I’m constantly walking that line between the classic rock tones and style that inspired me as a young man that was in awe of the guitar heroes that informed my playing, while constantly searching for my own tones and style of playing. It’s a constant search and keeps it fresh for me and always challenges me to get better at my own thing. It’s tough sometimes.
Hi, days after watching it, this video came to my mind again and after some reflection, I felt like I wanted to add something to the argument as well. I still think that not turning you backs to modern equipment when it comes to bass gear is an essential aspect of carrying human music into the future. But I also don’t think that we should totally abandon vintage gear. What I’m getting to is that we can still innovate by blending modern gear and techniques with vintage stuff. After all, most innovations are the results of these types of blending/ mixing and matching. Cheers, and I hope that you are having a great day 💜
I think maybe most of the best bass tones have already been discovered. Like who's the last bass player you thought "Oh, fuck... that person has something no one else ever has"? I watch and listen to a ridiculous amount of music and it's been since maybe Royal Blood? Now over 10 years old and most of us have copped the Darkglass tone from that singular band if we wanted to. IDK, I do my very very best to pull off that 70s SVT+810 sound without the weight and I still have the SVT. Chased that tone for years, got it... Still haven't found anything better.
Thanks for watching.....this response is more of an observation than having any solutions......I haven't heard any blues guitarists using Helix effects or guitar synths to evolve blues further: I think that's a quick off the top of my head example
I agree AI has no creativity. Drum machines have been around for 40 or more years and drummers are still in bands. However, keyboards have replaced pianos.
I dunno. When I'm playing old covers, I try to replicate the sound of the recording. Or when I play originals that are written in a certain style, say a 1980's rock style, I use equipment that is period correct if I have it. BUT, I have modern equipment, Sansamp stuff, direct signal, that I use mostly. I don't see it as leaving the past behind, but more of options. I imagine it's like having a Tesla next to your muscle car in the garage. Why limit your options? The AI thing is an issue for recorded music, but if people want to see live music that's a different story. Great vid Tony, keep em going!
I remember when Boston came out and hearing this new exciting sound ( I was almost a teen), then Fleetwood Mac "Rumors" and I thought it was new and exciting. Then, a few years later, I heard The Cars and thought "That's new and exciting" and this continued well into the 80s and part of the 90s.....but, since then, those "Gee, this sounds new and exciting" moments have gotten few and far between...however, there's been more and more Greta Van Fleet moments of "this sounds great but been there/done that" moments over the past few decades than "Gee, this sounds new and exciting" moments for me.....there's still great new bands going places out there but they are much much fewer in number than the days of yore...tell the kids and Momager "Hi" from me ❤
The kids say "Hi Rib!!!!!!" Jonathan loves the cars also. I thought Missing Persons sounded new also. Kids are practicing hard, we've got a lot of gigs coming up! Check out Jonathan playing the Star Spangled Banner, he's got nerves of steel!
The past just had that warmth and color to it, while the modern sound is more cold and sterile. I mean, think about it: instead of flatwounds, we use roundwounds now and instead of valve amps, we use transistor amps. Now, are these "advancements" objectively better? Roundwounds improve the dynamic range and sustain, but create fret noise and the dynamic range leads to clashing frequencies with the guitarist. Transistor amps are light and tiny but don't sound as good as valve amps. Music evolution since the 50's was always: take a step forward and then take a step backward right after that! And if we'd really go with the times, we all would be making electronic music by now, because that is the natural step of evolution. All that being said, i have to agree that some people go too far and see James Jamerson as some sort of a god; a role model for how a bass should sound. While in reality he probably didn't cared much about his sound at all and just used what was common for that time.
Thanks for watching and great to hear from you again: in a previous comment, I stated I don't have any solutions-- its just an observation.....but an off-the-top-of-me-bald-head example would be a guitarist using Helix effects and guitar synths to create a new modern never been done before blues iteration/evolution....just like when the blues went electric in the 1950s: the purists will hate it...thats how ya know its evolving lol
There are a lot of forward-thinking musicians. Maybe not soundwise but you find more and more music where musicians from all around the world create new music and yes, sounds. A good example is Playing for Change, and they are just scratching the surface.
@@Rib13Bass Sure, re-hash sucks, and I liked your point about Jamerson and The Kings using the most current tech to make the most current music for their current time but consider the violin. Now, the instrument has changed a bit over the years but is, essentially, the same thing, a pretty established instrument and design. And the finest players are given access to the finest, very old instruments (Stradivarius, Guarneri, etc.) In most cases, they don't even own them, but are given access to them for practice leading to performance. They also tend to use them for what is really a catalog repertoire. Now, our precious rock n roll entering into this type of "vibrant tradition" may seem a bit irksome for other reasons associated with the form, but it is a bit understandable. Vintage gear lust and stodgy old repetitious music can be grating (and I don't feel that Classical really falls into that, but some may see it in that limited perspective) but discarding the old is also a disservice to it as much as flogging its corpse. Basically, there is a way to honor both goals of respecting and re-invigorating old music and old instruments and forging ahead with new music and new tech innovations. We move at such a furious clip now that 50 years is considered "a long time" and that's actually pretty ludicrous, even for our precious Rock n Roll. Anyway, I enjoyed your points and your editing.
@@mykhedelic6471 Thank you very much for the excellent response. I was definitely targeting mainstream pop/rock music in my video, with classical being its own identity and culture not relevant to this video response and I probably should have stated that somewhere. To me, Classical music is the highest form of Western musical art that strives for perfection, especially in the subtleties and nuances. (BTW, Rachmaninoff Piano Concerto No. 2 op 18 is still my all time favorite classical piece lol)...on the other hand, Rock n Roll is the "Art of Imperfection": for the past 60+ years it has been the layman social media, its purpose for the layman musician to convey and communicate their ideas to the rest of the layperson world and I just feel that the guitar-driven combo is now just repeating itself ad nauseum. It doesnt mean that the music isnt good, its just that the messages (and especially the medium) have been stated previously over and over. Some people believe that everything that can be done with the guitar-combo has been done before - I refuse to believe that. I certainly believe that the bulk of guitar-combo low-hanging fruit has been well picked a long time ago...I dont think this means that all the fruit is gone; it may be higher in the tree but it takes effort to try and reach it
AI makes people think that they're smarter and more skilled than they actually are. I'm a programmer and I used to work for a company that had these young dolts who thought they could do anything that I could do, but use AI to come up with the code that they couldn't even make sense out of. AI isn't going to make you a better musician either. I won't be one bit surprised to see people use AI to "write" songs that they can't even begin to play live, just like these dolts who think AI is going to make them a programmer.
Interesting point and lots of merit to it but -AI may become extremely quick to learn new patterns. So it may get to the point where you have a couple of bands pioneering a new sound and AI flooding the market with more of it, instead of hundreds of humans' bands flooding the market with more of it as once was the case -This idea of perpetual innovation just does not work in my opinion. Humanity lived for thousands of years within communities that shared a relatively limited number of tunes. Looking at the west, (which I know best) with the development of the modern world, modern acoustic instruments, and modern sensibilities toward change, a music for the elites developed that had a tendency to evolve (classical music). But this music did evolve over the pace of decades. And even then it eventually came to a point where it was inaccessible for most people. In the 1900 with wealth spreading, tons of new instruments and sounds being invented through electronics, music development now disconnected from patronage as it had become part of the service industry (lucrative live music) at first and then consumer product (increasingly with recordings), there was a path of incredible development of popular musics. This was fed by a wealthy music industry which needed a new "sensation" every few months or less to keep money going. And had the marketing power to impose on people the idea that these new "sensations" were a big deal. But I believe this has been dying for a while. As a teenager in the early 2000s, now over 20 years ago, I already had a feeling that it was pointless. Mainstream music was sometimes using pyrotecnics to sound new but it was ultimately corny and mostly dull. And that was true even in the 80s. Granted, some songs were great but there was nothing in them that put them on a different levels compared to, say, old motown hits. Music did not evolve in a way in which a car that does more miles per litre of fuel is objectively better than one that does less. It was the old motown hits with new makeup. Niche music were interesting but I was mostly interested in music (niche or not) from before I was born. No need to navigate an increasingly huge ocean of new stuff to find the few pearls. The music industry may need constant innovation, but I was human the same way my parents were human, and probably very similarly to humans from hundreds of years ago who sang the same tunes for centuries. Most humans don't need music innovations. And even music geeks, as I was, may well be interested in the past more than in the future, as it is always the case with geeks
Thank you very much for the well thought out reply. I realize that my video is done in a way as presented as a solution, whereas it's more of an observation.....that being said, I pretty much agree on everything you stated. I do have a few comments on some points but I won't be able to reply until later this week: thanks for watching and standby lol
I thought the same thing when I watched Rick's video. AI will FORCE musicians to come up with something that hasn't been done yet. At least the best ones anyway. That's how art works.
Rock is dead if we give it rigid definition and gatekeep. I really enjoyed Olivia Rodrigo's "good 4 u," but when I referred to it as the best rock single of the year, guess who stepped in to explain that it wasnt "real rock music?" Yup! Rock musicians. Keep it up, Rib. 10/10 fricheks
Not sure where or why you would think that: I've responded to Rick before but it was easier to make a vid comment that he may look at than write long paragraphs that he probably wouldn't read ..... not everybody has ulterior click motives and its a sad state in the world that folks automatically assume the worst out of YT people instead of giving them the benefit of the doubt.....thanks for watching
Yes, but as soon as you evolve the music and it is out on the internet, AI will be able to replicate it. So, come up with a new type of music, AI could very possibly do it much better and quicker than you.
It still can't hurt for musicians to play in their present for their present. Music is one of the oldest forms of communication, and A.I. music doesn't communicate an idea - it only replicates it.....true, A.I. can learn and adapt quickly but that shouldn't give songwriters and original music acts a pass to be OK with complacency and not venture down roads less traveled
I’m constantly walking that line between the classic rock tones and style that inspired me as a young man that was in awe of the guitar heroes that informed my playing, while constantly searching for my own tones and style of playing. It’s a constant search and keeps it fresh for me and always challenges me to get better at my own thing. It’s tough sometimes.
Great take on the subject !
Always forward never backwards!
Hi, days after watching it, this video came to my mind again and after some reflection, I felt like I wanted to add something to the argument as well.
I still think that not turning you backs to modern equipment when it comes to bass gear is an essential aspect of carrying human music into the future. But I also don’t think that we should totally abandon vintage gear. What I’m getting to is that we can still innovate by blending modern gear and techniques with vintage stuff. After all, most innovations are the results of these types of blending/ mixing and matching.
Cheers, and I hope that you are having a great day 💜
@@yigitcengil2465 I agree with that.
Excellent point Rib 💜
Hey Rib, great points!
Love the video Spaz. Great perspective on how the greats in the past used whatever was modern in their day.
I think maybe most of the best bass tones have already been discovered. Like who's the last bass player you thought "Oh, fuck... that person has something no one else ever has"? I watch and listen to a ridiculous amount of music and it's been since maybe Royal Blood? Now over 10 years old and most of us have copped the Darkglass tone from that singular band if we wanted to. IDK, I do my very very best to pull off that 70s SVT+810 sound without the weight and I still have the SVT. Chased that tone for years, got it... Still haven't found anything better.
Thanks for watching.....this response is more of an observation than having any solutions......I haven't heard any blues guitarists using Helix effects or guitar synths to evolve blues further: I think that's a quick off the top of my head example
I agree AI has no creativity. Drum machines have been around for 40 or more years and drummers are still in bands. However, keyboards have replaced pianos.
I dunno. When I'm playing old covers, I try to replicate the sound of the recording. Or when I play originals that are written in a certain style, say a 1980's rock style, I use equipment that is period correct if I have it. BUT, I have modern equipment, Sansamp stuff, direct signal, that I use mostly. I don't see it as leaving the past behind, but more of options. I imagine it's like having a Tesla next to your muscle car in the garage. Why limit your options? The AI thing is an issue for recorded music, but if people want to see live music that's a different story. Great vid Tony, keep em going!
I remember when Boston came out and hearing this new exciting sound ( I was almost a teen), then Fleetwood Mac "Rumors" and I thought it was new and exciting. Then, a few years later, I heard The Cars and thought "That's new and exciting" and this continued well into the 80s and part of the 90s.....but, since then, those "Gee, this sounds new and exciting" moments have gotten few and far between...however, there's been more and more Greta Van Fleet moments of "this sounds great but been there/done that" moments over the past few decades than "Gee, this sounds new and exciting" moments for me.....there's still great new bands going places out there but they are much much fewer in number than the days of yore...tell the kids and Momager "Hi" from me ❤
The kids say "Hi Rib!!!!!!" Jonathan loves the cars also. I thought Missing Persons sounded new also. Kids are practicing hard, we've got a lot of gigs coming up! Check out Jonathan playing the Star Spangled Banner, he's got nerves of steel!
The past just had that warmth and color to it, while the modern sound is more cold and sterile. I mean, think about it: instead of flatwounds, we use roundwounds now and instead of valve amps, we use transistor amps. Now, are these "advancements" objectively better? Roundwounds improve the dynamic range and sustain, but create fret noise and the dynamic range leads to clashing frequencies with the guitarist. Transistor amps are light and tiny but don't sound as good as valve amps. Music evolution since the 50's was always: take a step forward and then take a step backward right after that! And if we'd really go with the times, we all would be making electronic music by now, because that is the natural step of evolution. All that being said, i have to agree that some people go too far and see James Jamerson as some sort of a god; a role model for how a bass should sound. While in reality he probably didn't cared much about his sound at all and just used what was common for that time.
Thanks for watching and great to hear from you again: in a previous comment, I stated I don't have any solutions-- its just an observation.....but an off-the-top-of-me-bald-head example would be a guitarist using Helix effects and guitar synths to create a new modern never been done before blues iteration/evolution....just like when the blues went electric in the 1950s: the purists will hate it...thats how ya know its evolving lol
There are a lot of forward-thinking musicians. Maybe not soundwise but you find more and more music where musicians from all around the world create new music and yes, sounds. A good example is Playing for Change, and they are just scratching the surface.
💯
But, the classical school...?
The video is more of a generalized blanket observation on pop/rock culture
@@Rib13Bass Sure, re-hash sucks, and I liked your point about Jamerson and The Kings using the most current tech to make the most current music for their current time but consider the violin. Now, the instrument has changed a bit over the years but is, essentially, the same thing, a pretty established instrument and design. And the finest players are given access to the finest, very old instruments (Stradivarius, Guarneri, etc.) In most cases, they don't even own them, but are given access to them for practice leading to performance. They also tend to use them for what is really a catalog repertoire. Now, our precious rock n roll entering into this type of "vibrant tradition" may seem a bit irksome for other reasons associated with the form, but it is a bit understandable. Vintage gear lust and stodgy old repetitious music can be grating (and I don't feel that Classical really falls into that, but some may see it in that limited perspective) but discarding the old is also a disservice to it as much as flogging its corpse. Basically, there is a way to honor both goals of respecting and re-invigorating old music and old instruments and forging ahead with new music and new tech innovations. We move at such a furious clip now that 50 years is considered "a long time" and that's actually pretty ludicrous, even for our precious Rock n Roll.
Anyway, I enjoyed your points and your editing.
@@mykhedelic6471 Thank you very much for the excellent response. I was definitely targeting mainstream pop/rock music in my video, with classical being its own identity and culture not relevant to this video response and I probably should have stated that somewhere. To me, Classical music is the highest form of Western musical art that strives for perfection, especially in the subtleties and nuances. (BTW, Rachmaninoff Piano Concerto No. 2 op 18 is still my all time favorite classical piece lol)...on the other hand, Rock n Roll is the "Art of Imperfection": for the past 60+ years it has been the layman social media, its purpose for the layman musician to convey and communicate their ideas to the rest of the layperson world and I just feel that the guitar-driven combo is now just repeating itself ad nauseum. It doesnt mean that the music isnt good, its just that the messages (and especially the medium) have been stated previously over and over. Some people believe that everything that can be done with the guitar-combo has been done before - I refuse to believe that. I certainly believe that the bulk of guitar-combo low-hanging fruit has been well picked a long time ago...I dont think this means that all the fruit is gone; it may be higher in the tree but it takes effort to try and reach it
Now some quality content, Maestro. I do like where this is going@ *takes huge bucket o'pop-corn and munches on it*
Lol
AI makes people think that they're smarter and more skilled than they actually are. I'm a programmer and I used to work for a company that had these young dolts who thought they could do anything that I could do, but use AI to come up with the code that they couldn't even make sense out of. AI isn't going to make you a better musician either. I won't be one bit surprised to see people use AI to "write" songs that they can't even begin to play live, just like these dolts who think AI is going to make them a programmer.
That's already happening
Yea-naaa, strange way to talk to me. 🙈🙉🙊
Interesting point and lots of merit to it but
-AI may become extremely quick to learn new patterns. So it may get to the point where you have a couple of bands pioneering a new sound and AI flooding the market with more of it, instead of hundreds of humans' bands flooding the market with more of it as once was the case
-This idea of perpetual innovation just does not work in my opinion. Humanity lived for thousands of years within communities that shared a relatively limited number of tunes. Looking at the west, (which I know best) with the development of the modern world, modern acoustic instruments, and modern sensibilities toward change, a music for the elites developed that had a tendency to evolve (classical music). But this music did evolve over the pace of decades. And even then it eventually came to a point where it was inaccessible for most people. In the 1900 with wealth spreading, tons of new instruments and sounds being invented through electronics, music development now disconnected from patronage as it had become part of the service industry (lucrative live music) at first and then consumer product (increasingly with recordings), there was a path of incredible development of popular musics.
This was fed by a wealthy music industry which needed a new "sensation" every few months or less to keep money going. And had the marketing power to impose on people the idea that these new "sensations" were a big deal.
But I believe this has been dying for a while. As a teenager in the early 2000s, now over 20 years ago, I already had a feeling that it was pointless. Mainstream music was sometimes using pyrotecnics to sound new but it was ultimately corny and mostly dull. And that was true even in the 80s. Granted, some songs were great but there was nothing in them that put them on a different levels compared to, say, old motown hits. Music did not evolve in a way in which a car that does more miles per litre of fuel is objectively better than one that does less. It was the old motown hits with new makeup.
Niche music were interesting but I was mostly interested in music (niche or not) from before I was born. No need to navigate an increasingly huge ocean of new stuff to find the few pearls. The music industry may need constant innovation, but I was human the same way my parents were human, and probably very similarly to humans from hundreds of years ago who sang the same tunes for centuries.
Most humans don't need music innovations. And even music geeks, as I was, may well be interested in the past more than in the future, as it is always the case with geeks
Thank you very much for the well thought out reply. I realize that my video is done in a way as presented as a solution, whereas it's more of an observation.....that being said, I pretty much agree on everything you stated. I do have a few comments on some points but I won't be able to reply until later this week: thanks for watching and standby lol
I thought the same thing when I watched Rick's video. AI will FORCE musicians to come up with something that hasn't been done yet. At least the best ones anyway. That's how art works.
Maybe spell “apocalypse” correctly before punching up.
Lol...well that's embarrassing.....thanks for making me aware....fixed
Rock is dead if we give it rigid definition and gatekeep. I really enjoyed Olivia Rodrigo's "good 4 u," but when I referred to it as the best rock single of the year, guess who stepped in to explain that it wasnt "real rock music?" Yup! Rock musicians.
Keep it up, Rib. 10/10 fricheks
50 Fricheks!
That has always happened with rock. In the '50s, the king of rock 'n' roll was Fats Domino. His music is largely forgotten by modern artists.
😂😂😂
Just some more unwarranted fear mongering to get clicks by Rick.
Not sure where or why you would think that: I've responded to Rick before but it was easier to make a vid comment that he may look at than write long paragraphs that he probably wouldn't read ..... not everybody has ulterior click motives and its a sad state in the world that folks automatically assume the worst out of YT people instead of giving them the benefit of the doubt.....thanks for watching
@@Rib13Bass granted, I could be mistaken ✌
Yes, but as soon as you evolve the music and it is out on the internet, AI will be able to replicate it. So, come up with a new type of music, AI could very possibly do it much better and quicker than you.
It still can't hurt for musicians to play in their present for their present. Music is one of the oldest forms of communication, and A.I. music doesn't communicate an idea - it only replicates it.....true, A.I. can learn and adapt quickly but that shouldn't give songwriters and original music acts a pass to be OK with complacency and not venture down roads less traveled