If Count Dooku fought Exar Kun in a contest of only lightsabers, who would come out on top? Check out the Star Wars Versus Series ruclips.net/video/syRAP2YOUxI/видео.html Check out the Which Series! ruclips.net/p/PLDFq63aBi3_yGAJNwozcKYs0OfmgMiqu-
Dooku underrated? Lol. If anything it's the other way around. I suggest you visit some recent threads featuring Dooku on Battle forum of Comic Vine. Some of those guys consider Dooku to be superior to Valkorion.
All I see are rows of comments saying that Tenebrous would ream Dooku. (Tenebrous being someone people generally have below Valkorion). There is only one guy here saying that Dooku could take Valk. So as I said, vast minority. He later softens his stance from saying Dooku stomps to saying that 'despite Dooku being ouclassed in the force, he can close the distance and win via sabers' and everyone else is still disagreeing with him. I don't see how one comment makes Dooku overrated on Comicvine when literally everyone else in this thread is disagreeing with him. ----- Also, regarding SnoopyRogue's comment. I believe he was saying that Dooku is underrated as a character/villain. Not as a combatant.
The great thing about Niman is that it's not particularly good when used ocassionally by Jedi-Diplomats but if you master the form you'll become a freakin' badass in lightsaber combat. You are almost invincible, undefeatable. For instance, look at Revan/Sidious.
Darth Kenobi Proof? Canonically Palpatine is considered to be one of the best duelist of all time. He had such a hard against Mace Windu because Vaapad is designed to feed off darkside beings to empower the user. If anyone would be have a hard time against Vaapad it would be Sidious. He's essentially the personification of the darkside. In terms of raw force abilities I'd say their very close. It just comes down to that Palpatine has no qualms about his repertoire of force powers.
Bru Master Meh. Interesting but a waste of time. If it's about what you think/remember but can't back it up with proof. Then why even bring it up? When Palpatine fought Savage & Maul he wasn't even trying. How is he Mediocre? He can fight Mace for an extend period of time and yet he's mediocre? Bullshit.
Finally a fighter who can challenge Dooku purely as a duelist. This fight would be like watching art in motion. Honestly, I can't tell who'd be the winner at face value.
Tina Dellavedova Sideous is a master of all 7 forms but kenobi is confirmed by mace windu (who is also a master of all 7 forms) to not be a master of form 3 but THE master of form 3. I'd say that heavily implies that obiwan is the absolute best in form 3
Let's appreciate Christopher's Lee acting - how ACTUALLY realistic his movie deaths and reactions (like hands cut) are He's never overacting. He served as Special Service soldier - he knows how crisis situations look
The interesting thing is that Dooku didn’t even tap into the dark side fully (which is why he did not have Sith eyes). If Dooku tapped into the dark side fully, he might’ve been able to beat Anakin, and even equal Yoda and Sidious. All hypothetical though.
I feel the problem with dooku is his arm and stamina I mean in like 95% of match ups dooku is the better and more powerful combatant, more skilled as a duelist and more versatile than most people it's just such a shame he can't keep this up throughout a long fight against a skilled opponent
An explanation for Dooku's seeming decline after leaving the Order: 1. There's no one around to keep him in shape 2. Unlike Palpatine, he isn't powerful enough in the Force, and thus can't augment his skills like Palpatine or Yoda 3. The Jedi were just getting better.
The decline thing is one that is one that is a strange one. Canon is mixed in its messages. On one hand there is Dark Disciple. On the other is the duel on Oba Diah with Dooku running circles around Anakin and Obi-Wan. And non-canon is even more confusing. Dark Rendezvous is late Clone Wars and Dooku was in prime shape and managed to wound Yoda twice in their duel without incurring a single hit from the Grand Master. On point two, Dooku did not seem to have an issue augmenting his speed and agility on Oba Diah. We also have to recognize that most of Dooku's duels in Clone Wars are not great examples because half the time he is taking it easy on an opponent or toying with them.
@@crownprincesebastianjohano7069 Well that’s that why I think we have so much debate over Dooku’s abilities. The Legend and Canon sources aren’t one to one and they are very confusing. To your point on Oba Diah he ran circles through Obi-wan and Anakin. Augmenting his abilities accordingly, deploying hand to hand combat, mental techniques, and displaying his exquisite blaster deflection skills and crowds control skills, yet just a little under a year later he gets his head lopped off. I find I ridiculous to say he declined so drastically in such a short span of time. Now while I’m not saying Dooku could win or lose to Exar I’m making a pointed fact that Dooku isn’t as handicapped as ppl seem to believe and while Form 2 does have its disadvantages it doesn’t seem to effect Dooku all that much to any life threatening degree (excluding the Dooku vs Anakin fight on the Invisible Hand). Also I personally think Dooku has a chance of beating Palpatine in a PURE (force technique EXCLUDED) lightsaber duel.
@@mylesstephens7791 canon wise,Dooku comes off better than Maul,way better but if we include Legends Maul has better chances,in legends I'd say they're even in sabers,but when accounting the force,Dooku has the edge.
@@crownprincesebastianjohano7069 In Dark Randezvous, Dooku was amped by the Vjun dark side nexus, no? And Yoda ultimately drove him intro retreat, as Dooku simply could not contend with Yoda.
Dookus prestige was all based on being a big fish in a small pond. When everyone else is training to fight against blaster wielders and you train as a duelist of course you're going to have an edge, but he never really had a real duel until the clone wars. Once dueling became viable and others started training for it and getting actual experience in the field his pomp and arrogance got the best of him. I honestly don't see why people give Dooku so much credit. He had a momentary advantage due to being the one guy who was into dueling, but as soon as dueling became a real sport he was beaten by someone with less than a third of his combat experience. The fact that Exar Kun, being a veteran of the sith wars would absolutely rofl stomp count Dooku was a forgone conclusion. Dooku was a dueling hobbyist, not a veteran.
VS Rounds is one of the best ideas you had. You were always one step ahead of every other vs guy, and you always did matches that only interested you, instead of doing stuff like the other guys, who just throw matches out there. Though I'll always wish you'd made Shaak Ti vs Depa Billaba.
Maciek Ciepły can this pleeeeeaaaaase happen? 2 fantastic Niman specialists with comparable power in the force and rivalling physical abilities, and they're both from the old republic! Please: VS Series: Revan (SWTOR) VS Exar Kun
William Henning Same here, Kun may not have been in as many fights, but his abilities and innovative style as a fighter carry through with the lightsaber. The force however is a closer call. Though Kun has only been pushed around by the highest level force users. I don't think Revan quite has it in him.
As per usual, good video. There is, however, one nitpick I'd like to levy. I don't think Niman is the quintessential Jedi form. Rather, I'd say it is Soresu, with its emphasis on going with the flow of battle and patience being the key to victory over raw, impassioned might. In that regard, Soresu is the true antithesis of Juyo, rather than Niman. If Niman was to have an opposite, it would most assuredly be Makashi. You once did a Samurai Champloo video, so you can look at it this way: Mugen uses Niman, while Jin uses Makashi. Makashi requires strict discipline and years of study and is a rigid form, whereas Niman is more free-flowing and adaptable. In this regard, you chose a good match up.
That makes sense on paper, but it's often pointed out how the jedi are very flawed and far from "balanced". Balance would be someone like Kyle Katarn, who's casually does good things rather than trying his hardest to be a hero, and he uses both the dark and the light side of the force. There's a reason why Obi-Wan is the posterboy of the jedi, It's because he's not perfect, but he's perfect in the eyes of the jedi, and he uses Soresu because, while not balanced, counteracts the more aggressive forms typically used by Sith. Niman is a better fit for Grey Jedi, or jedi who aren't blinded by the jedi's teachings. Soresu fits a jedi perfectly though. As Kriea said, "With a lightsaber blade and enough skill in deflection, it is an excellent offense against blasters, but in other situations, it merely delays the inevitable." A jedi protects first, fights second, making Soresu the perfect form for them.
@@wolfgod6443 Kyle Katarn is not balance. Neither are any grey Jedi. While its "cool" to be drawing upon both sides of the Force, you just diminish/dilute your will as well as make yourself more susceptible to falling to the dark side, while trying to fight against the lure of the dark side. Making yourself not as capable as a Jedi with their respective power and not as capable as a Sith with theirs. Making you useless against someone who would normally be your power tier if you devoted to one side. Only Revan has used the Force in balance without being diminished and arguably achieved oneness at will. But even Revan still reverted to darkness and held onto his body beyond death while his light essence became one with the Force.
@@lilcolgatevert3715 Yeah some of my thoughts on this changed since then. Though my thoughts on Soresu still stand. Revan didn't find balance either. Balance in SW to me (nowadays) is to follow the light, but remember the dark. The dark side is not entirely evil, and to accept it is to be in balance, but trying to use the full power of both like Revan will only create chaos. Just look at TLJ's meditation scene, light and dark was in balance on the island, but the pure dark side is an unnatural evil, as is the jedi an unnatural good (though sometimes you need an unnatural good while you never need that kind of evil).
@@wolfgod6443 Agreed, and true Revan didn't find balance until the end of his life, which is why he was nigh paranoid and ripped his essence in two when he died. But Revan did find clarity over using the power of the Force in balance without diminishing returns. He did find balance but only partially, as only part of his spirit transcended into the Unifying Force and retained its pneuma. This shows balance. And yeah, I agree with the rest. Basically: Qui Gon. Too bad they never really expanded upon him all too much in legends however. Even Yoda had to become Qui gon's apprentice and learn how to transcend the Unifying Force as a spirit. Only a balanced Force user can become a cosmic Force ghost. As you said: Accepting their darkness (as Yoda had to experience) but staying solely devoted to the light. The Jedi were flawed, but it isn't because they adhere to the light side, it's because the order *failed* to adhere to the light side, and also pretends as if darkness did not exist.
@@benrichards1694 But Tulak Horde is completely featless and likely lived during an age where the Sith rarely engaged Jedi if at all, ie pre-Great Hyperspace War. Plus Horde would have been utilizing a corded battery-pack lightsaber which were inherently inferior to later sabers.
@Priceluked Not true. For one, in KOTOR Kreia says he is the best duelist of their period, and in SWTOR his servant Khem Val says they fought Jedi on the worlds of Yn and Gnash (Yes thats weird because Pre-hyperspace he shouldn't have been found out, but canonically it happened, so my best guess is a small group of Jedi found Sith space and the Sith wiped them out). Also, in SWTOR, his sabers are available to buy and they are cordless.
You know something ... yeah, Exar should be winning this. His strength, his extremely unique and difficult fighting method, and his substantial edge in Force Connection as far as it correlates to lightsaber combat should culminate in a victory over Dooku's superior technical skill.
Dooku has the force advantage_ Kun has the dueling advantage. It's pretty obvious, Kun style will will definitely throw Dooku off guard. Dooku skills with the force will do the same too Kun.
I feel the opposite. I feel Dooku has more contention blade-to-blade than he does Force-to-Force, especially against Exar, whom was regarded by Luke as being near the level of Palpatine with Sith amulets. Ancient Sith like Kun and the power boosts they got in those stories are rather ridiculous to me.
Antoine Bandele I believe it's the opposite as well. Exar Kun is canonically above post Nathema Vitiate as a Force user but Dooku has better skill accolades and feats when you consider his comparative placement as a Force user.
Same, the power of the jedi and sith is much more consistent, and honestly better. Still, never underestimate the canon characters. Dooku may seem weak compared to some Legends sith, but he has some impressive feats in the Clone Wars, like fighting 3 skilled warriors, including Asajj Ventress (who can fight jedi masters) while blind. Oh, and with the new Vader comics coming out, it seems he's arguably stronger than his Legends counter part (actually, he's already done some things that surpass Malgus, who always had the most ridiculous feats of any force wielder). Speaking of Dooku, I found it odd how you mentioned Dooku may not be able to handle Exar Kun's barrage of random attacks, but isn't that almost exactly what Grievous does? Grievous fights unrelentingly, with speed, ferocity, and a uniquely randomized attack form. Yet Dooku can handle this with extreme ease. It's not just with Grievous either. Savage Oppress uses a similar overwhelming tactic that Dooku overcame without any trouble. I just think Dooku's skills aren't as limited as some may believe. Just because he lost to Anakin doesn't mean he can't handle a strong flurry of attacks. Besides, for all we know fighting Anakin is unlike fighting anyone else. I mean, his lightsaber skills seem a little sporadic at times, but he generally comes out on top. Maybe there's more to Dooku's loss against Anakin than it appears. Oh, and some cool Star Wars Vs. would be Gar Saxon vs. Fen Rau, or Fen vs. Bo Katan, or Sabine, or...ok, really, I just think it'd be neat to see some of the other Mandalorian warriors and where they stack up against each other. In fact, maybe it would be better to pit a canon Mando with a Legends Mando like Pre Vizla vs. Mandalore the Ultimate, or Gar Saxon vs. Mandalore the Lesser.
Well I don'T know Kun so yah but I most said Dooku force ability was nothing to laugh about whit his fight againt Yoda you can clearlly see how talented he was whit it (Force lighting, Force throw and Force crush and force crush was use really quickly in mid fight.) I still do fell If Dooku get somewhere he could slow down Kun he could win AKA a small hall or any place whit low fighting area he could clearlly win Dooku style it more or less like Obi-wan whitout DEF is good whene the enemies can't overpower it if Dooku used a Hall to stop Kun powerfull strike and jump he could clearlly win a 1 vs 1 there. (this fight is simply about the area I think.) If it a small area of fighting the Fencing 1 vs 1 lane of style would probably win over any handed style and if Kun used a double lightsable style it would be even worse since he would hit almost only wall. SORRY FOR THE BAD ENGLISH That just my opinion.
yes. a fight between Kenobi and dooku both ROTS Sabers only would be long and hard. For a long time, Kenobi's near perfect defense would defend against Dooku. But then Kenobi would switch to Ataru to attack and that's when Dooku can get him. It would be an interesting fight, the 2 most energy efficient fighters of their time.
Antoine Bandele but in the law it states that a form 3 master's defence can only be breached by a master of form 7. And with kenobi being THE master of form 3 at that time, that would further suggest that dooku wouldn't be able to piece his defence (in my opinion). Also in the season six fight between anakin Obi and dooku, kenobi was on the offensive with form 4 Ataru. ( a form that dooku knows inside out thanks to his master yoda and his apprentice Jin specialising in it and using it against him in "thousands" of spars). Kenobi used form 4 for all the fight which wouldn't even show the full ability of kenobi's range of skill (as he didn't employ form 3) and it still wasn't quite his prime yet. Dooku notes in the revenge of the sith novel that he couldn't piece kenobi's defence during the duel on the invisible hand. Further more, based on this I believe kenobi was at least close to hitting the levels of the likes of Dooku and Mace.
PPPPPPPLLLLLEEEEEEAAAAAASSSSSSEEEE do Darth Bane vs Darth Plagueis! I'd love it! Personally, here's how I think it would go: Physics: Equal Lightsaber Dueling: Bane The Force: Plagueis Personally, I think Bane would win. Great video, by the way.
I agree with the outcome, but it should be closer. Dooku is the superior swordsman and his ability to employ Force attacks mid-duel is peerless. Moreover, people consistently underrate his ability to absorb the attacks of physically stronger opponents. Only one person conclusively defeated him in a duel that way: the Chosen One. Grievous and Oppress were very strong, immensely so, but they were no match for Dooku's blade work.
Agreed, something to remember when anakin was fighting dooku for the last time it wasn’t just raw power that defeated dooku, it was also an equal level of skill or mastery as dooku considers him the finest djem so duelist he’s ever fought.
I agree with you where it comes to pure style-style match up between these two duelists. Though personally, I feel it will be even closer, as I feel Dooku is simply a higher calibur duelist than Exar (to an extent), though that simply may be Kun's lack of exposure as a duelist late in his Sith Career talking. And perhaps Kun's superior power might lend itself to closing that gap, as it often does in SW, so maybe i'm wrong. Definitely an interesting Match up though. This is an often discussed topic.
Good video, very well presented, edited and executed. Not sure if I agree though. I doubt Kun has any sort of strength advantage against Dooku, when the latter was matching Yoda in bladelocks. Yoda as a duelist is mainly attributed to be a speedster, but many overlook his strength, capable of matching Darth Sidious evenly; the Dark Lord having warded off the combined strength of Maul and Savage Opress. So yeah, not seeing any advantage for Kun. Another thing you didn't take into account was Dooku's ability to replenish his stamina. In the _Revenge of the Sith_ novelization, during his 1v1 with Anakin, he washes away all his fatigue with a snap of his finger. _He pushed this aside, drawing once more upon the certain knowledge of his personal invincibility to open a channel to the Force. Power flowed into him, and the weight of his years dropped away._ Yes, this is a lightsaber duel, but since Force augmentation is allowed, I'm assuming any Force ability that is directly linked to lightsaber combat is fair game as well. Even if not, the RotS junior novel states the dark side would keep Dooku going for as long as he needed, and that Anakin couldn't outlast him. The only time Dooku's stamina was an issue is when he was drugged, but I have never seen Dooku tire in a fair fight. Ever. _He's old, Anakin thought. Maybe I can just outlast him. But the power of the dark side flowed around him, denying that possibility. The dark side would keep Dooku going for as long as he needed._ So there goes Kun's primary advantages, and I wonder what he'll be left with. Not much, as I see it. Dooku wins this, but it's a good fight.
We have directly seen Dooku whittled down by strength with Savage on one occasion when he was disarmed, and multiples times with Anakin (and if you really want to, but I don't want to, you can include Vos). That's rather clear. Exar cut through a Force-imbued staff which takes more than just physical strength. For me, that strength advantage stands. Dooku had heavy breathing after facing Padawan Anakin, against after facing him multiple times in TCW, and after facing Ventress and Savage. And relative to Exar, who could fight Ulic Qel-Droma indefinitely, Dooku does not have superior stamina. Is he in super great shape for his age and can he sustain himself with his Force reserves? Certainly. But comparing him to Exar, he does not match up in that way.
Antoine Bandele Yes, but in my personal opinion I dont think Dooku would be beaten so easily. While I do think Exar Kun's unorthodox fighting style and unique double bladed lightsaber could potenially overwhelmed the count. I do not think it will completely throw dooku off. For Example, form ll are trained from being enslaved to form, by developing unique offenes and defenses.
Oppress? You realize that same episode featured Oppress simultaneously driving back anakin and kenobi? Citing Anakin does nothing for Kun. Anakin is a yoda/side level fighter who is physically superior to both. Quinlan Vos overwhelmed an injured Dooku, but let's not act like reverse scaling is a thing. If Vos is skilled enough that a stylistic edge can bridge the gap between him and an injured dooku, that's fantastic for Vos, it means nothing for Kun who's done nothing to suggest he can compete with dooku as a swordsman.
Either Anakin or Obi is more than capable of putting Opress down one-on-one. Him driving back both of them simultaneously (especially after tanking several blasts of Dooku's lightning) is a PIS in it's finest. Lol at Anakin being Yoda/Sidious level. Put him against either of them and watch him being torn apart.
Yoda is stronger than Sidious. He wasn't matching him evenly. And Yoda was very clearly holding the full extent of his augmentation back, or he would have slaughtered Dooku
cheuk hang Yu mace and dooku will be out of the equation with Yoda and Sidious. It really goes either way with Yoda and Sidious, maybe Yoda for being a better duelist or Sidious with his force advantage
cheuk hang Yu Vaapad is not a Sith trump card, Mace only got his only Vaapad Amp Against Sidious. Vaapad would work on Sidious but not on a calm Sith like Dooku especially with Dookus Makashi.
Well, I usually like longer videos because theres often more content to enjoy. But I can appreciate your conciseness here. The one thing I would say in the last fight is that when Dooku dueled Anakin he did hold him back with a strike to the legs, something of a similar nature could perhaps occur with kun, giving Dooku back his control. Not to mention such a tactic allowed Dooku a breather to freshen his reserves. That being said, Im no exar kun expert
It's highly unlikely Anakin would start throwing force pushes though. I feel like Anakin would start counteracting or it'd be a 50/50 Djem So battle. It's very interesting as a blade only battle because of the knowledge advantage Anakin has over him but Ulic could probably improvise since he was the equal of Exar Kun when he never fought against a double bladed saber before. I take that back +Monarch57 , that's a good choice.
You made a good point. Because these two saber fighting would be like a mirror match. Their personalities in combat and their level of skill are very similar it would be very interesting. Anakins use of the force would only really be used to knock away or throw off I'd love to see this. Ulic trained massively in Djem so and was only rivaled by exar kun in his time and he had the thirst to fight and liked over powering his enemies. Anakin is the same. Even though he didnt train as much as others his preferences in combat would compliment Ulic greatly. I'd give the win to Anakin but visually I'd imagine this would be one of the best saber fights EVER. Anakin is above Obi Wan in saber skills but was on equal footing with him because Obi was fighting style was like water to Anakins fire.
Kun isn’t bringing what anakin did to the table, he can’t become an avatar of the force like him nor does he know Dooku as well as Yoda or mace. I don’t recall Kun fighting anyone like or on par with Dooku he isn’t close enough to Form V to have the same advantage as Anakin did.also the count can match grevious I doubt kun can overwhelm him by number of strikes or randomness. He isn’t bringing enough of anything to defeat Dooku also Yoda had an army coming to back him up along with Dooku having the plans to the Death Star which can not fall into enemy hands. Even in their second fight Dooku had he stuck around would face not only a mass of clones but Anakin and obiwan along with Yoda while he would have killed more then one of the Jedi and a mass of clones it would still be foolish to stick around because he along with any fighter would be overwhelmed.
All2Meme I'm actually putting some notes together to see how post-orbalisk Bane and Kun stack up. I have not finished the force analysis yet, but Kun takes the lightsaber advantage while Bane gets the physical edge.
HarbingerOfBattle that's interesting because I would put that the other way around. I give Kun the physical edge but I would give Bane the duelling edge (though both categories are incredibly close). For force abilities I really cannot decide. I think Kun is overalls the more powerful force wielder (if only by a tiny bit), but Bane is more combatively viable. It's a great matchup, I really don't know!
Macattack 1 Frankly, Kun is a fragile lightweight. He can't take much damage where as Bane has been beaten, battered, electrocuted, poisoned and just about everything else. We have also seen several examples of his physical strength and stamina throughout his fights and quests. Kun may have the speed and agility advantage, but Bane's sheer strength, endurance and toughness takes it. As for lightsabers, Bane may be a master of Forms 5 and 3 with a little Juyo, but He never developed his own true fighting style. He knows the moves but is not bringing anything to the table Kun hasn't seen. On the flip side, Kun is using form 6 like nobody has ever seen before. Pair that with his unique lightsaber and Bane would be left scrambling. Bane doesn't deal well with the unexpected. When dropped into a situation cold he either tries to blast through it or become a tough stone. And with Kun's blade all over the place, it's only a matter of time before the inevitable happens.
Interesting, I also thought Exar Kun's Niman approach resembles Juyo or how (I at least think) it should be tactically approached (rather than how many commonly approach it); you won't be breaking that Soresu master's defense with sheer amount of physicality or skill, but putting him/her in a situation where he/she can't identify what from your (personalized) skillset is coming.
Good work Antoine!!! I was waiting awhile to see Exar :) . 100% Agree with the outcome but man I do not see the winner getting out without some damage hahah
Those are my thoughts. He had trouble with anie Skywalker. He has had some battles for days against high level force users. Also the incorporation of Sith magic that kun had. I mean he was the true Lord of his time as well. Dooku not so much lol
Think what adds to Kun's victory his his use of physical integration and strength based offense. He is capable of putting enough power in his blows to keep dooku on the back end
@Wes Bradley-Taubner it’s weird tho, I’ve seen both but I stand by the one handed sized Saberstaff, also with both side activated the movements look and act more like Makashi
Sorta a strange request but a vs with Samurai Jack would be cool. I think he has a lot of potential because he can potentially kill any opponent with his magical sword (or parry lightsabers) and skill, but because he is just a ordinary human he is still very fallible. Maybe Jack vs General Grievous, Jack vs Serpico (another really versatile fighter) or even Jack vs Guts.
Exar Kun would not defeat Dooku. He has nothing Dooku hasn't seen, heard of or thought of. There is a reason why Dooku is regarded in both legends and Canon as one if the greatest duelists not just of his generation but in the history of both the Jedi and Sith orders. To say that Dooku only won against unprepared Knights is a sham. He bested noted saber masters like Sora Bulq, he bested Windu twice, Anakin multiple times, Kenobi multiple times, fought evenly with Yoda, just to name a few. Yes his age was advanced but it has never been shown as a factor. Even in Revenge of the Sith, Dooku could match Anakin's strength for a time. I say the score would be more like 6-4 in Dookus favor
I don't think there's one good answer for that. Kun relies on unpredictability to create his own openings, while Revan is more content to follow the flow of battle, waiting for an opening to appear and using the most appropriate form to exploit it. As for who would win in a duel, I would say Revan. - greater versitility. Revan can fall back on any other form if Niman proves insufficient. - unlike Jedi in Kun's time, Revan has an experience fighting saberstaff wielding opponents. - as Antoine described, all those fancy settings of Kun's lightsaber are good... on paper. Without at least one documented case of him using those tricks in active combat, we cannot say how frequently or effectively Kun can use them. And even if we take those statements for granted, Revan's own mastery of Trakata and second lightsaber should be more than able to compensate. - better feats. All noteworthy dueling feats for Kun are stalemating Ulic and beating Baas thanks to element of surprise. The first one is inconclusive, the second one is circumstancial. Meanwhile, Revan defeated Malak after cutting his way through army of Star Forge battle droids, Sith troopers and Sith warriors and Bastila Shan. Keep in mind that the Star Forge was a powerful Dark Side Nexus which was amplifying the Sith while Revan was wickened. Meanwhile Malak was rested and had Star forge amp. And that was pre-prime amnesiac KotOR Revan.
Maybe I'm missing something here. But, what dueling feats does Exar Kun possess that puts him in the same league as count dooku? Dooku was able to duel with the likes of Yoda, Windu, Obi Wan and Anakin, etc.... I get that Kun is the greatest duelist of HIS era. But, Clone Wars era Jedi have actual feats. Something Exar only has against fodder. Exar Kun killing Vodo Siosk Bass doesn't mean much to the guy who can match Yoda. Now maybe I am missing something. But, from what I have read Exar Kun is most likely not out fencing Dooku. Now feel free to correct me if I am wrong.
Some have said kun has logistics on his side where dooku has feats on his, though looking back even the logistics should put kun in an uphill fight as his weapon is built for using trakata tactics, something that has been considered weak against makashi. As for feats I really do wonder that myself as well as the only known feats we’ve seen him have were against Sylvars mate, vodo siosk baas, and ulic qeldroma, who the latter two are considered as great duelists of their time haven’t exactly shown anything the clone wars era Jedi masters have, though ulic may be a prototype anakin with his skills.
I don't think this video gives Dooku enough credit for his skills. Of course Yoda overpowered him, but Yoda is possibly the greatest duelist of all times, so it's already quite impressive that he kept up with him for about a minute. In his fight with Ani however, he could have probably won if he had gone for a kill from the start where he still had higher power reserves. Only because of his age based physical weakness and Palpi's order not to attack Ani at the start did Ani overpower him. Exar however, when faced with a Dooku in his prime and with permission to kill him, could probably not sustain the early fight in 8/10 cases as depicted here, but most likely find his demise in the early or mid fight before he could dominate the late fight
The major differences between Exar Kun and General Grievous are that Exar had been trained for a lot longer, had succeeded in defeating the greatest combat instructor in the Jedi Order, and was technically a _genius_ in dueling. So you could say he's more than a match for the likes of Tyranus. If Tyranus has a hope against Exar, he'd need to rely on his knowledge of the dark side.
There's something you may have overlooked in _Jedi Academy Training Manuel_: _As the Jedi Watchman of Dantooine, Master Baas spends much of his time on the planet and trains multiple apprentices at a time. His strongest apprentice, however, is a young pupil named Exar Kun. Kun's skill with a lightsaber is so great that he claimed victory over his master many times when they sparred together._ Many times? Man, what an accomplishment! I'm sure Tyranus must've been so jealous. ;)
I can't believe noone else has realized that count Dooku is basically the Colonel Sanders/Robert E Lee of star wars. From his costume that looks like a confederate generals uniform, to his using a curved handled saber, and the fact that he led the confederacy of independant systems (cis). He is the CSA (Confederated states of america) leader of star wars.
Historically, the Samurai Miyamoto Musashi would side with Exar Kun as he references that the sword fighter should "Lead the dance while engaged with an opponent and do not let your opponent dictate your movement"
This is another one I've been waiting a long time to see... IMHO Exar takes majority in this sabers-only fight, but by an even more narrow margin than 7/10. I think his natural arrogance is a weakness that Dooku could goad him into exposing, given his skill with Dun Moch. But on the other hand... if Vodo, Kun's own master, couldn't pull that off it's a long shot that Dooku would do the same. The possibility is there though. More importantly, I think you (slightly) underrate Grievous' strength. The General's a cyborg and while he's a whirling dervish and not a strength-based duelist like Vader or Malgus, there's some decent visual evidence of Jedi straining under the strength of his blows at such a high tempo. If Dooku could find ways to subvert and withstand that I don't think an athletic, youthful but relatively squishy human like Kun is going to overwhelm Dooku until the late fight, where the Count's energy would be flagging. Otherwise, solidly argued and presented as usual Antoine. :) I'm glad you're still putting out new Star Wars content, I only wish the other members of the Forcecast updated as often.
I really want to hear the story about the 2 year mission with qui gon and Tyranus. Where when qui gon returned he was knighted right away without any tests
Maybe I just missed it but I’m pretty sure you forgot to mention that Exar Kunn’s lightsaber could only be used by one hand when it was in its dual blade variant
Antoine, what do you use to edit your Star Wars versus series? I'm making my own and use PowerPoint, but that is know where near as professional as the software you use in your videos.
Why you think Trakata is suited for Niman users? I actually think it is best suited for Makashi users, as what Trakata aims for is also what form two is all about, working around an opponent's defense with your lightsaber, am I wrong?
9:39: Perhaps with a grain of salt? Yeah, Dooku's endurance is pretty underrated. Had fought Yoda fresh he would've done a little bit better. It wouldn't have made the difference in the outcome, but I feel he could hold on a little longer had Anakin and Obi-Wan not worn him down.
We see the results of a fresh Dooku in _Yoda: Dark Rendezvous_ where Dooku did not do much better: "Then their blades clashed together in a lace of fire, green and red: but the green burned hotter. Slowly, slowly, Dooku gave way: and in the dark, drunken Vjun air, Yoda was terrible to behold."
+Antoine Bandele If I recall correctly before their fight Dooku and Yoda had a confrontation. I'm not sure if it was as "emotional" as I'm remembering so I'm unsure if it'd hinder him. The reason is probably because I remember it being similar to the prelude to the Mustafar duel.
Antoine, great video as always. I have one question. Why haven't you done a versus with tulak hord. I legitimately don't know much about him, is he too OP in a 1 on 1 duel or is there not enough information on him to make a versus episode?
Yeah I couldn't salvage all of it. It was much worse before, pops and scratches were happening throughout the entire verdict but I could not suppress those at the end.
It's a good video with a lot of good points. Also side note, going to speak in favor of being able to shorten or lengthen the blade of a lightsaber as that might be a standard feature now in the new continuity. Though there's at least good reason for this, as it would make sense as sometimes you might want a shorter blade.
I'm not really interested in the fact that lightsabers _can_ be shortened (which was shown in canon with Rebels) but no one has yet to actually apply it in active combat (which is the most important thing to me for these analysis's).
I think this would be closer than 7/3, but good video. Out of curiosity, what's you opinion on RotS Anakin (AKA Zonakin)? I personally don't buy the "nuclear furnace" hyperbole, but some people on the forums claim that he's above Yoda.
Exar Kuns style is to give the the impression of a single minded attacker ala anakin however it's a calculated deception every strike thought out every move forcing the opponent to react a certain way. Irish stick fighting follows the same mentality forcing an opponent to react to you. The ultimate question would be if dooku could last long enough to see the method behind the madness or just die. With dookus habit of toying with his opponent at the onset of a duel to gauge their skill I believe he would be at a massive disadvantage.
Here's the short version of the video: Dooku's advantages and disadvantages: The most skilled duelist in terms of pure swordsmanship focused around blade-to-blade combat but only possessing great skill or basic knowledge of the other forms. An experienced strategist and tactician, defeating opponents through decisive plans. But can be easily defeated if pressured enough Due to his age, he is pretty weak, but he's still stronger than the average human because of his Force Augmentation Kun's advantages and disadvantages: A pure tactician, born of arrogance; he prefers to meet his opponent head on and crush them with an overhead strike or overwhelm them with a hundred small cuts but because of this, he never plans out his fights no matter what and is unpredictable and wild, though not savage or animal-like A great all-around swordsman, having a mastery of Niman, though he is particularly aggressive and lacks understanding of adaptability and versatility which Niman preaches He is a lightweight who can't take a lot of damage, and uses his Force abilities to become far stronger. If his force reserves are drained, one good punch or kick can put him down easily. Winner: Exar Kun Count Dooku is overwhelmed and pressured by Kun's aggressive use of Niman, eventually draining the Count of his stamina and being pushed back until he makes a mistake, with Kun delivering the killing blow. It should be noted, that Dooku has an early advantage though he needs to fight aggressively enough for this to happen, which he rarely is.
Here are some of my suggestions for future battles. 1: Master Fay vs Aleema Keto. 2: Darth Maul vs Ulic Qel Droma. 3: Anakin vs Darth Bane. 4: Sora Bulq vs Asajj Ventress. 5: Exar Kun vs Revan (right before his split). 6: Darth Plaguies vs Mother Talzin. 7: Darth Maul (without his lightsaber) vs Amon. 8: Dooku vs Darth Malak. 9: Darth Marr vs Lucien Draay. 10: Plo Koon vs Rahm Kota. 11: Shaak Ti vs Darth Maul. 12: Kanan Jarrus vs padawan Obi-Wan.
Antoine Bandele Really? That's great to hear, I have wanted to see Darth Marr in something for so long. Also if you don't mind and have the time could you tell me who you think would win in the other battles? Only as long as it is okey with you
So if a fight has a 50/25/25 (or something along those lines) shot of ending in the early, middle, and late fight, how would you keep that a surprise for the audience these videos?
Multiple series match-ups Walking Dead (Comics/Tv series/Video games): Michonne vs Paul 'Jesus' Monroe Daryl Dixon vs Negan Carl Grimes vs Clementine Kenny vs David Garcia Scott Pilgrim: Matthew Patel vs Lucas Lee Roxie Richter vs Envy Adams Ramona Flowers vs Knives Chau Star Wars: Darth Vader vs Darth Revan Darth Malek vs Darth Malgus Avatar: Lin Beifong vs Suyin Beifong Master Piandao vs Ty Lee Zhao vs General Iroh II Harry Potter Harry Potter vs Newt Scamander Sirius Black vs Remus Lupin Nympedora Tonks vs Propentina Goldstein Crossover: Samurai Jack vs Himura Kenshin Rubeus Hagrid vs Hodor
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Dookus showings of defensive force powers and offensive ones are both high even as a Jedi his force shield already at nine was high enough that he was the only person Yoda put some effort into beating in force games and his telekinesis even at a young age was enough where he effortlessly lifted a many hundred pound plant while most people his age were only able to telekenetically levitate leaves
Anyone have an idea for who the 7th Sister and 5th Brother from Rebels could fight in a duo match? Those two have enough screen time to show how well they work together and their personal strength, but I can't think of a duo that wouldn't ground them into dust. The closest I can think of is Gorc and Pic from Dark Forces 2, but there's really not enough info on them for a fight.
Put a tournament of Two masters of a form in different eras(Kasim and Kao Cen) to see which one is ultimately the best one of each era. Then have the top,masters of each form fight to see which is the ULTIMATE duelist.
Yeah! have the whole Council collaborate on this. Have each "Councillor" choose a lightsaber form ( 1-2 may have 2 forms) and do a tournament. i can help if you want.
Even with the video watched , do you believe that Exar Kun could have won including force abilities, considering that lightsaber forms and physicality can be viewed close together? Also super excited for Thrawn vs Khan, just wondering when that video will come out?
Antoine Bandele so you don't think that adding in force abilities could have tipped either side an advantage ,and do you think that in the battle that force abilities would even be used, or just a pure battle of blades.
I'm surprised by the verdict, and even more so by the margin of that verdict...but it does make sense. I thought for sure Dooku had this since the power setting stuff on Kun's lightsaber was negated (for good reason)
While I do find it likely that Exar Kun would certainly win, I feel as though Dooku losing 0-4 in the late fight is strange, despite his advanced age. But this is just focusing on a lightsaber duel, so I can see the reasoning behind it. It still takes a lot to exhaust Dooku, and even at the end of his final duel with Anakin and Obi-wan, despite losing his hand (or hand*s* via film) he showed no signs of fatigue. I believe the fight would be SLIGHTLY closer, but that's just what I believe. I don't know Exar Kun all that well. I posted on your discussion that I believe that you should do a fight with Shaak Ti. I have not seen you use her in any versus match-ups and I believe that you would enjoy using her in this series. I'm not entirely sure who would be a fantastic match-up for her, but I have the urge to recommend Darth Malak, Satele Shan, or maybe even Darth Maul during TPM--though I personally believe that she takes that fight quite handily.
Christopher Lee did not perform the fatigue like he did in _Attack of the Clones_ but Dooku's fatigue does show up in the Clone Wars series and in the prose of the _Revenge of the Sith_ novelization. I've never been interested in Shaak Ti. But I do not believe she takes TPM Handily.
I see. That's my mistake in regards to the Dooku topic. It has been a while since I've even seen the novel for ROTS. It just seemed as though he was overwhelmed before he showed any signs of exhaustion, and in most of his duels, he has maintained his stamina for a long period, only ever being pushed to the edge by Anakin, Obi-Wan, or similarly skilled opponents--though I believe that we can both agree that Exar Kun is at such a skill level. You're right. I'm surprised that you are not interested in Shaak Ti, especially due to her seeming like a really fun character to use in this type of analysis due to her unique abilities and light-saber form. I wouldn't hold it against you if you don't want to use her in a fight, but I do ask that you think about her being in a match-up in the future. I may underestimate Darth Maul during TPM to some degree, but I do see Shaak Ti taking a majority over him regardless, even if it is hard-fought.
Antoine Bandele Yes but the time dooku had problems with fatigue during the clone wars series, is when he was fending off an attack from ventress and the nightsisters. And that was after being injected with a nightsister poison.
Antoine, have you considered using some of the fighters from the Fate/Series? They can be pretty interesting; an example being Sasaki Kojiro or EMIYA. The first one being a swordsman who wields a odachi and is basically a mixed version of Yoda and Dooku in terms of skill, and EMIYA, a weak yet incredibly smart strategist and tactician, being able to beat those WAY stronger than him through calculated decision making in the middle of a high-speed fight.
Anakin Skywalker vs Ulic Qel-Droma. Ahsoka Tano(Rebels) vs Jaden Korr. Arcann vs Starkiller. Commander Shepard vs Ryder. Darth Plagueis vs Darth Malgus. Emperor Valkorian vs Emperor Palpatine. Legends General Grevious vs Exar Kun. SoR Revan vs Darth Sidious. Figured I'd just throw an ass load of ideas at you. Thanks Antoine!
Why is everyone saying dooku was weaker than exar kun in the force. He was able to contest with yoda and knock out anakin with force lightning. He was by yoda to be his greatest student and he was an instructor in telekinesis and dun moch. His force lightning was second only to darth sidious in his Era and you forget exar kun used sith artifacts to pull of his force feats, dooku just used his training and personal strength.
Combining these 2 into one warrior is the Sith I would be. Forms 1,2, and 6 for Saber combat. Dun Moch and Sokan for strategy. Force lightning and tutaminis for force focus.
I do think you are on the early and late fight but in the middle I do think Doku would know what to expect and have enough stamina to even up the scores 2-2
If Count Dooku fought Exar Kun in a contest of only lightsabers, who would come out on top?
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Antoine Bandele dooku
Antoine Bandele can you do a sith tournament? To see which sith comes out on top.
You could divide the sith by era's to make it more easy to manage.
sidious should be disqualified from the start, he would spoil the competition
Matthew cass i thought it would come between darth visiout and darth sidious
Kun in an excellent fight.
"Dun Moch works exceptionally well until it doesn't. If you need more proof just ask Dooku and Vader".
It's all about knowing your opponent, when to push them and when to stop
@@tiredjediknight3110 Exactly, it's like bullying a potential school shooter
Dooku is such an underrated villain we need more content on him in the canon. Enough of Maul and Vader we need Lucino to do a Tyranus Novel.
Dooku underrated? Lol. If anything it's the other way around.
I suggest you visit some recent threads featuring Dooku on Battle forum of Comic Vine. Some of those guys consider Dooku to be superior to Valkorion.
I'm on comicvine and I've never seen anyone claim Dooku could come close to handling Valk.
And if anyone did they were in the vast minority.
The first example that comes to my head.
comicvine.gamespot.com/forums/battles-7/count-dooku-vs-darth-tenebrous-1837448/?page=1#js-message-18843813
All I see are rows of comments saying that Tenebrous would ream Dooku. (Tenebrous being someone people generally have below Valkorion).
There is only one guy here saying that Dooku could take Valk. So as I said, vast minority.
He later softens his stance from saying Dooku stomps to saying that 'despite Dooku being ouclassed in the force, he can close the distance and win via sabers' and everyone else is still disagreeing with him.
I don't see how one comment makes Dooku overrated on Comicvine when literally everyone else in this thread is disagreeing with him.
-----
Also, regarding SnoopyRogue's comment. I believe he was saying that Dooku is underrated as a character/villain. Not as a combatant.
I'm not talking in a versus matchup I mean as a character Maul and Vader take all the spotlight and Dooku never got a book or backstory
The great thing about Niman is that it's not particularly good when used ocassionally by Jedi-Diplomats but if you master the form you'll become a freakin' badass in lightsaber combat. You are almost invincible, undefeatable. For instance, look at Revan/Sidious.
Shadowstriker yoda is better than Sidious in sabers. Sidious is better than Yoda with the force.
Darth Kenobi First off, I wouldn't say that.
Secondly, that's why I said "almost"
Darth Kenobi Proof? Canonically Palpatine is considered to be one of the best duelist of all time. He had such a hard against Mace Windu because Vaapad is designed to feed off darkside beings to empower the user. If anyone would be have a hard time against Vaapad it would be Sidious. He's essentially the personification of the darkside. In terms of raw force abilities I'd say their very close. It just comes down to that Palpatine has no qualms about his repertoire of force powers.
Bru Master Meh. Interesting but a waste of time. If it's about what you think/remember but can't back it up with proof. Then why even bring it up? When Palpatine fought Savage & Maul he wasn't even trying. How is he Mediocre? He can fight Mace for an extend period of time and yet he's mediocre? Bullshit.
sacredbeastzenon exactly.
Finally a fighter who can challenge Dooku purely as a duelist.
This fight would be like watching art in motion.
Honestly, I can't tell who'd be the winner at face value.
Tina Dellavedova probably kenobi
Tina Dellavedova Sideous is a master of all 7 forms but kenobi is confirmed by mace windu (who is also a master of all 7 forms) to not be a master of form 3 but THE master of form 3. I'd say that heavily implies that obiwan is the absolute best in form 3
Tina Dellavedova without force augmentation, I doubt it considering his age. With augmentation, most likely
Anakin beat Dooku without force powers tho and relied on saber to saber combat
Literally Yoda, Anakin, Sidious
Windu, Maul, Kenobi
Now Quinlan Vos
Exar Kun is such an awesome character
Hopefully we get more Exar Kun stuff
Let's appreciate Christopher's Lee acting - how ACTUALLY realistic his movie deaths and reactions (like hands cut) are
He's never overacting. He served as Special Service soldier - he knows how crisis situations look
The interesting thing is that Dooku didn’t even tap into the dark side fully (which is why he did not have Sith eyes). If Dooku tapped into the dark side fully, he might’ve been able to beat Anakin, and even equal Yoda and Sidious. All hypothetical though.
Imagine a Dooku with his level of experience but as a young man, exhaustion is his biggest weakness
Much like many dark Jedi in the time period (Sora Bulq, Komari Vosa, Asajj Ventress) Dooku was better as a Jedi
I feel the problem with dooku is his arm and stamina I mean in like 95% of match ups dooku is the better and more powerful combatant, more skilled as a duelist and more versatile than most people it's just such a shame he can't keep this up throughout a long fight against a skilled opponent
An explanation for Dooku's seeming decline after leaving the Order:
1. There's no one around to keep him in shape
2. Unlike Palpatine, he isn't powerful enough in the Force, and thus can't augment his skills like Palpatine or Yoda
3. The Jedi were just getting better.
The decline thing is one that is one that is a strange one. Canon is mixed in its messages. On one hand there is Dark Disciple. On the other is the duel on Oba Diah with Dooku running circles around Anakin and Obi-Wan. And non-canon is even more confusing. Dark Rendezvous is late Clone Wars and Dooku was in prime shape and managed to wound Yoda twice in their duel without incurring a single hit from the Grand Master.
On point two, Dooku did not seem to have an issue augmenting his speed and agility on Oba Diah. We also have to recognize that most of Dooku's duels in Clone Wars are not great examples because half the time he is taking it easy on an opponent or toying with them.
@@crownprincesebastianjohano7069
Well that’s that why I think we have so much debate over Dooku’s abilities. The Legend and Canon sources aren’t one to one and they are very confusing. To your point on Oba Diah he ran circles through Obi-wan and Anakin. Augmenting his abilities accordingly, deploying hand to hand combat, mental techniques, and displaying his exquisite blaster deflection skills and crowds control skills, yet just a little under a year later he gets his head lopped off. I find I ridiculous to say he declined so drastically in such a short span of time. Now while I’m not saying Dooku could win or lose to Exar I’m making a pointed fact that Dooku isn’t as handicapped as ppl seem to believe and while Form 2 does have its disadvantages it doesn’t seem to effect Dooku all that much to any life threatening degree (excluding the Dooku vs Anakin fight on the Invisible Hand). Also I personally think Dooku has a chance of beating Palpatine in a PURE (force technique EXCLUDED) lightsaber duel.
@@mylesstephens7791 canon wise,Dooku comes off better than Maul,way better but if we include Legends Maul has better chances,in legends I'd say they're even in sabers,but when accounting the force,Dooku has the edge.
@@crownprincesebastianjohano7069 In Dark Randezvous, Dooku was amped by the Vjun dark side nexus, no? And Yoda ultimately drove him intro retreat, as Dooku simply could not contend with Yoda.
Dookus prestige was all based on being a big fish in a small pond. When everyone else is training to fight against blaster wielders and you train as a duelist of course you're going to have an edge, but he never really had a real duel until the clone wars. Once dueling became viable and others started training for it and getting actual experience in the field his pomp and arrogance got the best of him.
I honestly don't see why people give Dooku so much credit. He had a momentary advantage due to being the one guy who was into dueling, but as soon as dueling became a real sport he was beaten by someone with less than a third of his combat experience. The fact that Exar Kun, being a veteran of the sith wars would absolutely rofl stomp count Dooku was a forgone conclusion. Dooku was a dueling hobbyist, not a veteran.
VS Rounds is one of the best ideas you had. You were always one step ahead of every other vs guy, and you always did matches that only interested you, instead of doing stuff like the other guys, who just throw matches out there.
Though I'll always wish you'd made Shaak Ti vs Depa Billaba.
Nice, don't know a fat bunch on Kun but I have to agree, he's like a starkiller dooku hybrid in power skill and technique.
Eh I'd say he's more along the lines of Anakin than Dooku tbh.
So basically Kun has logistics on his side. On purely technical side (and featwise) Dooku has this.
Revan vs Exar Kun? Pretty please?
Maciek Ciepły same! Revan vs exar kun would be so awesome!
Maciek Ciepły can this pleeeeeaaaaase happen? 2 fantastic Niman specialists with comparable power in the force and rivalling physical abilities, and they're both from the old republic! Please: VS Series: Revan (SWTOR) VS Exar Kun
Maciek Ciepły I'd go Kun for a solid majority.
William Henning Same here, Kun may not have been in as many fights, but his abilities and innovative style as a fighter carry through with the lightsaber. The force however is a closer call. Though Kun has only been pushed around by the highest level force users. I don't think Revan quite has it in him.
William Henning I see. Personally I would go for Revan in a good fight.
I like this format and how it focuses on my favorite part of every video
My man Exar Kun is the goat (duelist wise)
As per usual, good video.
There is, however, one nitpick I'd like to levy. I don't think Niman is the quintessential Jedi form. Rather, I'd say it is Soresu, with its emphasis on going with the flow of battle and patience being the key to victory over raw, impassioned might. In that regard, Soresu is the true antithesis of Juyo, rather than Niman.
If Niman was to have an opposite, it would most assuredly be Makashi. You once did a Samurai Champloo video, so you can look at it this way: Mugen uses Niman, while Jin uses Makashi. Makashi requires strict discipline and years of study and is a rigid form, whereas Niman is more free-flowing and adaptable. In this regard, you chose a good match up.
The reason I disagree is because the Jedi sought out balance, and no form did that better than the moderation form.
That makes sense on paper, but it's often pointed out how the jedi are very flawed and far from "balanced". Balance would be someone like Kyle Katarn, who's casually does good things rather than trying his hardest to be a hero, and he uses both the dark and the light side of the force. There's a reason why Obi-Wan is the posterboy of the jedi, It's because he's not perfect, but he's perfect in the eyes of the jedi, and he uses Soresu because, while not balanced, counteracts the more aggressive forms typically used by Sith. Niman is a better fit for Grey Jedi, or jedi who aren't blinded by the jedi's teachings. Soresu fits a jedi perfectly though. As Kriea said, "With a lightsaber blade and enough skill in deflection, it is an excellent offense against blasters, but in other situations, it merely delays the inevitable." A jedi protects first, fights second, making Soresu the perfect form for them.
@@wolfgod6443 Kyle Katarn is not balance. Neither are any grey Jedi. While its "cool" to be drawing upon both sides of the Force, you just diminish/dilute your will as well as make yourself more susceptible to falling to the dark side, while trying to fight against the lure of the dark side.
Making yourself not as capable as a Jedi with their respective power and not as capable as a Sith with theirs. Making you useless against someone who would normally be your power tier if you devoted to one side.
Only Revan has used the Force in balance without being diminished and arguably achieved oneness at will. But even Revan still reverted to darkness and held onto his body beyond death while his light essence became one with the Force.
@@lilcolgatevert3715 Yeah some of my thoughts on this changed since then. Though my thoughts on Soresu still stand. Revan didn't find balance either. Balance in SW to me (nowadays) is to follow the light, but remember the dark. The dark side is not entirely evil, and to accept it is to be in balance, but trying to use the full power of both like Revan will only create chaos. Just look at TLJ's meditation scene, light and dark was in balance on the island, but the pure dark side is an unnatural evil, as is the jedi an unnatural good (though sometimes you need an unnatural good while you never need that kind of evil).
@@wolfgod6443 Agreed, and true Revan didn't find balance until the end of his life, which is why he was nigh paranoid and ripped his essence in two when he died. But Revan did find clarity over using the power of the Force in balance without diminishing returns. He did find balance but only partially, as only part of his spirit transcended into the Unifying Force and retained its pneuma. This shows balance.
And yeah, I agree with the rest. Basically: Qui Gon. Too bad they never really expanded upon him all too much in legends however.
Even Yoda had to become Qui gon's apprentice and learn how to transcend the Unifying Force as a spirit. Only a balanced Force user can become a cosmic Force ghost. As you said:
Accepting their darkness (as Yoda had to experience) but staying solely devoted to the light. The Jedi were flawed, but it isn't because they adhere to the light side, it's because the order *failed* to adhere to the light side, and also pretends as if darkness did not exist.
In my opinion, Exar is the definitely one of the best lightsaber duelists. Maybe even the best.
That title goes to tulak hord
@@benrichards1694 But Tulak Horde is completely featless and likely lived during an age where the Sith rarely engaged Jedi if at all, ie pre-Great Hyperspace War. Plus Horde would have been utilizing a corded battery-pack lightsaber which were inherently inferior to later sabers.
@Priceluked Not true. For one, in KOTOR Kreia says he is the best duelist of their period, and in SWTOR his servant Khem Val says they fought Jedi on the worlds of Yn and Gnash (Yes thats weird because Pre-hyperspace he shouldn't have been found out, but canonically it happened, so my best guess is a small group of Jedi found Sith space and the Sith wiped them out). Also, in SWTOR, his sabers are available to buy and they are cordless.
"Twice the pride, double the fall."
You know something ... yeah, Exar should be winning this. His strength, his extremely unique and difficult fighting method, and his substantial edge in Force Connection as far as it correlates to lightsaber combat should culminate in a victory over Dooku's superior technical skill.
The Jedi never started catching up to Dooku, he simply was in decline and was still thrashing them. Anakin was the only exception to this.
Nah, Id say Mace would likley overwhelm Dooku as well.
@@brianlogan4243 debatable
No, it’s a fact that most jedi weren’t trained for 1v1 combat. Dooku was more of a product of his time.
At 9:40 you sighed pretty heavily at the mention of Dark Disciple, I was just wondering why?
ruclips.net/video/pvSjaDGP7b0/видео.html
It tells you how skilled these two were, when just looking at their Lightsaber skills takes 15 minutes.
Dooku has the force advantage_ Kun has the dueling advantage. It's pretty obvious, Kun style will will definitely throw Dooku off guard. Dooku skills with the force will do the same too Kun.
I feel the opposite. I feel Dooku has more contention blade-to-blade than he does Force-to-Force, especially against Exar, whom was regarded by Luke as being near the level of Palpatine with Sith amulets. Ancient Sith like Kun and the power boosts they got in those stories are rather ridiculous to me.
Antoine Bandele I believe it's the opposite as well. Exar Kun is canonically above post Nathema Vitiate as a Force user but Dooku has better skill accolades and feats when you consider his comparative placement as a Force user.
Same, the power of the jedi and sith is much more consistent, and honestly better. Still, never underestimate the canon characters. Dooku may seem weak compared to some Legends sith, but he has some impressive feats in the Clone Wars, like fighting 3 skilled warriors, including Asajj Ventress (who can fight jedi masters) while blind. Oh, and with the new Vader comics coming out, it seems he's arguably stronger than his Legends counter part (actually, he's already done some things that surpass Malgus, who always had the most ridiculous feats of any force wielder).
Speaking of Dooku, I found it odd how you mentioned Dooku may not be able to handle Exar Kun's barrage of random attacks, but isn't that almost exactly what Grievous does? Grievous fights unrelentingly, with speed, ferocity, and a uniquely randomized attack form. Yet Dooku can handle this with extreme ease. It's not just with Grievous either. Savage Oppress uses a similar overwhelming tactic that Dooku overcame without any trouble. I just think Dooku's skills aren't as limited as some may believe. Just because he lost to Anakin doesn't mean he can't handle a strong flurry of attacks. Besides, for all we know fighting Anakin is unlike fighting anyone else. I mean, his lightsaber skills seem a little sporadic at times, but he generally comes out on top. Maybe there's more to Dooku's loss against Anakin than it appears.
Oh, and some cool Star Wars Vs. would be Gar Saxon vs. Fen Rau, or Fen vs. Bo Katan, or Sabine, or...ok, really, I just think it'd be neat to see some of the other Mandalorian warriors and where they stack up against each other. In fact, maybe it would be better to pit a canon Mando with a Legends Mando like Pre Vizla vs. Mandalore the Ultimate, or Gar Saxon vs. Mandalore the Lesser.
Well I don'T know Kun so yah but I most said Dooku force ability was nothing to laugh about whit his fight againt Yoda you can clearlly see how talented he was whit it (Force lighting, Force throw and Force crush and force crush was use really quickly in mid fight.) I still do fell If Dooku get somewhere he could slow down Kun he could win AKA a small hall or any place whit low fighting area he could clearlly win Dooku style it more or less like Obi-wan whitout DEF is good whene the enemies can't overpower it if Dooku used a Hall to stop Kun powerfull strike and jump he could clearlly win a 1 vs 1 there.
(this fight is simply about the area I think.)
If it a small area of fighting the Fencing 1 vs 1 lane of style would probably win over any handed style and if Kun used a double lightsable style it would be even worse since he would hit almost only wall.
SORRY FOR THE BAD ENGLISH
That just my opinion.
Charlé Ouel Dooku's definitely not outclassed, he's just outmatched.
1:01 wouldn't you agree that Obi Wan kenobi was hot on his tale as a lightsaber duellist too?
yes. a fight between Kenobi and dooku both ROTS Sabers only would be long and hard. For a long time, Kenobi's near perfect defense would defend against Dooku. But then Kenobi would switch to Ataru to attack and that's when Dooku can get him. It would be an interesting fight, the 2 most energy efficient fighters of their time.
Based on Clone Wars Season 6, which was a few months before ROTS, no, I do not think Kenobi was on Dooku's heels the way Anakin was.
The two would be at a standstill in a duel, just because of their clashing styles.
I don't personally think so. I see Dooku cutting around Soresu because he's not trying to drive through it with a sledgehammer, but a needle.
Antoine Bandele but in the law it states that a form 3 master's defence can only be breached by a master of form 7. And with kenobi being THE master of form 3 at that time, that would further suggest that dooku wouldn't be able to piece his defence (in my opinion). Also in the season six fight between anakin Obi and dooku, kenobi was on the offensive with form 4 Ataru. ( a form that dooku knows inside out thanks to his master yoda and his apprentice Jin specialising in it and using it against him in "thousands" of spars). Kenobi used form 4 for all the fight which wouldn't even show the full ability of kenobi's range of skill (as he didn't employ form 3) and it still wasn't quite his prime yet. Dooku notes in the revenge of the sith novel that he couldn't piece kenobi's defence during the duel on the invisible hand. Further more, based on this I believe kenobi was at least close to hitting the levels of the likes of Dooku and Mace.
PPPPPPPLLLLLEEEEEEAAAAAASSSSSSEEEE do Darth Bane vs Darth Plagueis! I'd love it! Personally, here's how I think it would go:
Physics: Equal
Lightsaber Dueling: Bane
The Force: Plagueis
Personally, I think Bane would win. Great video, by the way.
Nice! These are seriously the best versus videos on RUclips.
Hey Kwame! I knew someone with that name in high school.
I knew a kid in kindergarten named kwame. He tried to tell me that the black crayon was grey. Pft.... dumb ass
Though personally, I think Dooku would win.
Antoine may I watch the video?
Uh, yeah ...
Master Of Disguise lol
Damn dude.....
haha what!?
wtf man
I agree with the outcome, but it should be closer. Dooku is the superior swordsman and his ability to employ Force attacks mid-duel is peerless. Moreover, people consistently underrate his ability to absorb the attacks of physically stronger opponents. Only one person conclusively defeated him in a duel that way: the Chosen One. Grievous and Oppress were very strong, immensely so, but they were no match for Dooku's blade work.
Agreed, something to remember when anakin was fighting dooku for the last time it wasn’t just raw power that defeated dooku, it was also an equal level of skill or mastery as dooku considers him the finest djem so duelist he’s ever fought.
In my opinion Exar wins easily he is one of the top 3 sith lightsaber duelists of all time.
He's incredible. Probably the best duelist of all time. I really hope we see a movie or series based on him.
I really wanna see Exar Kun in an animated series. Imagine seeing him deflecting blaster bolts as an invincible laser wall.
I agree with you where it comes to pure style-style match up between these two duelists.
Though personally, I feel it will be even closer, as I feel Dooku is simply a higher calibur duelist than Exar (to an extent), though that simply may be Kun's lack of exposure as a duelist late in his Sith Career talking.
And perhaps Kun's superior power might lend itself to closing that gap, as it often does in SW, so maybe i'm wrong.
Definitely an interesting Match up though. This is an often discussed topic.
4:19 music name?
I'd say Exar Kun.
Sweet! I been waiting for this one!
Good video, very well presented, edited and executed.
Not sure if I agree though. I doubt Kun has any sort of strength advantage against Dooku, when the latter was matching Yoda in bladelocks. Yoda as a duelist is mainly attributed to be a speedster, but many overlook his strength, capable of matching Darth Sidious evenly; the Dark Lord having warded off the combined strength of Maul and Savage Opress. So yeah, not seeing any advantage for Kun.
Another thing you didn't take into account was Dooku's ability to replenish his stamina. In the _Revenge of the Sith_ novelization, during his 1v1 with Anakin, he washes away all his fatigue with a snap of his finger.
_He pushed this aside, drawing once more upon the certain knowledge of his personal invincibility to open a channel to the Force. Power flowed into him, and the weight of his years dropped away._
Yes, this is a lightsaber duel, but since Force augmentation is allowed, I'm assuming any Force ability that is directly linked to lightsaber combat is fair game as well. Even if not, the RotS junior novel states the dark side would keep Dooku going for as long as he needed, and that Anakin couldn't outlast him. The only time Dooku's stamina was an issue is when he was drugged, but I have never seen Dooku tire in a fair fight. Ever.
_He's old, Anakin thought. Maybe I can just outlast him. But the power of the dark side flowed around him, denying that possibility. The dark side would keep Dooku going for as long as he needed._
So there goes Kun's primary advantages, and I wonder what he'll be left with. Not much, as I see it. Dooku wins this, but it's a good fight.
We have directly seen Dooku whittled down by strength with Savage on one occasion when he was disarmed, and multiples times with Anakin (and if you really want to, but I don't want to, you can include Vos). That's rather clear. Exar cut through a Force-imbued staff which takes more than just physical strength. For me, that strength advantage stands.
Dooku had heavy breathing after facing Padawan Anakin, against after facing him multiple times in TCW, and after facing Ventress and Savage. And relative to Exar, who could fight Ulic Qel-Droma indefinitely, Dooku does not have superior stamina. Is he in super great shape for his age and can he sustain himself with his Force reserves? Certainly. But comparing him to Exar, he does not match up in that way.
Antoine Bandele Yes, but in my personal opinion I dont think Dooku would be beaten so easily. While I do think Exar Kun's unorthodox fighting style and unique double bladed lightsaber could potenially overwhelmed the count. I do not think it will completely throw dooku off. For Example, form ll are trained from being enslaved to form, by developing unique offenes and defenses.
Oppress? You realize that same episode featured Oppress simultaneously driving back anakin and kenobi?
Citing Anakin does nothing for Kun. Anakin is a yoda/side level fighter who is physically superior to both.
Quinlan Vos overwhelmed an injured Dooku, but let's not act like reverse scaling is a thing. If Vos is skilled enough that a stylistic edge can bridge the gap between him and an injured dooku, that's fantastic for Vos, it means nothing for Kun who's done nothing to suggest he can compete with dooku as a swordsman.
Either Anakin or Obi is more than capable of putting Opress down one-on-one. Him driving back both of them simultaneously (especially after tanking several blasts of Dooku's lightning) is a PIS in it's finest.
Lol at Anakin being Yoda/Sidious level. Put him against either of them and watch him being torn apart.
Yoda is stronger than Sidious. He wasn't matching him evenly. And Yoda was very clearly holding the full extent of his augmentation back, or he would have slaughtered Dooku
I'm loving it Antoine! Keep it up man!
Yoda vs Mace Windu vs Palpatine vs Dooku
Who will be the best ?
cheuk hang Yu mace and dooku will be out of the equation with Yoda and Sidious. It really goes either way with Yoda and Sidious, maybe Yoda for being a better duelist or Sidious with his force advantage
Mace's vaapad isn't give him advantage to fight Yoda or Sidious ?
cheuk hang Yu Vaapad is not a Sith trump card, Mace only got his only Vaapad Amp Against Sidious. Vaapad would work on Sidious but not on a calm Sith like Dooku especially with Dookus Makashi.
I see ...
cheuk hang Yu the fight will go like this Yoda==Sidious>Dooku>=Windu
Great Versus Antoine!!!!
Thanks xRadinox
Exar Kun vs Darth Plagueis
The tactical Shark yes!
No.
Not interested in Darth Plagueis under VS parameters.
Ki Adi Sandwich let me guess, you think Plagueis stomps?
The tactical Shark indeed I do.
Well, I usually like longer videos because theres often more content to enjoy. But I can appreciate your conciseness here. The one thing I would say in the last fight is that when Dooku dueled Anakin he did hold him back with a strike to the legs, something of a similar nature could perhaps occur with kun, giving Dooku back his control. Not to mention such a tactic allowed Dooku a breather to freshen his reserves.
That being said, Im no exar kun expert
How about Ulic qel droma vs Anakin( pre vador) they are very similar
Monarch57 That'd be quick since Anakin learned Djem So from a holocron of Ulic Qel Droma. He'd be better off going against Kun
Monarch57 It's an ok fight but I'd give it to Anakin for a solid majority.
Na. Ulic in his prime was in my opinion in his tier in saber skill. I think anakin wins due to superior force abilities
It's highly unlikely Anakin would start throwing force pushes though. I feel like Anakin would start counteracting or it'd be a 50/50 Djem So battle.
It's very interesting as a blade only battle because of the knowledge advantage Anakin has over him but Ulic could probably improvise since he was the equal of Exar Kun when he never fought against a double bladed saber before.
I take that back +Monarch57 , that's a good choice.
You made a good point. Because these two saber fighting would be like a mirror match. Their personalities in combat and their level of skill are very similar it would be very interesting. Anakins use of the force would only really be used to knock away or throw off I'd love to see this. Ulic trained massively in Djem so and was only rivaled by exar kun in his time and he had the thirst to fight and liked over powering his enemies. Anakin is the same. Even though he didnt train as much as others his preferences in combat would compliment Ulic greatly. I'd give the win to Anakin but visually I'd imagine this would be one of the best saber fights EVER. Anakin is above Obi Wan in saber skills but was on equal footing with him because Obi was fighting style was like water to Anakins fire.
Kun isn’t bringing what anakin did to the table, he can’t become an avatar of the force like him nor does he know Dooku as well as Yoda or mace. I don’t recall Kun fighting anyone like or on par with Dooku he isn’t close enough to Form V to have the same advantage as Anakin did.also the count can match grevious I doubt kun can overwhelm him by number of strikes or randomness. He isn’t bringing enough of anything to defeat Dooku also Yoda had an army coming to back him up along with Dooku having the plans to the Death Star which can not fall into enemy hands. Even in their second fight Dooku had he stuck around would face not only a mass of clones but Anakin and obiwan along with Yoda while he would have killed more then one of the Jedi and a mass of clones it would still be foolish to stick around because he along with any fighter would be overwhelmed.
I'd be curious as to how Exar Kun would fare against either Darth Bane or Darth Sidious...
All2Meme to me Sidious > Kun and Kun = Bane.
Bane vs Kun would be a great vs video I think
All2Meme Sidious >> Kun >> Bane.
All2Meme I'm actually putting some notes together to see how post-orbalisk Bane and Kun stack up. I have not finished the force analysis yet, but Kun takes the lightsaber advantage while Bane gets the physical edge.
HarbingerOfBattle that's interesting because I would put that the other way around. I give Kun the physical edge but I would give Bane the duelling edge (though both categories are incredibly close). For force abilities I really cannot decide. I think Kun is overalls the more powerful force wielder (if only by a tiny bit), but Bane is more combatively viable. It's a great matchup, I really don't know!
Macattack 1 Frankly, Kun is a fragile lightweight. He can't take much damage where as Bane has been beaten, battered, electrocuted, poisoned and just about everything else. We have also seen several examples of his physical strength and stamina throughout his fights and quests. Kun may have the speed and agility advantage, but Bane's sheer strength, endurance and toughness takes it.
As for lightsabers, Bane may be a master of Forms 5 and 3 with a little Juyo, but He never developed his own true fighting style. He knows the moves but is not bringing anything to the table Kun hasn't seen. On the flip side, Kun is using form 6 like nobody has ever seen before. Pair that with his unique lightsaber and Bane would be left scrambling. Bane doesn't deal well with the unexpected. When dropped into a situation cold he either tries to blast through it or become a tough stone. And with Kun's blade all over the place, it's only a matter of time before the inevitable happens.
Interesting, I also thought Exar Kun's Niman approach resembles Juyo or how (I at least think) it should be tactically approached (rather than how many commonly approach it); you won't be breaking that Soresu master's defense with sheer amount of physicality or skill, but putting him/her in a situation where he/she can't identify what from your (personalized) skillset is coming.
Yeah. I don't like getting too tied down by what texts say when the characters style sometimes says otherwise (like Qui-Gon and Ataru).
can you use arcann in versus series
He's coming in autumn.
Antoine Bandele or darth tenebrous
@@AntoineBandele can you make Darth vitiate vs Darth sidious
Good work Antoine!!! I was waiting awhile to see Exar :) . 100% Agree with the outcome but man I do not see the winner getting out without some damage hahah
No contest Exar Kun would mop the floor with Dooku.
Those are my thoughts. He had trouble with anie Skywalker. He has had some battles for days against high level force users. Also the incorporation of Sith magic that kun had. I mean he was the true Lord of his time as well. Dooku not so much lol
Think what adds to Kun's victory his his use of physical integration and strength based offense. He is capable of putting enough power in his blows to keep dooku on the back end
Yeah the we go EXAR!!!
I can’t figure out Kun’s lightsaber hilt length, is it long enough for two hands or just one
@Wes Bradley-Taubner it’s weird tho, I’ve seen both but I stand by the one handed sized Saberstaff, also with both side activated the movements look and act more like Makashi
Sorta a strange request but a vs with Samurai Jack would be cool. I think he has a lot of potential because he can potentially kill any opponent with his magical sword (or parry lightsabers) and skill, but because he is just a ordinary human he is still very fallible. Maybe Jack vs General Grievous, Jack vs Serpico (another really versatile fighter) or even Jack vs Guts.
Samurai Jack vs Afro Samurai is coming, and if the budget permits I'd like to do a motion comic verdict for it.
Antoine Bandele Samurai Jack via relativistic reaction speed, surviving 700 ton fall on him durability level and much more.
Antoine Bandele That would be awesome. My money's on Jack.
even jensaai1 said exarkun is not as good as thinks he is.
Exar Kun would not defeat Dooku. He has nothing Dooku hasn't seen, heard of or thought of. There is a reason why Dooku is regarded in both legends and Canon as one if the greatest duelists not just of his generation but in the history of both the Jedi and Sith orders. To say that Dooku only won against unprepared Knights is a sham. He bested noted saber masters like Sora Bulq, he bested Windu twice, Anakin multiple times, Kenobi multiple times, fought evenly with Yoda, just to name a few. Yes his age was advanced but it has never been shown as a factor. Even in Revenge of the Sith, Dooku could match Anakin's strength for a time. I say the score would be more like 6-4 in Dookus favor
who do you think was a better Niman practitioner. Revan or Kun
I don't think there's one good answer for that. Kun relies on unpredictability to create his own openings, while Revan is more content to follow the flow of battle, waiting for an opening to appear and using the most appropriate form to exploit it.
As for who would win in a duel, I would say Revan.
- greater versitility. Revan can fall back on any other form if Niman proves insufficient.
- unlike Jedi in Kun's time, Revan has an experience fighting saberstaff wielding opponents.
- as Antoine described, all those fancy settings of Kun's lightsaber are good... on paper. Without at least one documented case of him using those tricks in active combat, we cannot say how frequently or effectively Kun can use them. And even if we take those statements for granted, Revan's own mastery of Trakata and second lightsaber should be more than able to compensate.
- better feats. All noteworthy dueling feats for Kun are stalemating Ulic and beating Baas thanks to element of surprise. The first one is inconclusive, the second one is circumstancial. Meanwhile, Revan defeated Malak after cutting his way through army of Star Forge battle droids, Sith troopers and Sith warriors and Bastila Shan. Keep in mind that the Star Forge was a powerful Dark Side Nexus which was amplifying the Sith while Revan was wickened. Meanwhile Malak was rested and had Star forge amp. And that was pre-prime amnesiac KotOR Revan.
😮😮😮😮😮 best duel idea EVER!!
Maybe I'm missing something here. But, what dueling feats does Exar Kun possess that puts him in the same league as count dooku? Dooku was able to duel with the likes of Yoda, Windu, Obi Wan and Anakin, etc.... I get that Kun is the greatest duelist of HIS era. But, Clone Wars era Jedi have actual feats. Something Exar only has against fodder. Exar Kun killing Vodo Siosk Bass doesn't mean much to the guy who can match Yoda. Now maybe I am missing something. But, from what I have read Exar Kun is most likely not out fencing Dooku.
Now feel free to correct me if I am wrong.
Some have said kun has logistics on his side where dooku has feats on his, though looking back even the logistics should put kun in an uphill fight as his weapon is built for using trakata tactics, something that has been considered weak against makashi. As for feats I really do wonder that myself as well as the only known feats we’ve seen him have were against Sylvars mate, vodo siosk baas, and ulic qeldroma, who the latter two are considered as great duelists of their time haven’t exactly shown anything the clone wars era Jedi masters have, though ulic may be a prototype anakin with his skills.
I don't think this video gives Dooku enough credit for his skills. Of course Yoda overpowered him, but Yoda is possibly the greatest duelist of all times, so it's already quite impressive that he kept up with him for about a minute. In his fight with Ani however, he could have probably won if he had gone for a kill from the start where he still had higher power reserves. Only because of his age based physical weakness and Palpi's order not to attack Ani at the start did Ani overpower him. Exar however, when faced with a Dooku in his prime and with permission to kill him, could probably not sustain the early fight in 8/10 cases as depicted here, but most likely find his demise in the early or mid fight before he could dominate the late fight
The major differences between Exar Kun and General Grievous are that Exar had been trained for a lot longer, had succeeded in defeating the greatest combat instructor in the Jedi Order, and was technically a _genius_ in dueling. So you could say he's more than a match for the likes of Tyranus.
If Tyranus has a hope against Exar, he'd need to rely on his knowledge of the dark side.
I personally favor Exar and his brand of erratic and overwhelming onslaught over Grievous'.
There's something you may have overlooked in _Jedi Academy Training Manuel_:
_As the Jedi Watchman of Dantooine, Master Baas spends much of his time on the planet and trains multiple apprentices at a time. His strongest apprentice, however, is a young pupil named Exar Kun. Kun's skill with a lightsaber is so great that he claimed victory over his master many times when they sparred together._
Many times? Man, what an accomplishment! I'm sure Tyranus must've been so jealous. ;)
I can't believe noone else has realized that count Dooku is basically the Colonel Sanders/Robert E Lee of star wars. From his costume that looks like a confederate generals uniform, to his using a curved handled saber, and the fact that he led the confederacy of independant systems (cis). He is the CSA (Confederated states of america) leader of star wars.
Historically, the Samurai Miyamoto Musashi would side with Exar Kun as he references that the sword fighter should "Lead the dance while engaged with an opponent and do not let your opponent dictate your movement"
+Antoine Bandele Darth Krayt vs. Exar Kun, Revan vs. Darth Caedus/Jacen Solo, and An'ya Kuro vs. Jolee Bindo
JediAcolyte22 The most evenly matched suggestions I've seen in a while.
This is another one I've been waiting a long time to see... IMHO Exar takes majority in this sabers-only fight, but by an even more narrow margin than 7/10. I think his natural arrogance is a weakness that Dooku could goad him into exposing, given his skill with Dun Moch. But on the other hand... if Vodo, Kun's own master, couldn't pull that off it's a long shot that Dooku would do the same. The possibility is there though.
More importantly, I think you (slightly) underrate Grievous' strength. The General's a cyborg and while he's a whirling dervish and not a strength-based duelist like Vader or Malgus, there's some decent visual evidence of Jedi straining under the strength of his blows at such a high tempo. If Dooku could find ways to subvert and withstand that I don't think an athletic, youthful but relatively squishy human like Kun is going to overwhelm Dooku until the late fight, where the Count's energy would be flagging.
Otherwise, solidly argued and presented as usual Antoine. :) I'm glad you're still putting out new Star Wars content, I only wish the other members of the Forcecast updated as often.
I really want to hear the story about the 2 year mission with qui gon and Tyranus. Where when qui gon returned he was knighted right away without any tests
What song do you use at 4:19 when you start talking about Exar Kun? I heard it in one of your Revan videos as well!
Description box.
I listened to the tracks listed, couldn't hear it :/
Maybe I just missed it but I’m pretty sure you forgot to mention that Exar Kunn’s lightsaber could only be used by one hand when it was in its dual blade variant
Antoine, what do you use to edit your Star Wars versus series? I'm making my own and use PowerPoint, but that is know where near as professional as the software you use in your videos.
I use Adobe Premiere Pro CC and Apple Final Cut Pro X.
yay and Exar kun video! thanks!
Why you think Trakata is suited for Niman users? I actually think it is best suited for Makashi users, as what Trakata aims for is also what form two is all about, working around an opponent's defense with your lightsaber, am I wrong?
9:39: Perhaps with a grain of salt?
Yeah, Dooku's endurance is pretty underrated. Had fought Yoda fresh he would've done a little bit better. It wouldn't have made the difference in the outcome, but I feel he could hold on a little longer had Anakin and Obi-Wan not worn him down.
We see the results of a fresh Dooku in _Yoda: Dark Rendezvous_ where Dooku did not do much better:
"Then their blades clashed together in a lace of fire, green and red: but the green burned hotter. Slowly, slowly, Dooku gave way: and in the dark, drunken Vjun air, Yoda was terrible to behold."
+Antoine Bandele If I recall correctly before their fight Dooku and Yoda had a confrontation.
I'm not sure if it was as "emotional" as I'm remembering so I'm unsure if it'd hinder him. The reason is probably because I remember it being similar to the prelude to the Mustafar duel.
You should have a tactician Versus battle with Thrawn vs Revan. Battle strategy being examined instead of 1 on 1 fighting.
Thrawn is coming, but not against Revan.
Exar Kun looks so ripped in the Thumbnail. 💪🏽
9:38 What's wrong with Dark Disciple? (I didn't read it, I actually don't know what's wrong with it)
Dooku gets defeated by someone who should not be able to beat him.
Ufucking quinlan vos defeats Dooku and Tholme didd
Antoine, great video as always. I have one question. Why haven't you done a versus with tulak hord. I legitimately don't know much about him, is he too OP in a 1 on 1 duel or is there not enough information on him to make a versus episode?
I'm not much of a fan of Tulak.
Antoine Bandele ah, I see. great video as always
wow, there's quite a few audio glitches at the end of the video.
Yeah I couldn't salvage all of it. It was much worse before, pops and scratches were happening throughout the entire verdict but I could not suppress those at the end.
It's a good video with a lot of good points.
Also side note, going to speak in favor of being able to shorten or lengthen the blade of a lightsaber as that might be a standard feature now in the new continuity. Though there's at least good reason for this, as it would make sense as sometimes you might want a shorter blade.
I'm not really interested in the fact that lightsabers _can_ be shortened (which was shown in canon with Rebels) but no one has yet to actually apply it in active combat (which is the most important thing to me for these analysis's).
Ah, please forgive me as I misunderstood the comment on it.
Also thanks for responding to my comment, I really love your vids!
at 0:50, did you mention "the big 3"?
When Dooku was a Jedi, yes, he was among the top three along with Yoda and Mace.
if you were a jedi or sith student, which form of light saber combat would you choose?
ruclips.net/video/bPjII8tyZJ4/видео.html
I think this would be closer than 7/3, but good video. Out of curiosity, what's you opinion on RotS Anakin (AKA Zonakin)? I personally don't buy the "nuclear furnace" hyperbole, but some people on the forums claim that he's above Yoda.
I believe Antoine holds Anakin above Dooku but below Yoda.
Most definitely below Yoda.
Do Anakin Skywalker vs Exar Kun "the cocky pricks"
Exar Kuns style is to give the the impression of a single minded attacker ala anakin however it's a calculated deception every strike thought out every move forcing the opponent to react a certain way. Irish stick fighting follows the same mentality forcing an opponent to react to you. The ultimate question would be if dooku could last long enough to see the method behind the madness or just die. With dookus habit of toying with his opponent at the onset of a duel to gauge their skill I believe he would be at a massive disadvantage.
Here's the short version of the video:
Dooku's advantages and disadvantages:
The most skilled duelist in terms of pure swordsmanship focused around blade-to-blade combat but only possessing great skill or basic knowledge of the other forms.
An experienced strategist and tactician, defeating opponents through decisive plans. But can be easily defeated if pressured enough
Due to his age, he is pretty weak, but he's still stronger than the average human because of his Force Augmentation
Kun's advantages and disadvantages:
A pure tactician, born of arrogance; he prefers to meet his opponent head on and crush them with an overhead strike or overwhelm them with a hundred small cuts but because of this, he never plans out his fights no matter what and is unpredictable and wild, though not savage or animal-like
A great all-around swordsman, having a mastery of Niman, though he is particularly aggressive and lacks understanding of adaptability and versatility which Niman preaches
He is a lightweight who can't take a lot of damage, and uses his Force abilities to become far stronger. If his force reserves are drained, one good punch or kick can put him down easily.
Winner: Exar Kun
Count Dooku is overwhelmed and pressured by Kun's aggressive use of Niman, eventually draining the Count of his stamina and being pushed back until he makes a mistake, with Kun delivering the killing blow. It should be noted, that Dooku has an early advantage though he needs to fight aggressively enough for this to happen, which he rarely is.
Here are some of my suggestions for future battles.
1: Master Fay vs Aleema Keto.
2: Darth Maul vs Ulic Qel Droma.
3: Anakin vs Darth Bane.
4: Sora Bulq vs Asajj Ventress.
5: Exar Kun vs Revan (right before his split).
6: Darth Plaguies vs Mother Talzin.
7: Darth Maul (without his lightsaber) vs Amon.
8: Dooku vs Darth Malak.
9: Darth Marr vs Lucien Draay.
10: Plo Koon vs Rahm Kota.
11: Shaak Ti vs Darth Maul.
12: Kanan Jarrus vs padawan Obi-Wan.
9 is something I plan to do.
Antoine Bandele Really? That's great to hear, I have wanted to see Darth Marr in something for so long. Also if you don't mind and have the time could you tell me who you think would win in the other battles? Only as long as it is okey with you
So if a fight has a 50/25/25 (or something along those lines) shot of ending in the early, middle, and late fight, how would you keep that a surprise for the audience these videos?
Multiple series match-ups
Walking Dead (Comics/Tv series/Video games):
Michonne vs Paul 'Jesus' Monroe
Daryl Dixon vs Negan
Carl Grimes vs Clementine
Kenny vs David Garcia
Scott Pilgrim:
Matthew Patel vs Lucas Lee
Roxie Richter vs Envy Adams
Ramona Flowers vs Knives Chau
Star Wars:
Darth Vader vs Darth Revan
Darth Malek vs Darth Malgus
Avatar:
Lin Beifong vs Suyin Beifong
Master Piandao vs Ty Lee
Zhao vs General Iroh II
Harry Potter
Harry Potter vs Newt Scamander
Sirius Black vs Remus Lupin
Nympedora Tonks vs Propentina Goldstein
Crossover:
Samurai Jack vs Himura Kenshin
Rubeus Hagrid vs Hodor
do you think u can do a video explaining all of the lightsaber forms in context like u did in this video?
Already done!
ruclips.net/video/rIzMjFkZVA8/видео.html
Hey there are you new? Check out my playlists!
ruclips.net/p/PLDFq63aBi3_x9Yv0zGF_S-XhRug0g6qKW
ruclips.net/p/PLDFq63aBi3_yGAJNwozcKYs0OfmgMiqu-
Dookus showings of defensive force powers and offensive ones are both high even as a Jedi his force shield already at nine was high enough that he was the only person Yoda put some effort into beating in force games and his telekinesis even at a young age was enough where he effortlessly lifted a many hundred pound plant while most people his age were only able to telekenetically levitate leaves
Anyone have an idea for who the 7th Sister and 5th Brother from Rebels could fight in a duo match? Those two have enough screen time to show how well they work together and their personal strength, but I can't think of a duo that wouldn't ground them into dust. The closest I can think of is Gorc and Pic from Dark Forces 2, but there's really not enough info on them for a fight.
Kun surpassed him in all rounds, except dueling abilities. Dooku gets the edge in a lightsaber duel.
Wasn’t exar Kun one of the most powerful lightsaber dueliests
Put a tournament of Two masters of a form in different eras(Kasim and Kao Cen) to see which one is ultimately the best one of each era. Then have the top,masters of each form fight to see which is the ULTIMATE duelist.
I was thinking of doing this. But I'd like to do it as a collaboration between channels.
Yeah! have the whole Council collaborate on this. Have each "Councillor" choose a lightsaber form ( 1-2 may have 2 forms) and do a tournament. i can help if you want.
Even with the video watched , do you believe that Exar Kun could have won including force abilities, considering that lightsaber forms and physicality can be viewed close together? Also super excited for Thrawn vs Khan, just wondering when that video will come out?
Verdict would have been the same with Force abilities applied.
Antoine Bandele so you don't think that adding in force abilities could have tipped either side an advantage ,and do you think that in the battle that force abilities would even be used, or just a pure battle of blades.
I'm surprised by the verdict, and even more so by the margin of that verdict...but it does make sense. I thought for sure Dooku had this since the power setting stuff on Kun's lightsaber was negated (for good reason)
Power setting stuff always felt like an appendage to me, one that was never really solidified through active combat application.
While I do find it likely that Exar Kun would certainly win, I feel as though Dooku losing 0-4 in the late fight is strange, despite his advanced age. But this is just focusing on a lightsaber duel, so I can see the reasoning behind it. It still takes a lot to exhaust Dooku, and even at the end of his final duel with Anakin and Obi-wan, despite losing his hand (or hand*s* via film) he showed no signs of fatigue. I believe the fight would be SLIGHTLY closer, but that's just what I believe. I don't know Exar Kun all that well.
I posted on your discussion that I believe that you should do a fight with Shaak Ti. I have not seen you use her in any versus match-ups and I believe that you would enjoy using her in this series. I'm not entirely sure who would be a fantastic match-up for her, but I have the urge to recommend Darth Malak, Satele Shan, or maybe even Darth Maul during TPM--though I personally believe that she takes that fight quite handily.
Christopher Lee did not perform the fatigue like he did in _Attack of the Clones_ but Dooku's fatigue does show up in the Clone Wars series and in the prose of the _Revenge of the Sith_ novelization.
I've never been interested in Shaak Ti. But I do not believe she takes TPM Handily.
I see. That's my mistake in regards to the Dooku topic. It has been a while since I've even seen the novel for ROTS. It just seemed as though he was overwhelmed before he showed any signs of exhaustion, and in most of his duels, he has maintained his stamina for a long period, only ever being pushed to the edge by Anakin, Obi-Wan, or similarly skilled opponents--though I believe that we can both agree that Exar Kun is at such a skill level. You're right.
I'm surprised that you are not interested in Shaak Ti, especially due to her seeming like a really fun character to use in this type of analysis due to her unique abilities and light-saber form. I wouldn't hold it against you if you don't want to use her in a fight, but I do ask that you think about her being in a match-up in the future. I may underestimate Darth Maul during TPM to some degree, but I do see Shaak Ti taking a majority over him regardless, even if it is hard-fought.
Antoine Bandele Yes but the time dooku had problems with fatigue during the clone wars series, is when he was fending off an attack from ventress and the nightsisters. And that was after being injected with a nightsister poison.
Dooku is still a bad ass, imagine all the jedi or sith was his age, its crazy how he still competes out of his prime.
hey antoine if you were a jedi or sith what lightsaber forms would you use and what would your fighting style be like
ruclips.net/video/bPjII8tyZJ4/видео.html
Antoine, have you considered using some of the fighters from the Fate/Series? They can be pretty interesting; an example being Sasaki Kojiro or EMIYA. The first one being a swordsman who wields a odachi and is basically a mixed version of Yoda and Dooku in terms of skill, and EMIYA, a weak yet incredibly smart strategist and tactician, being able to beat those WAY stronger than him through calculated decision making in the middle of a high-speed fight.
Anakin Skywalker vs Ulic Qel-Droma. Ahsoka Tano(Rebels) vs Jaden Korr. Arcann vs Starkiller. Commander Shepard vs Ryder. Darth Plagueis vs Darth Malgus. Emperor Valkorian vs Emperor Palpatine. Legends General Grevious vs Exar Kun. SoR Revan vs Darth Sidious. Figured I'd just throw an ass load of ideas at you. Thanks Antoine!
Oh my lord finally!!!!!!!
Why is everyone saying dooku was weaker than exar kun in the force. He was able to contest with yoda and knock out anakin with force lightning. He was by yoda to be his greatest student and he was an instructor in telekinesis and dun moch. His force lightning was second only to darth sidious in his Era and you forget exar kun used sith artifacts to pull of his force feats, dooku just used his training and personal strength.
Combining these 2 into one warrior is the Sith I would be. Forms 1,2, and 6 for Saber combat. Dun Moch and Sokan for strategy. Force lightning and tutaminis for force focus.
I do think you are on the early and late fight but in the middle I do think Doku would know what to expect and have enough stamina to even up the scores 2-2