In Dragon Ball Z, Vegeta is used as a tool to drive the plot. We very often see him grow significantly in strength only to lose to the final villain right before the "real hero" saves the day. In this way Vegeta is used to show how strong the final villain actually is, but he never wins against him. This happened with Frieza, the Androids, cell, and majin Buu. Many fans view it as an overused trick to a beloved character. In my opinion Vegeta would win this fight. They are fighting at a level where power levels don't matter as much. Vegeta is a brilliant resourceful character who throughout the Namek Saga was fighting villains stronger than him.
Quite the opposite, at this point in the story they are fighting where ONLY power level matters now, it has become about who has a bigger number, in dragon ball there was far more techniques and strategies
@@santi_super_stunts2573 That's a legitimate perspective. I remember thinking the same thing when I first watched the show. But the 5 hour+ fight between the z fighters and Frieza is supposed to show how power alone will not win the fight. Pretty sure Toriyama said this himself and that power levels aren't supposed to matter. I respect your take on this though.
SSJ Vegata should be considerably stronger than Final Form, but yeah, if Frieza goes Full Power and doesn’t drag it out before he starts losing power, Vegeta might lose.
Yeah but Vegeta didn't hate Cell or Zarbon nearly as much as he hates Frieza. This would be as much of a story of revenge as it would be a test of his strength.
I feel like he would absolutely let Frieza power up. Even ignoring the situation in the Cell Saga, it was *Vegeta* who goaded Frieza to go into his 2nd Form, Not Frieza. Even if Vegeta is overpowering him initially, Frieza would play into this saying he isn’t using his full strength, and Vegeta would 100% fall into that trap and let him fully power up.
Also, as we see in the Android Saga, going Super Saiyan makes Vegeta’s ego fly out of control. Base Vegeta might be reasonable not to let Frieza power up, but SS Vegeta definitely would.
I would say that he likely learned his lesson when he encouraged freeza to transform the first time around... but he hadn't learned it by the time semi-perfect cell was around so... yeah, freeza has this one in the bag lul
Semi perfect cell was different though. Vegeta was dog walking him the whole fight. The vegeta vs frieza fight would be a lot closer. So vegeta ain’t letting bro take it up a notch. Even if he did. He’d find a way to kill Frieza
The point is it wouldn't even matter at point. Just as it didn't Goku. He was not merely just a little stronger than Frieza but multiple times stronger than Frieza. Especially if Vegeta went into the rage form like Goku did, he'd kill Frieza in 30 seconds.
It was clearly implied in the story that Goku was significantly above Vegeta by the time he finished healing and arrived to finally face Frieza. The two Saiyans weren't in the same league by that point, and Vegeta sensed it. It wasn't just Goku's fighting skill that helped him put up more of a fight but also his increased energy, speed, strength, and durability. Vegeta could tell after Goku's first exchange with Frieza that he was far & away the most powerful Saiyan he'd seen so far (Hence, why he believed Goku was the Super Saiyan after comparing their respective performances against Frieza in combat). Were Goku not stronger to an impressive degree, Vegeta wouldn't have been so confident that he could win. He was at a high enough level to anticipate & counter many of Frieza's attacks until he began fighting at 50% power, including the Death Beam (Vegeta could react to it but showed no capacity to directly block it like Goku did). He was quick enough to land the first hit against Frieza whereas Vegeta couldn't keep up with him once he started actually trying. Even then, Frieza was barely trying against Vegeta overall, not needing anywhere near 50% power to outpace him. The one somewhat serious effort he displayed was kicking away Vegeta's full power blast. Even if Vegeta unlocked Super Saiyan, it would likely only have put him on barely equal footing with Frieza at most (much like when he was able to resist 1st form Frieza; It took a great deal of effort, but he held him back). Once Frieza charged up to 100%, he'd kill Vegeta for sure. Even if Vegeta decided not to give Frieza time to power up, it's unlikely in my opinion that he'd be able to defeat, let alone kill him before he reached 100%. Frieza sent SS Goku flying via a two-handed kiai before he could react without using "even three quarters" of his full power. That same kiai would've most likely devastated or outright killed SS Vegeta. SS is an awesome multiplier + stamina revitilizer. Ex- It gave Goku the energy to continue fighting with fresh vigor when he was physically exhausted and had very little ki left just moments before. But it comes down to how much the base form offers to multiply in the first place. Vegeta simply wasn't at a high enough level yet for SS to put him over the top.
@@usuario15965 Their performances against Frieza showed otherwise long before Goku started using the Kaio-ken (No, there is no evidence that he started using it before the 2nd half of their battle, when they changed from aerial combat to the ground and Goku removed his gi's over-shirt; King Kai only referred to the Kaio-ken after that point). Goku was outdoing Vegeta in every conceivable way by an impressive margin from the moment he arrived to face Frieza. He actually challenged, pressured, and injured the tyrant to the point that he was forced to use 50% to outdo his enemy. Vegeta didn't challenge Frieza anywhere near to the same degree even with his full speed & power. You can say "Well, we don't know that Goku WASN'T using the Kaio-ken from the beginning", but the onus is on you to prove that he was using it before King Kai addressed it, not on me to prove that he wasn't. With or without the Kaio-ken, there was no comparison between Goku and Vegeta aside from Vegeta keeping up with Frieza's speed better and reacting to his Death Beam (again, until Frieza stopped playing). Granted, Frieza toyed with Goku too. But he at least had to try harder against him, even in his 4th form. He didn't break a single sweat against Vegeta despite the Saiyan Prince's best efforts, not even when kicking away his max power blast. However you examine it, Toriyama wrote & drew Goku as being significantly superior to Vegeta from the very beginning of that battle. Unless you cite evidence of Toriyama stating Goku & Vegeta were similar in power at this point, I'm not debating any further over what's plain to see in the original manga that the creator himself authored decades ago.
A pure heart in fact helps speed up the process of achieving Super Saiyan due to the gentler the nature the more S-Cells the Saiyan has the easier the process of achieving the Super Saiyan transformation which is why Goku could easily achieve it opposed to Vegeta
6:30 I would argue he would because he let zarbon transform and get the better of him in their first fight. It’s how Vegeta is. When he believes he’s stronger than you he’s cocky when knows he’s weaker he becomes intelligent.
Before they knew how to control its downsides (grade 4), super saiyan was an emotionally dangerous power-up, especially for the purebloods. Vegeta would one, not have the necessary power to beat 100% freeza like you said, and would two, fall victim to the egomaniacal frenzy that ssj brings on even harder than goku did due to his natural arrogance. He would try and get the ultimate humiliation against his slaver and die miserably for it. Freeza takes this
I think vegetas base form is around 2.5million because frieza was at 530,000 and his 2nd form was over 1million which means he probably got roughly 2x stronger. His 3rd transformation would probably be a 2x increase again putting him at 2,120,000. Vegeta can sense ki at this point so i dont think he would have been as confident to fight 4th form frieza if he didnt think he was marginaly above 3rd form frieza. Ik he thought he was about to turn super saiyan but vegetas not stupid he definently knew he was ahead of 3rd form frieza and was ready to fight final form. Thats why i'd say 2.5million. Also this saga was when you could barely be stronger than someone and completly dominate them for example vegeta vs dadoria/vegeta vs zarbon
The only chance he was if before Frieza goes full power, but I doubt Vegeta would do that. Why do ppl think he can win? He literally couldn’t TOUCH Frieza before he would go super saiyan. Heck even Frieza kicked his max powered attack like nothing. Goku on the other hand got way more hits and did way better in his base form. I think the gap between Goku and Vegeta was way more than what ppl realize. The number for Vegeta at 2.4 million never made sense to me. Personally Vegeta is at 2-2.1 million for me.
well yes he did that but we know he was stronger than piccolo but weaker than goku. So his power level would have to be between 1M and 3M. And if you multiply 50 by either one of those frieza has to use 50% power at the very least
You’re forgetting Goku was using Kaoken against Frieza, but was doing it so briefly and intermittently that no-one could tell apart from Piccolo I think. Base Goku was 20 times weaker than Final Form. Just to no diff someone in DB requires a pl difference of 1.5 times, never mind 20. Goku was using Kaoken. Despite whatever headcanon you have, it’s canon he’s somewhat around as strong as Base Goku at this point. If he unlocked SSJ, he would neg diff Final Form, but he could get smoked by Full Power as long as Frieza doesn’t drag it out, but if he does, Vegeta wins the war of attrition.
Here's my take, Vegeta is likely around 2 million maybe slightly above. Power level wise he would get around 100 or maybe a little above so yes if he let Frieza go to 100% he would be at a disadvantage. However something to note in especially in the Anime Freiza really struggles to hold that form the entire time he fights Goku at super saiyan he has to put a overdrive level into to land a hit. Goku pretty much just lets him waste himself down. So given that I would say this would be about like golden Freiza fighting Goku but with him having more obvious struggle against Vegeta before running out of steam. That is the worst case situation tho considering how Goku barley kept his cool Vegeta is about as likely to waste Freiza before he can power up further.
The reason Goku was able to keep up with Frieza was because he was using the kaio-ken throughout the entire fight. He was using the x10 for the entire fight, and boosted all the way up to x20 at one point. Meaning that Goku was spending most of the fight using a power level of 30'000'000, not 3. And even up to 60'000'000 when he used the x20. And even with that massive boost, Goku was still barely keeping up with a lackadaisical Frieza. Vegeta doesn't have the kaio-ken, so he got destroyed by Frieza easily. But his base power may have been similar; we know that he had to be considerably stronger than Piccolo, for the reasons you cited. It's worth noting also that Frieza can't maintain his top power for long; he gassed out and his power started to rapidly drop after fighting (canonically) for only a few minutes. At which point he stopped even being a challenge for Goku. The same would be true of Vegeta, even if we assume that the gap between him and Frieza wouldn't be as big as the one between Goku and Frieza.
Only edge he has is that if he does end up getting the upper hand he WILL NOT show mercy to Frieza, he wasn’t naive enough to show mercy to the ginyu force I don’t think he would to Frieza. He definitely won’t heal him either and would do anything to kill him
That thumbnail made me realize how clean Vegeta looks as a super Saiyan in his Namek armor. He was the only one screaming about how he was a super Saiyan LoL.🤷🏿Anyway, this video is really impressive, over 35K views and only 1.02K subs. I can tell it was researched. I subbed!😌
I really wish he could have gotten his vengeance against Frieza in Resurrection F. He truly deserved it after everything he witnessed and experienced growing up and watching everyone he knew die and his planet be destroyed.
According to Super Saiya Densetsu for the SNES, base Vegeta was almost 4 times stronger than base Goku. Goku was about 280,000 while Vegeta was about 960,000 or so... so if Vegeta went SSJ on Namek, he would have humiliated Frieza.
@@Kcinthasun that doesn't make any sense though, unless you accept that Toriyama realized that power levels were stupid and wanted to jump the shark with them. Which is probably the case. Why? Because Goku went from 90,000 vs Ginyu... and then got a zenkai boost to 3,000,000? Bro, c'mon don't be stupid. The Daizenshuu is bullshit. I know it, you know it, Toriyama knew it. He was either trolling, or just came up with an arbitrary number because he forgot what Goku's power level was during his fight with Ginyu. I promise you, the numbers from Super Saiya Densetsu make more sense.
This makes much more sense, and what I'm about to tell you is gonna blow your fuckin' mind because it makes a lot of the rest of the series make sense too, including Super. When Saiyans get a zenkai boost, it isn't based on their base power level, it's based on the highest power level their body has recently achieved. Therefore, when Goku went Kaioken up to 180,000 he got a Zenkai boost from that, not from 90,000 and even THEN going to 260,000 was nearly a 50% boost in his strength (which is approximately the amount of power he would get from a regular Kaioken). So Goku starts the fight at 260,000. Kaioken x10 is 2,600,000 and x20 is 5,200,000 with SSJ being 13,000,000 Frieza starts off using 33% of his power (one third) at 4,240,000 which makes sense because Goku was using Kaioken the whole time, and the only thing keeping him on an even footing was the fact that Freiza couldn't detect power levels, his fighting technique, and Frieza not taking the fight seriously. At 50% Frieza is at 6,360,000 which is why a x20 Kaioken Kamehameha almost got him if it weren't for the fact that he cancelled it out with his own Ki blast. At 100% he was at 12,720,000 which is why the fight was so close. You've gotta be out of your mind if you think Goku's power level was 150,000,000 when even 13,000,000 is based on a 50% fucking zenkai boost. Drugs bro.
@@SleepLessThan3 not at all. I didn't explain this far, but first form Frieza was 560,000... at 1/3 his full power. This means that Frieza was holding back in two ways the entire fight. He held back by sticking with his first form which uses less energy, and also by keeping his power level in check which, again, uses less energy. If anything what I'm saying is that first form Frieza could have powered up enough to be about even with Piccolo if he wanted to, or straight up just beat him silly in his second form, but transforming was more efficient for him. The math just about works out if you double his power level for every transformation. It's a little off from what I said before at 4,240,000 before for 33% final form to be fair, but not much. But either way, it works out. 560,000 1,120,000 2,240,000 4,480,000 So for Frieza, he was using 1/3 power the whole time, and transforming doubled his power level.
The only way I could see Vegeta ignoring his pride to let Freeza transform is if his anger at Freeza surpassed his pride & arrogance. However, I truly don't see that happening. It's too embedded in his character. Not just w/ Cell, but even in the Namek saga, we saw him not only allow but also encourage an opponent to transform because he believed he could still beat them if they did. The first one was Zarbon, who Vegeta had a slight upper hand against during their 1st fight while Zarbon was in base. But rather than finish him off when he had the opportunity, what did Vegeta do? He let Zarbon transform and then proceeded to catch a serious beating. Same w/ form 1 Freeza, he was able to just barely keep up with him during their initial confrontation. And true to form, what did Vegeta then do? He not only allowed but encouraged Freeza to transform cause he believed Freeza's power wouldn't "increase that much". And he turned out to be dead wrong on that one. So I definitely see him letting Freeza reach 100%, as being the first to become a Super Saiyan would have the prince drunk on power and feed his ego even more. The only way I see Super Saiyan Vegeta beating full-powered Freeza on Namek, is if he's able to outlast him. Since we saw that after obtaining his full power, Freeza couldn't hold on to it for long, and lost a big portion of it pretty rapidly. If Vegeta can withstand the initial onslaught, then I say he has a solid chance to win. But that's a really big if.
I understand those numbers were given at certain period of time by offical sources, however it's also been stated by official sources (i believe in Super) that 100% power Frieza was always stronger than Goku but just like in Resurrection F his lack of stamina lead to his downfall both times. Basically Frieza and Vegta want to be strong enough to one shot their opponents. When they are stronger they often do, or they play with their food. When they're not, they lose
The issue is this. When Goku went Super Sayain against Frieza, Frieza was at 50% power. In this case, Frieza would be at 2.5% at the time of Vegeta going Super Sayain. With that disparity in power, it would have only taken one proper below to kill or cripple Frieza. This could easily result in Frieza deing before he realised that he needed to power up.
You’re heavily underestimating Freeza’s ridiculous durability. Not even Goku blasting him enraged and the planet exploding finished him. Not even Broly’s rampage killed a significantly unmatched Freeza. He has always been written as a really durable nuisance.
Frieza would immediately power up to 50% seeing super saiyan. I think people forget how much of a gap there is between frieza and ssj vegeta. Frieza was taking goku's hits and was sometimes fighting on equal terms. Vegeta cant really damage frieza that much in his 100% power. While frieza attacks will do a lot of damage. Frieza would be around vegeta's speed so the destructo disk type attack that frieza used should have a great chance to hit. Remember this attack is always used by weaker and slower users (krillin mainly). That would K.O vegeta in a hit
Counterargument: the gap between vegeta's power and frieza's 100% is lower than the gap between goku's power and frieza's 100%. This would imply that the fight would last longer than in the original timeline where frieza ran out of energy. Vegeta would have been too smart and pessimistic to let frieza destroy namek before reaching 100%, frieza would have no need after 100%, and he would be too drained to think straight after the tides turn. Even disregarding all of this, I reject your assertion that 2.5 mil is too high for vegeta. Vegeta's confidence suggests he should be stronger than 3rd form frieza who could be argued to be 2 mil. Additionally, frieza likely started the fight stronger than his 3rd form putting him anywhere from 1.75 mil to 2.5 mil yet vegeta started off with the edge. It is very realistic for vegeta's power level to be anywhere from 2 mil to 2.5 mil.
Thats exactly what i was thinking! Vegeta can sense ki so it wouldnt make sense for him to still be weaker than 3rd form yet be confident against final form even if he thought he was gonna go ssj
@@AsakniGames If Vegeta was able to properly compare sensed ki to his own, he wouldn't have underestimated Perfect Cell just before getting his ass handed to him. Anyway, the "counterargument" in question uses the 120 mil Daizenshuu figure yet seems to be ignoring Goku's listing at 3 mil to start the Freeza fight. No way in hell is Vegeta at 2.5 if Goku is at 3. He's at 2 mil, maximum. The gulf between them is enormous, that much is made clear from the beginning of Goku vs Freeza and how Vegeta could not track his "true speed", even in the lower percentages. Another thing is that Freeza's barrier technique is equal to a Kamehameha. Freeza uses this move quite early against SSJ Goku. Vegeta has no answer for it, and, given how much stronger Goku is than Vegeta, there's a real chance that Freeza's barrier move kills Vegeta, especially if used multiple times. Important to remember that some of Freeza's limited time at full power was wasted trying to get to the dragon to make the wish.
@@Cableguy15Plus Vegeta’s ability to sense ki went through the window when Freeza was on his final form and thought he had a chance against him. His recent power boost got to his head and began the assault against an opponent that vastly outclassed him. Him going Super Saiyan would have been a repeat of this.
@@Cableguy15 I didn't ignore goku's power level, I just didn't mention it because I wasn't talking about goku. Your argument that vegeta's power level cannot be over 2 mill because he couldn't react to goku's speed also proves that his power level HAD to be AT LEAST 2 mill because piccolo could not react to vegeta's speed. This means that vegeta survives long enough for frieza to run out of stamina. As for this barrier technique, remember that vegeta's durability goes beyond that of most similarly strong fighters. On earth, he survived a kamehameha from a goku boosted to 1.77 times vegeta's power. If frieza's barrier technique only scales to a 1.5 times kamehameha, there's no guarantee this would decide the battle considering zenkai boosts. And it is not important to consider how frieza wasted time going to the dragonballs. The amount of time he wasted was insignificant and there's no reason to say this wouldn't happen anyways.
Remember, Frieza only said that he was using 1% after his first power up when he and Goku started fighting. He wasn't even using that 1% when he Killed Vegeta.
❤❤ love you fam i love your work keep going it feels so good to see someone who i share the same opinion with especially with namek vegeta and the what if scenarios in sparking zero
There are some errors here. For instance. Halfway through his fight with Goku, Freiza decided to use 50% of his power. This was enough to completely overwhelm Goku to the point he couldn't even fight back which resulted in him using the spirit bomb. Even after he reached 100%, Freiza almost immediately beat the breaks off of Goku. Freiza also beat Goku in several clashes and he buried and knocked Goku out at one point. The deciding factor was not that Goku was so much stronger than Freiza, it is just that Freiza's 100% power had a major drawback.
Vegeta stated super saiyan made him more aggressive. The reason his character "changed" in the cell saga was because he had achieved hjs goal of super saiyan. He felt untouchable cause of the reverence and pedastal he put the transformation on. If he achieved that in namek he would not imagine a possibility of frieza beating him and let him transform. There is dozens of proof for this. It is not opinion or arguable.
Precisely. He let Zarbon transformed and got beat near death, he almost got body swapped by Ginyu if it wasn’t for Goku stepping in front at the very last moment and got so blinded by his own power boost after Dende healed him that assault final form Freeza without a moment of thought and got destroyed. This was going to be the same thing all over again.
I'd say Vegeta was sitting at 2,500,000 ppl fail to realize Goku was only in the fight for so long because he was able to utilize kaioken x10 and 20 without that he would have got folded up.
and Vegeta is only left out because Toriyama said so as a Super Saiyan on Namek he would have beat him and in Resurrection F but its not written to be that way DBZ and GT and some of Super are welcome to the Goku show
Vegeta is literally a tactical fighter. Most fights that he gets to win he significantly stronger so it seems like he just an overpowering fighter but Vegeta thinks before he battles.
Frieza is the one person who had a psychological hold on Vegeta. I don’t think he’d let him get to 100%. He goaded him into transforming to his 2nd form because he knew Frieza could transform and wanted to get it out of the way.
100 million keeping up with 120 million (should be more since frieza got weakened by the spirit bomb) seems kinda far fetched. Frieza has too many powerful attacks
Namek Vegeta was different than his future self because Frieza was around, and around him Vegeta chew up whatever pride he could. But without Frieza, his Saiyan pride took over him. And also he was desperate to get rid of the shackles Frieza had on him, so yes he would eventually finish the job.
I'd argue that Vegeta's pride may have been at it's highest in some ways in this arc. Every death up to Frieza was necessary because they stood in the way of his ultimate goal - immortality and destroying Frieza. Faced with the chance to kill the tyrant, I think his pride would demand no mercy, especially BECAUSE it is so personal for him. To FINALLY exact his revenge on the monster that eradicated his people. It's not a challenge anymore. It's a demand from his pride that he cannot ignore
I think it's possible that Vegeta was close to 3 million at the time actually, since it was revealed by King Kai in the manga that Goku was using the Kaioken the entire fight prior to becoming a Super Saiyan. Which was meant to be a bad revelation, since the manga was in black and white, and the reader wouldn't have been able to tell. I don't think Vegeta was quite as strong as base Goku, but it's entirely possible that he was close.
Vegeta and Goku likely had a similar base power but Goku can amplify his power with kaioken and was doing it most the fight. I think people assume the power gap from Goku's intro hower Vegeta could also track Frieza's beam he just didn't block it. It's a good chance Frieza just chose to entertain Goku and wanted to break Vegeta. He also wanted to break Goku but Goku understood that and used it to his advantage for the spirit bomb. The power scaling gets weird right after the Ginyu force fight. We have no ideal how strong Vegeta actually was and Goku was using kaioken to power up to 180,000 and at that time Frieza had a base of 530,000...now the weirder part is Vegeta and Frieza tied up just 3-4 episodes later with that same Frieza with Frieza being impressed with Vegeta strength which clearly puts him somewhere in the realm of at least 120,000 to have Frieza thinking Vegeta originally killed the Ginyu force
@@qualiswilliams7403 it wasn't implied that goku was using kaio ken vs frieza only when Frieza started using 50 percent. Base goku vs Frieza using only mere digits of percent as implied in the anime seems more legit. A good reason to check
Gokek was stated to be using KKx10 throughout. We couldn’t see it. KKx20 with KMHM (x2.2* against Raditz) got 1H palmed by 50% (result as with his much lower PL against Raditz). JOBalot was being carried. And SS was later shown to be less than x4. It refreshed and amped him. There is no x50 (and that wouldn’t be enough for the results when one doesn’t stupidly overlook KMHM modifier as the non-canon magazine kids did in decades gone by).
It depends *when* I think, if he got healed right at the end his base power might be enough. If earlier Dende might not have been killed and boosts would still be on the table. It also doesn't say if Goku would have shown up still. I think together they could have worked out something, but there are too many variables. I think he would have had a shot
I think it ultimately comes down to whether vegeta could put aside his arrogance over achieving his new form for killing the person who ruined his life. If he let the power get to his head frieza'd power up to 100% and it'd likely be gg atp
Aye bro, keep going, I usually don't pay attention to small youtubers or dbz content, but the fact that you kept my attention amazes me, keep doing the good work
I think if Frieza killed Goku and it caused Vegeta to go SSJ, that would be a quicker fight where he wouldn't have let Frieza get to 100% power. If Vegeta was the last Saiyan alive and had no one else to be prince to, he wouldn't waste time like he did with Cell (where he also had an audience). The anger at Goku's death would have led to Vegeta going all-out to avenge him.
Vegeta called Goku a Super Saiyan JUST BY SENSING HIS BASE FORM. His BP was nowhere near 2.4m. And we DO know how strong Vegeta was at that point. It was around 1.5 million according to Kakarot.
The way i see it is if vegeta transforms after his attack is deflected and he starts to cry i think he uses his newfound power to get his retaliation on frieza and kills him without a second thought but if he unlocks it prior to the fight his arrogance would likely lead him to letting frieza hit his maximum
I think Vegeta wouldn't let his pride and arrogance in the way. He would finish final form frieza before the latter gets to full power. The reason Namek Vegeta was the best at getting the job done is because of what frieza did to king vegeta, vegeta himself and the saiyan race. He felt the same towards frieza's henchmen who were basically frieza's hands. So he would fight with the same job-finishing attitude against Frieza as his henchmen. The reason he let cell reach perfect form and let majin buu hatch is because he didn't feel the same resentment for them as he felt for frieza.
Considering the way he reacted to Goku not finishing off the ginyus (and him subsequently doing it himself) I imagine he’d go in for the kill right away.
Not after getting so high on his own power by finally transforming into a Super Saiyan. He would have been EXTREMELY overconfident by his own achievement and having realized the legend that he would have let Freeza power up to 100% to try and humiliate him like he did Zarbon and subsequently die for his own arrogance.
Goku was, on the down low using kaioken too. Which can't be used with Super Sayain. So Goku with his skill and Kaioken makes his base performance make so much sense. But yeah, Vegetas power level I think would be 100 mill. Great video and a fun discussion
What? Who said you can't stack kaioken? Now with Goku just transforming it makes sense, cuz he's not used to the form. But as seen in Super he stacks it on blue, so it's safe to say he could stack it on any of the forms, it's just the drawback might also be multiplied.
@beyondthesacrosanctbreeze Aside from filler, I'm sure I remember it being said it was only possible in super sayain blue due to control of energy that the form has.
@@mattycans6994 Lol, not sure what exactly your referring to but I always thought kaioken was an under utilized technique. When was it ever stated that it can't be used with the SSJ forms? I don't remember them mentioning it could be used cuz of the God form, but they could have, I don't remember. Either way the God stuff came way later and it was kind of an ass pull to counter a time skip technique which makes no sense at all.
@@beyondthesacrosanctbreeze It was mentioned by Old Kai in Dragon Ball Super that using Kaio-ken alongside Super Saiyan is almost impossible or rather lethal because the intense emotional turmoil caused by the Super Saiyan transformation would not allow precise ki control to survive the technique. I know, it's said in super. But man Goku would have been insane if I was rocking both Kiaoken and Ss early on haha
@@mattycans6994 Yeah, I always thought it would be cool. If he stacked kaioken on the instant transmission Kamehameha against Cell. Might have actually won that fight lol.
One thing about this I don't agree with ( and I very well may be wrong idk). At this point Frieza couldn't suppress his power without the use of transformations. I always interpreted him claiming to x% of his powers as intimidation.
I guess you could say he wouldn't be more powerful than 100% "final form" Frieza, but I think he could still win. That form drains Frieza fast, and we did see Vegeta win a war of attrition against Goku in the Saiyan Saga where he was over powered by Kaio Ken but Goku couldn't maintain that for long.
During the Freeza saga, Vegeta was ruthless. He didn't give the ginyu force a chance, he murdered them while he could. I believe he would have crippled Freeza then allowed him to try to power up in order to play with him like a cat does to its prey. Vegeta is prideful to a fault.. but at this time he was more of a predator than a showboat. His prideful stupidity doesn't come until later on when he thinks that he and Goku are the strongest things out there, especially with freeza and king cold being dead.
can you imagine vegeta just going super saiyan, the transformation of legend he grew up with his entire life, for his moment of triumph, and being scared of freeza saying "let me go 100%", no he would let him i do agree with you that freeza would just blow up the planet if he had to, vegeta has a different effect psychologically on goku -- goku is a martial artist and he triggers the martial artist's pride in his enemies (including vegeta), which makes them want to beat goku in a straight up fight instead of just blowing up the planet and calling it a day. vegeta on the other hand doesnt have that same purity so they act like him, just wanting to win
I really don't think this comes solely down to just "who has the slightly higher power level". Vegeta is tactically a better fighter than Goku and exhibits far more ruthlessness when he attacks. Not to mention, Frieza's mentality toward Vegeta would be different as well. At full power, he was fighting to KILL Goku from the word go. But for Vegeta, I feel like it might be closer to what he did with Vegeta during the whole fight: looking too punish him, cull his ego, and put him in his place. And underestimating him that much despite not having much more power than him could result in Vegeta landing something devestating while his guard is down a little bit. For example, look at how much damage and how good of a fight Vegeta was able to put up against Recoom despite being vastly outmatched.
I think in this scenario vegeta would not allow freeza to power up anymore because at this point he allowed him to do it 3 times already and he was wrong about being stronger than him every time. That mixed with vegetas hated for freeza i think he would kill him as fast as possible
The amount of arrogance and pride he would get by turning SSJ at that point would have totally blinded him. He would 1000% would have let Freeza power up thinking he was unstoppable as a SSJ only to get the tables turned. He did the same with Zarbon, he did the same with Cell, and the only reason he killed Recoome and Burter immediately was because all of them were downed by that point. He was cocky against Jeice and Ginyu, to the point he was going to fall to him if it wasn’t for Goku interception his Body Change at the right moment.
I personally think Vegeta wouldn't make the pride mistake since its freiza and the overall history between them. I could see him having no mercy for anything he says or does. Especially getting the legendary form, he would feel like its his fate to annihilate him.
100% Frieza was capped at 120 million with Goku stating that he loses power since reaching that state at a rapid rate. Even if you lowball Vegeta, a SSJ Tranformation of a x50 boost would be more than enough to last 2-3 minutes until Frieza weakens enough for Vegeta to get the job done.
Goku was not merely matching Frieza, Super Saiyan was far stronger than Frieza in his final form and the only reason 100% power Frieza could compete was because Frieza was burning his energy very fast in that form to try and finish the fight fast. Even as max power, Frieza was losing the fight
The notion that Dragonball would have ended in the Freeza arc is a myth. Toriyama never said he intended to end it there. The closest you get is one of his old editors wanted that. It holds no weight just like that fan myth that Toriyama wanted Dragonball to end in the Cell saga.
I've always had Vegeta at 2 million when he fought Freeza in his final form, so I would agree with that part. There's also kind of a really solid chance that Vegeta actually wouldn't let Freeza power all the way up to 100%. It wouldn't make any sense for Vegeta to doubt Freeza's power or let him power up more again. He already did it once after he grappled with him in his first form. It would be lame for him to do it again for the same opponent. Catch my drift? I hope that someone gets it.
One thing people didnt count , is that Goku used kaioken before going x20 , he used lower levels to sustain in short burts when needed , sort of hit and run. So Frieza wasnt fighting Goku only at 3 mil , we know Vegeta is above 2 mil because both stated in the anime and manga that Frieza 2nd form is above 1 mil that means each form is only a higher state. Vegeta took in consideration and guessed Frieza to cap at to 2mi which Vegeta himself must have been higher in order to boast about him being better. So between a 2.5 mil and a 3 mil isnt a significant difference in order to keep up with Frieza below 50% , proof that Goku used lower states of Kaioken , Kaio sama even said that at some point Goku used kaioken all this time, before going x20. All and all , Vegeta wouldnt gain the same boost of power like Goku did because grief ,anger ,sadness gives more then just rage alone. Vegeta would be weaker then Frieza around maybe 110 mil peaking in burts at 115 BUT Frieza cant sustain that level of power and Vegeta 's battle experience plus this is Namek Vegeta , he would throw dirt in your eyes to win. For comparison , in the manga Goku's fight was rather one sided then the anime , it was clear that Goku wanted to humiliate Frieza by taking his best shots.
Here's why I say yeah during the cell saga he told sell "this is my son trunks if I would have managed to lose my son will finish you off" trunks is a time traveler so Goku would still have killed Frieza but he's just a subordinate if Vegeta would have wished he would travel in time to have finished the job himself, Goku never killed Frieza until after Trunks, Trunks is one of his best finishing moves giggity...
I’ma be nice to Vegeta in the Namek saga he took on Dodoria, Zarbon and the entire ginyu force before he got his ass whooped by Freiza , and I know it’s not mentioned in Dragon Ball Z, I’m pretty sure that universe doesn’t have PTSD unless you’re talking about trunks, also I know Senso beans are very helpful, but mentally I imagine Vegeta is drained by the end of fighting with the Ginyu Force. But with super Saiyan, especially a forced transformation like Vegeta has. I think he would be able to smash freezer into the ground. Especially if he was back to full health by the beginning of the fight.
Goku got one of the, if not the, most insane OP power buffs in DBZ when he got healed on Namek. Vegeta certainly got a solid one, but nowhere near the 30x power boost Goku got.
I think vegeta may not let freezer get up to 100%. This is because his ego got hurt AFTER goku transformed on ssj on namek and he started becoming frustrated to not be the strongest warrior. But in namek, he was a total strategist. He didn't want to prove he was the strongest, he wanted to kill everyone on frieza force to avenge his race, and everything on his way should perish. After Zarbon, he may be intelligent enough to understand his past mistakes and destroy freezer when he gets the chance. Yes, his ego was hurt by goku on earth but i think it should cured after becoming the legendary super saiyan, but his character hasn't still running on full ego. Goku's transformation and Trunk's transformation did change the character and on the entire cell saga he became more and more arrogant.
There’s no way that would happen. He was stupid enough to sense ki by the time Freeza transformed to his final form and completely disregarded it in lieu of his recent power up by trying cheating a near death experience from Krillin and healed by Dende. He was so high on his own power boost that he went straight for final form Freeza and got toyed hard until he lost his will to live. Dude gets clapped.
I feel like vegeta would win even if freezer reaches his 100% since the difference isnt that high and in that state freezer's power keeps decreasing because he isnt used to that form. Goku's fight against freezer lasted less than 5 minutes and before that freezer was already exhausted. I doubt vegeta cant last at least 2 minutes against freezer even if he is more powerfull.
In Dragon ball being any difference in power is a huge difference. That means Freeza has more Ki to move faster and hit harder than Vegeta, and Vegeta would take more damage. Freeza would kill Vegeta in 3 or 4 minutes before that fatigue set in.
@stephenvargas5806 Freezer could give a bit of a fight against ssj goku, since the difference in power is similar I was thinking vegeta would be able to outlast that difference, since freezer literally got tired in 3 minutes at most
Namek sage vegeta was far more brutal and tactical, willing to take cheap shots and basically do anything to win. He chides goku in this respect. In my opinion, Vegeta goes SS and injures freiza considerably. Then freiza powers up to full after goading vegeta. But the injuries combined with frieza's poor control over his max power will allow vegeta to take the upperhand and win.
Goku was stated to be using kaioken times ten in his fight with freeza without anyone knowing. The z fighters on king Kai planet were watching the fight and then tien says that Goku would win because he still has the kaio Ken. King Kai then revealed that he was already using times ten. He then uses times twenty to damage fifty percent freeza This vastly widens the range of vegetas potential power in which Goku is still the the strongest and performs significantly better than vegeta and yet vegeta still be potentially stronger or most likely just very similar to base Goku without Kaioken. Not too familiar with the guidebooks but have the manga almost memorized from my parents using the library as childcare
Honestly it depends on if Vegeta's hate for Frieza is stronger than his pride. If it is, I could see him doing everything in his power to obliterate Frieza, and even if Frieza's power level is higher, there's still a chance Vegeta could hit him with an attack that's strong enough to kill or seriously injure Frieza (Like the final flash with Cell, and Frieza can't regenerate like Cell can.) He has a chance to take it, but i think in the long run it was best that he didn't become a Super Saiyan until later.
Great video. Very good argument. I agree that Vegeta initially will have the power to beat Frieza but then make him reach full power and then lose...🤦🏽♂️
I believe vegeta would let freeza transform. Vegeta was barely able to stand up to first form freeza, but he encouraged freeza to transform. This is knowing that zarbon kicked his ass after he transformed. He'd let freeza reach 100% to test his ne ss ability
My thoughts before watching.. Its pretty safe to say vegeta was between 1.5 to 2mil max as his base wasnt close to goku's based on performance. However Vegeta was greater than 3rd form frieza after getting his last zenkai. Ssj would put vegeta just under Friezas max
"You're not dealing with the average Saiyan warrior anymore..."
😂
NO!
"Oh My GOD!..."😂😂😂
GREAT 👌 SUPER SAIYAN VEGETA VS FRIEZA.
“But fr this time”
"You see frieza, I became the thing you feared , I have became the legend , the super saiyan!"
700 th sub good vid
Frieza: "No, seriously, you have no idea how old that got."
Cringe 12 year old
@@Ghostselfhelper me? I was trying to quote something i heard from DBZA
Super pooper scoopers are just legends
Imagine getting a new form you hyped up for a whole saga and still losing💀 sounds like a Vegeta move
Certainly happened when achieved UE and promptly got clapped
No it sounds like a toriyama move
So fucked if you think about it. Even in this hypothetical situation...he still loses. 😂
Vegeta wins with every reveal in canon.
>UE
Non-canon. Also, he didn’t lose (thanks to help).
@@BigVEEWe calling the manga non-canon now? Also he technically lost his debut of SS blue
My mans just needed to tingle his energy in his back ☠️☠️☠️
In Dragon Ball Z, Vegeta is used as a tool to drive the plot. We very often see him grow significantly in strength only to lose to the final villain right before the "real hero" saves the day. In this way Vegeta is used to show how strong the final villain actually is, but he never wins against him. This happened with Frieza, the Androids, cell, and majin Buu. Many fans view it as an overused trick to a beloved character.
In my opinion Vegeta would win this fight. They are fighting at a level where power levels don't matter as much. Vegeta is a brilliant resourceful character who throughout the Namek Saga was fighting villains stronger than him.
True, in narrative especially if Toriyama wrote it he's not winning LMAO
@DecBird Yeah it's pretty ridiculous lol
EXCELLENT WORK.
Quite the opposite, at this point in the story they are fighting where ONLY power level matters now, it has become about who has a bigger number, in dragon ball there was far more techniques and strategies
@@santi_super_stunts2573 That's a legitimate perspective. I remember thinking the same thing when I first watched the show. But the 5 hour+ fight between the z fighters and Frieza is supposed to show how power alone will not win the fight. Pretty sure Toriyama said this himself and that power levels aren't supposed to matter. I respect your take on this though.
But know vegeta he would let frieza power up since he did it with zarbon and frieza 1st 2nd and 3rd form
And notoriously with Cell going perfect
SSJ Vegata should be considerably stronger than Final Form, but yeah, if Frieza goes Full Power and doesn’t drag it out before he starts losing power, Vegeta might lose.
Yeah but Vegeta didn't hate Cell or Zarbon nearly as much as he hates Frieza. This would be as much of a story of revenge as it would be a test of his strength.
@@macrochipped he literally told frieza to transform
Vegeta is by definition the "fuck around and find out" type of guy
I feel like he would absolutely let Frieza power up. Even ignoring the situation in the Cell Saga, it was *Vegeta* who goaded Frieza to go into his 2nd Form, Not Frieza.
Even if Vegeta is overpowering him initially, Frieza would play into this saying he isn’t using his full strength, and Vegeta would 100% fall into that trap and let him fully power up.
Yeah, ive seen the argument
Also, as we see in the Android Saga, going Super Saiyan makes Vegeta’s ego fly out of control. Base Vegeta might be reasonable not to let Frieza power up, but SS Vegeta definitely would.
I would say that he likely learned his lesson when he encouraged freeza to transform the first time around... but he hadn't learned it by the time semi-perfect cell was around so... yeah, freeza has this one in the bag lul
Semi perfect cell was different though. Vegeta was dog walking him the whole fight. The vegeta vs frieza fight would be a lot closer. So vegeta ain’t letting bro take it up a notch. Even if he did. He’d find a way to kill Frieza
The point is it wouldn't even matter at point. Just as it didn't Goku. He was not merely just a little stronger than Frieza but multiple times stronger than Frieza. Especially if Vegeta went into the rage form like Goku did, he'd kill Frieza in 30 seconds.
It was clearly implied in the story that Goku was significantly above Vegeta by the time he finished healing and arrived to finally face Frieza. The two Saiyans weren't in the same league by that point, and Vegeta sensed it. It wasn't just Goku's fighting skill that helped him put up more of a fight but also his increased energy, speed, strength, and durability.
Vegeta could tell after Goku's first exchange with Frieza that he was far & away the most powerful Saiyan he'd seen so far (Hence, why he believed Goku was the Super Saiyan after comparing their respective performances against Frieza in combat). Were Goku not stronger to an impressive degree, Vegeta wouldn't have been so confident that he could win.
He was at a high enough level to anticipate & counter many of Frieza's attacks until he began fighting at 50% power, including the Death Beam (Vegeta could react to it but showed no capacity to directly block it like Goku did). He was quick enough to land the first hit against Frieza whereas Vegeta couldn't keep up with him once he started actually trying.
Even then, Frieza was barely trying against Vegeta overall, not needing anywhere near 50% power to outpace him. The one somewhat serious effort he displayed was kicking away Vegeta's full power blast. Even if Vegeta unlocked Super Saiyan, it would likely only have put him on barely equal footing with Frieza at most (much like when he was able to resist 1st form Frieza; It took a great deal of effort, but he held him back). Once Frieza charged up to 100%, he'd kill Vegeta for sure.
Even if Vegeta decided not to give Frieza time to power up, it's unlikely in my opinion that he'd be able to defeat, let alone kill him before he reached 100%. Frieza sent SS Goku flying via a two-handed kiai before he could react without using "even three quarters" of his full power. That same kiai would've most likely devastated or outright killed SS Vegeta.
SS is an awesome multiplier + stamina revitilizer. Ex- It gave Goku the energy to continue fighting with fresh vigor when he was physically exhausted and had very little ki left just moments before. But it comes down to how much the base form offers to multiply in the first place. Vegeta simply wasn't at a high enough level yet for SS to put him over the top.
No theire actually close in power,the only difference was the kaioken
@@usuario15965"KAIO WHAT?"
@@usuario15965 Their performances against Frieza showed otherwise long before Goku started using the Kaio-ken (No, there is no evidence that he started using it before the 2nd half of their battle, when they changed from aerial combat to the ground and Goku removed his gi's over-shirt; King Kai only referred to the Kaio-ken after that point).
Goku was outdoing Vegeta in every conceivable way by an impressive margin from the moment he arrived to face Frieza. He actually challenged, pressured, and injured the tyrant to the point that he was forced to use 50% to outdo his enemy. Vegeta didn't challenge Frieza anywhere near to the same degree even with his full speed & power.
You can say "Well, we don't know that Goku WASN'T using the Kaio-ken from the beginning", but the onus is on you to prove that he was using it before King Kai addressed it, not on me to prove that he wasn't. With or without the Kaio-ken, there was no comparison between Goku and Vegeta aside from Vegeta keeping up with Frieza's speed better and reacting to his Death Beam (again, until Frieza stopped playing). Granted, Frieza toyed with Goku too.
But he at least had to try harder against him, even in his 4th form. He didn't break a single sweat against Vegeta despite the Saiyan Prince's best efforts, not even when kicking away his max power blast. However you examine it, Toriyama wrote & drew Goku as being significantly superior to Vegeta from the very beginning of that battle.
Unless you cite evidence of Toriyama stating Goku & Vegeta were similar in power at this point, I'm not debating any further over what's plain to see in the original manga that the creator himself authored decades ago.
@@usuario15965No they are not. We have official power levels at this point in the show and Goku performed much better. Stop the Vegeta Glaze.
@@usuario15965vegeta was just slightly above frieza third form after the dende zenkai, he never stood any chance against final form frieza
0:53 a pure heart is not required
A pure heart in fact helps speed up the process of achieving Super Saiyan due to the gentler the nature the more S-Cells the Saiyan has the easier the process of achieving the Super Saiyan transformation which is why Goku could easily achieve it opposed to Vegeta
@smasherjosh5000 Speeds it up it's not required. Goku didn't achieve it very easily either.
His heart is pure. Pure unadulterated badass.
@ArkaeaFCL3 No, it isn't. Remember that if they didn't need him to beat Buu, he would have gone to hell
@LuisPerez-5 I was quoting dbz abridged. I wasn't being serious.
6:30 I would argue he would because he let zarbon transform and get the better of him in their first fight. It’s how Vegeta is. When he believes he’s stronger than you he’s cocky when knows he’s weaker he becomes intelligent.
Before they knew how to control its downsides (grade 4), super saiyan was an emotionally dangerous power-up, especially for the purebloods. Vegeta would one, not have the necessary power to beat 100% freeza like you said, and would two, fall victim to the egomaniacal frenzy that ssj brings on even harder than goku did due to his natural arrogance.
He would try and get the ultimate humiliation against his slaver and die miserably for it. Freeza takes this
Super Saiyan Vegeta wipes and it's not close
@@beliac7712 What do you mean? Vegeta would absolutely let frieza transform and then get recked
I think vegetas base form is around 2.5million because frieza was at 530,000 and his 2nd form was over 1million which means he probably got roughly 2x stronger. His 3rd transformation would probably be a 2x increase again putting him at 2,120,000. Vegeta can sense ki at this point so i dont think he would have been as confident to fight 4th form frieza if he didnt think he was marginaly above 3rd form frieza. Ik he thought he was about to turn super saiyan but vegetas not stupid he definently knew he was ahead of 3rd form frieza and was ready to fight final form. Thats why i'd say 2.5million. Also this saga was when you could barely be stronger than someone and completly dominate them for example vegeta vs dadoria/vegeta vs zarbon
“The Saiyan Prince against the Galactic Tyrant”
That line goes so hard 🔥
Cringe 12 year old
Ssj1 will always be the most iconic imo
The only chance he was if before Frieza goes full power, but I doubt Vegeta would do that. Why do ppl think he can win? He literally couldn’t TOUCH Frieza before he would go super saiyan. Heck even Frieza kicked his max powered attack like nothing. Goku on the other hand got way more hits and did way better in his base form. I think the gap between Goku and Vegeta was way more than what ppl realize. The number for Vegeta at 2.4 million never made sense to me. Personally Vegeta is at 2-2.1 million for me.
well yes he did that but we know he was stronger than piccolo but weaker than goku. So his power level would have to be between 1M and 3M. And if you multiply 50 by either one of those frieza has to use 50% power at the very least
You’re forgetting Goku was using Kaoken against Frieza, but was doing it so briefly and intermittently that no-one could tell apart from Piccolo I think.
Base Goku was 20 times weaker than Final Form. Just to no diff someone in DB requires a pl difference of 1.5 times, never mind 20. Goku was using Kaoken.
Despite whatever headcanon you have, it’s canon he’s somewhat around as strong as Base Goku at this point. If he unlocked SSJ, he would neg diff Final Form, but he could get smoked by Full Power as long as Frieza doesn’t drag it out, but if he does, Vegeta wins the war of attrition.
He's stronger than xenomorph frieza
Toryama would just find a way to make frieza win still. So no vegeta would not get the W if he turned super saiyan
Toryama would just find a way to make frieza win still. So no vegeta would not get the W if he turned super saiyan
Here's my take, Vegeta is likely around 2 million maybe slightly above. Power level wise he would get around 100 or maybe a little above so yes if he let Frieza go to 100% he would be at a disadvantage. However something to note in especially in the Anime Freiza really struggles to hold that form the entire time he fights Goku at super saiyan he has to put a overdrive level into to land a hit. Goku pretty much just lets him waste himself down. So given that I would say this would be about like golden Freiza fighting Goku but with him having more obvious struggle against Vegeta before running out of steam. That is the worst case situation tho considering how Goku barley kept his cool Vegeta is about as likely to waste Freiza before he can power up further.
Ive also thought this at one point as well
Finally someone that can read the fucking manga and come with a good opinion
The reason Goku was able to keep up with Frieza was because he was using the kaio-ken throughout the entire fight. He was using the x10 for the entire fight, and boosted all the way up to x20 at one point. Meaning that Goku was spending most of the fight using a power level of 30'000'000, not 3. And even up to 60'000'000 when he used the x20. And even with that massive boost, Goku was still barely keeping up with a lackadaisical Frieza.
Vegeta doesn't have the kaio-ken, so he got destroyed by Frieza easily. But his base power may have been similar; we know that he had to be considerably stronger than Piccolo, for the reasons you cited. It's worth noting also that Frieza can't maintain his top power for long; he gassed out and his power started to rapidly drop after fighting (canonically) for only a few minutes. At which point he stopped even being a challenge for Goku. The same would be true of Vegeta, even if we assume that the gap between him and Frieza wouldn't be as big as the one between Goku and Frieza.
Only edge he has is that if he does end up getting the upper hand he WILL NOT show mercy to Frieza, he wasn’t naive enough to show mercy to the ginyu force I don’t think he would to Frieza. He definitely won’t heal him either and would do anything to kill him
Vegeta: Put your morals aside Kakarot, you need to fight to win.
Vegeta wouldn't let frieza get to full power.
7:18 the biggest kill count for Vegeta was blowing up Arlia in Saiyan saga before arriving to Earth.
That thumbnail made me realize how clean Vegeta looks as a super Saiyan in his Namek armor. He was the only one screaming about how he was a super Saiyan LoL.🤷🏿Anyway, this video is really impressive, over 35K views and only 1.02K subs. I can tell it was researched. I subbed!😌
I really wish he could have gotten his vengeance against Frieza in Resurrection F. He truly deserved it after everything he witnessed and experienced growing up and watching everyone he knew die and his planet be destroyed.
According to Super Saiya Densetsu for the SNES, base Vegeta was almost 4 times stronger than base Goku. Goku was about 280,000 while Vegeta was about 960,000 or so... so if Vegeta went SSJ on Namek, he would have humiliated Frieza.
Base Goku was at 3 million bro 😂
@@Kcinthasun that doesn't make any sense though, unless you accept that Toriyama realized that power levels were stupid and wanted to jump the shark with them. Which is probably the case. Why? Because Goku went from 90,000 vs Ginyu... and then got a zenkai boost to 3,000,000?
Bro, c'mon don't be stupid. The Daizenshuu is bullshit. I know it, you know it, Toriyama knew it. He was either trolling, or just came up with an arbitrary number because he forgot what Goku's power level was during his fight with Ginyu.
I promise you, the numbers from Super Saiya Densetsu make more sense.
This makes much more sense, and what I'm about to tell you is gonna blow your fuckin' mind because it makes a lot of the rest of the series make sense too, including Super.
When Saiyans get a zenkai boost, it isn't based on their base power level, it's based on the highest power level their body has recently achieved. Therefore, when Goku went Kaioken up to 180,000 he got a Zenkai boost from that, not from 90,000 and even THEN going to 260,000 was nearly a 50% boost in his strength (which is approximately the amount of power he would get from a regular Kaioken).
So Goku starts the fight at 260,000. Kaioken x10 is 2,600,000 and x20 is 5,200,000 with SSJ being 13,000,000
Frieza starts off using 33% of his power (one third) at 4,240,000 which makes sense because Goku was using Kaioken the whole time, and the only thing keeping him on an even footing was the fact that Freiza couldn't detect power levels, his fighting technique, and Frieza not taking the fight seriously. At 50% Frieza is at 6,360,000 which is why a x20 Kaioken Kamehameha almost got him if it weren't for the fact that he cancelled it out with his own Ki blast. At 100% he was at 12,720,000 which is why the fight was so close.
You've gotta be out of your mind if you think Goku's power level was 150,000,000 when even 13,000,000 is based on a 50% fucking zenkai boost. Drugs bro.
@DonutGuard according to your logic first form frieza is stronger than final form frieza when he's fighting goku before powering up to 50% 😂😂😂😂
@@SleepLessThan3 not at all. I didn't explain this far, but first form Frieza was 560,000... at 1/3 his full power. This means that Frieza was holding back in two ways the entire fight. He held back by sticking with his first form which uses less energy, and also by keeping his power level in check which, again, uses less energy. If anything what I'm saying is that first form Frieza could have powered up enough to be about even with Piccolo if he wanted to, or straight up just beat him silly in his second form, but transforming was more efficient for him.
The math just about works out if you double his power level for every transformation. It's a little off from what I said before at 4,240,000 before for 33% final form to be fair, but not much. But either way, it works out.
560,000
1,120,000
2,240,000
4,480,000
So for Frieza, he was using 1/3 power the whole time, and transforming doubled his power level.
The only way I could see Vegeta ignoring his pride to let Freeza transform is if his anger at Freeza surpassed his pride & arrogance. However, I truly don't see that happening. It's too embedded in his character. Not just w/ Cell, but even in the Namek saga, we saw him not only allow but also encourage an opponent to transform because he believed he could still beat them if they did. The first one was Zarbon, who Vegeta had a slight upper hand against during their 1st fight while Zarbon was in base. But rather than finish him off when he had the opportunity, what did Vegeta do? He let Zarbon transform and then proceeded to catch a serious beating.
Same w/ form 1 Freeza, he was able to just barely keep up with him during their initial confrontation. And true to form, what did Vegeta then do? He not only allowed but encouraged Freeza to transform cause he believed Freeza's power wouldn't "increase that much". And he turned out to be dead wrong on that one. So I definitely see him letting Freeza reach 100%, as being the first to become a Super Saiyan would have the prince drunk on power and feed his ego even more. The only way I see Super Saiyan Vegeta beating full-powered Freeza on Namek, is if he's able to outlast him. Since we saw that after obtaining his full power, Freeza couldn't hold on to it for long, and lost a big portion of it pretty rapidly. If Vegeta can withstand the initial onslaught, then I say he has a solid chance to win. But that's a really big if.
Great respect this is an interesting topic hope you reach 1k subs soon this banger content
nice video, like the way you went over this
I understand those numbers were given at certain period of time by offical sources, however it's also been stated by official sources (i believe in Super) that 100% power Frieza was always stronger than Goku but just like in Resurrection F his lack of stamina lead to his downfall both times.
Basically Frieza and Vegta want to be strong enough to one shot their opponents. When they are stronger they often do, or they play with their food. When they're not, they lose
The issue is this.
When Goku went Super Sayain against Frieza, Frieza was at 50% power. In this case, Frieza would be at 2.5% at the time of Vegeta going Super Sayain. With that disparity in power, it would have only taken one proper below to kill or cripple Frieza. This could easily result in Frieza deing before he realised that he needed to power up.
You’re heavily underestimating Freeza’s ridiculous durability. Not even Goku blasting him enraged and the planet exploding finished him. Not even Broly’s rampage killed a significantly unmatched Freeza. He has always been written as a really durable nuisance.
Frieza would immediately power up to 50% seeing super saiyan.
I think people forget how much of a gap there is between frieza and ssj vegeta. Frieza was taking goku's hits and was sometimes fighting on equal terms.
Vegeta cant really damage frieza that much in his 100% power. While frieza attacks will do a lot of damage.
Frieza would be around vegeta's speed so the destructo disk type attack that frieza used should have a great chance to hit. Remember this attack is always used by weaker and slower users (krillin mainly). That would K.O vegeta in a hit
Counterargument: the gap between vegeta's power and frieza's 100% is lower than the gap between goku's power and frieza's 100%. This would imply that the fight would last longer than in the original timeline where frieza ran out of energy. Vegeta would have been too smart and pessimistic to let frieza destroy namek before reaching 100%, frieza would have no need after 100%, and he would be too drained to think straight after the tides turn. Even disregarding all of this, I reject your assertion that 2.5 mil is too high for vegeta. Vegeta's confidence suggests he should be stronger than 3rd form frieza who could be argued to be 2 mil. Additionally, frieza likely started the fight stronger than his 3rd form putting him anywhere from 1.75 mil to 2.5 mil yet vegeta started off with the edge. It is very realistic for vegeta's power level to be anywhere from 2 mil to 2.5 mil.
Thats exactly what i was thinking! Vegeta can sense ki so it wouldnt make sense for him to still be weaker than 3rd form yet be confident against final form even if he thought he was gonna go ssj
@@AsakniGames If Vegeta was able to properly compare sensed ki to his own, he wouldn't have underestimated Perfect Cell just before getting his ass handed to him.
Anyway, the "counterargument" in question uses the 120 mil Daizenshuu figure yet seems to be ignoring Goku's listing at 3 mil to start the Freeza fight. No way in hell is Vegeta at 2.5 if Goku is at 3. He's at 2 mil, maximum. The gulf between them is enormous, that much is made clear from the beginning of Goku vs Freeza and how Vegeta could not track his "true speed", even in the lower percentages.
Another thing is that Freeza's barrier technique is equal to a Kamehameha. Freeza uses this move quite early against SSJ Goku. Vegeta has no answer for it, and, given how much stronger Goku is than Vegeta, there's a real chance that Freeza's barrier move kills Vegeta, especially if used multiple times. Important to remember that some of Freeza's limited time at full power was wasted trying to get to the dragon to make the wish.
@@Cableguy15Plus Vegeta’s ability to sense ki went through the window when Freeza was on his final form and thought he had a chance against him. His recent power boost got to his head and began the assault against an opponent that vastly outclassed him. Him going Super Saiyan would have been a repeat of this.
@@Cableguy15 I didn't ignore goku's power level, I just didn't mention it because I wasn't talking about goku. Your argument that vegeta's power level cannot be over 2 mill because he couldn't react to goku's speed also proves that his power level HAD to be AT LEAST 2 mill because piccolo could not react to vegeta's speed. This means that vegeta survives long enough for frieza to run out of stamina. As for this barrier technique, remember that vegeta's durability goes beyond that of most similarly strong fighters. On earth, he survived a kamehameha from a goku boosted to 1.77 times vegeta's power. If frieza's barrier technique only scales to a 1.5 times kamehameha, there's no guarantee this would decide the battle considering zenkai boosts. And it is not important to consider how frieza wasted time going to the dragonballs. The amount of time he wasted was insignificant and there's no reason to say this wouldn't happen anyways.
Remember, Frieza only said that he was using 1% after his first power up when he and Goku started fighting. He wasn't even using that 1% when he Killed Vegeta.
But that’d be weaker than his 3rd form
It really depends on if vegeta power level has a super saiyan is at least above frieza at 50 percent and he finishes the job
“✨💫”
“hullo everywon, majin burd here”
I'm willing to bet ssj Vegeta would've never let Frieza reach full power due to years of animosity
❤❤ love you fam i love your work keep going it feels so good to see someone who i share the same opinion with especially with namek vegeta and the what if scenarios in sparking zero
There are some errors here. For instance. Halfway through his fight with Goku, Freiza decided to use 50% of his power. This was enough to completely overwhelm Goku to the point he couldn't even fight back which resulted in him using the spirit bomb.
Even after he reached 100%, Freiza almost immediately beat the breaks off of Goku. Freiza also beat Goku in several clashes and he buried and knocked Goku out at one point. The deciding factor was not that Goku was so much stronger than Freiza, it is just that Freiza's 100% power had a major drawback.
Vegeta stated super saiyan made him more aggressive. The reason his character "changed" in the cell saga was because he had achieved hjs goal of super saiyan. He felt untouchable cause of the reverence and pedastal he put the transformation on. If he achieved that in namek he would not imagine a possibility of frieza beating him and let him transform. There is dozens of proof for this. It is not opinion or arguable.
Precisely.
He let Zarbon transformed and got beat near death, he almost got body swapped by Ginyu if it wasn’t for Goku stepping in front at the very last moment and got so blinded by his own power boost after Dende healed him that assault final form Freeza without a moment of thought and got destroyed. This was going to be the same thing all over again.
I'd say Vegeta was sitting at 2,500,000 ppl fail to realize Goku was only in the fight for so long because he was able to utilize kaioken x10 and 20 without that he would have got folded up.
and Vegeta is only left out because Toriyama said so as a Super Saiyan on Namek he would have beat him and in Resurrection F but its not written to be that way DBZ and GT and some of Super are welcome to the Goku show
Vegeta is literally a tactical fighter. Most fights that he gets to win he significantly stronger so it seems like he just an overpowering fighter but Vegeta thinks before he battles.
Good analysis
Frieza is the one person who had a psychological hold on Vegeta. I don’t think he’d let him get to 100%. He goaded him into transforming to his 2nd form because he knew Frieza could transform and wanted to get it out of the way.
This is about as well thought out an answer as you could ask for to this question.
if vegeta manages to even keep up with frieza at full power for long enough frieza's stamina could lower enough for the odds to be in his favor
100 million keeping up with 120 million (should be more since frieza got weakened by the spirit bomb) seems kinda far fetched. Frieza has too many powerful attacks
Namek Vegeta was different than his future self because Frieza was around, and around him Vegeta chew up whatever pride he could. But without Frieza, his Saiyan pride took over him. And also he was desperate to get rid of the shackles Frieza had on him, so yes he would eventually finish the job.
I'd argue that Vegeta's pride may have been at it's highest in some ways in this arc. Every death up to Frieza was necessary because they stood in the way of his ultimate goal - immortality and destroying Frieza. Faced with the chance to kill the tyrant, I think his pride would demand no mercy, especially BECAUSE it is so personal for him. To FINALLY exact his revenge on the monster that eradicated his people. It's not a challenge anymore. It's a demand from his pride that he cannot ignore
Many ways for that fight to end but damn I'd love to see it
I think it's possible that Vegeta was close to 3 million at the time actually, since it was revealed by King Kai in the manga that Goku was using the Kaioken the entire fight prior to becoming a Super Saiyan. Which was meant to be a bad revelation, since the manga was in black and white, and the reader wouldn't have been able to tell. I don't think Vegeta was quite as strong as base Goku, but it's entirely possible that he was close.
Everyone the main character until they do the thumb pose
Vegeta was on a vengeful killing spree on the Frieza force.. seeing how he handled the ginyu force shows you how he would've dealt with Frieza
Vegeta thinking he's strong enough for final form Frieza automatically has him over 3rd form Frieza, who's over 2 mil
Vegeta and Goku likely had a similar base power but Goku can amplify his power with kaioken and was doing it most the fight. I think people assume the power gap from Goku's intro hower Vegeta could also track Frieza's beam he just didn't block it. It's a good chance Frieza just chose to entertain Goku and wanted to break Vegeta. He also wanted to break Goku but Goku understood that and used it to his advantage for the spirit bomb. The power scaling gets weird right after the Ginyu force fight. We have no ideal how strong Vegeta actually was and Goku was using kaioken to power up to 180,000 and at that time Frieza had a base of 530,000...now the weirder part is Vegeta and Frieza tied up just 3-4 episodes later with that same Frieza with Frieza being impressed with Vegeta strength which clearly puts him somewhere in the realm of at least 120,000 to have Frieza thinking Vegeta originally killed the Ginyu force
@@qualiswilliams7403 it wasn't implied that goku was using kaio ken vs frieza only when Frieza started using 50 percent. Base goku vs Frieza using only mere digits of percent as implied in the anime seems more legit. A good reason to check
Gokek was stated to be using KKx10 throughout. We couldn’t see it. KKx20 with KMHM (x2.2* against Raditz) got 1H palmed by 50% (result as with his much lower PL against Raditz). JOBalot was being carried. And SS was later shown to be less than x4. It refreshed and amped him. There is no x50 (and that wouldn’t be enough for the results when one doesn’t stupidly overlook KMHM modifier as the non-canon magazine kids did in decades gone by).
It depends *when* I think, if he got healed right at the end his base power might be enough. If earlier Dende might not have been killed and boosts would still be on the table. It also doesn't say if Goku would have shown up still. I think together they could have worked out something, but there are too many variables. I think he would have had a shot
I think it ultimately comes down to whether vegeta could put aside his arrogance over achieving his new form for killing the person who ruined his life. If he let the power get to his head frieza'd power up to 100% and it'd likely be gg atp
Freiza "In preparation, I trained for 45 minutes. In that period, I multipled my power 100 fold. " If Freiza just survives and trains, he's unbeatable
Aye bro, keep going, I usually don't pay attention to small youtubers or dbz content, but the fact that you kept my attention amazes me, keep doing the good work
Thanks, will do!
I think if Frieza killed Goku and it caused Vegeta to go SSJ, that would be a quicker fight where he wouldn't have let Frieza get to 100% power. If Vegeta was the last Saiyan alive and had no one else to be prince to, he wouldn't waste time like he did with Cell (where he also had an audience). The anger at Goku's death would have led to Vegeta going all-out to avenge him.
Vegeta called Goku a Super Saiyan JUST BY SENSING HIS BASE FORM. His BP was nowhere near 2.4m. And we DO know how strong Vegeta was at that point. It was around 1.5 million according to Kakarot.
The way i see it is if vegeta transforms after his attack is deflected and he starts to cry i think he uses his newfound power to get his retaliation on frieza and kills him without a second thought but if he unlocks it prior to the fight his arrogance would likely lead him to letting frieza hit his maximum
If Saiyans had the knowledge to build gravity chambers the rest of the universe would have been cooked
"Is not close" brother it wasn't even close in the original💀💀💀
Your comment make nonsense
I think Vegeta wouldn't let his pride and arrogance in the way. He would finish final form frieza before the latter gets to full power.
The reason Namek Vegeta was the best at getting the job done is because of what frieza did to king vegeta, vegeta himself and the saiyan race.
He felt the same towards frieza's henchmen who were basically frieza's hands. So he would fight with the same job-finishing attitude against Frieza as his henchmen.
The reason he let cell reach perfect form and let majin buu hatch is because he didn't feel the same resentment for them as he felt for frieza.
I agree with you I don’t think vegeta at the moment could beat full powered frieza even as a ssj I think he puts up a decent fight
Considering the way he reacted to Goku not finishing off the ginyus (and him subsequently doing it himself) I imagine he’d go in for the kill right away.
Not after getting so high on his own power by finally transforming into a Super Saiyan. He would have been EXTREMELY overconfident by his own achievement and having realized the legend that he would have let Freeza power up to 100% to try and humiliate him like he did Zarbon and subsequently die for his own arrogance.
Goku was, on the down low using kaioken too. Which can't be used with Super Sayain. So Goku with his skill and Kaioken makes his base performance make so much sense.
But yeah, Vegetas power level I think would be 100 mill.
Great video and a fun discussion
What? Who said you can't stack kaioken?
Now with Goku just transforming it makes sense, cuz he's not used to the form. But as seen in Super he stacks it on blue, so it's safe to say he could stack it on any of the forms, it's just the drawback might also be multiplied.
@beyondthesacrosanctbreeze Aside from filler, I'm sure I remember it being said it was only possible in super sayain blue due to control of energy that the form has.
@@mattycans6994 Lol, not sure what exactly your referring to but I always thought kaioken was an under utilized technique. When was it ever stated that it can't be used with the SSJ forms? I don't remember them mentioning it could be used cuz of the God form, but they could have, I don't remember. Either way the God stuff came way later and it was kind of an ass pull to counter a time skip technique which makes no sense at all.
@@beyondthesacrosanctbreeze It was mentioned by Old Kai in Dragon Ball Super that using Kaio-ken alongside Super Saiyan is almost impossible or rather lethal because the intense emotional turmoil caused by the Super Saiyan transformation would not allow precise ki control to survive the technique. I know, it's said in super. But man Goku would have been insane if I was rocking both Kiaoken and Ss early on haha
@@mattycans6994 Yeah, I always thought it would be cool. If he stacked kaioken on the instant transmission Kamehameha against Cell. Might have actually won that fight lol.
is this like vegeta when he fights frieza, or his zenkai while ssj goku and frieza are fighting?
One thing about this I don't agree with ( and I very well may be wrong idk). At this point Frieza couldn't suppress his power without the use of transformations. I always interpreted him claiming to x% of his powers as intimidation.
"vegeta cant be that close to goku" goku was using kaioken
I guess you could say he wouldn't be more powerful than 100% "final form" Frieza, but I think he could still win. That form drains Frieza fast, and we did see Vegeta win a war of attrition against Goku in the Saiyan Saga where he was over powered by Kaio Ken but Goku couldn't maintain that for long.
I think this would be a very close fight
During the Freeza saga, Vegeta was ruthless. He didn't give the ginyu force a chance, he murdered them while he could. I believe he would have crippled Freeza then allowed him to try to power up in order to play with him like a cat does to its prey. Vegeta is prideful to a fault.. but at this time he was more of a predator than a showboat. His prideful stupidity doesn't come until later on when he thinks that he and Goku are the strongest things out there, especially with freeza and king cold being dead.
can you imagine vegeta just going super saiyan, the transformation of legend he grew up with his entire life, for his moment of triumph, and being scared of freeza saying "let me go 100%", no he would let him
i do agree with you that freeza would just blow up the planet if he had to, vegeta has a different effect psychologically on goku -- goku is a martial artist and he triggers the martial artist's pride in his enemies (including vegeta), which makes them want to beat goku in a straight up fight instead of just blowing up the planet and calling it a day. vegeta on the other hand doesnt have that same purity so they act like him, just wanting to win
I really don't think this comes solely down to just "who has the slightly higher power level". Vegeta is tactically a better fighter than Goku and exhibits far more ruthlessness when he attacks. Not to mention, Frieza's mentality toward Vegeta would be different as well. At full power, he was fighting to KILL Goku from the word go. But for Vegeta, I feel like it might be closer to what he did with Vegeta during the whole fight: looking too punish him, cull his ego, and put him in his place. And underestimating him that much despite not having much more power than him could result in Vegeta landing something devestating while his guard is down a little bit. For example, look at how much damage and how good of a fight Vegeta was able to put up against Recoom despite being vastly outmatched.
I think in this scenario vegeta would not allow freeza to power up anymore because at this point he allowed him to do it 3 times already and he was wrong about being stronger than him every time. That mixed with vegetas hated for freeza i think he would kill him as fast as possible
The amount of arrogance and pride he would get by turning SSJ at that point would have totally blinded him. He would 1000% would have let Freeza power up thinking he was unstoppable as a SSJ only to get the tables turned. He did the same with Zarbon, he did the same with Cell, and the only reason he killed Recoome and Burter immediately was because all of them were downed by that point. He was cocky against Jeice and Ginyu, to the point he was going to fall to him if it wasn’t for Goku interception his Body Change at the right moment.
Here before u blow up and get famous
salute to you and bc of that youll be the first mod
w-Wait i've been here since 380 subs ❤@@DetBird
@@tmtsps12 I've been here since his second vid
He would let him power up cause he is the super saiyan from legends so he thinks he is unbeatable but gets then overwhelmed by Freezer
I personally think Vegeta wouldn't make the pride mistake since its freiza and the overall history between them. I could see him having no mercy for anything he says or does. Especially getting the legendary form, he would feel like its his fate to annihilate him.
Definitively Frieza would oversmarted Vegeta to let him reach that 100%. Damn that only make both of them greater characters....
Golden Frieza VS Super Saiyan Vegeta is NOT Close. Ahh video
The only reason goku won against frieza was because Frieza was hit by a spirit bomb before he fought super saiyan goku.
Vegeta going SSJ would DEFINITELY let Frieza go 100% the build up to him becoming SSJ would be too much for him to not be cocky.
100% Frieza was capped at 120 million with Goku stating that he loses power since reaching that state at a rapid rate. Even if you lowball Vegeta, a SSJ Tranformation of a x50 boost would be more than enough to last 2-3 minutes until Frieza weakens enough for Vegeta to get the job done.
I wanna.. I wanna I wanna I wanna
Goku was not merely matching Frieza, Super Saiyan was far stronger than Frieza in his final form and the only reason 100% power Frieza could compete was because Frieza was burning his energy very fast in that form to try and finish the fight fast. Even as max power, Frieza was losing the fight
The notion that Dragonball would have ended in the Freeza arc is a myth. Toriyama never said he intended to end it there. The closest you get is one of his old editors wanted that. It holds no weight just like that fan myth that Toriyama wanted Dragonball to end in the Cell saga.
I've always had Vegeta at 2 million when he fought Freeza in his final form, so I would agree with that part. There's also kind of a really solid chance that Vegeta actually wouldn't let Freeza power all the way up to 100%. It wouldn't make any sense for Vegeta to doubt Freeza's power or let him power up more again. He already did it once after he grappled with him in his first form. It would be lame for him to do it again for the same opponent.
Catch my drift? I hope that someone gets it.
One thing people didnt count , is that Goku used kaioken before going x20 , he used lower levels to sustain in short burts when needed , sort of hit and run.
So Frieza wasnt fighting Goku only at 3 mil , we know Vegeta is above 2 mil because both stated in the anime and manga that Frieza 2nd form is above 1 mil that means each form is only a higher state.
Vegeta took in consideration and guessed Frieza to cap at to 2mi which Vegeta himself must have been higher in order to boast about him being better.
So between a 2.5 mil and a 3 mil isnt a significant difference in order to keep up with Frieza below 50% , proof that Goku used lower states of Kaioken , Kaio sama even said that at some point Goku used kaioken all this time, before going x20.
All and all , Vegeta wouldnt gain the same boost of power like Goku did because grief ,anger ,sadness gives more then just rage alone.
Vegeta would be weaker then Frieza around maybe 110 mil peaking in burts at 115 BUT Frieza cant sustain that level of power and Vegeta 's battle experience plus this is Namek Vegeta , he would throw dirt in your eyes to win.
For comparison , in the manga Goku's fight was rather one sided then the anime , it was clear that Goku wanted to humiliate Frieza by taking his best shots.
Serious question what was the job of vegeta? Soldier?
I think he would be motivated to take down Freiza, especially due to the history they share and the sayains being wiped out by him.
Here's why I say yeah during the cell saga he told sell "this is my son trunks if I would have managed to lose my son will finish you off" trunks is a time traveler so Goku would still have killed Frieza but he's just a subordinate if Vegeta would have wished he would travel in time to have finished the job himself, Goku never killed Frieza until after Trunks, Trunks is one of his best finishing moves giggity...
I’ma be nice to Vegeta in the Namek saga he took on Dodoria, Zarbon and the entire ginyu force before he got his ass whooped by Freiza , and I know it’s not mentioned in Dragon Ball Z, I’m pretty sure that universe doesn’t have PTSD unless you’re talking about trunks, also I know Senso beans are very helpful, but mentally I imagine Vegeta is drained by the end of fighting with the Ginyu Force. But with super Saiyan, especially a forced transformation like Vegeta has. I think he would be able to smash freezer into the ground. Especially if he was back to full health by the beginning of the fight.
Goku got one of the, if not the, most insane OP power buffs in DBZ when he got healed on Namek. Vegeta certainly got a solid one, but nowhere near the 30x power boost Goku got.
I think vegeta may not let freezer get up to 100%. This is because his ego got hurt AFTER goku transformed on ssj on namek and he started becoming frustrated to not be the strongest warrior. But in namek, he was a total strategist. He didn't want to prove he was the strongest, he wanted to kill everyone on frieza force to avenge his race, and everything on his way should perish. After Zarbon, he may be intelligent enough to understand his past mistakes and destroy freezer when he gets the chance. Yes, his ego was hurt by goku on earth but i think it should cured after becoming the legendary super saiyan, but his character hasn't still running on full ego. Goku's transformation and Trunk's transformation did change the character and on the entire cell saga he became more and more arrogant.
There’s no way that would happen. He was stupid enough to sense ki by the time Freeza transformed to his final form and completely disregarded it in lieu of his recent power up by trying cheating a near death experience from Krillin and healed by Dende. He was so high on his own power boost that he went straight for final form Freeza and got toyed hard until he lost his will to live.
Dude gets clapped.
I feel like vegeta would win even if freezer reaches his 100% since the difference isnt that high and in that state freezer's power keeps decreasing because he isnt used to that form.
Goku's fight against freezer lasted less than 5 minutes and before that freezer was already exhausted. I doubt vegeta cant last at least 2 minutes against freezer even if he is more powerfull.
In Dragon ball being any difference in power is a huge difference. That means Freeza has more Ki to move faster and hit harder than Vegeta, and Vegeta would take more damage. Freeza would kill Vegeta in 3 or 4 minutes before that fatigue set in.
@stephenvargas5806 Freezer could give a bit of a fight against ssj goku, since the difference in power is similar I was thinking vegeta would be able to outlast that difference, since freezer literally got tired in 3 minutes at most
Namek sage vegeta was far more brutal and tactical, willing to take cheap shots and basically do anything to win. He chides goku in this respect. In my opinion, Vegeta goes SS and injures freiza considerably. Then freiza powers up to full after goading vegeta. But the injuries combined with frieza's poor control over his max power will allow vegeta to take the upperhand and win.
Goku was stated to be using kaioken times ten in his fight with freeza without anyone knowing. The z fighters on king Kai planet were watching the fight and then tien says that Goku would win because he still has the kaio Ken. King Kai then revealed that he was already using times ten. He then uses times twenty to damage fifty percent freeza
This vastly widens the range of vegetas potential power in which Goku is still the the strongest and performs significantly better than vegeta and yet vegeta still be potentially stronger or most likely just very similar to base Goku without Kaioken.
Not too familiar with the guidebooks but have the manga almost memorized from my parents using the library as childcare
Vegita was less then 2 million at this time
Vegeta would let his pride get in the way and let Frieza power up then he would lose eventually because Frieza still had a higher pl than him
Honestly it depends on if Vegeta's hate for Frieza is stronger than his pride. If it is, I could see him doing everything in his power to obliterate Frieza, and even if Frieza's power level is higher, there's still a chance Vegeta could hit him with an attack that's strong enough to kill or seriously injure Frieza (Like the final flash with Cell, and Frieza can't regenerate like Cell can.) He has a chance to take it, but i think in the long run it was best that he didn't become a Super Saiyan until later.
Even if this did happen Akira would’ve found a way to write vegeta getting his ass beat in the and goku saves him as a ssj
Great video. Very good argument. I agree that Vegeta initially will have the power to beat Frieza but then make him reach full power and then lose...🤦🏽♂️
I believe vegeta would let freeza transform. Vegeta was barely able to stand up to first form freeza, but he encouraged freeza to transform. This is knowing that zarbon kicked his ass after he transformed. He'd let freeza reach 100% to test his ne ss ability
6:25 I don't think he would let frieza tho, he killed pretty much most of the saiyans and their home i think hed want frieza dead
My thoughts before watching.. Its pretty safe to say vegeta was between 1.5 to 2mil max as his base wasnt close to goku's based on performance. However Vegeta was greater than 3rd form frieza after getting his last zenkai. Ssj would put vegeta just under Friezas max