Time in Fighting Games
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- Опубликовано: 8 июн 2024
- Fighting games are full of mechanics and resources but there's one that's always caught my eye in every game I've played: Time. Timers can be used for multiple things and to even bring out emotions in players, but more often than not, it seems to be less of a factor than I think it potentially can be! So let's look into :How can we fix time in fighting games?
There's a lot of information in this video so if you want to learn more about a specific game I mentioned, here's some other content to help:
Infilament Experiment - t.co/QQZjieWJvD
GRsmash video @GR. - • The Longest Game in Sm...
UNI 2 Video @DazIsBambo - • Under Night In-Birth v...
SFxT Video @TheoryFighter - • Comeback Mechanics & "...
Big thanks to the SFxT Discord as well for helping me gather footage
Games Included:
Tekken 7
Guilty Gear Strive
Mortal Kombat 11
Marvel vs Capcom 3
Dragon Ball FighterZ
BlazBlue Central Fiction
Street Fighter 4
Smash 4 Wii U
Super Smash Bros. Brawl
Smash Bros. 64
KOF XV
Under Night inBirth
Samsho 2019
Street Fighter 6
Street Fighter x Tekken
Timestamps:
00:00 - Intro
03:07 - Marvel Time (Baby)
05:01 - Time vs Reality
07:13 - Elena (SF4)
09:20 - Longest Match Ever
11:30 - Under Night inBirth
14:07 - Samurai Shodown
16:49 - Street Fighter x Tekken
19:15 - Conclusion 
Игры
![Latto - Sunday Service (feat. Megan Thee Stallion & Flo Milli) [Remix] (Official Video)](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/9gL0F1xIt2I/mqdefault.jpg)
Just wanted to say that I used to play mostly strike/throw rushdown characters, but I started playing charge zoners after your charge characters video. It's been fun switching it up, and gave me even more of a reason to try team games because I can play both archetypes at the same time there.
And now with UNI2 I'm finally playing Vatista, and she's been at on of fun; plus her combos are some of the most interesting things I've tried in any game. So, yeah, the rants do inspire players to try new stuff.
Thank you for the videos!
Damn this is one of my favorite comments I've received for sure. Thanks for letting me know and I'm glad you're enjoying trying new things! Fighting games really are something so great
@@qmanchu I love fighting games
same, but i just changed to zoners cause i like Axl
The occasional time out is hype as heck, but if a fighting game is always going to time, it's just not going to be fun to watch.
Totally agree. It isn't something we need every round which is a big reason hype for SFxT died so quickly. It's just funny to me that I literally couldn't even find a time out for a modern Guilty Gear game and I only could think of one time out for BlazBlue. Some games you never see it, others too much. Just gotta find that sweet spot somewhere
Depends on how they are fighting!
XD
@@qmanchui would check out CEOtaku 2023 GF for BBCF. Monarch managed to time out Betadood (who plays Ragna, a character whose stagger pressure is insanely scary) by playing defense PERFECTLY.
@@qmanchu ive played strive since its release and ive seen time out once the entire time
@@qmanchu The sweet spot can be found in Soulcalibur and Virtua Fighter due to the forgotten 3rd method to end a round: Ring Out.
A really interesting and unique fighting game timer is the turn timer in yomi hustle. There are actually 2 different turn timer settings: the default timer which gives you a fixed amount of time for each move, usually 30 seconds or a minute, and the chess timer, which gives you a certain amount of time for the whole game, I think the default setting is 30-40 minutes, and there's a separate setting for the minimum amount of time you can have per turn for when you run down your whole clock, usually 10-15 seconds. Most people generally prefer the regular timer, but all tournaments are run with the chess timer because at the top level everyone plays so optimally that if they had time to think about their moves no one would ever get hit, so tournament matches have a secondary objective which is to play faster than your opponent so they run down their clock first and start making mistakes first, but not fast enough that you make mistakes because of it, and it's a fun dynamic that doesn't really exist in any other fighting game
Another FatYoshi banger
@@qmanchu I have a reputation to uphold
Just so you know, regional pricing is next. I should've done it before tekken but the story was deeper than I realized. I hope I do it justice
Yeah, the balance of how fast can you play vs how WELL you can play makes chess timer so much more interesting than 30 seconds. + The game has an actual ROUND timer that can lead to time over if you play too passive and somehow avoid sadness while out of your move selection timer.
WOOOOO YOMIH MENTIONED
hi semicomp yomer here. the timer is mostly because stall used to be so broken that stalling to 5s clock and 0f in game timer was legitimately a viable strategy, and most protocol tournaments run with a 30 minute / 15 second timer due to time constraints (though weve seen a move to two day tournaments, so things may change). nowadays, the round clock (default 3600 frames) is the main thing in contention: as far as i know, 3000 or so frames is now the standard competitive ruleset to avoid timeouts (where it used to be 2000 frames, due to the aforementioned time constraints; nobody wanted to play much longer than 30-40 minutes, but since we got faster and the meta got more aggressive weve shifted a bit to emphasize the strategy aspect of the game)
Saw DIO in the thumbnail and only saw him once. Disappointment is immeasurable. Great video tho!👍🏽
Saw Axl in the thumbnail and only saw him once. Disappointment is immeasurable. Great video tho!
I am here for both reasons. Same.
And my day is ruined.
You know surprisingly me and my brother never really considered time as an element for the fighting game we want to make one day. I just sent him this video and hopefully we can think of a unique as well as great time based mechanic.
This channel is the new Core-A Gaming. You deserve to reach the mark of a million of subscribers
Damn that means a lot. I'm working on it! Gotta hit 20k first lol
It's interesting because in counterstrike and other tac shooters, the timer is so integral that you regularly see pros wait until the last few seconds to do a push. The 2 minutes is time spent gathering info, trying to get safe kills, secure space, and wait out smoke and fire grenades. Nothing sucks more than your opponents managing to save a smoke or molotov for the last few seconds, and you're forced to charge through. There are just a lot more resources that have to be juggled as a team compared to fighting games, with a lot of interaction involved. Grenades, health, lives, information, weapons, area, and of course, time.
One game that I think does some really interesting stuff with its timer is Touhou 12.3 Hisoutensoku's Weather system. Without getting too deep into it, it works similar to UNI's GRD cycle where a secondary timer ticks down, and when it turns over a forecasted weather takes effect, which alters system mechanics. Players are able to influence what the next weather cycle will be, so on top of the usual fighting game mindgames, you're constantly making decisions to try and set up the next weather cycle being favorable to you.
I don't think Soku/SWR weather system can be compared to GRD as they serve two very different purposes and players have to interact with them in very different ways. Only if you mean that in regards of 'Things that the player has to pay attention along the match'. In Soku you can use a spell or a bounce to interact with the weather counter, or that system card, but that's generally not used; While in UNI the way you play around GRD is just playing good neutral and making good choices in regards to your situation. Plus, Soku and many other doujin fighters don't even have a timer, it doesn't really apply here, it is a good example that you can still have a fg be interesting and encourage players to do stuff without a timer. If Soku had one all it'd encourage would be heavy stalling lol
I literally just posted a comment about Soku before seeing this one. Man I love Soku, and I will die on the hill that the weather system is absolutely genius.
Hisoutensoku mentioned
Comment has been planted
Unexpected Touhou Heck Yeah!
Or UTHY for short.
As for what UTHY means… idk
Well would you look at that
Man I love UNI. GRD system is like an evolution of GG's tension system that rewards risk taking on offense and defense. And top level is kinda silly with essentially two people crouch blocking in the last quarter of the cycle but it's also really fun trying to squeeze that extra GRD for vorpal.
The timer is an often overlooked and misunderstood mechanic but the basics often are.
When one of the developers of starcraft was asked what he thought was the most innovative thing about the game, he said, fog of war. It makes sense. It compels the player into the map as before once you revealed an area, it was always revealed. Taking something valuable away from people has always been the spark for conflict.
That last sentence is valuable to me as a game dev! Ty for bringing it up.
Other examples are things such as Tifa's death in FF7 or the nature of Removal Cards in PvZ Heroes. Everybody hates Rose for Removing their ability to have fun, and everybody hates losing their one healer in FF7.
Your channel really does feel like core A gaming 2. I'm almost upset by it, I couldn't stop binging your videos all day today haha. Keep up the great work man! 🤙🏼
*Geras would like to know your location.*
Amazing Video!!! Time is often unappreciated in these games and you did a fantastic analysis.
Great vid, the stuff about how games use the timer to basically manipulate the players is really interesting. It’s interesting too when there’s kind of layers of timers, like you’ve got the round timer but smaller timers within like in uni. Or even in tekken 8 it feels very common that someone will go into heat mode and that creates a time sensitive situation - can you get your opponent to waste their time in heat, can you make the most of your heat, etc
A good video, and one that comes with tones of cool reccs as well. Heres hoping it will get you to 20k!
Many thanks friend
Happy to see the growth bro! Congrats and wish you much more success 🙏🏽
Many thanks! It's funny seeing you comment on my videos considering years back I'd watch your DBFZ guides! Never thought I'd find myself on YT like this
You've almost hit 20K! It's well earned. Once again, here's to even greater heights! Also, thinking of rekindling my relationship with Sam Sho.
I love your videos man, haven't watched it yet but i know its already a banger ^^^
Thanks for letting me know! I really hope you enjoy cuz I put a lot into compiling all the clips for this one haha
Baited with DIO, stayed for knowledge for my creation
Counterargument:
All framedata IS time as a resource.
P.S.: Samsho is awesome, and at least in V special you have two types of Rage burst: the normal rage and a time slow "tranquility" which can only be done with an empty rage bar, super useful for whiff punishing. The rage meter also adds extra depth because different characters build rage at different rates, and once you have full rage it goes away after a few seconds, so sometimes it's good to "meditate" and willingly reduce some of your rage meter, so you can gain full rage at a later time instead.
basically, if there are 100s in a round and a punch takes 1s, you only ever have 100 punches maximum to get your opponent's life _lower_ than yours.
The People are not ready for a full dive into Soku's weather mechanics.
Yo! I just subscribed solely off the strength of that hardcore bait that you hit me with. My head is spinning 😵💫🤕, but I'm excited to see more content from you brother!
Lmao you never escape the 50/50s my friend. Glad you enjoyed
@@qmanchu that's hilarious I didn't even think of the mix up. Brings a whole new meaning to "I got hit" 🤣🤣
You are so humble. Loved the video, already a subscriber
Thanks a lot my friend. I just want my hard work to speak for itself haha
Such an interesting topic
Wish more games had meta stuff interacting with the timer and stuff
Don't mind me just finding well edited underrated videos and channels on my feed
Glad you enjoyed!
Officially at 20k. Awesome dude!
Most interesting video, mate. Thanks for making it! Much respect, and Please Come to Brazil.
cool video!! i'm glad you brought up the kof time bonus to health recovery, i always felt like that was an interesting way to make the timer a bit more impactful. i remember hearing, possibly in a justin wong video or appearance or something, that one strategy is to purposefully play keepaway if you know you're going to lose a character SPECIFICALLY to keep the opponent from getting life back after the fact. it's very funny and devious and honestly i should be practicing defense more often just to force that situation.
also great to see SFxTK mentioned. god what a weird game that was. i wasn't 100% in the know when that was out but in my mind i always jokingly called it Street Fighter x Time Out because that's kinda what the game was to me and, i'm speculating, a lot of other people. can cosign for the Theory Fighter video--his stuff on SFxTK is incredible
It's funny because a big reason I wanted to make this video was to share some sources of my own knowledge of fighitng games. SFxT was one of the first games I labbed combos in so I loved it when it came out. Seeing the resurgence during 2020 was awesome.
All the videos I mentioned here are some of my favorites on their respective games so if you ever have down time and wanna hear a cool story, these guys got em. Maybe I'll make a playlist of my favorite essays soon
Budokai Tenkaichi music!
Haha, great video! I hadn't noticed how interesting this topic can be. And I appreciate the shoutout
Glad you enjoyed
W budokai
Can't believe I wasn't subbed after all the videos I've watched of you.
That being said, If I got the life lead, I'm BIG chillin. You gotta approach, I'll sit here for 90 seconds. In reverse, if I'm down, I gotta approach and take the risk. Some players don't think like that, especially online, not so much in a tournament. I think there is something really special about time outs. Like I don't go into a match with that as a goal, but if the opportunity presents itself, I'll just change gears. Feels great to time scam, which is why I was so mad that SF6 supers stop the clock, that just made time outs so much less viable in a game that already is really explosive and never go to time. Feels bad man
You get a sub for the storm 2 outro. Great video
Great video as always! went well with my morning coffee
What an honor
I've added you to my "FGC HISTORY & EDITORIAL" playlist. Subbed too.
I appreciate that! Glad you enjoyed
There's definitely more to "time" in fighting games than just the round timer if you know where to look. You touched on this with pandora and rage explosion, but it's not uncommon to have a universal or semi-universal mechanic that gives the player windows of power. Melty blood has HEAT and MAX modes, where your super meter drains over time, during which your character is in a powered-up state and the round timer is paused. P4A had shadow frenzy, where any shadow character could convert burst+super meter into a powered-up state as well. MvC3 tried to have something similar with X-factor, but the duration scaled too high, so it's easy to forget that it actually had a timer. And lots of games have characters with install supers, giving them a limited window of time with which to use their improved kit.
One of my favorite examples come from one of the touhou fighters, immaterial and missing power. The game itself has no round timer, but the entire super system plays around the concept of time. In normal gameplay, you accrue super meter, but cannot use it until you "declare," which restores some missing health and gives a window based on how many bars of super you accrued, which must be used within that time. Once the timer expires, that's it. You can't declare again for the rest of the round, and any unspent bars are lost.
Rage burst in SamSho sounds so sick, been meaning to check that game out for awhile
unironically one of the best videos regarding FGC ive seen. Everyone understand timers are important, but not many seem to understand why and this video is one of the concise on the topic. I don't play many traditional fighting games. Mostly Smash melee and some dabbling in GGST. And in the melee community, we don't really have to worry about time much. The characters that can stall super easily are pretty bad all things consider (except fox and puff) Im not sure how frowned it is to play to timer more outside of melee, but I know that because we are a smaller scene and have an heir of "hype" surrounding us (if its real or fake thats up to debate) I think it encourages our players to not go for time outs as much. You look at players like Hbox and M2K who had slower playstyles and were kinda demonized for it. Regardless, a lot of the mechanics in this video seem super interesting from an outside perspective. great vid!
This comment means a lot to me! This video is an idea I've sat on for years and years. I've compiled all these clips in my head and wanted to create a cohesive project from them. I'm so glad others can enjoy it as well
For elena just add a dot mechanic where she will receive damage, but she has a strong lifesteal multiplier where the more combo points she gets the more heals she gets
That sounds like a bad character. Not bad design, but simply one that just incentivizes her opponents to stay away, which wouldn't work for a character like her that's designed to catch opponents trying to chase her down. It's just a whole new thing at that point but I think you're on to something. I don't think she was a bad design, her frame data just needed tweaking from that initial version.
Another thing to consider is that fighting games were born in arcades where they wanted to maximize profit. Having a timer meant that no match was allowed to exceed 297 seconds. So when two people put in quarters, one of them would have to leave or plunk in another quarter at least every 5 minutes at max.
Pretty sure half of the games at my local arcade were fighting game cabinets to maximize profits
Heck, they usually had a non FGC Cabinet between them to ensure elbow room!
XD
Tldr, snes power rangers game has Kirby megaton punch bar minigame to get ex moves and supers
One time related thing in a fighting game that I’d like to see more people talking about is the one in Mighty Morphin’ Power Rangers: Fighting Edition for the SNES. The timer isn’t anything special but just below it and the health bar is another bar that fills up with a color in about a second and a half, and when it reaches the end of the bar it stops very very briefly and goes back to filling up again. As far as I know, it does this completely independently of the player, and loops indefinitely. Every time you input a special move, the bar stops wherever it was until the special move finishes, then it resets back to zero and continues its routine. HOWEVER, if you execute a special move when the bar is completely full, it’ll stop and flash until the special move finishes, and then the fill will change color. This tells you that you’ve advanced to the next level of the bar. If I remember correctly it goes from blue at lvl 1 to red at lvl 2 to green at lvl 3. Afaik, as your levels go up, your special moves get more and more enhanced. Think like EX moves, but instead of just being normal or EX it can be normal, EX, or EX2. Once you advance to lvl 4, your bar will just have a constant lightning animation and won’t do its fill routine at all. This allows you to input a super, but only if you do it within a certain amount of time and also at the cost of resetting your bar back to lvl 1 when you execute a super, regardless of if it lands. I don’t really know what effects this has on the game competitively since I don’t think it really has a scene, but it’s nothing I could reasonably say exists in any other game I know
This is from a POWER RANGERS game?!
0:35 LOOK AT THE TIME!! LOOK AT IT!!!!!!
Melty blood heat system let the player have their hand on both health and the timer as the timer is frozen while heat is active. It gives nuanced decisions every so often (will they heat in low life to regain comfortable health level but giving me more time/chances to get ahead etc.)
It's not the deepest use of time but with how everything ressource wise (meter, time, health) is tied together it's one of the most well thought in my opinion
AXL MENTIONED THIS IS SO OUT OF THE BOX ❤❤:3
From the Josuke pfp to the "Axl mentioned" comment I can tell this was definitely a treat for you lol. Part 4 is underrated
Yomih is a pretty unique fighting game, but I think the timer itself is used pretty interestingly (unless you use chess timer)
It is! I just didn't talk about it here cuz I did a video on that game not too long ago! I probably could've thrown a mention
I mean this isn't the kind of fighting game you're thinking of, but in Punch Out Wii, the timer ticks down a bit faster than in real life, but when you have your opponent stunned, it's slower than real time. From my (probably inaccurate) counting, it's about twice as fast as real time normally and somewhere between 0.25x and 0.5x when your opponent is stunned, plus you get a lil caera zoom in when they're stunned so that's cool I guess.
This normally doesn't apply in head to head because you can't stun the opposing little mac, only hit him with a single punch. Giga Mac, however, can be stunned for like 2-3 hits max.
That's about all I know.
I think Danger Time in GGXrd is one of the nuttiest and best aspects about the game. Just a pure seconds of "all or nothing" that can only come out after both characters clash attacks.
Sure, it can be really unfair sometimes and most people don't really know how to move arround it properly because is something relatively uncommon, so labbing it can be considered a waste of time (much more now at least), but it surely adds soul to the game, I just love it
It's pretty damn funny tbh lol. Truly one of the mechanics of all time!
1:52 i was about to click on that bell.
Would love to see a fighter in any game that can control the in game clock to an insane degree. Imagine using moves that would drop 15 seconds off the clock, or add 10, forcing or avoiding a time out. Maybe some projectile that remembers when it was fired and will reverse or re-fire when the timer hits the same time again.
Mk11's Geras can do that with a custom move.
A game where time is really interesting and a core of what the whole game is (albeit not a fighting game) is Quake duel.
In quake you have a 10 min timer, which works like fighting game timers, but, you also have items around the map. Each item when picked up has a respawn timer (35 or 25 seconds for most important items), so the whole game revolves around getting the time at which those items will respawn and then being there to pick them up as soon as they reappear.
Its very interesting and while i've always been more into quake than fighting games, both genres share a lot in common. The 1v1 setting, map control, conditioning, reads, etc. If you want to watch a good quake match, i'd suggest quakecon 2016 rapha vs evil grand final :)
I'll definitely check it out
Fighterz has a 300 second clock since that's how long the Fusion Dance last
This actually makes more sense than I'd like lol. It lasts 30 minutes so they just said, "here you go, 300 seconds"!
15:23 baiken is lost like zoro
just popping by the comment section to let you know that your vids and style of editing is really good!
hopefully this comment pushes more stuff like this into my algorithm lmao
Thanks a lot! I'm really glad you enjoyed
The thumnail being designed to make it look like this video is about Time Stop is pretty duche-y
Samsho, Uni, and SFxT, all games that I highlighted in this video have means of actually stopping time in the matches, which I talk about (Rage explosion, chain shift, and Pandora).This video is about time stop AND more.
So there's nothing douchey happening here friend and it would be nice if you actually watched the video instead of calling me names
I also though this was about time stop and feel scammed. I was tricked into watching a video and I have already reported this to the proper authorities
Geras in MK11 had an equip move that let him add or subtract 10 seconds on the timer. It wasn't online or tournament legal, though, so you never see anyone ever use it. And I've yet to get the AI to use it in towers.
WHOA. What's funny is I looked into him to make sure I didn't miss anything substantial but I did not run into that! That's sick but also obviously broken
Look at the time, LOOK AT ITTT. Is still a top 5 evo moment for me.
It fits what I wanted to talk about in this video so perfectly lol
I seen the whole video and it’s pretty great. I’m surprised Geras wasn’t mentioned from MK 11 since he can remove or add time to the round clock itself. I’m not too in depth on the knowledge of the game but I thought it was actually an interesting move.
Considering it's not competitively viable, it's hard to speak about. Hypothetically it's interesting but wasn't worth keeping in the game, so I don't think it's worth putting in the video
honey wake up new fighting game essay just came out
Im working on a timer mechanic that is unique as far as i knoe id love to hear any feedback!
Its a very fast KO time platform fighter with 4 stocks, there is no "damage". Im taking on better incorpwrating timerscam combos and infinites as being intentional in their design.
For this ive come to "timer burn" a mechanic that accelerates the timer for each hit of your combo if you have the lead.
The game also counts still having not been hit, your "perfect-status" as a lead over being hit, so you can in theory get a ToD timerscam off first hit, but theyre generally very difficult, and reliant on true frames or counterhits with how combo scaling works.
This creates a meaningful split in optimal routing if youre in the lead toward longer combos for more time advantage. I've thought enjoyed the mechanic in testing but given its indev almost nobodys gotten good enough to thoroughly test it.
3:21 beardless apologyman jumpscare
One thing with "Marvel time" in MvC3 is that time outs happened a lot whenever early builds of the game were brought out for play testing, so Marvel time was one solution to this.
That makes a lot of sense considering how weird Marvel combos can be. Thanks for sharing!
Pucci in Jojo ASB games literally weaponized the in game timer using his Made in Heaven super
Not only the enemy moves in slow motion, the game timer speeds up exponentionally, which almost always causes a time out
Why? Because despite the massive advantage Pucci got during this super, his damage scaling becomes ridiculously high for some reason, and thus if the enemy has a huge life lead, you can actually lose the round by using this super since its hard to land big damage during it
Usually when I play with friends we usually have timers off but I noticed especially in sf6 when people get the life lead they start running. And no they weren't playing guile lol
I'm surprised BBCF's Overdrive wasn't mentioned. Its a 4 second super mode (minimum of 2 if canceled into, maximum of 8 at low health) that gives the character better Drive moves and combos until it runs out, as well as a free reversal super.
Biggest reason I didn't was because I couldn't find many interactions with the clock for bbcf. The other games have modes like this that are more integral to the relationship of mechanic to time left on the clock.
But bbcf is fricking awesome
@@qmanchu One thing Overdrive does do is pause the timer, so it can allow you an extra 8 seconds (not including when the timer stops counting down during Hitstun) for a comeback that might otherwise not be possible
Ngl Dio and Axel are two of my favorite fighting game characters
I wish there was a fighter that used up the global timer as a super
Plays a track from Under Night In-Birth II Sys:Celes with the note "I ain't writing all that"
Coward.
I'm surprised this is the only comment on that gag lol
at first i thought the ending song was somnus and now i want to know what this song is
Lol I have used that song before, I think in the Yoko Shimomura video (makes sense).
It's the opening menu theme for Naruto Ultimate Ninja Storm 2
in a fighting game where the characters fight without a referee, who watch the time?
Dbfz casually having 300 seconds
For some reason, this reminded me of Pokken Tournament DX and if I’m not wrong, the timer is skewed towards short considering the Health to Damage ratio.
Characters could run a strategy more reliant on time-outs and keep away.
(Don’t quote me on this one though)
Nah I'm pretty sure you're right about this. I didn't play dx but I remember this about the base game
great video
Quality content
It would be interesting to do something like how Mobas use their timers, rather than a count down, with a specific stop point, you have a count up that affects different mechanics. For example, making defensive options harder by making guard gauges drain faster or making attacks do more damage, giving more resources to force interactions like giving super meter faster, and maybe even an overtime mode that essentially says, alright its time to end this now, and gives you something crazy like everyone getting a homing attack onto their opponent or all hits becoming counter hits.
FF@15
surprised you didnt made an honorable mention to Iron Tager time scam, BEST TIME OUT STRATEGY THERE IS
Yknow what that's such a good point! There's too much to mention haha
real and true i hate video essays but just going to leave a comment and watch to give u engagemtn since them topic iscool
I appreciate your sacrifice fam
Touhou 12.3 Hisoutensoku doesn't have a timer, instead it cycles through weather effects that can be manipulated by the players, causing different strategies and playstyles to be more or less effective throughout the match.
It's such a complex yet elegant system that i adore because if, say, your opponent is running away and blocking everything too much, you could force a weather that rendered them unable to block. Or another weather that limited their getup options so you could oki better.
It's sad i don't see this game get talked about enough and i would love to see more games take inspiration from this system.
Someone else mentioned this in the comments and I have no idea what this game even is. I thought Touhou was a bullet hell game lmao
@@qmanchu most of them are, there are some spinoff titles that are fighting games though. I highly recommend checking it out and seeing if there's video inspiration there. The game is so incredibly active even 11 years after the game's release, it's wild. The community is pretty small but really active and creative, I loved being a part of it.
@@theINNOSINT you've piqued my interest
Time limit for upping the pace=fun
Time limit actually expiring, leaving the match "incomplete"=not much fun
Surprised to not see Geras mentionned since he can litterally add and remove time on the timer.
I wanted to mention him but I actually didn't know about that mechanic of his since it was never legal for competition haha
Waku Waku 7 on Switch can let you set the timer to exactly 1 second.
Craziest experience ever.
Well I have to mention Kirby Fighters 2 right? That game doesn’t have a timer, but since there are rules in place preventing stalling, and characters have really strong fireballs and approach options across the board, the game rarely ends up in situations where the players aren’t interacting. Obviously it’s not perfect but it’s certainly interesting. Though it is reliant on anti stalling rules.
When the 2 name drops are 2 RUclipsrs I also watch 😂
Great minds think alike
Actually, the real explanation is the simplest. You don't want players sitting at your arcade hogging the cabinet. The faster players lose, the faster another coin can be inserted into the machine.
Time is money.
This doesn't explain anything mentioned in the video though cuz it's not like Marvel 3, DBFZ, SFxT, or the majority of games here were arcade games.
I mention exactly what you said making sense for old games, but why is it the case for new ones? Those timers should be more in line with a non arcade setup
@@qmanchu Simply holdovers from old conventions and design. If they had wanted to, they could've done away with the concept of timers ages ago while still achieving the intended gameplay loop. They're simply designing around gameplay elements leftover from the arcade days that really don't have to be there anymore, but they choose to keep.
where did you get that arcade footage at the end of your intro
It's from storyblocks haha. Stock footage
Ahhh, theory fighter! Or as I like to call him for the name on his logo: The Dry Fighter.
Fun fact: Geras from Mortal Kombat 11 can add or take round time.
Good video
not mentioning Jojo's All Star Battle is actually criminal, considering it has a character who can speed up the timer, a character who can turn back the timer, and three separate characters who stop the timer
Still a great video tho, I just wanted to see my fave unplayable game mentioned
Time stop wasn't something I wanted to talk about, and I'm working on a whole separate HFTF project. ASBR will probably get one too down the line when I know what to say
You should try yomi hustle, it's a interesting turn based fighting game
How would you feel if I told you I did a video solely on turn based fighting games in the past? Lol
@@qmanchu I've watched it now and it's a very good video, thanks for the recommendation
No problem! I wish that video was treated well by the algorithm cuz so many people ask me to cover Yomi Hustle or Checkmate showdown lol.
Glad you enjoyed
I think the "timer is slower than real seconds" is to trick players into thinking they're in *THE ZONE* or focused so hard they perceive time slower, but also its a blatant trick LMAO
I can assure you that had Elena's skill been a 1 round barrier that adds let's say a green block of shield to her HP the exact same amount she would have had she healed, nobody would complain about it. Because that way the system would still only look at her HP and still made her lose.
The reason why straight up healing is a bad mechanic in FG is because it causes passive one sided action instead of interactions. Everyone will get knocked down or back at any point in a fighting game and the fact that Elena can use it to get a quick heal is what makes it bad. Had Yoshimitsu of Tekken also healed much more, everyone would complain as well. The reason why Ragna's or Nagoriyuki/Slayer's lifesteal is good is because its an aggressive action instead of passive one that the other player can play around on.
But back to Elena, if her healing is turned into a barrier, this does two things.
1. It means the Elena player can't play lame and stall you out for time.
2. If means the Elena player has to jump in to attack you after putting on her barrier meaning it opens up for more interactions between both players.
These are great points and a cool way to tackle this actually. You've obviously put a good deal of thought into this
I think this video may be demonetized just because a short mortal kombat footage is involved 1:07
I was hoping for clocks
16:55 The jojo-? Ah nevermind.
when will arksys make a character with a super that skips 30 seconds on the clock
It's weird that you think timers are supposed to force interactions. To me timers reward defensive play with an alternative win condition without a timer the defender would eventually be worn down by never ending attacks.
Many games exist where this isn't true unfortunately. Negative penalty like I mentioned is a thing in many games. You can't run away for long at all before it kicks in and suddenly that defensive play becomes 3x as costly. That's why in this video there isn't a single guilty gear time out and only 1 Blazblue timeout that I could find. I should've been more clear about that.
But in many games, like Samsho, you're right, that is the case
14:21 song name?
time is like ray
where yomi hustle?
Time sure does run fast wouldn't you think so? And since you've mentioned characters that use the power of time, there's one notable fighting game character I'd like to talk about, Kamui Tokinomiya from Arcana Heart. She has a default Arcana named Anutpada who's basically Arcana Heart's answer to Dio Brando's World Stand from Jojo who has the power to freeze time. And next time, why don't you talk about assist characters like those in games like King of Fighters 2000, Arcana Heart, Dengeki Bunko Fighting Climax and Super Smash Bros?
I actually just bought Arcana Heart a few weeks ago cuz it was on sale. Lots of people told me to check it out.
And assists could be fun to talk about. Not sure if there's anything interesting (to me) to say but I'll look into it
Wheres the yomi hustle love?
I did a whole video where yomi was the highlight months before this one. Check out my turn based fighting game video
I don't get the "Marvel Time" section. Does the game actually indicate anywhere that it is using seconds to measure the time, or is that just player assumption? Because you talk about "what the game tells players", but I don't see the game telling players that anywhere
9:04
why is the footage made extremely tiny in this segment for no reason? It's difficult to see what you're trying to demonstrate
For no reason? That's how the footage came unfortunately. Stream vod wasn't great