Some of the comments: "I learnt about geography and history because of Empire: Total-War." "Don't forget the Paradox games. They taught more about History than any teacher." "kerbal space program where just about everything being about very accurate rocket science" And many people will tell you that they learned English through playing games/watching movies and also how guns work some thoughts: nobody wants to play boring games and traditional educational games are boring because they are "fully" educational you can't make a game exclusively about learning you can't even make it the main focus of the game with that said, there has to be context for the information you're trying to educate people on, you can't just pick random random characters from a MOBA and call them "pancreas" and call one of their abilities "digest proteins". That completely destroys suspension of disbelief (not to mention that its "teaching to the test") learning can come from lore (a good strategy) but the best way to learn is by necessity don't make a game about learning how cells work make a game where you're a virus and your job is to blow up cells by invading their interior and destroying their core organs names don't matter, don't feel forced to teach them at the first chance. For example, in that virus game, you would have blown up dozens of cells before you knew what a mitochondria was, even though they were one of your primary targets do not add any amount of educational material that would make the game less fun. the game must be as fun as possible first, and then educational. Of course that there will be a lot less material, but it WILL be remembered by the player. As you said, don't try to replace a complete education, just try to make the player learn something from playing your game
Miau Frito Yeah I get what you mean. Also, some subjects are a lot easier to turn to games than others :/ Like how's anyone going to incorporate calculus elements into a fun game without making it clunky? Seems pretty hard :/
I learned basic german by switching language to german. I used gothic 3 because it forces you to actually read the queast logs to move on in the game. Weck mit dem Waffe!
@Karl Palmgren I actually used Gothic 2 to learn English, and then I heard the dialogs are more fun in German, so I switched to German but it was way too complicated to learn anything, even though I studied German for 3 years at school :S I feel I'm missing out on all the great mods made by the community...
I am Swedish and can sort of make out what's written, allthough i had a Dictionary with me while playing. No background in german other than the app duolingo.
I really want to see a game that throws you into a world where people only speak the language you want to learn (obviously with hints and such in your own language). You can learn the language and play the game :D
***** Yeah, I've played Euro Trucker 2 in all Swedish with Google Translate on my phone next to me :D The trouble is with language support. Sometimes you get full audio, sometimes just subtitles, but often you don't get anything.
I feel that MMOs would be pretty great at this. Part of the reason I learned how to type and write was from playing an MMO. Hop over to a European server with French/German/some such, and play from there. I remember being so frustrated when I didn't know how to type fast or spell words correctly when trying to talk with others, though you had to in order to go to dungeons and accomplish things within the game. Some serious motivation there. I will say that MMOs have lost a lot of their edge in this regard because most of them have become what amounts to a single player game. Would have worked wonders in the past though where you needed to be able to communicate to play.
Age of Empires III kinda does this since each empire speaks their own language when you control their characters :D I think the hardest ones to turn into a game would be the Sciences and Maths. Languages, History and Geography seems to be the easiest to incorporate into games :D Age of Empires does this pretty well in my opinion :D
Europa 4, Crusader kings 2, Victoria 2 and Hearts of Iron, Red orchestra 2 are some of the reasons why I am currently really advanced in history right now. Great example of games that teach you while providing some really good game play
Idea needs some work, but its a good idea. I think rather than replace the medium of knowledge like titling and stuff, why not try to get kids to use real world concepts to solve a problem in the game? Think of counter strike, the bare bones of counter strike is that its a battle of psychology. The one who can read the opponents movements better will end up killing their opponent and thus winning. Since kids will naturally want to get better at these games, giving them mini lessons in say... psychology will give them an edge in a game like counter strike. In the end with this model, we are Effectively teaching kids psychology because they want to learn it not because they have to. probably best of all, they can apply it meaning they can still play their games. Just a small suggestion... :P
Good in theory but it seems to contradict itself. Such a patch shoehorns information in and deducts from the game as a whole. It introduces complexity and gives nothing in return (for in-game purposes), and creates a separate vocabulary that if learned independently from its originally designed form , leaves people unable to communicate with others in the game. Imagine asking a teammate, "Yo NiNjA_h8er6969, help me kill the mitochondria so I can receive enough red blood cells to buy a synthesis boost." I don't play dota and cant tell you the in-game equivalent but I think your team will think you are nuts. I would love to see an example that sounds more reasonable or how you could teach physics or math in a comprehensive way without specifically designed games.
I like the idea. But I think for existing DOTA-players relearning the names of all items&abillities would be to much work, and no fun. Not to mention relearning it again months later for another course. I think the main issues are : 1) In school you just simply learn way to much. 'fun' comes from using your knowledge, preferably creatively, to achieve valuable or impressive tasks. 2) School games have a ridiculously low budget compared to 'real' once, (which you try to address with the zip, but I honestly think you need to create a game from scratch, otherwise you will actually become worse at the game your playing, and lose to your competition) However the subliminal learning point is really valid. I still remember most cool-downs&items&spells&price and their interactions and I quit playing 4 years ago.....
It won't have to be a patch for the international audience. It can just be a mod for the games used for edutainment. This means that for the majority of the users of the game, the game is just as it has always been, and for those using the game for education, they just have to get the students to apply the mod.
If growing real-world skills/knowledge would be marketable as a feature game producers would have started doing that a long time ago. So far however we seem to have this silent understanding that "serious/relevant can't be fun". I believe the opposite is the case: If a fun activity has some added real world benefit it must feel all the more rewarding. This seems to be related to our relationship to real work (which we feel we should be compensated for, because we wouldn't do it otherwise, because it's not fun, because it's work, ...).
Spoken by CGP Gray in an hello Internet episode… You are not in school to learn things. School is a place to occupy your time, and to show that you can be a human being in society by completing tasks and being responsible. No one expects, or thinks it's necessary to remember the things you learn in school. It is a fantastic source for daycare for parents of young children, and if you do well in high school, you get a certificate that says that you're a good human. That is what school is for. Granted it does increase intuition, writing skills, speaking skills, but if school was supposed to be teaching you things to remember for the rest of your life, they would teach you things that mattered. Not high-level math, not high-level science, but how to do your taxes, how to get loans ect.
This is such an interesting concept. My A' level Computer Science coursework this year pretty much focuses on exactly this (it's a quiz style revision tool embedded into a World of Warcraft like simulation.) It was pretty hard to do and it's not flashy at all because all I'm working with is basic Python knowledge, but from my testing it works both to help kids learn information and to encourage them into more video games.
Fun thing about this. There is a game called Fate (I think something like that at least) that is a card game where all the characters are historical figures or fictional characters, and their backstories in the game is litterally just their life story in the real world. I have a friend who aced history class solely because of this game.
The part where you talk about Dota 2 and a science textbook makes so much sense. It has even inspired some ideas of my own. I am just getting into game development, but I will certainly consider your points while making my games! Great vid!
I love when people conceive and share ideas like these. Obviously, to put these ideas into effect is not so easy, but I appreciate a lot the creative act. Thank you :)
I just finished watching all of your videos. Your content is superb. It's on the level of Vsauce, MinutePhysics, CGP Grey, an much more. Keep up the good work. At this rate, you'll be one of the best internet educators within no time. Cheers
dont forget we also need to make it subtle like adding spaces in the prenounciation otherwise it becomes too obvious and it wont have the backup that history does in games
Maybe one day we will be able to connect our brain to a computer and just move the knowledge there, but we're going to need hundreds of thousands of years.
There have already a TON of mnemonics that work based on the same idea: adding uninteresting things to interesting things and hope that to work. Problems: too much time needed, not enough creative power.
The problem is modern games use instant gratification to keep players engage while studying is the complete opposite if that instant gratification can make people interested in learning but its only short term the knowledge gain will be quicky forgotten as a result
This is why if someone managed to make a video game whose physics are almost identical to real life (at least classically speaking), I think it could be revolutionary in making people more aware of the basic laws of nature. I think most people have a hard time grasping a subject until it's broken down and visualized. I feel like that's why analogies even exist.. I'm just saying... how amazing would it be to toss on an oculus rift and literally experience the extremities and intricacies of the nature of our universe firsthand... or even just a world identical to ours but where your resources for experimentation are unlimited. Just a thought
Stupid Electromagnetism players. So cheap, EM is a totally OP hero. Just spam Solenoid all the time. Try playing as World War II, that actually takes some skill.
1. what was that cellular structure game? 2. Dragon Box Algebra is, by far, the best example of this I've come across. My daughter was 4 when she completed the game and near the end there is virtually no operational characteristic that separates the game from genuine algebra.
There are plenty of games that are incredibly fun and incredibly educational. I feel as if the way to incorporate both aspects is to generate interest in the material by showing off how it can be used to succeed in the context of the game, as well as present it in an accessible way. A good example might be redstone in Minecraft. It allows you to manipulate the world in ways that can be beneficial and cool, but doesn't have to be complicated and is easy to use. Maybe another example might be literally any RTS game with a historical theme that also applies to the different controllable factions and how they play. Generally they have lore info documented in spaces adjoining explanations of game mechanics or tutorials. I imagine it's incredibly feasible to introduce complicated concepts behind cellular biology or human anatomy or genetics or even histology behind a strategy game that utilizes math or probabilistic models based on the way things actually function without forcing the player to interface with them and calculate them manually. If you can present the topic in an engaging and immersive way that is fun and challenging, you can create a game that is also educational. Also, a major flaw of edutainment games that people don't generally talk about is the fact that they are often cheaply made, short, and have very unprofessionally done art and music. It's almost as if the creators of these games are trying to be corny and tacky. It doesn't have to be that way at all either. Look at games like Shenzen IO, which is a game about efficient programming, or even Rocket League or Planetside 2. RL and PS2 both might not seem obviously educational, but those games really boil down to being able to coordinate with or lead other people efficiently to overcome the coordination or leadership of another team. You can have top tier players on your side but if you can't utilize their strengths and make smart decisions and lay down clear plans through clear communication you will lose easily against almost completely naive but better organized players. Of course, I haven't listed all of the games that have any educational value, but there are dozens more examples of well loved games that can augment one's knowledge of history, engineering, logic, math, art, and other topics.
Well there are already high crossing edutainment: Historical strategy games, like Age of Empires, Civilization, Total War, etc. Only for one part of education but well it's something
True, Some games do have knowledge and require you to apply what you learn, but so few people actually figure it out for themselves. Instead people relay on guilds. Like Minecraft has redstone, which is essentially logic gates. but instead of learning redstone, people just look up "how to" on youtube. Ark Survival has a pretty good breeding system that shows inheritance and mutations. But almost no one takes the time to learn it.
The thing about copying down redstone, like with a technical tutorial about anything else, is that patterns and connections between certain things are picked up just by going through the motions. When I was 13, I was one of those kids, but the stuff I picked up from copying down designs from other people allowed me to create my own designs. The end result of all of this, 5 or 6 years later, is that due to my experience trouble shooting or connecting the dots in what I was doing resulted in an already developed understanding of modular math and Boolean logic when I began to learn how to program and engage myself in higher level math.
There actually a story behind each character in Dota 2. It's important and interesting to players. Also, there are people making money on Dota 2 winning competitions it's not just a game it's a sport. And sport can be crucial for kid development.
I'm not so sure about this, but I did learn to read Russian playing Metal Gear Solid 3. Every time you change areas the load screen shows the name of the area in English and Russian. Then you just compare. Subtlety is always best I think
you'd have to make new games as people have already memorised these games. A good example of a new game that's doing this sort of thing would be oxygen not included which has good (very) basic chemistry and is fun to play.
Make more videos! I love your unique perspective and the way you present your ideas! You have some awesome potential to be a really popular/profit making youtuber! Keep up the good cotent!
I'm sorry, but I just don't see how my pancreas can't digest proteins until level 6, or how it digesting proteins allows me to see the location of my thyroid gland when it is invisible.
@@The-Rest-of-Us I have lots of half baked ideas my self. I like to compare it to musicians, it's unrealistic that a musician would only create good music. In reality they create a lot of music from which they only present the best work openly. Same thing with ideas that change the world. We are all just "jamming ideas" in hopes of producing something fruitful.
2:15 I don't think Dota has much to offer as knowledge outside the game but still, the team play, the way to communicate with a team under presure, some basics of ressources management. i mean, it's not like Rust where you have a lot a knowledge that can be transmited IRL or like, Gmod, screeps and factorio where you litteraly learn logic gates and programming but every games with some ressources management are great for preparing your minde to what's coming. Just by playing tropico and Anno you'll get the basics of how an economy works, by playing strategy games you'll get a better understanding of what every battles means, when to engage, when to flee., the bigger picture. Minecraft will give you a lotwith logical systems (redstone), ressource management, leadership when played on PvP faction servers. You'll always get something from thoses games. YOu can get general concepts, learn some basics DCA vs air crafts, sand make glass, behaviour of an XOR gate etc... But you'll never get too specific most of the time... except when building computers out of redstone like I did but you get it. I'm about to be an engineer and from what I can tell, videogames gave me quite a lot of things I wouldn't have otherwise, even shooters like halo. :p
I so want to go home and play my Pancreas character with my special digest proteins ability. Yeah.... no. You are going to get these kids beat down, talking like that lol
I think it would be nice to have for example Game of Thrones, Lord of the rings etc. in more languages. Watching this movies in languages you are learning is a great way to improve the learning progress. At the moment this is very easy when you want to learn English but for other languages you often have a reduced selection of movies available. TV is often a good option but streaming TV from an other country is often impossible (if you do it legally)...
please watch extra credits' video on game design. you can't just change the names of things and expect poeple to still conect to it as if nothing was deffrent. for example. the story of the game dark souls is very dark and philosophical. and the game is very hard to beat. they did that on purpose. it would be really weird if dark souls was very easy to beat. because the gameplay makes the story better. if you take a game that isn't conected to biology and give everything the names of organs. it would be very weird and wouldn't be as good as something that understands itself and is made for one purpose. imagine katamari damacy with a dark souls theme and you get what i mean.
oops i forgot. video games often do have information that carries over to the real world. like math and problem solving. but it is not very often very obvious. thats where most edutainment games fail. if you get reminded of the fact that you're learning for school stuf, then it is impossible to forget that school exists. and that's why a lot of poeple play videogames... you just have to look for moments that is comes in handy to know something that you learned from playing video games. video games can be used as literature and art as other things. but video games are the only thing that's interactive. look up the youtube channels extra credits and games as lit. 101 if you want to know more.
i like the idea, and it is used in games such as assassin's creed and (slightly less popular) hearts of iron 4(likely not specifically for education), however, when educators with in-depth understandings of these subjects try to do this, it usually seems like they didn't put any effort in. Also, it doesn't seem very likely for this to ever happen with math:(.
I'm the founder of a very young startup in the gaming ecosystem and I might have the power to integrate this amazing structure for the next generation. I will hit you up soon when I find the time. Best regards, your probably newest fan, Daniel Stenz, founder of ExaQueue.com
I tried playing Dota in Chinese and French (french i was taught). Problem is 'Aegis of immortal' in French doesnt mean anything - just like in English. I could see how binding of issac could do biology to be fair though.
the problem with gamifying educational topics to be able to complete our education earlier is a moot point because our education system would have to better allow for students to understand that they can move forward like that. most A students who could easily be finishing early just don't know that, or they just would rather stick with their friends. which leads to the hidden but true meaning behind public schools. a place to teach proper behavioral habits. people don't like admitting it, but one of the main functions schools really need to fulfill is teaching children how to act in the real world, how to interact with one another and treat people with respect and kindness. this isn't exactly accepted because most people forget the system originally was designed to create silent and order following factory workers. that's what was needed of the mass public at that time. now however we need to change that focus, and this is part of why the games are aimed at competeing with big learning material like books. until the education system wises up and sees the potential of games not only to teach educational topics but also to teach social behavior habits, the system will be unwilling to change.
That's a very bad solution. A good solution is making an actual good game with an intrinsically desirable goal, where the mechanics are whatever you want to teach. Such as Kerbal Space Program, teaching about physics.
I dont think it would honestly work. let's use dota so while you use the example of the basic mechanics of the game but you have realized that you can incorporate different forms of education to help one's play or contextualize the way you would play. So for instance learning told efficiency for items is a good way to understand basic ratios and simple math. the concept of how to take objectives or when to force fights can be analyzed through tacitcs of historical battles of similar situations (ive seen plenot of videos of teaching dota through the art of war or other historical texts). labeling works solely if the person doesn't know the labels in game already. Though for games about teaching biology you can use games like trauma center etc.
don't think this could work well. The amount of info that can be put into a game without ruining the experience is just too low to be significant in terms of education. Even kerbal space program where just about everything being about very accurate rocket science has very low information density. I could learn in one hour what the game takes over 100 to teach and this is with the whole game based around the concept. I imagine doing something similar for something like DotA as you described would have a ratio closer to 1:1000.
Some of the comments:
"I learnt about geography and history because of Empire: Total-War."
"Don't forget the Paradox games. They taught more about History than any teacher."
"kerbal space program where just about everything being about very accurate rocket science"
And many people will tell you that they learned English through playing games/watching movies
and also how guns work
some thoughts:
nobody wants to play boring games and traditional educational games are boring because they are "fully" educational
you can't make a game exclusively about learning
you can't even make it the main focus of the game
with that said, there has to be context for the information you're trying to educate people on, you can't just pick random random characters from a MOBA and call them "pancreas" and call one of their abilities "digest proteins". That completely destroys suspension of disbelief (not to mention that its "teaching to the test")
learning can come from lore (a good strategy) but the best way to learn is by necessity
don't make a game about learning how cells work
make a game where you're a virus and your job is to blow up cells by invading their interior and destroying their core organs
names don't matter, don't feel forced to teach them at the first chance. For example, in that virus game, you would have blown up dozens of cells before you knew what a mitochondria was, even though they were one of your primary targets
do not add any amount of educational material that would make the game less fun. the game must be as fun as possible first, and then educational. Of course that there will be a lot less material, but it WILL be remembered by the player. As you said, don't try to replace a complete education, just try to make the player learn something from playing your game
Miau Frito Yeah I get what you mean. Also, some subjects are a lot easier to turn to games than others :/
Like how's anyone going to incorporate calculus elements into a fun game without making it clunky? Seems pretty hard :/
I learned basic german by switching language to german. I used gothic 3 because it forces you to actually read the queast logs to move on in the game. Weck mit dem Waffe!
@Karl Palmgren I actually used Gothic 2 to learn English, and then I heard the dialogs are more fun in German, so I switched to German but it was way too complicated to learn anything, even though I studied German for 3 years at school :S
I feel I'm missing out on all the great mods made by the community...
I am Swedish and can sort of make out what's written, allthough i had a Dictionary with me while playing. No background in german other than the app duolingo.
Puzzle game in the style of amnesia or portal but with calculus focused puzzles mixed in
cyka blyat Kidney's passive ability regulate blood pressure is op, pls nerf gaben
this made be chuckle
I really want to see a game that throws you into a world where people only speak the language you want to learn (obviously with hints and such in your own language). You can learn the language and play the game :D
***** Any that you would recommend checking out?
***** Yeah, I've played Euro Trucker 2 in all Swedish with Google Translate on my phone next to me :D
The trouble is with language support. Sometimes you get full audio, sometimes just subtitles, but often you don't get anything.
I've heard of a guy that played through Skyrim in German to learn the language
I feel that MMOs would be pretty great at this. Part of the reason I learned how to type and write was from playing an MMO. Hop over to a European server with French/German/some such, and play from there. I remember being so frustrated when I didn't know how to type fast or spell words correctly when trying to talk with others, though you had to in order to go to dungeons and accomplish things within the game. Some serious motivation there.
I will say that MMOs have lost a lot of their edge in this regard because most of them have become what amounts to a single player game. Would have worked wonders in the past though where you needed to be able to communicate to play.
Age of Empires III kinda does this since each empire speaks their own language when you control their characters :D
I think the hardest ones to turn into a game would be the Sciences and Maths.
Languages, History and Geography seems to be the easiest to incorporate into games :D Age of Empires does this pretty well in my opinion :D
Counter-strike *is* educational
I'm now fluent in over 3,000 Russian swear words!
I laughed way more than I should have when I read this.
lmfaooooo
Europa 4, Crusader kings 2, Victoria 2 and Hearts of Iron, Red orchestra 2 are some of the reasons why I am currently really advanced in history right now. Great example of games that teach you while providing some really good game play
Same here I love Paradox Interactive
And civilization is also good if you want good grades in history
Nickzz Paradox trumps the Civ series history wise IMO
I play Europa Universalis Iv as well, and I've learned a lot about Europe during those ages.
History wise, no, playing Civ will only give you like 4/10 while PDX games will give you 9
Don't forget the Paradox games. They taught more about History than any teacher.
Idea needs some work, but its a good idea. I think rather than replace the medium of knowledge like titling and stuff, why not try to get kids to use real world concepts to solve a problem in the game?
Think of counter strike, the bare bones of counter strike is that its a battle of psychology. The one who can read the opponents movements better will end up killing their opponent and thus winning. Since kids will naturally want to get better at these games, giving them mini lessons in say... psychology will give them an edge in a game like counter strike.
In the end with this model, we are Effectively teaching kids psychology because they want to learn it not because they have to. probably best of all, they can apply it meaning they can still play their games.
Just a small suggestion... :P
Nice one! You are in the growing stages of your channel. Keep your awesome work going! Good luck.
Poor dude had a viral video but didn't get the subs out of it...
Good in theory but it seems to contradict itself. Such a patch shoehorns information in and deducts from the game as a whole. It introduces complexity and gives nothing in return (for in-game purposes), and creates a separate vocabulary that if learned independently from its originally designed form , leaves people unable to communicate with others in the game.
Imagine asking a teammate, "Yo NiNjA_h8er6969, help me kill the mitochondria so I can receive enough red blood cells to buy a synthesis boost." I don't play dota and cant tell you the in-game equivalent but I think your team will think you are nuts.
I would love to see an example that sounds more reasonable or how you could teach physics or math in a comprehensive way without specifically designed games.
I like the idea. But I think for existing DOTA-players relearning the names of all items&abillities would be to much work, and no fun. Not to mention relearning it again months later for another course.
I think the main issues are : 1) In school you just simply learn way to much. 'fun' comes from using your knowledge, preferably creatively, to achieve valuable or impressive tasks.
2) School games have a ridiculously low budget compared to 'real' once, (which you try to address with the zip, but I honestly think you need to create a game from scratch, otherwise you will actually become worse at the game your playing, and lose to your competition)
However the subliminal learning point is really valid. I still remember most cool-downs&items&spells&price and their interactions and I quit playing 4 years ago.....
It won't have to be a patch for the international audience. It can just be a mod for the games used for edutainment. This means that for the majority of the users of the game, the game is just as it has always been, and for those using the game for education, they just have to get the students to apply the mod.
If growing real-world skills/knowledge would be marketable as a feature
game producers would have started doing that a long time ago. So far
however we seem to have this silent understanding that "serious/relevant
can't be fun". I believe the opposite is the case: If a fun activity
has some added real world benefit it must feel all the more rewarding.
This seems to be related to our relationship to real work (which we feel we should be compensated for, because we wouldn't do it otherwise, because it's not fun, because it's work, ...).
Huh, learning for fun.
Almost like watching this RUclips channel...
You know that you have a good idea when you want someone to steal it from you
Good idea but not sure if it would ever be used ( the kids wouldn't want to have this). But in general a really good idea!
Spoken by CGP Gray in an hello Internet episode… You are not in school to learn things. School is a place to occupy your time, and to show that you can be a human being in society by completing tasks and being responsible. No one expects, or thinks it's necessary to remember the things you learn in school. It is a fantastic source for daycare for parents of young children, and if you do well in high school, you get a certificate that says that you're a good human. That is what school is for. Granted it does increase intuition, writing skills, speaking skills, but if school was supposed to be teaching you things to remember for the rest of your life, they would teach you things that mattered. Not high-level math, not high-level science, but how to do your taxes, how to get loans ect.
School has a purpose, but it's not to learn a bunch of academic information.
Tim?
Ayo Kerman Dad?
Hey Tim, are you on a plane?
Honest to god, I hope you're not freebooting this video.
***** xD! I'm not freebooting it, I'm view-jacking. Long live The Order of the Flaggy Flag.
This is such an interesting concept. My A' level Computer Science coursework this year pretty much focuses on exactly this (it's a quiz style revision tool embedded into a World of Warcraft like simulation.) It was pretty hard to do and it's not flashy at all because all I'm working with is basic Python knowledge, but from my testing it works both to help kids learn information and to encourage them into more video games.
Fun thing about this. There is a game called Fate (I think something like that at least) that is a card game where all the characters are historical figures or fictional characters, and their backstories in the game is litterally just their life story in the real world. I have a friend who aced history class solely because of this game.
The part where you talk about Dota 2 and a science textbook makes so much sense. It has even inspired some ideas of my own. I am just getting into game development, but I will certainly consider your points while making my games! Great vid!
I love when people conceive and share ideas like these.
Obviously, to put these ideas into effect is not so easy, but I appreciate a lot the creative act. Thank you :)
I just finished watching all of your videos.
Your content is superb. It's on the level of Vsauce, MinutePhysics, CGP Grey, an much more.
Keep up the good work. At this rate, you'll be one of the best internet educators within no time.
Cheers
Thanks buddy.
Cool idea. If such a thing existed, I might play it on my free time.
dont forget we also need to make it subtle like adding spaces in the prenounciation otherwise it becomes too obvious and it wont have the backup that history does in games
Maybe one day we will be able to connect our brain to a computer and just move the knowledge there, but we're going to need hundreds of thousands of years.
There have already a TON of mnemonics that work based on the same idea: adding uninteresting things to interesting things and hope that to work.
Problems: too much time needed, not enough creative power.
Tin + copper = bronze
Thank you Runescape
I think it is a great idea. At least in practice. Worth giving a thought.
I've always played Age of Empires and interacting with the civilizations let you learn about history, for example in the "Story" mode.
its actually gem thoughts, love it
It's like what the civilization series has been doing
I just play town of salem with my username changed to science terms like "mitochondria" so I can memorize it for bio tests
Absolutely amazing video!
KSP where you are given the mathematical tools to learn to be your own Kerbal Engineer!!
Well made, insightful and original video. Great work! x
Your channel needs to be at the top rn i love it so much
Thanks. It's comments like these that motivate me to keep going. :)
The problem is modern games use instant gratification to keep players engage while studying is the complete opposite if that instant gratification can make people interested in learning but its only short term the knowledge gain will be quicky forgotten as a result
I agree with your train of thought. Thank you for sharing this with us.
civ v is a perfect example of this
great thinking
This is why if someone managed to make a video game whose physics are almost identical to real life (at least classically speaking), I think it could be revolutionary in making people more aware of the basic laws of nature.
I think most people have a hard time grasping a subject until it's broken down and visualized. I feel like that's why analogies even exist..
I'm just saying... how amazing would it be to toss on an oculus rift and literally experience the extremities and intricacies of the nature of our universe firsthand... or even just a world identical to ours but where your resources for experimentation are unlimited.
Just a thought
Really interesting idea
god damnit you are a genius.
You deserve more recognition !!
it's a cool idea but I don't think this could be viable
I agree. Electromagnetism is a much more viable hero than Pancreas.
+Vizaru ELECTROMAGNETISM META
Stupid Electromagnetism players. So cheap, EM is a totally OP hero. Just spam Solenoid all the time. Try playing as World War II, that actually takes some skill.
Brilliant!
nice channel you have i love the paradox videos
Dota 2 literally has a modding system. You can make fully functional games inside of it.
I love this
whats your mmr ?
+3zehnutters 4k on a good day
but everyday is bad day haha
4k bruh
Paradox Interactive ftw.
1. what was that cellular structure game?
2. Dragon Box Algebra is, by far, the best example of this I've come across. My daughter was 4 when she completed the game and near the end there is virtually no operational characteristic that separates the game from genuine algebra.
Genius!
There are plenty of games that are incredibly fun and incredibly educational. I feel as if the way to incorporate both aspects is to generate interest in the material by showing off how it can be used to succeed in the context of the game, as well as present it in an accessible way. A good example might be redstone in Minecraft. It allows you to manipulate the world in ways that can be beneficial and cool, but doesn't have to be complicated and is easy to use. Maybe another example might be literally any RTS game with a historical theme that also applies to the different controllable factions and how they play. Generally they have lore info documented in spaces adjoining explanations of game mechanics or tutorials. I imagine it's incredibly feasible to introduce complicated concepts behind cellular biology or human anatomy or genetics or even histology behind a strategy game that utilizes math or probabilistic models based on the way things actually function without forcing the player to interface with them and calculate them manually. If you can present the topic in an engaging and immersive way that is fun and challenging, you can create a game that is also educational. Also, a major flaw of edutainment games that people don't generally talk about is the fact that they are often cheaply made, short, and have very unprofessionally done art and music. It's almost as if the creators of these games are trying to be corny and tacky. It doesn't have to be that way at all either. Look at games like Shenzen IO, which is a game about efficient programming, or even Rocket League or Planetside 2. RL and PS2 both might not seem obviously educational, but those games really boil down to being able to coordinate with or lead other people efficiently to overcome the coordination or leadership of another team. You can have top tier players on your side but if you can't utilize their strengths and make smart decisions and lay down clear plans through clear communication you will lose easily against almost completely naive but better organized players. Of course, I haven't listed all of the games that have any educational value, but there are dozens more examples of well loved games that can augment one's knowledge of history, engineering, logic, math, art, and other topics.
Well there are already high crossing edutainment:
Historical strategy games, like Age of Empires, Civilization, Total War, etc.
Only for one part of education but well it's something
True, Some games do have knowledge and require you to apply what you learn, but so few people actually figure it out for themselves. Instead people relay on guilds. Like Minecraft has redstone, which is essentially logic gates. but instead of learning redstone, people just look up "how to" on youtube. Ark Survival has a pretty good breeding system that shows inheritance and mutations. But almost no one takes the time to learn it.
The thing about copying down redstone, like with a technical tutorial about anything else, is that patterns and connections between certain things are picked up just by going through the motions. When I was 13, I was one of those kids, but the stuff I picked up from copying down designs from other people allowed me to create my own designs. The end result of all of this, 5 or 6 years later, is that due to my experience trouble shooting or connecting the dots in what I was doing resulted in an already developed understanding of modular math and Boolean logic when I began to learn how to program and engage myself in higher level math.
There actually a story behind each character in Dota 2. It's important and interesting to players.
Also, there are people making money on Dota 2 winning competitions it's not just a game it's a sport. And sport can be crucial for kid development.
I'm not so sure about this, but I did learn to read Russian playing Metal Gear Solid 3. Every time you change areas the load screen shows the name of the area in English and Russian. Then you just compare. Subtlety is always best I think
Give them as nicks, like Slardar the "Pancreas", Please don't change them completely
There's already an awesome "Edutainment" game.
It's called Civ IV.
It at least works for history... Maybe biology as well.
Gamification is the future.
you'd have to make new games as people have already memorised these games. A good example of a new game that's doing this sort of thing would be oxygen not included which has good (very) basic chemistry and is fun to play.
Make more videos! I love your unique perspective and the way you present your ideas! You have some awesome potential to be a really popular/profit making youtuber! Keep up the good cotent!
Are already games like those in the market? I would love to buy it :)
I think we shouldn't shorten schooltime but instead make it longer :D
Your channel is great.. It'll be a big channel one day
HOLY SHIT MIND BLOWN GOOD IDEA MAN!!!!!
"Cell Biology" "Useful in the real world" k
I'm sorry, but I just don't see how my pancreas can't digest proteins until level 6, or how it digesting proteins allows me to see the location of my thyroid gland when it is invisible.
Such a half baked idea. But don't let me stop you.
Yea 5 years later I agree. Thought about deleting this one but decided to leave it up as a record of my thought process
@@The-Rest-of-Us
I have lots of half baked ideas my self.
I like to compare it to musicians, it's unrealistic that a musician would only create good music. In reality they create a lot of music from which they only present the best work openly. Same thing with ideas that change the world. We are all just "jamming ideas" in hopes of producing something fruitful.
2:15 I don't think Dota has much to offer as knowledge outside the game but still, the team play, the way to communicate with a team under presure, some basics of ressources management.
i mean, it's not like Rust where you have a lot a knowledge that can be transmited IRL or like, Gmod, screeps and factorio where you litteraly learn logic gates and programming but every games with some ressources management are great for preparing your minde to what's coming. Just by playing tropico and Anno you'll get the basics of how an economy works, by playing strategy games you'll get a better understanding of what every battles means, when to engage, when to flee., the bigger picture.
Minecraft will give you a lotwith logical systems (redstone), ressource management, leadership when played on PvP faction servers.
You'll always get something from thoses games. YOu can get general concepts, learn some basics DCA vs air crafts, sand make glass, behaviour of an XOR gate etc... But you'll never get too specific most of the time... except when building computers out of redstone like I did but you get it.
I'm about to be an engineer and from what I can tell, videogames gave me quite a lot of things I wouldn't have otherwise, even shooters like halo. :p
I learnt about geography and history because of Empire: Total-War.
A better option would be to mix math and science into mmo's with trade skills and the sort.
I so want to go home and play my Pancreas character with my special digest proteins ability. Yeah.... no.
You are going to get these kids beat down, talking like that lol
Or... Build an addictive game AROUND these principles. Such as with EUIV
Just subscribed, good job.
I think it would be nice to have for example Game of Thrones, Lord of the rings etc. in more languages. Watching this movies in languages you are learning is a great way to improve the learning progress. At the moment this is very easy when you want to learn English but for other languages you often have a reduced selection of movies available. TV is often a good option but streaming TV from an other country is often impossible (if you do it legally)...
please watch extra credits' video on game design. you can't just change the names of things and expect poeple to still conect to it as if nothing was deffrent. for example. the story of the game dark souls is very dark and philosophical. and the game is very hard to beat. they did that on purpose. it would be really weird if dark souls was very easy to beat. because the gameplay makes the story better. if you take a game that isn't conected to biology and give everything the names of organs. it would be very weird and wouldn't be as good as something that understands itself and is made for one purpose. imagine katamari damacy with a dark souls theme and you get what i mean.
oops i forgot. video games often do have information that carries over to the real world. like math and problem solving. but it is not very often very obvious. thats where most edutainment games fail. if you get reminded of the fact that you're learning for school stuf, then it is impossible to forget that school exists. and that's why a lot of poeple play videogames... you just have to look for moments that is comes in handy to know something that you learned from playing video games. video games can be used as literature and art as other things. but video games are the only thing that's interactive. look up the youtube channels extra credits and games as lit. 101 if you want to know more.
omg why can't he post more often I love his videos
i like the idea, and it is used in games such as assassin's creed and (slightly less popular) hearts of iron 4(likely not specifically for education), however, when educators with in-depth understandings of these subjects try to do this, it usually seems like they didn't put any effort in. Also, it doesn't seem very likely for this to ever happen with math:(.
_If you want to learn history then play _*_AGE OF EMPIRES III_*_ !!_
I'm the founder of a very young startup in the gaming ecosystem and I might have the power to integrate this amazing structure for the next generation.
I will hit you up soon when I find the time.
Best regards, your probably newest fan,
Daniel Stenz, founder of ExaQueue.com
You don't buy aganims scapter for slardar!
Buen Trabajo ;) eres un Crack
I tried playing Dota in Chinese and French (french i was taught). Problem is 'Aegis of immortal' in French doesnt mean anything - just like in English. I could see how binding of issac could do biology to be fair though.
The simplest way to do this would be with mods
I heard Minecraft does this. I don't game myself so I don't know if it's true.
this is really good. I am 12 years old too
the problem with gamifying educational topics to be able to complete our education earlier is a moot point because our education system would have to better allow for students to understand that they can move forward like that. most A students who could easily be finishing early just don't know that, or they just would rather stick with their friends. which leads to the hidden but true meaning behind public schools. a place to teach proper behavioral habits. people don't like admitting it, but one of the main functions schools really need to fulfill is teaching children how to act in the real world, how to interact with one another and treat people with respect and kindness. this isn't exactly accepted because most people forget the system originally was designed to create silent and order following factory workers. that's what was needed of the mass public at that time. now however we need to change that focus, and this is part of why the games are aimed at competeing with big learning material like books. until the education system wises up and sees the potential of games not only to teach educational topics but also to teach social behavior habits, the system will be unwilling to change.
That's a very bad solution.
A good solution is making an actual good game with an intrinsically desirable goal, where the mechanics are whatever you want to teach.
Such as Kerbal Space Program, teaching about physics.
assassin's creed was close to it. If history had to have a game
DOesn't work like that dude.
Fun English or Fun Russian? It's good that kids are learning foreign languages, blyat.
Durch Videogames hab ich english gelernt. Innert kürzester Zeit, als ich jünger war. :D
Dota > LoL, confirmed
Endlich ein deutscher CGP Grey 😍😍😍
1v1 me in Fun English
I dont think it would honestly work. let's use dota so while you use the example of the basic mechanics of the game but you have realized that you can incorporate different forms of education to help one's play or contextualize the way you would play. So for instance learning told efficiency for items is a good way to understand basic ratios and simple math. the concept of how to take objectives or when to force fights can be analyzed through tacitcs of historical battles of similar situations (ive seen plenot of videos of teaching dota through the art of war or other historical texts). labeling works solely if the person doesn't know the labels in game already. Though for games about teaching biology you can use games like trauma center etc.
Dude, Dota has way more than 10 million, that's only steam ppl, remember that Chinese ppl use the our world launcher, they are a lot of ppl
don't think this could work well. The amount of info that can be put into a game without ruining the experience is just too low to be significant in terms of education.
Even kerbal space program where just about everything being about very accurate rocket science has very low information density. I could learn in one hour what the game takes over 100 to teach and this is with the whole game based around the concept. I imagine doing something similar for something like DotA as you described would have a ratio closer to 1:1000.
Saw Dota. Stayed for Dota.
Hey Google 'The Dress' and make a video on it plz .. i wanna understand more about it. Thnaks