The Embarrassing History of Thundercats Roar
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- Опубликовано: 1 май 2024
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After Thundercats ended in 1989 they tried again in 2011 and it did not go well at all. Maybe 3rd time is the charm?
Announced in 2018 Thundercats Roar was the 3rd try at Thundercats and a wild departure from what came before. The reaction to Thundercats Roar was overwhelming and immediate. And terrible.
SOURCES:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thunder...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thunder...
www.herebegeeks.com/tv/interv...
sg.style.yahoo.com/we-talk-to...
thundercats.fandom.com/wiki/T...
www.saturdaymorningsforever.c...
• ThunderCats Roar | Com...
www.cbr.com/thundercats-roar-...
www.kidzcoolit.com/reviews/ca...
CalArts Style Articles:
www.ballstatedaily.com/byte/a...
www.polygon.com/2018/5/22/173...
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Развлечения
It was terrible.
Thundercats 2011 GANG💯💯💯
Gaslighting 101 kids, pay attention.
I had to scroll really far down to find a person who realized this was a joke. Dan was really channeling his inner Andy Kaufman for this one.
@@Noneofyourbusiness2000 could've came with a disclaimer caption before the vid started, shouldn't he?
@@SuperWolsey It's a lot funnier this way and he also wouldn't get the same backlash. I think the point was to get backlash like the show did.
I think there's a related conversation to be had about the endless recycling of existing IPs versus telling entirely new stories without relying on existing brand recognition.
I liked the OG show, I LOVED the 2011 reboot. I tried an episode of Roar, and it wasn’t for me and moved on. Still love Thundercats
I might be the only person that loves all three. I didn't think I'd like Roar, especially after the cringe interviews from creators, but I found it funny and thought it used the lore well - BUT I know I'm in the extreme minority.
@@ta0paipai You are not alone. There are dozens of us.
2011 reboot was amazing. I love how they expanded the backstory *significantly* even if it differed from the original.
Roar simply wasn't gonna happen with me; modern reboots had already left a bad taste in my mouth and Roar was a bitter pill.
Such a grown up response. How refreshing.
Look at you being all reasonable and mature and adult like
I think this video is longer than Thundercats Roar lasted. 😆
I actually think is one of Larry Fink's ESG, crowning achievements: Destruction, Humiliation, Soul crushing, Annihilation of a beloved, seen as macho, property from the 80s when there were too many, for Larry's taste, macho properties.
It really says something when a show is so completely hated and rejected by the audience that the company who made/owns it just buries it completely.
@@JohnDoe-wq5euWhich is really too bad, because I went in planning to hate it and was completely hooked. Loved the original, loved the 2011 reboot. Art style aside, this one is really similar to the original down to using many of the same musical cues. Only people who were fans of the original could've made this one.
"On this week's episode of 'Chip on my Fucking Shoulder...'"
Ye gotta admit this definitely was somewhat revenge driven but I can understand why
The best way to sum up Thundercats Roar is that it was Velma before there was Velma. A show seemingly deliberately made to turn off the original fanbase with it's ugly design yet was completely dependent on that fanbase since all of the "humor" revolved around being familiar with the original show. It was a show made with absolutely no one in mind, fans of both the original and reboot didn't want it and it was unapproachable to potential new fans.
While it is a fair criticism to say that the internet drama surrounding the show was overblown it is however utterly ridiculous to blame angry fans for the shows failure. The simply fact is if the show had had any real merit it would have found an audience regardless of how much older fans disliked it.
It is NOT like Velma, get that take outta here
@@tino9117 It is just like Velma, an ugly disgrace to the source material that was made solely for the self satisfaction of the creator.
@@conduit64 in fairness the creator of Velma wanted to make an original IP it was WB that made her put a known IP skin on it
The people who would care about a Thunder Cats reboot simply didn't want it. It was banking on the notoriety of an IP with two separate generations of fans, without serving either, with the second generation having legitimate reasons to feel let down. It was a very wild swing and a very predictable miss.
Japan has a better sense of humor with this kind of s show. SD Gundam has been around since the damn 80's.
@@JeffreyPiatt The thing about SD Gundam is that they still made regular gundam with it.
@JeffreyPiatt I got to say that is a horrible comparison. SD was never meant to overtake the normal Gundam stuff. SD was a comedic show meant for a younger audience. While still continuing the dark 'war is hell' Gundam stories. I feel this is an bad faith argument here. We didn't have a comedic and more serious shows going side by side here. We had a 'Well if u don't like it too bad ur not a real fan!' Thing happen.
This paragraph could be used on EVERY new remake
Here's the thing. 80's Thundercats, is absolutely stupid. I grew up with it as a kid, and I watched it and liked it then, but it was ridiculous back then and even kid me knew that, but I didn't mind. 00/10s Thundercats was a gritty reboot with a stronger focus on storytelling than episodic nonsense. It only bears the vaguest resemblance to 80s Thundercats. I liked it. It was good. I watched it as an adult. Thundercats Roar was not for me. Much like Teen Titans Go, is not for me. Thundercats Roar was for a new generation, the same one that adored Teen Titans Go. Much the same way not every TMNT reboot is good, or the fact that I hate the Transformers movies. It doesn't mean that it's the wrong way to go with the franchise, it just means it's not for me. And not every reboot has to be for me. If I don't like it, I don't watch it, and allow the people who do enjoy it to have that. Maybe the next reboot will be for me, maybe it won't. But just because I like it a certain way doesn't mean it always has to be presented in that way. Drawing back in the old fans is nice, but getting new fans is better. Your childhood isn't ruined is any way by new versions of a franchise. Those shows still exist. You can go back and watch them anytime. If they aren't on streaming services they're probably available on Blu-Ray or DVD, or RUclips. It's highly likely they exist somewhere on the internet. Go re-watch them, bathe in your nostalgia, and leave the reboots alone. New viewers will decide if they like them or not and the brand will continue to perpetuate for new generations. That's how you respect your nostalgia. Watch what you enjoy, don't watch what you don't. If a reboot/remake is truly bad, it'll make itself known. So called "fans" don't need to clamor for everyone involved in it's creation to be launched out of a catapult into the sun.
You won't find me shedding a tear for Thundercats Roar, I don't even care about it enough to hate it.
Arguably, that's the worst fate for a franchise: folks not caring about it *at ALL.*
same. i feel bad for the fans that hated this as i have been there with Voltron, Death Note, and Cowboy Bebop
Plot twist, Dan was secretly one of the producers on Thundercats Roar.
The only advice Warner Bros should take with Thundercats Roar is to leave that version buried and dead and never, ever speak of it again.
Kinda surprised there was an effort to defend this show. It was a product nobody wanted except for the executives that tried to replicate Teen Titans Go 's success. Fans of the original (now adults) would never have accepted this dumbed down version of it, and having kids why would they show them Roar if they can show them the original and make some awesome shared memories in the process?
It is also weird that the main defense always is that it was a show for kids, well what do you think fans of the original were back in the 80s/90s? Makes no sense. If somebody out there loved the show, that's okay, but I'll never understand why.
The show died as it lived unremarkable and forgettable I wouldn't throw on the cape for this one Dan
TBT be told I never understood who this show was supposed to be for: fans of the original were sure to hate because it literally bends over backwards to mock everything about it and not in loving roast way or clever, sly, insightful way either but an aggressively laughing at you for ever having liked it way. It wasn't really for kids either because jokes relied heavily upon have at least some familiarity which the original show which one under the age of 40 at the time was much going to have. Honesty it seemed like it was made exclusively for people who saw the OG show when they were old enough to know how goofy it was at times.
Truly a baffling poorly conceived show that proved my pondering was well warranted because it completely failed to find an audience in the end.
Yes, it's like forgetting who the audience was for Velma. Pitch Meeting examined this question. Apparently, Velma's audience was the writers and producers, and no one else was considered important, since they dissed on the original Scooby Doo. This was similar. And ugly animation, IMO.
I think the creator was getting retroactive revenge on his brothers.
The show creators tried something. The audience didn't want it. Doesn't matter if it was good or not. People didn't want it and it died. Sometimes crap wins sometimes quality does sometimes it's the other way around. Not much we can do about it.
Now was Roar like that Loonatics show? No idea it didn't look like my thing so I moved on. If it was? Well it got what it deserved and hopefully they learned from it. But as nobody learns anything especially not the business and entertainment sector? Well there we go. If it was good and died? Oh well it happens. From reading comments here it was more in that Loonatics level of THIS IS NOT WHAT ANYONE WANTS AND ISN'T EVEN GOOD region as opposed to the 2010s show which was great.
I'm still halfway convinced that this whole show was an inside job by Mumm-Ra himself to destroy the Thundercats brand.
And he had to stretch it out by putting in clips relating to the Cats broadway play!
Insidious.
I'm still upset over the 2011 show cancellation. It was good damnit!
Preach to the choir! There are dozens of us!
@@maxxcreese9911 Sadly, maybe even a whole Score. >.>
Here you go.
I enjoyed the original Thundercats. I really enjoyed the 2011 reboot.And I appreciate that Roar knew what it wanted to be, and did that. But the problem was 'that thing it wanted to be' wasn't a good Thundercats show. You spoke of straddling the line between maintaining the previous fans, and engaging new ones, and much like 2011 Thundercats failed to get new fans (though it certainly wasn't targeting the demographic that would storm toy stores and scream until their parents bought them that Lion-O figure), Roar likewise failed to maintain those old fans. In fact the creators outright condemned any opinion that wasn't "This is the greatest Thundercats show ever" (spoiler: it wasn't).
The animation, while popular at the time, was not the right medium for Thundercats. Even the 80's Thundercats was clean, realistic (as far as 80s animation and anthropomorphic cats can be realistic). They looked good. They looked professional. Roar . . . did not. And other shows using that janky animation (yes, even Teen Titans Go) did a far better job at combining the humor it should include with at least reasonable storylines, even the ones that were episodic in nature and not long form.
It failed not because the original fans disliked it, it failed because the creators did nothing to make the older fans *want* to like it. And that's on them. No one else.
This is Dan's "Leave Britney Alone!" video.
Except Chris Crocker had a valid point, just poorly expressed.
Not even close man, this video looks at the nature of toxic fandoms as a whole, just using this show as a major example cause like, ye this show is mostly known through it's controversy
@@The_Jimplication Not to mention he was unintentionally funny.
@@tino9117 corpos have no excuse to greenlight a piece of shit like this that has "franchise killer" written all over it
I'm sorry, Thundercats Roar deserved every bit of disdain it received.
@@keithjones5568 Evidence? This isn't a scientific hypothesis. We're not debating the existence of flying saucers. It's all subjective.
He's not even bringing up how they made jokes about one of the actors recently dying. And I thought just hating on fans who didn't like the new show was bad.
@@KJ-tz7vcThe show is the evidence. It was a POS and anyone who likes it is the same.
@@KJ-tz7vcthe evidence is that it’s a piece of shit.
@@unclefranklin4575Teen Titans Go fault not Roar's, it is kind of weird that he doesn't bring it up either for TTG but I guess since this episode isn't about them then ye
Coming from someone with zero attachment to any incarnation of Thundercats, I feel this video really missed the mark. It focused WAY too much on the internet drama and didn't seem to consider that it looked to be a flawed approach from conception.
Obviously the hardcore nostalgia-obsessed people who grew up with the 80's show wouldn't like it, the people who wanted a continuation of the 2011 series also wouldn't be interested, but they're not the target demographic. Kids are, and kids have no awareness or attachment to Thundercats as a brand due to it spending most of its 40 or so years of existence with no new shows or movies to keep it in the public consciousness. Transformers and TMNT are able to reboot themselves so often and so successfully because they've never really had these massive dry spells of no new media, so even kids that haven't seen an older incarnation of Transformers still know who Optimus Prime is, or kids who have never seen a Ninja Turtles show know who Michaelangelo is. Just like this video, it failed at reading the room and wound up drawing the worst kind of attention while the people it was targeted at didn't know about it or didn't care.
Agreed
This video is so far off the mark that I feel like he is pulling an Andy Kaufman and trolling all of us. The man who says, "is it canon" in almost every episode decides to criticize fan nostalgia? This video has 2.4k down votes vs 3.3k up votes, and most people don't even know there is a way to see that. Maybe it's some form of artistic critique. Thundercats Roar took the opposite approach of the original, so let's do an episode on it were Dan Larson says the opposite of what he usually does.
To be fair, this comment section presents a pretty compelling case for the internet drama being the lede in this story
I agree with that
Agreed
Some shows are worth dying on a hill to defend. Roar is not one of those shows.
Exactly
As if you can just decide that
@@tino9117 I just did.
I've actually watched Roar. It's insultingly bad.
@@tino9117 yes they can. That’s how opinions work…
That like to disike ratio, though.
Honestly not enough dislikes for how much an ass he was in this video.
I watched this show with a little kid that loved every CN show at the time. He find this one boring and ugly. He laughed and enjoyed SU, Adventure Time and all the other shows. This one was destined to die.
Never got into Steven Universe, but Adventure Time actually was a really good, intricately-crafted show. It doesn't deserve to be compared to this shlock.
@@victorcastle5757 Adventure Time shares some similar principles when it comes to design, Adventure Time can even be blamed for influencing the art direction of a lot of shows, plus the show is pretty overrated.
@Channeleven2345789 i guess to most of that, but I dont think it's overrated, but pretty good.
The real reason it failed is because it did not find a new audience .I agree no one should be threatened, Fans are passionate they keep all of these IPs going. Your channel is based on the love for all of these shows. I felt like this was more of a rant video than a history of video. I really enjoy your work. I disagree with this take. Thank you
I hope Dan doesn’t continue down this path. He’ll wind up a bitter man in a basement like Retroblasting.
@@davidanderson4748 Sort of thing was the reson why i stopped watching retroblasting, even when I agreed with their overall point.
@@bobdude7111I quit when he got into a spat with another toy channel that was from a guy who had been in the industry. Like his dorky raging on parts of Robotech or Neca? Sad but people have their own opinions. Not wanting to cover any toy line he hadn't 100% completed? Kinda dumb in both a financial and THIS IS AN INTERNET VIDEO ABOUT OLD TOYS sense. His debate with that guy? Yeah Rblastin came off as a sulky entitled douche canoe. One who apparently has a very well paying job (hopefully) to buy lots of expensive needless stuff.
lol no
@@CaptainRufus Michael French is notoriously thin-skinned and while some of his early content was good, he started a lot of feuds with other channels. When he talks to the camera he drove me up a wall. I don't think Dan Larson is gonna go that path
Dan has seen more episodes of Thundercats than I have, and I was a kid when the show was on. I have no nostalgia for it.
The Promo card for Thundercats 2011 at 4:07 reads ‘Saturday Night at 2:30A’ with a glorious time slot as two thirty in the morning it’s a wonder why it failed.
The schedule was pretty much what killed the show's prospects.
Not to sound whiny, but there IS a Thundercats movie in the works, saying "if only you had liked the awful show" is just one of many moot points in the video.
Maybe the cartoon just sucked.
Indeed.
It didn't.
it did
There are plenty of reasons a show/movie can fail. Decent-ish stuff typically gets rediscovered through home video/streaming. UHF bombed at the theatres because it came out the same summer as Batman & Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade. UHF got pushed aside in the wake of those two blockbusters but later found success on home video. Nowadays stuff remains in the dustbin of history either because of rights issues... or it is just junk.
It was dumb, predictable and unfunny, plus cheaply animated. Call it Thundercats, call it anything else, it's still crap
I tried watching it. It wasn’t for me. I also think that animation style is horrid, but that’s my opinion not a fact.
It actually is a fact
@@angelalvarezcine opinions =/= fact. It's okay if you didn't like it, but let's not state opinions are facts.
@@tyfyghtr the animation style is horrid and that’s a fact. Just compare it to any other style, from old disney, to ghibli, to tartakowsky’s, to wander over yonder (which has the “calarts” style too). It’s objectively bad. It’s ok if you like it though, to each their own. But it is bad and it’s not just an opinion.
While I don’t disagree in disliking the art of the show, again art is subjective, always in the eye of the beholder and therefore always metered on opinion over fact. Again won’t deny that it looks like trash to me, but it’s practically gold in an animation style since it wasn’t bound by solid standards of reality letting the animators get away with more than they would have otherwise in a style like either show before. For what the show was attempting to do it wasn’t an entirely wrong choice. Only that the entire feel of the show didn’t resonate with most. Older fans hated the departure from the more action oriented series it had always been, while kids probably saw it for ripping off the Teen Titans Go format with characters that they had no real impact from.
It's a fact.
enjoy that sellout check
I still am hurt that 2011 died. It was amazing
Lego Chema
I wouldn’t say amazing, but it was good. For me, the 80’s Thundercats is the best of the three officially produced TV shows.
I own DVD/Blu rays of the 80’s Thundercats and the 2011 Thundercats. I would like to own a physical copy of Thundercats Roar even though the couple of episodes I watched did absolutely nothing for me, it is now (unfortunately) a part of the Thundercats legacy.
It was so dope
It really was. One of the few times that a remake was better than the original.
Not gonna lie, this ep had a weird energy
Very combative right out the gate.
Fan-shaming!
Nah, asshole blaming @@KJ-tz7vc
As of this response, 2.6k upvotes compared to 1.8k downvotes......I'll abstain myself 😅
@@MrChupacabra555 The Thundercats Roar curse strikes again! 😸
Thundercats Roar was one of the first examples of IP holders making an ill advised reboot/remake, mocking fans for hating it, then blaming anything but themselves for it failing. Now that is common practice.
Ghostbusters 2016?
@@hellacoorinna9995 Yeah! That was on the same level.
Classic WB bullshit.
Please tell me where the creators/IP holders were mocking fans without bringing up the TTG episode that they didn't work on
Thundercats Roar was like an early version of the "Velma" problem. A show that doesnt care who the audience is, mostly expresses disdain for the IP audience of Scooby Doo, and is nowhere good enough to find a new one. Plus terrible animation, after the beautifully rendered 2011 Reboot. This should have been figured out in the pitch meeting. Speaking of..watch Ryan George's Pitch Meeting of Velma. That explains the problem here.
Not only did it mess with 80s Thundercats, but it ALSO screwed the 2011 reboot. "CalArts" internet hate was at its peak and this show didn't help. Getting 80s Lion-O to tell all the haters they have poop opinions while 2011 Panthro rots didn't go over well either.
No, LEGO screwed the 2011 reboot, and let's be real, the 2011 reboot was a forgettably generic cartoon
What? 6:50
Nobody is Ever going to be "excited and hooked in to the show" with awful cheap looking designs like that, I went to elementary school with kids that could draw better.
For people that "loved" the original show I don't see how they could have felt ok with making something that looked and presented itself in such a way. Roar should have been shorter episodic thing at the end of the real effort. Just because Adventure Time had lesser animation design doesn't mean every other show can pull it off, Finn and Jake are an original property and had much better writing, there wasn't a built in multi-generational fan base dieing for new or possibly continued content.
Thundercats Roar came off as more of an insult than anything else. 🤷♂️
Roar was greenlit because it was cheap, never mind all that "fresh approach" nonsense
It was greenlit because Teen Titans Go was successful, hence the derivative title and tone.
@@AussieDragoon And it was cheap
@AussieDragoon In fact it looks even cheaper than Teen Titans go
@@AussieDragoon TTG was the best rated show on CN not because it was good but because CN pulled everything better to stuff the lineup with more TTG.
The "fresh approach" bit is more so for why the creators made it, they wanted to do something they thought would be funny and entertaining as fans of the source material
But ye to be honest, it was greenlit cause it looked like easy money thx to TTG being a success (for some reason)
One thing worth mentioning in any Thundercats retrospective is how much the original knocked the logo out of the park. You still see people putting that logo on tattoos, clothes, stickers, etc. way out of proportion to the show's original run.
Yea that Mercury (the car) logo is awesome
Even as a kid I was kinda luke-warm about Thundercats. You could not call me a huge fan. Whatever language that describes 'Roar's' ...'derpy' art style? ...the anger? I totally get it. It makes me, a non-fan, angry too.
The style oozes with a willfully weak, infantilized slacker, non-try energy. Which is antithetical to the in-shape, up-and-Adam, will-to-power self-actualization energy OG Thudercats was bringing. ....so the mystery behind the anger there? ....Not that mysterious.
(Side note: While I don't love Thundercats, I DO love Tsuguyuki Kubo's character design. He was also responsible for Rankin Bass's Hobbit/Return & Last Unicorn. I love his style.)
It's hard not to be so negative when the creators of Roar explicitly told the audiences "those who don't like Thundercats Roar as a worthy succesor have poop mouths with poop opinions"
Basically the type that views any criticism as bullying.
Bad faith criticism is bullying yes, of course not to say it was all bad faith mind you, but alot of it was, and mostly overshadowed it@@KJ-tz7vc
AHAAAAA, SEE THAT'S JUST THE THING! The crew for Thundercats Roar had absolutely no involvement with that episode of TTG, outside of the actor for the new Lion-O, but if we wanna start kicking their ass for that, you gotta take notice of the guy who voiced classic Lion-O who was there too
It was still in all accounts an awful episode, but those kind of episodes was TTG's bread and butter, they made a name off of self-deprecating and passive aggressive attacking towards fans, that coupled with the constant re airing made it run for over a decade
he left that out of the embarrassing history huh
This Ain't It, Chief.
It is, slick!
This show totally missed its mark. I am a fan of the OG series and I liked the 2011 series, as well. So, i was willing to give Roar a chance. I watched it with my daughter that wanted to see it because she thought it would be like Teen Titans Go or Steven Universe because of the style...
Well, she hated the show. We got halfway through the first episode and she asked to watch something else. Not only that, but she questioned why i even liked Thundercats because the show was horrible. I told her the older shows were nothing like Roar and showed her some episodes of the OG series. She loved them and asked me why they didn't make it more like the original. I didn't have a good answer. So, I just told her sometimes they like making goofy spinoffs of great shows like Teen Titans Go. She didn't know what i was talking about and I realized she didn't remember the original Teen Titans so I put on a few of those and her reaction was like someone turned on a light switch. Every time she had a chance, she'd asked to watch more TT. I'm not going to lie, i was a little upset that she didn't want to rewatch the original Thundercats anymore.
At the time of Roar, my daughter was around 11-12. She was definitely in the target demo of those they wanted watching Roar. The show was horrible. So even though there was a small minority of fanatics that were loud online, the show itself made a mockery of the OG series, itself and any fans it could have had.
Nice anecdote, but really it's only that.
Very surprised by Galaxy’s biased approach on this. I do not deny that the outrage went overboard, but the show was garbage. He even said he barely watched the original and didn’t like it. He is presenting the show runner in a positive light when he dismissed fans of both previous shows in a pompous way. Roar was a bad idea and bad execution. Defending it here is turning your back on your demo.
Hubris all over the place from the creator and Dan, here.
With the recent success of x-men 97, his points seem to fall apart.
Let's ignore the new x-men animation, why the 2017 ducktales last longer than thundercats roar?
@@YungJiewell said ❤
He got butthurted because fans didn't like that hideous cal arts style, big L this episode
I don't think you know what "bias" means. Having different opinions about a cartoon is turning their back on their demo? I know this is a channel about children's toys and cartoons, but grow up.
Dan seems to be taking the hatred of this show a bit personally. It's not The History Of Thundercats Roar, the video should be titled The Defense Of Thundercats Roar.
I have to agree. Its like he wanted to do a "toxic fan" counter video and just hijacked this IP to do it.
Yes quite strange … and so late in the game …
I’m getting “I was a producer” feelings from this as well.
There are certainly properties that would be a better example of toxic fandom than Thundercats Roar.
@@doro626 The vibe I got, especially after his credits monologue, was that he was a fan of Roar, but never saw/liked the other versions, so he's kinda salty that fan hate cost him his show.
Wow, I never realized that voicing disappointment with a studios decision made me toxic. How dumb am I?
I don't need Dan or the channel to share my opinion, and I don't need to be insulted by them either.
We're also willfully ignoring how those producing these halfbaked shows treat legacy fans, forgetting those fans are the ones with kids they're attempting to target.
@@DocXango my point exactly
@@DocXango I've been having a similar feeling lately, like whoever is writing the titles of episodes is really doing a disservice; they've been really negative lately and making me not want to watch the episodes as I enjoyed the shows they were about and don't want to watch something called "the disappointment of [title]"
John K.'s style is blatantly ripped off into corporate ownership in the form of Spongebob, replicating Ren and Stimpy as Squidward and Spongebob pretty blatantly, it's tyhe exact same thins as Miracle Star is to Amazing world of Gumball and John K. has every right to be resentful. This style IS visionary, and the "cal arts" style is broadly speaking stealing ONLY from John K. and Adventure Time. They are objectively NOT visionary, but derivative like Hayao Miyazaki would loathe.
USA always does this China-style reappropriation, even Thundercats comes to mind because "anime" as such is a word that couldn't exist in Japan, since "cartoon" already equals "アニメ". What the word "Anime is FOR, is to whitewash all the "anime"" influence from shows like Thundercats and TMNT, despite produced by Toei's anime animators. Rebrand it, like cattle, under this broad US property of "non-anime" that gets compete with NORMAL cartoons. SPECIAL cartoons like "anime" go to reservations and weird time slots, branded as sexual and violent, more than teaching children to be mercenaries like The Avengers.
And it goes deeper. "Normal" Americans distinguish even themselves from the 700 000 000 residents of the American continent, which is BIZARRE if you think so in any othe place, like Africa would have "Africans" and "native Africans". And you give this esteem to George Lucas and Tarantino, who copypaste styles of interantional auteurs like Sergio Leone and Akira Kurosawa. Batman throws his little Batarangs and not Shuriken, and instead of criticising Spanish imperialism, Bruce Wayne works more like, hmm, a little bit like Lavender AI of the Israeli government: with magical ability to DIRECT "righteous" justice, in the mind of the inquisitor and all the little recruits to US militaries before they're old enough to drink. CHILD SOLDIERS, that is, turtle defense of the splinter factions.
So yeah, pretty toxic topic.
When they unveiled Thundercats Roar in 2018, I thought it looked horrible. Still do. I talked about it with people, but that's about it. I'm not one to get obsessed with things I don't like, so I just moved on. I smugly moved on assuming it would fail hard, and was right, like so many others. You can say it was a different show meant for a different audience, but that misses something big which was at the heart of the backlash. If the goal was a different show to attract a different audience, then there was no reason to use an existing property other than not wanting to actually create something new. They used Thundercats assuming that a decent chunk of the existing fan base, however small, would be a built-in audience upon which to build. They wanted the boost from the name value. However, they did not account for the existing fans having no interest in a change of tone and Sunday comic-strip visual style, even though that was pretty obvious outside of their industry bubble. That's the nature of taking an existing concept and changing it drastically. I'm also not aware of any of the online backlash to Roar in any way preventing the "new audience" it wanted from finding or enjoying it since that audience wouldn't really know or care about that. I also disagree, though this is only speculation, that had Roar been successful, we would have seen a revival of the property as an action-adventure show too. It's possible, but it's also just as possible it would have made the property permanently into a zany gag show, especially since that would be far easier to make since the writing would be less important and....that art style. Yes, some of the reaction was over the top. There's always going to be some of that, but plenty of level-headed people had the same reaction to the unveiling of the show. The problem was the show.
Wow this whole episode felt like that episode of the Simpsons where Kent Brockman says, "Now, at the risk of being unpopular, this reporter places the blame for all of this squarely on YOU, the viewers."
You hit the nail on the head.
I mean, I didn't take it that way but then again I'm not a thin skinned loser getting mad at cartoons on the internet.
@@ImpalerVladTepesWe found Dan alt account.
100% They knew the fans, the people that grew up with the show, were steamed at this goofball take on Thunder Cats and doubled down with an episode attacking audience? Yeah, that always works out!
I have no nostalgia for the original cartoon, I didn't watch the 2011 reboot, but i can say why the Thundercats Roar are a bad product. It's not because they make fun of an '80s kids show, it's because they are not funny: the jokes in all this kind of childish animation (and apparently many comedies today) is always based on a limited number of cliche, a fast pace that gets mistaken for comedic timing and never, absolutely never counting on actual jokes. It's dumbing down the quality of the entertainment.
One can try and defend Teen Titans Go and Thundercats Roar all day long, in the end the truth is that they are decadent, poor quality entertainment even for kids, because they are so dumbed down that pose no challenge, and without challenge there's no growth. In other words, just crap.
There's a difference between saying that people shouldn't be whining pretending that the use of a corporate brand offends them (which is right of course), and pretending that all products are worth the same. Some things are just decadent crap, even if there's someone who likes them.
Not with you on this one Dan. The premise of Thundercats begins with the near extinction of an entire race, survivors settling on a new planet...and continually battling a demonic enemy trying to kill them. The original series was semi-serialized, with a coherent story as it went. The animation and artistry was among the best in western animation at the time, and the stories always had a certain heft.
Fart jokes were the worst treatment this show could have received. The art style just made it painful. My then 9 year old couldn't stand more than half of the first episode. Remind me who the target audience was?
I hated the OG thundercats growing up. I would watch literally anything else, even resorting to turning off the tv and going outside. That being said, I absolutely loved Roar...
Clearly It was made for me, and not you. Big deal!
Yeah, Dan fan-blaming in support of this crappy and long-canceled reboot is a weird hot take.
@@PoodlePuncher And yet the fans of the OG series/2011 series are blamed for the this series failing/being cancelled because they either didn't watch it (knowing it wasn't going to be for them, so avoiding it entirely) or gave a few eps a chance, and stopped watching because it really wasn't made for them.
What did the showrunners expect the fans to do - watch something they hated simply because the name 'Thundercats' was attached to it?
@@madamefluffy4788Maybe the Thundercats brand isn't as popular as they think it is
@@madamefluffy4788 To zip it like Mirage TMNT fans, maybe. Because the handful of them probably not even 2 million literally don't matter, especailly when the going rate you pay for streaming is like 30 cents an hour. That's what your attention is worth to YOU, but then you get paid by AdSense to host your hot takes on free anti-social media, and bring it to negative digits.
Damn Dan, you really want people to hate you here. I get you werent a thundercats fan, many people werent, but some of us were. And the original series wasnt a serious study of good and evil, but it was more serious than other cartoons at the time, and many of us apreciated it for that.
Lion-O wasnt just given the power, he had trials, and in many episodes, he defered to the wisdom of his elder partners. The third earth was a place devastated by previous wars, many of its inhabitants were the result of this.
The cats planet exploded, and they were refugees, they had to made alliances with other races on earth, thats how the Cats Lair got build.
This and many more elements, are important to what the Thundercats are, and changing that tone to a funny cartoon was meant to dislike thundercats fans.
Yes, the og cartoon was in the past, but either you appeal to those fans, or you try to get new ones; now, who was this meant for?
You cant call it a vocal minority, if there is no silent majority with opposing opinions. If no one watched this show, it was because the majority didnt like what they saw.
And no, people are not forced to "give an oportunity" to products that dont appeal to them , creators have to convince the public to watch their product.
"Oh but if people have watched this, maybe there be more thundercats products, maybe even a movie", yeah, thats bullshit Dan, what would have happened if people had watched this, is that there would be now spiderman spew, superman flooosh, power ranges piu piu and more things like that, because thats how hollywood works
Totally normal reaction by a sane person right here.
@@contempocomics Wow, such a well thought out and fundamented response.
Make sure you rest after this, so you won't faint from the effort
Dan - you liked the show. Good for you. Perhaps it is you who should accept that you hold the minority opinion and just let it go? Lectures from the creators didn't help - they just added more fuel to the dumpster fire.
Why does every single new comment to this video make the most valiant effort to not get that his sentiments were inherently aimed against the people having a fucking meltdown over a parody of Thundercats existing, yes there were genuine criticisms, and that TTG episode fucking sucked, but they were all mere droplets in a vast ocean of vitriol and grifters using it to promote the most insane shit for the sake of a culture war
Wow, coming out of the gate strong with being absolutely wrong in every way.
A bold move, Cotton. Lets see if it works out.
Sorry, Dan, gonna politely disagree with you on this one. As someone who has not seen just "maybe four or five episodes" but the entire series and owns the DVD box set, I can say beyond the shadow of a doubt that I'm glad this show wasn't produced. The art style *is* lazy, and overused. I get that they were aiming for a younger audience, but I watched the original as a child of that age and didn't need flashy, goofy, attention deficit fifteen minute bursts of slapstick to keep me watching. I was enthralled by the characters, their stories and the rich worldbuilding.
TC Roar was a cash grab for an audience that can't focus on anything for more than a few minutes and I'm glad it wasn't made. I would say the target audience agreed too, because that's all the execs care about - if it had played well with them, no amount of adults whining about it would've kept that show off the air. That being said, I'm glad we kids of the 80s get to see at least one of the things we cherish not be butchered by modern writers. Seethe at actual fans who disliked it all you want, you can be wrong once in a while too. ;)
Still thoroughly enjoy the majority of your content and continue to be a fan. :)
I think the big point you glossed over was there had only been two ThunderCats shows in over 30 years and people did actually want more of those or at the very least the second half/satisfying conclusion to the 2011 show before doing something new.
You compare to Transformers and TMNT which had numerous shows in the same time period with hardly any gaps and oftentimes multiple at the same time; so people didn't have time to constantly be nostalgic for the past (though some were and there's nothing wrong with that) or at least had more choices for the brand they loved.
ThunderCats is clearly a smaller property in comparison to them and while popular in its own right; people had waited nearly 10 years since the sad premature cancellation of its last show for a variety of reasons. So, when they saw the teaser for Roar, you can't blame people for being massively disappointed. If Roar truly was the great show you thought; it would have overcome that "vocal online minority" with great success or perhaps find its audience later on. Living here in the future; we can see that did not happen ;)
If, IF, you are truly modern audience, you want depressing anime coloring, not vibrant lowest of the low, effort dog💩. This is the reason the 2011 show failed, new audiences that liked it were not enough. What true og fans wanted is/was the OG show in pristine 1080p transfer and a continuation from the og people that may still be around if they have stuff in their mind, with the same character designs, muscles, shadows, detailed drawings of explosions, that stuff.
@@Jucelegario
I mean the problem was the 2011 version was hella expensive. So what did they do they turned around and did roar instead and it was the exact opposite problem it was an insanely cheap-looking show that pissed off everyone besides the fans of that art style (of which there are few or at least far fewer than most people claim) but even those people didn't want thundercats in that style. The most recent one was literally a product looking for a market.
A continuation of the original thundercats or at least the 2011 would have been much more well received.
@@JohnDoe-wq5eu the 2011 version's main problem was the depressing color grading and is ridiculous to me that standardized, software corrected, digital drawings, are more expensive than back in the day, hand drawn cells. One have to be either too $tuxxd or too evil to green lit something like the Cal Arts dog💩 and I believe is the later.
Mind you there was no audience for the 2011 reboot, that's why it got cancelled, nobody was watching.
@@JohnDoe-wq5eu The other thing was no one was really buying the toys that were released to coincide with the 2011 series.
“John K.? Who is that guy”
1 Google search later:
“John K.? I hate that guy”
Is Secret Galaxay trying to convince us, or themselves, that this show wasn't awful?
SG seems to be doing that or they have a tank of copium and are inhaling.
I'll agree with the video's statement that the creators and writers of the show shouldn't be threatened or treated harshly, but I won't agree with the opinion of Roar being good. Again personal opinions may vary, offer not valid outside of participating stores, etc.
15:43 "If Thundercats Roar was even a mild hit it could have..." but it wasn't and that needs to be the main point, not could haves, not possibly, not any other optimistic projection that Roar was a potential save for the Thundercats IP.
It sucked, Secret Galaxy, the marketplace has spoken, move on.
I'm not saying there weren't supporters but they didn't put enough money or their own "fanaticism" to show the company that this show was worth saving.
If the Secret Galaxy channel enjoyed it, more power to them, sit there and wait for the inevitable streaming release or whatever Blue Ray cheap disc they get some day. Meanwhile others who liked the old Thundercats shows? They can find them, in the marketplace, because they were successful.
They're trying to convince us that outright hatred of a cartoon that didn't appeal to us is not a reasonable reaction. They're correct. People don't have to like Roar, but it's just a cartoon. Pitching fits online, directing vitriol and harassment at the makers, and then playing victim when those makers clap back? Those are the reactions of a child.
@@Atlas3060I also agree with you
Gotta admit, it's doing wonders to drive "engagement" to feed the Almighty Algorithm.
I think he's just saying that toxic fans shouldn't be toxic, because they end up drowning out any genuine criticisms and cuz he clearly thought Roar wasn't anywhere near as bad as they said, so sure he's saying it wasn't awful, but that's not the point of the video
Did someone on the writing team use to work on the show? I can't wait to see how many other failed reboots will be defended in this style of sucking up to multibillion dollar corporations.
a, someone was called out as "Fan"
please, act age appropriate and touch some grass
It seemed quite of a late defense of Roar … most of people by now had thankfully forgotten that silly thing.
They should have just made a new show. By using an IP that already has a fanbase it was insulting to the fanbase. Just make something new if you're not going to truly honor something that already exists.
Having a go at fans being blinded by nostalgia when your channel is nothing but nostalgia is a bold strategy
This was my main thought here. Bizarre that a channel all about covering old properties suddenly gets angrily defensive about THIS show, of all things. Roar isn't even an old enough show to be nostalgic about, I have no idea why they've made this episode.
will give Mighty Orbots goodpoints for being "a show first and no a toyline", but even if Thundercats started development the same way, he will just see it as a toy commercial like all the others.
More than anything, this episode felt like a critique of the disgusting behavior displayed by a toxic, but vocal, minority whenever someone tries to do anything new with an old intellectual property. A lot of the time the stuff turns out to be bad, or not the same, but that doesn't excuse these so called "fans" from harassing people to the extent that they do. For example, I hate that in the new Star Wars films Ray became a jedi knight in a few hours, with no instruction, but I didn't go online and harass someone for it. I just didn't bother watching the 3rd movie. What Dan said is that a lot of the time these trolls go online and post abuse and arguments that don't hold any water--like how the "calarts style" criticism has no basis in fact.
If fans want more of the stuff they like. They need to allow for other versions of it to be moderately successful, and not to try to destroy it. They can choose not to watch it. If they have to, they can post a well-thought out criticism. Then let some people actually enjoy it. Or trolls can torpedo anything different from what _THEY_ want, and they can accept their favorite thing is truly dead when no one ever dares to touch it again.
Do you.... Think he just praises every product he talks about in these vids? If anything he looks at a lot of them with cynicism, this is just the only one where he decided to give an actual take on the insane backlash
Thundercats Roar didn't just commit the crime of being bad. It did not get targeted solely because old fans are too precious about the IP. People involved directly with the creation of Roar attacked fans and disrespected some of the people involved in the original cartoon, including but not limited to directly joking about the death of one of the OG voice actors.
Fans cop a lot of shit about acting fanatical, and some of it is deserved, but the behavior of the so-called professionals involved in this was, in a word, repugnant.
Dan is way out of bounds in this video, pooling rational critical opinions together with the unhinged fringe that exist for nearly any subject on the internet --- and then explaining to us that it is ok to have a negative opinion if we express it reasonably. The vast majority of people did express themselves reasonably... They didn't watch it, or care about its existence.
The fact Secret Galaxy paid no attention to the Earl Hyman matter just shows they're one-sided bias about the entire endeavor.
It's insulting TBH.
If not liking a show nor even giving it a chance based on the toxic nature of the creative team means we deserve an 18 and a half minute lecture, I'm certainly in the wrong place.
This, Dan totally failed to address the attack to the fans, you know, the foundation of your whole franchise.
Yeah, I usually fall on Dan's side with most things but not with this.
Man this video missed on every beat, the hell happened here. This show was an abomination and he blames fans for the show not succeeding? Unreal
I think downvoting a trailer to oblivion because a show looks terrible is a very reasonable reaction.
16:47 "Action sequences to rival every other cartoon that has ever been made"
Dude have you ever even SEEN any other action cartoon???? Roar Is hot garbage are you on drugs perhaps?
It's a weird time we live in. Powers That Be want old fans to like their new take on things they love while simultaneously making fun of both said properties and said fans. And then they complain when that specific formula doesn't work out.
The video mentions that Transformers and TMNT are still alive because they get chances to reinvent themselves. However, even with the extremes they've gone to, neither franchise has a "ThunderCats Roar" in their camp.
Maybe if ThunderCats got a reboot in the style of the new comic that was mentioned in the video, instead of a "made to be shared in social media" show, things would've gone differently…
Perhaps WB should release this masterpiece to stream and hard-copy sales if the fandom is so overwhelmingly supportive as implied here. After all, if the only set back was the (unjustified) critique of a rabidly vocal minority, surely there must be plenty of meat on the bone for WB to harvest at market. Being a T-cats super fan myself, I would love another opportunity to reacquaint myself to its euphonious charms. Perhaps I had the sound too low during my first encounter with this dreck. Let’s all band together to BRING BACK ROAR, Morbius-style!
For real. If the show was so popular and beloved then how come a "vocal minority" could do any damage? It's not like their not-watching the show would damage their supposedly massive view numbers and toy sales.
Thundercats 2011 was a gem and they follow with this $#¡T?!?
Roar was garbage, man.
15:57 The problem with that analogy is that TMNT and Transformers have never really left the public eye since their debut: like you yourself said, those series got movies and comics and games that kept them relevant. Once the original ThunderCats went off the air, it was pretty much dead until the 2011 series, and that got killed off before it could really get going. It's really not a fair comparison.
Transformers and Ninja Turtles are pop culture icons, recognizable even to people who have never even watched the shows/movies or read the comics simply because they've been referenced and parodied so often. ThunderCats is lucky to get acknowledged at all.
I don't blame the fans for being upset or lashing out. They waited 30+ years to get more content, it gets cut short due to low toy sales, and then, less than a decade later, WB announces a new series that has been more-or-less "kiddified," which just screams "All we care about is toy sales."
Transformers as a franchise has had multiple instances where it almost died off in the eye of the public. The G2 reboot in the 90s almost killed them off until Beast Wars came around--and even then, Beast Wars was just a comparative blip. Beast Machines, RiD2001, and the Unicron Trilogy *existed*, but they were far from culturally relevant. Transformers effectively was underground "nerd crap" until the Bayverse movies came out. Those movies are the only reason why Transformers has any modern relevance.
Without the Bayverse movies, Transformers would be in the same place Thundercats is now: the thing you trot out in a Family Guy episode where someone says "Hey nerds, remember this weird thing from the 80s?"
@@Levitz9 Transformers might not have been mainstream until 2007, *but it was still getting media and merchandise for the entirety of the downtime.* Thundercats had NOTHING. "Almost died off" is not the same thing as "DEAD."
Besides, most franchises like these were considered "nerd crap" until those nerds grew up and entered the Hollywood workforce.
WB only cares about toy sales? Big shock
@@TheEmeraldWeirdospace ghost coast to coast is the one exception to everything, something that had it's fans, but then nothing was done with it until some guys who grew up with it decided to make a parody that many people grew to love, it's obviously a gamble, but it's not impossible, I truly believe the only ones suffering with Roar were 2011 fans, had that series not existed, roar wouldn't have as negative of a stigma
@@tino9117 The fallacy with that argument is that if the 2011 series never existed, then Roar probably wouldn't have been made, either.
I'm just amazed how animation has devolved and gotten uglier over the years. Thundercats Roar was just a symptom of a horrible trend.
OP seems really mad a turd was successfully flushed
I love how any time some one does not like something they are irrational or foaming at the mouth. Considering that Thundercat's roar tanked and was canceled even this younger modern day audience did not like it. The show was garbage which is why it did not last. I hate this idea that people must just shut up and consume any garbage the entertainment industry produces these days.
Forever misunderstanding
I mean the market spoke clearly. People could have said whatever they wanted but if the kids wanted it or were watching it it wouldn't have mattered what anyone else said. But they very clearly rejected it just like the other fans. Even people that didn't know what thundercats was looked at that show and we're disgusted by it. And even the people that "kinda" liked it I just don't think could have held up the entire show anyway.
The show was doomed from the get-go, and the fact that WB has completely buried it tells me they knew exactly what the reaction was.
I need to say a couple of things here.
1) Do you know who was a big fan of Batman? Joel Schumacher. Do you know who wasn't? Tim Burton. Now which one of those did two good Batman movies and which one did two bad ones? Being a fan of a property doesn't guarantee you're going to do a good job with it because being a fan is not a skill.
2) It's also curious how apparently, according to you, being a fan is OK when they're offering praise to this show but it's a bad thing when they're not. I'm not gonna lie: I don't like the tone of this video. I've seen this sort of thing many times before (though not in this channel that I remember), where someone disagrees with someone else's opinion and rather than respecting it they feel the need to invalidate it. If your first thought is "everyone who didn't like this series hates fun, it's not really a fan and doesn't have an actual personality" then maybe reevaluate your own opinion and consider people might have entirely legitimate reasons not to like it instead of being a massive prick about it all while pretending you're the only voice of reason.
In Joel Schumacher's defense, WB kind of forced him to make Batman Forever and Batman & Robin they way he did due to parents complaining about WB selling toys based off of the rather dark Batman and Batman Returns. Schumacher actually wanted to continue the tone Burton set up, but WB's executives basically said, "No, you need to make a toy commercial."
@@TheEmeraldWeirdo I mean, sure, but even he himself ended up accepting the blame, claiming that as a director he should have found a balance, which he didn't. After all, all directors have to work under studio demands, and you need to be skilled to release a good movie regardless of it.
I'm just going to say it. Joel Schumacher made one bad batman movie. Batman Forever is great.
It’s like he’s auditioning for some other job that also like to degrade fans of original properties.
16:00 - Yes, Dan, but those franchises never put out a series that not only looked like it was mocking the original, but *did* mock it! (Pssst! Thundercats Roar mocked the original two series.)
Finger wagging and fan blaming is one of the things that made fans hate the show.
This show deserves every ounce of vitriol it got.
Wow lost me in the first5 seconds.
My daughter loves teen titans go.. I loved it too. She couldn’t even stand to watch the first episode of Roar . She hated it.
Damn, I wonder if it says more about you two than the actual product
@@tino9117 that it didn’t resonate with its target audience or people outside of it?
I mean the fact it failed should tell you that 🤷🏻♂️
Does "fun" mean "cheap and disrespectful" now? When did this happen?
*EDIT:* "I've only seen 4 episodes of the original series, and I don't even like the ones I've seen." Oh. That makes more sense now. Thanks for the input.
I never realized thundercats was rankin and bass thats super interesting!!! I loved the last unicorn and hobbit movies as a kid. I always wanted to know more about mumras mythology as a kid.
Thundercats Roar was an intersection of every bad idea in one show.
I look forward to seeing your video on the new Good Times animated series on Netflix.
I'm sure Velma is a masterpiece.
This episode felt weirdly combative. Did y'all have friends/family on the production staff or something?
I loved the original show and liked the 2011 show alot. I couldn't bring myself to watch Thundercats Roar... because it's not Thundercats.
Definitely no bias in this one, no sir lol
Yes. I saw the dislike ration and thought that maybe it was due to the dislike of the subject itself. Starting watching the video and left it at a certain point after finding out. Don´get the reasoning behind this video then.
I really wish that this video talked more about the show itself and let people make up their own minds about wether or not it would be worth revisiting than just 18 minutes of blaming the "fans".
Very soapboxy on this one. Idk if I’m biased because I disagree or what.
This was almost like a weird propaganda piece...if i dare..... fake news.
This episode is a big fat L
@TheMaskedheel oh you're funny
Honestly he's not concerned with you revisiting it or not, it's already cancelled and not coming back, this episode is more concerned with being a commentary on not just Thundercats but really all shows/movies/games/comics with tons of new iterations made to appeal to the people of those eras that have fanbases who get this wild over some stuff and cause the controversy is kind of the most notable thing about it, he says he likes it a good deal, but really it's a pretty basic gag show all things considered
I gave it a fair shot. I watched about half an episode. The art wasn't the problem. Bad writing was.
How toXiC of you!
I doubt the art Helped, going by the clips, even if you had nothing against the broader style, it was a particularly bad example.
For the record, Dan's lambasting of "fans" sure sounds a lot like the all too common mantra coming from entertainment media these days. "People don't like a show and voice criticism are either too stupid or too *insert media buzz word here*-ist and should just not watch" yet, when the folks don't watch they wonder why no one watched. You can't be pissed when the audience doesn't like a product and votes with their wallets. If the show was so great then it would have found an audience. I appreciate his point of view, I just absolutely disagree with him.
Yeah. Remember when another Dan defended the 2016 Ghostbusters by saying the people who didn’t like it were KKK members.
Studio: If you don't like our show, then don't watch it!
Audience: Oh, okay.
Studio: Hey! Why isn't anyone watching our show?! >:(
@@TheEmeraldWeirdo The Charlies Angels reboot, the new Doctor from Doctor Who, and Bros movie. Oddly enough all of them said this isn't for straight men, and ALL OF THEM complained that no straight men watched their movies due to misogyny.
I think he's got a point though. Fans ruin a lot of shit. I love to see legitimate criticism about things I enjoy because it offers a different perspective but when every other comment is like "Where did Rogue's ass go?" It makes me wonder if people ARE too stupid for some of these shows.
@@alexsanchez7076 I agree, for the most part, but I also think that those are a vocal minority and even if everyone who wondered where Rogue's ass went watched the show it wouldn't move the needle that much. Its an excuse for poor writing and execution. You need normies more than hardcore fans to be successful, but angering the folks who are fans and creating bad word of mouth doesn't help, either. I do think that fans really can't ruin anything, though. If it is good enough to stand on its own merits, no matter what it may be, it will. I mean, nothing could have saved the Rings of Power show.
My wife is a normie and also way younger than I am, so she knew of Thundercats but never actually watched it. Then when they released the intro of Roar I showed her he original 80s intro and she said "that's pretty cool and awesome". Then I showed her scenes from the 2011 show and she didn't quite like it, but agreed that it was pretty well made. Then I showed her the intro of Roar, and I regret not having recorded her reaction. She was in shock, and said "is this a joke?! Seems like a joke! Like mockery!"
Yeah that's how it felt like to me, when I watched promotional Videos of Thunderchats Roar: like mockery.
That's cause it is! Literally a parody show!
@@tino9117 A parody show can be good. Teen Titans GO! is a grand example. I'm not a fan of it, but my nieces loved it and when I watched it with them it was pretty well made. Thundercats Roar wasn't well made, and it didn't respect the viewers or the market. You can make a parody, but if you antagonize the viewers or the market, you pay the price.
You said "it's a parody" as if that means something. Sure it's a parody, but is it good? Is it good as a show, or as a parody?
Are the creators in touch with what the people and the market want?
If Thundercats doesn't get another chance on the screen the fault lies not within the fans that complained, but within writers that made a wildly despised adaptation.
"The client is always right" is a bullcrap sentence that will never d!e soon enough, "the client is always right ABOUT WHAT THEY LIKE" should be treated as the holy gospel: if I enter a vegan restaurant and ask for beef I am a Karen and should be treated as one, if I enter a restaurant and ask for a beef only to be served a piece of cardboard painted as a beef, the restaurant is garbage and deserves to lose clients.
Teen Titans GO already had overwhelmingly negative reviews and, knowing this, they choose to apply the same treatment to Thundercats.
The harassment was unjustified, as it always is, the failure is absolutely deserved.
It the brand dies it's 100% fault of the producers of Roar.
No
THANK YOU!
You have no idea how happy it makes me to see someone else agree with just how utterly stupid the "customer is always right" slogan is.
It was NEVER to be used as they attempt to use it today. Your correct. Customers only know what THEY WANT. That does not entitle them to dictate how a business is ran.
That all said, ThunderCats has a very long history and dedicated fan base. So long as the source material is respected, then those old customers will accept the new menu.
However; if you toss out everything respectful about the franchise and purposely alienate those loyal fans, then no one is gonna look at your menu, let alone order the slop from it. And that's exactly what TCR was. Slop.
This comment is painfully misguided, the "quality" of an iteration means nothing to the executives that put their money into it, YES the fans complaining was in fact the reason, and YES, a lot of the complaining was mostly harassment and bad faith, perhaps some were more genuine in their critique, or it just wasn't for them, I think alot of the people making it look worse than it actually was may have deterred people away from giving it a fair chance, the backlash lead to it getting delayed and quietly released, the delay and quiet release led to low viewership, low viewership lead to them just not wanting to bother with it
Lmfao
@@tino9117 Talk about misguided.
Even by your standards, it's still 100% the creator's fault for its failure: guess whose responsability it is to advertise a product and make it look appealing?
Hint: it's not the audience's.
You create a product the fan don't want, you don't make it appealing, you don't advertise it... you fail!
It's the creator's job to produce, it's the audience HOBBY to consume.
The audience has no duty to fill the gaps for the creator's shortcomings.
Thundercats Roar, a big steaming pile of poo in the kitty litter box on the legacy of Thundercats.
Amazing that someone actually thought this Thundercats show was a GOOD idea.
The only way to explain the fan outrage with Thundercats is with the Godzilla franchise and how Godzilla 98 was mishandled....It's just cringe.
The difference is, Godzilla 98 was headed up by a hack director that didn't even like Godzilla, and thus, didn't understand the franchise. Godzilla IS supposed to be slow, large, and lumbering. There's existential dread with Godzilla slowly stomping his way down a city, you know you can't escape him. So the director just made the same crappy disaster movie he usually makes and threw Simpsons voice actor cameos in it. Frustratingly, there were several American Godzilla films made by actual Godzilla fans that got turned down for THIS. Now, I have no doubt the Thundercats Roar showrunners were Thundercats fans, just... it's THAT kind of fan that makes questionable fan art/fiction. Think bad fat fetish art or awful crossover. Though, to be fair to 98 Godzilla, at least we got a shockingly GOOD cartoon series out of it.
I guess you never heard of the 70s Godzilla cartoon with Godzookie?
@@JohnKelly2 It's just odd the GOOD Godzilla movies got a shite cartoon and the shite Godzilla movie got a GOOD cartoon.
@@mightyfilm Godzilla 98 is a perfectly watchable action flick if you don't know or care about the history of Godzilla. I quite enjoyed it when it came out and it's better than The Lake, the 2022 Thai Kaiju movie I just watched.
Thundercats Roar is unwatchable by anyone with a double digit iq.
@@thedirectorschair1054 Godzilla 98 reminds me of the Gene Deitch Tom and Jerry cartoons. He was roped into it, he hated the characters, and he wasn't in his element. Godzilla 98 is a perfectly fine disaster film with a giant monster as the disaster, but it just isn't a good Godzilla movie because it doesn't understand Godzilla.
As for Thundercats Roar, the show's problem is the sense of humor. It's all Randumz lol stuff, and not even mocking the franchise. You CAN certainly have a comedy/parody version of a more action oriented movie/series. Lego versions of anything, Marvel Super Hero Squad, even Mighty Mouse: the New Adventures. You just have to have GOOD comedy. I spent more time laughing AT Thundercats Roar than with it. The show couldn't stop being a hyper overactive headache for even a second, so nothing landed. Not the characters, not the "humor" and certainly not any sense of plot. It truly was the equivalent of an annoying 4 year old when a camera is on them
Your points are all missing the reason of why cartoons like Gravity Falls (which I love as well as my kids) succeeded and TC Roar failed. Every single Transformers reboot has been good by respecting the original IP and equsling or improving on the original series. If the TC Roar already knew they couldn't make it equal or better, they should have done their own thing inspired by TC, but not TC. Here's where your points fall flat. I did watch with my kids and before I could open my mouth they said what is this crap? Then I showed them the TC original series and they were even more shocked and asked why.
Multiple shows using the supposed CalArts style have succeeded, but why? They made their own IP. Things like Velma, Roar, He-Man etc are an oxymoron. They are trying to ride nostalgia, but reject the things that made the original series so popular, while ignoring the original fans.
When did He-Man do that?
@@Convoy00X
There is/was a He-Man show done in the more "Obvioulsy CGI style".
@@Convoy00X
*_He-Man and the Masters of the Universe (2021 TV series)_*
@hellacoorinna9995 I often forget about that one, despite having watched it and owning some of the toys. I'm not sure it did everything described above...
@@Convoy00X
Hey man, I'm just the messenger.
Original Thundercats is a series I loved from a distance then engaged with and realised...wow that intro is advertising a much better show than you get XD
Thundercats Roar is actually worse than Magic Spoon
And that’s saying something
bruh Magic Spoon's honey nut is actually hella good
@@iwasakikoji6969 It's $10 for 7 oz box
@@daveassanowicz186 I got it for $7. Yeah, it's overpriced, but at least it tastes good unlike some other keto cereals that taste like dust, peas and butthole sweat.
I’ve tried most of the flavors, and have the bowls and spoons. I have to say it’s not worth it. Overpriced, the bag is filled only a quarter of the way. The taste is medicinal. And the texture is so hard it rips your gums apart more than Capn’ Crunch could ever do. Mostly they end up going stale on me… sad because I really wanted to love them and gave it MULTIPLE tries.
Hahaha. I guess this is your "jump the shark" moment. This is a nostalgia RUclips channel. I'm sorry, you cannot mock fans of a franchise because they are obsessed with nostalgia.
I watched the original when it first came out. I bought the DVD sets when they came out. I loved it, even with it's flaws. I also loved the 2011 version and was pissed when it got canceled. I personally don't care what this version was about because it looks horrible. I don't care what school these people went to. The characters look terrible and you can't change my mind. No matter how much you think people who don't like it are meanies. You can like it, and that's fine; plus some people went overboard, and was stupid. I still think this was a terrible idea the moment I first saw it. I'm glad it failed.
After the unjustified cancelation of the 2011 Thundercats and replacing it with Roar, the fans have every right to be pissed.
Exactly my point. The roar series were not THAT BAD but bringing that kind of reboot instead of a continuation of that version was a BIG mistake
I think this point gets swept under the rug a lot. It's not just that we were reacting to a bad show aimed at a more general demographic, it was that we had our LOTR-style epic ripped away and were instead given THIS. And when we didn't immediately like it, we were insulted for essentially being spoiled children. Whether that is truthful may be up to the individual person's feelings but taking that approach with PR almost never works.
"Replaced"? It was 9 years later! That's not replacing Thundercats 2011, that's just making a new show after the previous one failed!
Facts!!!
It seemed like Warner Brothers and Cartoon Network had way too many wars with fans instead hiring someone to find a way to bring skeptical fans on board. Instead of a charm offense for Thunder Cats Roar it was wage a battle that only reinforced negative feelings.
this is the first time in all th eyears I've been watching this channel that I have ever thumb downed a Secret Galaxy video, tis a momentous occasion I shall never forget. P.S hey, it's still not as bad as teen tians go! this isnt a video this is just a ranting salty hodgepodge lol
I'm not really detecting any arguments in favor of this show, outside of telling people to calm down.
"MODERN AUDIENCES"
Weird direction on this episode. It just seemed like the writing on this episode devolved into the same kind of discourse you were critiquing. 🤷♂
Yeah, it's hard to say if it was self aware of just hypercritical.
Beginning to wonder if this is their most downvoted video ever (got a extension that lets me see them: 4.6 up vs 3.3 down, as of this post)