I'm trying to make it no longer a power fantasy by actually listening to my friends recommendations, the problem is that I haven't been able to make it work in the reverse
@@Delmworks It's not so weird. "Reach Heaven Through Violence" basically means to achieve self-actualization through struggle, not necessarily actual violence.
@@MrMobiusfan thus far this doesn’t seem to be K6BD’s thesis on the subject matter. Though we have admittedly gotten to the point in the story where that turn would make sense.
January 1st 2025, I'm expecting John and Woolie to be fighting shirtless in the rain on the top of the empire state building as the rest of the city is on fire.
@@WandererReduxwe need the new hotness. Considering John’s first tournament and all, and the moment the song is tied to, Tekken 8’s Storm Rising would be more fitting. With a blend of Heat Haze
Why is Eyepatch Wolf such a natural tension builder? He can't approach anything directly, every story and every assignment has to build up the maximum amount of discomfort before providing any sort of relief, and that's why he's always such a delight to listen to.
My mental image for this podcast is John and Woolie regularly meeting up in a police interrogation room and on the table is a single pistol labeled "Omikron"
I feel like that's just every podcast now, except more pistols keep being placed on the table. There was a revolver labeled "Omikron" but now there's also a glock labeled "Boxing."
It should be said, that Tom Bloom ran a tournament in the Kill Six Billion Demons world, where participants created their own characters, and then got pitted against each other. They then each had to draw a short comic showing how their character won the battle, and then the community would vote on who won. And it had an entire thing going on where people claimed parts of the world using these fights. (People Make Games has an entire video on this and it is amazing) He then also designed his own TTRPG based on Kill Six Billion Demons. He then went on to create Lancer together with Miguel Lopez. A mecha tabletop RPG that is just absolutely wonderful and has possibly as deep lore as Kill Six Billion Demons He is now creating ICON a fantasy TTRPG, which is inspired by like Final Fantasy Tactics and other tactical RPGs. Then he made Magnagothica, a gothic horror skirmish wargame where you play as necromancers fighting to get the End of Death. And then finally he has created his magnum opus, the grandest work yet, the one page RPG "Goblin With a Fat Ass" where you play as a goblin with a fat ass that has to rob the richest person in town. So in short this motherfucker is both an accomplished comic book artist and a prolific game designer and can do basically whatever they want and get away with it.
Interesting, I might need to check out ICON. I've been trying to work on some board games/cards games myself, also inspired by tactics and final fantasy combat systems, so I'm always curious about what someone else is able to make.
@@thatoneguy5969 I can warmly recommend it, I ran a campaign of it's 1.45 playtest over six months and it was a blast. It is a game with a heavy tactical focus and with a lot of customization in what characters can do. In fact there is so much focus on that, that your raw stats don't change throughout the entire game, the only difference between first and max level are abilities, and it works so well.
@@thatoneguy5969There are a couple other Final Fantasy games worth checking out. Beacon uses the same system as ICON/Lancer, but gives you more tools to build your own setting and heroes. Fabula Ultima adapts JRPG game design in the opposite direction, emulating the vibes and thematic experience rather than the mechanics. The rules are much lighter, embracing abstracted simplicity, but still allows for incredible customization. I’ve GMed two FabUlt campaigns and I love it!
"Reach heaven through violence" is a quote from the lessons of Vivec in morrowind. Abaddon used to be pretty active in the morrowind community from what I remember.
"... A night out with your friends gettin blitzed is not quite the heroes journey, but it can be!..." *Not even a single beat missed* "I grew up in Dublin Woolie."
I think you misunderstood Bjorn's relationship with Askeladd. Bjorn did not want to kill him, he wanted Askeladd to mercy kill him in a duel so that he can go to Valhallah. In fact Bjorn last words was him wanting acknowledgement from Askeladd that they were real friends in the end.
And whether in a moment of sincerity or a rare moment of empathy, Askeladd confirms they were friends. Whether Askeladd really meant it is debatable, but it's clear he cared enough about Bjorn to give him some small comfort before his death.
Honestly feel like getting a "Vinland Saga vs Kill 6 Billion Demons" Volume 2 would be extremely fun at some point since it's a pair with so much to offer even after this initial coverage.
@@kenjithewizard4980 the pain was worth it, much like shaving my hair off with a dull sword, for I do not contain a peasants soul (although I do cook good noodles).
It still amazes me that K6BD started out in its earliest form as a fuckin adventure thread on the official homestuck forums before they got blown off the face of the earth.
@@Inojin67 Certain pages are findable on Wayback Machine, but a lot of it is lost media. Unfortunately for you, more of the early stuff was captured as compared to the later bits you're likely after. People can still see the scene where proto-Allison meets Frederick Nietzsche though.
the origin of daylight savings time is basically that businesses realized they make more money when it is still daylight out as ppl are coming home from work. when the sun did not allow for this, they lobbied to change the clocks. it is often blamed on farmers but fun fact, it actually screws farmers' schedules and they hate it
Oh right that makes sense. Like someone said earlier farmers don't care what time it is, their schedule is from dusk till dawn, if they can see what they're doing they're working
It's actually because the train companies didn't want to spend money on the gas for the lights. It stated with Atlantic Canadian farmers though so that's where the farming thing comes from.
Woolie acting like a proud dad during the fighting game tournament section is so heartwarming lmao Edit: Within FOUR EPISODES this podcast went from two friends recommending each other fun stuff in a cool little nerd book club to them ACTUALLY getting ready to beat the shit out of each other IRL
Alongside the rest of the PCs: - Chakravartin Jagganoth, Wheel-Turning King, Red Eyed Heir, Pankrator, The God Eater, Bearer of the Word BLADE and Destroyer of the Seven-Part World; - Yabalchoath, Thief-Queen of the Shadeside Rim, Night-Walker, Life-Plucker; - 33 Judicious Rains Sear the Unrepentant.
I recommend you take a read on the comments under some KSBD's pages, some took a liking to Abbadon's writing and names, I swear you never saw someone ask a simple question and get the most confused answer from the weirdest account name
Regarding Earthbound, a few years ago I watched a guy on Twitch play through it. He hated it and was miserable the entire time. He was zooming through it, complaining about every design choice and quirk in the game. Then he got to Giygas at the end and the moment the fight started, he was hammering on Pray. Because he knew about the final fight by cultural osmosis and wanted to just be done with it all. What he didn't know was that you have to actually fight Giygas for awhile in an actual boss fight and deplete his HP until a cutscene happens where Porky taunts you to call for help, and after THAT, you can use Pray to end the fight. So this already salty player was smoldering with impotent rage that the spoiler he knew about the boss fight didn't let him instantly win, and that he had to actually fight the final boss of an rpg instead of instantly entering a cutscene due to his hasty use of incomplete foreknowledge. He viewed this, as a demerit towards the game. A preconceived notion he had a half memory about and blindly followed through on, was the GAME'S problem. Meanwhile, four months ago, I played through Earthbound with my friend and he was super into it. I gave him some vague hints about teddy bears, PP management and how to set up your backpacks, but mostly just hung out while he played. He got to the final fight blind and went through a similar situation to Woolie, and by the time credits were rolling, he was already planning to play Mother 3.
@@fluidthought42It sounds like it’s a game they were set on hating and/or felt they were forced to play. Game has its quirks and issues, but it’s hard to imagine someone forcing themselves to play through it being miserable.
It's crazy how hard they have speedrun the whole tragectory of a podcast that they are already at the "make a second one" stage Been enjoying the hell out of this
I am but a humble being. I see a new episode of Versus Wolves. I click on a new episode of Versus Wolves. I watch a new episode of Versus Wolfes. I am happy, since Versus Wolves exists.
I love the look of joy on Woolie's face when John asks him for commentary on his match. All memes and Kayfabe aside, all he wants is to share the thing he really loves with others and I think that's why he and John get along so well. Their greatest shared interest is sharing their interests. Also muscle ladies, but I digress.
season 2 is so damn fascinating as a follow up to season 1. I am so damn eager to hear Woolie's take on it and I really really hope he gets around to it.
It's amazing how fast this became my favorite podcast. John and Woolie bounce off of one another so well, and you can constantly tell how genuine their friendship is and how happy they are to be doing this show together. I hope it lasts a long time to come.
@@rossman8919 it’s definitely more focused on frieren picking up memories from her past and cherishing them, but there’s some good action interspersed within it. The last arc of the season is action heavy too.
Praise YISUN, another episode of Versus Wolves, this time with one of the most quotable comics of all time. "Royalty is an endless cutting motion," and all that.
"But remember, men like him have forgotten their mothers. Their feet do not touch the earth, and they grasp at feeble things. They are like a mangy dog fighting over a fetid corpse. They have forgotten that with their brothers, working together, they could bring down a magnificent ox." I hope more people will talk about this webcomic. It's so good. I'm fighting tooth and nail to get my buddy to read it.
KSBD is such a good one for this, especially because of the sheer depth of its story, worldbuilding, character arcs, and the philosophical framing and how it relates to Buddhism, Hinduism, and non-dualism generally. John definitely seems like the type that could really appreciate it even beyond it being a sick-ass shounen/isekai-style story that in a just world would get a killer animated adaptation.
I don't mean to offend when I ask this question, I thought Woolie doesn't like to talk about religion whenever having a podcast due to personal trauma when growing up (this made some episodes uncomfortable to watch when the comment section gets hostile against the subject). So I assumed those themes you mentioned that Woolie might just push them away. Edit: Watching more of the video, it seems the depth of the worldbuilding of the story appeals to him, so maybe that's the answer to my question.
@@leithaziz2716 I mean you'd have to ask Woolie, he seems to enjoy it just fine. Though, his trauma is very much based in Christianity, whereas KSBD is far more influenced by Buddhism and Hinduism and other east-Asian religions and philosophies than western ones. They're very different beasts, in terms of tone and theme and scale of mythos.
@@stargrace420 Sure. I am a young guy who's admittedly still struggling in learning Muslim teachings and history, but on a personal note I love learning about other cultures worldwide. I remember being big into Greek Mythology as a kid due to all the cool stories that were told in media.
@@leithaziz2716Woolie loves mythos, religious sociology and the artwork surrounding religion. He doesn't like talking about personal dogma or actual Judeo-Islamo-Christian religious experiences of real-world people in a positive light, specifically.
I love how "Reach Heaven through Violence" keeps coming up in K6BD. First as the literal meaning, "Kill a god to become one, rip divinity from their brow!" Then, later as with an internal meaning "Your true self can only be found though struggle." Finally, toward the end as a philosophical question of the world "If violence is the tool of both oppression and liberation, are we doomed to an endless cycle of death?" Edit: spoiler/correction "The Maybe Sword" is not the name of a weapon...
As someone who knows Woolie's tastes, and as someone who did a bit of Brazilian Jujitsu in their youth, Woolie is going to *love* this assignment. BJJ is about as close as you can get in the real world to fighting game mechanics. The entire fighting style is built around effectively taking turns between being the one grabbing and being the one breaking grab, and every hold you can go for has specific counter-play and reversals to memorize and execute. I know woolie loves his boxing, but woolie also loves hyper-realized anime boxing that is far more chess-like, and BJJ is the exact thing to scratch that itch. Flopping around the floor might not be as *stylish* to an observer, but, actually participating, he's gonna have a blast. He might get his shit pushed in, but he's gonna have a blast.
Like many people, I'd been recommended Kill 6 Billion Demons but never got around to reading it. Once John started narrating the opening pages, I decided to pause the video and give the comic a go, so as to better understand the conversation. I began the comic last night at 10 PM, planning to read for an hour, then maybe listen a little while to the podcast before going to sleep... I did not sleep until 8 AM because I am now up to date on K6BD! There has to be a follow up to this podcast because I NEED both John and Woolie to discuss the sickest shit that currently awaits them.
I can't believe John competed in a tournament with a broken finger. That's almost like the time Kurt Angle won three Olympic gold medals with a broken freakin' neck.
GOD I hope you two will keep on discussing KSBD as you get further into it because it just keeps on getting better the further you go and I'd love to hear your thoughts on it
Havent seen the vid yet but I just wanna say Vinland Saga and Kill 6 Billion Demons are one of my favorite works of fiction from an aesthetic and story standpoint, what I just realized is how oddly similar but different the core message of each series is- how you see the mc of both going through some insane levels of pain and somehow coming back each time slowly becoming more aware of themselves and becoming a "better person" in their own right and I absolutely LOVE that transformation and the INSANE ART that accompanies the story as a whole.
wrt "kill 6 billion demons", once i got the vibe of the setting, i always understood it as a title or name, much like the way the angels are named, and not as a command given to allison.
man i remember reading kill 6 billion demons when it was still an MSPAFanventure on the forums, and was basically a continuation of DyE Fantasy. So proud to see how it grew up!
As someone who loves these comics immensely, its wild how much they praise it and they didnt even reach the real peak parts of either. Like Vinland season 2 is incredible and they didnt even get to the REAL K6BD title drop.
I love Woolie's take about being able to appreciate an incredibly cool charismatic antagonistic figure while absolutely not forgiving them. Looking at you, Yotsuyu from FFXIV.
Incorporating your proposal with your partner's favourite thing is so heartwarming. The effort + thoughtfulness. Hope things went well for that couple.
I think this is the best format though so they can build up all their thoughts and experiences throughout the month to deliver these big juicy episodes
I ADORE the notions bit because I’ve caught myself doing the exact same shit with my folks, I just didn’t know there was a term for it! Also, I fully expect this podcast to finally end with John and Woolie having a Yakuza-style fight in the rain, manly tears and all.
This podcast convinced me to check out Kill 6 Billion Demons. Ended up bing'ing it from start up to its current update IN A SINGLE NIGHT. Thank you so much for recommending this, legit one of the best comics I've read in a looooong time.
2:36:06 I’m so glad they mentioned Inoue again. Even if his stuff isn’t that good, more people should keep an eye out for him. I got a feeling he might do something someday.
Pankrator Jagganoth is one of my favorite all time villains, his look, his prowess, his presence, and his motives, just all come together perfectly... to the point when I encounter villains who are not as well written I go "Why can't you be Jagganoth!"
The days when this podcast uploads, seeing this podcast in my notifications has genuinely been the highlight of that day all three times it has happened so far; and I am looking forward to it happening for many more times to come.
Exhausting all other resources until you use Pray out of desperation is how I beat Earthbound back in 1995. I don't even remember if I had the guide, but I do still have my physical copy so it's not a rental. I just ran out of anything else, so I tried it. That is by far the best experience I've had playing video games. Nothing like it has quite come there, and I totally get where Undertale and other Earthbound/Mother inspired games are coming from trying to capture that feeling.
The same artist for KSBD also made a TTRPG called "Lancer" and a warhammer-esque combat game called "MAGNAGOTHICA MALEGHAST". Those are also cool to check out.
I'm right there with you, John. It became overwhelming trying to do the index notes along with trying to absorb the K6BD world. I'm not turned off from reading but holy hell is this kinda story a lot to do at once.
I was that kid who played it when I was 12, and that game has shaped me a lot. It influenced my thoughts on life, ideas about darkness and happiness, and my perspective on traveling, emphasizing the importance of the people you meet on your journey. Also, this game gave me so many nightmares as a kid.
i feel like hearing the irish concept of "craic" and then hearing the irish concept of "notions" is like...these two concepts must be like mortal enemies or something, like you could make a spectrum chart from one to the other pretty easy
Woolie challenging EyepatchWolf to read K6BD got me to dive in as well. You should ask my partner I wouldn't shut up about how fucking awesome this comic is
On the point of casual forgiveness for villains or even good characters who have a temporary lapse in moral character, I am staunchly in Woolie's camp. Like he says, ya I'll admit that Askelad can be rad and cool as shit, but I NEVER forget in the back of my mind that this is a monster we are watching. Like there is a cosmic ledger of accounts that must and will be paid you can't just brush away with a redemption arc.
I appreciate the offer of another podcast, but between this, JeffJeff’s Bizarre Adventure, Well There’s Your Problem, Behind the Bastards, and A More Civilized Age, I really think I’m like. Fully good
(Honestly, Castle Super Beast would be up there too, but every time I listen to it, it’s like. There’s a 50/50 shot whether I’ll feel fine, or deeply sad. Deeply sad because of how everything with SBF turned out; not because they broke up, but because they broke up on such bad terms. I recognize it shouldn’t be an issue this many years after, but it’s still disappointing & uncomfortable. It’s like finding out the mythbusters hated each other, only at least in the mythbusters case Jamie and Adam still say they respected each other as coworkers; with SBF, all we got is “they are no longer friends”. I don’t know why I’m typing all this out and baring my soul about my stupid parasocial hang ups, but. Fuck it, I typed all this out, I’m not deleting it now.)
Good taste ya got there, I didn't know about that last one. BtB has been a hell of a ride the last few months, so much I didn't know about supposedly "Great" people, most of whom had all the pieces there to do wonderful things but just put them together wrong.
I cannot *wait* until you guys keep going on K6BD. It goes *hard,* and if you're interested, Tom also made a Tabletop RPG called Lancer that's basically K6BD's aesthetic as applied to Mech Combat, including the terrifying existential horror! It's a lot of fun!
thank you so much for talking about KSBD, i haven't been able to get into any anime, manga, or comics in a very long time and seeing the art and hearing you guys talk about how fucking cool this series is really made me actually go out and read it. i've made it to book 3 in like one sitting.
One of my favorite themes of Vinland saga is the end of period and the rise of a new one. The discussions about Christianity and how those concepts are completely foreign to the Vikings are fascinating to me.
As I understand it, Kill Six Billion Demons started as a quest on the MS Paint Adventures forum. The webcomic is a full reboot, and I'm told pretty different from the original quest, but there's still traces of the original and its format in the webcomic version. For example, Cio's full name (well not _full_ full, but fuller than just Cio), Ciocie Cioelle. Try to say that out loud. Yeah in the original quest, the readers named her Coca Cola, if what I'm told is correct.
The idea of notions is so real and genuinely oppressive and funny, Growing up it stopped me wearing any designs or band shirts cus "who do I think i am " xD
I power-read KSBD in a day and a half, reading the whole comic to the current end-page and the extra stuff on the bottom of the pages. More people need to read it, it is so amazing. Praise YISUN for giving it to us!
Having just caught up on K6BD today, I find it hilarious how comparable this Vinland Saga discussion of non-morality and the true measure of a warrior are to the philosophies in the later parts of K6BD and John and Woolie have no idea
My Kaori trauma moment was definitely the first few Minutes of Ghost in the Shell. I had no concept of what was actually happening and Im just watching Motoko explode this “innocent” guys head. I was at a friend’s house spending the night for the first time and I remember going to the bathroom and just weeping. I still think about that a lot. Somewhere around 7 years old.
Chapters and link to full timestamps added. 👍🏾
So glad i was able to watch the last episode of Versus Wolves 😂
Thank you!!
Where's the imgur link to the photo Jon!?
That imgur link to his injury was never added anywhere, but what an incredible story
@@Kydroup
Versus wolves popped off because it provides the ridiculous power fantasy of recommending something to a friend and they actually listen
Authors are so indulgent with their power fantasies lately
A little unrealistic but an alluring fantasy nonetheless
I'm trying to make it no longer a power fantasy by actually listening to my friends recommendations, the problem is that I haven't been able to make it work in the reverse
Says you, I reccomended One Piece to a friend and 2 years later they almost finished the anime.
This makes the toilet Isekai seem realistic
I love the dichotomy of Kill 6 Billion Demons “Reach Heaven through Violence” and Vinland Saga “No Man is My Enemy”
Woolie and Wolf's opposing philosophies in the Omicron saga.
The weird part is that they come to a lot of the same conclusions despite this
@@Delmworks It's not so weird. "Reach Heaven Through Violence" basically means to achieve self-actualization through struggle, not necessarily actual violence.
"Reach Heaven Through Violence" is about violence being a barrier to Heaven, not the method of reaching it.
@@MrMobiusfan thus far this doesn’t seem to be K6BD’s thesis on the subject matter.
Though we have admittedly gotten to the point in the story where that turn would make sense.
January 1st 2025, I'm expecting John and Woolie to be fighting shirtless in the rain on the top of the empire state building as the rest of the city is on fire.
It's the only way this podcast can end
For the final episode, they should do a 1-to-1 recreation of MGS4‘s final battle
With _It Has to be This Way_ playing in the background.
The fanfic writers are already taking notes
@@WandererReduxwe need the new hotness. Considering John’s first tournament and all, and the moment the song is tied to, Tekken 8’s Storm Rising would be more fitting. With a blend of Heat Haze
Why is Eyepatch Wolf such a natural tension builder? He can't approach anything directly, every story and every assignment has to build up the maximum amount of discomfort before providing any sort of relief, and that's why he's always such a delight to listen to.
No.
Yesh mae
nuh@@SevenIsaCannibal7
As he said, between the two of them, he's the video essayist. He used to writing fire.
Probably his pro wrestling background shining through
My mental image for this podcast is John and Woolie regularly meeting up in a police interrogation room and on the table is a single pistol labeled "Omikron"
also, I fully expect the inevitable fight this podcast is leading to is going to begin with one of them going "I recommend THESE HAND"
I feel like that's just every podcast now, except more pistols keep being placed on the table. There was a revolver labeled "Omikron" but now there's also a glock labeled "Boxing."
@@Orion_The_Merchant How long until "Rent A Girlfriend" and "all of Homestuck" get added to the table as shotguns
@@oriandthesleepytime watching the same episode 8 times shouldn't be as bad as Omikron or all of R-a-G
And John always has a very very visible gunshot scar that he draws attention to every so often.
The fuckin' NOTIONS on these guys to have a 3 hour podcast
Who the fuck do these two think they are?
3? Try 4 hours
It should be said, that Tom Bloom ran a tournament in the Kill Six Billion Demons world, where participants created their own characters, and then got pitted against each other. They then each had to draw a short comic showing how their character won the battle, and then the community would vote on who won. And it had an entire thing going on where people claimed parts of the world using these fights. (People Make Games has an entire video on this and it is amazing)
He then also designed his own TTRPG based on Kill Six Billion Demons.
He then went on to create Lancer together with Miguel Lopez. A mecha tabletop RPG that is just absolutely wonderful and has possibly as deep lore as Kill Six Billion Demons
He is now creating ICON a fantasy TTRPG, which is inspired by like Final Fantasy Tactics and other tactical RPGs.
Then he made Magnagothica, a gothic horror skirmish wargame where you play as necromancers fighting to get the End of Death.
And then finally he has created his magnum opus, the grandest work yet, the one page RPG "Goblin With a Fat Ass" where you play as a goblin with a fat ass that has to rob the richest person in town.
So in short this motherfucker is both an accomplished comic book artist and a prolific game designer and can do basically whatever they want and get away with it.
“Goblin with a Fat Ass piqued my interest way more than I ever expected
He really do be built different
Interesting, I might need to check out ICON. I've been trying to work on some board games/cards games myself, also inspired by tactics and final fantasy combat systems, so I'm always curious about what someone else is able to make.
@@thatoneguy5969 I can warmly recommend it, I ran a campaign of it's 1.45 playtest over six months and it was a blast. It is a game with a heavy tactical focus and with a lot of customization in what characters can do. In fact there is so much focus on that, that your raw stats don't change throughout the entire game, the only difference between first and max level are abilities, and it works so well.
@@thatoneguy5969There are a couple other Final Fantasy games worth checking out. Beacon uses the same system as ICON/Lancer, but gives you more tools to build your own setting and heroes.
Fabula Ultima adapts JRPG game design in the opposite direction, emulating the vibes and thematic experience rather than the mechanics. The rules are much lighter, embracing abstracted simplicity, but still allows for incredible customization. I’ve GMed two FabUlt campaigns and I love it!
"Reach heaven through violence" is a quote from the lessons of Vivec in morrowind. Abaddon used to be pretty active in the morrowind community from what I remember.
Fucking love the lessons, Kirkbride is such a nut
Kirkbride also gave his blessing to the comic somewhere around 2014 too
Oh yh, a lot of the ksbd side stories have big kirkbride energy
"... A night out with your friends gettin blitzed is not quite the heroes journey, but it can be!..."
*Not even a single beat missed*
"I grew up in Dublin Woolie."
Literally the city that gave us _Ulysses_ lol
I think you misunderstood Bjorn's relationship with Askeladd. Bjorn did not want to kill him, he wanted Askeladd to mercy kill him in a duel so that he can go to Valhallah. In fact Bjorn last words was him wanting acknowledgement from Askeladd that they were real friends in the end.
And whether in a moment of sincerity or a rare moment of empathy, Askeladd confirms they were friends. Whether Askeladd really meant it is debatable, but it's clear he cared enough about Bjorn to give him some small comfort before his death.
Honestly feel like getting a "Vinland Saga vs Kill 6 Billion Demons" Volume 2 would be extremely fun at some point since it's a pair with so much to offer even after this initial coverage.
I feel like that's what the other podcast is for.
@@jagehtso The other podcast?
yes please, I really wanted to see Woolie's opinions on redemption arcs after vinland season 2
I'd kill for a live reaction shot of John reading through the origin story of Solomon David in KSBD. That seems like *exactly* his kind of thing.
It being monthly makes every episode feel like a gift, not a routine
K6BD LETTTSS GOOOOOOOOOO!
REACH HEAVEN THROUGH VIOLENCE.
We out here getting isekai'ed, throwing hands with demiurges, and achieving Royalty
@@stargrace420 I have Metis sword manual engraved in my actual sword (not all of it obvs)
Kill the lie called I.
Funny place to get a tattoo @@pluemas
@@kenjithewizard4980 the pain was worth it, much like shaving my hair off with a dull sword, for I do not contain a peasants soul (although I do cook good noodles).
It still amazes me that K6BD started out in its earliest form as a fuckin adventure thread on the official homestuck forums before they got blown off the face of the earth.
Does anyone have archives of that? I never got to finish reading it..
I see that you would know lol
@@Inojin67 Certain pages are findable on Wayback Machine, but a lot of it is lost media. Unfortunately for you, more of the early stuff was captured as compared to the later bits you're likely after.
People can still see the scene where proto-Allison meets Frederick Nietzsche though.
Proto-Allison getting Grimdrunk within the stomach of a demon.
I miss that forum so much.
the origin of daylight savings time is basically that businesses realized they make more money when it is still daylight out as ppl are coming home from work. when the sun did not allow for this, they lobbied to change the clocks. it is often blamed on farmers but fun fact, it actually screws farmers' schedules and they hate it
oh awesome i hate it even more now! thank you for the info
Besides, most farmers set thier own schedule anyways and don't even care what time it is except for days where they need to go into town.
Nah we should have perma-DST. Let the sun be out at normal human hours, not just when we are trapped at work.
Oh right that makes sense. Like someone said earlier farmers don't care what time it is, their schedule is from dusk till dawn, if they can see what they're doing they're working
It's actually because the train companies didn't want to spend money on the gas for the lights. It stated with Atlantic Canadian farmers though so that's where the farming thing comes from.
Woolie acting like a proud dad during the fighting game tournament section is so heartwarming lmao
Edit: Within FOUR EPISODES this podcast went from two friends recommending each other fun stuff in a cool little nerd book club to them ACTUALLY getting ready to beat the shit out of each other IRL
Like all good friendships should be.
"82 white chain born in emptyness returns to subdue evil"
Ah, an Exalted player.
Alongside the rest of the PCs:
- Chakravartin Jagganoth, Wheel-Turning King, Red Eyed Heir, Pankrator, The God Eater, Bearer of the Word BLADE and Destroyer of the Seven-Part World;
- Yabalchoath, Thief-Queen of the Shadeside Rim, Night-Walker, Life-Plucker;
- 33 Judicious Rains Sear the Unrepentant.
I recommend you take a read on the comments under some KSBD's pages, some took a liking to Abbadon's writing and names, I swear you never saw someone ask a simple question and get the most confused answer from the weirdest account name
Putting this here 3:31:25 because this call for help is pretty deep into the video.
Regarding Earthbound, a few years ago I watched a guy on Twitch play through it. He hated it and was miserable the entire time. He was zooming through it, complaining about every design choice and quirk in the game.
Then he got to Giygas at the end and the moment the fight started, he was hammering on Pray. Because he knew about the final fight by cultural osmosis and wanted to just be done with it all. What he didn't know was that you have to actually fight Giygas for awhile in an actual boss fight and deplete his HP until a cutscene happens where Porky taunts you to call for help, and after THAT, you can use Pray to end the fight.
So this already salty player was smoldering with impotent rage that the spoiler he knew about the boss fight didn't let him instantly win, and that he had to actually fight the final boss of an rpg instead of instantly entering a cutscene due to his hasty use of incomplete foreknowledge. He viewed this, as a demerit towards the game. A preconceived notion he had a half memory about and blindly followed through on, was the GAME'S problem.
Meanwhile, four months ago, I played through Earthbound with my friend and he was super into it. I gave him some vague hints about teddy bears, PP management and how to set up your backpacks, but mostly just hung out while he played. He got to the final fight blind and went through a similar situation to Woolie, and by the time credits were rolling, he was already planning to play Mother 3.
DSP behavior
I mean, the inventory system is miserable. Other than that though... I just don't know how you complain about Earthbound.
@@fluidthought42It sounds like it’s a game they were set on hating and/or felt they were forced to play. Game has its quirks and issues, but it’s hard to imagine someone forcing themselves to play through it being miserable.
This is going to end with Woolie and John fighting to the death in the back of a Denny's parking lot.
Best podcast I've ever listened to.
They have no idea how hard the Salami Dave arc goes in K6BD.
*Susumu Hirasawa's Technique of Relief playing softly in background*
The what?
@@donutholebandit6212 the chad Salami dave's arc. Actually the comic gets way better during the heist arc, but the salami dave arc is godly.
@@silverphoenix4934 Then there's the depression arc that builds up to the hardest title drop of all time.
I have now caught up and i know the majesty of My Father, Salami Dave.
God, he's cool. But also awful.
But so cool.
I like how John instantly gets so much more Irish at 14:33
It's crazy how hard they have speedrun the whole tragectory of a podcast that they are already at the "make a second one" stage
Been enjoying the hell out of this
I am but a humble being. I see a new episode of Versus Wolves. I click on a new episode of Versus Wolves. I watch a new episode of Versus Wolfes. I am happy, since Versus Wolves exists.
Woolie VS Brazilian Jiu-jitsu will be so wholesome if this turns into a lifelong passion alongside kite flying
I love the look of joy on Woolie's face when John asks him for commentary on his match.
All memes and Kayfabe aside, all he wants is to share the thing he really loves with others and I think that's why he and John get along so well. Their greatest shared interest is sharing their interests.
Also muscle ladies, but I digress.
It's straight up GOG TIME SON (with your pal, Gog Agog. Gog of the Agog and Gog of Gog Agog)
I'm agog of if Gog Agog
Not gog-Agog though, Gog-Agog is still mad at gog
The current Agog arc is the good shit
@@plufimGog
Gog damn it.
YOOOOOOOOOOOOO
REACH HEAVEN THROUGH VIOLENCE
This is not the message to take from Vinland Saga lololol
@@TheOldYoungOne read Kill Six Billion Demons
@@TheOldYoungOne yeah it's pretty funny how Vinland Saga is the literal exact opposite tagline.
@@dappernecromancer5364yeah after seeing that one panel of the lady being separated into 5 layers I was sold
John's knowing smiles during that entire Vinland Saga discussion were absolutely delicious! Really hope we get a season 2 follow up later on!
season 2 is so damn fascinating as a follow up to season 1. I am so damn eager to hear Woolie's take on it and I really really hope he gets around to it.
It's so good! SO GOOD
I’m sad Willie didn’t read it instead.
It's amazing how fast this became my favorite podcast. John and Woolie bounce off of one another so well, and you can constantly tell how genuine their friendship is and how happy they are to be doing this show together. I hope it lasts a long time to come.
kill 6 billion demons was the alternative title to Frieren
I miss Frieren Fridays…
More like “6 Billion Demons Kill Themselves.”
i watched 2 episodes of frieren and couldnt get into it, i assumed it was just slice of life, does the story pick up soon after?
@@rossman8919 it’s definitely more focused on frieren picking up memories from her past and cherishing them, but there’s some good action interspersed within it. The last arc of the season is action heavy too.
@@MostLikelyMortal how much of it focuses on the blue haired hero ? hes the only character i dont like
Praise YISUN, another episode of Versus Wolves, this time with one of the most quotable comics of all time.
"Royalty is an endless cutting motion," and all that.
"But remember, men like him have forgotten their mothers. Their feet do not touch the earth, and they grasp at feeble things. They are like a mangy dog fighting over a fetid corpse. They have forgotten that with their brothers, working together, they could bring down a magnificent ox."
I hope more people will talk about this webcomic. It's so good. I'm fighting tooth and nail to get my buddy to read it.
Knowing how Woolie feels about Vagabond, I definitely want to hear his thoughts on the second season of Vinland
I wanted Woolie to read it but then I remembered that Yukimura drank stupid juice after farmland.
KSBD is such a good one for this, especially because of the sheer depth of its story, worldbuilding, character arcs, and the philosophical framing and how it relates to Buddhism, Hinduism, and non-dualism generally. John definitely seems like the type that could really appreciate it even beyond it being a sick-ass shounen/isekai-style story that in a just world would get a killer animated adaptation.
I don't mean to offend when I ask this question, I thought Woolie doesn't like to talk about religion whenever having a podcast due to personal trauma when growing up (this made some episodes uncomfortable to watch when the comment section gets hostile against the subject).
So I assumed those themes you mentioned that Woolie might just push them away.
Edit: Watching more of the video, it seems the depth of the worldbuilding of the story appeals to him, so maybe that's the answer to my question.
@@leithaziz2716 I mean you'd have to ask Woolie, he seems to enjoy it just fine. Though, his trauma is very much based in Christianity, whereas KSBD is far more influenced by Buddhism and Hinduism and other east-Asian religions and philosophies than western ones. They're very different beasts, in terms of tone and theme and scale of mythos.
@@stargrace420 Sure. I am a young guy who's admittedly still struggling in learning Muslim teachings and history, but on a personal note I love learning about other cultures worldwide. I remember being big into Greek Mythology as a kid due to all the cool stories that were told in media.
@@leithaziz2716Woolie loves mythos, religious sociology and the artwork surrounding religion. He doesn't like talking about personal dogma or actual Judeo-Islamo-Christian religious experiences of real-world people in a positive light, specifically.
I love how "Reach Heaven through Violence" keeps coming up in K6BD. First as the literal meaning, "Kill a god to become one, rip divinity from their brow!" Then, later as with an internal meaning "Your true self can only be found though struggle." Finally, toward the end as a philosophical question of the world "If violence is the tool of both oppression and liberation, are we doomed to an endless cycle of death?"
Edit: spoiler/correction
"The Maybe Sword" is not the name of a weapon...
K6BD is a lesson in makimg your world baller as fuck and metal as hell
Thank you for talking about Kill 6 Billion Demons, I never hear it talked about or see it anywhere and it's sooooooo good!
When John gets to the tournament arc he's going to lose his fucking mind
As someone who knows Woolie's tastes, and as someone who did a bit of Brazilian Jujitsu in their youth, Woolie is going to *love* this assignment.
BJJ is about as close as you can get in the real world to fighting game mechanics. The entire fighting style is built around effectively taking turns between being the one grabbing and being the one breaking grab, and every hold you can go for has specific counter-play and reversals to memorize and execute. I know woolie loves his boxing, but woolie also loves hyper-realized anime boxing that is far more chess-like, and BJJ is the exact thing to scratch that itch. Flopping around the floor might not be as *stylish* to an observer, but, actually participating, he's gonna have a blast. He might get his shit pushed in, but he's gonna have a blast.
Like many people, I'd been recommended Kill 6 Billion Demons but never got around to reading it. Once John started narrating the opening pages, I decided to pause the video and give the comic a go, so as to better understand the conversation. I began the comic last night at 10 PM, planning to read for an hour, then maybe listen a little while to the podcast before going to sleep...
I did not sleep until 8 AM because I am now up to date on K6BD! There has to be a follow up to this podcast because I NEED both John and Woolie to discuss the sickest shit that currently awaits them.
became royalty pilled
Royalty is a continuous reading motion
Reach heaven through sleepiness.
I can't believe John competed in a tournament with a broken finger. That's almost like the time Kurt Angle won three Olympic gold medals with a broken freakin' neck.
GOD I hope you two will keep on discussing KSBD as you get further into it because it just keeps on getting better the further you go and I'd love to hear your thoughts on it
I know right? The heist? The slice of life moments? The fucking tournament????
@@plufimThe THING that happens right after the tournament!
Havent seen the vid yet but I just wanna say Vinland Saga and Kill 6 Billion Demons are one of my favorite works of fiction from an aesthetic and story standpoint, what I just realized is how oddly similar but different the core message of each series is- how you see the mc of both going through some insane levels of pain and somehow coming back each time slowly becoming more aware of themselves and becoming a "better person" in their own right and I absolutely LOVE that transformation and the INSANE ART that accompanies the story as a whole.
Imo, they've only tried actually fighting one demiurge to the death, and it ended... Not well.
The art style of K6BD is like a combination of Aeon Flux and Dorohedoro
John is such an amazing storyteller
That entire tournament arc had me on edge
wrt "kill 6 billion demons", once i got the vibe of the setting, i always understood it as a title or name, much like the way the angels are named, and not as a command given to allison.
they had me at "two idiots gushing for an hour over a comic book" signed up immediately
Initialize Friendship at risk Protocol
man i remember reading kill 6 billion demons when it was still an MSPAFanventure on the forums, and was basically a continuation of DyE Fantasy. So proud to see how it grew up!
Oh boy, time for a new episode of 2 frenemies recommending things very intensley
As someone who loves these comics immensely, its wild how much they praise it and they didnt even reach the real peak parts of either. Like Vinland season 2 is incredible and they didnt even get to the REAL K6BD title drop.
Watching Woolie's whole thing on forgiveness while looking at John's face clearly thinking "ohhh season 2" is just incredible
I love Woolie's take about being able to appreciate an incredibly cool charismatic antagonistic figure while absolutely not forgiving them. Looking at you, Yotsuyu from FFXIV.
Incorporating your proposal with your partner's favourite thing is so heartwarming. The effort + thoughtfulness. Hope things went well for that couple.
23:20 the dizzying swiftness with which genuine concern for a friend's possibly permanent injury got overridden by HYPE FOR FIGHTING GAME
Does... does Woolie not know that Kill 6 Billion Demons is still ongoing?
THEY FINALLY RETURN. The time between episodes is understandable but DAMN id be lying if i said i didn’t want more
I think this is the best format though so they can build up all their thoughts and experiences throughout the month to deliver these big juicy episodes
Oh man, Woolie doesn't even know how Wooliecore K6BD becomes.
REACH HEAVEN THROUGH VIOLENCE, YEAHHHH
I ADORE the notions bit because I’ve caught myself doing the exact same shit with my folks, I just didn’t know there was a term for it!
Also, I fully expect this podcast to finally end with John and Woolie having a Yakuza-style fight in the rain, manly tears and all.
Minor request for timestamps/bookmarks in these? Its real hard to scrub to points to rewatch or find something specific without a lot of visual cues.
Eyepatch Wolf is such a fantastic storyteller
WE REACHING ROYALTY WITH THIS ONE THIS TIME BOYS!!
I'm begging on my knees for you people to update us on your KSBD thoughts/opinions throughout this podcast
I agree!!!
This podcast convinced me to check out Kill 6 Billion Demons. Ended up bing'ing it from start up to its current update IN A SINGLE NIGHT. Thank you so much for recommending this, legit one of the best comics I've read in a looooong time.
gog agog agog?
Honestly hyped for these two to experience the rest of K6BD - it honestly just keeps elevating throughout it's run.
I enjoy this podcast because I can listen to it in short, random intervals, and whenever I finish an episode, there's always a new one available.
2:36:06 I’m so glad they mentioned Inoue again. Even if his stuff isn’t that good, more people should keep an eye out for him. I got a feeling he might do something someday.
Pankrator Jagganoth is one of my favorite all time villains, his look, his prowess, his presence, and his motives, just all come together perfectly... to the point when I encounter villains who are not as well written I go "Why can't you be Jagganoth!"
The days when this podcast uploads, seeing this podcast in my notifications has genuinely been the highlight of that day all three times it has happened so far; and I am looking forward to it happening for many more times to come.
This podcast means a lot for me life has sucked recently but this does bring me joy
Thank you for doing this
Pity the Dragon! Venerate the Count!
IA! IA!
IA IA
IA!
REACH HEAVEN THROUGH VIOLENCE
The only pieces of worldbuilding that ever struck me as much as K6BD were The Malazan Book of the Fallen series and a webnovel called GODCLADS.
Yoooo Malazan was my shit
I FELT THE TINGLE
I bet it jumped
John has good taste, because we all love Ciocie Cioelle
Exhausting all other resources until you use Pray out of desperation is how I beat Earthbound back in 1995. I don't even remember if I had the guide, but I do still have my physical copy so it's not a rental. I just ran out of anything else, so I tried it.
That is by far the best experience I've had playing video games. Nothing like it has quite come there, and I totally get where Undertale and other Earthbound/Mother inspired games are coming from trying to capture that feeling.
The same artist for KSBD also made a TTRPG called "Lancer" and a warhammer-esque combat game called "MAGNAGOTHICA MALEGHAST". Those are also cool to check out.
CASTIGATE THE GODHEAD!
He's also developing a TTRPG called ICON
@@Jumungous I have seen that now and I'm so excited for it to come out officially.
I'm right there with you, John. It became overwhelming trying to do the index notes along with trying to absorb the K6BD world. I'm not turned off from reading but holy hell is this kinda story a lot to do at once.
That raven is so sick, he uses heat so well
Waiting for Woolie to make Jon get into kiting now.
I was that kid who played it when I was 12, and that game has shaped me a lot. It influenced my thoughts on life, ideas about darkness and happiness, and my perspective on traveling, emphasizing the importance of the people you meet on your journey. Also, this game gave me so many nightmares as a kid.
i feel like hearing the irish concept of "craic" and then hearing the irish concept of "notions" is like...these two concepts must be like mortal enemies or something, like you could make a spectrum chart from one to the other pretty easy
Woolie challenging EyepatchWolf to read K6BD got me to dive in as well. You should ask my partner I wouldn't shut up about how fucking awesome this comic is
On the point of casual forgiveness for villains or even good characters who have a temporary lapse in moral character, I am staunchly in Woolie's camp. Like he says, ya I'll admit that Askelad can be rad and cool as shit, but I NEVER forget in the back of my mind that this is a monster we are watching. Like there is a cosmic ledger of accounts that must and will be paid you can't just brush away with a redemption arc.
I appreciate the offer of another podcast, but between this, JeffJeff’s Bizarre Adventure, Well There’s Your Problem, Behind the Bastards, and A More Civilized Age, I really think I’m like. Fully good
(Honestly, Castle Super Beast would be up there too, but every time I listen to it, it’s like. There’s a 50/50 shot whether I’ll feel fine, or deeply sad.
Deeply sad because of how everything with SBF turned out; not because they broke up, but because they broke up on such bad terms.
I recognize it shouldn’t be an issue this many years after, but it’s still disappointing & uncomfortable. It’s like finding out the mythbusters hated each other, only at least in the mythbusters case Jamie and Adam still say they respected each other as coworkers; with SBF, all we got is “they are no longer friends”.
I don’t know why I’m typing all this out and baring my soul about my stupid parasocial hang ups, but. Fuck it, I typed all this out, I’m not deleting it now.)
Good taste ya got there, I didn't know about that last one. BtB has been a hell of a ride the last few months, so much I didn't know about supposedly "Great" people, most of whom had all the pieces there to do wonderful things but just put them together wrong.
I'm glad I got to the end of book 3 of Kill 6 Billion Demons in time for the episode. Amazing stuff!
I cannot *wait* until you guys keep going on K6BD. It goes *hard,* and if you're interested, Tom also made a Tabletop RPG called Lancer that's basically K6BD's aesthetic as applied to Mech Combat, including the terrifying existential horror! It's a lot of fun!
If you like Vinland Saga, I would really recommend the comic “Northlander”
It’s a pretty cool comic about Vikings, and life.
Actually a town in Canada called Port Arthur, Ontario was the first place in the world to use Daylights Saving
IT WAS CANADA ALL ALONG
This is probably one of the most popular videos about K6BD on youtube and i am FUCKING FOR IT
thank you so much for talking about KSBD, i haven't been able to get into any anime, manga, or comics in a very long time and seeing the art and hearing you guys talk about how fucking cool this series is really made me actually go out and read it. i've made it to book 3 in like one sitting.
One of my favorite themes of Vinland saga is the end of period and the rise of a new one. The discussions about Christianity and how those concepts are completely foreign to the Vikings are fascinating to me.
As I understand it, Kill Six Billion Demons started as a quest on the MS Paint Adventures forum. The webcomic is a full reboot, and I'm told pretty different from the original quest, but there's still traces of the original and its format in the webcomic version. For example, Cio's full name (well not _full_ full, but fuller than just Cio), Ciocie Cioelle. Try to say that out loud.
Yeah in the original quest, the readers named her Coca Cola, if what I'm told is correct.
She is named how Coca Cola is spelled.
The idea of notions is so real and genuinely oppressive and funny, Growing up it stopped me wearing any designs or band shirts cus "who do I think i am " xD
I power-read KSBD in a day and a half, reading the whole comic to the current end-page and the extra stuff on the bottom of the pages. More people need to read it, it is so amazing. Praise YISUN for giving it to us!
When the fighting game footage started this became main screen content
Having just caught up on K6BD today, I find it hilarious how comparable this Vinland Saga discussion of non-morality and the true measure of a warrior are to the philosophies in the later parts of K6BD and John and Woolie have no idea
My Kaori trauma moment was definitely the first few Minutes of Ghost in the Shell. I had no concept of what was actually happening and Im just watching Motoko explode this “innocent” guys head. I was at a friend’s house spending the night for the first time and I remember going to the bathroom and just weeping. I still think about that a lot. Somewhere around 7 years old.