Springfield Echelon vs Beretta APX A1
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- Опубликовано: 23 авг 2023
- #justinopinion #gunreview #shooting
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I just bought a APX A1 for $288 with the rebate from Beretta. Low recoil and accurate, getting one for that price is a no brainer.
You and I must have had got the exact deal from the same store. That was also my cost after tax, rebate, and shipping. How is yours doing? My first shots had terrible failure to eject. A few for me and pretty much every shot for my wife. I have to try different ammo still, but it's the worst first shots I've ever seen out of any gun.
@bkpugsley did you do a complete cleaning first or just shoot it straight out of box? Was just curious
@@TADDs101 Yeah I did an initial cleaning but I took it back out with some different ammo and it performed flawlessly. I blame the ammo I used first. With the second trip, I even held it lightly trying to make it jam and it wouldn't. So I think it loosened up and is good. I'll try the PMC Bronze ammo again and see if it still malfunctions or eats it up now as well.
@@bkpugsleyhow was it after trying the ammunition again?
@kingcarter2727 Sorry for the late reply but I didn't have anymore of the same PMC ammo but I racked the slide a ton, loaded my mags up and let them sit a few days and fired some old +p HPs and some Winchester 115 grain FMJ and haven't had an issue since. I even tried holding it loosely to make it jam and it wouldn't. So it's possible that it was weak ammo and then a stiff new gun combined, but I'm good. My rebate arrived as well yesterday so it truly was $249 new before tax. Can't beat that deal!
For the specs you show the APX A1 mag capacity at 10/15/17 but Beretta also has 21 round mags for it too. I have a APX A1 with almost 4K rounds thru it and it's never jammed. I'll take it over a G17 anyday of the week.
Never shot the Springfield but the APX is a great gun. Could be my favorite polymer pistol
Beretta hands down for me you won’t have to worry about the APX A1 magazines dumping your round all over the ground like the echelon
Yes. That surprises me. With all the "rigorous" testing Springfield did on this gun you would think that 20rd mag dump problem would have been spotted & corrected pre- distribution. Red flag imo🚩
Love my APX1. I made this choice after holding 8-10 other handguns such as Sig, CZ, PDP, S&W, etc... but the way APX looks and feels, and the weight distribution not being barrel-heavy.. and the price! I went for APX! My first handgun btw
VolksStokes Beretta is my personal favorite manufacturer
FYI-The Beretta is also modular. It seemed after watching the video that you referenced only the Echelon as modular...
I caught that too. Not sure how a removable FCU isn't modular...
I have the berreta apx a1 I would trust my life on this gun.
Beretta all day long. Springfield makes great stuff it’s just not on the higher level like Beretta
Thanks for this video. These are the two pistols that I am most interested in of late.
Hope you found some useful information here to help you.
Love your opening! Like the comparison.Thanks.
Enjoyable review as always Justin. I think this SA is going to have a lot of options coming out and the ability to remove the trigger group is awesome for changing grips.
You can remove the APX trigger system as well.
Thank you for doing this comparison video. Some of the challenges I see with the new Echelon is the availability of different frames, and the apparent issues with the magazines. I had the Beretta APX Centurion in 40 S&W and did love it. The challenges with the APX was it was not optic ready as well as difficulty in finding a holster for it. With that said I would not choose either the Echelon or the new APX. I would lean more toward the Beretta 92X series.
There aren't any mag issues with the Echelon. The Mag Extension was just installed improperly either by the factory or by individual users. It's a very easy thing to fix. But the lack of Frames is valid. There's a ton supposed to be coming out soon, but no idea when yet.
I have not experienced any magazine issues and will continue to test that. As far as frames go, I think for any new product line it takes a minute for those to trickle into the marketplace. The P320 was out for ages before options started to come. I'll be amazed if the Echelon is not very well supported in that regard.
Safariland makes holsters for the APX
Consumer (i.e., market) demand should address your concerns about frame availability. The (extended) magazine issue probably has already been fixed by Springfield Armory.
The magazine thing is so dumb. It's a baseplate issue, the mags feed fine. Acting like that's a demerit against the gun is just weird.
HS Produkt made a great gun, but they should have made sure the baseplates were being installed properly and made sure they weren't excessively easy to remove.
The Beretta is modular as well. I carry a Centurion daily with the competition springs, and I only paid 330.00 total for it. When it first came out it was the only modular pistol besides the P320, and people made fun of its look until Walther and now Springfield copied it.
Thanks for the comparison video and the chuckle you gave me about the incorrect pronunciation of "ambidextrous". Every time I hear a big gun-tuber add the "i" at the end I die a little bit inside!
I’ve been wondering how these two would stack up to each other! You read my mind!
Those Springfield pistols made by HS PRODUKT in Croatia are excellent.
Good comparison. Two of my favorite pistols. Maybe because it has more rounds through it but I feel the APX A1 has a better trigger than the Echelon. Like them both though.
I still don’t understand the massive amount of hype around the echelon. The APX does everything the echelon does and is much cheaper. The 320 allows you to actually use the modularity and customize your gun with a large aftermarket support. The only thing about the echelon is the optics mounting system which isn’t that big of a deal imo as long as it’s not the MOS system lol. I just don’t get why people are acting like this is some game changing handgun.
Thank you for point on “ambidextrous” guns. It drives me crazy too as a left-handed shooter.
Thank you for the review. This was interesting and I had hoped for a better result from the APX A1. Not that it was bad but for the pistols you had (which may very well be accurate representations of the entire line) the Echelon did perform better.
An interesting review for me would be the Beretta APX versus the APX A1 or the APX Carry versus he APX A1 Carry. Beretta has made claims of better grip frames for the full size and better triggers for both. I am curious if there really is an improvement between the two versions or if it is just different cosmetics.
Interesting comparison, thanks.
You're welcome!
I have the APX and APXA1 with Burris Fastfire 3. Fantastic weapons. I like the Springfield but just don't need it lol
I was going to get the APX A1 when I seen it but I ended up spending more and getting the PX4 Storm LTT version
@dylangardner5502 I have the standard PX4 COMPACT 9mm also and love it.
Great match up Thanks
I'm one that went knee deep with the Beretta APX and APX a1. The Echelon (at least for now) has the same almost fatal flaw as the Beretta. The proprietary accessory range for each pistol. But Beretta is worse. Especially when you buy sights for your A1 from Beretta and they don't fit. But all in all, both are awesome pistols. But I think Springfield/HS Produkt waited with the Echelon to see the public response of the Beretta. And it was smart.
But I've had both side by side, too. The Beretta is slightly better built, but though the Echelon costs more, it's more gun for the money,
I think your aiming issue was that the ergos on those two back to back is polarizing different. I did that when comparing the Apx to the Glock 17.
APX Tactical for the win imo. Both are solid tools as both brands know what quality is.
Great review. Thanks for sharing this information.
I have both, and even though I WANT to like the Echelon more, I keep going back to the Beretta and for some reason have come to prefer it over time. The APX A1 is just so comfortable to hold and I really like the way it shoots!
Any good deals on the apx?
@@magno408_1 My local Cabelas just had the full size and compact on sale, and Sportsman's Warehouse has them listed for $399. And Beretta extended their $100 rebate through Mar 31, 2024. $299 for any APX is a great deal.
Which one manages recoil better in your opinion?
Thanks Justin enjoyed the video
Love my Echelon!! It’s a great shooter!
Great comparative review. Now please compare the Echelon to the IWI Masada which is also an ambidextrous chassis based striker fire pistol from a proven go to war company and which is similarly priced (less) like the Beretta Apx A1 and weighs similar to or lighter than the Echelon. I would also like to see the Masada compared with the APX A1 as they are so similar). The Echelon vs the non chassis based Fully Ambi Champ HK VP9 would be great to see. Also , actually demonstrating the full ambidexterity of the guns and their symmetrical control use is important to see. The number of firearms that have slide release/ slide locks on both sides but have far worse activation in left handed use such as the M&P or CZ P10C is way too common and frustrating. Thanks!!
wow i have the Berretta APX AI Compact and love that gun and now i just bought the Springfield Echelon 4.5" but shooting it this weekend for the firs time can't wait
I think it's the best new gun introduced in a long time - let me know what you think!
ok you bet@@JustinOpinionChannel
Interesting. I'm hoping for a head to head comparison of the Echelon and the SIG P320/M17.
Lookin sharp again. Like the clean cut look
Small bag of groceries or gas in your lawnmower 😆 🤣 nailed it
The echelon is hands-down, my favorite pistol I’ve ever owned so far. This gun does it all for me. I have a thin frame so weight of a gun plays a big part for me. I can carry it all day with no problem. My carry ammo is liberty ultra lite so that cuts the weight down also. I almost bought the apx because of the deals that have been going on. But decided to get what I really wanted which was the echelon. I wish I could have the u-notch sights on all my firearms. You can’t go wrong with either gun.
This is EXACTLY the comparison I wanted to see Justin. When I saw the Echelon introduced, it reminded me in many ways of the APX A1. I love the APX family in many ways, but I did pick up the Echelon and I think I like it a touch more.
You could tell BEFORE he went to the range he was going to favor the Echelon. What gave it away was him saying he liked the "U" rear site
The Masada comes close in comparison too in my opinion. It doesn't get much attention, just like the Beretta.
Thanks for the video. Echelon will be my next pistol - when it will be available in my country 🙂. Greetings from Poland
Good review. I'm a lefty and have adapted my "lefty-ness" to the mostly right handed world. I don't really care if a firearm is ambidextrous. I only really care about the fit and feel.:) I'm a left-handed, former Marine. I've been adapting and overcoming all of my adult life...:) The original Beretta APX in my view, is one of the best looking, best handling, and best designed firearms, ever...:)
I have a med hand, got large frame with aggressive texture and small backstrap, prefect, I have sand paper grips on all my pistols, not needed with their aggressive texture grip module
Hi Justin, I recently bought an Echelon. I really love this pistol. After the first 300 rounds, I noticed the optic plate screws came loose. After taking it home and cleaning it, I put blue lock tight on the screws, snugged them down. I took it out the following week and after 200 rounds the screws came loose again. So, I took it home cleaned it and this time, put blue lock tight down the screw holes and snugged the screws up. I have not shot it since then. So, my question to you is, did you find the optics plate screws coming loose on your Echelon when you were shooting it? Thank you!
The "modularity" is only as good as the manufacturer and aftermarket commitment to make accessories and parts available en masse. This is where the P320/P365 has succeeded. The Beretta, sadly, not so much (which sucks, because it's a supremely underrated gun). The Echelon's future in this area is yet to be determined - depends how fast SA and the aftermarket are able bring innovative and interesting options to market (grip modules - and not just in different colors, but sizes, styles, and materials, holsters, etc.)
Agree - and have an optimistic feeling about it.
Sig has not surpassed beretta.
Beretta for me!
Funny, I decided to rent these two pistols the last time I was at my gun club. Had exactly the same issue with the Beretta's sights. I'm more interested in the compact versions of these, so I'll have to wait to see if Springfield releases one.
Beretta have combat sights. Not really my favorite thing from them as I don't want to center the target directly behind the dot on front irons. On my original APX I swapped out the stock sights for adjustable fiber optic sights to alleviate that problem. On my APX A1 I went with a Trijicon RMR. Both now shoot exactly how I want them and they have been flawless in operation.
@@proverbialmind_spread9421did the Trujicon RMR fit or did you need a optic plate?
@@spidermonkeynuts3851 Any optic you choose for the APX A1 will need a plate.
“Ambi Ready” for beretta means Ambi slide stop with a swappable mag release.
Beretta also has 21 round mags for APX. Great vid I like both.
Yep, good point
Justin is the only one telling the truth about the super high hold beyond 12 o'clock hold!
I know, I know, really late to the comment section... The first time I picked up an Echelon was at a promo for it that was tied in to a competition at my local range. At the time I was shooting a Masada and a VP9, and while I shot the Echelon really well, what really stood out about it for me was how plasticky it felt compared to other pistols I'd handled. I later ended up buying an APX A1 Compact, put a dot on it and it's my EDC now. I don't remember whether it's also sighted for a combat hold at its sighted-in-range (cover the target with front sight), but with a dot it's very accurate. It would be nice if more companies at least let you know what distance the sights are dialed in for with a particular hold. So far only my Masada's instructions give that information (25 yd combat hold).
Great matchup
I currently only have the Beretta APX A1 Tactical, I love it. I put a green dot on (optics plate is only $30 from Beretta), so I never fired it with sights. It would have been nice to see your comparison of each with red/green dot sights zeroed to your distance. You didn't mention that although it isn't as easy to remove the fire control group from the APX, it too is modular. I have lusted after the Echelon and I'm sure it is a pleasure to shoot as well. Thanks for your video.
Great video comparison!! I'm leaving more towards the Springfield Armory Echelon!! I hope to see more videos with the threaded barrel Echelon with the tritium night sights. It should be noted that I love that last scene of the overhead view of you shooting both guns and the shells ejecting!!
I just bought an APX A1 Compact and I haven't broke it in yet but have already had two double feeds. Hoping it was just the ammo (wolf) but it kinda worries me about reliability.
If both had the same red dot calibrated the same would the feel of the guns change? The sites being off on the Beretta seemed to start it off with a handicap.
Damn look at that double power!!!
I'm a new shooter and considering both firearms at this time. Also, I'm looking for some good hearing protection. Can you tell me what hearing protection you used in this video? Thanks.
Those were custom made. Best similar thing on the market is the Axil products.
Ambi mag release is just asking to drop the mag when you grip the gun correctly/hard... Happens in shootings all the time. Im a lefty and I prefer it on the left side of the gun.
Could you do a review on the Taurus TH45…please.
I want the APX compact but I cant find it anywhere
I’m not sure what you mean by true modular with the echelon. The APX has a removable chassis and they actually sell different grip modules. Seems the echelon fits modularity in the same way you say the APX is optics ready and ambi.
The Echelon seems to be getting great reviews. As it looks like a souped up Glock 17, did the grip feel like a Glock 17 to you or a better and more up and down grip…?
Feels nothing like a Glock grip (in a good way). I think Springfield retained the basic geometry of the XD series of pistols with better flow of material and superior texture. It and the APX really are very similar in that respect.
Echelon is my choice which gun stores are now selling for $569.00 in my city.
I hope an Echelon is offered in compact size like the G19 which will be a best seller.
Why the echelon when it costs double and is already having mag issues?
@@randyreviewsitthe mag issues are not issues..the 20 round mag extensions have a tab that if put on improperly, it will come off. The 17 rounds mags have NO issues…
Unfortunately, prior to watching this the video, I think the Echelon would come out on top (but not because its the better gun). Which is the better gun? Idk yet. I enjoy the APX very much but its lack of aftermarket is its death. The APX is very popular outside the USA, but in the States, it is largely ignored.
Springfield's primary market is the US and so will focus on pushing their gun here. Springfield is also very good at marketing despite the many flaws of their previous guns.
The Echelon barely come out and it already has popular holster makers making holsters for it. The APX A1 has been out for over a year, and you will still struggle to find aftermarket for it. Beretta is one of my favorite gun makers, but their marketing is garbage. The APX is one of my top striker fired guns, but I don't want to be scouring the internet for a decent holster. Echelon has already overcome that obstacle
The problem for the APX is the 92 - it will remain Beretta's flagship pistol for the foreseeable future. It doesn't even seem like the company cares about the APX, except has a means of securing military contracts with low bids.
@@gutblaster187 that’s only true from our point of view in the States.
Currently, the APX is their most popular and most produced gun in production. It’s won various contracts and has become popular in Europe and South America. The market is much bigger than the USA alone and Beretta is winning in the regard with the APX.
Since Beretta is not dependent solely on the American market, they can lack in their marketing here, which unfortunately is disastrous for their guns in the American market but not their overall sales of the gun.
Finally, Beretta has a strong preference for military/le and competition sales over civilian sales. Civilian is an afterthought for them.
I think the APX A1 really resembles the new Taurus TS9.
Just thought I'd mention that Beretta makes a 21 round magazine for under $40.
I think the Echelon is quite similar to the Walther PDP 4.5". Tech specs are very close. Sounds like maybe the triggers are too?
Not even close with the triggers. Ive tried both (own a PDP) and the trigger is MILES above the Echelons trigger, easily
@@RafsGunCollection if you like very light triggers.
@@plantguy100 it isnt even super light, its just perfect and smooth as butter. I love the PDPs trigger. Best stock trigger for any striker fired
Beretta APX 1 does as good as the Echelon for about $200 less. So, it is just a matter of personal preference.
Nice review but would have like closeup shots of both guns…..
Check out the separate reviews of each gun for those. I thought it better to show the two together in photos here, but I appreciate that feedback.
Thanks, I alway enjoy your reviews,,,no nonsense no BS🤠
I think the modularity is what could make this a really good option.
Doesn't matter if nobody supports it.
They’re both modular.
My apx a1 w/ red dot ( burris fast fire 3 ) was $399.99 new at cabelas. I could buy a tr-1 trigger group plus a 3rd mag for the price of that bare bones Springfield. Also why is the ambi controls a positive. I hate them. They snag on your shirt, get in the way of your grip, get hit on accident causing malfunctions, and serve no point unless your part of the 10% lefties.
Man I thought when echelon came out it copied the beretta Apx a1.
Why doesn't anyone pit the Echelon against the Walther PDP?
Apxa1 not even a debate
The Springfield might be the new hotness, but the Beretta is a proven military design that is literally built for war.
The fact that it is sub $300 is borderline hilarious.
Still crying about the plates. Dude, it's only 30 dollars. Or how many red dots are planing to put in 1 firearm? 😂
APX all day.
I prefer the Beretta, but I also shoot low with it and have seen reviews that other people do as well. Odd.
I don't want anymore plates or goofy mounting systems.
Dircet mill for Holosun K footprint on small guns & RMR/ Holosun C pattern for everything else.
Optic companies will adjust to this.
I’m an APX fan haven’t shot APX-A1 not sure I will.
All my European guns have that goofy hold where you cover the target with the muzzle, they call it a combat hold, I hate it, I like a six o’clock hold.
my A1 came with a red dot for under $550 . plus if you get any rebates from Beretta to top that off its a no brainer for me!
Bass pro has the A1 with a red dot for $399 right now. Not the gun I’ve had my eye on, but a good price.
@@JW-vo5gs are you talking about the a1 carry or full size
@@JW-vo5gs bc the the full size is showing $499
on the site
@@theDocta2010A1, it’s on sale for $499, with $100 rebate to drop it to $399
i wanted the APX a1 in the worst way, my wife and daughter was going to make it happen and got me one thru Bass Pro Shop, when it came in we drove the over hour to Bass Pro, and 2 issues, Bass Pro is too lazy to call in the 4473, they fax it and it can take up to 3 days to get a reply, they expected me to do the paperwork, drive over an hour home with nothing and come back whenever. 2nd issue the magazines were damaged and they said i could send them back and wait for berreta to send me some, meanwhile they had half a dozen on the wall, could have made me right and they as the dealer sent back the bad mags, i declined and got a refund. on the drive home my wife found another APX a1 at a huge local store Kittery Trading Post, and i bought it, but a problem, the take down lever was so jammed their gunsmiths couldn't budge it 2 strikes the Beretta SUCKS IN MY BOOK, ended up with a hell of a deal on a Springfield XD9 service model with 4 16 round mags and 2 carry bags for $319
As a right-hander, who is not ambidextrous, I find it very hard to care whether a firearm is ambidextrous.
Justin, I can’t wait until you put on your Legion underwear and compare the Echelon with the new Sig Sauer P320 AXG Legion to see if the Legion is worth the extra money.
Your car would be “UK ready” if it was able to flip the wheel but it’s not. So there is a such thing. Not everything is made to flip…like your car. Plus most cars are foreign but made “American ready” because as eastern people they establish the wheel on the left to make it US Capable.
I have both guns the Springfield is a much better pistol. The APX A1 the trigger is not near as good and it won’t feed 115 grain ammo runs fine with 124 grain .
Ive got 2 apx a1 full sz. Both shot every range ammo ive ever put in it perfecly.
Why did I feel like I was watching an educational work safety video...dann dude I fell asleep 4x
Is here.
👍
Still say the Echelon look like clone of the Walther PDP.
Please don’t put a talon grip on it!
My original APX Full-size does the same thing. Shoots low so I have to cover the target to be on. Not cool. I’ll stick with my Walther PDP. I greatly avoid giving any money to Springfield, as much as it pains me. Sell-Outs.
Both are modular.
Maybe the APX is am bee dex TREE us?
Not quite - only fixin' to be....
Being facetious with how people mispronounce ambidextrous aside, I believe the APX would be considered "bilateral". Maybe?@@JustinOpinionChannel
@@Scout4x Nah. The slide stop/release is ambi, but the the mag release is "reversible". You decide which way you want it and commit to that. That's a long way from ambidextrous (hence the long overdue rant). :)
In croatia apx 1000e echelon 700e
I have not shot the apx, the echelon, medium grip module model gave me serious slide bite. I have to give the nudge to the apx because of how deep the beaver tail is. Plus, the apx has went through very serious rigorous testing. Not that the echelon hasnt, but the the apx series has a longer track record of course. I have to go apx over echelon.
Is he really comparing switching your pistol from right handed to left handed to switching a vehicles steering wheel from one side to the other...switching a pistol in such a manner is free and can be done at home in a short period of time...switching a vehicles steering...it would be cheaper to just buy a car with the steering on the opposite side.
cant compare anything to beretta. beretta is the mercedes of guns.
Justin, how does the Echelon compare to the new Sig Sauer AXG P320 Legion since you are a Sig Legion fanboy buddy?
I switched my mag release out in about 5 min. it's extremally easy and VERY AMBI so stop with the put down on the APX and tell the truth. If you ever changed out one you would know this.
Echelon is nice but I'll take an Italian made gun over an eastern block euro gun anyday. Springfield just shilled the heck out of every youtuber just to hype it up.
Now that you've tackled the guntuber pronunciation and usage of "ambidextrous," please now do a rant on "fitment."