Old Town would make more money if they made their motorized kayaks upgradable. If you own a PDL already, you’re much more likely to pay $2k for the ePDL drive + wiring kit than you are to pay $6k for a whole new kayak.
Totally agree - and adding to what you're saying, I would love to see an Autopilot model with the versatility of being able to swap out the motor for a (separately purchased) PDL drive. I want to buy one, but I see myself wanting both drives and there's no way in hell I would want to buy two separate kayaks just to have both drives, it wastes too much space. Likely a pipe dream, but sure would be a sweet option. I guess the ePDL drive is the closest thing to having both, but I definitely see myself wanting more power during some days on the water.
FeelFree makes a pedal drive that can be easily motorized. However, it doesn't have the GPS capabilities of the AutoPilot. The best solution is to buy a pedal drive kayak and put a removable bow mount motor on it.
It's depressing seeing what Hobie has become. I've considered selling my 2019 Outback and 2018 Compass for upgrades, but I actually think their age is what makes me want to hold onto them for the quality issues you mentioned. The number one thing keeping me in a hobie is the Mirage drive. It's in my opinion the best non-motorized propulsion system available right now and it's why I won't buy an Old Town. Yet.
I think the EPDL will mostly help to sell their autopilot and pdl models. As the onboard any inventory, I’m sure that they will discount it to be priced slightly higher than the autopilot.
I just want the 3 companys feel free for the seat hobie for the drive and hull(pro-angler)and oldtown for the spot lock motor to come together and make that kayak...it would be the king of kings
I bought a Feelfree Lure II tandem with pedal drive when we moved from river country Idaho to lake country Idaho. I’m able to keep it in the water and use it every day all spring & summer. It’s been great! Early in the season I troll with a sinking line on my fly rod and flies or spinners. When the water warms up I switch to a floating line and flies or poppers. Trout, bluegill, bass & pike are abundant. I had originally shopped Hobie but the local dealer employees didn’t seem to know much about them. An avid kayaker friend steered me to a local business that has 37 years of only canoe and kayak experience and they carry Feelfree as their fishing kayak. The owner, independent of the company, personally guarantees everything he sells and has the credibility. I’ve seen some features on Hobie or Old Town kayaks that I thought looked more durable, or adjustable, or efficient but everything on my Feelfree has delivered 100% through two seasons of frequent use.
I can't argue about West Coast anglers being abandoned, but let's be honest, there's not much for dealer support either. If you're in Washington, Oregon, the western half of Idaho, and the western half of Montana, the closest place to go and try a few brands is Next Adventure in Portland. You'd think a kayak company would push to serve this market, just like boat brands have, but it's just not a priority to any of them.
I 100% agree. I don't know if its the distance from the east coast but many brands don't seem interested in the Northwest. Also most kayak shops here are pretty lame and I don't know of any with exceptional customer service.
Purchased my Native Titan 13.5 back in March 2019, it’s been an awesome rig for me since the first day I’ve had it on the water. Only drawback is it’s extremely heavy. Otherwise, it’s been a Beast on the water. Since I’ve had this rig I’ve installed a Minn Kota Terrova with spot lock, Hummingbird Solix 10, two usb ports and, the NLD upgraded steering handle. Over the winter I plan on installing the Torqeedo 1103 with foot control and led navigation lights. I may be in the market for another yak for my son to use once he’s back in the states after deployment.
For me I couldn’t pass on the price being that the rig was a demo. One of the biggest deciding factors for me was stability as I fish the back bays and larger reservoirs here in NJ.
Love your content. Has helped my fishing tremendously. BTW, I think a good lake to try for sizable Kokanee might be Holter Reservoir in Montana. It’s a beautiful lake too.
Absolutely agree that the west coast anglers have been abandoned! Started kayak fishing southern and central California coast in the 90's through 2015. Launching/landing through the surf. Started with Cobra Kayaks Fish-N-Dive and Marauder-XF, Malibu Kayaks X-Factor, Ocean Kayaks Trident 13. Cobra Kayaks dissolved years ago! They were the standard for offshore fishing in the 90's. Malibu Kayaks dissolved around 2019-2020. You're correct, since Johnson acquired Ocean Kayaks, there no longer exists any offshore Ocean Kayak that that I'd offshore fish from. The Prowler and Trident kayaks were great for offshore fishing! I wish I still had my Trident 13.... may have to scour ebay for one. Currently fishing the Viking Kayaks Profish Reload. It's a New Zealand kayak. But since moving to the Reno/Tahoe area I've had to switch gears to freshwater trolling for trout and Kokanee from my Viking Reload. I am in the market for a hands free/peddle kayak. Initially considered the Hobie Outback. But I hear so many fishermen in the northern California and Nevada areas reporting quality issues. For the past two years. I've been looking forward to "New" Hobie innovations... only to be disappointed by minor modifications and mostly "New" color schemes. Contemplating pulling the trigger on an Oldtown. Thanks again for your great content! Looking forward to your continued series on "Trolling depth calculations"... dodgers, different speeds (1.75 and ir 2.0mph), Mono diameters.... Thanks again!
Great video as always! As a great lakes angler i agree that most manufacturers have forgotten us in favor of other markets. I do run a hobie outback and a pa14 myself and love them both, although i do see room for improvement. Id be curious on your thoughts on the motorized movement.... im personally strongly against it. Just my two cents but kayak angling should have an element of physical difficulty!
Sadly I think you are spot on with hobie. I’ve been told Hobie has already moved much of their manufacturing to Mexico already. I feel like they are moving down hill very quickly. They have done a reorg in the company. Many of the reps have been let go. It just seems to all be going down hill.
Hi tyler, I love listening to your vast knowledge of kayak fishing. I never hear you talk much about feel free kayaks. They're made in Thailand but are affiliated with designers here in the US. I have a 11.5 lure pedal that is rigged for fishing... We fish the local lakes here in the Northwest and go out about 20 times a year. I've had this kayak for 3 years now and it's been trouble free. Just curious as to your input on the brand.... Keep up your videos and see you in 24
Really limited experience with the brand honestly. I know only a few people who fish from them. I wish the feel free lure II tandem allowed for two pedal drives. I'd probably get one for road trips with Sidra.
My thoughts on the old town $6000 ePDL is that’s it’s a swing and miss. Like you mentioned the timing of an expensive kayak like this is too much and I don’t believe there will be a huge demand for it. The used market is too good right now to pass up. It’s old town though so people will still buy it. They chose to not make the ePDL backwards compatible, fairly insulting to their current customer base. For that same price, you could build two paddle BigWater 132s with GPS (gps not available with ePDL) Xi3, wiring, bow mounts, and two batteries (all day power, versus ~3hour runtime of the ePDL). If you went to the used market right now you could buy two sportsman’s (better platform imo) a 106 pdl and a 120 autopilot and still save money. By the way, I’m not some old town hater. I fished tournaments out of a sportsman 106 pdl for three years and am currently wearing an old town hoodie.😅
I 100% agree with you. Slapping an Xi3 on the bow of any pedal kayak is the way to go. You get all the benefits of ropeless anchor, cruise control, plus pedal and electric power. Also you always just leave the motor at home for those days you don't need it.
@@spiltmilt I was pretty hyped about the teasers old town was doing for this rollout. It definitely disappointed me. I think if it came out at a cost less than an AP I wouldn’t have even batted an eye but unfortunately the cost isn’t even close.
Hobie moved their Oceanside facility to Mexico, and problem is they cannot keep up production and having supply chain issues. Also Vibe kayak is actually not bad, their shearwater is stable and faster than hobie outback.
I do like the Vibe Shearwater. However, after speaking with several Shearwater owners they all told me they had to put a few hundred more dollars into hardware and fix factory problems with that kayak.
Hey Taylor, Crescent Kayaks, which I bought this year is a great boat( which I learned about them last year from you). And they have come out with a motor mount now for there boats.Headwaters out of California ships to Washington
Sad to hear Hobie is stumbling. I have a 2017 Angler 14 w/ 180 peddle mirage, and while I bring the gear in for the winter, the kayak itself has sat outside through 0F Idaho winters. No issues with the drive or kayak despite heavy kokanee use every year. My dad in law has a 2014? with the single direction drive, and has worked flawlessly too despite similar storage abuse (lol). I've continued recommending Hobie when I'm on the water and asked about my setup, but I'll be mentioning your ponderings as well now too.
I fish kayak bass fishing tournaments and I agree - So many issues with the Hobie. A lot of the anglers are dealing with cracked hulls and water in the hulls that cant be sourced. The new Titan X looks promising. I run the Oldtown PDL120 and couldn't've be happier - great kayak.
Good wrap up, Tyler. Next Adventure in Portland is a Bonafide dealer and my buddy Matthew Burdick, along with Michael Phillips, are the first two Bonafide Team members up here in the PNW. Bonafide, Native Watercraft, Hurricane, and Liquid Logic are all made in the Big Adventures factory in North Carolina. Big Adventures definitely has their sights set on the Northwest as an under-serviced market. The Native Titan X 10/12.5 feature all the same motor-centric features as the Bonafide PWR but in a pedal kayak. I was on the team that helped design that model. We started over a year ago and attempted to address all the feedback we had from customers on the old Titans, while innovating towards a motor-centric platform. We saw motors starting to dominate and tried to provide anglers with flexibility for running the motor or motors they want. Sales so far have been excellent and there's a lot of interest in those two models. We're or done innovating with more exciting ideas in the works.
I don't quite know if NuCanoe boats are canoes or kayaks but they are based out of Bellingham, WA where I live. I think NuCanoes are manufactured in Wisconsin.
Hobie was sold and has been going down hill ever since. Also lightning kayaks are molded in Houston Texas, I believe same rotomolded that perception/pelican uses
To be honest I've never been a fan of Native kayaks. Everyone I've ever been in is so slow and they push a ton of water. I also don't like have the rudder tucked up under the kayak like that. If a fish gets wrapped up in it there no chance of addressing that on the water.
I had a Native and it was great for certain fisheries. Well engineered, simple, stable, durable, easy reverse. Their propel is simple and solid. Like Tyler said the stable design creates more drag than Hobie and others, so if you're trolling or in ocean current it takes more energy.
I’d love to upgrade to at least one set of turbo fins on my Hobie Oasis, but for what it costs, I’m gonna save that for when I destroy one of the standard kick fins first. That money would be a great fish finder upgrade, or downrigger for my Old Town 132. With the EPDL, I’d be packing more fishing gear than my whole vehicle is worth.
Currently in Sea eagle fast track. Was really tempted to get a pdl salty but now that nomad is looking pretty good. Looks like it has less storage space and no instant reverse but the flipper drive seems like it'd be great in some situations. Think I'm still leaning salty though. Would be cool to see Old Town come out with a replaceable flipper drive.
Great commentary and observations Tyler. I completely agree. I’ve been very dismayed at the lack of innovation. I was excited to see what this last year would bring and it was just more electric motors and higher price points. I love my OT PDL. I’m not sure why there isn’t more research into faster/lighter manual drive systems and in hull/material design. The whole idea of relying on batteries seems counter intuitive to the purpose of a kayak/small craft use. But you’re also correct that motors on kayaks seem quite popular, so maybe I’m the odd man out.
It’s frustrating for sure. The age of pedal drives seems to have passed with the industry hyper focused on motors and giant 40” wide bass focused fishing kayaks.
I have an outback and a bow mount minn kota ready to go. I almost got swept out in the ocean. Sometimes that motor is more for peace of mind and getting back home.
I think for 6k I would have something more substantial than a kayak. But that’s just me, if you can afford it and that’s want ya want, go for it and have fun!! I’ll keep my old wilderness radar 135. It keeps rolling and I’ve dropped that thing off the truck off my trailer and it still hasn’t leaked or cracked.
Is the Salty PDL the best choice for PNW fisheries? The new color options from Old Town look nice, but it doesn't seem like they made any actual changes to the model.
Its the best kayak for the PNW for MY needs. It really depends on the fisheries you pursue here but its a lightweight pedal drive kayak (comparably), extremely fast, stable, and still has enough space to add something like a downrigger. If I lived closer to the coast and did more beach launch and landings I might go back to the Hobie Revolution but the Revo isn't as comfy and stable as the Salty but the Mirage is nice for surf landings.
Interesting video. I must admit that I was most interested in your touching on Hoodoo kayaks. I bought one of their Tempest 120P pedal drive kayaks back in August of this year. I decided to motorize it, as it makes it easier for me to troll for trout and kokanee salmon. And hopefully chinook salmon next year in California! Being 60 years old, the motor is a definite plus! Don't get me wrong, I've used the pedal drive nearly as much as I've run it with the motor(7 trips with the motor, vs 6 using the pedal drive). I just prefer the motor for trolling. The motor is a Minn Kota Max 55 pound thrust model. To which I've added that r/c aircraft propeller hack which gets me a top speed of 3.75 mpg with this kayak. Not too bad. The biggest drawback of using the r/c aircraft prop over the upgraded Minn Kota propeller is that it's no good in weeds. Almost makes me want to go back to the upgraded Minn Kota prop that I put on this motor a while back as it easily makes chopped salad out of weeds. I made a custom built rail mount for the motor that goes on the front rails. It's made from 2"x1"x27" plastic sheet with a 6"x6"x1" plastic sheet to support the motor in the center of hole where the pedal drives goes. I have found the Tempest 120P to be well made,and that it handles well in all conditions. I've had it out in wind,rain,flat calm, and every thing in between. No problems at all. It also has a lot of storage. The bow storage is huge, with a secure cover, and scupper holes to allow drainage. I've joked with sister about being able to use the front storage as an ice chest for boat camping trips, or long,hot days on the water. All in all, I'm satisfied with my Hoodoo,and would buy another one for my wife, if she decides she wants one. I also want to mention that the customer service at Hoodoo has been top notch with them responding same day with any concerns that I may have had.
I think its a great idea. Be neat if there was a regen mode while anchored in a stream/river or even while pedaling. 6k, like someone else pointed out, that approaching boat prices. Small market. But neat and innovative as you said.
Always enjoy your videos. You briefly mentioned the Native line. Do you have any additional thoughts on the new Titan X? It’s heavy but has a solid pedal drive with easy ability to use motors on bow, stern, or both. Said to be very stable. Your opinion has value!
@@spiltmilt Surprised that you give Bonefide credit for innovating with the PWR but don't recognize Native for doing the same with the Titan when the Titan was announced with power plates before the PWR. Not to mention the 360 swivel seat.
@@mikelafontaine8464 because the Bonafide PWR looks like a kayak and weighs a reasonable 80ish lbs. The new Native is a 40" wide johnny boat that weighs 150 lbs. Its not really a kayak.
In Canada there aren’t many used deals around my area. I also don’t want to pay 4K+CAD for a kayak. So I imported a knock off native slayer max 10 kayak from China for less then half. Pedal drive is great and I have a motor for it when I fish on bigger lakes. I’d love to support American but the cost is too much right now.
Hobie Falling off hard and the only reason it's still hanging in their is due to their cult-like following of users. There's little doubt that the fall coincided with the sale of the company to that private equity group.
Please stay on your pictures much longer... You flash them uo so fast and then keep talking about it even after the picture is gone when you want to pay attention to what you are describing in the pictures. Please please please keep them up longer way longer.
All part of the FeelFree family of kayaks made in Thailand. Seastream and Feelfree have never really stood out to me. Getting parts and kayaks has always been an issue.
Thanks for the content. I honestly dont think this will fly. It is going to be close to $7,000 after all the taxes and exchange rate is factored in for Canada. They will sell some, but right now I have much more attractive options. (still looking for my first kayak because I am a working joe with kids who do after school stuff). I agree that oldtown are the standard to beat, but really not worth that price.
Could never figure out why hobie was so expensive when I was heavily researching several years ago. I concluded it was hype only. Didn’t help that every video I watched the hobie pedals squeaked like crazy how annoying. Not to mention the drive has so many problems. Glad I went with old town so much cheaper such better quality and tremendous customer support. No brainer. Also everyone needs to see through the overly optimistic opinions of anyone sponsored by hobie or others even. Sponsorship does that to people .. obviously. Figure it out on your own.
Exactly that’s why I stepped away from sponsorships, too many brainwashed loyalists. Brands nowadays want cheerleaders not people who provide constructive criticism.
@@spiltmilt I bought a Salty for bass fishing based on information from your channel and the Navarre Kayak Fishing channel. It has worked out well. Unsponsored RUclipsrs are far and few between, so if you can make that work, you will have a truly great channel.
Old Town would make more money if they made their motorized kayaks upgradable. If you own a PDL already, you’re much more likely to pay $2k for the ePDL drive + wiring kit than you are to pay $6k for a whole new kayak.
Totally agree - and adding to what you're saying, I would love to see an Autopilot model with the versatility of being able to swap out the motor for a (separately purchased) PDL drive. I want to buy one, but I see myself wanting both drives and there's no way in hell I would want to buy two separate kayaks just to have both drives, it wastes too much space. Likely a pipe dream, but sure would be a sweet option. I guess the ePDL drive is the closest thing to having both, but I definitely see myself wanting more power during some days on the water.
FeelFree makes a pedal drive that can be easily motorized. However, it doesn't have the GPS capabilities of the AutoPilot. The best solution is to buy a pedal drive kayak and put a removable bow mount motor on it.
It's depressing seeing what Hobie has become. I've considered selling my 2019 Outback and 2018 Compass for upgrades, but I actually think their age is what makes me want to hold onto them for the quality issues you mentioned. The number one thing keeping me in a hobie is the Mirage drive. It's in my opinion the best non-motorized propulsion system available right now and it's why I won't buy an Old Town. Yet.
6k can get you 14ft boat with 30hp
Exactly. Hobie prices are insane.
Love my Lightning Kayak. I did upgrade to Hobie drive. I'm in the NW if you'd like to try one.
I think the EPDL will mostly help to sell their autopilot and pdl models. As the onboard any inventory, I’m sure that they will discount it to be priced slightly higher than the autopilot.
I just want the 3 companys feel free for the seat hobie for the drive and hull(pro-angler)and oldtown for the spot lock motor to come together and make that kayak...it would be the king of kings
$6,000?! Dang, I was just looking at a used 16’ aluminum boat for $6,000 with kicker and autopilot bow mount.
I bought a Feelfree Lure II tandem with pedal drive when we moved from river country Idaho to lake country Idaho. I’m able to keep it in the water and use it every day all spring & summer. It’s been great! Early in the season I troll with a sinking line on my fly rod and flies or spinners. When the water warms up I switch to a floating line and flies or poppers. Trout, bluegill, bass & pike are abundant. I had originally shopped Hobie but the local dealer employees didn’t seem to know much about them. An avid kayaker friend steered me to a local business that has 37 years of only canoe and kayak experience and they carry Feelfree as their fishing kayak. The owner, independent of the company, personally guarantees everything he sells and has the credibility. I’ve seen some features on Hobie or Old Town kayaks that I thought looked more durable, or adjustable, or efficient but everything on my Feelfree has delivered 100% through two seasons of frequent use.
I can't argue about West Coast anglers being abandoned, but let's be honest, there's not much for dealer support either. If you're in Washington, Oregon, the western half of Idaho, and the western half of Montana, the closest place to go and try a few brands is Next Adventure in Portland.
You'd think a kayak company would push to serve this market, just like boat brands have, but it's just not a priority to any of them.
I 100% agree. I don't know if its the distance from the east coast but many brands don't seem interested in the Northwest. Also most kayak shops here are pretty lame and I don't know of any with exceptional customer service.
Purchased my Native Titan 13.5 back in March 2019, it’s been an awesome rig for me since the first day I’ve had it on the water. Only drawback is it’s extremely heavy. Otherwise, it’s been a Beast on the water. Since I’ve had this rig I’ve installed a Minn Kota Terrova with spot lock, Hummingbird Solix 10, two usb ports and, the NLD upgraded steering handle. Over the winter I plan on installing the Torqeedo 1103 with foot control and led navigation lights. I may be in the market for another yak for my son to use once he’s back in the states after deployment.
The poor hydrodynamics and weight of Native kayaks has always deterred me from that brand.
For me I couldn’t pass on the price being that the rig was a demo. One of the biggest deciding factors for me was stability as I fish the back bays and larger reservoirs here in NJ.
Love your content. Has helped my fishing tremendously.
BTW, I think a good lake to try for sizable Kokanee might be Holter Reservoir in Montana. It’s a beautiful lake too.
Already have a campsite booked
Absolutely agree that the west coast anglers have been abandoned! Started kayak fishing southern and central California coast in the 90's through 2015. Launching/landing through the surf. Started with Cobra Kayaks Fish-N-Dive and Marauder-XF, Malibu Kayaks X-Factor, Ocean Kayaks Trident 13.
Cobra Kayaks dissolved years ago! They were the standard for offshore fishing in the 90's. Malibu Kayaks dissolved around 2019-2020. You're correct, since Johnson acquired Ocean Kayaks, there no longer exists any offshore Ocean Kayak that that I'd offshore fish from. The Prowler and Trident kayaks were great for offshore fishing! I wish I still had my Trident 13.... may have to scour ebay for one.
Currently fishing the Viking Kayaks Profish Reload. It's a New Zealand kayak. But since moving to the Reno/Tahoe area I've had to switch gears to freshwater trolling for trout and Kokanee from my Viking Reload.
I am in the market for a hands free/peddle kayak. Initially considered the Hobie Outback. But I hear so many fishermen in the northern California and Nevada areas reporting quality issues. For the past two years. I've been looking forward to "New" Hobie innovations... only to be disappointed by minor modifications and mostly "New" color schemes.
Contemplating pulling the trigger on an Oldtown.
Thanks again for your great content!
Looking forward to your continued series on "Trolling depth calculations"... dodgers, different speeds (1.75 and ir 2.0mph), Mono diameters....
Thanks again!
Those Viking boats awesome. Superb in the surf.
Perfect timing! Been looking for a pedal drive for awhile now. Where are good places to find used ones besides Craigslist?
Facebook marketplace has the most
@@spiltmilt
Guess I'll have to create a Facebook account like everyone else in the world 🤣 Thanks, Tyler!
Great video mate, my new Sib and motor is cheaper than epdl, so insane
That's a sweet lil boat you got.
Great video as always! As a great lakes angler i agree that most manufacturers have forgotten us in favor of other markets. I do run a hobie outback and a pa14 myself and love them both, although i do see room for improvement. Id be curious on your thoughts on the motorized movement.... im personally strongly against it. Just my two cents but kayak angling should have an element of physical difficulty!
The motorized kayak movement doesn't really bother me but I am annoyed at how much it has stalled innovation in pedal and paddle kayaks.
Great information. The new Lightning NOMAD is amazing. I love it.
Too bad you can't catch any fish from it. 😅 J K JK❤
@@lengray7804 🤣😂
Sadly I think you are spot on with hobie. I’ve been told Hobie has already moved much of their manufacturing to Mexico already. I feel like they are moving down hill very quickly. They have done a reorg in the company. Many of the reps have been let go. It just seems to all be going down hill.
Hi tyler, I love listening to your vast knowledge of kayak fishing. I never hear you talk much about feel free kayaks. They're made in Thailand but are affiliated with designers here in the US. I have a 11.5 lure pedal that is rigged for fishing... We fish the local lakes here in the Northwest and go out about 20 times a year. I've had this kayak for 3 years now and it's been trouble free. Just curious as to your input on the brand.... Keep up your videos and see you in 24
Really limited experience with the brand honestly. I know only a few people who fish from them. I wish the feel free lure II tandem allowed for two pedal drives. I'd probably get one for road trips with Sidra.
My thoughts on the old town $6000 ePDL is that’s it’s a swing and miss. Like you mentioned the timing of an expensive kayak like this is too much and I don’t believe there will be a huge demand for it. The used market is too good right now to pass up. It’s old town though so people will still buy it. They chose to not make the ePDL backwards compatible, fairly insulting to their current customer base.
For that same price, you could build two paddle BigWater 132s with GPS (gps not available with ePDL) Xi3, wiring, bow mounts, and two batteries (all day power, versus ~3hour runtime of the ePDL). If you went to the used market right now you could buy two sportsman’s (better platform imo) a 106 pdl and a 120 autopilot and still save money.
By the way, I’m not some old town hater. I fished tournaments out of a sportsman 106 pdl for three years and am currently wearing an old town hoodie.😅
I 100% agree with you. Slapping an Xi3 on the bow of any pedal kayak is the way to go. You get all the benefits of ropeless anchor, cruise control, plus pedal and electric power. Also you always just leave the motor at home for those days you don't need it.
@@spiltmilt I was pretty hyped about the teasers old town was doing for this rollout. It definitely disappointed me. I think if it came out at a cost less than an AP I wouldn’t have even batted an eye but unfortunately the cost isn’t even close.
Hobie moved their Oceanside facility to Mexico, and problem is they cannot keep up production and having supply chain issues. Also Vibe kayak is actually not bad, their shearwater is stable and faster than hobie outback.
I do like the Vibe Shearwater. However, after speaking with several Shearwater owners they all told me they had to put a few hundred more dollars into hardware and fix factory problems with that kayak.
Hey Taylor, Crescent Kayaks, which I bought this year is a great boat( which I learned about them last year from you). And they have come out with a motor mount now for there boats.Headwaters out of California ships to Washington
Yes One Objective has always made motor mounts for several models of Crescent kayaks. Glad you like yours!
Sad to hear Hobie is stumbling. I have a 2017 Angler 14 w/ 180 peddle mirage, and while I bring the gear in for the winter, the kayak itself has sat outside through 0F Idaho winters. No issues with the drive or kayak despite heavy kokanee use every year. My dad in law has a 2014? with the single direction drive, and has worked flawlessly too despite similar storage abuse (lol). I've continued recommending Hobie when I'm on the water and asked about my setup, but I'll be mentioning your ponderings as well now too.
I fish kayak bass fishing tournaments and I agree - So many issues with the Hobie. A lot of the anglers are dealing with cracked hulls and water in the hulls that cant be sourced. The new Titan X looks promising. I run the Oldtown PDL120 and couldn't've be happier - great kayak.
Well said, all true, agree 100%. Keep up the great videos.
saving for a blue sky 360 angler
Good wrap up, Tyler. Next Adventure in Portland is a Bonafide dealer and my buddy Matthew Burdick, along with Michael Phillips, are the first two Bonafide Team members up here in the PNW. Bonafide, Native Watercraft, Hurricane, and Liquid Logic are all made in the Big Adventures factory in North Carolina. Big Adventures definitely has their sights set on the Northwest as an under-serviced market. The Native Titan X 10/12.5 feature all the same motor-centric features as the Bonafide PWR but in a pedal kayak. I was on the team that helped design that model. We started over a year ago and attempted to address all the feedback we had from customers on the old Titans, while innovating towards a motor-centric platform. We saw motors starting to dominate and tried to provide anglers with flexibility for running the motor or motors they want. Sales so far have been excellent and there's a lot of interest in those two models. We're or done innovating with more exciting ideas in the works.
Sounds like Hobie sold out to the big guys and now they will produce them cheaply now, with the high price still.
I don't quite know if NuCanoe boats are canoes or kayaks but they are based out of Bellingham, WA where I live. I think NuCanoes are manufactured in Wisconsin.
Yes they are Bellingham based but not really designed for our waters.
Hobie was sold and has been going down hill ever since. Also lightning kayaks are molded in Houston Texas, I believe same rotomolded that perception/pelican uses
Thanks for the correction on Lightning.
Tyler I’ve spent a lot of time looking at fishing kayaks and I really like the Native Slayer line. Have you looked at them?
To be honest I've never been a fan of Native kayaks. Everyone I've ever been in is so slow and they push a ton of water. I also don't like have the rudder tucked up under the kayak like that. If a fish gets wrapped up in it there no chance of addressing that on the water.
I had a Native and it was great for certain fisheries. Well engineered, simple, stable, durable, easy reverse. Their propel is simple and solid. Like Tyler said the stable design creates more drag than Hobie and others, so if you're trolling or in ocean current it takes more energy.
I’d love to upgrade to at least one set of turbo fins on my Hobie Oasis, but for what it costs, I’m gonna save that for when I destroy one of the standard kick fins first. That money would be a great fish finder upgrade, or downrigger for my Old Town 132. With the EPDL, I’d be packing more fishing gear than my whole vehicle is worth.
Currently in Sea eagle fast track. Was really tempted to get a pdl salty but now that nomad is looking pretty good. Looks like it has less storage space and no instant reverse but the flipper drive seems like it'd be great in some situations. Think I'm still leaning salty though.
Would be cool to see Old Town come out with a replaceable flipper drive.
where would I find a used kayak? Looking for a Old Towne Sportman 106 PDL
Facebook Marketplace is the place to go.
Great commentary and observations Tyler. I completely agree. I’ve been very dismayed at the lack of innovation. I was excited to see what this last year would bring and it was just more electric motors and higher price points. I love my OT PDL. I’m not sure why there isn’t more research into faster/lighter manual drive systems and in hull/material design. The whole idea of relying on batteries seems counter intuitive to the purpose of a kayak/small craft use. But you’re also correct that motors on kayaks seem quite popular, so maybe I’m the odd man out.
It’s frustrating for sure. The age of pedal drives seems to have passed with the industry hyper focused on motors and giant 40” wide bass focused fishing kayaks.
I have an outback and a bow mount minn kota ready to go. I almost got swept out in the ocean. Sometimes that motor is more for peace of mind and getting back home.
I think for 6k I would have something more substantial than a kayak. But that’s just me, if you can afford it and that’s want ya want, go for it and have fun!! I’ll keep my old wilderness radar 135. It keeps rolling and I’ve dropped that thing off the truck off my trailer and it still hasn’t leaked or cracked.
Is the Salty PDL the best choice for PNW fisheries? The new color options from Old Town look nice, but it doesn't seem like they made any actual changes to the model.
Its the best kayak for the PNW for MY needs. It really depends on the fisheries you pursue here but its a lightweight pedal drive kayak (comparably), extremely fast, stable, and still has enough space to add something like a downrigger. If I lived closer to the coast and did more beach launch and landings I might go back to the Hobie Revolution but the Revo isn't as comfy and stable as the Salty but the Mirage is nice for surf landings.
What’s the opinion on Jackson? The Knarr isn’t cheap but it seems like it has some great features.
The Jackson Knarr is a heavy over priced piece of garbage. I know two people who bought one and both ended up sending it back and asking for a refund.
Used kayak is a paradise right now 🥰
Indeed it is! I have absolutely zero need for another kayak but its hard not to jump on some of these deals.
@@spiltmilt Where would I find those deals?
Had the pro angler, the outback, now I have an Old Town Salty and am so happy I bought it. Hobie way overpriced and turbo fins suck.
Old town really needs to upgrade the autopilot
Native Titan X?
Meh 40” wide and 150 lbs…I’ll pass
I totally agree with you on what Hobie is doing. The PA360 probably will be my last Hobie I’ll buy.
Does your trolling church for the lead weights include the include the flasher for Cokenee
No flasher or dodger.
Interesting video.
I must admit that I was most interested in your touching on Hoodoo kayaks.
I bought one of their Tempest 120P pedal drive kayaks back in August of this year.
I decided to motorize it, as it makes it easier for me to troll for trout and kokanee salmon.
And hopefully chinook salmon next year in California!
Being 60 years old, the motor is a definite plus!
Don't get me wrong, I've used the pedal drive nearly as much as I've run it with the motor(7 trips with the motor, vs 6 using the pedal drive).
I just prefer the motor for trolling.
The motor is a Minn Kota Max 55 pound thrust model.
To which I've added that r/c aircraft propeller hack which gets me a top speed of 3.75 mpg with this kayak.
Not too bad. The biggest drawback of using the r/c aircraft prop over the upgraded Minn Kota propeller is that it's no good in weeds.
Almost makes me want to go back to the upgraded Minn Kota prop that I put on this motor a while back as it easily makes chopped salad out of weeds.
I made a custom built rail mount for the motor that goes on the front rails.
It's made from 2"x1"x27" plastic sheet with a 6"x6"x1" plastic sheet to support the motor in the center of hole where the pedal drives goes.
I have found the Tempest 120P to be well made,and that it handles well in all conditions.
I've had it out in wind,rain,flat calm, and every thing in between.
No problems at all.
It also has a lot of storage.
The bow storage is huge, with a secure cover, and scupper holes to allow drainage.
I've joked with sister about being able to use the front storage as an ice chest for boat camping trips, or long,hot days on the water.
All in all, I'm satisfied with my Hoodoo,and would buy another one for my wife, if she decides she wants one.
I also want to mention that the customer service at Hoodoo has been top notch with them responding same day with any concerns that I may have had.
Thanks for sharing! I’ve heard several people say that Hoodoo has good customer service. Glad you enjoy yours
I think its a great idea. Be neat if there was a regen mode while anchored in a stream/river or even while pedaling. 6k, like someone else pointed out, that approaching boat prices. Small market. But neat and innovative as you said.
Wth is up with Hobie... always increasing price but nothing changes
Always enjoy your videos. You briefly mentioned the Native line. Do you have any additional thoughts on the new Titan X? It’s heavy but has a solid pedal drive with easy ability to use motors on bow, stern, or both. Said to be very stable. Your opinion has value!
A good prop driven alternative to the ProAngler 12 I think with better features.
@@spiltmilt Surprised that you give Bonefide credit for innovating with the PWR but don't recognize Native for doing the same with the Titan when the Titan was announced with power plates before the PWR. Not to mention the 360 swivel seat.
@@mikelafontaine8464 because the Bonafide PWR looks like a kayak and weighs a reasonable 80ish lbs. The new Native is a 40" wide johnny boat that weighs 150 lbs. Its not really a kayak.
What people are trying to get for USED kayaks is ridiculous.
Yes LOL it’s like depreciation doesn’t exist
It’s all about the money
In Canada there aren’t many used deals around my area. I also don’t want to pay 4K+CAD for a kayak. So I imported a knock off native slayer max 10 kayak from China for less then half. Pedal drive is great and I have a motor for it when I fish on bigger lakes.
I’d love to support American but the cost is too much right now.
Fair enough. Those Canadian pesos don't go far. LOL Which kayak did you have imported?
Hobie Falling off hard and the only reason it's still hanging in their is due to their cult-like following of users. There's little doubt that the fall coincided with the sale of the company to that private equity group.
Please stay on your pictures much longer... You flash them uo so fast and then keep talking about it even after the picture is gone when you want to pay attention to what you are describing in the pictures. Please please please keep them up longer way longer.
Hobie is going down hill for sure! the 360 drive is AWFUL.
I would really be interested in what seems to be a bit of a sleeper, the seastream 120 pd
All part of the FeelFree family of kayaks made in Thailand. Seastream and Feelfree have never really stood out to me. Getting parts and kayaks has always been an issue.
Thanks for the content. I honestly dont think this will fly. It is going to be close to $7,000 after all the taxes and exchange rate is factored in for Canada. They will sell some, but right now I have much more attractive options. (still looking for my first kayak because I am a working joe with kids who do after school stuff). I agree that oldtown are the standard to beat, but really not worth that price.
The old town auto pilot has gone up $1000 not reasonable other brands for lot less have basically the same thing
Yes the cost of Old Town kayaks jumped significantly in the past year.
Could never figure out why hobie was so expensive when I was heavily researching several years ago. I concluded it was hype only. Didn’t help that every video I watched the hobie pedals squeaked like crazy how annoying. Not to mention the drive has so many problems. Glad I went with old town so much cheaper such better quality and tremendous customer support. No brainer. Also everyone needs to see through the overly optimistic opinions of anyone sponsored by hobie or others even. Sponsorship does that to people .. obviously. Figure it out on your own.
Exactly that’s why I stepped away from sponsorships, too many brainwashed loyalists. Brands nowadays want cheerleaders not people who provide constructive criticism.
@@spiltmilt I bought a Salty for bass fishing based on information from your channel and the Navarre Kayak Fishing channel. It has worked out well. Unsponsored RUclipsrs are far and few between, so if you can make that work, you will have a truly great channel.
@@spiltmilt@spiltmilt For what it's worth, I/We always valued your constructive feedback.
Disagree about Native not innovating. Titan X is legit and $1,000 less than Hobie and Old Town
Meh...the industry needs another 150 lb 40" wide kayak like I need another hole in my head.