You know what's funny about this whole topic. If Gohan was a real person and these dumb mfs tell Gohan that Goku is a terrible dad, he would beat them the fuck up. Gohan states Goku is an Angel and we are debating that he's a bad dad c'mon bro
Saying he's using the source material but only sourcing the funimation dub and not idk the FUCKING MANGA is also hilarious. Also, Gohan went to Namek on his own accord he LITERALLY said "I'm not gonna sit around and let everyone fight for me, I have to go and make my dad proud" like bro what is he talking about
You also need to look at it from Goku's perspective ever since General Tao Getting Beaten to a bloody pulp was a regular occurrence for Him and His friends Why would he think Gohan would be traumatized when he had all his limp broken by the Demon F king or piccolo putting a hole in the chest during the tournament
"Goku didn't die in the Raditz fight because he wanted to save Gohan. He died because he wanted to save the earth. It's just utilitarianism." Some people try their damnest to sound smart when they have the silliest arguments.
Like you don't need to be a genius to get that. lol If Goku cared more about the Earth, he sure as shit wouldn't be letting Piccolo live and taken God's job, not that smartypants would know that. Or even let Krillin and Roshi help and potentially fodder themselves in the name of "saving the planet".
Yep, and besides, didn't Goku literally get the idea and resolve to even get up with broken ribs and shit, BECAUSE Raditz was about to kill Gohan? And didn't he literally head into that fight to save Gohan?
Ironically, TFS actually disagrees with Goku being a bad dad. They only did it for the jokes and actually regret the fact that so many people started taking it as fact.
@@keiviroque5666I wouldnt say its whole heartedely untrue either. Goku in z does make some horrible decisions as a father. But he is a good person and most above all he is one of the most SUPPORTIVE dads in db. However that doesnt absolve him of his blatant mistakes as a dad which is where him being a bad dad comes from. Id still take Goku over a straight up abusive one, and sure as hell over Vegeta for most of the series.
Craziest parts that I just started watching dragon Ball z and it just hit me that you're correct because they were quite literally on their toes when piccolo first showed up during the show and they were all ready to fight him. Meaning at that point they were still legitimate enemies but he set aside his differences to team up with him. Anyway, the guy who literally tried to kill him
Then he died and let chi chi in their house alone for 6 months without knowing where her 5 year old was even worse that the guy who tried to kill her husband multiple times is the one responsible for him, that's not good parenting, after Namek freeza is dead instead of coming home to his family he chose to train for a full year in another planet, chi chi has to feed herself and Gohan pay for his studies with her father money cause Goku in all of the series never got a job he could have literally opened a martial fight gym and support his family but he never did even Yamcha tried to play professional baseball to support himself. After the time skip chamber and "finding" his son true potential instead of talking to him about it he ignored his son nature no wonder Piccolo was pissed off, who sends a pacifist into a fight where he has to kill? There is more to talk about Goku but its not worth the rant.
all of the food and tuition was literally paid for by gokus tournament money what're you talking about bro chi chi only brings up money once the prize money or whatever money goku gives her runs out.@@glcsander
You guys fail to realize goku never went to FUCKING school. He not once was told that and he was raised without talking to anyone except a man that trained him TOO FIGHT, no wonder he thought HIS SON WITH HIS DNA would like the things he does.
its so crazy how people call goku a bad says piccolo a good dad like he didn’t make a six year old live alone in the woods and fight a literal dinosaur is so crazy
Toriyama, the writer of Dragon Ball says Goku is a bad dad. Sorry. Author says so. He then said he needed DBS to emphasize certain things about Goku because DBZ fans may of missed it
Goku is an Alien that was raised on martial arts and learning to always do the right thing. If Goku wasn't pure of heart, he wouldn't be able to ride the Nimbus. Chi Chi was the bad influence on Gohan for never letting him find his own path like she did with Goten. Expecting Goku to know what a good parent is given his childhood is hilarious and the dude is still better than 70% of fathers in America today. Dudes a superhero lol
According to Toriyama, Goku is a bad father because he is incapable of feeling certain parental emotions. Toriyama says Gohan and Chi-Chi to Goku is the same as Krillin to him
You are using childhood as an excuse? Toriyama already said Goku has no capability of fatherly or husband love. Chi Chi, Gohan are the same to him as Krillin and Yamcha. If Goku finds something fun he will leave again. Toriyama himself said that.
Right at the start of the convo you can dismantle the whole thing. These are humans arguing for what a good HUMAN father is. SAIYANS are NOT human and raise their children COMPLETELY differently, often times hardly even being present. Goku, by Saiyan standards, is not only a great parent but an EXCEPTIONAL father, and he isn't even a bad father by human standards to begin with! Him dying (TWICE for the sake of his child) and thus not being around does NOT make him a bad dad, in fact it makes him a GREAT Dad. For as much as I love TeamFourStar I really hate that they popularized this concept.
@@lurkytv2521you can’t count that as goku being a good father if it’s not apart of the real story.that’s like when vegeta found out broly was the legendary super saiyan and the man was so in shock he literally didn’t even try to fight.We all know that’s not vegetas character.
@@nitroblaze6696 then the bean isn’t a mistake misreading Gohan was. His gamble and faith in his kids power was the right move cause if he didn’t everyone dies.
Yeah, only 0.6% of people would do that. Plus, how does saving the earth make someone a bad dad? Do dragon ball "fans" even watch the show they talk about
@@terminalfeeting you wanna know whats ironic I tagged it in another comment. In his own video he uses the "dbz fans and not watching their own show" meme and then 10 minutes later he says gohan's convo with goku against super perfect cell was in his imagination, like bro didnt litterally say "im talking to you through king kai"
@xana7617hey man, stop it, the tropes of " Fans can't read " is yugioh fans trademark, do not rob us from that title! You guys have all the badge already!
@@rifarira9160 nah with yugioh its not the fans who cant read, its the characters in the show 🤣🤣 Why do you think they keep repeating what pot of greed does, or misuse so many cards in illegal ways?
The bad Dad trope is getting stupid asf, the fact that goku is literally a sayian a race that don’t prioritize taken care of your kids and sending them to another planet where they grow up on their own just shows how much he went against his own genetic makeup into being in Gohan’s life, supporting Gohan livelihood in becoming a scholar not a fighter and believed in his son so much that he betted the world on him the in cell saga, excluding the times he sacrificed himself from Gohan his son how tf is that bad father.
@@sumnahlennon5449 I checked, and never saw Toriyama saying that Goku sees his family like they're just like Krillin, and him saying that Goku doesn't have any parental instincts. I do agree that Goku is not a Good Father though... If we're talking about Goku being a Normal father in a society, because this would make sense as to why Toriyama says Goku is a bad father. But we are talking about Goku here, a man that was born and only known martial arts. His circle of close friends are literally just filled with people with Martial Arts knowledge, including his wife, the only exception can be counted with just three or four fingers. Bulma Baba Launch And Blue Launch. He literally doesn't even have any normal parental figures in his life. "Oh! But Grandpa Gohan" Grandpa Gohan died in between Goku's arrival and the first episode. Goku's actual age is 12. Not 14, 12. Because he couldn't count. The Debate started because people who thinks that Goku is a bad father means he's as bad as Hitler's Father or fucking Klaus Kinski. And only said that Piccolo is a Good father because he understands Gohan more than Goku did. Forgetting that *PICCOLO PUNCHED A 4 YEAR OLD AND LEFT HIM ON THE MOUNTAIN AND PICCOLO DURING THE CELL GAMES EVENT IS MERGED WITH FUCKING KAMI WHO WAS WATCHING OVER EVERYONE! PICCOLO'S "BETTER DAD" ATTITUDE IS NOT BECAUSE HE IS, BUT BECAUSE OF FUCKING KAMI.*
@@sumnahlennon5449are you dumb? because if you couldn't tell he was laughing while saying that, and if you know toryiama he joke's alot and he also forget's about alot of thing in his story.
You can’t even use Goten as a reason for Goku being a bad dad because 1. Goku was dead for the first 7 years of his life and 2. When Goku was alive he spent the next 10 years prior to the end of the series spending with his family including training Goten. So much time in fact his best friends Bulma Krillin Yamcha etc.. had not seen him in years.
Also, it’s almost as if people don’t want him to defend the fucking earth. He uses his power to defend everyone including his family yet he is penalized for doing so, he could’ve been like every other fucking Saiyin and killed everyone on earth. People forget that fact.
@@voxxi7598 Difference is he didn't spend much time with his family. Even before Beerus showed up he was spending all his free time on King Kai's planet. The only time he came home for longer than a lunch break was if ChiChi forced him to work.
4:35 Idk what this guy was yappin bout. Cause IN ALLL VERSIONS. Og sub, Kai dub, Kai sub, the manga, and EVEN the wack og funimation dub when raditz says something like "what are doing", Goku says "To get my son/boy back!" This dude either has a bad memory and didn't double check, or just didn't watch the show at all and is capping his brain off.
yeah, I'm going to get my son back for me, literally being the reason why he was kidnapped in the first place. Then immediately got bodied and had to get his son to save him because he was shit at fighting, because everyone he fights, he has to be over levelled to face, otherwise, he gets his ass clapped.
Goku literally says that he's a magnet for trouble, he stays dead for 7 YEARS, and the literal ONE DAY he comes back the Boo saga happens. What was this other dude yapping about? Did he like... literally not watch the series?
if you think about it, the buu saga happened becasue goku decide that " hey, a tournament on earth would be nice. " . If goku isnt there vegeta wouldnt be a majin, because vegeta being a majin was a decision not submission, he was capable of resisting babidi spell at all and just decide to let him in because he's insecure about the gap between him and goku. so if goku never there vegeta and gohan would have a huge chance to prevent buu altogether, which prove goku was right with his decision. and without buu thats mean no fat buu to annoy beerus (assuming beerus still get the dream and go to earth regardless of goku staying dead), and with buu still sealed its mean kid buu never get seperated from fat buu thus making moro a non threat since his seal would still be intact. the only problem that in theory will not solve itself without goku is zeno problem. without goku proposing a tournament zeno would just erase u7 without intervention. But if take a look at future timeline one can argue zeno somehow decide to not erase u7 even without ToP because f trunks timeline have passed the time of top and still not get erased somehow, not until zamasu fuse with the universe.
@@rifarira9160 To blame Vegeta becoming a Majin on Goku is like blaming a parent for their childs actions. While Goku (Or a parent) definitely have influence over Vegeta (or their child) neither one can directly force the other to make a decision. On the other hand, Goku is LITERALLY responsible for the arrival of Raditz and ADMITS TO IT.
@@ithoughtso.7016 yeah this comment about Goku causing the Buu saga makes no sense. Goku not being there wouldn’t change the revival at all, it would still happen.
I remember seeing a meme about how Super Buu is way more capable of reading a book than over half or the fans reading about DBZ. It's what the meme said, not me
Goku was with the Gohan the first 4 years of his life. Goku whole reason of fighting raditz was to get Gohan back and died for Gohan. This is the same Goku that likes to fight strong opponents and that is reasoning. But for this fight he literally says he is doing this for Gohan. When Goku comes back the first thing he does is save gohan for getting killed by the saiyans. Same thing for Frieza saga. Saves gohan and heals his broken neck and in doing so he also gets to fight someone strong. In the cell saga Goku spends all of time with gohan, especially in the room of spirit of time. Goku was the only one to believe in gohan and knew what he could do. Yes he didn’t realize gohan didn’t like to fight but the thing is Gohan does like to train. That easily could be confusing on Goku part of not understanding that Gohan is a gentle person. Also when Goku has to sacrifice himself to clean up gohans mess, he doesn’t blame gohan even though he told him to hurry up and finish off cell. Goku then says he is going to stay dead to protect his friends and family from harm. Does that suck for Gohan, yes but sometimes parents do the hard stuff to protect their children. Goku comes back and what he said in the cell saga happened. Majin buu was able to come back because in part of majin Vegeta wanting to fight Goku. If Goku didn’t come back that fight wouldn’t have happened and babadi would have still been gathering energy. But this entire arc Goku has a better understanding of Gohan and is around when he can be. After in super Gohan is an adult. Goten got to spend a lot of time with Goku when he came back alive and into super. But again the first 7 years he was protecting them.
@edAtolThis. majin vegeta happened because vegeta let it happen, without Goku there Vegeta wouldnt let babidi take over him. and without majin vegeta both of them would clear the ship and get to the bottom and have a huge possibility to prevent buu from awakening at all. Since buu never wake up, it means that kid buu never get seperated from fat buu and die, which mean seal on moro never become weak and thus preventing another danger. Heck without fat buu around Beerus perhaps wouldn't be mad thus preventing another danger.
"Gohan Im talking from the other world thanks to King Kai" Obviously just imagination right? The only imagination could be Goku being there but yhe whole talk? Nah
@@GeorgeTooCur1oustbf not only he just saw his father death, he's also bleeding while at the same time on a beam clash that decide the fate of the planet, that for sure will mess with your head a little.
Wtf is wrong with that guy? He must be a professional athlete considering the amount of hoops he's jumping through to make Goku out to be a bad father. Apparently dying for your children isn't enough to be considered a good parent (according to HIS standards apparently). Also he strategically chose to ignore things that happened off screen because if he DIDN'T then he would have no real argument against the fact that up to the point that Raditz showed up Goku had literally been there for Gohan since he was BORN. As for the Cell Saga argument I think that's entirely unfair towards Goku, he realized just how much potential his son had and went out of his way to nurture his son's natural talent and strength. He literally put his son's growth before his own interest, if he was a more selfish person he could have focused entirely on himself and neglected Gohan's development...but he didn't. As for Piccolo telling Goku that Gohan didn't like to fight like it was the most obvious thing in the world, I'd argue the only reason HE knows that is because HE irresponsibly placed Gohan in dangerous situations MULTIPLE times up until Goku showed up in the Saiyan Saga. Goku may have made a mistake when giving Cell the bean however he only made that mistake because he was trying to help Gohan grow by setting him on a path he thought would lead to Gohan succeeding and he was arguably correct in the end.
@xana7617 That honestly tops anything I've ever heard. Wow. That'd be like if people said Piccolo was a bad son for disregarding the reason King Piccolo created him
@xana7617 Yeah. And I agree with you. Especially in terms of operating by Dragon Ball standards, Goku is probably the best father in the show (not counting Grandpa Gohan) up until Krillin and 18 have Maron. Maybe it's not Goku hate that's the reason, though that definitely is a factor. It kind of feels like those attempts to analyze a story to find some throughline that would've went over our heads as a kid but end up going so far in the opposite direction it loops back around to being completely wrong and ridiculous. It's like if someone took away from the Star Wars prequels that the Jedi were wrong and blinded by dogmatic service to the force which caused them to accidentally create their ultimate undoing in Anakin. That would be fair up until you go as far as to say "So the sith are the good guys because they're allowed to have emotions and they're much more upfront with how self serving their code is".
@xana7617 Oh without a doubt. That's the main problem with the analyzation: it's overanalyzing. And hey, it's been dying down for a while now. Hopefully the next misconception to get cleared up is Super Goku being more authentic to the character
My issue with the Goku being a bad dad take is that people will bring up Vegeta like he just clears as a dad prior to super. This man told Future Trunks he ain't give a fuck about him or Bulma, neglected present day Trunks until he was a super saiyan, and threw away what little bit he did have just to fight Goku again in the Buu arc.
OMG yes! Like oh "Goku is a bad dad, not cause he's a Saiyan look at Vegeta. Vegeta just casually calling his son trash and literally not giving a fuck tll Future Trunks freaking dies. It reminds me of the video of Trunks dying where commenters were saying how Vegeta was a better dad cause he got mad. Disregarding how much of a crappy parent he was. Literally could've been training and helping each other get stronger but relied on pride.
The dude never embraced his son for 8 years straight. Is Vegeta more present. Yes, but "present" is being confused for "good" here. He antagonizes his future son and only really shows he cares *after his death.* I have never gotten that argument.
@@castform7 it's funny cause that's actually the reason why I get annoyed at the character I guess. Like yes Goku isn't present but he still has means to communicate. Like just talking to your family lol.
@@AL7249 That's a fair point. Like yeah, I get that he probably wants no connection to the Earth after the sacrifice but I don't think a call once or even twice a month would hurt. The only reason not on Goku I could see is King Kai just not wanting to be a cell phone.
If Gohan actually had PTSD then he would be refusing to fight altogether. He isnt traumatized thats just what the fanbase thinks he is. Goku is a top tier dad cause i dont know any father that would literally die for their son twice like he did
even though he did punch gohan when he tried to fly away from the time chamber to face the androids/cell (i cant really remember which one💀) it was for a good reason. that reason being that he basically stopped gohan from getting himself killed
You're so wrong, piccolo said he didn't like fighting, Gohan even was hesitant to fight cell, and at the end of z he literally stopped fighting whatsoever.
@01_171 read the message carefully.... I said Gohan never "said" it piccolo is not Gohan. Gohan was also a have human kid. He was more scared or doubtful than anything. That has nothing to do with not liking to fight. He said he didn't like senseless killings. And his mother didn't like fighting and wanted him to be a scholar. So for you to say that last part makes no sense.
@michael_mcgowan I never read the Manga so I can't speak on it, if I'm wrong in wrong. But I've never hear him say he didn't like fighting specifically
@@kurltonfalconer9353 I got the actual quote that the guy is referencing for you if you're interested. Gohan says, "But I don't like to fight... Like dad does. I don't want to kill anybody."
Goku doesn't understand most people. But he's not a bad dad. If my dad trained me to become a super Saiyan, idgaf we're cool. Even if you just want to work in some lab, what are you worried about? Your family isn't ever getting mugged at gunpoint. You move faster than they can fire and bullets can hit your skin and fall off. Even if you aren't a fighter, he unlocked your ability and you're living the safest life ever. Even if you dislike fighting. Stand up for yourself.
ruclips.net/user/shortszARyduo9iCQ?si=GriOn5P-u1QM6wPe this yt shorts video had parents leaving their child just cause the kid was annoying them by playing his car. Then what happened, the kid died due to get hitted by a car. I was like i swear to god, these people shouldnt call goku a bad father when you have this shit in real life.
In Super, Vegeta is waiting for Bulla to be born and Goku tries to convince him to come train (for the ToP, I think). Vegeta explains why he can't go, and Goku says that he wasn't there for either of his sons' births. Vegeta calls him a bad father, which is ironic considering where he was when Trunks was born. For Goku’s part, it actually makes sense. Goten for obvious reasons, but in Gohan's case it should be remembered that they live in the wilderness and Goku goes out to hunt for food basically every day. I imagine that while he was out, Chi-Chi went into labor. As we know, baby gonna come out when baby wanna come out, and the mother doesn't have too much say on when that happens.
Finally!!!! I’ve been arguing with my homeboy for years about this shit. People need to stop saying the dude is a bad dad. I know he isn’t perfect but my god the fact that people believe that being dead isn’t a fucking valid excuse or that saving your fucking kid is “basic”; like seriously, why in every other instance is sacrificing one’s self to save someone a heroic gesture, but the moment Goku does it for his son, he’s not a good father?! Could he have been better in some regards, sure but my god what the fuck else is he supposed to do?! Also a good father teaches his son how to defend himself. Like… that’s literally what he did. And his son enjoyed training with his dad. The hate that people have for Goku is so fucking wild.
the fact that he dosnt mention that goku ends up acceptingg and supporting gohans intterest in being a scholar after the cell games and into super even though goku himself couldnt be any less interested in it
Actually, during the Cell Games, he supports it. When trying to convince Gohan to fight Cell, he says, "Do it, Gohan! Bring peace back to the world. You want to grow up to be a scientist, don't you?" (Chapter 209 of the manga)
@noah_256. I said almost but tp answer ur question he let vegeta live, the ginyu force, frieza, and gave cell(the guy talking about blowing up the planet) a senzu bean to fight his son fairly
This man said, “He saved Gohan because Raditz was about to blow up the planet.” Here are my problems with that horrendous take: 1.) It’s been established that in order to blow up a planet you need a power level of 10,000+. Raditz had a power level of 1200. 2.) Raditz came to Earth to recruit Goku and when Goku was unwilling Raditz made him an impossible offer: He kidnapped his son and told him to kill and stack on the beach of Roshi’s Island, 100 Earthlings by the next day. Now my fellow DB enthusiasts, what did Goku do immediately after Raditz pimped off with his son and that new information? To run the ones with his brother to get his son back. There was no hesitation. He even teamed up with his mortal enemy at the time to do it.
Gohan also came off as if he liked or didn’t mind fighting especially when it was no other option which Goku did know and that’s what he wanted to bring out of gohan. His plan just wasn’t all the way thought out because he didn’t quite fully understand Gohan. But here is the question……. How many of our parents understood who we were fully?
And it’s stupid to say he’s a bad father for that because after Piccolo yells at him about it Goku immediately asked for a senzu so he could go back to fighting instead of Gohan. He acknowledged he was wrong and tried to correct it immediately
@@jason15212But of course they don't when piccolo is around Is Gohan is usually in trouble when Goku is around Gohan steps the F up Piccolo saw Gohan being frozen in Fear against Nappa Goku saw Him STARING DOWN GREAT APE VEGETA
@@ithinkimanaries2620What's crazy about that scene is that people forget the only reason Piccolo even understood that was because Gohan flat out told him that himself before proceeding to tell Gohan to just deal with it and do whatever he actually wants after they beat the Saiyans. You know, pretty much the same scenario minus Goku being aware and dismissive of his son's wishes. Like you said, the second it's brought to his attention he's ready to handle it himself.
If you are talking about Sage than right. If you are talking about the other dude all his arugements are things Goku couldn't control and or wouldn't know.
From the beginning of z skip frieza saga move to the android saga all we see is goku spending every minute with his family, For context after the ending to dragon ball goku and chi chi were living together, goku hunts for food chi chi takes care of the house when they had gohan the same thing goku hunts chi chi cooks and clean:Beginning of Z he’s shown doing the same thing just with son until he decides to introduce his kid to his friends. Android saga:after goku returns to earth and gets bad new from trunks he ‘s shown at home training with piccolo until gohan interrupts (expressing his desire to fight) goku sees this and believes his son would follow in his footsteps. Continuing on from that goku takes gohan to the time chamber where he learns of gohans potential in comparison to his own,Goku probably wouldn’t give cell a senzu beam if gohan didn’t express to his father those same desires.
@@painvillegaming4119Yes a weakend Cell would have gone a lot more desperate if he realized Gohan's power maybe even going for the bomb before a ssj2 could happen
33:35 I believe that Goku giving Cell a Senzu bean was actually a High IQ move that goes over a lot of people's heads. Goku knew that Cell had Freeza AND Vegeta's DNA. Goku has fought both of them and knows their fighting style. He knows that when both of them think they have an advantage in a fight they won't take it seriously and will make unnecessary mistakes. Both of them could've killed Goku quickly if they seriously fought him at full power in the beginning of their Fights. Goku also knows that when Vegeta and Freeza think their opponent has an overwhelming advantage they crashout and try to blow up the planet. Cell's overconfidence was what allowed Gohan the time necessary to achieve ssj2 in the first place. Side note: remember when Goku kept smiling while saying I knew it after Gohan went ssj2. Goku also warned Gohan to finish the fight quickly because he'd seen the pattern twice already and knew Cell was bout to crash out and blow up the Planet. EVEN THEN, Goku didn't blame Gohan. He took responsible for his mistake(not know Gohan didn't like to fight) and sacrificed himself to save Gohan.
It feels like this guy doesn't really understand what a priority is. As an analogy I bring up Mario Galaxy. Bowser's ultimate goal is to take over the universe. Mario, in stopping him, saves the universe but his main priority is saving Peach. Getting Peach out of danger was the most important thing to him. Same for Goku. Stopping Raditz would save the planet but the main thing on Goku's mind is making sure Gohan is safe. Is Goku a flawed father. Yes, he showed a lapse in understanding about what is son wanted on a monumental scale. But even once he learned about it, he gave his life up for it and was prepared to stay dead for the rest of eternity purely because he is that magnet for danger that he now wants to keep away from his son and everyone else. Also the "just his imagination" point is in general stupid. We, in any dub of the anime, are shown Goku in Other World conversing through King Kai to Gohan. There isn't, nor should there be any ambiguity to if Goku was actually there or not. 5 year olds could probably pick this up.
@@lightgivemepower6425 Nothing. I'm making a parallel and to do that, I go towards a different series. In both scenarios, a character's main objective is protecting one person close to them rather than the world/universe at large.
@@bdg1970 Yes, in the same way I believe Goku would still fight for the planet if Gohan wasn't kidnapped. With both kidnappings happening though, it turns the protection of the planet/universe into an extra large bonus rather than the main goal.
9:30 any one else notice that the video just didn't acknowledge the fact that Goku, upon realizing he might be wrong, Immediately asked for a Senzu bean so he could go save his son from someone he knew he had no chance of defeating.
A point that I don't get that people bring up is the year that he spent training on Yardrat. Sure he refused to come back to earth. But the technique that he learned on Yardrat helped not only save the Earth but also his son. If he didn't learn the instant transmission EVERYONE including Gohan would have LITERALLY DIED.
I feel the need to bring up that Gohan struck Raditz on the chest, cracked his armor and ribs, which led to Raditz's focus to go squarely on the boy. He proceeds to kick Gohan, knocking him out, and approach him with energy gathering to finish the job. "Blow up the planet..." Raditz can decimate a city or two, but way less efficiently than Nappa and his Giant Storm. I mean, part of why he was heading to Earth was because he sucked at his job. So yeah, Earth wasn't going to be immediately destroyed like people assume. Raditz isn't *that* powerful.
Roshi blew up the moon. And using calcs it was large planetary level. Raditz is many many leagues above and nappa only did that cause he wanted the earths dragon balls because immortality. So blowing uo earth would be the stupidest decision by them. Bruh did you even watch or read og dragon ball or dragon ball z?
@@tonggtieiMaybe Raditz has Planetary level Attack Potency but I don't think he has the Attack Range to accomplish it, I guess if he destroys Earth's core he'd be able to.
@@ElHarmonyV roshi has moon busting power for dc. And for calcs large planetary busting abilities for dc. Raditz who is far greater then that roshi would easily have the power to destroy earth.
Both Roshi and Piccolo destroyed the moon quite easily with far less power than Raditz. I think Raditz could destroy the earth but it wouldn't be "reduced to ashes" as Vegeta states he's capable of. Raditz would most likely be able to blow a large chunk out of the earth, which would most definitely destroy the planet's atmosphere and structural integrity.
I believe Goku is a good dad. He loves his kids and they know he loves them. His absence is almost always either to stop harm from following him to his family or training so he can stop an imminent threat. He had missteps and made mistakes, but his kid's well-being and potential were always at the forefront of his mind.
Gohan says he doesn't like fighting. Goku pushes his son to be strong enough that if Gohan HAS to fight, he can survive. Goku HAS respected Gohan's chocies and even encouraged him to be a scholar. He knew Gohan was the only one who could beat Cell.
10:14 this point is really stupid. Goku spent 5 years with his family and rarely kept up with his training, and what happened? An alien from space way stronger than him beat him an took his son. This is something Piccolo and Vegeta recite alot, that even though they are in a time of peace, that doesn’t excuse getting soft and sloppy. Goku prioritizes training not only to keep himself in fighting shape but to also be strong enough to handle any potential threats that could endanger the earth and his family. He is not going to be caught lacking again.
I hate how people say Goku rather train than to be with his family. He has to train because of he hadn’t all his friends and family would have been dead. Training has been necessary
He had that point about Raditz COMPLETELY backwards. He said he fought Raditz to save the Earth, and saving Gohan was just a byproduct of that. No. He went there to save his son, and he stated that. Saving Gohan was why he confronted Raditz, fought him, and died. Saving the Earth was the side note
This is why i fuck with you sage, because you have a heart, this goku hater deadass sounds like hes so full of himself and views people less. That sorta negative energy shit deadass clouds judgment. I fucking love you dog❤❤❤🫡
What's really crazy is that he said he hasn't consumed the other media surrounding Goku but it's willing to make an "objective" take on him as a character.
9:54 It’s funny how the dude in the video says that Gohan hates fighting. Yet Gohan volunteers to go to Namek to help bring everyone back die to responsibility. If he didn’t like anything related to fighting he would’ve elected to stay on Earth.
Nobody brings ever brings this up but when goku appears in battle the first thing he usually does is tell gohan to LEAVE. Or he gives him a job to where he doesn’t have to confront the threat ( androids 19 and 20 arrive) up until the Cell saga where he see’s gohans true potential. THINK ABOUT THAT SHIT
@xana7617there's a scientific name to this phenomenon, basically people will hold to their view even if its wrong because pride/dont want to be on the wrong side but to prideful to admit it.
"Gohan was just on the planet. Goku didn't save gohan directly." No, that's an argument on how he saved chi chi. He fought raditz to save gohan specifically, and the planet was what happened to be a side effect of beating raditz. Not the other way around
Some things you both missed 1. Gohan LOVES fighting. He's a half saiyan which they all love fighting. He just doesn't like fighting to the death like Goku. Goku said he's having fun even though he's in trouble. Gohan enjoys training. He just doesn't like hurting and killing. 2. Goku was wrong for misjudging Gohans will to fight but was 100% correct that Gohan would beat Cell and was the only hope. If your son was the only person with the power to no diff the villain that no one can beat, would you make him go home or fight? 3. Goku took up for Gohans mistake with that sacrifice 4. Breaking the laws between life and death is pretty loose in the dbz universe and you gotta accept it. Talking to Gohan from the dead doesn't break any rules and only proves that he's a good dad. Almost forgot: The senzu bean thing wasn't bad and you can't give a good explanation as to why it was. 1, Gohan could handle it 2, Gohan DID handle it. It made 0 difference. Making Gohan fight Cell = Lions making their cubs hunt or humans giving their pets live feedings. Except The cub/pet is stronger than you and the live feeding and if they don't take it out then the earth will be destroyed. Episode 1 is literally all about Goku and Gohan. Every time Goku is off screen he's spending time with Gohan. Now every time he's off screen he's spending time with Goten
People forget or ignore the fact that piccolo made the “mistake” of relying on gohans power without considering his gentle nature in the saiyan saga & it caused tiens death, however that arc proved gohan is not a coward & when everything was on the line he stood 1v1 against vegeta to protect goku (all of which piccolo didn’t witness) while he taught krillan to direct the spirit bomb. Goku in the end made the right choice in the cell saga because he was the only person beside gohan himself that knew what he was capable of when pushed into a corner. All it took was android 16 to explain that given the circumstances letting go of that kindness to protect the things you hold dear is okay. Gohan doesn’t display any trauma through the franchise but he isn’t fearless like goku & piccolo. he doesn’t hate fighting. He hates being powerless to protect his friends & hates needless killing/suffering
People calling Goku a bad dad while Vegeta literally got Bulma pregnant then left for a year and a half or whatever to train then basically told his literal grown up future version of his son “What *ABOUT* my wife and toddler son?” When Gero escaped the Z Figthers in the canyon will forever confuse me. Goku at least spent time with Gohan pre Raditz, time with him in the time chamber, and didn’t just “Ight I’m dead Gohan, you’re the strongest one left so ball tf up.” Meanwhile Vegeta literally didn’t give two shits about Trunks until he was dead. If any other parent did that would we be saying that’s a good parent?
All fathers make mistakes , and goku is not your normal over achiever alpha male dad . He knows what was best for Gohan , he knew Gohan needed to be strong as well as he needed to improve his own strength to secure a future for earth. Goku needed to take every opportunity to get stronger even if it means time away from Gohan , or the next villain would slaughter everyone .
Raditz never said he was going to blow up the planet lol. Raditz's only threat was that he was going to take gohan if goku didn't kill 1000 people. Bro did not watch dragon ball and he's saying that we didn't 😭
Remember if goku was only concerned about the planet’s safety, he would’ve done everything raditz said and killed 100 earthlings and left the earth with him. He may cares about the planet’s safety, his immediate goal was to save his son.he even tries to calm gohan down by telling him that daddy is here.
You do realize how fast Kid Buu’s blast was right? It was so fast that Kibito Kai using instant transmission just barely saved Goku and Vegeta and earth is vaporized before Kibito Kai, Goku, and the Others reach the Land of the Kai’s. Simply put, Goku simply didn’t have time and was under pressure.
Around 8:25 fool says gohan didn't ask to be savior of earth, he contradicted himself by saying goku didn't save his son from raditz but the planet which everyone would do. That cell arc was implying goku can't be the protector forever and his son would have to take up the mantle because he is the only one that has the power too. So, When goku saves gohan, it's actually saving the planet which everyone would choose. But when goku sends gohan to fight cell now he forced to be the one to save the planet... but i thought everyone would choose to save the planet?!
Goku never took an oath to be like super man and watch after the planet. Most anime protagonist aren’t trying to save the world just to save their family.
The Android and Cell Saga training, if Gohan had SAID “I don’t wanna fight, I hate it” Goku very much would’ve been like “that’s ok Gohan, that means I’ve gotta train even harder” or gave him a motivational speech about how much potential he sees in his son. Gohan HAS expressed he likes learning so Goku lets that happen. I forget what arc it was but someone brought up bringing Gohan in for the fight and Goku DIDNT WANT TO DRAG GOHAN INTO IT. For some reason Super just did a LOT of character regression.
This was a hard watch. He definitely believes he’s the smartest person constantly. The fact that he ignored the reason why Goku went to fight Raditz was stupid he also ignored the fact that Goku was right staying away from earth because his Friends and family had peace for 7 years. These Goku bad dad takes aren’t even takes anymore it’s just people choosing to be stupid 😂
if you think about it, the buu saga happened becasue goku decide that " hey, a tournament on earth would be nice. " . If goku isnt there vegeta wouldnt be a majin, because vegeta being a majin was a decision not submission, he was capable of resisting babidi spell at all and just decide to let him in because he's insecure about the gap between him and goku. so if goku never there vegeta and gohan would have a huge chance to prevent buu altogether, which prove goku was right with his decision. and without buu thats mean no fat buu to annoy beerus (assuming beerus still get the dream and go to earth regardless of goku staying dead), and with buu still sealed its mean kid buu never get seperated from fat buu thus making moro a non threat since his seal would still be intact. the only problem that in theory will not solve itself without goku is zeno problem. without goku proposing a tournament zeno would just erase u7 without intervention. But if take a look at future timeline one can argue zeno somehow decide to not erase u7 even without ToP because f trunks timeline have passed the time of top and still not get erased somehow, not until zamasu fuse with the universe.
I rarely even let people pull the bad dad card with Goten. Whenever Goku isn’t training it’s very rare to not see him with Goten. He’s usually eating food at home or working as a farmer with Goten. Goten’s main criticism is his wasted potential but it’s mainly because Goku has learned the error of his ways and flat out doesn’t train his son to keep him out of harms way.. you’ll never hear this from Mr.1000000 iQ DB Savant over there though
16:00 was probably the stupidest argument the guy bashing Goku made. Raditz came to earth to kill Goku, Androids were made for the sole purpose of killing Goku. Bad guys do come to Earth because Goku is there. Goku's logic was actually very sound. But also let me just point out with the confusing that Gohan doesn't like fighting thing, Goku's entire upbringing was fighting his whole damn life. It was how he got his food, how he made friends, how he met his wife. 19:59 what does this guy mean Frieza was eventually going to show up on Earth? Earth was seen as a low level interest planet. There are billions and billions of planets. Earth could have died before Frieza ever got there.
Small correction: Raditz didn't come there to kill Goku. He came there to see what his brother was up to. Then beat his ass and used Gohan as leverage to make him kill earthlings like a True Saiyan.
I'm surprised that Vegeta isn't brought up in the bad father discussion considering he's borderline abusive & neglectful to his family in Z & very emotionally (sometimes physically) absent at the start of Super. No, I'm not talking about everything he did/said to Trunks before he knew he was his son, even after he knew, was cold, condescending, & dismissive of him.
@@Phoenix_Blader_93 Made worse by all the hype Bulma must have built up. No way Trunks didn't go in knowing his dad was a self-centered, prideful a-hole.
Thank you! My thing about Goku or any male saiyan being a father whose actually present in the lives of their children is unheard of. They are made and raised to be warriors, not care takers. Gohan's childhood was far from perfect but Goku did his best
Im not gonna the second he said that goku dying for his son is misleading i lost all interest. Edit: i generally think this some of the dumbest shit ive watched in a long-time.
The scary thing is, this isn't even the worst take about dragon ball. The fact that there are people who have said dumber things than this guy is crazy
17:51 the LITERAL day that Goku came back to life, the fucking apocalypse occurs, the entire population (except a human, God, and a fucking dog) gets exterminated, and the earth gets destroyed. All over the course of a goddamn week. Goku had every reason to stay dead lmao
I'll give bro one thing, was right when he said he's been on Twitter Cuz that was the most cherry-picked, disingenuous, biased bullshit I've EVER seen used to argue that Goku is a bad father. Bro thinks he's so smart but can't fathom the idea that Goku literally hasn't seen a lot of the rough things Gohan went through. And lemme just poke an additional hole in his argument while the getting is good. He says misunderstanding his son is another thing that makes Goku a bad father, but SINCE WHEN does misunderstanding your child automatically label you a bad parent? There's SO many people who's parents misunderstood them when they were younger when it came to their interests, ideals, beliefs, etc, but you can still be a GOOD PARENT my guy. My parents misunderstood me a lot when I was younger, but they were AMAZING parents.
Tbf, Gohan disliking fighting had no setup and no build up from a reader's perspective. Gohan was always shown to be one of the first people to the action, even if hopelessly outmatched, and at least enjoys training. It's more of a failure on Toriyama's part due to the lack of setup, but it's alright because it was a cool and iconic moment. It was still a mistake on Goku's part (even Goku himself thinks it was), but it's a very forgivable one that's easy to make when not even the readers could've known about Gohan's dislike for fighting.
Yeah... Once he got to Namek. And if it wasn't from his rage kicking in, it was from his sense of duty and desire to protect people. Neither of which means he likes having to fight in such serious situations. He fought because he felt he had to, not because he wanted to.
@@espurrseyes42 Doesn't change it having poor build up as he wasn't hinted at to dislike fighting. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the only times I can think of is against Raditz and Nappa due to lack of experience in real battles. Even then he was shown to enjoy it when fighting the dinosaur during Piccolo's training, and when first arriving on Namek he highfives Krillen after beating up the Freiza soldiers that blew up the ship. I'm not saying it's wrong for Gohan to dislike fighting, I'm saying that an important moment for Gohan's character didn't have the proper build up from the reader's perspective so it's forgivable for Goku to make that mistake. Also Cell and Buu are the only characters he has to fight out of duty due to being the strongest one on earth during those times.
@@OpenKoms Yes. Because he could handle the dinosaur and Frieza Soldiers. Shit wasn't serious life or death type shit. No. The entirety of Namek was duty. Because he wanted to go there to help revive his friends that died because he couldn't get the job done against Nappa. Same thing happened with all of the Android stuff. He wants to be able to fight alongside everyone and not be the deadweight that gets everyone killed trying to save him like against Nappa. If it wasn't rage, it was a desire to not let a Nappa Wipe happen again, or make up for said wipe, pushing Gohan into combat. We've never seen him genuinely enjoy fighting or wanting to get involved in serious battles, let alone being put in the high pressure situation of him being the last resort instead of his dad.
@@espurrseyes42 I'm saying Gohan's dislike of fighting wasn't properly built up to. There are moments where he is shown to possibly like fighting or dislike fighting, but they are up to interpretation on whether it was something else that caused the reaction and not his enjoyment or lack there of for fighting. Plus the most apparent ones for both liking and disliking are in the Saiyan Saga, so they're pretty old. For example; he enjoyed training with Goku and Piccolo, but it's much easier to interpret his enjoyment towards spending time with his father figures than him liking fighting. I'm not arguing that he shouldn't dislike fighting or that he didn't fight out of necessity, but that he wasn't properly hinted at to dislike fighting for the purpose of building up to the moment he says it in the Cell Saga so Goku should be forgiven for making the mistake of sending him into battle.
@@espurrseyes42 I also didn't say that Namek wasn't done out of duty, and if I did then it was completely wrong. Gohan made it quite clear in the hospital scene that it was out of duty. Just to be clear.
Dude I never understood the raditz argument. Goku literally teams up with piccolo, who wants him dead btw, specifically because raditz kidnapped Gohan.
The four dumbest things Dragonball fans say: 1. Goku is a bad dad 2. Piccolo is black/also he's Gohan's "real dad" despite having kidnapped him and stranding him in the wilderness for 6 months 3. The dumbest Yamcha jokes they beat like a horse's skeleton 4. CaN hE bEaT gOkU tHo? (The Nasuverse beats Goku, The Zodiac Knights from Saint Seiya beat Goku, Sailor Moon beats Goku, any Digimon ultimate level and above, beats Goku)
Maturity is realzing chichi is the reason gohan is half and half about fighting. Because there has been multiple moments where gohan would train on his own or enjoy getting stronger. Because it's deadass shown when gohan fought goku that he enjoy fighting with his dad. You can argue it was for the sake of the universe but it doesn't chnage that fact that gohan was still enjoying himself.. at the end of the day having a earthling mother who constantly wants you to study and be a scholar so you can have a big house and money vs having a father who likes to train and get stronger gives him an identity crisis
As soon as you have to use a mistranslated bad dub as your argument instead of the manga or the original version of the dialogue, that's when you know you're wrong.
Note that Gohan wanted to go to namek so much he yelled at his mom, defend the namakiens of his own will, stop frieza even if it meant running the 1s, and during piccolos training he didnt throw him at obstacles that could realistically kill him. Piccolo trains him after he just saw Gohan output more power than him or goku so he knows hes stronger than himself on a high end. Piccolo is training Gohan in the same environment he grew up in because its the only form of training he knows. He knows the sayins are coming and knows Gohan needs to be there to help protect the earth because piccolo understands hes not strong enough to do it himself. And unlike Piccolos truly solitary childhood Gohan has someone looking after him at all times. Piccolo didnt abandon him in the valley he is in the air providing backup clothes and weapons any time he needs it.
Actually, he wanted to go there because he felt responsible for Piccolo dying. He did ask for Goku's permission though. Goku said yes. Chi-Chi told Gohan no and Gohan told her off and she relented and let him go
The only time Goku messed up was when he gave the Sensu Bean to Cell and told Gohan to fight him...but thanks to Piccolo..Goku realized his mistake and took the L for him and apologized for not recognizing who his son was. After Cell Goku stopped pushing Gohan to fight ..gohan pushed himself against his mothers wishes because of the threat Buu posed
this guy makes a lot of terrible points but one thing he does say that I've never seen anyone else adress is the fact that goku di not tell gohan any part of his plan. I don't think it makes him a bad father I just think his awful communication isnt brought up enough imo
14:00 That guy seems to be forgetting/leaving 2 key details. It's not like Goku had a choice at the time. He was in the hospital, recovering. So Gohan straight up WANTED to go to Namek. Luckily Goku pulled up with sensu beans. This is him BEFORE learning instant Transmission too. I don't know where he got the idea Goku loved seeing Gohan in that condition, where he was worried for his friends in both Saiyan & Namek arcs. ( *Slight edit cause I rewatched the scene:* Goku even encourages Gohan to go, because he understood how much his friends meant to him. Another point about Goku & Gohan I'm bout to get into) Another is that Goku got the impression Gohan loves fighting, because his son was happy to train with him. Gohan even told his father to straight up hit him with everything he got, so he can finally protect himself & others. So you can say both instances Goku took it as not only he has a love for battles, but his son maturing, and got something to prove. That Namek & Cell saga comparasion was a huge reach. It was like that person who made the video only saw TFS, and saw that as the actual canon lol.
You know what's funny about this whole topic. If Gohan was a real person and these dumb mfs tell Gohan that Goku is a terrible dad, he would beat them the fuck up. Gohan states Goku is an Angel and we are debating that he's a bad dad c'mon bro
He's a child tho a lot of people don't realize their parents are bad lol
@@simplygregatron gohan said gokus an angel when he was an adult bro
@@thefirstprime012416 -17 but yeah
@@thefirstprime0124 i mean even as an adult that doesnt mean he totally had a good grasp of all he went through as a child lol
@@simplygregatronnigga that’s copium and we both know it
Saying he's using the source material but only sourcing the funimation dub and not idk the FUCKING MANGA is also hilarious. Also, Gohan went to Namek on his own accord he LITERALLY said "I'm not gonna sit around and let everyone fight for me, I have to go and make my dad proud" like bro what is he talking about
You also need to look at it from Goku's perspective ever since General Tao Getting Beaten to a bloody pulp was a regular occurrence for Him and His friends
Why would he think Gohan would be traumatized when he had all his limp broken by the Demon F king or piccolo putting a hole in the chest during the tournament
@@painvillegaming4119 also if he was completely traumatized he'd never wanna train or fight again. People just be pulling shit from human experiences
Kai was a better adaptation of the manga so that's what I watch
@@MrSonicHedgehog as you should
@@PrinxeGaming_ wish there was a version of the whole series with Faulconer's score though
"Goku didn't die in the Raditz fight because he wanted to save Gohan. He died because he wanted to save the earth. It's just utilitarianism." Some people try their damnest to sound smart when they have the silliest arguments.
Fr they act like gohan wouldnt die
Exactly goku literally went their to save his son
Like you don't need to be a genius to get that. lol
If Goku cared more about the Earth, he sure as shit wouldn't be letting Piccolo live and taken God's job, not that smartypants would know that. Or even let Krillin and Roshi help and potentially fodder themselves in the name of "saving the planet".
Yep, and besides, didn't Goku literally get the idea and resolve to even get up with broken ribs and shit, BECAUSE Raditz was about to kill Gohan? And didn't he literally head into that fight to save Gohan?
Ong
Goku being a bad dad should be left in TFS. If you actually watch Z he constantly made decisions with Gohan in mind
This guy probably just watched TFS
@@painvillegaming4119 i watched tfs all through high school. im 25
@@deblag5992i think he mean the guy who make video about goku bad father
Ironically, TFS actually disagrees with Goku being a bad dad. They only did it for the jokes and actually regret the fact that so many people started taking it as fact.
@@keiviroque5666I wouldnt say its whole heartedely untrue either. Goku in z does make some horrible decisions as a father. But he is a good person and most above all he is one of the most SUPPORTIVE dads in db. However that doesnt absolve him of his blatant mistakes as a dad which is where him being a bad dad comes from. Id still take Goku over a straight up abusive one, and sure as hell over Vegeta for most of the series.
Didn’t Goku team up with his mortal enemy TO GET HIS SON BACK?!?! Wtf are we doing?!?!
yapping
Craziest parts that I just started watching dragon Ball z and it just hit me that you're correct because they were quite literally on their toes when piccolo first showed up during the show and they were all ready to fight him. Meaning at that point they were still legitimate enemies but he set aside his differences to team up with him. Anyway, the guy who literally tried to kill him
Then he died and let chi chi in their house alone for 6 months without knowing where her 5 year old was even worse that the guy who tried to kill her husband multiple times is the one responsible for him, that's not good parenting, after Namek freeza is dead instead of coming home to his family he chose to train for a full year in another planet, chi chi has to feed herself and Gohan pay for his studies with her father money cause Goku in all of the series never got a job he could have literally opened a martial fight gym and support his family but he never did even Yamcha tried to play professional baseball to support himself.
After the time skip chamber and "finding" his son true potential instead of talking to him about it he ignored his son nature no wonder Piccolo was pissed off, who sends a pacifist into a fight where he has to kill? There is more to talk about Goku but its not worth the rant.
all of the food and tuition was literally paid for by gokus tournament money what're you talking about bro chi chi only brings up money once the prize money or whatever money goku gives her runs out.@@glcsander
Akira Toriyama says Goku is a bad father, but not a bad person. The writer's words
You guys fail to realize goku never went to FUCKING school. He not once was told that and he was raised without talking to anyone except a man that trained him TOO FIGHT, no wonder he thought HIS SON WITH HIS DNA would like the things he does.
🎯
Actually a very good argument
spot on
and to further explain, all goku ever saw/heard of gohan doing was fighting
Plus he fell on his head that fucked him up, and lived in the mountains for awhile, this is common knowledge, but rare for “dragonball fans”
its so crazy how people call goku a bad says piccolo a good dad like he didn’t make a six year old live alone in the woods and fight a literal dinosaur is so crazy
Toriyama, the writer of Dragon Ball says Goku is a bad dad. Sorry. Author says so. He then said he needed DBS to emphasize certain things about Goku because DBZ fans may of missed it
The thing is piccolo wasn't even a bad father figure either, there are some weird db fans
@@sumnahlennon5449 I feel like you’re capping where you hear that from?
@@sumnahlennon5449 source
@@sumnahlennon5449"that's a nice argument why don't you back it up with a source"
Goku is an Alien that was raised on martial arts and learning to always do the right thing. If Goku wasn't pure of heart, he wouldn't be able to ride the Nimbus. Chi Chi was the bad influence on Gohan for never letting him find his own path like she did with Goten. Expecting Goku to know what a good parent is given his childhood is hilarious and the dude is still better than 70% of fathers in America today. Dudes a superhero lol
According to Toriyama, Goku is a bad father because he is incapable of feeling certain parental emotions. Toriyama says Gohan and Chi-Chi to Goku is the same as Krillin to him
Toriyama said Goku is worst than most fathers. He has no capability of fatherly emotion. It doesnt matter who he grows up with.
You are using childhood as an excuse? Toriyama already said Goku has no capability of fatherly or husband love. Chi Chi, Gohan are the same to him as Krillin and Yamcha.
If Goku finds something fun he will leave again. Toriyama himself said that.
@@sumnahlennon5449stop fucking meat riding
@@sumnahlennon5449death of the author, a lot of what happens in the show contradicts what toriyama said.
Bruh this is the worst argument yet about him being a bad dad. Some people just don’t have the sharpest intellect on this dustball.
that’s my thing not even tryna disrespect him. my comments ALWAYS disagree so that’s fine. but THIS argument wasn’t it
Right at the start of the convo you can dismantle the whole thing. These are humans arguing for what a good HUMAN father is. SAIYANS are NOT human and raise their children COMPLETELY differently, often times hardly even being present. Goku, by Saiyan standards, is not only a great parent but an EXCEPTIONAL father, and he isn't even a bad father by human standards to begin with! Him dying (TWICE for the sake of his child) and thus not being around does NOT make him a bad dad, in fact it makes him a GREAT Dad. For as much as I love TeamFourStar I really hate that they popularized this concept.
@@MultiCaiserTFS didn't popularize it enough for it to be notable, it's ALWAYS been a thing.
@@TSO_Sage
Can we talk more about bro saying goku is a bad dad by staying dead so gohan and by extension the whole world can be safe 😭
@@TheFakeMakotoYukiThat was a hilarious statement 😭
Goku is a great father because he defied the laws of reality just to save Gohan from Bojack. That punch was mean too.
yea but that’s not canon unfortunately still pretty cool tho
@@XxTuRnUpMaStAhxXwhat does it matter if it’s canon or not?
@@lurkytv2521you can’t count that as goku being a good father if it’s not apart of the real story.that’s like when vegeta found out broly was the legendary super saiyan and the man was so in shock he literally didn’t even try to fight.We all know that’s not vegetas character.
@@von1626 oh that makes sense
@@XxTuRnUpMaStAhxX we talking about Goku being a good father. In this case it doesn't matter if it canon or not.
vegeta calling goku a horrible father when HE WAS GOING TO LET BULMA AND BABY TRUNKS FALL HUNDREDS OF FEET IN A AIRPLANE.
Yeah but vegeta didn't become a good father until the end of that arc.
I feel like people who call Goku a bad dad should rewatch the series. Because there is so much context that people are either misremember or ignore.
I think people get the events that happened in z and the abridged versions mixed up
@@elijahjackson3585honestly
I doubt the people who made these arguments have even watched the show to begin with. They probably watched a 5-minute clip of dbz at best
Remember. The first thing Goku did when piccolo told him that Gohan wasn’t like him, was try and get some Senzu beans and jump cell.
He made a mistake but after he realized it he immediately tried to make things right
Bro didn't even mention that on the video. He literally skipped that part, IT WAS LITERALLY JUST 1 SECOND APART @@nitroblaze6696
@@nitroblaze6696Giving the bean to Cell was a massive mistake though.
@@illusionofquality979 it was indeed a mistake because he wasn't aware that Gohan doesn't like fighting
@@nitroblaze6696 then the bean isn’t a mistake misreading Gohan was. His gamble and faith in his kids power was the right move cause if he didn’t everyone dies.
"saving the earth is something litterally everyone would want to do" 😂😂😂
Oh yeah because thats working out so well for us in the real world huh
Fr
Yeah, only 0.6% of people would do that. Plus, how does saving the earth make someone a bad dad? Do dragon ball "fans" even watch the show they talk about
@@terminalfeeting you wanna know whats ironic
I tagged it in another comment. In his own video he uses the "dbz fans and not watching their own show" meme and then 10 minutes later he says gohan's convo with goku against super perfect cell was in his imagination, like bro didnt litterally say "im talking to you through king kai"
@xana7617hey man, stop it, the tropes of " Fans can't read " is yugioh fans trademark, do not rob us from that title! You guys have all the badge already!
@@rifarira9160 nah with yugioh its not the fans who cant read, its the characters in the show 🤣🤣
Why do you think they keep repeating what pot of greed does, or misuse so many cards in illegal ways?
The bad Dad trope is getting stupid asf, the fact that goku is literally a sayian a race that don’t prioritize taken care of your kids and sending them to another planet where they grow up on their own just shows how much he went against his own genetic makeup into being in Gohan’s life, supporting Gohan livelihood in becoming a scholar not a fighter and believed in his son so much that he betted the world on him the in cell saga, excluding the times he sacrificed himself from Gohan his son how tf is that bad father.
Because Akira Toriyama, the author repeatedly calls Goku a bad father. His writing *INTENT* is to depict Goku as a bad father
Toriyama himself doesnt even agree with you.
Doesnt matter his race. Toriyama says Goku is a bad father.
@@sumnahlennon5449 I checked, and never saw Toriyama saying that Goku sees his family like they're just like Krillin, and him saying that Goku doesn't have any parental instincts.
I do agree that Goku is not a Good Father though... If we're talking about Goku being a Normal father in a society, because this would make sense as to why Toriyama says Goku is a bad father.
But we are talking about Goku here, a man that was born and only known martial arts.
His circle of close friends are literally just filled with people with Martial Arts knowledge, including his wife, the only exception can be counted with just three or four fingers.
Bulma
Baba
Launch
And Blue Launch.
He literally doesn't even have any normal parental figures in his life.
"Oh! But Grandpa Gohan"
Grandpa Gohan died in between Goku's arrival and the first episode. Goku's actual age is 12. Not 14, 12. Because he couldn't count.
The Debate started because people who thinks that Goku is a bad father means he's as bad as Hitler's Father or fucking Klaus Kinski.
And only said that Piccolo is a Good father because he understands Gohan more than Goku did.
Forgetting that *PICCOLO PUNCHED A 4 YEAR OLD AND LEFT HIM ON THE MOUNTAIN AND PICCOLO DURING THE CELL GAMES EVENT IS MERGED WITH FUCKING KAMI WHO WAS WATCHING OVER EVERYONE! PICCOLO'S "BETTER DAD" ATTITUDE IS NOT BECAUSE HE IS, BUT BECAUSE OF FUCKING KAMI.*
@@sumnahlennon5449are you dumb? because if you couldn't tell he was laughing while saying that, and if you know toryiama he joke's alot and he also forget's about alot of thing in his story.
You can’t even use Goten as a reason for Goku being a bad dad because 1. Goku was dead for the first 7 years of his life and 2. When Goku was alive he spent the next 10 years prior to the end of the series spending with his family including training Goten. So much time in fact his best friends Bulma Krillin Yamcha etc.. had not seen him in years.
Also, it’s almost as if people don’t want him to defend the fucking earth. He uses his power to defend everyone including his family yet he is penalized for doing so, he could’ve been like every other fucking Saiyin and killed everyone on earth. People forget that fact.
Some people just don't watch the anime
That used to be the case until Super came along and retconned it so that Goku spent the majority of those 10 years off training with Whis and Beerus.
@@denickart Goku left to train uub just like that so... i dont see any difference given Goku did took some family time until beerus appeared
@@voxxi7598 Difference is he didn't spend much time with his family. Even before Beerus showed up he was spending all his free time on King Kai's planet. The only time he came home for longer than a lunch break was if ChiChi forced him to work.
4:35 Idk what this guy was yappin bout. Cause IN ALLL VERSIONS. Og sub, Kai dub, Kai sub, the manga, and EVEN the wack og funimation dub when raditz says something like "what are doing", Goku says "To get my son/boy back!"
This dude either has a bad memory and didn't double check, or just didn't watch the show at all and is capping his brain off.
yeah, I'm going to get my son back for me, literally being the reason why he was kidnapped in the first place.
Then immediately got bodied and had to get his son to save him because he was shit at fighting, because everyone he fights, he has to be over levelled to face, otherwise, he gets his ass clapped.
@@lost.name636brother9 Needless Goku stray? Shit at fighting bro what!?
@@lost.name636brother9 ????
@@lost.name636brother9 He literally died for his son, twice. What the actual hell are you talking about you goofball
@@lost.name636brother9this bitch trolling😂
Goku literally says that he's a magnet for trouble, he stays dead for 7 YEARS, and the literal ONE DAY he comes back the Boo saga happens. What was this other dude yapping about? Did he like... literally not watch the series?
if you think about it, the buu saga happened becasue goku decide that " hey, a tournament on earth would be nice. " . If goku isnt there vegeta wouldnt be a majin, because vegeta being a majin was a decision not submission, he was capable of resisting babidi spell at all and just decide to let him in because he's insecure about the gap between him and goku. so if goku never there vegeta and gohan would have a huge chance to prevent buu altogether, which prove goku was right with his decision.
and without buu thats mean no fat buu to annoy beerus (assuming beerus still get the dream and go to earth regardless of goku staying dead), and with buu still sealed its mean kid buu never get seperated from fat buu thus making moro a non threat since his seal would still be intact. the only problem that in theory will not solve itself without goku is zeno problem. without goku proposing a tournament zeno would just erase u7 without intervention. But if take a look at future timeline one can argue zeno somehow decide to not erase u7 even without ToP because f trunks timeline have passed the time of top and still not get erased somehow, not until zamasu fuse with the universe.
@@rifarira9160 To blame Vegeta becoming a Majin on Goku is like blaming a parent for their childs actions. While Goku (Or a parent) definitely have influence over Vegeta (or their child) neither one can directly force the other to make a decision.
On the other hand, Goku is LITERALLY responsible for the arrival of Raditz and ADMITS TO IT.
Pretty sure babidi was already on earth before goku arrived but yeah go on
@@ithoughtso.7016 yeah this comment about Goku causing the Buu saga makes no sense. Goku not being there wouldn’t change the revival at all, it would still happen.
I remember seeing a meme about how Super Buu is way more capable of reading a book than over half or the fans reading about DBZ. It's what the meme said, not me
Goku was with the Gohan the first 4 years of his life. Goku whole reason of fighting raditz was to get Gohan back and died for Gohan. This is the same Goku that likes to fight strong opponents and that is reasoning. But for this fight he literally says he is doing this for Gohan.
When Goku comes back the first thing he does is save gohan for getting killed by the saiyans. Same thing for Frieza saga. Saves gohan and heals his broken neck and in doing so he also gets to fight someone strong.
In the cell saga Goku spends all of time with gohan, especially in the room of spirit of time. Goku was the only one to believe in gohan and knew what he could do. Yes he didn’t realize gohan didn’t like to fight but the thing is Gohan does like to train. That easily could be confusing on Goku part of not understanding that Gohan is a gentle person. Also when Goku has to sacrifice himself to clean up gohans mess, he doesn’t blame gohan even though he told him to hurry up and finish off cell. Goku then says he is going to stay dead to protect his friends and family from harm. Does that suck for Gohan, yes but sometimes parents do the hard stuff to protect their children.
Goku comes back and what he said in the cell saga happened. Majin buu was able to come back because in part of majin Vegeta wanting to fight Goku. If Goku didn’t come back that fight wouldn’t have happened and babadi would have still been gathering energy. But this entire arc Goku has a better understanding of Gohan and is around when he can be. After in super Gohan is an adult. Goten got to spend a lot of time with Goku when he came back alive and into super. But again the first 7 years he was protecting them.
If Goku didn't come back probably Gohan and Vegeta would have cleared the ship and Killed Badibi and Dabura
@edAtolThis. majin vegeta happened because vegeta let it happen, without Goku there Vegeta wouldnt let babidi take over him. and without majin vegeta both of them would clear the ship and get to the bottom and have a huge possibility to prevent buu from awakening at all. Since buu never wake up, it means that kid buu never get seperated from fat buu and die, which mean seal on moro never become weak and thus preventing another danger. Heck without fat buu around Beerus perhaps wouldn't be mad thus preventing another danger.
Bro said the Father and son kamehameha was gohans imagination????? WALLAHIII🤦🏿♂️😂
"Gohan Im talking from the other world thanks to King Kai"
Obviously just imagination right?
The only imagination could be Goku being there but yhe whole talk? Nah
@@WonderedAtol gohan being schizo right as he's about to die lmfao
@@GeorgeTooCur1oustbf not only he just saw his father death, he's also bleeding while at the same time on a beam clash that decide the fate of the planet, that for sure will mess with your head a little.
Goku basically high jacked god’s Skype call just to encourage his son.
Is imagining his father being actually good and dare for once
Wtf is wrong with that guy? He must be a professional athlete considering the amount of hoops he's jumping through to make Goku out to be a bad father. Apparently dying for your children isn't enough to be considered a good parent (according to HIS standards apparently). Also he strategically chose to ignore things that happened off screen because if he DIDN'T then he would have no real argument against the fact that up to the point that Raditz showed up Goku had literally been there for Gohan since he was BORN.
As for the Cell Saga argument I think that's entirely unfair towards Goku, he realized just how much potential his son had and went out of his way to nurture his son's natural talent and strength. He literally put his son's growth before his own interest, if he was a more selfish person he could have focused entirely on himself and neglected Gohan's development...but he didn't. As for Piccolo telling Goku that Gohan didn't like to fight like it was the most obvious thing in the world, I'd argue the only reason HE knows that is because HE irresponsibly placed Gohan in dangerous situations MULTIPLE times up until Goku showed up in the Saiyan Saga. Goku may have made a mistake when giving Cell the bean however he only made that mistake because he was trying to help Gohan grow by setting him on a path he thought would lead to Gohan succeeding and he was arguably correct in the end.
I swear anytime you bring up the 4 years prior to Raditz showing up the "Goku is a Bad Dad" supporters look for anyway to discredit that fact
@xana7617 That honestly tops anything I've ever heard. Wow. That'd be like if people said Piccolo was a bad son for disregarding the reason King Piccolo created him
@xana7617 Yeah. And I agree with you. Especially in terms of operating by Dragon Ball standards, Goku is probably the best father in the show (not counting Grandpa Gohan) up until Krillin and 18 have Maron.
Maybe it's not Goku hate that's the reason, though that definitely is a factor. It kind of feels like those attempts to analyze a story to find some throughline that would've went over our heads as a kid but end up going so far in the opposite direction it loops back around to being completely wrong and ridiculous.
It's like if someone took away from the Star Wars prequels that the Jedi were wrong and blinded by dogmatic service to the force which caused them to accidentally create their ultimate undoing in Anakin. That would be fair up until you go as far as to say "So the sith are the good guys because they're allowed to have emotions and they're much more upfront with how self serving their code is".
@xana7617 Oh without a doubt. That's the main problem with the analyzation: it's overanalyzing.
And hey, it's been dying down for a while now. Hopefully the next misconception to get cleared up is Super Goku being more authentic to the character
My issue with the Goku being a bad dad take is that people will bring up Vegeta like he just clears as a dad prior to super. This man told Future Trunks he ain't give a fuck about him or Bulma, neglected present day Trunks until he was a super saiyan, and threw away what little bit he did have just to fight Goku again in the Buu arc.
OMG yes! Like oh "Goku is a bad dad, not cause he's a Saiyan look at Vegeta. Vegeta just casually calling his son trash and literally not giving a fuck tll Future Trunks freaking dies. It reminds me of the video of Trunks dying where commenters were saying how Vegeta was a better dad cause he got mad. Disregarding how much of a crappy parent he was. Literally could've been training and helping each other get stronger but relied on pride.
The dude never embraced his son for 8 years straight. Is Vegeta more present. Yes, but "present" is being confused for "good" here. He antagonizes his future son and only really shows he cares *after his death.* I have never gotten that argument.
@@castform7 it's funny cause that's actually the reason why I get annoyed at the character I guess. Like yes Goku isn't present but he still has means to communicate. Like just talking to your family lol.
@@AL7249 That's a fair point. Like yeah, I get that he probably wants no connection to the Earth after the sacrifice but I don't think a call once or even twice a month would hurt. The only reason not on Goku I could see is King Kai just not wanting to be a cell phone.
@@castform7 yeah I don't see how that's going against him not wanting to be a magnet for trouble to have Goten know his Dad.
When he said “time spent together off screen doesn’t count” i knew this video was gonna be what it was.
I knew it when he was hyping up his own IQ
If Gohan actually had PTSD then he would be refusing to fight altogether. He isnt traumatized thats just what the fanbase thinks he is. Goku is a top tier dad cause i dont know any father that would literally die for their son twice like he did
even though he did punch gohan when he tried to fly away from the time chamber to face the androids/cell (i cant really remember which one💀) it was for a good reason. that reason being that he basically stopped gohan from getting himself killed
@@Golden_Fredina0 he's punched Gohan enough times to remind him he's the FATHER 😭😭😭
@@Golden_Fredina0That punch is filler
In the manga he just stops him without hurting him
@@theblacknaruto 1 was to stop him from approaching Cell and the other punches were for training in the chamber
Yeah man. You cooked. That other guy was reaching to the pits of hell to the high heavens.
Gohan never once said he didn't like fighting.... he dealt with doubt. And hates senseless killing...
You're so wrong, piccolo said he didn't like fighting, Gohan even was hesitant to fight cell, and at the end of z he literally stopped fighting whatsoever.
@01_171 read the message carefully.... I said Gohan never "said" it piccolo is not Gohan. Gohan was also a have human kid. He was more scared or doubtful than anything. That has nothing to do with not liking to fight. He said he didn't like senseless killings. And his mother didn't like fighting and wanted him to be a scholar. So for you to say that last part makes no sense.
He says he doesn't like fighting to Cell in chapter 210 of the manga
@michael_mcgowan I never read the Manga so I can't speak on it, if I'm wrong in wrong. But I've never hear him say he didn't like fighting specifically
@@kurltonfalconer9353 I got the actual quote that the guy is referencing for you if you're interested. Gohan says, "But I don't like to fight... Like dad does. I don't want to kill anybody."
Goku doesn't understand most people. But he's not a bad dad. If my dad trained me to become a super Saiyan, idgaf we're cool. Even if you just want to work in some lab, what are you worried about? Your family isn't ever getting mugged at gunpoint. You move faster than they can fire and bullets can hit your skin and fall off. Even if you aren't a fighter, he unlocked your ability and you're living the safest life ever. Even if you dislike fighting. Stand up for yourself.
Fr, like at least he’s not heihachi. Now THATS a bad dad
@@nicholasrolack1017 Heihachi is like when your dad went out for milk but he came back for blood (™️)
Goku is a better parent than most parents real life.
ruclips.net/user/shortszARyduo9iCQ?si=GriOn5P-u1QM6wPe this yt shorts video had parents leaving their child just cause the kid was annoying them by playing his car. Then what happened, the kid died due to get hitted by a car. I was like i swear to god, these people shouldnt call goku a bad father when you have this shit in real life.
In Super, Vegeta is waiting for Bulla to be born and Goku tries to convince him to come train (for the ToP, I think). Vegeta explains why he can't go, and Goku says that he wasn't there for either of his sons' births. Vegeta calls him a bad father, which is ironic considering where he was when Trunks was born.
For Goku’s part, it actually makes sense. Goten for obvious reasons, but in Gohan's case it should be remembered that they live in the wilderness and Goku goes out to hunt for food basically every day. I imagine that while he was out, Chi-Chi went into labor. As we know, baby gonna come out when baby wanna come out, and the mother doesn't have too much say on when that happens.
also let's not forget about vegeta not giving a fuck about trunks until he died in the cell saga, he also didn't care about bulma
@@liquid1514yeah in the cell sega I think the only thing vegeta called bulma was women
@@liquid1514remember when vegeta watched as BABY TRUNKS AND BULMA ALMOST FELL TO THEIR DEATH??
definitely a better father than goku 💀
@@Zeno1781not only that he also like beat his teen son just to fight perfect cell
Finally!!!! I’ve been arguing with my homeboy for years about this shit. People need to stop saying the dude is a bad dad. I know he isn’t perfect but my god the fact that people believe that being dead isn’t a fucking valid excuse or that saving your fucking kid is “basic”; like seriously, why in every other instance is sacrificing one’s self to save someone a heroic gesture, but the moment Goku does it for his son, he’s not a good father?! Could he have been better in some regards, sure but my god what the fuck else is he supposed to do?! Also a good father teaches his son how to defend himself. Like… that’s literally what he did. And his son enjoyed training with his dad. The hate that people have for Goku is so fucking wild.
No way he did the “dragon ball fans dont watch the show” meme at the beginning and then proceeded to say the shit that he said
the fact that he dosnt mention that goku ends up acceptingg and supporting gohans intterest in being a scholar after the cell games and into super even though goku himself couldnt be any less interested in it
Actually, during the Cell Games, he supports it. When trying to convince Gohan to fight Cell, he says, "Do it, Gohan! Bring peace back to the world. You want to grow up to be a scientist, don't you?" (Chapter 209 of the manga)
Goku when talking abt his son : “Nah he’d win”
He died for Gohan twice....
very true, every time goku died it was to save gohan
Bro literally teamed up with his worst enemy to save his son
He also let ppl who almost killed his son live so idk how much dying for him matters when u aren't willing to kill the ppl putting him at deaths door
@@bandwagon2290who killed his son that Goku let live
@noah_256. I said almost but tp answer ur question he let vegeta live, the ginyu force, frieza, and gave cell(the guy talking about blowing up the planet) a senzu bean to fight his son fairly
This man said, “He saved Gohan because Raditz was about to blow up the planet.” Here are my problems with that horrendous take:
1.) It’s been established that in order to blow up a planet you need a power level of 10,000+. Raditz had a power level of 1200.
2.) Raditz came to Earth to recruit Goku and when Goku was unwilling Raditz made him an impossible offer: He kidnapped his son and told him to kill and stack on the beach of Roshi’s Island, 100 Earthlings by the next day. Now my fellow DB enthusiasts, what did Goku do immediately after Raditz pimped off with his son and that new information? To run the ones with his brother to get his son back. There was no hesitation. He even teamed up with his mortal enemy at the time to do it.
Exactly what I said in my comment 😂…… I probably didn’t explain it as well as you did but still
3. It's still him saving his son. Any parent willing to sacrifice themselves to save their child is a good parent.
i even vaguely remember Goku crawling on all four begging raditz to let Gohan go after gohan head butt raditz
Gohan also came off as if he liked or didn’t mind fighting especially when it was no other option which Goku did know and that’s what he wanted to bring out of gohan. His plan just wasn’t all the way thought out because he didn’t quite fully understand Gohan. But here is the question……. How many of our parents understood who we were fully?
And it’s stupid to say he’s a bad father for that because after Piccolo yells at him about it Goku immediately asked for a senzu so he could go back to fighting instead of Gohan. He acknowledged he was wrong and tried to correct it immediately
@@ithinkimanaries2620 Piccolo doesn’t fully understand gohan either
@@jason15212But of course they don't when piccolo is around Is Gohan is usually in trouble when Goku is around Gohan steps the F up
Piccolo saw Gohan being frozen in Fear against Nappa
Goku saw Him STARING DOWN GREAT APE VEGETA
@@ithinkimanaries2620What's crazy about that scene is that people forget the only reason Piccolo even understood that was because Gohan flat out told him that himself before proceeding to tell Gohan to just deal with it and do whatever he actually wants after they beat the Saiyans. You know, pretty much the same scenario minus Goku being aware and dismissive of his son's wishes. Like you said, the second it's brought to his attention he's ready to handle it himself.
Anyone who says goku is a bad father needs to rewatch db
Based take. Goku is a tough parent, but far from bad lol
If you are talking about Sage than right.
If you are talking about the other dude all his arugements are things Goku couldn't control and or wouldn't know.
He's the exact opposite of tough. Infact he's far too kind and lenient. 😅
From the beginning of z skip frieza saga move to the android saga all we see is goku spending every minute with his family,
For context after the ending to dragon ball goku and chi chi were living together, goku hunts for food chi chi takes care of the house when they had gohan the same thing goku hunts chi chi cooks and clean:Beginning of Z he’s shown doing the same thing just with son until he decides to introduce his kid to his friends.
Android saga:after goku returns to earth and gets bad new from trunks he ‘s shown at home training with piccolo until gohan interrupts (expressing his desire to fight) goku sees this and believes his son would follow in his footsteps. Continuing on from that goku takes gohan to the time chamber where he learns of gohans potential in comparison to his own,Goku probably wouldn’t give cell a senzu beam if gohan didn’t express to his father those same desires.
You could also look at it as a way to have cell not just immediately go for the Kill because he was Definitely infuriated
@@painvillegaming4119Yes a weakend Cell would have gone a lot more desperate if he realized Gohan's power maybe even going for the bomb before a ssj2 could happen
@@WonderedAtol I don’t think he would go for the bomb but he would definitely start throwing death beams
33:35 I believe that Goku giving Cell a Senzu bean was actually a High IQ move that goes over a lot of people's heads. Goku knew that Cell had Freeza AND Vegeta's DNA. Goku has fought both of them and knows their fighting style. He knows that when both of them think they have an advantage in a fight they won't take it seriously and will make unnecessary mistakes. Both of them could've killed Goku quickly if they seriously fought him at full power in the beginning of their Fights. Goku also knows that when Vegeta and Freeza think their opponent has an overwhelming advantage they crashout and try to blow up the planet.
Cell's overconfidence was what allowed Gohan the time necessary to achieve ssj2 in the first place. Side note: remember when Goku kept smiling while saying I knew it after Gohan went ssj2. Goku also warned Gohan to finish the fight quickly because he'd seen the pattern twice already and knew Cell was bout to crash out and blow up the Planet. EVEN THEN, Goku didn't blame Gohan. He took responsible for his mistake(not know Gohan didn't like to fight) and sacrificed himself to save Gohan.
It feels like this guy doesn't really understand what a priority is. As an analogy I bring up Mario Galaxy. Bowser's ultimate goal is to take over the universe. Mario, in stopping him, saves the universe but his main priority is saving Peach. Getting Peach out of danger was the most important thing to him. Same for Goku. Stopping Raditz would save the planet but the main thing on Goku's mind is making sure Gohan is safe.
Is Goku a flawed father. Yes, he showed a lapse in understanding about what is son wanted on a monumental scale. But even once he learned about it, he gave his life up for it and was prepared to stay dead for the rest of eternity purely because he is that magnet for danger that he now wants to keep away from his son and everyone else.
Also the "just his imagination" point is in general stupid. We, in any dub of the anime, are shown Goku in Other World conversing through King Kai to Gohan. There isn't, nor should there be any ambiguity to if Goku was actually there or not. 5 year olds could probably pick this up.
What does Mario have anything to do with dragon ball?
@@lightgivemepower6425 Nothing. I'm making a parallel and to do that, I go towards a different series. In both scenarios, a character's main objective is protecting one person close to them rather than the world/universe at large.
@@castform7 I haven't played Mario Galaxy but do you think that Mario would have fought Bowser even if Peach wasn't kidnapped?
@@bdg1970 Yes, in the same way I believe Goku would still fight for the planet if Gohan wasn't kidnapped. With both kidnappings happening though, it turns the protection of the planet/universe into an extra large bonus rather than the main goal.
9:30 any one else notice that the video just didn't acknowledge the fact that Goku, upon realizing he might be wrong, Immediately asked for a Senzu bean so he could go save his son from someone he knew he had no chance of defeating.
I did
A point that I don't get that people bring up is the year that he spent training on Yardrat. Sure he refused to come back to earth. But the technique that he learned on Yardrat helped not only save the Earth but also his son. If he didn't learn the instant transmission EVERYONE including Gohan would have LITERALLY DIED.
I feel the need to bring up that Gohan struck Raditz on the chest, cracked his armor and ribs, which led to Raditz's focus to go squarely on the boy. He proceeds to kick Gohan, knocking him out, and approach him with energy gathering to finish the job. "Blow up the planet..." Raditz can decimate a city or two, but way less efficiently than Nappa and his Giant Storm. I mean, part of why he was heading to Earth was because he sucked at his job. So yeah, Earth wasn't going to be immediately destroyed like people assume. Raditz isn't *that* powerful.
He probably has the power to destroy earth but he sure as hell ain't doing it while being on the planet
Roshi blew up the moon. And using calcs it was large planetary level.
Raditz is many many leagues above and nappa only did that cause he wanted the earths dragon balls because immortality. So blowing uo earth would be the stupidest decision by them. Bruh did you even watch or read og dragon ball or dragon ball z?
@@tonggtieiMaybe Raditz has Planetary level Attack Potency but I don't think he has the Attack Range to accomplish it, I guess if he destroys Earth's core he'd be able to.
@@ElHarmonyV roshi has moon busting power for dc. And for calcs large planetary busting abilities for dc. Raditz who is far greater then that roshi would easily have the power to destroy earth.
Both Roshi and Piccolo destroyed the moon quite easily with far less power than Raditz.
I think Raditz could destroy the earth but it wouldn't be "reduced to ashes" as Vegeta states he's capable of.
Raditz would most likely be able to blow a large chunk out of the earth, which would most definitely destroy the planet's atmosphere and structural integrity.
Its crazy how people thinking that goku should think like a human father as if he isn’t from a warrior alien race
I believe Goku is a good dad. He loves his kids and they know he loves them. His absence is almost always either to stop harm from following him to his family or training so he can stop an imminent threat. He had missteps and made mistakes, but his kid's well-being and potential were always at the forefront of his mind.
Gohan says he doesn't like fighting. Goku pushes his son to be strong enough that if Gohan HAS to fight, he can survive. Goku HAS respected Gohan's chocies and even encouraged him to be a scholar. He knew Gohan was the only one who could beat Cell.
This man reached far as hell for like all his points lmao
Gohan imagined it😂 that’s wild
10:14 this point is really stupid. Goku spent 5 years with his family and rarely kept up with his training, and what happened? An alien from space way stronger than him beat him an took his son. This is something Piccolo and Vegeta recite alot, that even though they are in a time of peace, that doesn’t excuse getting soft and sloppy. Goku prioritizes training not only to keep himself in fighting shape but to also be strong enough to handle any potential threats that could endanger the earth and his family. He is not going to be caught lacking again.
agree, but then super goku comes (he caught lacking a lot)
I hate how people say Goku rather train than to be with his family. He has to train because of he hadn’t all his friends and family would have been dead. Training has been necessary
He had that point about Raditz COMPLETELY backwards. He said he fought Raditz to save the Earth, and saving Gohan was just a byproduct of that. No. He went there to save his son, and he stated that. Saving Gohan was why he confronted Raditz, fought him, and died. Saving the Earth was the side note
When Goku came back for 24hrs, all Gohan wanted people to see was how great his dad is go back watch the arc
This is why i fuck with you sage, because you have a heart, this goku hater deadass sounds like hes so full of himself and views people less. That sorta negative energy shit deadass clouds judgment. I fucking love you dog❤❤❤🫡
We're also forgetting the fact that gohan considered goku as a good dad because when explaining goku to goten gohan calls goku like an angel
What's really crazy is that he said he hasn't consumed the other media surrounding Goku but it's willing to make an "objective" take on him as a character.
9:54 It’s funny how the dude in the video says that Gohan hates fighting. Yet Gohan volunteers to go to Namek to help bring everyone back die to responsibility. If he didn’t like anything related to fighting he would’ve elected to stay on Earth.
Nobody brings ever brings this up but when goku appears in battle the first thing he usually does is tell gohan to LEAVE. Or he gives him a job to where he doesn’t have to confront the threat ( androids 19 and 20 arrive) up until the Cell saga where he see’s gohans true potential.
THINK ABOUT THAT SHIT
@xana7617there's a scientific name to this phenomenon, basically people will hold to their view even if its wrong because pride/dont want to be on the wrong side but to prideful to admit it.
"Gohan was just on the planet. Goku didn't save gohan directly." No, that's an argument on how he saved chi chi. He fought raditz to save gohan specifically, and the planet was what happened to be a side effect of beating raditz. Not the other way around
Some things you both missed
1. Gohan LOVES fighting. He's a half saiyan which they all love fighting. He just doesn't like fighting to the death like Goku. Goku said he's having fun even though he's in trouble. Gohan enjoys training. He just doesn't like hurting and killing.
2. Goku was wrong for misjudging Gohans will to fight but was 100% correct that Gohan would beat Cell and was the only hope. If your son was the only person with the power to no diff the villain that no one can beat, would you make him go home or fight?
3. Goku took up for Gohans mistake with that sacrifice
4. Breaking the laws between life and death is pretty loose in the dbz universe and you gotta accept it. Talking to Gohan from the dead doesn't break any rules and only proves that he's a good dad.
Almost forgot: The senzu bean thing wasn't bad and you can't give a good explanation as to why it was. 1, Gohan could handle it 2, Gohan DID handle it. It made 0 difference. Making Gohan fight Cell = Lions making their cubs hunt or humans giving their pets live feedings. Except The cub/pet is stronger than you and the live feeding and if they don't take it out then the earth will be destroyed.
Episode 1 is literally all about Goku and Gohan. Every time Goku is off screen he's spending time with Gohan. Now every time he's off screen he's spending time with Goten
People forget or ignore the fact that piccolo made the “mistake” of relying on gohans power without considering his gentle nature in the saiyan saga & it caused tiens death, however that arc proved gohan is not a coward & when everything was on the line he stood 1v1 against vegeta to protect goku (all of which piccolo didn’t witness) while he taught krillan to direct the spirit bomb. Goku in the end made the right choice in the cell saga because he was the only person beside gohan himself that knew what he was capable of when pushed into a corner. All it took was android 16 to explain that given the circumstances letting go of that kindness to protect the things you hold dear is okay. Gohan doesn’t display any trauma through the franchise but he isn’t fearless like goku & piccolo. he doesn’t hate fighting. He hates being powerless to protect his friends & hates needless killing/suffering
People calling Goku a bad dad while Vegeta literally got Bulma pregnant then left for a year and a half or whatever to train then basically told his literal grown up future version of his son “What *ABOUT* my wife and toddler son?” When Gero escaped the Z Figthers in the canyon will forever confuse me. Goku at least spent time with Gohan pre Raditz, time with him in the time chamber, and didn’t just “Ight I’m dead Gohan, you’re the strongest one left so ball tf up.” Meanwhile Vegeta literally didn’t give two shits about Trunks until he was dead. If any other parent did that would we be saying that’s a good parent?
All fathers make mistakes , and goku is not your normal over achiever alpha male dad . He knows what was best for Gohan , he knew Gohan needed to be strong as well as he needed to improve his own strength to secure a future for earth. Goku needed to take every opportunity to get stronger even if it means time away from Gohan , or the next villain would slaughter everyone .
Goku trains so that his life Has a normal life yes goku does love fighting he loves the excitement of the battle but 2 thing can be true at once
Raditz never said he was going to blow up the planet lol. Raditz's only threat was that he was going to take gohan if goku didn't kill 1000 people. Bro did not watch dragon ball and he's saying that we didn't 😭
Don't fuck with dragon ball fans, we haven't watched the series
@@terminalfeetingum did you watch db cause
Raditz scales to planetary level
@@Kikikikenokenohe wasn't gonna blow up the planet 🤣
Goku and chichi are great parents look at gohan he’s successful has a wife and kids and super strong
I think DBZA also did a lot of damage in adding to the goku is a bad father allegations...or maybe it's just something only I noticed.
The brainrot was already there, TFS just multiplied it.
Remember if goku was only concerned about the planet’s safety, he would’ve done everything raditz said and killed 100 earthlings and left the earth with him. He may cares about the planet’s safety, his immediate goal was to save his son.he even tries to calm gohan down by telling him that daddy is here.
I'm surprised he didn't bring up the fact that Goku saves Hercule and Dende instead of Gohan and Goten when Kid Buu blew up the planet
In hindsight it was the better decision
Tbh he COULDNT have because he didn’t have enough time to be able to reach gohan and plus it ended up working out in the end
You do realize how fast Kid Buu’s blast was right? It was so fast that Kibito Kai using instant transmission just barely saved Goku and Vegeta and earth is vaporized before Kibito Kai, Goku, and the Others reach the Land of the Kai’s. Simply put, Goku simply didn’t have time and was under pressure.
@@SamuelRondreigz4720plus you know.…dragon balls
There was no time
Everyone would have died if he did that
"The mountain wouldn't kill gohan." Raditz confirmed his power level at that time was 1. That mountain would have killed gohan. Lol
Around 8:25 fool says gohan didn't ask to be savior of earth, he contradicted himself by saying goku didn't save his son from raditz but the planet which everyone would do. That cell arc was implying goku can't be the protector forever and his son would have to take up the mantle because he is the only one that has the power too. So,
When goku saves gohan, it's actually saving the planet which everyone would choose. But when goku sends gohan to fight cell now he forced to be the one to save the planet... but i thought everyone would choose to save the planet?!
I need to know this man's dr*g dealer, because ain't no way he thought Gohan imagined Goku was there 🤣😭
Agreed
Goku never took an oath to be like super man and watch after the planet. Most anime protagonist aren’t trying to save the world just to save their family.
The Android and Cell Saga training, if Gohan had SAID “I don’t wanna fight, I hate it” Goku very much would’ve been like “that’s ok Gohan, that means I’ve gotta train even harder” or gave him a motivational speech about how much potential he sees in his son. Gohan HAS expressed he likes learning so Goku lets that happen. I forget what arc it was but someone brought up bringing Gohan in for the fight and Goku DIDNT WANT TO DRAG GOHAN INTO IT. For some reason Super just did a LOT of character regression.
This was a hard watch. He definitely believes he’s the smartest person constantly. The fact that he ignored the reason why Goku went to fight Raditz was stupid he also ignored the fact that Goku was right staying away from earth because his Friends and family had peace for 7 years. These Goku bad dad takes aren’t even takes anymore it’s just people choosing to be stupid 😂
if you think about it, the buu saga happened becasue goku decide that " hey, a tournament on earth would be nice. " . If goku isnt there vegeta wouldnt be a majin, because vegeta being a majin was a decision not submission, he was capable of resisting babidi spell at all and just decide to let him in because he's insecure about the gap between him and goku. so if goku never there vegeta and gohan would have a huge chance to prevent buu altogether, which prove goku was right with his decision.
and without buu thats mean no fat buu to annoy beerus (assuming beerus still get the dream and go to earth regardless of goku staying dead), and with buu still sealed its mean kid buu never get seperated from fat buu thus making moro a non threat since his seal would still be intact. the only problem that in theory will not solve itself without goku is zeno problem. without goku proposing a tournament zeno would just erase u7 without intervention. But if take a look at future timeline one can argue zeno somehow decide to not erase u7 even without ToP because f trunks timeline have passed the time of top and still not get erased somehow, not until zamasu fuse with the universe.
People say Vegeta is a good dad when this dude nearly let his wife and son get killed until Future Trunks saved the day.
He didn’t hug or hold his son til 7 years old. But Goku is a bad dad
I rarely even let people pull the bad dad card with Goten. Whenever Goku isn’t training it’s very rare to not see him with Goten. He’s usually eating food at home or working as a farmer with Goten. Goten’s main criticism is his wasted potential but it’s mainly because Goku has learned the error of his ways and flat out doesn’t train his son to keep him out of harms way.. you’ll never hear this from Mr.1000000 iQ DB Savant over there though
even then goku never force gohan to train, gohan always gave goku consent to train him.
16:00 was probably the stupidest argument the guy bashing Goku made.
Raditz came to earth to kill Goku, Androids were made for the sole purpose of killing Goku. Bad guys do come to Earth because Goku is there. Goku's logic was actually very sound.
But also let me just point out with the confusing that Gohan doesn't like fighting thing, Goku's entire upbringing was fighting his whole damn life. It was how he got his food, how he made friends, how he met his wife. 19:59 what does this guy mean Frieza was eventually going to show up on Earth? Earth was seen as a low level interest planet. There are billions and billions of planets. Earth could have died before Frieza ever got there.
Small correction: Raditz didn't come there to kill Goku. He came there to see what his brother was up to. Then beat his ass and used Gohan as leverage to make him kill earthlings like a True Saiyan.
I'm surprised that Vegeta isn't brought up in the bad father discussion considering he's borderline abusive & neglectful to his family in Z & very emotionally (sometimes physically) absent at the start of Super. No, I'm not talking about everything he did/said to Trunks before he knew he was his son, even after he knew, was cold, condescending, & dismissive of him.
I feel bad for trunks. Imagine seeing your dad but he turns out to be an AH
@@Phoenix_Blader_93
Made worse by all the hype Bulma must have built up. No way Trunks didn't go in knowing his dad was a self-centered, prideful a-hole.
Thank you! My thing about Goku or any male saiyan being a father whose actually present in the lives of their children is unheard of. They are made and raised to be warriors, not care takers. Gohan's childhood was far from perfect but Goku did his best
Im not gonna the second he said that goku dying for his son is misleading i lost all interest.
Edit: i generally think this some of the dumbest shit ive watched in a long-time.
Dude I'm at that point and it feels like my brain is hurting. OMG! I'd feel bad but I just wanna rant and roast him.
Seconded. My head hurts after hearing his arguments.
@@N_DAnimationEnthusiast trust me yall anit the only ones holy shit people are so damn stupid.
The scary thing is, this isn't even the worst take about dragon ball. The fact that there are people who have said dumber things than this guy is crazy
@@terminalfeeting i really feel like I'm gonna regret but what are they?
17:51 the LITERAL day that Goku came back to life, the fucking apocalypse occurs, the entire population (except a human, God, and a fucking dog) gets exterminated, and the earth gets destroyed. All over the course of a goddamn week.
Goku had every reason to stay dead lmao
Goku is more of a danger than Hulk, Cthulhu and every other destroyer of worlds.
Its better to have no hero than a Trouble magnet like this clown Goku
@@maalikserebryakov I said none of those words but ok
I'll give bro one thing, was right when he said he's been on Twitter
Cuz that was the most cherry-picked, disingenuous, biased bullshit I've EVER seen used to argue that Goku is a bad father.
Bro thinks he's so smart but can't fathom the idea that Goku literally hasn't seen a lot of the rough things Gohan went through.
And lemme just poke an additional hole in his argument while the getting is good. He says misunderstanding his son is another thing that makes Goku a bad father, but SINCE WHEN does misunderstanding your child automatically label you a bad parent? There's SO many people who's parents misunderstood them when they were younger when it came to their interests, ideals, beliefs, etc, but you can still be a GOOD PARENT my guy.
My parents misunderstood me a lot when I was younger, but they were AMAZING parents.
this
"Kakarot, I have to stop calling you a clown, because I found the clown and he's calling you a horrendous father."
Tbf, Gohan disliking fighting had no setup and no build up from a reader's perspective. Gohan was always shown to be one of the first people to the action, even if hopelessly outmatched, and at least enjoys training. It's more of a failure on Toriyama's part due to the lack of setup, but it's alright because it was a cool and iconic moment.
It was still a mistake on Goku's part (even Goku himself thinks it was), but it's a very forgivable one that's easy to make when not even the readers could've known about Gohan's dislike for fighting.
Yeah... Once he got to Namek. And if it wasn't from his rage kicking in, it was from his sense of duty and desire to protect people. Neither of which means he likes having to fight in such serious situations. He fought because he felt he had to, not because he wanted to.
@@espurrseyes42 Doesn't change it having poor build up as he wasn't hinted at to dislike fighting.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but the only times I can think of is against Raditz and Nappa due to lack of experience in real battles. Even then he was shown to enjoy it when fighting the dinosaur during Piccolo's training, and when first arriving on Namek he highfives Krillen after beating up the Freiza soldiers that blew up the ship.
I'm not saying it's wrong for Gohan to dislike fighting, I'm saying that an important moment for Gohan's character didn't have the proper build up from the reader's perspective so it's forgivable for Goku to make that mistake.
Also Cell and Buu are the only characters he has to fight out of duty due to being the strongest one on earth during those times.
@@OpenKoms
Yes. Because he could handle the dinosaur and Frieza Soldiers. Shit wasn't serious life or death type shit.
No. The entirety of Namek was duty. Because he wanted to go there to help revive his friends that died because he couldn't get the job done against Nappa. Same thing happened with all of the Android stuff. He wants to be able to fight alongside everyone and not be the deadweight that gets everyone killed trying to save him like against Nappa.
If it wasn't rage, it was a desire to not let a Nappa Wipe happen again, or make up for said wipe, pushing Gohan into combat. We've never seen him genuinely enjoy fighting or wanting to get involved in serious battles, let alone being put in the high pressure situation of him being the last resort instead of his dad.
@@espurrseyes42 I'm saying Gohan's dislike of fighting wasn't properly built up to.
There are moments where he is shown to possibly like fighting or dislike fighting, but they are up to interpretation on whether it was something else that caused the reaction and not his enjoyment or lack there of for fighting. Plus the most apparent ones for both liking and disliking are in the Saiyan Saga, so they're pretty old.
For example; he enjoyed training with Goku and Piccolo, but it's much easier to interpret his enjoyment towards spending time with his father figures than him liking fighting.
I'm not arguing that he shouldn't dislike fighting or that he didn't fight out of necessity, but that he wasn't properly hinted at to dislike fighting for the purpose of building up to the moment he says it in the Cell Saga so Goku should be forgiven for making the mistake of sending him into battle.
@@espurrseyes42 I also didn't say that Namek wasn't done out of duty, and if I did then it was completely wrong. Gohan made it quite clear in the hospital scene that it was out of duty. Just to be clear.
Dude I never understood the raditz argument. Goku literally teams up with piccolo, who wants him dead btw, specifically because raditz kidnapped Gohan.
The four dumbest things Dragonball fans say:
1. Goku is a bad dad
2. Piccolo is black/also he's Gohan's "real dad" despite having kidnapped him and stranding him in the wilderness for 6 months
3. The dumbest Yamcha jokes they beat like a horse's skeleton
4. CaN hE bEaT gOkU tHo? (The Nasuverse beats Goku, The Zodiac Knights from Saint Seiya beat Goku, Sailor Moon beats Goku, any Digimon ultimate level and above, beats Goku)
4 is wrong keep on coping with ur old ass shows pokemon is dead btw 😂😂😂
I think that Goku was more scared of Chi Chi getting angry than His brother kidnapped his kid.
Maturity is realzing chichi is the reason gohan is half and half about fighting. Because there has been multiple moments where gohan would train on his own or enjoy getting stronger. Because it's deadass shown when gohan fought goku that he enjoy fighting with his dad. You can argue it was for the sake of the universe but it doesn't chnage that fact that gohan was still enjoying himself.. at the end of the day having a earthling mother who constantly wants you to study and be a scholar so you can have a big house and money vs having a father who likes to train and get stronger gives him an identity crisis
Yes indeed
Gohan has never shown trauma from his past. He instead has shown regret for not stepping out of himself and making a difference.
Where’s the vegeta is a bad father vid? This man didn’t even acknowledge his future son and barely cared for his present son till he was 8
Reminder Gohan chose to go to namek and showed compassion for saving his friend.
As soon as you have to use a mistranslated bad dub as your argument instead of the manga or the original version of the dialogue, that's when you know you're wrong.
Note that Gohan wanted to go to namek so much he yelled at his mom, defend the namakiens of his own will, stop frieza even if it meant running the 1s, and during piccolos training he didnt throw him at obstacles that could realistically kill him.
Piccolo trains him after he just saw Gohan output more power than him or goku so he knows hes stronger than himself on a high end. Piccolo is training Gohan in the same environment he grew up in because its the only form of training he knows. He knows the sayins are coming and knows Gohan needs to be there to help protect the earth because piccolo understands hes not strong enough to do it himself.
And unlike Piccolos truly solitary childhood Gohan has someone looking after him at all times. Piccolo didnt abandon him in the valley he is in the air providing backup clothes and weapons any time he needs it.
GOHAN WANTED TO GO TO NAMEK
FOR HIS DAD
Actually, he wanted to go there because he felt responsible for Piccolo dying. He did ask for Goku's permission though. Goku said yes. Chi-Chi told Gohan no and Gohan told her off and she relented and let him go
The only time Goku messed up was when he gave the Sensu Bean to Cell and told Gohan to fight him...but thanks to Piccolo..Goku realized his mistake and took the L for him and apologized for not recognizing who his son was. After Cell Goku stopped pushing Gohan to fight ..gohan pushed himself against his mothers wishes because of the threat Buu posed
Them last comment really had sage thinking: hallelujah dbz fans can fucking read
Goku never said he didn't know his kids were born, he said he wasn't there when they were born, he was training
Indeed
this guy makes a lot of terrible points but one thing he does say that I've never seen anyone else adress is the fact that goku di not tell gohan any part of his plan. I don't think it makes him a bad father I just think his awful communication isnt brought up enough imo
I mean tbf i dont know who gohan thought he was training for if it wasnt for cell.
@@pixelspixelation6418gohan thought he's there just as a sparing partner for his father, not as the one his father prepared to fight cell
@@rifarira9160 i guess
Alternative name for the video you reviewing , "Man with no kids explains parenthood"
Goku 100% went to fight radditz right after getting demolished by him for the sole reason to get his son back
14:00 That guy seems to be forgetting/leaving 2 key details. It's not like Goku had a choice at the time. He was in the hospital, recovering. So Gohan straight up WANTED to go to Namek. Luckily Goku pulled up with sensu beans. This is him BEFORE learning instant Transmission too. I don't know where he got the idea Goku loved seeing Gohan in that condition, where he was worried for his friends in both Saiyan & Namek arcs. ( *Slight edit cause I rewatched the scene:* Goku even encourages Gohan to go, because he understood how much his friends meant to him. Another point about Goku & Gohan I'm bout to get into) Another is that Goku got the impression Gohan loves fighting, because his son was happy to train with him. Gohan even told his father to straight up hit him with everything he got, so he can finally protect himself & others. So you can say both instances Goku took it as not only he has a love for battles, but his son maturing, and got something to prove. That Namek & Cell saga comparasion was a huge reach. It was like that person who made the video only saw TFS, and saw that as the actual canon lol.