My Biggest Problem With Hazbin Hotel
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- Опубликовано: 27 янв 2024
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Hazbin Hotel is an American adult animated musical comedy streaming television series created by Vivienne "VivziePop" Medrano. The series revolves around Charlie Morningstar, princess of Hell, on her quest to find a way for demons to be "rehabilitated" and allowed into Heaven. She opens a rehabilitation hotel, called the "Hazbin Hotel", which offers demons a chance at redemption. The series is produced by independent entertainment company A24 and animation studio Bento Box Entertainment, in collaboration with Amazon Studios.
The series follows Charlie Morningstar, the princess of Hell, as she sets about fulfilling her seemingly impossible dream of opening a hotel called "Hazbin Hotel," which aims to rehabilitate sinners. Due to overpopulation, Hell goes through an annual purge where angels, led by Adam, descend from Heaven and kill demons. Charlie finds this upsetting, and wants to find a more peaceful solution to the overpopulation problem. Her goal is to have her clients "check out" from Hell as redeemed souls and be accepted into Heaven.
With the help of her devoted manager and girlfriend, Vaggie and their reluctant first patron, pornographic film actor Angel Dust, she is determined to make her dream become a reality. But when her proposal on live television goes awry, her plan attracts the attention of the powerful "Radio Demon" Alastor, who despite finding her belief in redemption laughable, wants to help Charlie run the hotel for his own amusement. 
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Extra notes and corrections"
I kinda glossed over Lilith in this video, but this does also apply to her. Maybe even more so considering she was the most active ruler, apparently.
About me talking about sinners killing each other: There's apparently evidence that they can't really kill each other, which makes me raise some eyebrows, but I guess it refutes that point if true.
I think I should have been clearer that when I say 'Heaven is the bad guy' I'm basically referring to the show's version of God and the arbitrary rules he pushes and lets them enforce. My bad.
Evidently, the interpretation of the original sin in this show is 'Lucifer seduced both of Adam's wives.' What are we even doing?
Sinners essentially respawn unless killed with a blessed weapon
Sinners essentially respawn unless killed with a blessed weapon
Also sinners are stuck in the pride ring and can’t enter the other deadly sins territory. Thats why the deadly sins dont interact with sinners! :D
@@idiedyesterday6581 Okay. I kinda want to ask the writers why. That seems pretty limiting. Like, why are they even called the seven deadly sins if they don't interact with sinners. Is it all just a naming reference? And what is the point of the Succubi seducing humans?
I guess this confirms my statement that Hell in this show is basically just a hell-flavoured alien world.
I kinda want to see how it all came to be in-universe though. What was Lilith thinking?
Sinners regenerating is only referenced once in the show as far as I recall. When Valentino rips up one of Velvet's models, she remarks that "It'll be a while until that bitch puts herself back together" as all of her body parts are wheeled away in a cart.
I wish they made the whole "Only angel weapons perma kill Sinners" thing more clear. If it's mentioned anywhere in the show, I didn't see it myself.
hazbin hotel's hell feels more like a steven universe fan's version of Las Vegas
LMAO!!!
I was reminded of the afterlife in Corpse Bride, but I like this take too.
Oh my god it does!! 😭😭
@@DrawciaGleam02people keep saying is hazbin the new bojack ? Is hazbin the new moral Orel
@@kaloxiiapeople keep saying is hazbin the new bojack ? Is hazbin the new morel Orel
For a show which main premise is "this is hell" I'll say this is easily the most SAFE FOR WORK and TAME hell I've ever seen. Sinners don't suffer and if they do they do it because of OTHER humans.
People have jobs houses and apparently economy. Therefore they have FREEDOM.
Freedom to make it hell for other people
@@ThanosDestroyeryearsago freedom for evil is still freedom
Sinners do suffer they kill and torture all the time in the show. Second the version of hell were sinners are punished by demons originates from literature not the bible. The bible never describes what hell is supposed to be like just that it sucks.
@@maravreloadedPeople can sell their soles and become literal slaves to other people in Hazbin Hotel so they really don't really have all that much freedom. But ignoring that the people can rape murder and torture people in Hazbin Hotel. Being "free" to be raped, tortured and murdered is not actually a good thing.
Yup. Dante's Inferno being a Famous one.
Now Imagine all those atheist saying they'd rather be in a Void than believe in a God but it turns out. That Void IS Hell. An Eternal Seperation from God that leave you trapped in a Never ending Void awaiting only the day of your Souls Final death in Fire.
That's actually how Orthodox Christians see Hell. The Eternal Separation from God. @@magnadramon0068
Hazbin hotels and helluva boss hell is basically a retextured earth with magic
And instead of the show's setting being separated by continents on a planet, everyone is separated by the Seven Rings
Not to mention everything is red, with spikes and horns (e.g. the cars and buildings)
@@supersonic1991 So...if someone like me were to create a PG/PG-13 rated fanfic set in those two worlds, what would be a good name for me to use as a substitute for Hell?
The best idea I can think of is the Demon Realm?
@@SilverScribe85 dude idk
@@SilverScribe85Misseryville.
That is true... It's supposed to be the final punishment for sinners, but it seems like the worst of the sinners just kind of... Roam around and have a lot of power lol.
Yeah it doesnt feel like hell it kinda feels like a reward for..being bad??
@@Nik0__ Bingo!
That's the point. What makes the hell in Hazbin hotel bad is that it's a place where people can rape, torture, and abuse each other without consequences. Being trapped in a place where everyone you meet is either a rapist or a serial killer is not actually a fun thing.
Dude. They literally take over most of hell from the demons. 😂
@@magnadramon0068 Except since it has a Society a Certain degree of Order is needed. They still got Contracts.
Plus. As they said it ends up rewarding the worst of Sinners with Power
Hell is meant to be a punishment for Sinners but Hell is no worse than the Earth we see in Helluva Boss.
It's objectively better if you come out strong right off the bat.
You can grow stronger by making deals or claiming souls.
You can never die except during the Exterminations.
You can engage in every vice or sin to your heart's content.
Really Viv did too much of a good job making Hell seem like a paradise for awful people.
Also if you die virtuously you get sent straight to Heaven.
Another big problem with Viv's writing is how she approaches morality. She wants so badly for you to like specific characters that she will throw accountability out the window entirely to give them justifications for why doing horrible things doesn't make them bad people. Either they were coerced into it, or they're too traumatised to be blamed, or it was really someone else. See Lucifer, Ozzy, Bee, Stolas, Loona, Alastor or Blitzo.
Where the characters she wants you to hate can do the exact same things but because Viv doesn't want you to like them they are presented as evil and irredeemable. See Adam, Mammon, Valentino, Striker & Stella. Viv's idea of morality is *"If I want you to like this character the bad things they do don't really matter - but if I want you to hate them then nothing they do is justified."*
I first noticed this favoritism with the sisters who were Fizz's rivals in Mamon's competition. They literally did nothing especially bad, they were just a little mean to Fizz. And at the end of the episode, a pillar falls on top of them when they were happy over the fact Fizz quit. Considering Blitz, Moxxie and Millie literally kill humans for a living, I thought it was disproportional to punish those two just for being high-school-mean-girls levels of evil.
@@luluzin5022 Exactly.
The Sisters were treated that way because Fizz is a fan favourite.
There really are no stakes to the contest either because Fizz has nothing to lose even if he loses.
Hell doesn't really feel like hell even considering we'd seen Earth in Helluva Boss and they kinda the same to me. The worldbuilding would be much better if they replace hell with purgatory instead. They should had made the leaders of the Seven Sins be descendants of the former leaders who want to do better. Lucifer would remain the only original sins. And it would make much more sense for the citizens of hell to be disrespectful of Charlie if she was an angel who came to Hell to help redeem them instead of being the princess of Hell.
Very interesting take
I _really_ like the idea of Charlie as an angel sneaking down to hell in disguise as a demon, discovering first hand that her people genocide demons every year, and she’s super heartbroken about this fact, so she tries and tries to convince other angels to stop this horrible annual attack, but no one will listen to her because they have no sympathy for “evil demons”. So she tries open up a *happy hotel* to in hope to redeem demons, so it will prevent them from being slaughtered every year, she talks about this idea to demons, but no one seems gives a crap, she can’t find anyone to help her… then she runs into the infamous Radio Demon, Alastor, she talks to him about redeeming souls, and he seemed really interested in this silly endeavor. She doesn’t even know if it’s possible to redeem a demon, but she risks it all and decides to strike a deal with him anyways. She later meets the other cast of characters.
Then later on in the finale, she finds out that Lucifer is actually her father (PLOT TWIST 😱), and it turns out he’s not as bad and evil as the stories say he is, he’s actually a really kind and quirky dude who happens to love ducks.
I Understanding the complain that earth and hell act pretty much the same, but I fell like that's kind of justified because all demosn with the exception of imps--and I think maybe the goetia?--where humans before they died. Kind of like in Johnny the Homicidal Maniac, here hell is hellish because it is full of awful people that treat others like shit.
That said, you bring up a dynamic that I don't think is really explored enough in either show, which is demons born in hell versus demons that were once human and the friction that probably exists there.
I know that this is sort of explored with Blitz and Stolas relationship in Hellivaboss, but it never really feels like imps are substantially disadvantaged in society; Moxie and Millie can get a reservation in a high end restaurant in the ring of lust while working for Blitz and Moxie's father was rich.
I like your idea of Charlie being an angel rather than a Demon, though. Would make for some interesting conflict and would cast a different light on her ignorance of people's struggle and what actually gets people into heaven.
@@XxHunterDarkDragonX8 Yeah, I think the reason why hell doesn't feel like hell was because in this universe, hell was just another place?
Sinners are people from the earth and they are still people except with loose morals. Then Hellborns are just another people except they got born in a very bad place and thus growing into what we know them as, you know the "nurture" aspect.
As for the dynamic between Sinners and Hellborns? I think the reason why there wasn't much coverage about it was because Sinners are pretty much stuck in the Pride Ring and Hellborns can go anywhere. Considering the fact Sinners can return back to life unless they got killed by an angelic weapon unlike hellborns, then either because of wariness or they have a beef with them then its much safer to just move away.
Now I'm imagining Sinners like foreigners who the locals avoided or ignored. 😅
This would auctully make more sense. No disrespect to the show as it is.
OH MY GOD I FORGOT LUCIFER IS THE SIN OF PRIDE. like i technically remembered but i also forgot???? bro does NOT embody his sin AT ALL. honestly its so weird, because i have my own versions of the demons representing the seven sins and when i was creating their personalities, i used their sins as the central core of their characters? but lucifer feels like he was made to be charlie's dad, not the sin of pride. just. how do you make a version of the seven sins without taking their sins into account?????
real bro, this is my main grip with his character; he's kinda one dimensional
7 deadly Sins even got that Idea right.
@@crrabb_1413Satan and Lucifer aren’t the same person in the show the creator of hazbin said hazbin isn’t biblically accurate
This show is what happens when people play with concepts from religious myths without understanding them
The best trick the Devil ever pulled was to convince humanity he doesn't exist. 😁
I've thought of some ideas that could both explain why Hell functions incredibly similar to Earth but also make it a place of suffering:
•Hell is inside Earth's core. It's an entire pocket dimension and the sky they see above Hell is the magma of Earth's core but is clouded by smoke from factories.
•Sinners cannot die but their bodies can be destroyed and still be alive to keep feeling pain, making their suffering truly eternal. The remains of the sinners are even commonly used as construction materials, furnitures, and electronic parts (like how every camera lens is literally an eye).
•The Seven Rings of Hell isn't a pancake, but is a circular super continent with Pride as the ring in the very center and the whole continent is surrounded by an infinite ocean of magma.
•They harvest steel from the magma ocean by draining a good amount of it inland, let it cool down then try to extract all the different metals they need there.
•Their electricity is purely geothermal and they boil billions of gallons of blood into steam that they use to power generators.
•Hell's entire economy and infrastructure is built by slavery. Most slaves are old sinners that have been there for hundreds/thousands of years while new sinners have a better chance of not being enslaved and get to live a less miserable afterlife.
•The 7 deadly sins do indulge in the sins they represent. Even when it seems like the sinners under their influence seem to be having a good time doing the sins they enjoy, the Seven are fully aware of how self-destructive they all are.
•The 7 deadly sins are manifestations of the sins committed on Earth. It literally feeds them and if a person on Earth is really sinful enough, they would be rewarded with such power once they go to Hell.
•Hellborns need to feed on the flesh of sinners, so they're actually part of the punishment instead of just simply existing.
•Angels are virtuous good guys but they are indifferent to the suffering of sinners. Adam is not a misogynistic douche, but he is very fanatical about hating demons especially when he lost both Cain and Abel because of sin.
•Exterminations aren't even needed for Charlie's motivation when Hell is already this horrible. Sera can still be an antagonist by having her be a very strict seraphine that does everything by the book because she doesn't want to end up like Lucifer no matter what.
I love this idea
is it cool if i use one of these ideas for my own world i'm building? i'm basically making a kingdom out of the abyss instead of hell
@@JOTAPHOBIA_TXT are you gonna tell us when you’re finished?
@@somerandomguy7325 yeah!
@@JOTAPHOBIA_TXT sure it's fine to use any of the ideas I mentioned
It's clear the world building aspect wasn't the top priority. The pacing is unfortunate, you never get enough time to get a good feel for the characters or form a strong attachment to them. It's probably because they don't know if they're gonna get renewed so they're just blasting on all cylinders with the best they have as fast as they can to see what sticks. It's definitely one of those shows that you shouldn't examine too much or else it kind of falls apart.
The world building was supposed to be Helluva Boss' job to do before the release of Hazbin Hotel, though it still wasn't enough because Helluva Boss still shows that Hell isn't that different from Earth
Gotta also understand when the show was being made....as well it's decently possible that when the pandemic was in full force it limited much of the work one the show and what was put in and what wasn't . But that's just speculation on my part
Also 8 episodes of 24min is clearly not enough time either.
@@Skifreak-nv7ej
Honestly I'm tired of the 8 episode excuse. 8 episodes, each being 24min is 3 hours and 12 min. That's plenty of time to tell a good story.
Over the Garden Wall is also an animated series, it is 10 episodes and each episode is only 11 min. That's a total of 1 hour and 50 min (which is pretty much slightly longer than the average animated movie). And it has no problems fleshing out the characters and giving a satisfying end.
If 3 hours is not enough then you should dial back the scope, no one is forcing you to go through several plot twists, arcs and constant new character introductions in only 3 hours. If you can't tell a good story in 3 hours that says more about you as a writer than it does about the run time.
Also the set up of the show conflicts with the Pilot episode, where you can see several of the overlords sheltering with Lucifer, so it's strange he doesn't know more about them, also Carmine was in that room with him, yet she killed an angel during the last cleanse? What was there a stray angel that didn't leave with the others and stuck around longer than everyone else?
I get that it's a pilot, but the show acts like the Pilot is canon.
its been several years, thats plenty of time to tweek a story, plus the pilot isnt technically the first episode, its more like filler to introduce the cast and world
The polite is still canon. However, and is treated like the first main real episode @@gothic_ace2037
Could be Carmilla joined Lucifer AFTER killing the angel
It really bothers me that sinners can become as powerful as Alaster. Hell is supposed to punish all "bad" people, so how come some sinners are allowed to be rich, have superpowers, and outright OWN the souls of others? It doesn't seem like Alastor or the V's are being punished all that much. If anything, they probably have more power in Hell then they had even back on Earth. They can avoid being tortured, but they get to torture the people around them. How does one even get superpowers anyway? You get them when you die? Is your strength in Hell proportional to the power you had over other people when you were alive? That seems like the opposite of what should happen! The more you hurt people on Earth, the more you should be punished in Hell. That's just common sense!
Making deals with fellow sinners or gaining territory in hell.
That's what I heard.
Got to say, before they showed Lucifer in the show I had quite a different take on how he would be like based on Helluva Boss theories, such as that he actually liked the Extermination Day because it helped him ensure his power over the souls because he allowed the event to happen but the sinners didn’t know it and he could convince them that Heaven was their enemy in order to make sure they would follow him, he hired the inccubi/succubi to the living world in order to corrupt people into going to Hell, that he built the theme park Lu Lu World in order to make sinners interact with Hell-born beings, that he only allowed sinners to live in his Ring of Pride because he was prideful for having so many souls in his domain and because he wanted to take more and more of God’s creation away from him, but now we’re left with this idea that actually none of that was done or planned by him which is quite disappointing (at least to me), until the “Dead Beat Dad” I had this theory that maybe the show would end with a twist and Charlie would find out her father wanted to use her hotel and the angel’s trust on her to try and take over Heaven, but now… not so much
From MY perspective, the way Hazbin depicts Lucifer is a means of showing where Charlie gets most of her personality from; her quirkiness, her perky attitude, her hope for change and of course, her so-called "controversial" ideas. While I agree that he isn't what I expected him to be as the king of Hell...I believe THAT is the overall point of Hazbin, to show us viewers that the whole "good and evil" thing isn't quite as cut n' dry as we humans think.
Sure, there are plenty of despicable denizens in Hell like Valentino, Crimson (Moxxie's father,) Vox and of course, Alastor. But a lot of them are actually pretty decent beings who are just living life as THEIR society dictates. Going back to Moxxie from earlier; sure, it IS true that he kills people for a living...but we saw that even HE has standards.
My point is Lucifer being a decent guy in this show doesn't bother me, especially when Heaven is revealed to be just as flawed of an ethereal plain as Hell is
This is a pretty good point but I swear to god my Christian family probably won't approve of this lol
@@octosquid48 No denying that
Both shows have characters who are just plain good guys and plain bad guys with no depth whatsoever the issue is when it makes no sense. Adam being so prideful is stupid because he didn't eat the fruit of knowledge so he shouldn't have the ability to sin since he doesn't have free will, Mammon is a ruler of a ring so why is he so obsessed with money when he has no use for it? Why is someone so old and experienced as him so stupid?
And Lucifer being the way he is in order to explain why Charlie is the way she is makes no sense with the context of others characters that we see, Stolas is just a poor baby OwO despite all the influences in his life, the same applies to Moxxie, it's like the show can't make up its mind on whether it's nature over nurture or vice-versa.
I feel like stupidity is a big problem in both shows, so much in it only happens due to people acting unnecessarily stupid, the trial scene is the best example of this as it's most likely the most important scene in Hazbin Hotel and it only happens due to people acting unreasonable dumb, Adam asks why isn't Angel in heaven already and for no reason Sera turns off her brain instead of giving the obvious and quick answer that one good action doesn't wash away all the bad and that one bad action doesn't wash away all the good, but we need conflict so everyone justs starts acting unreasonable, then there's the forced conflict of heaven not knowing what precise criteria whatever passes judged on souls uses, when that's a non-issue as the matter of how to have these souls go to heaven couldn't be more simple simple to solve: if souls aren't automatically taken to heaven upon being redeemed then set a group of angels that stay at the hotel to check how progress is going and every year before the extermination they choose a batch of sinners who, after much trial and error, are deemed worthy of heaven, a portal to heaven is open and these sinners go to heaven through the portal. There, problem solved.
@@guerreiroazul3230 In regards to Mammon's character; even when someone has little to no use for money, their greed simply drives them to obtain as much of it as they can regardless.
After all, Mam IS the Lord of Greed.
Secondly, Adam DID eat the apple from the Tree of Knowledge; it was just Eve who did so first. At least, that's how the story goes in the Bible; it may play out differently in the show.
In any case, I see Adam's pride as him acting like he's a superstar big shot due to being the OG human male in creation. Most people who become the first of ANYTHING may turn into complete a-holes later.
Finally, I see Lucifer's behavior as not only reference to where Charlie gets her quirks from. But in addition, I see it as an example of the fact not every being may be as good or evil as we've heard them described.
Heck, no one would imagine angels being murderous; right?
@@SilverScribe85 I wouldn't have a problem with Mammon wanting money if his want came from him being the personification of Greed, but that's not the case as Asmodeus and Bee aren't completely driven by the sins they represent. And unlike humans who have uses for their money even if they have a shit ton of it already, Mammon does not, let's use Elon Musk since he is a good example of a rich greedy guy who has uses for his money, he has a shit ton of money, but he still works on ways to get more because he clearly wants to leave a legacy like many of the great scientists that came before, so he wants money to invest in the research of his companies, other rich greedy people might use money to buy politicians, translating their money into political power. the same can't be said about Mammon, he has no legacy to leave, no desire for a mark, nor does he seem to want money for power of any kind, he jusy wants money for money sake, and him being the lord of greed doesn't make it any less dumb as Asmodeus and Bee aren't controlled by the sin they lord over.
In the show Adam didn't eat the fruit, they only show and mention Eve eating it.
My point is that sin comes from free will, and free will comes from the fruit of knowledge, so if you didn't eat the fruit of knowledge you should be incapable of sin and pride is a sin, therefore Adam shouldn't have pride.
I also can easily imagine angels being murderous, that happens in the bible and in the divine comedy all the time, it's easy to imagine angels and god in the bible as being these very peaceful and kind people, but that's just Jesus and even Jesus is willing to smack a bitch if necessary.
"The Devil is boring." I genuinely think this was actually a sensible take by itself. I myself like Lucifer, but I can understand that he just seems like a goofy character among goofy characters and might not stick out much. What I really like is that he seems like a good depiction of a father who wants to get closer to his daughter but is unable to because of his social awkwardness.
I think he meant the bible devil when he said that
@@italianissimobaldi5720
Yeah
@@italianissimobaldi5720 Oh. Well shit. That makes sense.
Your issue is sort of same as everyone's with Hazbin, too fast of a pacing.
Vivzie just doesn't have time to develop Lucifer as character, especially since Mimzy steals the very few precious minutes ep. 5 had.
Really wish season had more episodes since besides maybe 3-4 characters who only got few character developing moments, we barely get any development.
Also you were speaking fax about Vivzies Hell hierachy being boring and making no sense and also I agree with your unique critique of how Luci's character is basically non entity in Vivzieverse and how it's boring. My only explanation to both questions is that maybe Lucifer has to follow some rules from Heaven/God and isn't allowed to rule over sinners, hense why Hellborn hierarchy is so seperate from Sinners hierarchy, cuz Luci legit isn't allowed and doesn't want to interact with sinners so he has his own sphere of influence eith royals who do their own shtick and rule over imps who are less "evil"
I feel like the pacing isn't so much Viv's fault, that lies on the whole "eight episode season" policy she and her crew are forced to follow.
When you have only eight episodes of a season to work with, how else will you flush things out properly?
@@SilverScribe85if you know you only have 8 episodes and a 2nd season, that's on you to accommodate to make a coherent story
It feels like she did no research onto biblical lore at all it would have been nice if we saw Michael, Gabriel etc but we just get some generic ocs instead
I think she did do research, but chose to do her own thing.
I also think she's going out of her way to minimize using information and characters that are actually straight from the bible like Michael and Gabriel where she can.
Satan is a good guy in most depections, I just kind of find it odd that he has given up on sinners with no explanation, since generally speaking he gave people the knowledge of good and evil because he loved people
I gotta be honest, if I had to live on Hazbin hell, I think I'd give up on them too.
@@JesseGolo I mean, at least you can die once you're dead. I can't imagine being in what my parents think Heaven is like. It sounds like a kind of torture
I mean to be fair he went on for like four minutes saying why he gave up, concluding with "Look, theyre actively attacking us, and the person who just arrived only came here so we would fight their battle for them"
@@JesseGolo
So, how literally the Hell would it work if they had direct punishments? Would each ironic Hell be a riddle they have to solve the symbolism for?
Vaggie: "OK, we have Fried Toast being repeatedly lit on fire by giant squirrels before they extinguish the flames with really sticky honey."
Charlie: "Let's see. Could it be he had lit squirrels on fire in life?"
random imp: "Why don't we get punished like that?"
Vaggie: "For what sin?"
Angel Dust: "Wait, how can we have an overpopulation problem... yet each sinner gets a personal Hell?"
Alastor: "Could probably make room by getting rid of that ironic here crap."
Note: Having each sinner be stuck in punishment is worse for the "so Hell could not oppose Heaven" stuff.
@@Bezaliel13 I think it's been made pretty clear the overpopulation thing is a lie meant to cover up that Heaven is just afraid.
And if the characters were getting ironic punishments, it'd probably make Charlie's job easier. And it'd make the show a lot more like therapy.
Honestly, I lean more towards making this Lucifer actually encourage people to be bad than having them get punished. Make him clearly one of the antagonists even though he loves his daughter. It can be because he supports any expression of free will, even evil. Hell exists by his and Lilith's design; Give them more responsibility in the direction it went. That way, we can keep the violent circus the show relies so much on.
I love Lucifer he is so entertaining to watch
"Take that depression."
A little to silly
"yeah seeing the devil kill thousands of innocent souls is entertaining to watch"
I feel like having sinners being present in all of Hell instead of just the pride ring would have been a great opportunity to come up with truly terrifying punishments for sinners, which in turn could justify why the exterminations have been going on for so long.
I really appreciate your takes on this show. Me watching this show gave me a very similar feeling. You really put it into words I can show this to my friends to get my points across better. Thanks !!
Honestly I think you nailed it pretty quickly. Hell doesnt feel like Hell and Heaven doesnt feel like Heaven, so ultimately what was the point of using the setting at all when you could have 2 nameless countries and achieve the same thing. Even the premise of show was completely shelved in the first 3 minutes since charlie knows heaven only kills sinners to prevent an uprising and not for the excuse of over population, so why would she ever think they would be open to the idea of the redemption of a few sinners?
Its a nice show to look at but its pacing and story really needed some work maybe if they had saved the Heaven is evil reveal for season 2 it might of had some weight but thay still doesnt help that the orginal premise is flawed.
Imagine thinking the guy who make the world phanking get destroy by evil is a hero
Hmm, there is some interesting stuff in this I Want to give my point of view.
1: I think the Way heaven is portrayed isnt like "they are actually assholes", and its more something like North Korea. Most of people in heaven doesn't know about the things That happen in hell, and the ones that know are actually the assholes, that either love what They are, or are too scared of change to do nothing. I Can't Believe I compared heaven to North Korea, but there is always a first Time.
2: I actually hoped they did the inverse with the sins. I wanted all to be the responsible Way to handle, and the human/demonic spirit was what pushed it to an extreme. But mammon had to ruin it.
3: I think no one respects Charlie is because Lucifer is always recluded. He doesn't watch TV, and looks like he hasn't left home for a long while. Maybe people has lost fear to him the same Way alastor said. By not showing his power, people forgot and lost fear, and got cocky.
Hmm... I can see where you're coming from, especially with the Lucifer thing.
Took me a second to realize you were talking about North Korea. It might have been more accurate for me to say 'God' rather than heaven since it's his rules, but I'm not entirely sure God even exists in the traditional way in this show.
@@JesseGolo oh, sorry. In Spain Korea is written with a C, hence the mistake. Let me correct it.
For 3 I think it was confirmed it’s due to her not really throwing her power around, so most people tend to treat her as an annoyance they can’t really do much about
@@JesseGolocurrent running theory is that the show works under the sleeping god theory
@@TrippieMint I don't what that is, but I assume it involves God waking up to the sound of Charlie fighting Sera at his doorstep, looking around and going "What the fuck?"
To summarize, Sinners are only in the Pride Ring, non-Sinners do not get punished for..., Sinners are not directly punished, just going to ignore the "nobody knows what makes a Winner" part *on that* I guess, and having Adam *still* represent all of Heaven.
Seriously, how would the premise work if they had direct punishments?
Also the fact that Lucifer is an angel, he isn’t evil so it wouldn’t make sense for him to act evil or intimidating, hell is a punishment for him as much as it is for the sinners so why would he care to actively rule it
@@absolutelyliberated1357
A better point than most if this video had.
I guess Viziepop let's herself be very loosely inspired of the real story of Heaven and Hell.😁
There should have been Nine Circles of Hell like in the Divine Comedy not Seven Rings because it would have made things more interesting in my opinion and it should have been King Minos in charge of the Circle of Lust not Asmodeus.
4:16 Just sounds like a mix of Greek Mythology's Prometheus and Disney's Belle.
Love this video! Keep up the good work man
If I’m being honest, part of why I’m a big fan of Mammon is the fact that he is really entertaining, while still being an unrepentant bastard.
I think they're saving the true Nightmare for later down the road with possibly a character named Roo.
Who the heck is roo?
@@dragonempress8367 A character that Vivian is really excited about introducing but will be taking a while. I will say that this one has something to do with the tree that Eve ate the fruit from.
This show would be good but we need a bunch of stuff rewritten 😭😭
i enjoyed the golden fiddle
To be honest I like how humans are worst then the sins. Like they need the sin to keep the power but at the same time humans always takes things too far.
You can have Sinners who arent evil buddy.
I was not ready to see ever after high on this video, but that gag was nice.
IDK. I think that Charlie being disrespected has more to do with her being unable to actually stand up for herself and excersise her authority. From what we saw Lucifer has been cloistered away for at least seven years, so maybe that's why there's less fear of reprisal from him. I definitely agree that Adam makes the whole stroy a bit confused, I unserstand that they wanted to emphasize that heaven isn't perfect, but he just feels like a bad characicture, especially considering he just behaves like a dude bro. If they wanted to make him mysoginistic, it would have made more sense to give him like a really old-fashioned view imho. As for it being hell, I disagree, it definitely seems even if you have amenities there's constant danger. Some people are thriving and others aren't, but it's still a punishment in the sense that being overtaken by darkness and loosing your humanity entirely is a punishment. I mean in demonology there's all sorts of demons who are rulers so it seems to make sense to me that part of the suffering is the rat race and oppression from others (but the show needs to actually give us more insight into the caste system). I do agree though that Asmodeus having this perfectly put together relationship feels very contradictory.
Its becouse eight epeisodes are considered to be the "perfect bingeing length" anymore then that and you start loseing viewers becouse they cant sit and watch the show in a single setting. givin that the shows episodes air schedual dosent really allow for this anyway, and i would suspect that Hazbin being eight spisodes was a studio movie rather then Vivze, has frankly, the horrbile paceing is my biggest gripe with the show. It feels like its Vivze couldnt bear to cut out so many of the charaters she built for the show over the years (and I get that) but now the show dosent have the run time to let any of them really be characters.
I like the live-action TV series Lucifer, although them having six seasons and a ton of episodes let them spend a lot of time with him and build him as a character and his relationships. I think it's pretty stupid that Hazbin Hotel has 8 episodes and try to shove in so much when they have so little time. I think it would be better if they followed one or two plotlines throughout this season instead of making a new one every episode. I mean, they literally randomly skipped to five months later between episodes 4 and 5! I love Hazbin Hotel but I'm just super disappointed by what we're given because it's just a mess. I'd rather season 1 exclusively deal with Angel Dust's character growth and how he redeems himself with Charlie's help.
really well soken videp, ya.... i like it but unfortunately only having eight episodes (it was recently renewed so what now) really hurt this show and besides some inconveniences hell just doesn't feel that consequential i mean what was it like b4 the extermination
Isn’t it that Lucifer is being punished for his actions by being surrounded by his failures and imprisoned there rather than hell being an actual punishment for the sinners
Everyone keeps talking about how hell is a punishment to the sinners but that’s only said by the sinners and the executioner angels, it could be that everyone is going off of how “hell is a punishment” because of what they were told while alive. It actually could be that hell is simply the trash can where souls that don’t make it into heaven go
Also the only thing that kills sinners are angelic weapons, anything less than an angelic weapon and the sinner will eventually pull themself back together. It’s reference casually a couple of times, best example is when Velvette is complaining to Vox about Valentino “killing” her best model but in the same breath is saying “we can’t wait for the unlucky b*tch to pull her self back together”. They’ll eventually recover from non-angelic weapon damage but will eventually come back to life
Then we had Alastor threaten to rip Husk's soul apart, it's possible some people are powerful enough they don't actually need the holy weapons as they can interact with a soul more directly.
Yes hell is just as much of a punishment for Lucifer as it is for sinners
Which partly explains why Lucifer has no real desire to rule over it
Really? what if a sinner has a limb torn off? They just regenerate it over time????
@TheJadeFist I think that's just because he owns Husk's soul 😅
@@DrawciaGleam02 nope, the limb is just gone I’d imagine, they just wouldn’t die from shock
24 Episodes should be minumum
Judgemental critter talks constantly about how there is way too many characters that take away screen time from others. Maybe if they actually gave the devil more screen time his evil would actually show...
I highly doubt Lucifer is evil in this show.
@@JesseGolo probably
Wait didn't we get confirmation that in this universe Satan and lucifer are two different people but I say to each thier own people will like or hate it but I feel like to each thier own,
Yes. Satan is the head of Wrath. A completely different character we haven't seen yet.
@@JesseGolo This.
True
I think there is something to be said about hell being just a fucked up version of the real life and I think that it's a good idea for a punishment.
The standard torture stuff is kind of boring imo. The way it's done in hazbin it's just a rigged world with way to many ways to fuck your life up without an escape and with the constant threat of losing everything you have in an extermination which is rare enough to not be an escape for those that would want to die.
I also don't agree with you in show heaven take because heaven isn't the bad guy. Adam and Sara is. Heaven is just clueless in a way that is realistic but obviously not evil and I like the commentary of blindly following a perceived good despite not actually being able to justify it logically. These characters are not one dimensional and I really appriciate it
You can even say that not being allowed into heaven itself is a punishment.
At the very least, heaven is peaceful compared to earth or hell.
Should be noted that we have yet to see *Satan* (the sin of wrath) in either of the shows set in this universe,but what is known about him is that he's a god like figure for the imps and that he's apparently more like his traditional presentation (might be interpreting this wrong cause the tweet talking about it is kinda vague if vivzie means the biblical interpretation or the circus theme all the sins have going on), he could totally be the the capital D Devil people are more familiar with and might even be the reason violence is common in hell despite it having no practical purpose (since nobody down there can truly die without the angels)
4:23 agreed
I personally don't see a problem with Asmodeus wanting consent when it comes indulging in lust for sexual activities, I think it makes sense that he would want as many people as possible to enjoy the act of doing a kink they deep down want to commit because its pleasurable for all parties involved
I don't see Valentino being a representation of lust either since what he is doing is more so exploitation and abuse of a certain nature that makes him feel powerful since he has control over others in this narcissistic way
This is why I think Asmodeus is a totally fine representation of lust
No, because lust as a deadly sin isn't about wanting to do a kink every once in a while. It refers to being consumed and controlled by it to the point were you do more and more horrible things just to feel it. The point isn't to
be a prude, it's to warn people who go too far and lose all reason. So no, Asmodius isn't a good representation of the Sin itself. If he was, he'd be cheering on stuff like S.A. because that is lust, unrestrained.
@@joecrazy9896it being a deadly sin doesn’t mean the dude will be evil that makes no sense. Countless characters in media portray list but don’t sexually assault people. Lust from Fullmetal alchemist and even gowther from seven deadly sins.
@jknetwork6211 Yes, he is because he's supposed to represent the worst aspects of it. That how the deadly sins work, feeling them on occasion isn't bad. It's being consumed by them, and letting them take over your life is the issue. If he was a human before, sure, you'd have a point, but the guy is supposed to be hellborn. Also, the Sins in Fullmetal Alchemist don't fit to well because they aren't the concepts themselves. They are strictly tied to Father, not the universe itself.
While I DO find it surprising that Ozzie supports CONSENSUAL lust, mostly due to how the Sin is usually described, I still approve.
For example, I've seen far too many stories where characters try to use love potions or some version of Cupid's love power to "earn" the love of others. That right there isn't REAL love, it's nothing but an illusion
@@jknetwork6211actually Gowther did I believe
💯 agreed
So I'm guessing JesseGolo imagines Hell in the more traditional sense: the Seven Sins have more monstrous appearances and punish/enslave ex-human souls for their specific sins...all while the souls have to watch hellborn demons indulge in vices in front of them. What if the Seven Sins had children and they want to make Hell a less chaotic place but also try to curb their naturally sinful tendencies since that's how they were brought up. Hierarchy: royals at the top, hellborn in the middle, humans at the bottom). Lucifer is both good and evil, hating humans, but also longs to go back to Heaven...he has to punish human souls everyday and also see their memories on Earth. The descendants want to redeem their parents and their world, but the only way for them to do so is 1. Go through Hell's Rings, 2. Be chosen for Purgatory afterwards by a twisted spiritual council of elders whos job is to evolve as many beings as they can so God can evolve, 3. endure the purgatory flames and 4. learn lessons from three lives on Earth with their memories erased to make it to Heaven. Once they are in Heaven, they can work with the angels to try and purify people/unite with God. But if they fail their reincarnations (or incarnations if hellborn are chosen since they are also part of God), they are sent back to Hell and dishonored, reliving their worst sins for hundreds of years until they are chosen again or if the royals want them to suffer something else. (Example: a succubus/soul who did sexual sins has to live Earth lives a sexual victim, a rapist, and sexual abstinence to know how it all feels like). Only a lucky handful of hell ex-human souls have passed all the tests...and no hellborns have passed...yet.
Lucifer: traits of both Lucifer and Satan, angelic light but with six black wings, shapeshifter
Asmodeus: three heads of man, ram, and bull - succubus daughter: Clitorisa
Mammon: greedy wolf/dragon
Beelzebub: giant fly
Belphegor: lazy sloth troll with inventions like Hephaestus
Leviathan: sea monster ruling a twisted version of Atlantis
Satan: horned red devil with eldritch appearance
7:37 Incredibly special. When sinners get killed with angelic weapons, they don’t come back to life. It’s permanent. Given the fact that the last elimination got rid of 16% of Hell’s population, that’s a pretty big deal.
1:36 id recommend windigoons vid more
Also as a Christian i find it weird you call the devil boring but im sure you didn't mean it in a offenseive way i just wanted to say it could have been worded better
Yea 0:14
I like the characters I mean u see alastor and u dont think he's cool
I'm not sure Adam's personality is meant to show heavens hypocrisy, but its lack of understanding of what makes a person good enough to be in heaven, because from all account, Adam should be in hell, he's wrathful, lustful, prideful and a pretty awful person, abording the idea of extermination and taking pleasure in it, he's a sinner and should be in hell, but because he was the first of mankind he was probably given a pass, and i hope that later in the show they play into that aspect of his character as a like further "proof" that their system is flawed
I love how hazbil hotel is too edgy for some and too safe for others, never enough :'D
12:17 as someone still dealing withe religious trauma, it is entirely possible to be too blind to see the hypocracy if you are indoctrinated early enough.
King David in the Bible did some pretty heinous things while he was alive.
Yet, God didn't end his life early - he allowed him to enter the grave with a warm girl in his bed. People still name their kids after him.
The God in that Bible is way more interested in how his sacrifices and worship are done than the quality of the human doing it.
He makes VivziePop's Adam look like a slightly red-pilled 7th grader.
"This" Adam is a SFW presentation of what the Judeo-Christian God actually does allow in Heaven.
In my opinion they did there best with the time thye had and the limit on episodes.
Ngl, the aspect that all Sinners go to Pride and the fact that Sinners apparently aren't allowed to leave that ring bothers me and makes me wonder how in the world Hell is "overpopulated" when they can't even go to the other rings. By that logic (to me at least) it would be the hellborn demons making the population boom rather than the Sinners.
Eh... the series makes it kind of clear hell doesn't have an overpopulation problem. Heaven is just scared of them getting too strong. It kinda messes with the shows premise.
@@JesseGolo I loved the pilot from 4 years ago and all it implied. I'm sad that this doesn't quite follow it :/
Also, I'm not sure how to feel about Lucifer. He looks like a circus ringleader, and is nearly on par with Blitz's personality 🤔 This version of him doesn't intimidate me at all.
@@hunty.0 I read somewhere that hell is designed after a circus, so him being a ringleader actually fits. Like, Mammon's basically a clown.
@@JesseGolo oooh, that does make sense then 😅
@@JesseGoloI think that Sera is afraid that at some point sinners will be able go to Earth or even to heaven. For example “root of evil” lets them in, in some moment. The horror is that immortal beings will rampage on Earth. The killer who was shot by a policeman goes to take revenge at the police station on Earth, etc.
Yeah for a rated r show they arent really... Rayed r
Why ISN'T Charlie in heaven?
Hellborns stay in hell. Humans are the only ones with a chance.
Though the last episode suggests she that she could just stay if they let her.
She's a half breed.
Real
120
Never let him cook again
Question yourself would jesus chirst accpect that you're watching this?
For me, I’m the “enjoys the entertainment despite people telling me some reasonable faults”
As long I’m entertained, I don’t mind 😅
Okay, with all respect I don't like people like You critisizing the show while not understanding it.
Hell is actually doing more harm to sinners than You might think. They are going through everything they did while being alive on Earth every single day, they can't die there, can't kill themselves because they will be remanifested in Hell again, the only way to die there is through extermination but even that don't kill them really because like Viv said: they are actually becomming a part of Hell - this is why there are a lot of eyes in Hell. Sinners from what I remember can't travel between rings So everyone is there for a reason. In Hazbin we see only pride ring, those overlords and sinners were too pridefull when alive. Too narcisissistic, Valentino is not embodiment of lust nor good example for being 'sin of lust'. R4pists are narcisissistic and pridefull because they are thinking about what THEY WANT. There is no pleasure in this, only showing that You are in power, which is pride. This is why he is in pride ring. Ozzie wanting consent is not bad, he just want everyone to be lustful, having pleasure in what they are doing, Lust have a lot of versions, You can be a bloodlust, sexually lustful. Beelzebub being Sin of Gluttong doesn't necessarely make her obese and etc. She works as Queen Bee, she have workers, she don't have to do anything but make more of what she is good at. Hellhounds are doing everything for her, sin of Gluttony is not necasserely about overeating, You can have too much of everything, probably those parties she make is just to get more of her workers. Mammon is all about getting richer and having everything for himself even if that means exploiting someone, I don't need to explain. Lucifer is Pride, this is why he is short, to hit i to this pride, Pridefull people are not always slobs. You don't have to like portray the awfull evil in this show - what sadly most of those "religous fanatics" are on and about doing more harm to others than good. Whis is also pride. As You are very religous as You started You don't have objective opinion, You see everything through what you've been told, but forgot that God was also portrayed as evil in the Old Testament. I don't think You need a reminder on that. Comparing like 7 season serię with a cartoon with about like 20 episode (8 episode of Hazbin, 2 season of Helluva which both have around 6-8 ep.) is stupid af. There is not much to compare while You have 7 seasons of about 20 eps each having like 20-40 min length to an animation with 25 min per episode length.
And WHAT IS MORE IMPORTANT two different takes on the matter, these are two different concepts, I don't know what are You Comparing at this point.
I disagree. Especially on Pride. I don't think it makes sense that every sinner is stuck in the pride ring. And do you think Lucifer only became short after he went to hell or something?
Also I'm not religious, I just know what's in the Bible. And while God does a lot of questionable things in the Old Testament, he is definitely not portrayed as evil. It basically always says that he's right.
I never said Gluttony is about overeating. I said it's about overindulgence.
Also, I pointed out that Lucifer has more material and has a different focus in the video. I was just looking at something with a similar concept as a point of comparison.
POV: when you come down to hell and it doesn't have furry cute demons instead it has eldritch horrors beyond. Our comprehension..
This is not a defense of the show. Just an observation. I don't think the Hell were seeing is of the original hell. We as humans characterized it as holding these structures and specific punishments, but the reality that only the higher angels are aware of is that it's just a hole where you have to really fuck up to fall into and that it's not that difficult to get into heaven.
The conspiracy heaven is hiding is that redemption is possible and they just don't want another class of person to taint what they have. So they disguise they're disdain for the actual penitent under the "population control propaganda". And who would blame them; humans are flawed and depraved creatures, angels might actually hate them.
And for the denizens of hell holding titles; they may just be regular folks who had to get Strong and live some part of their souls to match their sin in order to survive the hole they're in; perpetuating their sin/demonic stereotype further.
For God and Lucifer; I present you with an idea. If Lucifer has no control of the will of others, do you think God does. Is he even there. What if the Angels diposed him for giving humanity free will or he left out of disgust not just of humanity , but by the angels as well.
These are just theories. I highly doubt Vizpop put alot of thought into the ideas of the Christian Mythos, but you never know; people may suprise you. What I do know, is that one of those episodes needs to be more of a lore dump or she's gonna have her audience start getting annoyed.