I have freeze and flight. Sometimes I just can't function, other days I start doing stuff and feeling like leaving this town...when I freeze guilt and shame kick in...then I start doing till i burn out...
Tim Fletcher has multiple series’s on complex trauma, it covers this precisely in his series specifically on “shame and complex trauma”, but I have found ALL his content to be helpful ❤
This is my go to response. Throughout lockdown I didn't stop, thinking by being productive and creative 24/7 it was a positive thing. In many ways it was but I can see now that this was mostly a distraction from processing my feelings of fear and anxiety. Thank you so much for taking the time to make these videos, they make my day when the notification comes up. Learning so much from this series, (another distraction possibly!) Also you look fabulous that beautiful print top 💕
I used to be this exact person. Had a nervous breakdown a couple of years back when my career stagnated, an engagement ended horribly and now im into the reverse i dont want to work on myself. What happened in between is extensive verbal/emotional abuse from a birth giver, a snarky boss with whom i consciously learn to fawn to eacape being targetted. Am i still in flight? Idk.
Sobbing is easy for me when someone i really liked has hurt me. That trigger gets all my emotions stirred up. Through trauma research I understand now that I will never chase people again or let my self be used. I deserve better and until than I will stay alone.
Great video! I didn't realize that perfectionism is characteristic of flight and noticed a couple other tendencies I have as well. Love this series. Thank you Dr Kim!
I was studying for an exam that takes a few years to pass but I decided to give up bc I got OCD and anxiety and it got worse when I neared the exam date. Then I realised it was the same in every other exam/assignment due date for my life.
I relate well to the busy-ness tendencies that you shared. In my thirties, a friend invited me to start meditating. After a year or so, painful early memories emerged during my quiet time and that was a turning point for me. Where is the tipping point for too much thinking? - no way to really know, I suppose. The way you describe the video-making process, combing your thoughts, feelings, experience and research is an approach I find inspirational, so I imagine the tipping point for too much is a matter of degree and something we need to attend to each day taking into account the marvelous “complex adaptive systems” that we are.
Thanks for the work you are doing! I just got diagnosed with this yesterday. I’m also diagnosed with depression and anxiety from the military. I realize now after doing research on cptsd that’s where the anxiety and depression is coming from. Probably why I had so much of an issue being away from my wife in the military. It’s crazy to hear the signs and symptoms. I also have a adhd diagnosed with BPD. What a list… this is literally how I’m living my life almost everyday I never sit I always have to be accomplishing something. Or the self talk comes in and I’m lazy.. just downloaded the book from audible look forward to learning more and finding ways to help myself get better.
Complex PTSD was the book 📖 that was like the final layer of the onion 🧅 that I had been peeling for the past 20+ years. I didn’t just read that book, I experienced it over 4 or 5 days in January 2020, right before the pandemic. Pete Walker seemed to know me better than my parents. The stories in that book were heartbreaking.
I get triggered and go from 1 to ten and want to hurt whom has caused it . Always men . All therapy and medication has never worked . And sometimes I'm stuck in panic mode for 12 hours till exhausted. I scare my self and dont know how to stop it. Mindfulness also doesnt work for me .
You are amazing ❤ Thank you so much for your videos. I learned so much from you. I’m pretty sure my mother has Bpd. She was physically abused by her mother in terrible ways. My mother had 10 siblings and they all had some psychological problem. But as far as I can tell she is the only one with BPD. She has celiac disease, MTHFR, COMT and MAo genetic snps. She is 86 years old now and her suicidal tendencies are way worse. Now I understand somethings about myself but it’s been I hard journey with her.
Great info, i am such a busy body!! I am hsp, and i relate to the menopause thing!! I feel more grounded after menopause. I am an enfp, i am just kinda high strung, but i do need alone time. In my alone time, i process my feeling and for me, prayer is my go to 100 percent effective meditation. God bless you, your videos are NOT a waste of time, but i also know the feeling of intense drive during a creative endeavor, and not sleeping!! Lol!! I don't mind burning the candle if its meaningful. Thank you!! God bless everyone!!!! 🌹🌹🌹
Thanks for these videos this is so me, and when I feel people don’t see it and appreciate it, it really triggers me and sends me on a downward spiral 😍😍
I seriously need help When I was 7 I was responsible for accidentally causing the death of my 5 yr old sister. My mother made me lie to the police about what happened because she put me in the position of being always responsible for all of my 4 younger siblings. I have been extremely emotionally ill my whole life since then. I constantly ask myself why did I make that decision?
Hello Kim, have you ever thought of yourself being gifted? check Paula Prober's blog: Your rainforest mind. Some of the signs you say sound like gifted. I am gifted myself (never thought I was intelligent though). Thinking faster than speaking, high achievers, good grades, very sensitive, etc are some signs. Check Imi Lo's book too. Best wishes.
hi Dr. Kim I have cptsd from my teenage years, the cause of that is from heavy bullying, verbal abuse, name calling, and all the false accusations etc. I am now in my mid 40s but I am still so strongly attached to the truama emotions that I had when the trauma first occured. .....and as you know C-PTSD is a recurring Trauma, so every time the the Trauma occurs again, I automatically went into that response, ....I just hate it so much, but I really have no idea of how to break out of that, I am just feel so stuck and don't know what to do, can you please give me some advice. thank you very much.
Have you looked into the Extreme Demand Avoidance/PDA profile of Autism? It is not a generally acknowledged diagnosis.. Kristy Forbes talks about this, she says, the PDA brain looks very similar like a PTSD brain. But they were not the same. But I wonder, is this just an extreme flight response but in an autistic person?
It is! Fight, flight, freeze, and fawn can be subtle. A fight response doesn’t necessarily mean you get physical with people for example. Instead this could mean you’re very confrontational and sensitive. Similarly flight doesn’t have to mean literally fleeing. Instead these things are considered flight because you’re distracting yourself by focusing on perfectionism and/or being busy. This is a characteristic of flight because you’re avoiding (aka fleeing from) your feelings.
@@lindsay5305 No problem! 🙂 That’s a fair point. I realize that I made a mistake. I sorta made it sound like busying yourself and perfectionism are similar, which isn’t true. While it’s possible someone could be using perfectionism as a distraction from their feelings I would imagine that perfectionism is most commonly classified as flight because the individual is avoiding conflict by maintaining/putting on a perfect image.
@@andrewalpern2178 mmm I appreciate your articulate communication and I disagree. I think perfectionism is a strategy to artificially create a sense of worth. If so, how is that a flight response?
@@lindsay5305 Thank you :). I’m not exactly sure. Perfectionism doesn’t have to manifest in the way I described it. I was describing it in relation to a flight response because of your original comment. Mental health is obviously very complicated so while perfectionism can be related to a flight response its definitely possible that the feelings surrounding that are more complex or related to something else entirely. P.S. While I believe I’m accurate this response is mostly based on my intuition rather than information I’ve learned from psychologists so if this comment is confusing or you disagree I encourage you to do more research on it!
Yeah the left hemisphere perception - aaaalways busy busy busy, NOT available (be it emotionally or physically) and being busy is valued in our society unfortunately and if you are not, you are treated as "less then" ... I think it was Gabor Maté who talks about workaholism as addiction - also pointing towards himself, speaking about his own trauma, being abandoned as a child by his mother (because she tried to save him) --- Being busy so much that they at times make a total mess, juggling too many hats at once... - I think "ADHD" is a trauma based expression on the neurodivergent side of things... - it is at the other end of the autism spectrum - and yes, they are often so successful - since they are SENSORY SEEKERS - while autistics often end up unemployed BECAUSE of their sensory sensitivities, AVOIDING ANY SENSORY input if possible... One question came up also - HOW DO YOU have proper dicernment between covert narcissism and the FLIGHT response? I am asking because this just happened to me, where I suddenly asked myself, am I dealing with a FLIGHT- type ADHD person here, or am I now in the devaluation phase of a covert narcissist ??? (Watched Dr. Ramini last night where she talked about stockholm syndrome & trauma bonding ruclips.net/user/livei55PR3DiqsY?feature=shared and here where the guy asks, WHY we actually accept abusive behaviour, why do we let other people in, despite that abuse? Which is where traumabonding comes in.... Traumabonding - ruclips.net/video/XmmJKtUAe9c/видео.htmlfeature=shared , This person I am confronted with.. who suddenly is really quite emotionally absent, even avoidant, where I asked myself, have I done something wrong? (typical, blaming yourself, even when you observe the chaotic way of life the other is in but does not want to acknowledge it (flight response, avoidance of seeing things plainly...) Of course I am familiar with "dis-association" (and yes I write it in that way on purpose, as it is un-coupling things too- therefore rather healing) , so yes, I love to watch movies for example, because it calms me, and I find everything that activates GABA pathways VERY SOOTHING against anxiety. But I would say, that is different. I am not displaying addiction nor workaholism ...if I am forced to do to much I end in burnout, has happened before and it is awful.... NOW I NEED a LOT of downtime to regulate ... getting quickly stressed out... So I don't think, Pete Walker's book is a good fit for neurodivergent people, it seems to put the blame on the person suffering from trauma, which creates guilt and shame, same as the mainstream autism narrative does. It is a way of balancing out the stress. response..I think, many autistics are "stockholm syndromed" by their environment, especially kids who got ABA abuse.
I have freeze and flight. Sometimes I just can't function, other days I start doing stuff and feeling like leaving this town...when I freeze guilt and shame kick in...then I start doing till i burn out...
How do you stop feeling so bad about the ways you were hurt by your parents? I feel ashamed for being hurt by 2 people who did their best.
Tim Fletcher has multiple series’s on complex trauma, it covers this precisely in his series specifically on “shame and complex trauma”, but I have found ALL his content to be helpful ❤
You feel pitty for them instead .
Be proud you diddnt turn out the same as your abuser .
@@sarahalderman3126me too
This is my go to response. Throughout lockdown I didn't stop, thinking by being productive and creative 24/7 it was a positive thing. In many ways it was but I can see now that this was mostly a distraction from processing my feelings of fear and anxiety. Thank you so much for taking the time to make these videos, they make my day when the notification comes up. Learning so much from this series, (another distraction possibly!) Also you look fabulous that beautiful print top 💕
I used to be this exact person. Had a nervous breakdown a couple of years back when my career stagnated, an engagement ended horribly and now im into the reverse i dont want to work on myself. What happened in between is extensive verbal/emotional abuse from a birth giver, a snarky boss with whom i consciously learn to fawn to eacape being targetted. Am i still in flight? Idk.
For those with limited time or short attention span, description starts at 3:44
Thanks!!
Sobbing is easy for me when someone i really liked has hurt me. That trigger gets all my emotions stirred up. Through trauma research I understand now that I will never chase people again or let my self be used. I deserve better and until than I will stay alone.
Great video! I didn't realize that perfectionism is characteristic of flight and noticed a couple other tendencies I have as well. Love this series. Thank you Dr Kim!
Jay if you see this, i wish the very best for you. You are worth love, a great love! Never give up and take care of yourself always.
Wow- I feel seen. This was an eye opener! Thank you 💜
I was studying for an exam that takes a few years to pass but I decided to give up bc I got OCD and anxiety and it got worse when I neared the exam date. Then I realised it was the same in every other exam/assignment due date for my life.
Do I ever think to much and such a perfectionist. Never connected it to my cptsd.
I love you 😭 thank you for all you do
I have ... Flight from danger or from poor self worth , Fight to protect not myself so much as the vulnerable, Freeze in loss and Fawn from love
You are such a light spirited sweet person!
May you have a great day and success with all your projects!
I relate well to the busy-ness tendencies that you shared. In my thirties, a friend invited me to start meditating. After a year or so, painful early memories emerged during my quiet time and that was a turning point for me. Where is the tipping point for too much thinking? - no way to really know, I suppose. The way you describe the video-making process, combing your thoughts, feelings, experience and research is an approach I find inspirational, so I imagine the tipping point for too much is a matter of degree and something we need to attend to each day taking into account the marvelous “complex adaptive systems” that we are.
Thanks for the work you are doing! I just got diagnosed with this yesterday. I’m also diagnosed with depression and anxiety from the military. I realize now after doing research on cptsd that’s where the anxiety and depression is coming from. Probably why I had so much of an issue being away from my wife in the military. It’s crazy to hear the signs and symptoms. I also have a adhd diagnosed with BPD. What a list… this is literally how I’m living my life almost everyday I never sit I always have to be accomplishing something. Or the self talk comes in and I’m lazy.. just downloaded the book from audible look forward to learning more and finding ways to help myself get better.
Complex PTSD was the book 📖 that was like the final layer of the onion 🧅 that I had been peeling for the past 20+ years. I didn’t just read that book, I experienced it over 4 or 5 days in January 2020, right before the pandemic. Pete Walker seemed to know me better than my parents. The stories in that book were heartbreaking.
I get triggered and go from 1 to ten and want to hurt whom has caused it . Always men .
All therapy and medication has never worked .
And sometimes I'm stuck in panic mode for 12 hours till exhausted.
I scare my self and dont know how to stop it. Mindfulness also doesnt work for me .
You are amazing ❤ Thank you so much for your videos. I learned so much from you. I’m pretty sure my mother has Bpd. She was physically abused by her mother in terrible ways. My mother had 10 siblings and they all had some psychological problem. But as far as I can tell she is the only one with BPD. She has celiac disease, MTHFR, COMT and MAo genetic snps. She is 86 years old now and her suicidal tendencies are way worse. Now I understand somethings about myself but it’s been I hard journey with her.
You are amazing! I learn SO MUCH from you. Your energy is very calm and appeasing and you are so accurate and on point! Thank you!
Great info, i am such a busy body!! I am hsp, and i relate to the menopause thing!! I feel more grounded after menopause. I am an enfp, i am just kinda high strung, but i do need alone time. In my alone time, i process my feeling and for me, prayer is my go to 100 percent effective meditation. God bless you, your videos are NOT a waste of time, but i also know the feeling of intense drive during a creative endeavor, and not sleeping!! Lol!! I don't mind burning the candle if its meaningful. Thank you!! God bless everyone!!!! 🌹🌹🌹
This video really resonates with me. I am going to check out the Pete Walker book.
Thanks for these videos this is so me, and when I feel people don’t see it and appreciate it, it really triggers me and sends me on a downward spiral 😍😍
I seriously need help
When I was 7
I was responsible for accidentally causing the death of my 5 yr old sister.
My mother made me lie to the police about what happened because she put me in the position of being always responsible for all of my 4 younger siblings. I have been extremely emotionally ill my whole life since then.
I constantly ask myself why did I make that decision?
Thanks Kim. This is so me. Been in therapy the last 7 years. But getting there. Enjoyed u video. X
I like the meditations by the American Academy of Mind-Body Healing on here.
OMG this is so me, really hit home!
Insight timer is my favorite app too!!
It's so good!:)
Thankyou for this video
Hello Kim, have you ever thought of yourself being gifted? check Paula Prober's blog: Your rainforest mind. Some of the signs you say sound like gifted. I am gifted myself (never thought I was intelligent though). Thinking faster than speaking, high achievers, good grades, very sensitive, etc are some signs. Check Imi Lo's book too. Best wishes.
Interesting topic. But don’t we all think faster than we speak?
Hey Kim,
There is light at the end of the Tunnel. Is there??.
LONG TUNNEL......🚂🚂🚂🚂🚂🚂
Thanks Dr. Kim 🌷
hi Dr. Kim I have cptsd from my teenage years, the cause of that is from heavy bullying, verbal abuse, name calling, and all the false accusations etc. I am now in my mid 40s but I am still so strongly attached to the truama emotions that I had when the trauma first occured. .....and as you know C-PTSD is a recurring Trauma, so every time the the Trauma occurs again, I automatically went into that response, ....I just hate it so much, but I really have no idea of how to break out of that, I am just feel so stuck and don't know what to do, can you please give me some advice. thank you very much.
Thank you so much for this video 🙏
Thank you
Mam i have flight response+dissociation is it possible
Oooooo boy, this is me.
Have you looked into the Extreme Demand Avoidance/PDA profile of Autism?
It is not a generally acknowledged diagnosis..
Kristy Forbes talks about this, she says, the PDA brain looks very similar like a PTSD brain.
But they were not the same.
But I wonder, is this just an extreme flight response but in an autistic person?
YES
Im very confused. I thought flight was running away and escaping, not being busy and perfectionistic. Can you help me understand this please?
It is! Fight, flight, freeze, and fawn can be subtle. A fight response doesn’t necessarily mean you get physical with people for example. Instead this could mean you’re very confrontational and sensitive. Similarly flight doesn’t have to mean literally fleeing. Instead these things are considered flight because you’re distracting yourself by focusing on perfectionism and/or being busy. This is a characteristic of flight because you’re avoiding (aka fleeing from) your feelings.
@@andrewalpern2178 thanks. I dont think perfectionism is a distraction technique
@@lindsay5305 No problem! 🙂 That’s a fair point. I realize that I made a mistake. I sorta made it sound like busying yourself and perfectionism are similar, which isn’t true. While it’s possible someone could be using perfectionism as a distraction from their feelings I would imagine that perfectionism is most commonly classified as flight because the individual is avoiding conflict by maintaining/putting on a perfect image.
@@andrewalpern2178 mmm I appreciate your articulate communication and I disagree. I think perfectionism is a strategy to artificially create a sense of worth. If so, how is that a flight response?
@@lindsay5305 Thank you :). I’m not exactly sure. Perfectionism doesn’t have to manifest in the way I described it. I was describing it in relation to a flight response because of your original comment. Mental health is obviously very complicated so while perfectionism can be related to a flight response its definitely possible that the feelings surrounding that are more complex or related to something else entirely.
P.S. While I believe I’m accurate this response is mostly based on my intuition rather than information I’ve learned from psychologists so if this comment is confusing or you disagree I encourage you to do more research on it!
This is me
Yeah the left hemisphere perception - aaaalways busy busy busy, NOT available (be it emotionally or physically) and being busy is valued in our society unfortunately and if you are not, you are treated as "less then" ... I think it was Gabor Maté who talks about workaholism as addiction - also pointing towards himself, speaking about his own trauma, being abandoned as a child by his mother (because she tried to save him) ---
Being busy so much that they at times make a total mess, juggling too many hats at once... - I think "ADHD" is a trauma based expression on the neurodivergent side of things... - it is at the other end of the autism spectrum - and yes, they are often so successful - since they are SENSORY SEEKERS - while autistics often end up unemployed BECAUSE of their sensory sensitivities, AVOIDING ANY SENSORY input if possible...
One question came up also - HOW DO YOU have proper dicernment between covert narcissism and the FLIGHT response?
I am asking because this just happened to me, where I suddenly asked myself, am I dealing with a FLIGHT- type ADHD person here, or am I now in the devaluation phase of a covert narcissist ???
(Watched Dr. Ramini last night where she talked about stockholm syndrome & trauma bonding ruclips.net/user/livei55PR3DiqsY?feature=shared and here where the guy asks, WHY we actually accept abusive behaviour, why do we let other people in, despite that abuse?
Which is where traumabonding comes in.... Traumabonding - ruclips.net/video/XmmJKtUAe9c/видео.htmlfeature=shared ,
This person I am confronted with.. who suddenly is really quite emotionally absent, even avoidant, where I asked myself, have I done something wrong? (typical, blaming yourself, even when you observe the chaotic way of life the other is in but does not want to acknowledge it (flight response, avoidance of seeing things plainly...)
Of course I am familiar with "dis-association" (and yes I write it in that way on purpose, as it is un-coupling things too- therefore rather healing) , so yes, I love to watch movies for example, because it calms me, and I find everything that activates GABA pathways VERY SOOTHING against anxiety. But I would say, that is different.
I am not displaying addiction nor workaholism ...if I am forced to do to much I end in burnout, has happened before and it is awful.... NOW I NEED a LOT of downtime to regulate ... getting quickly stressed out...
So I don't think, Pete Walker's book is a good fit for neurodivergent people, it seems to put the blame on the person suffering from trauma, which creates guilt and shame, same as the mainstream autism narrative does.
It is a way of balancing out the stress. response..I think, many autistics are "stockholm syndromed" by their environment, especially kids who got ABA abuse.