be hung from the steel
Hi… I love your videos, simple and I’ve watched all your videos on loft conversation,,, I’m a pretty handy diyer, but some times underestimate my self (so my wife says) …. Please don’t take this question as any sort of insult … I just want to know will all this advice on the loft conversion get passed off by building regs?? Reason I ask is I’ve just moved in to new home (1930,s) semi…. And after watching your videos I feel more than confident taking on the job but I’ve been reading that if building regs ain’t signed off then it could void home insurance 😭😭 any advice is greatly appreciated, brilliant videos keep up the good work, 👍🏴 from a fellow Welsh man 🏴🏴
Hi there. I want to convert my loft in room and I find it’s the best way to do so, but I have a question that in the ground floor I have load bearing steel beam between the two rooms as it has no wall between the rooms!!
If I use this middle wall to support the joist in the loft, would that beam be able to bear the load of the new joist ceiling ??
Please let me know. Thanks
I hope Papa Pouse give you the back of his hand for taking the piss! Great Vids Taffy, I have been thinking of using I beams and you have inspired me to do it the same way. Thanks very much for uploading.
He's too old to give me a clip! Thanks again for the comments and good luck with your project.
Excellent video mate. I am looking to do the same but without putting on a new roof. How would you recommend securing wood to the plates ?
I'm using screws, but nails can also be used. It depends on your set up I guess. In a later video (not uploaded yet) when the slates are off you can me screwing through the joists into the wall plates. Hope that helps. Thanks for watching.
Don’t you need at least 300mm insulation between the joists? I think you said these new joists were 175mm
love the vids and love the accent
Thanks for the feedback.
loving the chicken. bluebell?
Bit late now pousecbut why didnt you use steels and then just use joist hangers?
Nevermind i didnt realise it was a hipped roof.
Hi Matty, even if it wasn't a hipped roof it didn't require steels as it's an old house with e load bearing walls across it. Also the use of steels would have meant the beams would have filled my cupboard space which I specifically wanted for storage.
Thank you very much. Does it cost a lot to get a structural engineer and building regs to have a look?
Structural engineer name their own price according to what is involved.Building control is a set fee based on what category the work falls into. Check your local authority website, they will have tables explaining this. Then as I previously said speak to Building Control to confirm. It's different in different local authorities.
Great series of videos, the right balance between the informative and the entertaining. One question, did the existing ceiling joists have binders on top, if so did you just remove them to fit the new joists in?
There were two I think, and not doing a lot! I removed them but I redid all the ceilings with plasterboard years ago so I know they wouldn't shift. If you have the head room you can sit your joists above them with packers? Best of luck and thanks for watching.
What would you charge to fit joists in my loft in West Yorkshire?
I wouldn't, this is a labour of love, not my job sorry. Thanks for watching.
will 38 X 63 cls do? or 38 x 89
Completey depends on the span of the joists. You need to either employ a structural engineer, or as a quick go to, check the joist span tables available on line. Hope that helps. Best of luck!
Great video. Nice job . A few useful tips there . 👍
Hi m8, did u install a steel beam or did u just work of the load bearing wall
3 load bearing walls. Front and back wall of house and a middle load bearing wall. The house is Victorian so all solid brick walls. Thanks for watching.
How come your noggins are not flush with the top of the joist?
its a good job
Thank you.
Is it integral to use 7 x 3 timber or is other timber sufficient- for example 8 x 2?
Get a structural engineer to work it out for you. It depends on many things. There are tables on the internet that will give you a rough idea if your just looking to work out a rough cost but building control will want to see your calculations.
What length do the joists span your loft?
Are stud walls below strong enough for joist supports?
The joists are supported on 3 load bearing solid brick walls. The house is Victorian so no stud walls at all, all brick from the ground up to roof level. Hope that helps. Thanks for watching!
@@POUSEaroundtheHOUSE hi. Thanks for the reply, i was talking generally as i am currently looking to support the joists in my loft but there only seems to be stud walls on the first floor
What’s the average cost of the structural engineer to give you some calculations etc
It's hard to say because it depends on work you need done. In my example I just used timber joists but you may need calculations for steels etc. Also depends on where you live. I imagine a structural engineer in London will cost a lot more than one in South Wales as he needs to pay for his more expensive bills! Just ring a few and get some quotes. Best of luck with it.
My existing joists span 21ft! How am I going to do that since you cant get lengths of wood above 4.8 metres?
Speak to a structural engineer and your local building control officer for your area. They are very happy to help and know the most up to date info / regs etc.
Good video👍
Thanks Ryan!
Great video! Can I borrow your old man, I have a project I want to string out for a year or two ;-) Only joking.
Was this done to building regs? Is there a rule for noggins to conform to regs I.E. one every X cm's or something?
Yes building regs but best to speak to your local officer. Mine was very flexible and pragmatic and I just rang him if I came across any issues. He was really helpful. You can find a lot of info on the .gov website regarding loft conversions, fire safety, joists, stairs etc, well worth a read. Hope that helps.
A very interesting project, and plenty of hard graft ahead :) Just subscribed so I can follow along. I must also add my two penn'orth about the need to normalise the sound on these videos. The music is so much louder than your speech that it prevents me just sitting back and enjoying them because I've got to keep one hand on the volume control. :)
Hi Tony, a few people have mentioned this, I'll try to adjust for next vid. Thanks for the feedback and thanks for watching!
Is it 4 by 2 or 6 by 2 you're using mate?
175 x 75mm
A quality job.
Thanks for the feedback and thanks for watching!
Can't you put a complete materials list ?
Thanks
No problem.
2:41..giving us the finger!..haha....nice work and also some crakin tunes in yr vids:)
Thanks for the feedback. The tunes are by 'the elephant rescue plan'. A local band with a great drummer! Thanks for watching!
Weldone....👍
Thanks again for watching!
I've added you as a featured channel on my channel! Not hinting or anything lol
Not sure I even know how to do that. I'll look into it. Thanks for watching!
I didnt know Harry Kane did Loft Conversions 🤣🤣🤣
Pmsl
They're some thicc floor joists aren't they? 👍
Yes, I went for wider but less tall joists to provide the correct strength but maximise headroom.
I didn't think you were allowed to reduce the height of the joists at the wall plate. My roofer is going to put the 2x2 battens (required to thicken the rafters to allow for the insulation and air gap) ontop of the existing rafters to raise the felt and tiles to allow clearance for the ridiculous 9x2 joists which BC say is necessary. Edit - just noticed that its only half the joist which sits on the wall plate which has been reduced.
Also, my joists are 75mm x175mm so shorter but wider than yours. This was to add a bit of headroom by keeping the joists lower. So when you trim a bit off at the wall plate, they are still 3 inches wide and very solid. More expensive than the 9x2 joists though.
@@POUSEaroundtheHOUSE Thanks for that. I never got the option of wider joists so I'll have to have a word with building control on that one and see if I can use those instead.
If you misaligned the nogins you could have screwed in from the sides
Would you mind answering some of these please?
I have just answered a few Richard. Hope that helps.
Song name?
Song - Ambush / Band - The Elephant Rescue Plan. Thanks for watching!