Really like your videos as I find them very interesting. However, if I could make a comment that's not meant to be harsh, so please forgive me if it comes over that way. Could you film with the camera further away?
Thank you so much for this video , it was most helpful to me . Many people do not know these things and can be lambs to the slaughter . Your video content is so good for anyone looking for work like myself .
It's absolutely the case that recruiters are only interested if you're a fit for a given role and if you ace the interviews. I did an in person interview recently that was a 100 mile round trip and got no feedback at all. I thought it went well and wanted feedback to know how to improve. The recruiter essentially ghosted me afterwards. As you say, seeing them as sales is a good way to frame it. Just take it as part of the journey of finding work.
They don't like it if you don't pass an interview for them, they quietly drop you. That was my experience, and I never bothered with them again. It's a pretty horrible industry to be honest, I could never understand why a human resources part of a company could not recruit themselves, and get a middleman involved costing more money. Baffling.
@@davidlacey2588 Having sat on the other side of the fence for 20 odd years and working for small companies, we didn’t have full time HR. So job ads on relevant skills based websites and recruiters were the main route. It’s a balancing act of, how much time do I want to spend doing the hiring and doing the day job? Find a good recruiter, build up a good relationship, it’s very productive. It does seem though that I've had more traction getting interviews via recruiters than applying direct to companies.
@@davidlacey2588 Having sat on the other side of the fence for 20 odd years and working for small companies, we didn’t have full time HR. So job ads on relevant skills based websites and recruiters were the main route. It’s a balancing act of, how much time do I want to spend doing the hiring? Find a good recruiter, build up a good relationship, it’s very productive. I share your pain but it does seem though that I've had more traction getting interviews via recruiter than applying direct to companies.
Was a Recruitment Consultant for the last 40 years, most of the time as a Director of my own biz. Worked on Perm Engineering roles most of the time was never interested in doing temps/contractors etc. I am so glad I got out 2 years back and ended up in the civil service which has been a real eye opener to say the least. What I hated about the recruitment industry was that the bad consultants painted a bad picture for the good ones and you had a job persuading clients that you were just not any bod looking for a quick fee etc. When it's your own biz you have a different approach and you look to develop long term relationships with clients and candidates but I found there was a real shift in attitudes to consultants since the covid pandemic and a lot of the ethics went out of the window. Maybe because I am older I found that harder to take but getting out was the best move I ever made!
I always had a negative view on recruitment agencies. Then I worked for a friends agency for about 6 months while I was preparing my new business to open and that negative view increased a hundred fold. They’re basically salespeople and you’re correct, a lot of the jobs don’t exist and are just used as glorified advertising to attract new jobseekers to the agency.
I am a finance contractor and have had the most excellent 15 year relationship with my recruitment consultants. I only use the one agency. They know me well, know the type of roles that will suit me , both in terms of job content, and the manager and/or team that matches my personality. Nothing but praise for them. I have never been without a good long contract (9-12 months) work when I wanted it.
They worked incredibly hard to find me the right contracts and I'm grateful for their services, both to the employer and contractor. Yes they make a fee, but why not have an enjoyable experience with them at the same time. They got to know me, my skills and preferences and what to avoid. It's well worth developing a strong relationship with any agency.
Greetings from Lymm! I think some advertised jobs are bait so they can get CVs in to then harvest details of employers they can then cold call / hassle. Especially in IT. Also by getting history from CV they can find out key contact details and from recent employment history get an idea of the organisation structure of the business. The same goes for linkedin, they can harvest info from your employment history from there.
More often than not, the recruiters are desperate than the candidates from having have to make up for the quotas every month. When the deadline looms, they sort of panic and sell-off anything on the table. Think of them as real-estate agents except that they are dealing with the people instead of the real-estates.
Loathe, both as a candidate and a recruiter. I remember once as a recruiter we worked with one particular agency and interviewed a few candidates. A few days later I was inundated with cold calls from other agencies. I reckon they had asked the candidates who they had had recent interviews with. Also they did seem to push certain candidates.
In Australia, large companies won't deal with you directly as a contractor for legal reasons and have a panel of preferred recruitment suppliers. Even when I had a previous relationship with a company and secured the job myself, I was told to pick a labour hire company. Probably the same in the UK.
Maybe it's different for contractors but I've never needed a consult to find a job. Any decent one's I've come across tend to leave recruitment shortly, probably because they're decent people
Not consultants,but I know recruitment/employment agencies have become crap nowadays. 3 decades ago you could actually pop into a local office and talk with someone about your job search, but nowadays you cannot really do that and any place that IS open to the public will just get you online asap. I do agree that if you have a , let's say erratic work history, they will not be helpful...they are looking for easy placements and who can blame them
As with anything, it depends... When candidates were difficult to find (back when I worked in an agency) then they were useful for both sides. Now, things like Lnkdin mean that an advert gets 100s (just had >500 applications for 1 post) of applicants bc it's so easy to apply. Now that agent isn't going to spend the 2 weeks needed to sort and rank all those thoroughly, when all they need is, say, the first half dozen really good ones. Because 2 weeks for one commission is poor use of time
My own experience with recruitment agents was that they didn't want to work with me because l was unemplyed. They couldn't get me back out of the door fast enough. I never bothered with them again.
mark i was thinking of going to an agency for work . i was advised to do this by the job centre .. so do you think i will have any luck with this . thanks for the help .
My experience of Recruitment consultants: They seem to operate under the Hook, Line and Stinker method. The Hook, a great job has come up on their books that fits your CV. The Line, asking you lots of questions about your job, salary expectations, availability, etc. The Stinker: Ghosted !
I have twice got jobs through recruitment consultants - once was headhunted and I got the job. So, they can be good. However, I’m certain a lot of the time they just advertise fake jobs to get you on their books. The fake jobs and the fake interviews (where the person they are going to appoint is already waiting in the wings, waiting until the official process is over) is so demoralising. I’ve prepared many times for interviews for jobs I later realised weren’t available. Such a waste of time, effort, money, travel, getting dressed up - all just to make up the numbers. I confronted two HR interviewers about this once. I had a flash of knowledge. I said something like “I’m not even going to be considered for this job am I?!” Wow! That hit the nerve. Neither of them would look at me. They looked at every corner of the room except me. Then they looked at each other in panic and started stuttering and each looking to the other to say something - having been smooth and confident before that. I knew I’d hit the nail on the head.
I would agree about the jobs advertised on websites, I, and nobody I know, who has applied for one has ever heard anything more about it unless it was an agency going fishing. My experience of recruitment agents is entirely negative, mostly down to lack of disclosure about the job they are pushing, such that it has a lengthy unpaid trial period
Beware of the chat and fake smiles. Ultimately, it's down to them finding you suitable roles and providing connections. There is an exodus of these people, many of whom are out of work now. For contracting over the last few years the roles have all come from my network.
I was in exec search for 15 years, City. Korn Ferry was one of my employers. Top level. 100k salaries plus. Lets be clear, whether high street recruiter or chandaliers and oak tables, that i enjoyed: no one over 45 is going to be taken seriously unless youre MD level of a big firm. Candidates over 45 hound agents when their chances are 1%. No one will represent you. Clients expect youth, 35 yr olds for 100k jobs, 25 for 50k. Theyre blue chip, they have an end game fee for the agent. Everyone else, adios.
I honesty can’t stand recruitment agents. They give false hope and the disappear. Or if you are progressing in another process, they apply so much pressure for the role they are recruiting for, acting like they care when it’s really about their commission! If I ever use them, I also try and apply directly to the organisation for the same role, and of course continue to apply elsewhere.
I don't like it when they ask what are you looking for ? Tell me first what you have and the location and don't bother with the waffle, I always ask can you send me the JD over ? That's when I can look in my own time and give them permission to send my CV over or not
I heard talk years ago given by a recruitment agent who said by doing temping it's a good of way gsinig expereince postentially being offered permanent vacancy. If I hadn't been a temp at my current employer I would found out or applied for my previous job I've been promoted since plus even though I was a temp they helped me to develop,
Companies only use recruiters to help them find talent they cannot easily find themselves. If you fit that criteria as a candidate the recruiter will invest time with you. Spending hours each day talking to different candidates that are not suitable and explaining why they are not suitable does not pay the bills. They have to focus on fees and keeping the lights on.
As an employer I view agencies as the absolute last resort. The charge very high fees for very little work and just throw unsuitable candidates at me hoping one will just about meet the minimum requirements. They pretend the have some secret stash of wonderful people just waiting to work, when in reality any candidate could find any job on indeed, so why use an agency?
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Really like your videos as I find them very interesting. However, if I could make a comment that's not meant to be harsh, so please forgive me if it comes over that way. Could you film with the camera further away?
LOL!. Maybe not so close.
Thank you so much for this video , it was most helpful to me . Many people do not know these things and can be lambs to the slaughter . Your video content is so good for anyone looking for work like myself .
It's absolutely the case that recruiters are only interested if you're a fit for a given role and if you ace the interviews. I did an in person interview recently that was a 100 mile round trip and got no feedback at all. I thought it went well and wanted feedback to know how to improve. The recruiter essentially ghosted me afterwards. As you say, seeing them as sales is a good way to frame it. Just take it as part of the journey of finding work.
They don't like it if you don't pass an interview for them, they quietly drop you. That was my experience, and I never bothered with them again.
It's a pretty horrible industry to be honest, I could never understand why a human resources part of a company could not recruit themselves, and get a middleman involved costing more money. Baffling.
@@davidlacey2588 Having sat on the other side of the fence for 20 odd years and working for small companies, we didn’t have full time HR. So job ads on relevant skills based websites and recruiters were the main route. It’s a balancing act of, how much time do I want to spend doing the hiring and doing the day job? Find a good recruiter, build up a good relationship, it’s very productive.
It does seem though that I've had more traction getting interviews via recruiters than applying direct to companies.
@@davidlacey2588 Having sat on the other side of the fence for 20 odd years and working for small companies, we didn’t have full time HR. So job ads on relevant skills based websites and recruiters were the main route. It’s a balancing act of, how much time do I want to spend doing the hiring? Find a good recruiter, build up a good relationship, it’s very productive.
I share your pain but it does seem though that I've had more traction getting interviews via recruiter than applying direct to companies.
Was a Recruitment Consultant for the last 40 years, most of the time as a Director of my own biz. Worked on Perm Engineering roles most of the time was never interested in doing temps/contractors etc. I am so glad I got out 2 years back and ended up in the civil service which has been a real eye opener to say the least. What I hated about the recruitment industry was that the bad consultants painted a bad picture for the good ones and you had a job persuading clients that you were just not any bod looking for a quick fee etc. When it's your own biz you have a different approach and you look to develop long term relationships with clients and candidates but I found there was a real shift in attitudes to consultants since the covid pandemic and a lot of the ethics went out of the window. Maybe because I am older I found that harder to take but getting out was the best move I ever made!
I always had a negative view on recruitment agencies. Then I worked for a friends agency for about 6 months while I was preparing my new business to open and that negative view increased a hundred fold.
They’re basically salespeople and you’re correct, a lot of the jobs don’t exist and are just used as glorified advertising to attract new jobseekers to the agency.
I am a finance contractor and have had the most excellent 15 year relationship with my recruitment consultants. I only use the one agency. They know me well, know the type of roles that will suit me , both in terms of job content, and the manager and/or team that matches my personality. Nothing but praise for them. I have never been without a good long contract (9-12 months) work when I wanted it.
They worked incredibly hard to find me the right contracts and I'm grateful for their services, both to the employer and contractor.
Yes they make a fee, but why not have an enjoyable experience with them at the same time.
They got to know me, my skills and preferences and what to avoid.
It's well worth developing a strong relationship with any agency.
Greetings from Lymm! I think some advertised jobs are bait so they can get CVs in to then harvest details of employers they can then cold call / hassle. Especially in IT. Also by getting history from CV they can find out key contact details and from recent employment history get an idea of the organisation structure of the business. The same goes for linkedin, they can harvest info from your employment history from there.
More often than not, the recruiters are desperate than the candidates from having have to make up for the quotas every month.
When the deadline looms, they sort of panic and sell-off anything on the table.
Think of them as real-estate agents except that they are dealing with the people instead of the real-estates.
Not necessarily a necessary evil but many job seekers are terrible at selling themselves, and a recruiter may be able to help you with that.
Loathe, both as a candidate and a recruiter. I remember once as a recruiter we worked with one particular agency and interviewed a few candidates. A few days later I was inundated with cold calls from other agencies. I reckon they had asked the candidates who they had had recent interviews with. Also they did seem to push certain candidates.
In Australia, large companies won't deal with you directly as a contractor for legal reasons and have a panel of preferred recruitment suppliers. Even when I had a previous relationship with a company and secured the job myself, I was told to pick a labour hire company. Probably the same in the UK.
Maybe it's different for contractors but I've never needed a consult to find a job. Any decent one's I've come across tend to leave recruitment shortly, probably because they're decent people
Not consultants,but I know recruitment/employment agencies have become crap nowadays. 3 decades ago you could actually pop into a local office and talk with someone about your job search, but nowadays you cannot really do that and any place that IS open to the public will just get you online asap. I do agree that if you have a , let's say erratic work history, they will not be helpful...they are looking for easy placements and who can blame them
As with anything, it depends...
When candidates were difficult to find (back when I worked in an agency) then they were useful for both sides. Now, things like Lnkdin mean that an advert gets 100s (just had >500 applications for 1 post) of applicants bc it's so easy to apply. Now that agent isn't going to spend the 2 weeks needed to sort and rank all those thoroughly, when all they need is, say, the first half dozen really good ones. Because 2 weeks for one commission is poor use of time
My own experience with recruitment agents was that they didn't want to work with me because l was unemplyed. They couldn't get me back out of the door fast enough.
I never bothered with them again.
mark i was thinking of going to an agency for work . i was advised to do this by the job centre .. so do you think i will have any luck with this . thanks for the help .
My experience of Recruitment consultants: They seem to operate under the Hook, Line and Stinker method. The Hook, a great job has come up on their books that fits your CV. The Line, asking you lots of questions about your job, salary expectations, availability, etc. The Stinker: Ghosted !
Its always sunny on your videos, I've always been led to believe it always rains in Manchester. I hate agencies TBH.
I have twice got jobs through recruitment consultants - once was headhunted and I got the job. So, they can be good. However, I’m certain a lot of the time they just advertise fake jobs to get you on their books.
The fake jobs and the fake interviews (where the person they are going to appoint is already waiting in the wings, waiting until the official process is over) is so demoralising. I’ve prepared many times for interviews for jobs I later realised weren’t available. Such a waste of time, effort, money, travel, getting dressed up - all just to make up the numbers.
I confronted two HR interviewers about this once. I had a flash of knowledge. I said something like “I’m not even going to be considered for this job am I?!” Wow! That hit the nerve. Neither of them would look at me. They looked at every corner of the room except me. Then they looked at each other in panic and started stuttering and each looking to the other to say something - having been smooth and confident before that. I knew I’d hit the nail on the head.
I would agree about the jobs advertised on websites, I, and nobody I know, who has applied for one has ever heard anything more about it unless it was an agency going fishing. My experience of recruitment agents is entirely negative, mostly down to lack of disclosure about the job they are pushing, such that it has a lengthy unpaid trial period
Beware of the chat and fake smiles. Ultimately, it's down to them finding you suitable roles and providing connections. There is an exodus of these people, many of whom are out of work now.
For contracting over the last few years the roles have all come from my network.
I was in exec search for 15 years, City. Korn Ferry was one of my employers. Top level. 100k salaries plus. Lets be clear, whether high street recruiter or chandaliers and oak tables, that i enjoyed: no one over 45 is going to be taken seriously unless youre MD level of a big firm. Candidates over 45 hound agents when their chances are 1%. No one will represent you. Clients expect youth, 35 yr olds for 100k jobs, 25 for 50k. Theyre blue chip, they have an end game fee for the agent. Everyone else, adios.
I honesty can’t stand recruitment agents. They give false hope and the disappear. Or if you are progressing in another process, they apply so much pressure for the role they are recruiting for, acting like they care when it’s really about their commission!
If I ever use them, I also try and apply directly to the organisation for the same role, and of course continue to apply elsewhere.
I don't like it when they ask what are you looking for ? Tell me first what you have and the location and don't bother with the waffle, I always ask can you send me the JD over ? That's when I can look in my own time and give them permission to send my CV over or not
I hate it when consultant agencies pretend they are your best mates. They aren't - get me a job and then I'll consider you a mate....maybe.
I heard talk years ago given by a recruitment agent who said by doing temping it's a good of way gsinig expereince postentially being offered permanent vacancy. If I hadn't been a temp at my current employer I would found out or applied for my previous job I've been promoted since plus even though I was a temp they helped me to develop,
Companies only use recruiters to help them find talent they cannot easily find themselves. If you fit that criteria as a candidate the recruiter will invest time with you. Spending hours each day talking to different candidates that are not suitable and explaining why they are not suitable does not pay the bills. They have to focus on fees and keeping the lights on.
As an employer I view agencies as the absolute last resort. The charge very high fees for very little work and just throw unsuitable candidates at me hoping one will just about meet the minimum requirements. They pretend the have some secret stash of wonderful people just waiting to work, when in reality any candidate could find any job on indeed, so why use an agency?
Recruiters should be qualified like nurses.
I keep getting pestered by these people. There is nothing they can say that you don't already know if you've done your research.
awful like all other unregulated professions like estate agents etc wouldnt trust them as far as i can throw them
Always found recruitment companies to be sharks. Advertise non existent jobs to entice you to sign up with them.
90% of recruitment consultants are compulsive liars. The drivel I've heard from them over the years has had me rolling around laughing at times.