Bigscreen Beyond: www.bigscreenvr.com/ Pimax Crystal: pimax.com/crystal/ Join this channel to support Tested and get access to perks: ruclips.net/channel/UCiDJtJKMICpb9B1qf7qjEOAjoin
@@bro_duck You might be able to with a SteamVR headset (for example using a quest 2/3 with index controllers) but you would need to calibrate every time you launch steamVR if it even works.
Bigscreen Crystal and Pimax Beyond? Beyond Crystal and Pimax Bigscreen? Bigmax Beystal and Piscreen Cryond? Bimeen Beystond and Pigscrax Cryol?? Bimcrax Bryonal and Pigsmreen Ceystond???
When VR headsets are all the size of a pair of eye glasses in 20 or 30 years from now, the Pimax Crystal will probably get featured in like, "crazy retro tech" articles. And kids will marvel at how big and heavy it was and how much it cost. "1600 dollars!? wow, that's like 10,000 credits in today's money"
Expensive? Absolutely not. Look at it this way, a good 65 inch oled tv is gonna cost 2.5k this hmd is just essentially 2 tvs strapped to your eyes except you can get a 120 foot screen out of it and also do VR. I think peeps got it twisted by going cheap on their hmds. It's the cheap hmds that will damage your eyes and also when you buy cheap, the companies ie meta will continue making cheap and that's the experience you will get....cheap.
@@stevebobowski3507 i love this logic, even though u cant compare the crisp quality of 4K TV vs VR floating screen unless Bigscreen have 12k resolution for that minimum
@@moncimoov I can absolutely compare as I have a 4k tv and compare it with my aero at 39ppd and it's nearly indistinguishable. Given the bigscreenbeyond is only 31ppd and wouldn't compare but a step in the right direction.
I'm so happy that this is out in the wild now. I was an early tester under NDA for the Beyond beginning in March 2021 and I wanted to tell the world about this headset, but couldn't. Thank you for getting the word out about how good the headset is, as well as noting some of the shortcomings. Providing a clear picture is key to long term adoption. When I first heard about it I was so excited, as my #1 complaint about VR headsets was always comfort. I love VR, but found it difficult to remain immersed for long periods of time due to comfort issues with extended use of headsets like the Index or Rift S. Don't even get me started about standalones. Massive pressure headaches, anyone? Anyway, I am certianly biased towards the Beyond, but the comfort is undeniable. I would have been happy even if I had to compromise on the optics, but to have my expectations exceeded in BOTH categories? Amazing. It was also a great journey to watch the itterations from the inside and try prototypes, which made the final production version all the more sweet.
Hey, as someone who's been using it for so long, can you give your feedback regarding the glare? Is this really that bad, or is it in line with other pancake lens headsets?
Without a doubt the #1 reason people stop playing VR is how cumbersome it is to get started. The weight is part of it, comfort for sure, adjusting things especially in VR sets used by many people in a house, and the time it takes to get in and do something. ALL of these issues seem to be solved by the Beyond except maybe boot time but that's likely out of their hands and the least issue. The price is a bit steep for the Quest type of people to pay for it, but as someone who mostly wants to use VR for sim racing and sim flying (DCS), I am beyond excited to try this set out! If they could find some way to get the mask scan stuff on Android that would be very helpful as I am not an iphone user.
Man, Norm, you've come a long way. I remember around 10 years ago when you first started working with, Adam. How awkward you were as an interviewer. You've become my favorite tech journalist, hands down. Here's to a long career, dude!
21 minutes in I was thinking, where in the hell is the comparison?! 😂 The Bigscreen Beyond is such exciting tech that it's difficult not to talk about! I am incredibly excited to get my hands on mine, which is going to be a game changer for me because I have degenerative disc disease in my neck (arthritis) which starts to irritate me during longer sessions currently wearing a Valve Index which is 807g + 200g counterweight, so it's 1kg! The Bigscreen Beyond at only ~200g fully equipped is going to help so much!
Yes but... it's easy to make a light headset when you leave out vitally important stuff like... I don't know...audio??? What was the idea there? I mean ok for media I guess or seated gaming, but not really ideal for active gaming. Although I don't know how you reach for your drink or snacks. So maybe wouldn't replace my TV just yet. You know what is annoying also? A wire Well then how about having two wires? One for the headset and one for your audio solution? No. Not cool. Sure. I think big screen has its place and I would like to try it. But they are already sensibly pivoting to include that audio strap and a more universal face gasket. The pimax might be terribly heavy. So that's not good, but at least it can be potentially used wirelessly in future, and doesn't require annoying faffing with separate headphones that you can't see. Plus dismissing the eye tracked foveated rendering offered by pimax is also an odd omission from Norms one sided comparison. Idk!
@@CorporateZombi I disagree that it is easy to make a light headset, at all. It was very challenging for Bigscreen, and required years of R&D. It is a shame there is no audio included, but I got hopes for the Audio Strap that will likely fix that. That said, I *much* prefer using my own headphones over a solution similar to Meta's approach with the Quest Headphones. These are absolutely terrible. They are serviceable when you have nothing else, but one of the first things to do with any Quest 2 or Rift S is to get your own headphones, earbuds or the Vive Deluxe audio strap and 3d printed adapter. The included audio is abysmal and not immersive at all. So yeah, agreed that no audio off the bat is not ideal. But I understand the idea, especially when the strap on the beyond is so light and thin that using your own headphones is easy. Speaking of Headphones, bluetooth audio has gotten miles better. You don't need a wire if you don't want one, just wireless headphones. A few companies make some that have their own receiver (namely Logitech and Steel Series) so you don't need anything else, but if you get your hands on a aptX Low Latency compatible headphones then you can just buy a good bluetooth receiver and bam, it works with no noticeable latency. This would work well for the Beyond. That said, for my beyond, I am going the fully wired route. I already have a wired setup with the Rift S on my PC, with a pulley system for the cable management, so it's a non-issue in my case. But I understand how wireless has its appeal.
@@CorporateZombiI agree. I appreciate the headset itself, and what it will do for hardware in the future, but it really is filling a void, and won't help in getting new VR users into the market. Its quite niche. But I guess it does the niche very well.
I own the Pimax Crystal. My battery lasts a LOT more longer than 3 hours while plugged in. I fly DCS World with it, and I can fly for over 8 hours on one battery. It's not as heavy as is being described. If you've ever worn a helmet, you won't notice it. It's VERY comfortable, even while wearing glasses, although I will say you need to get the 15mm face pad and not the 11mm. My glasses actually scratched my lenses and I had to get a replacement pair, however, the Crystal is a solid frontrunner. Inside outside tracking and dynamic foveated rendering are huge game changers. I can play DCS World with 90% of the graphics on the highest and still get great performance using a RTX 3090. I have owned it for over 2 months, and I love it.
Really appreciate the detail! Think I’m going to pull the trigger on the Beyond, the idea of being able to watch my media library in the most immersive way imaginable is too much to pass up!
I love the idea of the big screen. And I assume their solution for glasses wearing people are the magnetic lenses he took on and off repeatedly. I love that for a vr headset rather than the lenses moving themselves back and forth. Just seems intuitive and an actual solution rather than a compromise
Hey Norm, awesome video as always. I just wanted to mention that future headsets will need eye tracking for dynamic foveated rendering so I don't think Pimax (or any future hmd) should take that out. One of the only times I've disagreed with you but still love your take on things. Appreciate all the hard work you put into these!
Bigscreen VR with inside out tracking would be perfect (also if they could cram in some wireless that would be killer) Love the direction that bigscreen VR is going.
I wonder if it would be possible to use htcs self tracked tracker as a head tracker together with beyond? would be kinda wild. For wireless i think nofio who made a wireless adapter for the index is working on something
Bigscreen Beyond with built in headphones, inside out tracking, wider fov, with free motion controllers, pancake lenses, and reliable to turn it from worse product to okay one 😅
I would like to see the pimax do away with a lot of the standalone VR features too, as well as making the headset lighter. But personally, I see eye tracking and foveated rendering being essential for all VR headsets going forwards. I think I'd also chose the higher PPI and FoV over the extra weight too. It's frustrating because no headsets really nail it STILL, and when they're asking $1000 for just the headset, without the ability to use it unless you also purchase valve lighthouses, you kind of expect them to get it right.
Foveated rendering doesn't mean shit if you don't have the pixels to back it up, and seeing these funny headsets coming out with less than 4K per eye is giving me depression
@@LoganDark4357Lol. Most PCs cant even render games on good fps at 4k for one monitor, now imagine that in 2 mini monitors… it’s ridiculous because its a hardware problem. Most people dont have the specs to run that
@@demapples6580 ...foveated rendering avoids having to render the whole 4k, but only what you are directly looking at. Everything in peripheral vision and etc. is lower resolution.
Thanks for your always interesting and informative reviews mate. I don't think that Meta is only standalone focused, they just don't intend to produce any wired-only headsets anymore. Kind of a big difference imho. Neither the Crystal or BSB headset are my cup of tea. The Crystal is way too bulky and the BSB too inflexible (needing a custom facial interface is too restrictive, for me anyway). Maybe newer headset will come out in 2024/25 that will make me want to upgrade my Quest Pro. Time will tell I guess. The Q3 looks good and I intend to preorder on asap. I mainly am getting this to replace my aging Q2 for better standalone VR/MR, and as a backup for my 11mo preordered Quest Pro. I doubt that the Q3 with do better PCVR but you never know, lol! For now, my QPro with i913900k/rtx4090 continues to work great with all my PCVR games/sims and I'm always amazed how well it works wireless with Air Link. I can get a bit better distant visuals with Link at 650mbps bitrate but I much prefer the freedom of wireless. Maybe due to my rtx4090 and/or settings, but I don't see any so-called streaming artifacts that many users report and complain about. I also run a dual VR headset setup with a DP wired VP1 (Etsy lens mod and Index controllers) so I do know the differences between these. My QPro still gives better overall clarity and much less SDE. The only advantage that DP gives me is about 10% higher FPS performance and this is due to the extra GPU resources required to do the streaming encoding. I easily make up this performance difference by running my QPro at 80Hz refresh rate, compared to my VP1 which is fixed at 90Hz. Again, many thanks for sharing all this mate and best cheers from Australia.
I know this is a small thing but thank you so much for putting a camera through the lenses so I could finally be able to understand visually the characteristics that so many people have been describing, but it didn’t really mean much until you actually showed it. Especially with the lense reflections, I didn’t really know what that actually looked like, and I do see it now, it’s kind of a bloom effect, but to be honest it’s really not that bad, and the contrast of the displays is still able to show through it, unlike a cheap lcd or a tv with local dimming, where the bloom is built into the screen itself, which looks a lot worse to me, then it just being in the lenses.
15:44 That's not what Bigscreen said, though. They said that the GPU runs at max res, then it gets compressed, sent through the cable, then decompressed.
Eye tracking is a must for sure, the Beyond not having it makes it a no go for me. With the cost of graphics cards and the increasingly more demanding games makes eye tracking crucial. Needing an iphone and having to order the custom lenses for glasses users makes it also an issue for the Beyond, this review felt pretty partial for not addressing those points, maybe it's just a very different use case for me then it is for the reviewer, but it didn't felt fair. The battery swapping for the Pimax outside of stand alone was a huge drawback though, i don't want to have to deal with that.
Great insight!!! I'm going for big monster hehe Beyond has big minus - its not shareable and that is must for me. We are just racing and flying here.....
The use case for the Pimax Crystal is clear: serious simmers who don't want compromises when they switch to VR. On my flat screen, I can read my avionics screens and gauges off center from my head. Being forced to center my head on the instrument instead of a quick glance (minor head turn or no) has to be possible otherwise I am fundamentally not going to be able to effective fly and operate a military fighter/attack/bomber jet. I find that all flight simmers who are using non Aero/Pimax headsets are fairly casual with it (GA - general aviation), or only flying air to air combat which means you aren't heavily using avionics outside of your HOTAS.
I love that I'm 16 minutes into a 28 minute video and he's still talking about the Big Screen VR headset. I really wonder what he's going to say about the Pimax..
First I'd like to thank Adam for this excellent review of BigScreen Beyond the through the lens footage is especially beneficial I was searching for through the lens footage throughout alot of BigScreen Beyond reviews but was unable to find that type of footage. What he didn't tell us was the GPU he is using, the through the lens footage has amazing colors and smoothness of movement. He didn't mention that in order to create the face gasket you need to provide BigScreen VR with a FaceScan that you need an iPhone XR to do this.
i get why they did the kitchensink thing, that standalone and insideout market was a completely untapped source of customers for them. i just prey that they get rid of all the insideout and standalone fluff for the 12k. i honestly cant even imagine the big 12k displays possibly working with that much crap bolted onto it.
I would really like to buy the Bigscreen Beyond but the fact that I cant share it with friends and family is a huge no for me. Especially taking into consideration that a lot of my friends have very strong glasses.
you can get lense inserts like he has to accomidate glasses. Also if you friends have ipd close to yours +/- 3 pts or so it will be fine. For me at least, after the hype wore off i was using it myself 95% of the time. If someone wants to try it for 30 min i am ok having them suffer with incorrect ipd :)
For the Beyond, do you need knuckles controllers and base station 2.0 from the index? Or can you use the 2016 vive accessories? Some of us, including myself are still using these.
I’m pretty sure you can use vive controllers and base stations with the beyond. It uses the same tracking as the index and that is backwards compatible
Just got the Aero. Chose it over Pimax and Bigscreen due to enterprise level support and the confidence that comes with that. Pimax also just rubs me the wrong way, too many software issues reported by other users for me to trust them. The clunk when he sat down the Pimax was confirmation enough for me that it's not right for me lmao
That's what I'd pick too if they'd ship to my country. I love tested, but this review was weird. I found inconsistent how 90hz, resolution, sweet spot, and productivity were factored. He mentions you can't go back to lower res after experiencing VR on high res, but then says 1920 upscaled at 90hz is preferable to 72hz. Says edge clarity makes the beyond still not good for productivity. But by that sense, Quest Pro would be preferable with breathable design on top. I believe resolution is addictive, but then why stop at 2.5k with nauseating low refresh rate instead of going highest available with standard 90hz and what seem a not so heavy headset. I wish he included the Varjo aero on this.
The Bigscreen Beyond is the most interesting of the two, but for me too expensive for my usage. The Pimax is too big and clunky. I'm looking forward to the Quest3 and also very interested in how the headset from Immersive is going to be. 2x4k for 700$ in a headset that is slightly bigger than a pair of sunglasses.... I'm looking forward to that on the market.
They seem VR headsets from two different eras. It doesn't matter how clear the image is: If the headset is uncomfortable you're not going to enjoy using it. Waiting to see if Quest 3 is going to be a good compromise between comfort and image quality but I got this feeling that comfortable VR with hi image quality is still 10 years away from us.
Eh, it depends on the user. I have a Pimax 5K, and it's even bigger. But it's not **that** much of a hindrance, I wouldn't go as far to call it "uncomfortable" or anything. The big-ass FOV and high pixel density sorta help with the enjoyment too.
It's awesome to see all the tech available to successful RUclipsrs and the uber wealthy. To a large portion of the people viewing this content, these products are as obtainable as a light saber or a gundam.
If oculus actually check analytics majority of long time quest users play it mostly tethered or through air link (virtual desktop) means a PCVR release is much more in demand than a standalone, which maybe the next leaked release might be as majority of the standalone components can be left out.
@@egirlsrule902 I just ordered it 😜. I've watched so many reviews and complaints I know what I'm getting I think. I won't be racing. Mostly dark environments to exploit the OLED. Bring on the glare and soft peripheral vision I'm ready.
You should review the Goovis G3 Max Personal Cinema. Its Micro OLED, curious about how the movie watching experience is compared to Micro OLED vr headsets
I would like to see the field and view and refresh rate improve on the bigscreen. I love how light and small it is but I feel like most people would be fine with 100 grams more or so just to put it more in like with what you’d expect from an enthusiast level headset
I would love if you could revisit the Aero and compare it. I’m currently agonizing on if I should cancel my Beyond preorder for an Aero. Recent price cut puts it at the exact same price. Such a hard decision
Same here. Bigscreen hast the better fov but aero the eye tracking. Wish I could just have both. Using the index now I don't want to compromise too much on the fov
@@MixedRealitySimRacing A good point my buddy made to me is Meta research says that vertical FOV matters more for immersion and the Beyond has better vertical FOV!
No resell value on Beyond turns me off and Glare is the main problem for me so i have to sell this in the future eventually. 30% of scene will be washed out with glare is big problem. Aero has resell value but small vertical fov and shitty picture color is bad. I wish Quest 3 has local dimming lcd but Mark Fuckerburg is too greedy to have it with $500 price quest 3
I wish I understood any of this I used to be a gamer but being 46 and completely out of this for several years I’d like to get back in it and do these run with the current gaming consoles
No they are both PC VR headsets. I'm the same age as you and have always gamed and TBH VR has ruined gaming in a good way because being in the actually game makes playing it flat screen (on a traditional monitor) just feel "less than". VR is in it's infancy still so lacks AAA titles but there are plenty of poly shaded games that don't need high fidelity and still rock. I would buy something cheap (relatively) like a Quest 2 (which will nose dive in price once the soon to be release Quest 3 comes along) as it's stand alone so no need to invest in a decent PC rig (mobile processor/stand alone). If you find VR "clicks" for you then you could splurge on a beefy PC rig to run higher end games (still using your Quest 2 with a wired link). The issue is for many of us our journey has been incremental (I already own base stations for tracking) and a fairly strong PC with VR controllers but if you are starting from scratch you're going to have to splash out a fair amount of cash to catch up. Finally whilst the Crystal mentioned has great specs Pimax who makes it are just god awful and have yet to meet Western expectations in terms of customer support/QA standards and the Big Screen headset will require lighthouses (trackers) and for me is too little too late (plus who makes an ultra lightweight portable small form factored headset, hinting at movies on the go and then sticks a wire on it...I find it just odd)
I tried to like the crystal but my head shape didn't work with it. Narrow small face. So it moved around even when tightly strapped and the result was blurriness and distortion.
Dang. So for the big screen vr you need external trackers for it to work? Currently using a quest 2 for sim racing. I’m stationary in my cockpit, but I do need head tracking to look around. Would I need external trackers for the BSVR to work?
Whats the vertical measurements on that beyond FOV???? It's great that they managed to increase the horizontal but depending on the Vertical, it's either a cumulative win or loss for me. I've been holding off buying it cause I don't know and as an example, the Vive XR Elite is small and light and their horizontal is about 100 ish degrees but they destroy the experience for me with a vertical of only 80 ish degrees so it feels like your looking through a very wide but very narrow window.
@@ReavoEnd hmm, interesting, I'm torn now between the beyond and the varjo aero which recently got a price cut from 2k ish to under a grand lol and I don't even have to track down an iphone for the stupid face scan lmao decisions decisions lol
yes, i have a question. what dies focal lenght really mean? let me ask the question this way: the ps5vr2 is the only vr headset i ever tried. iam very shortsighted with -6,5dpt and tested the vr2 with 4 friends. some of them slighty shortsightes, some have normal vision. when i wear contacts, i become kinda farsighted. without any aid, i have to hold my phone 10cm away from my eyes to be able to see it, when wearing contacts, i have to hold the phone at arms lenght otherwise i cant focus any text.. but in vr with contacts? i can basically push a sheet of paper against my eyelashes and can still read it, while all my friends, could read any text whatsoever, that was closer then 30 cm to your eyes. does that mean, the the focal lenght of the psvr2 gives me with my dpt a good experience but others dont get it and does that mean, having a shoter focal lenght of the headset, that i then wont be able to see close objects sharp?
This is the video I needed to justify my Bigscreen Beyond purchase. I have been regretting ordering it a bit because its expensive, but now I can't wait to get it. Hopefully valve doesnt announce an index 2 a week after I get it.
I'm skipping BSB because it's dip in FOV and makes me use a wire. For ME, my Vive Pro 2 with wireless is the best headset for my needs, but this would tempt me if cheaper or could use a wireless mode.
Is it worth buying a pc and the base station and controllers and the beyond? I think my quest 2 is too heavy and lack performance .. I love vr and want the best experience Thank you for great vids love u
When watching a movie on the big screen beyond , do the pixels disappear permanently? Meaning, it is as if you are watching the movie on a Sony or Samsung 4k TV??
I still have the original vive pro headset, but it's so frustrating to not have a way to know if it's worth to upgrade without testing new hardware yourself.
I've got the original as well. I've come to the conclusion there isn't a worthy upgrade yet for a couple of reasons. First the industry for VR is too small. There just aren't enough VR games that can be played right now, or enough games with VR/PC cross play to justify spending money on a new headset. When I want to hop into VR and have fun I've got the tools to do it, but there aren't any hardcore VR games which justify a hardcore investment into the tech. Second is that none of the headsets really do what I want. The bigscreen seems great, and might even be the one I go for if I decide to get serious, but the problem is still FOV, screendoor, and wireless. I REALLY want a wireless VR headset, and truly wireless with a built in hot-swappable battery, not the corded strap it to your leg nonsense. Nor do I want all of this onboard processor crap. Nobody who is spending $1000+ on VR tech wants to play shitty mobile games with it. Anyone who is that invested already has a powerful gaming PC and want's to use it. So I think right now until those change, then there isn't any reason to upgrade. Enjoy the Vive in all it's early VR glory and save up for when the technology and industry are mature enough to be worth investing in.
I had the original Vive Pro too, but I'd say even the Quest 2 would be a worthy upgrade if you're not so keen on springing for a high-end headset like the Valve Index. I have both, and the Quest 2 isn't **too** far off from the experience of using the Index (the Index's superior controllers and audio aside). While the Quest 2 doesn't have an OLED screen, what is DOES have that's an advantage over the Vive Pro is the displays use an RGB stripe subpixel arrangement instead of Pentile. Long story short, despite the similar pixel count, the Quest has noticeably less screen door effect due to the smaller gaps between the sub-pixels. It also has wireless standalone and PC VR functionality, which is REAL nice. Personally, I'd upgrade to the Quest 2 or Pico 4 and sell your Vive Pro. Or maybe hold off for the Quest 3 or Pico 5..? Make sure to keep the lighthouses though! This will let you use the Index controllers, which are amazing!
- hurry up you guys and buy the Bigscreen Beyond so I can afford the next generation! (someone said eye tracking in xmas) - oh man, I just thought of a legit advantage of BB: eating. While eating, watching tv/movies is a must, and with a large VR headset there's too much weight on your cheekbones, so VR moves up and down as you chew... - 17:20 does text look that blurry? it would be nice if the blur were adjusted in photoshop to reflect how it actually looks in the headset
They're so small but they COULD have made them bigger for a better FOV and they'd still be smaller and lighter than anything else. Not sure why so many VR companies feel that FOV is not important. I'm not buying another VR headset until someone comes out with one that has 2k+ pixels per eye, integrated audio, 200+ degree field of view, eye tracking and foveated rendering. I'm thinking that's about 5-10 years away before one of these companies decides to integrate all of these already existing technologies into one headset.
I understand Norms reasoning and it makes sense for someone watching videos but I feel like he is severely underselling the importance of eye tracking. Especially as resolution of HMD's get higher and the fidelity of games just gets higher and higher. Playing VR is a very resource heavy operation and will be even more so as games become more beautiful. I'm playing on a 4090 and a i9-13900K and some games are still pretty taxing for my system. Especially those that are flatscreen games ported or modded into VR. Due to the way latency works frame generation is not really viable in VR and so we must find other means of increasing performance without the cost of fidelity. In comes eye tracking, Foveated Rendering is a godsend and IMO essential for any high end headset to be even somewhat future proof. Not even mentioning how good eye tracking can be for things such as navigating menus and I'm sure games will start to incorporate it more and more as popularity rises for the simple reason that it's so... comfortable to use. We all have different priorities and expectations and Norm makes perfect sense in what he says but here you also have another viewpoint. IMO do not sleep on eye tracking if you want a headset that will be able to keep up in the gaming space for years to come. I truly believe you are doing yourself a disservice if you buy a headset without it at this day and age.
I’m kinda tired about everybody complaining about the weight of the Pimax Chrystal. I’m not a fanboy or anything but anybody who is serious about simulation would know that most of these VR headsets are use for seating experiences when it comes to PC i.e. flight simulation, or Sim racing. Which means that you are using the headsets are being used to simulate real conditions. If you’ are doing combat simulation with planes then you should be wearing a helmet and if you are a Sim racing, most racing requires you to wear a helmet. Yes, we have carbon reinforced helmets, but they still have wait to them so having a bit of weight for a VR headset is not a problem, they weigh just about the same amount as a helmet. It’s ok to have some light weight VR headset as there is a market for them but they all don’t need to be super light, I rather have the tech.
Honestly, the bigscreen looks very enticing, but the price is killing it for me. Aside from that, sharing the VR set with family members is basically a nogo because of the made to fit concept. If you could make like a few of those frames and have a manual adjustment for the ipd for a better price then it would be a killer for me.
You'll be able to make new gaskets, but cant adjust IPD. It's a whole thing that required calibration and special equipment. With pancake lenses though, you can be +/- 2 mm for IPD if that's any consolation.
Norm mentions that they are releasing a more generic foam insert that can replace the silicone insert for active-games that might make you sweat -- with the added benefit that such an insert might also be ideal for sharing the headset with others. Of course, as @yourfriendandi correctly states, that won't account for the locked-in IPD.
Big potential for 3D printing, I think: ergonomics of something you strap to your face are so important. I agree that Big Screen's approach seems like the best way forward, but they could make the tooling for the face gasket freely available. Some way to change IPD would also be better, so people can share a headset (I've found it great fun at parties to take turns playing Beat Saber or Superhot or something). Even swappable IPD spacers would probably do (although I've also noticed that IPD really doesn't need to be spot on for such short sessions). I do think inside out tracking is a vastly superior experience to remodelling a room to accommodate VR, but otherwise the Beyond's minimalism is the right call. Get everything that doesn't need to be on the headset, off of it. Have it just be the screens and a ton of sensors (cameras, eye tracking, mic, whatever additional black magic is required for tracking...). Then the user can ideally pick whether they want to connect to a chonky PC for max fidelity or to something that fits in a pocket (or onto a belt clip) for optimal mobility. I really hope that's what the Quest 3 will do, but from what I've seen so far they're still on the "all-in-one" approach.
Can you please clarify by what you mean Bigscreen Beyond not being good for desktop productivity? Surely with OLED at that high resolution text should be easy to read and do work with?
@@Killswitch1411 the Bigscreen Beyond has a 102 degree FOV, which is 2 degrees more than the Apple Vision Pro and yet that headset is described as ideal for productivity. And the Bigscreen Beyond also uses the same micro OLED type display, so what's the difference?
@@TimLongson I own both AVP and BSB and no chance in hell am I doing anything remotely productive in that. Just the lenses alone mess that up for the BSB.
Why does Tested only make reviews of VR headsets and not actual content about VR stuff, like before? I remember the "Projections" show, it was pretty good.
Hello mate! What adapter /cable you're using to connect the pimax crystal? I also have Lenovo legion pro 7i with rtx 4080, i want to buy Crystal light.
What do you think if you use wifi 6 ( or 6E ) with this quest pro this pictures enough there is no articact on the screen? ( AV1 codec is much better than the old one ) So the Quest 3 would be sharper and it means there won'T be so much picture quality differenc with Crystal which use display port or the wireless VR won't be the same picture quality than the dedicated display ports PC VR ? it is impossible? Thanks this answer in advance,
Lifetime maybe, but burn in probably won't be an issue with VR because most VR games have no fixed hud and you are constantly moving your head. Maybe it's also just compromising low persistence and by that being less sharp with motion m
I'm waiting on someone to come up with a headset with a wide field of view. Maybe the Pimax 12k will be the one to really move things forward. Right now, none of the headsets seem terribly interesting to me.
I love my quest 2. I use the AirPlay mode with my rig and don’t really have much to complain about. I have super fast internet and my VR space is same room as my pc so I get a smooth experience. Bonelabs and Blade and Sorcery are my go to games. Also love playing onward without wires getting in my way.
I like how all the previous companies are completing with these heavy bulky hmd. And big screen comes along and not just raises a bar they raise that thing like no one even was participating. They got work else where to go but everyone else now doesn't even compare with the visuals/weight. A combo generations ahead. I am disappointed in needing to touch anything apple tho, even just for the scan. I couldn't even find someone to borrow one from for a second. No one owns one any more. The heavy headsets not just take away from my vr experience it straight up ruins it.
Wanted to love the Bigscreen, but there is no way I can deal with that glare. My Index just collects dust because every time I try to sim with it, the image is so washed out by glare that I can't read any gauges.
I honestly just wish the Bigscreen Beyond was compatible with Mac. I honestly think I could pick one up to replace multiple monitors for productivity, the portability and access would make travel and hybrid work so, so much simpler. It's about the closest I've seen to the ideal for me, but I think even with the Bigscreen the tech and support for "spatial computing" just isn't quite there.
I'm so happy to hear about the face gasket being worked on more, thanks for the information!! I do kind of wish they emailed us more but I guess thats what i get for not being in the discord haha
I tried jumping from the Quest 2 to the Pimax 8KX, and just had an awful time. Sure, the hardware was better, but it was a chore to use. Constant tinkering required, impossible to comfortably use my own headphones even when the audio solution was removed... I do believe they're improving, but I don't think I'll be ready to buy pimax again until I hear glowing reviews across the board. Ultimately, I ended up picking up a used Varjo Aero. I love it and don't think I could go back to the resolution of the Quest 2, but I'll admit, I do often find myself missing a lot of the quest creature comforts. The passthrough and far-superior-to-steamVR desktop mode made it easy to stay in VR for long periods of time.
I love my Pimax 5K+ , paid $100 for it and just needed a little soldering to repair. I couldn't go back to low FOV (been using VR since the original Rift DK1... and worked with the guy who invented Virtuality for 15+ years :))
@@legendfpv "A lot of people tried Pimax 5K+ at our iNFINITE.XR.Lab (which is open for everyone) and we found out everyone prefers different settings. I prefer medium, where to distortion is still visible, but not bothering me. Some people go with ‘there is still distortion at medium, so let’s not sacrifice FOV and go Large). Others (usually those prone to motion sickness) prefer Small to have no distortion at all. " Not sure where you're getting 99% from?
@@njones420 stop shilling. pimax doesnt even have the aparature to correct the distrotions. EVERY SINGLE THING PIMAX HAS EVER POSTED IS A PURE JOKE! EVERYTHING! FROM TESTERS BEHIND THE SCENES, TO SHIPPING THE PRODUCT WHERE THE LOGISTIC GUY HAS TO PICK BOXES FROM THE FLOOR. CHINA BE CHINA!
Why doesn’t someone make a VR headset that combines the advantages of the Bigscreen Beyond with the portability of a standalone headset? Combine an ultralight, unpowered headset like the BB with a “puck” that goes in your pocket, or even a larger backpack “puck”. There would be a thin cable connecting the headset to the puck, which would be snaked down your shirt or whatever. This “puck” would contain the battery and the processing hardware, and that’s where 90% of the weight would go. The result would be a super comfortable headset like the BB, but you wouldn’t need a PC and you wouldn’t be “tethered”. You’d still be able to move around freely.
Which application are you using to watch 4k movies ? The bigscreen app on steam ? I have a bunch of 4k movies on Plex but I don’t think the bigscreen steam app supports 4k mkv
The Vision Pro weighs ~450g, which makes it one of the lightest headsets ever made right after the beyond screen. What in the hell are you talking about? PS.: Even if we add the external battery (60G), it would be the same weight as the Quest 2 while being incomparably less bulky.
over long periods, yes even the 450g Vision Pro would cause neck pain. thats why the Bigscreen Beyond form factor is the ONLY viable form factor going forward.
How could any one put on the Pimax when the Big Screen Beyond is half the size? Would someone detail exactly what is needed to get the Big Screen Beyond up and running for movies, flying, and anyting else I would like to do? Thanks.
just need 2 steamvr base stations (preferablly the 2.0 versions you can source from steams website, for upgrade purposes) and steamvr tracked controllers (such as the valve index controllers, which are sold as L/R pairs on steams website aswell). The Beyond should have built in support to pair these controllers, and with a VR ready PC you should be good to go. The Pimax can track itself and has it's own controllers, but comes with a lot of reliability issues and weird stuff like having to swap/charge the batteries even though for PCVR you are stuck to a tehered experience. You can upgrade its poor built-in tracking with the steamvr faceplate but you would still need the peripherals mentioned for the beyond then, and you will omit yourself from the supposed wireless adapter the pimax is making since it's not compatible with the steamvr faceplate. all in all, as the reviewer said I wouldn't reccomend the pimax - but both would require a decent investment to get into coming outside the SteamVR ecosystem.
I tried the Bigscreen, and it gets too hot for my comfort after about 20mins. Despite the gasket was for someone else's face it worked well for mine, but the result is no ventilation what so ever. And the glare! Omg the glare on that thing! Sorry, not for me.
Norm glossed over the cons.. the glare being one of them.. He's like i'm soo immersed I didn't even see the glare. Glare was over 30% of the image just in the through the lens
@@Killswitch1411 So what? If he IS so immersed that the glare isn't an issue, why are you so hung up on it, even though you yourself haven't tried it? How are you possibly in any position to argue?
@@KaNoMikoProductions and yet you sit here arguing about something you never tried.. Norms words are not gospel.. idk who's paying you to police what people say is acceptable and not. I've seen more than one person complain about glare and they were pretty on the fence about it being acceptable to them. From the looks of it, it's pretty substantial.
Bigscreen Beyond: www.bigscreenvr.com/
Pimax Crystal: pimax.com/crystal/
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I have a question, can you use your oculus controllers with this headset?
@@bro_duck You might be able to with a SteamVR headset (for example using a quest 2/3 with index controllers) but you would need to calibrate every time you launch steamVR if it even works.
Who swapped the names for these devices? It's like an Iceland Greenland situation.
My thoughts exactly. One is literally a big screen, the other is a small crystalline shape.
😂😂😂
lol
I didn't even think about this.... but that is freaking hilarious!
Bigscreen Crystal and Pimax Beyond?
Beyond Crystal and Pimax Bigscreen?
Bigmax Beystal and Piscreen Cryond?
Bimeen Beystond and Pigscrax Cryol??
Bimcrax Bryonal and Pigsmreen Ceystond???
I love Tested tech reviews so much
The VR news space on RUclips is blessed with some awesome personalities, and Norm is RIGHT at the top! Love this guy.
Amen brother Amen
IN BASED NORM WE TRUST. Thank you norm as always for your thorough VR reviews!
When VR headsets are all the size of a pair of eye glasses in 20 or 30 years from now, the Pimax Crystal will probably get featured in like, "crazy retro tech" articles. And kids will marvel at how big and heavy it was and how much it cost. "1600 dollars!? wow, that's like 10,000 credits in today's money"
Actually it will be in your eyeball, so basically glasses won't even exist
Is that social credits ?
@@mikehunt1528 probably something worse than that in 20-30 years.
@mz4637 I bet you're fun at parties.
Nice cross post on many YT comments.
The extended FoV for the Bigscreen Beyond is fantastic news. The price is certainly steep, but what an awesome and lightweight headset.
Think that's bad? The Crystal is 60% more expensive. D:
@@DemmrirLmao 😂
Expensive? Absolutely not.
Look at it this way, a good 65 inch oled tv is gonna cost 2.5k this hmd is just essentially 2 tvs strapped to your eyes except you can get a 120 foot screen out of it and also do VR.
I think peeps got it twisted by going cheap on their hmds. It's the cheap hmds that will damage your eyes and also when you buy cheap, the companies ie meta will continue making cheap and that's the experience you will get....cheap.
@@stevebobowski3507 i love this logic, even though u cant compare the crisp quality of 4K TV vs VR floating screen
unless Bigscreen have 12k resolution for that minimum
@@moncimoov I can absolutely compare as I have a 4k tv and compare it with my aero at 39ppd and it's nearly indistinguishable.
Given the bigscreenbeyond is only 31ppd and wouldn't compare but a step in the right direction.
I'm so happy that this is out in the wild now. I was an early tester under NDA for the Beyond beginning in March 2021 and I wanted to tell the world about this headset, but couldn't. Thank you for getting the word out about how good the headset is, as well as noting some of the shortcomings. Providing a clear picture is key to long term adoption. When I first heard about it I was so excited, as my #1 complaint about VR headsets was always comfort. I love VR, but found it difficult to remain immersed for long periods of time due to comfort issues with extended use of headsets like the Index or Rift S. Don't even get me started about standalones. Massive pressure headaches, anyone? Anyway, I am certianly biased towards the Beyond, but the comfort is undeniable. I would have been happy even if I had to compromise on the optics, but to have my expectations exceeded in BOTH categories? Amazing. It was also a great journey to watch the itterations from the inside and try prototypes, which made the final production version all the more sweet.
Hey, as someone who's been using it for so long, can you give your feedback regarding the glare? Is this really that bad, or is it in line with other pancake lens headsets?
@@khaledassaf6356I've heard that it's not as bad as Index. But that it is there. Can someone 2nd that?
@@khaledassaf6356I've heard that it's not as bad as Index. But that it is there. Can someone 2nd that?
Without a doubt the #1 reason people stop playing VR is how cumbersome it is to get started. The weight is part of it, comfort for sure, adjusting things especially in VR sets used by many people in a house, and the time it takes to get in and do something. ALL of these issues seem to be solved by the Beyond except maybe boot time but that's likely out of their hands and the least issue. The price is a bit steep for the Quest type of people to pay for it, but as someone who mostly wants to use VR for sim racing and sim flying (DCS), I am beyond excited to try this set out! If they could find some way to get the mask scan stuff on Android that would be very helpful as I am not an iphone user.
Man, Norm, you've come a long way. I remember around 10 years ago when you first started working with, Adam. How awkward you were as an interviewer. You've become my favorite tech journalist, hands down. Here's to a long career, dude!
21 minutes in I was thinking, where in the hell is the comparison?! 😂 The Bigscreen Beyond is such exciting tech that it's difficult not to talk about! I am incredibly excited to get my hands on mine, which is going to be a game changer for me because I have degenerative disc disease in my neck (arthritis) which starts to irritate me during longer sessions currently wearing a Valve Index which is 807g + 200g counterweight, so it's 1kg! The Bigscreen Beyond at only ~200g fully equipped is going to help so much!
Yes but... it's easy to make a light headset when you leave out vitally important stuff like... I don't know...audio??? What was the idea there? I mean ok for media I guess or seated gaming, but not really ideal for active gaming. Although I don't know how you reach for your drink or snacks. So maybe wouldn't replace my TV just yet.
You know what is annoying also?
A wire
Well then how about having two wires? One for the headset and one for your audio solution?
No. Not cool.
Sure. I think big screen has its place and I would like to try it. But they are already sensibly pivoting to include that audio strap and a more universal face gasket.
The pimax might be terribly heavy. So that's not good, but at least it can be potentially used wirelessly in future, and doesn't require annoying faffing with separate headphones that you can't see. Plus dismissing the eye tracked foveated rendering offered by pimax is also an odd omission from Norms one sided comparison.
Idk!
I'd love to have a wired setup but wireless VR is kinda a requirement for me right now. I'd absolutely love a beyond though!
@@CorporateZombi I disagree that it is easy to make a light headset, at all. It was very challenging for Bigscreen, and required years of R&D.
It is a shame there is no audio included, but I got hopes for the Audio Strap that will likely fix that. That said, I *much* prefer using my own headphones over a solution similar to Meta's approach with the Quest Headphones. These are absolutely terrible. They are serviceable when you have nothing else, but one of the first things to do with any Quest 2 or Rift S is to get your own headphones, earbuds or the Vive Deluxe audio strap and 3d printed adapter. The included audio is abysmal and not immersive at all.
So yeah, agreed that no audio off the bat is not ideal. But I understand the idea, especially when the strap on the beyond is so light and thin that using your own headphones is easy. Speaking of Headphones, bluetooth audio has gotten miles better. You don't need a wire if you don't want one, just wireless headphones. A few companies make some that have their own receiver (namely Logitech and Steel Series) so you don't need anything else, but if you get your hands on a aptX Low Latency compatible headphones then you can just buy a good bluetooth receiver and bam, it works with no noticeable latency. This would work well for the Beyond.
That said, for my beyond, I am going the fully wired route. I already have a wired setup with the Rift S on my PC, with a pulley system for the cable management, so it's a non-issue in my case. But I understand how wireless has its appeal.
@@CorporateZombiI agree. I appreciate the headset itself, and what it will do for hardware in the future, but it really is filling a void, and won't help in getting new VR users into the market. Its quite niche. But I guess it does the niche very well.
@@CorporateZombiLmao, the lack of audio isn't what made it lightweight. Most audio solutions on these headsets don't weigh much at all.
I know I say it everytime we see one of these videos but... This is my favorite VR source of news by far! From the start!
I own the Pimax Crystal. My battery lasts a LOT more longer than 3 hours while plugged in. I fly DCS World with it, and I can fly for over 8 hours on one battery. It's not as heavy as is being described. If you've ever worn a helmet, you won't notice it. It's VERY comfortable, even while wearing glasses, although I will say you need to get the 15mm face pad and not the 11mm. My glasses actually scratched my lenses and I had to get a replacement pair, however, the Crystal is a solid frontrunner. Inside outside tracking and dynamic foveated rendering are huge game changers. I can play DCS World with 90% of the graphics on the highest and still get great performance using a RTX 3090. I have owned it for over 2 months, and I love it.
Really appreciate the detail! Think I’m going to pull the trigger on the Beyond, the idea of being able to watch my media library in the most immersive way imaginable is too much to pass up!
Wacth out for the bad glare with the Beyond, lots of reviewers say you can't watch movie since the glare is really bad in high contrast scenes.
its not that bad
@@ECAstack
Hey how is it
Awesome reviews Norm. You are my go to person for VR!
NORM i have been watching you covering VR since 2014 !!!! Nobody covers VR better than you !!
I love the idea of the big screen. And I assume their solution for glasses wearing people are the magnetic lenses he took on and off repeatedly. I love that for a vr headset rather than the lenses moving themselves back and forth. Just seems intuitive and an actual solution rather than a compromise
Hey Norm, awesome video as always. I just wanted to mention that future headsets will need eye tracking for dynamic foveated rendering so I don't think Pimax (or any future hmd) should take that out. One of the only times I've disagreed with you but still love your take on things. Appreciate all the hard work you put into these!
Bigscreen VR with inside out tracking would be perfect (also if they could cram in some wireless that would be killer) Love the direction that bigscreen VR is going.
Imagine a little device that connects to the back of a headband that does the tracking inside out and standalone processing
I wonder if it would be possible to use htcs self tracked tracker as a head tracker together with beyond? would be kinda wild.
For wireless i think nofio who made a wireless adapter for the index is working on something
Bigscreen Beyond with built in headphones, inside out tracking, wider fov, with free motion controllers, pancake lenses, and reliable to turn it from worse product to okay one 😅
Great review, liked and Subscribed. Appreciate all the content creators and people doing these reviews. ✌🏻
Great video. I'm looking forward to my Bigscreen!
I would like to see the pimax do away with a lot of the standalone VR features too, as well as making the headset lighter.
But personally, I see eye tracking and foveated rendering being essential for all VR headsets going forwards.
I think I'd also chose the higher PPI and FoV over the extra weight too.
It's frustrating because no headsets really nail it STILL, and when they're asking $1000 for just the headset, without the ability to use it unless you also purchase valve lighthouses, you kind of expect them to get it right.
Foveated rendering doesn't mean shit if you don't have the pixels to back it up, and seeing these funny headsets coming out with less than 4K per eye is giving me depression
@@LoganDark4357Lol. Most PCs cant even render games on good fps at 4k for one monitor, now imagine that in 2 mini monitors… it’s ridiculous because its a hardware problem. Most people dont have the specs to run that
@@demapples6580 Hence why we're only talking about super high resolution screens using FOVEATED RENDERING... (I suggest you try googling it)
@@demapples6580 ...foveated rendering avoids having to render the whole 4k, but only what you are directly looking at. Everything in peripheral vision and etc. is lower resolution.
Thanks for your always interesting and informative reviews mate. I don't think that Meta is only standalone focused, they just don't intend to produce any wired-only headsets anymore. Kind of a big difference imho. Neither the Crystal or BSB headset are my cup of tea. The Crystal is way too bulky and the BSB too inflexible (needing a custom facial interface is too restrictive, for me anyway). Maybe newer headset will come out in 2024/25 that will make me want to upgrade my Quest Pro. Time will tell I guess. The Q3 looks good and I intend to preorder on asap. I mainly am getting this to replace my aging Q2 for better standalone VR/MR, and as a backup for my 11mo preordered Quest Pro. I doubt that the Q3 with do better PCVR but you never know, lol!
For now, my QPro with i913900k/rtx4090 continues to work great with all my PCVR games/sims and I'm always amazed how well it works wireless with Air Link. I can get a bit better distant visuals with Link at 650mbps bitrate but I much prefer the freedom of wireless. Maybe due to my rtx4090 and/or settings, but I don't see any so-called streaming artifacts that many users report and complain about. I also run a dual VR headset setup with a DP wired VP1 (Etsy lens mod and Index controllers) so I do know the differences between these. My QPro still gives better overall clarity and much less SDE. The only advantage that DP gives me is about 10% higher FPS performance and this is due to the extra GPU resources required to do the streaming encoding. I easily make up this performance difference by running my QPro at 80Hz refresh rate, compared to my VP1 which is fixed at 90Hz. Again, many thanks for sharing all this mate and best cheers from Australia.
I know this is a small thing but thank you so much for putting a camera through the lenses so I could finally be able to understand visually the characteristics that so many people have been describing, but it didn’t really mean much until you actually showed it. Especially with the lense reflections, I didn’t really know what that actually looked like, and I do see it now, it’s kind of a bloom effect, but to be honest it’s really not that bad, and the contrast of the displays is still able to show through it, unlike a cheap lcd or a tv with local dimming, where the bloom is built into the screen itself, which looks a lot worse to me, then it just being in the lenses.
Man, that Pimax looks like one of the early VR 90s headsets.
Pimax looks like a 32" TV strapped to your face
15:44
That's not what Bigscreen said, though. They said that the GPU runs at max res, then it gets compressed, sent through the cable, then decompressed.
yes that is true, it still only displays at a maximum of 2560x2560 on the display
@@spookykitty2327But that's not what Adam said.
Eye tracking is a must for sure, the Beyond not having it makes it a no go for me. With the cost of graphics cards and the increasingly more demanding games makes eye tracking crucial. Needing an iphone and having to order the custom lenses for glasses users makes it also an issue for the Beyond, this review felt pretty partial for not addressing those points, maybe it's just a very different use case for me then it is for the reviewer, but it didn't felt fair. The battery swapping for the Pimax outside of stand alone was a huge drawback though, i don't want to have to deal with that.
@Gervaj79 It's necessary for foveated rendering, which enables people with not RTX 4090 to actually run these resolutions.
Great insight!!!
I'm going for big monster hehe
Beyond has big minus - its not shareable and that is must for me.
We are just racing and flying here.....
The use case for the Pimax Crystal is clear: serious simmers who don't want compromises when they switch to VR. On my flat screen, I can read my avionics screens and gauges off center from my head. Being forced to center my head on the instrument instead of a quick glance (minor head turn or no) has to be possible otherwise I am fundamentally not going to be able to effective fly and operate a military fighter/attack/bomber jet. I find that all flight simmers who are using non Aero/Pimax headsets are fairly casual with it (GA - general aviation), or only flying air to air combat which means you aren't heavily using avionics outside of your HOTAS.
I love that I'm 16 minutes into a 28 minute video and he's still talking about the Big Screen VR headset. I really wonder what he's going to say about the Pimax..
First I'd like to thank Adam for this excellent review of BigScreen Beyond the through the lens footage is especially beneficial I was searching for through the lens footage throughout alot of BigScreen Beyond reviews but was unable to find that type of footage. What he didn't tell us was the GPU he is using, the through the lens footage has amazing colors and smoothness of movement. He didn't mention that in order to create the face gasket you need to provide BigScreen VR with a FaceScan that you need an iPhone XR to do this.
i get why they did the kitchensink thing, that standalone and insideout market was a completely untapped source of customers for them.
i just prey that they get rid of all the insideout and standalone fluff for the 12k. i honestly cant even imagine the big 12k displays possibly working with that much crap bolted onto it.
I would really like to buy the Bigscreen Beyond but the fact that I cant share it with friends and family is a huge no for me. Especially taking into consideration that a lot of my friends have very strong glasses.
you can get lense inserts like he has to accomidate glasses. Also if you friends have ipd close to yours +/- 3 pts or so it will be fine. For me at least, after the hype wore off i was using it myself 95% of the time. If someone wants to try it for 30 min i am ok having them suffer with incorrect ipd :)
I'm guessing a Matrix plug directly into the brain stem might be less of an inconvenience than the Pimax Crystal.
Really appreciate the correction of niche
For the Beyond, do you need knuckles controllers and base station 2.0 from the index? Or can you use the 2016 vive accessories?
Some of us, including myself are still using these.
I’m pretty sure you can use vive controllers and base stations with the beyond. It uses the same tracking as the index and that is backwards compatible
You can use any steamvr controllers.
Love Norm's reviews! To anyone considering Pimax: Don't! :)
Just got the Aero. Chose it over Pimax and Bigscreen due to enterprise level support and the confidence that comes with that.
Pimax also just rubs me the wrong way, too many software issues reported by other users for me to trust them.
The clunk when he sat down the Pimax was confirmation enough for me that it's not right for me lmao
That's what I'd pick too if they'd ship to my country. I love tested, but this review was weird. I found inconsistent how 90hz, resolution, sweet spot, and productivity were factored. He mentions you can't go back to lower res after experiencing VR on high res, but then says 1920 upscaled at 90hz is preferable to 72hz. Says edge clarity makes the beyond still not good for productivity. But by that sense, Quest Pro would be preferable with breathable design on top. I believe resolution is addictive, but then why stop at 2.5k with nauseating low refresh rate instead of going highest available with standard 90hz and what seem a not so heavy headset. I wish he included the Varjo aero on this.
The Bigscreen Beyond is the most interesting of the two, but for me too expensive for my usage. The Pimax is too big and clunky. I'm looking forward to the Quest3 and also very interested in how the headset from Immersive is going to be. 2x4k for 700$ in a headset that is slightly bigger than a pair of sunglasses.... I'm looking forward to that on the market.
Hello, did you get guest 3? How is your experience? Thank you
@@kaankucuk1612No not yet...
They seem VR headsets from two different eras.
It doesn't matter how clear the image is: If the headset is uncomfortable you're not going to enjoy using it.
Waiting to see if Quest 3 is going to be a good compromise between comfort and image quality but I got this feeling that comfortable VR with hi image quality is still 10 years away from us.
Eh, it depends on the user. I have a Pimax 5K, and it's even bigger. But it's not **that** much of a hindrance, I wouldn't go as far to call it "uncomfortable" or anything. The big-ass FOV and high pixel density sorta help with the enjoyment too.
Clarity trumps all. Comfort can be modified such as an additional aftermarket top strap
I've been playing a lot of flat games lately in the virtual cinema this headset must be amazing for that.
It's awesome to see all the tech available to successful RUclipsrs and the uber wealthy. To a large portion of the people viewing this content, these products are as obtainable as a light saber or a gundam.
If oculus actually check analytics majority of long time quest users play it mostly tethered or through air link (virtual desktop) means a PCVR release is much more in demand than a standalone, which maybe the next leaked release might be as majority of the standalone components can be left out.
but the whole point is for you to buy the games through oculus and not steam. It's all about the money.
@@AbideinChristFully if oculus actually had decent releases that are worth the price
My bigscreen Beyond arrives this month!
Is it good?
@@hgahsiea it is really good especially for iracing. But the glare is annoying on the sides of the lenses. But I’m used to it
@@egirlsrule902 I just ordered it 😜. I've watched so many reviews and complaints I know what I'm getting I think. I won't be racing. Mostly dark environments to exploit the OLED. Bring on the glare and soft peripheral vision I'm ready.
You should review the Goovis G3 Max Personal Cinema. Its Micro OLED, curious about how the movie watching experience is compared to Micro OLED vr headsets
Pimax isnt shipping Crystal to backers, it wasn't on Kickstarter
I would like to see the field and view and refresh rate improve on the bigscreen. I love how light and small it is but I feel like most people would be fine with 100 grams more or so just to put it more in like with what you’d expect from an enthusiast level headset
I would love if you could revisit the Aero and compare it. I’m currently agonizing on if I should cancel my Beyond preorder for an Aero. Recent price cut puts it at the exact same price. Such a hard decision
Yeah, the Aero seems like the best buy now that it is half the price, i think it has eye tracking as well. Kinda struggling with the idea myself.
Same here. Bigscreen hast the better fov but aero the eye tracking. Wish I could just have both. Using the index now I don't want to compromise too much on the fov
@@MixedRealitySimRacing A good point my buddy made to me is Meta research says that vertical FOV matters more for immersion and the Beyond has better vertical FOV!
@@mikehudgins8545 also has better horizontal
No resell value on Beyond turns me off and Glare is the main problem for me so i have to sell this in the future eventually. 30% of scene will be washed out with glare is big problem. Aero has resell value but small vertical fov and shitty picture color is bad. I wish Quest 3 has local dimming lcd but Mark Fuckerburg is too greedy to have it with $500 price quest 3
I wish I understood any of this I used to be a gamer but being 46 and completely out of this for several years I’d like to get back in it and do these run with the current gaming consoles
No they are both PC VR headsets. I'm the same age as you and have always gamed and TBH VR has ruined gaming in a good way because being in the actually game makes playing it flat screen (on a traditional monitor) just feel "less than". VR is in it's infancy still so lacks AAA titles but there are plenty of poly shaded games that don't need high fidelity and still rock.
I would buy something cheap (relatively) like a Quest 2 (which will nose dive in price once the soon to be release Quest 3 comes along) as it's stand alone so no need to invest in a decent PC rig (mobile processor/stand alone). If you find VR "clicks" for you then you could splurge on a beefy PC rig to run higher end games (still using your Quest 2 with a wired link). The issue is for many of us our journey has been incremental (I already own base stations for tracking) and a fairly strong PC with VR controllers but if you are starting from scratch you're going to have to splash out a fair amount of cash to catch up.
Finally whilst the Crystal mentioned has great specs Pimax who makes it are just god awful and have yet to meet Western expectations in terms of customer support/QA standards and the Big Screen headset will require lighthouses (trackers) and for me is too little too late (plus who makes an ultra lightweight portable small form factored headset, hinting at movies on the go and then sticks a wire on it...I find it just odd)
@@Space-O-2001 Thank you, I really appreciate that.
@@jasonstorie8740 You're welcome, if you can be bothered let us know which way you went and how it was for you :P
i seriously hope you get a hands on of some sort im so happy you are covering it, will you be streaming the even any chance?
I tried to like the crystal but my head shape didn't work with it. Narrow small face. So it moved around even when tightly strapped and the result was blurriness and distortion.
Dang. So for the big screen vr you need external trackers for it to work? Currently using a quest 2 for sim racing. I’m stationary in my cockpit, but I do need head tracking to look around. Would I need external trackers for the BSVR to work?
yes. u need a full steam vr setup
Whats the vertical measurements on that beyond FOV???? It's great that they managed to increase the horizontal but depending on the Vertical, it's either a cumulative win or loss for me. I've been holding off buying it cause I don't know and as an example, the Vive XR Elite is small and light and their horizontal is about 100 ish degrees but they destroy the experience for me with a vertical of only 80 ish degrees so it feels like your looking through a very wide but very narrow window.
Beyond's vertical FOV is ~90deg.
@@ReavoEnd hmm, interesting, I'm torn now between the beyond and the varjo aero which recently got a price cut from 2k ish to under a grand lol and I don't even have to track down an iphone for the stupid face scan lmao decisions decisions lol
You would like our Crystal more, but between the Aero and the BSB I think you would probably enjoy the Aero more. @@gordontechreviews
How was desktop experience? I want a VR set for working and reading text and coding. Think this is the best?
yes, i have a question. what dies focal lenght really mean? let me ask the question this way: the ps5vr2 is the only vr headset i ever tried. iam very shortsighted with -6,5dpt and tested the vr2 with 4 friends. some of them slighty shortsightes, some have normal vision. when i wear contacts, i become kinda farsighted. without any aid, i have to hold my phone 10cm away from my eyes to be able to see it, when wearing contacts, i have to hold the phone at arms lenght otherwise i cant focus any text.. but in vr with contacts? i can basically push a sheet of paper against my eyelashes and can still read it, while all my friends, could read any text whatsoever, that was closer then 30 cm to your eyes. does that mean, the the focal lenght of the psvr2 gives me with my dpt a good experience but others dont get it and does that mean, having a shoter focal lenght of the headset, that i then wont be able to see close objects sharp?
This is the video I needed to justify my Bigscreen Beyond purchase. I have been regretting ordering it a bit because its expensive, but now I can't wait to get it. Hopefully valve doesnt announce an index 2 a week after I get it.
dont worry, valve dont care about vr
yeah knowing Valve, I think you're good
I'm skipping BSB because it's dip in FOV and makes me use a wire. For ME, my Vive Pro 2 with wireless is the best headset for my needs, but this would tempt me if cheaper or could use a wireless mode.
You should have waited for somnium VR 1
@@x32i77 I don’t wait. I buy what is best at the time, for my needs.
Thanks for the honest review of the Big Screen Beyond(and to some extent the Pimax crystal lol)
Is it worth buying a pc and the base station and controllers and the beyond? I think my quest 2 is too heavy and lack performance .. I love vr and want the best experience
Thank you for great vids love u
When watching a movie on the big screen beyond , do the pixels disappear permanently? Meaning, it is as if you are watching the movie on a Sony or Samsung 4k TV??
I still have the original vive pro headset, but it's so frustrating to not have a way to know if it's worth to upgrade without testing new hardware yourself.
I've got the original as well. I've come to the conclusion there isn't a worthy upgrade yet for a couple of reasons.
First the industry for VR is too small. There just aren't enough VR games that can be played right now, or enough games with VR/PC cross play to justify spending money on a new headset. When I want to hop into VR and have fun I've got the tools to do it, but there aren't any hardcore VR games which justify a hardcore investment into the tech.
Second is that none of the headsets really do what I want. The bigscreen seems great, and might even be the one I go for if I decide to get serious, but the problem is still FOV, screendoor, and wireless. I REALLY want a wireless VR headset, and truly wireless with a built in hot-swappable battery, not the corded strap it to your leg nonsense. Nor do I want all of this onboard processor crap. Nobody who is spending $1000+ on VR tech wants to play shitty mobile games with it. Anyone who is that invested already has a powerful gaming PC and want's to use it.
So I think right now until those change, then there isn't any reason to upgrade. Enjoy the Vive in all it's early VR glory and save up for when the technology and industry are mature enough to be worth investing in.
I had the original Vive Pro too, but I'd say even the Quest 2 would be a worthy upgrade if you're not so keen on springing for a high-end headset like the Valve Index. I have both, and the Quest 2 isn't **too** far off from the experience of using the Index (the Index's superior controllers and audio aside).
While the Quest 2 doesn't have an OLED screen, what is DOES have that's an advantage over the Vive Pro is the displays use an RGB stripe subpixel arrangement instead of Pentile. Long story short, despite the similar pixel count, the Quest has noticeably less screen door effect due to the smaller gaps between the sub-pixels. It also has wireless standalone and PC VR functionality, which is REAL nice. Personally, I'd upgrade to the Quest 2 or Pico 4 and sell your Vive Pro. Or maybe hold off for the Quest 3 or Pico 5..? Make sure to keep the lighthouses though! This will let you use the Index controllers, which are amazing!
So you want wireless and a hot-swappable battery, but without the onboard processor that is required to make wireless work?@@Goodgu3963
Me who still uses the first HTC VIVE, can't wait to get one.
- hurry up you guys and buy the Bigscreen Beyond so I can afford the next generation! (someone said eye tracking in xmas)
- oh man, I just thought of a legit advantage of BB: eating. While eating, watching tv/movies is a must, and with a large VR headset there's too much weight on your cheekbones, so VR moves up and down as you chew...
- 17:20 does text look that blurry? it would be nice if the blur were adjusted in photoshop to reflect how it actually looks in the headset
They're so small but they COULD have made them bigger for a better FOV and they'd still be smaller and lighter than anything else. Not sure why so many VR companies feel that FOV is not important. I'm not buying another VR headset until someone comes out with one that has 2k+ pixels per eye, integrated audio, 200+ degree field of view, eye tracking and foveated rendering. I'm thinking that's about 5-10 years away before one of these companies decides to integrate all of these already existing technologies into one headset.
Thank you Norm!!
I understand Norms reasoning and it makes sense for someone watching videos but I feel like he is severely underselling the importance of eye tracking. Especially as resolution of HMD's get higher and the fidelity of games just gets higher and higher.
Playing VR is a very resource heavy operation and will be even more so as games become more beautiful. I'm playing on a 4090 and a i9-13900K and some games are still pretty taxing for my system. Especially those that are flatscreen games ported or modded into VR.
Due to the way latency works frame generation is not really viable in VR and so we must find other means of increasing performance without the cost of fidelity. In comes eye tracking, Foveated Rendering is a godsend and IMO essential for any high end headset to be even somewhat future proof. Not even mentioning how good eye tracking can be for things such as navigating menus and I'm sure games will start to incorporate it more and more as popularity rises for the simple reason that it's so... comfortable to use.
We all have different priorities and expectations and Norm makes perfect sense in what he says but here you also have another viewpoint. IMO do not sleep on eye tracking if you want a headset that will be able to keep up in the gaming space for years to come. I truly believe you are doing yourself a disservice if you buy a headset without it at this day and age.
I’m kinda tired about everybody complaining about the weight of the Pimax Chrystal. I’m not a fanboy or anything but anybody who is serious about simulation would know that most of these VR headsets are use for seating experiences when it comes to PC i.e. flight simulation, or Sim racing.
Which means that you are using the headsets are being used to simulate real conditions. If you’ are doing combat simulation with planes then you should be wearing a helmet and if you are a Sim racing, most racing requires you to wear a helmet. Yes, we have carbon reinforced helmets, but they still have wait to them so having a bit of weight for a VR headset is not a problem, they weigh just about the same amount as a helmet.
It’s ok to have some light weight VR headset as there is a market for them but they all don’t need to be super light, I rather have the tech.
this dude needs a Sterilite sponsorship
Honestly, the bigscreen looks very enticing, but the price is killing it for me. Aside from that, sharing the VR set with family members is basically a nogo because of the made to fit concept. If you could make like a few of those frames and have a manual adjustment for the ipd for a better price then it would be a killer for me.
You'll be able to make new gaskets, but cant adjust IPD. It's a whole thing that required calibration and special equipment. With pancake lenses though, you can be +/- 2 mm for IPD if that's any consolation.
Tbf how many VR users have rl friends to share it with
Norm mentions that they are releasing a more generic foam insert that can replace the silicone insert for active-games that might make you sweat -- with the added benefit that such an insert might also be ideal for sharing the headset with others. Of course, as @yourfriendandi correctly states, that won't account for the locked-in IPD.
@@LeafBoye feeling called out. Facts is facts.
@@LeafBoye 🤣
I don't have an iPhone.. but the BIgscreen Beyond looks so promising!
Surely someone around you has one. As much as I hate it, half of my family and friends uses iphones. The other half has samsung/android phones
Big potential for 3D printing, I think: ergonomics of something you strap to your face are so important. I agree that Big Screen's approach seems like the best way forward, but they could make the tooling for the face gasket freely available. Some way to change IPD would also be better, so people can share a headset (I've found it great fun at parties to take turns playing Beat Saber or Superhot or something). Even swappable IPD spacers would probably do (although I've also noticed that IPD really doesn't need to be spot on for such short sessions). I do think inside out tracking is a vastly superior experience to remodelling a room to accommodate VR, but otherwise the Beyond's minimalism is the right call. Get everything that doesn't need to be on the headset, off of it. Have it just be the screens and a ton of sensors (cameras, eye tracking, mic, whatever additional black magic is required for tracking...). Then the user can ideally pick whether they want to connect to a chonky PC for max fidelity or to something that fits in a pocket (or onto a belt clip) for optimal mobility. I really hope that's what the Quest 3 will do, but from what I've seen so far they're still on the "all-in-one" approach.
Can you please clarify by what you mean Bigscreen Beyond not being good for desktop productivity? Surely with OLED at that high resolution text should be easy to read and do work with?
Glare, small fov
@@Killswitch1411 the Bigscreen Beyond has a 102 degree FOV, which is 2 degrees more than the Apple Vision Pro and yet that headset is described as ideal for productivity. And the Bigscreen Beyond also uses the same micro OLED type display, so what's the difference?
@@TimLongson do you own a Bsb? Well the sweet spot in that fov is smaller than AVP by a large margin.
@@TimLongson I own both AVP and BSB and no chance in hell am I doing anything remotely productive in that. Just the lenses alone mess that up for the BSB.
@@Killswitch1411 ah ok, fair enough. So it's a problem if you rely on peripheral vision? And you would recommend the Meta Quest 3 as better?
Stoked to see @Thrillseeker in your watch history in Bigscreen. The crossover I've been waiting ages for.
Why does Tested only make reviews of VR headsets and not actual content about VR stuff, like before? I remember the "Projections" show, it was pretty good.
Because there is no content. Everytime new vr headset comes out it always mentions "alyx". Pcvr has died.
@@SINfromPL have you played Alyx yet?? YES WE ALL HAVE!! We need more content
@@Killswitch1411 yes i played it, and i think it's complete garbage. half life 2 is much better game
man i miss the vr minute I have no idea anymore what happens in pop culture or tech anymore
Hello mate!
What adapter /cable you're using to connect the pimax crystal?
I also have Lenovo legion pro 7i with rtx 4080, i want to buy Crystal light.
What do you think if you use wifi 6 ( or 6E ) with this quest pro this pictures enough there is no articact on the screen? ( AV1 codec is much better than the old one ) So the Quest 3 would be sharper and it means there won'T be so much picture quality differenc with Crystal which use display port or the wireless VR won't be the same picture quality than the dedicated display ports PC VR ? it is impossible? Thanks this answer in advance,
Nice video norm sir thanks for sharing
wondering if that increased brightness everyone seems to use is reducing the lifetime of the oled displays/risk of burn in
Lifetime maybe, but burn in probably won't be an issue with VR because most VR games have no fixed hud and you are constantly moving your head. Maybe it's also just compromising low persistence and by that being less sharp with motion m
I'm waiting on someone to come up with a headset with a wide field of view. Maybe the Pimax 12k will be the one to really move things forward. Right now, none of the headsets seem terribly interesting to me.
I love my quest 2. I use the AirPlay mode with my rig and don’t really have much to complain about. I have super fast internet and my VR space is same room as my pc so I get a smooth experience. Bonelabs and Blade and Sorcery are my go to games. Also love playing onward without wires getting in my way.
I like how all the previous companies are completing with these heavy bulky hmd. And big screen comes along and not just raises a bar they raise that thing like no one even was participating. They got work else where to go but everyone else now doesn't even compare with the visuals/weight. A combo generations ahead. I am disappointed in needing to touch anything apple tho, even just for the scan. I couldn't even find someone to borrow one from for a second. No one owns one any more.
The heavy headsets not just take away from my vr experience it straight up ruins it.
Wow. That Pimax Crystal, next to the BSB, looks ridiculous 😅
Wanted to love the Bigscreen, but there is no way I can deal with that glare. My Index just collects dust because every time I try to sim with it, the image is so washed out by glare that I can't read any gauges.
I honestly just wish the Bigscreen Beyond was compatible with Mac. I honestly think I could pick one up to replace multiple monitors for productivity, the portability and access would make travel and hybrid work so, so much simpler. It's about the closest I've seen to the ideal for me, but I think even with the Bigscreen the tech and support for "spatial computing" just isn't quite there.
16:07 is that the glare everyone is talking about?
Is it like a bright light shining to your face while in the dark?
Also this 18:33
I'm so happy to hear about the face gasket being worked on more, thanks for the information!! I do kind of wish they emailed us more but I guess thats what i get for not being in the discord haha
I tried jumping from the Quest 2 to the Pimax 8KX, and just had an awful time. Sure, the hardware was better, but it was a chore to use. Constant tinkering required, impossible to comfortably use my own headphones even when the audio solution was removed... I do believe they're improving, but I don't think I'll be ready to buy pimax again until I hear glowing reviews across the board. Ultimately, I ended up picking up a used Varjo Aero. I love it and don't think I could go back to the resolution of the Quest 2, but I'll admit, I do often find myself missing a lot of the quest creature comforts. The passthrough and far-superior-to-steamVR desktop mode made it easy to stay in VR for long periods of time.
Great video. I think I will come back after 5 years to see if high PPD VR headsets have gone mainstream. For now, I will pass.
big screen could do with being a little bit bigger, with a diopter, eyetracking and wider FOV it doesn't have to be that small
I love my Pimax 5K+ , paid $100 for it and just needed a little soldering to repair.
I couldn't go back to low FOV (been using VR since the original Rift DK1... and worked with the guy who invented Virtuality for 15+ years :))
The distortion makes 99% of people sick.
@@legendfpv what distortion? I've never noticed...
@@legendfpv "A lot of people tried Pimax 5K+ at our iNFINITE.XR.Lab (which is open for everyone) and we found out everyone prefers different settings. I prefer medium, where to distortion is still visible, but not bothering me. Some people go with ‘there is still distortion at medium, so let’s not sacrifice FOV and go Large). Others (usually those prone to motion sickness) prefer Small to have no distortion at all. "
Not sure where you're getting 99% from?
@@njones420 stop shilling. pimax doesnt even have the aparature to correct the distrotions. EVERY SINGLE THING PIMAX HAS EVER POSTED IS A PURE JOKE! EVERYTHING! FROM TESTERS BEHIND THE SCENES, TO SHIPPING THE PRODUCT WHERE THE LOGISTIC GUY HAS TO PICK BOXES FROM THE FLOOR. CHINA BE CHINA!
"I dont see anyone else doing micro-oled, and dont see anyone doing customization like this..."
Immersed Visor: "Hold my beer!"
It’s going to be next year, along with Vision Pro that also uses Micro OLED. So for 2023c Big Screen Beyond is it.
No 120Hz mode and the need to use an apple device for taking the measurments is a dealbreaker for me. Hopefully Deckard will be worth it.
Hardware manufacturers please consider the Star Wars proto-saber approach!
Why doesn’t someone make a VR headset that combines the advantages of the Bigscreen Beyond with the portability of a standalone headset?
Combine an ultralight, unpowered headset like the BB with a “puck” that goes in your pocket, or even a larger backpack “puck”. There would be a thin cable connecting the headset to the puck, which would be snaked down your shirt or whatever.
This “puck” would contain the battery and the processing hardware, and that’s where 90% of the weight would go. The result would be a super comfortable headset like the BB, but you wouldn’t need a PC and you wouldn’t be “tethered”. You’d still be able to move around freely.
If the Bigscreen Beyond had a wireless solution I'd buy it. Since it doesn't, I'll stick with my Vive Pro 2.
I have heard and seen rumors about the pico5, if what I have seen is true, I would wait to buy a new VR headset.
how about if i have rift stations and controllers can i still use big screen vr headset?
Which application are you using to watch 4k movies ? The bigscreen app on steam ? I have a bunch of 4k movies on Plex but I don’t think the bigscreen steam app supports 4k mkv
Get a free account on VRChat and watch all that shid for free, don't tell anyone I sent you there
I’m excited to see what Norm thinks about the Vision Pros weight. Neck breaking.
He did mention feeling the weight of the Vision Pro.
The Vision Pro weighs ~450g, which makes it one of the lightest headsets ever made right after the beyond screen. What in the hell are you talking about?
PS.: Even if we add the external battery (60G), it would be the same weight as the Quest 2 while being incomparably less bulky.
over long periods, yes even the 450g Vision Pro would cause neck pain. thats why the Bigscreen Beyond form factor is the ONLY viable form factor going forward.
How could any one put on the Pimax when the Big Screen Beyond is half the size?
Would someone detail exactly what is needed to get the Big Screen Beyond up and running for movies, flying, and anyting else I would like to do? Thanks.
just need 2 steamvr base stations (preferablly the 2.0 versions you can source from steams website, for upgrade purposes) and steamvr tracked controllers (such as the valve index controllers, which are sold as L/R pairs on steams website aswell). The Beyond should have built in support to pair these controllers, and with a VR ready PC you should be good to go.
The Pimax can track itself and has it's own controllers, but comes with a lot of reliability issues and weird stuff like having to swap/charge the batteries even though for PCVR you are stuck to a tehered experience. You can upgrade its poor built-in tracking with the steamvr faceplate but you would still need the peripherals mentioned for the beyond then, and you will omit yourself from the supposed wireless adapter the pimax is making since it's not compatible with the steamvr faceplate.
all in all, as the reviewer said I wouldn't reccomend the pimax - but both would require a decent investment to get into coming outside the SteamVR ecosystem.
I tried the Bigscreen, and it gets too hot for my comfort after about 20mins. Despite the gasket was for someone else's face it worked well for mine, but the result is no ventilation what so ever.
And the glare! Omg the glare on that thing! Sorry, not for me.
Norm glossed over the cons.. the glare being one of them.. He's like i'm soo immersed I didn't even see the glare. Glare was over 30% of the image just in the through the lens
@@Killswitch1411 So what? If he IS so immersed that the glare isn't an issue, why are you so hung up on it, even though you yourself haven't tried it? How are you possibly in any position to argue?
They're making an accessory to help with the heat.
@@KaNoMikoProductions and yet you sit here arguing about something you never tried.. Norms words are not gospel.. idk who's paying you to police what people say is acceptable and not. I've seen more than one person complain about glare and they were pretty on the fence about it being acceptable to them. From the looks of it, it's pretty substantial.
when did you try out the Beyond? they had an optics update in June that reduced the glare greatly, lower than the Valve Index i've heard.