I have a 2 month old 23 lyrik ultimate and have experienced similar harness. I took the lower apart and inspected everything. It didn't seem like Rock Shock put enough oil in the fork. I put new oil in and notice immediately more sensitivity. I read one other user taking his fork apart and found almost no oil in the lowers.
@@jim6335I also saw something similar, with low oil volume. I completed an air spring upgrade with lower service and noticed the fork felt more plush at the beginning stroke.
Did you test the bushing stiction? The lower sensitivity could be caused by too tight bushings. That is a problem a lot of forks have and can be solved by burnishing the bushings. To test the bushings, take out the airshaft and damper and let the stanchions slide into the lowers. If you need to push them and they don't slide in almost by their own weight, the bushungs are too tight which will cause less sensitivity and more wear
If your fork is feeling harsh on small bumps , you might have air trapped in lowers . Release all the air from the air spring , does the lowers drop to the crown? It should do so by the weight of the bike itself . If not , press down on fork and press both pressure relief valves on both lowers to release any air trapped in lowers , (this only works if all the air is out of air spring ) Refile air spring being sure to cycle shock 5 or 6 times about half way full with air and again after full . If you had air trapped in lowers this will make a big difference on performance on the fork ....or at least it did on mine .
I have a 2023 150mm Lyrik on my full sus. Had no problem with it so far. I am still playing around with pressure and damping though. It does feel different to the Pike I had on there before, but that was a 3 year old fork, so had some wear on it I guess. I am running less pressure than recommended, but tend to ride a bit 'light' compared to some people. Really good quality build as well.
Will try these settings and see if the fork will improve. Agree that the trail head app suggestions are quite off for my riding. Thanks for doing the deep dive, not much out there that I've found on set up suggestions.
Kind of amusing how much work went into tuning it right off the bat. The previous gen was so good and mostly just worked out of the box. The amount of people who don’t know how to really thoroughly tune a fork (myself included), I think would be discouraged by that. And to have less small bump sensitivity than previous, to me that’s a downgrade, but hey, gotta keep making new and ‘better’ products to keep people wanting to upgrade.
I think this green will match my 20 trance perfectly As I bought it as a starter bike I never got along with the gold rl fork But find the bike to be a blast to ride and haven’t come across anything it couldn’t handle I think this fork will be the new winter upgrade Looking forward to dialing it in
No, thanks. These upgrades don't convince me to change from the incredible small bump sensitivity of the previous model (I even run the previous Debonair shaft for that reason). And the ride height can be easily tunable with tokens. The independent LSC and HSC make sense only if you haven't found a setup with which you are happy on the previous model...
your comments @ 11:35 about claims doesn't say anything about there being cross-talk.. Yes if you run your HSC all the way closed your fork is going to ride higher in its travel. Thats what any suspension with HSC adjusters should do. What you should have said is, "I haven't yet had the Charger 3 tested in the lab yet" that will be the only way you can make a claim about it not being "perfect"
That’s a lot of sag and your sat in the mid travel. Maybe no tokens and slightly increase pressure with lower sag would see you sat up in the travel and give better small bump. Just a thought.
Any chance if a side by side and ride comparisons between the new rockshox and fox? Get those suspension doctors and run the same trail, get a visual on how each is reacting. And, have a rep there to set up the system.
I’m getting a Pike Select+ on my new bike. I’m curious if it would be worth it to upgrade to buttercups. I believe it would be a $500 upgrade. Thoughts? Worth it?
If anyone has this fork in 29" & 150mm, can you tell me what you measure the axle to crown as? Rockshox says it should be 561mm but mine measures 571mm. Also my stanchion length is 160mm. I don't get it...
I would like to see a comparison between a lightweight non aero climbing bike with clipon aero bars vs. a high end aero bike, like a Aeroad CFR or Pinarello Dogma F riding on the hoods.
As a 56kg rider, I’m pretty worried about the heavy rebound damping, definitely sounds like I wouldn’t want to buy this blind without testing to make sure I can get it to rebound fast enough :(
pro tip: set speed to 1.25 to avoid the annoyingly slow speak. Nice reviews though. I own the 2023 zeb and think old zeb with seccus is better than the new.
@@craigmellin6217 I don't think the new spring with secus will work. Vorsprung does not recommend the luftkappe with secus as it will be much worse than doing nothing.
go with fox. way better. I have tried both ultimate super deluxe supreme mega pinacle apex #1 top shock from rockshox and even their megneg bs. and just like this new 2023 damper it sat low and ramped hard toward end of its travel. i absolutely hated how it felt. then I went with fox and immediately noticed a much plusher ride and mire linear stroke and still good bottom out support. i was able to ride much faster down hill and take corners faster because of the better support from the new fox float shock.
@Bikeradar New Lyrik Report on 2022 Ibis Ripmo 195lbs geared up. 160mm fork Sag 45mm 1 token PSI 71.5 LSC 0 HSC 1 Rebound 3 clicks in from full out (clockwise) Mid stroke support is a amazing on successive Sqaure edge rocks unlike the old Lyrik. But the small bump compliance isn't as smooth as the old Lyrik. I'll be searching for a better balance for small bumps compliance. Let me know if you have any tips.
@@Gavlister hard to swallow $375 after paying $1k for the new fork. I’m going to have Suspension Syndicate do a basic service to see if there is any manufacture gunk in it.
@@rockygibson1231 can you follow up on this? Would be great to know how it goes. I'm riding a 2020 Lyrik Ultimate. Tossing up on the secus upgrade or just getting this new fork. Had a ride on the same fork as mine with a secus and it was vastly improved
You do realise that it totally depends on the fork, rider weight and preference, right? Some people might run it fully open and still not have it fast enough, and some people might run it closed and not have it slow enough.
Is it the ultimate upgrade to your all-mountain machine? Let us know in the comments!
I have a 2 month old 23 lyrik ultimate and have experienced similar harness. I took the lower apart and inspected everything. It didn't seem like Rock Shock put enough oil in the fork. I put new oil in and notice immediately more sensitivity. I read one other user taking his fork apart and found almost no oil in the lowers.
I'm also running the same air pressure, open hs compression but I'm running about 12 clicks of rebound from closed and middle ls compression
@@jim6335I also saw something similar, with low oil volume. I completed an air spring upgrade with lower service and noticed the fork felt more plush at the beginning stroke.
First fork I've ever run without any tokens. Fantastic fork, tons of traction everywhere.
This video sounds better played at 1.25x speed.....
I just did that omg 😆 it was right speed
Thanks. Much better this way. At standard speed, dude talks like he’s trying to put you to sleep.
Did you test the bushing stiction? The lower sensitivity could be caused by too tight bushings. That is a problem a lot of forks have and can be solved by burnishing the bushings. To test the bushings, take out the airshaft and damper and let the stanchions slide into the lowers. If you need to push them and they don't slide in almost by their own weight, the bushungs are too tight which will cause less sensitivity and more wear
I have that problem with my SID fork. Im glad I read this.
If your fork is feeling harsh on small bumps , you might have air trapped in lowers .
Release all the air from the air spring , does the lowers drop to the crown? It should do so by the weight of the bike itself . If not , press down on fork and press both pressure relief valves on both lowers to release any air trapped in lowers , (this only works if all the air is out of air spring )
Refile air spring being sure to cycle shock 5 or 6 times about half way full with air and again after full .
If you had air trapped in lowers this will make a big difference on performance on the fork ....or at least it did on mine .
I have a 2023 150mm Lyrik on my full sus. Had no problem with it so far. I am still playing around with pressure and damping though. It does feel different to the Pike I had on there before, but that was a 3 year old fork, so had some wear on it I guess. I am running less pressure than recommended, but tend to ride a bit 'light' compared to some people. Really good quality build as well.
Rockshox quality, never let me down, my new solo air fork is so simple yet amazingly engineered, and with white lowers the look the BOMB
Will try these settings and see if the fork will improve. Agree that the trail head app suggestions are quite off for my riding. Thanks for doing the deep dive, not much out there that I've found on set up suggestions.
Kind of amusing how much work went into tuning it right off the bat. The previous gen was so good and mostly just worked out of the box. The amount of people who don’t know how to really thoroughly tune a fork (myself included), I think would be discouraged by that. And to have less small bump sensitivity than previous, to me that’s a downgrade, but hey, gotta keep making new and ‘better’ products to keep people wanting to upgrade.
I think this green will match my 20 trance perfectly
As I bought it as a starter bike I never got along with the gold rl fork
But find the bike to be a blast to ride and haven’t come across anything it couldn’t handle
I think this fork will be the new winter upgrade
Looking forward to dialing it in
No, thanks. These upgrades don't convince me to change from the incredible small bump sensitivity of the previous model (I even run the previous Debonair shaft for that reason). And the ride height can be easily tunable with tokens. The independent LSC and HSC make sense only if you haven't found a setup with which you are happy on the previous model...
your comments @ 11:35 about claims doesn't say anything about there being cross-talk.. Yes if you run your HSC all the way closed your fork is going to ride higher in its travel. Thats what any suspension with HSC adjusters should do. What you should have said is, "I haven't yet had the Charger 3 tested in the lab yet" that will be the only way you can make a claim about it not being "perfect"
I agree
so lyrik 2022 vs fox 36 ?which one do you feels is better
That’s a lot of sag and your sat in the mid travel. Maybe no tokens and slightly increase pressure with lower sag would see you sat up in the travel and give better small bump. Just a thought.
Any chance if a side by side and ride comparisons between the new rockshox and fox? Get those suspension doctors and run the same trail, get a visual on how each is reacting. And, have a rep there to set up the system.
Rear shock review please!
Sounds like the perfect damper and chassis for a coil spring + HBO if that'd solve the small bump stiffness
..........but why Green???????? Bring back Rock Shox Red, or at least have it as an option
it looks so good on that bike
I'm not convinced it's an upgrade if it's harsh over the small stuff. And you're not the first to report these findings.
These new forks are like new iPhones, I lost track of what is the latest. Im still on 2016 rockshox on 1 bike and 2018 fox on my other bike.
The new forks are amazing I can personally attest to this.
I was honestly expecting you to say the opposite with the new butter cups claiming to take out 20% of trail chatter with small bump compliance…
I have upgraded my Yari to Charger2.1 and it has similar improvements in the beginning of the travel.
I’m getting a Pike Select+ on my new bike. I’m curious if it would be worth it to upgrade to buttercups. I believe it would be a $500 upgrade. Thoughts? Worth it?
Sell them and buy the ultimates. Factor in the Labour price of someone swapping your damper and airshaft over if you can’t.
Hey, I has a San Quentin 2 with Revelation forks.
I would love to see a Pike Ultimate review
If anyone has this fork in 29" & 150mm, can you tell me what you measure the axle to crown as? Rockshox says it should be 561mm but mine measures 571mm. Also my stanchion length is 160mm. I don't get it...
Yes, shock review pls!
Maybe it's just me, but I'd never have a fork of that colour.
just took my new 150 for its first ride.
A 10 mile mostly road ride and my compression dial is leaking. FML!
Can't wait yr Zeb review
In the near future will the Charger 3 damper replace the Race Day damper found in the SID?
Probably not. A coil backed IFP Damper is much heavier compared to the expanding bladder type affair used in the raceday dampers.
Please do a review on the coil
Not good news for lighter riders that you had to run the rebound wide open.
Review on the new coil please
How about Lyrik Select...is it any good?
I would like to see a comparison between a lightweight non aero climbing bike with clipon aero bars vs. a high end aero bike, like a Aeroad CFR or Pinarello Dogma F riding on the hoods.
I would say those bikes would climb better but this new Lyrik would easily be better on rough descents.
As a 56kg rider, I’m pretty worried about the heavy rebound damping, definitely sounds like I wouldn’t want to buy this blind without testing to make sure I can get it to rebound fast enough :(
Exactly what I was thinking
Has anyone at BikeRadar or in this channel tried the Pike Ultimate Charger 3, also suffering from bad small bump sensitivity?
Sooo...you rode it with no rebound damping??
More interested in comparison of Lyrik Select (new) VS Lyrik Ultimate (old), as they have similar price
Ultimate old
Yeah the old ultimate is definitely superior, the damper is way better
Where is he riding?
pro tip: set speed to 1.25 to avoid the annoyingly slow speak. Nice reviews though. I own the 2023 zeb and think old zeb with seccus is better than the new.
....new with secus?
@@craigmellin6217 I don't think the new spring with secus will work. Vorsprung does not recommend the luftkappe with secus as it will be much worse than doing nothing.
@@craigmellin6217 this is what I'm thinking....addresses the small compliance
Super Deluxe review video please!
go with fox. way better. I have tried both ultimate super deluxe supreme mega pinacle apex #1 top shock from rockshox and even their megneg bs. and just like this new 2023 damper it sat low and ramped hard toward end of its travel. i absolutely hated how it felt. then I went with fox and immediately noticed a much plusher ride and mire linear stroke and still good bottom out support. i was able to ride much faster down hill and take corners faster because of the better support from the new fox float shock.
@@MM-tn3br go with Shimano shock cuz I can't tune a shock either. Girvin suspension is even better
The music was some what distracting while trying to listen to your review.
What model from Marvin is this bike in the video ??
Marin Alpine Trail XR
@Bikeradar
New Lyrik Report on 2022 Ibis Ripmo
195lbs geared up.
160mm fork
Sag 45mm
1 token
PSI 71.5
LSC 0
HSC 1
Rebound 3 clicks in from full out (clockwise)
Mid stroke support is a amazing on successive Sqaure edge rocks unlike the old Lyrik. But the small bump compliance isn't as smooth as the old Lyrik. I'll be searching for a better balance for small bumps compliance. Let me know if you have any tips.
I'm thinking this fork with the Vorsprung Secus may be a great option. The Secus definitely improves small bump compliance
@@Gavlister hard to swallow $375 after paying $1k for the new fork. I’m going to have Suspension Syndicate do a basic service to see if there is any manufacture gunk in it.
@@rockygibson1231 can you follow up on this? Would be great to know how it goes. I'm riding a 2020 Lyrik Ultimate. Tossing up on the secus upgrade or just getting this new fork. Had a ride on the same fork as mine with a secus and it was vastly improved
I'll stick with my fox 34
So much sag is weird...
Too bad they dont make it in red color. That green is fugly.
That sag…fork sounds awful.
$1000...Hell NO!
It is definitely a Fox 36 killer
now can you do an honest review? not the one where you got paid by rockshox to say nice things about their new stuff.
Who the f runs rebound fully opened
You do realise that it totally depends on the fork, rider weight and preference, right? Some people might run it fully open and still not have it fast enough, and some people might run it closed and not have it slow enough.
The fact that someone of average weight needed to run it wide open suggests that the adjustment range won't be good for lighter riders.