Ed Machine is a GREAT channel! Had to chime in on the Edelbrock RPM cam since I have used it and witnesses the same results! The Edelbrock RPM flat tappet is a .496/.520 lift 224/234 dur @.050 110* (3* of advance ground into in the camshaft) The engine it was in my '78 Mustang II -- 1974 302 block, flattops, approx 9:1 c/r (lower than it should be for this cam) extensively ported '66 289 heads w/SBC 1.94/1.60 valves, roller rockers, Weiand Stealth Intake and 735 cfm Holley (factory '66 390 Ford GT carb) Cam was dot to dot because at 21, I didn't know about degreeing, or cared...lol C4 auto, 2200 stall, 3.50:1 rear ratio w/spool, and 26" tall Street tires. Also had SouthSide Machine bars (like Cal-tracs in a way) This setup produced insane amounts of low end grunt! Much more than I'd ever expect from a 302, especially at 9:1 with this cam. It would also continue to make power up through 6500 rpms. But on the bottom, it would pull hard. I'll link a video, but there is a spot at 2:17 where I'm just barely on the gas holding it at 2000 rpms and it EASILY boils the tires. ruclips.net/video/UWs1ZGtXqH4/видео.html Check it out for yourself. It's an old video, but illustrates the potential this cam has with the right equipment around it. Now I'm not an Edelbrock fan boy for anything, actually not usually that impressed by their products, but this cam and setup works! If you were to run this cam with a stock set of heads, manifolds, and smaller induction, i can easily see how it would be lazy on the bottom. The SBF's biggest problem is breathing, the stock heads un-touched, are horrible. But opened up mid-late 289 heads DO really perform. I actually had these heads flow tested and they out flowed a set of E7TE's (the hot budget piece at that time) Fords with stock heads also seem to respond really well and MUCH better bottom end with a split lift and split duration cam. I have noticed good gains in the bottom end over single pattern cams. Now, once the stock head is opened up considerably (namely the exh side) then the single pattern cams start showing similar gains. Currently the car has a 289 with the same heads, Erson .504 lift 228 dur cam and a dual quad tunnel ram. (as seen in later video)
@@edsmachine93 any time! Sorry I don't comment as much on your vids, but most the time there's nothing to say because you cover it well, or I'm learning something new!
Yes you touched on a lot of good things there and I agree with you and I'm not an edlebrock fan myself you have to pick and choose their products thanks so much for the input and watching 😊
The Edelbrock 302 Performer RPM cam is 224/234/112 and the Edelbrock 351W Performer RPM cam is 224/234/110, with a different firing order. The Summit 218/228/114 makes great power in a 302. The Edelbrock 302 Performer RPM intake seems a bit big and I always get a bit more power. quicker ET's with the 302 Weiand Stealth intake, which give both higher torque and power in a stock stroke 302 for me.
I know it's a year old video but this brings back memories of running this cam( Wolverine offered the same grind in a hyd flat tappet.) bought at the Englishtown swap meet! ok, so I built an early 302 block with the old TRW solid dome L2249F30 pistons, stock crank and rods, HV oil pump, deep oil pan. early 351W heads backyard(well, shed) ported by me. screw in studs & guide plates, RPM intake, holley 750dp, equal length shorties/off road pipe/flowmasters & turndowns. into a buddies 79 Capri RS turbo rolling shell. at first with a C4 and a 2400 stall converter, 3.73:1 gears and some basic suspension. ran strong, wanted 100 octane. then went to a T-5. At Englishtown it ran down to a 13.05 @105/107mph depending on weather. needed a 4:10 or 4:30 gear, long tubes and probably more/better port work and a good valve job. ran well for what it was and definitley pulled hard from 2500rpm & up! thanks for the memories!
I’ve got a comp XE266HR12. My setup is 331 cu in, aluminum 190 heads 2.02/1.60 springs good to .575 lift, heads flow 250 @ .500, 544/555 lift, 218/224 @ 050, 10:1 compression, dual plane w/ 1” open spacer, 600 cfm vac carb, but I’m in a manual bronco, plenty of gear relatively speaking. It runs decent, not a dog for what it is. BTW, my wife and I had a stomach bug lasted two days, stabby pains/gas. Weird… thx Terry feel better
🔔😎 Just passing on info: I always heard that back in the day Crane ground the letter cams for Ford. Modern versions like "E+" etc being marketed with more agressive ramp rates probably are worth a few more area under the curve. As you pointed out, most people fail to degree in cams with a piston stop for each specific combination and just hope dot-to-dot gets close. Few seem to realize that maybe they need +1, +3, or even -2*. ONLY TESTING can determine exactly. As you said Terry, Think "combination" !! David Vizard has shown that 302s need a 110* LSA (E cam) or a shade less, depending on valve diameter. The other letter cams and most companies' shelf-cams are wide 112, 114, or 115* LSA for computer purposes and definitely require tunes. I've found that stock cams with 1.7 rockers do well on street cars that rarely see over 5500 rpm. Remember agressive lift cams require more spring, rockers, and pushrods due to base circles and valve train flexing and lifter collapse. DV recommends PRW/Comps steel roller tip ball pivot rockers for budget builds. Just info for the guys. Be well and prosper, have a joy-joy day. YeeeeeHaaaaw!!!! 😁😎 BTW the E cam is just a roller version of the 289 HIPO/ BOSS 302 (same) cam numbers and rates with a little more lift. +.027" I noticed the kinked radiator hose 😳
Your spot on Ray I don't know why I'm just seeing this comment from 2 months ago sorry my friend thanks for watching appreciate all of your knowledge and input 😊
I had this cam in my 289 with 1970 351w ported heads, Edelbrock F4B Intake 650 double Pumper 4-speed 3.50 gear in a Mustang. I kept it looking fairly stock with painting the Intake Blue and running Dual Exhaust thru the 351w Cast Iron Manifolds. It would rev, but was sluggish down low. It was about 4 10ths slower in the 1/4 mile than with 69 302 heads and stock cam. I did something wrong.
Sometimes it's hard to figure out what's wrong but it's usually minor things , I went a second slower due to my carburetor not being tuned right I never thought it would make that much of a difference and even the cam shaft being degreed in off by 2 degrees could do that , but it sounds like a nice little combo outside of that, thanks for watching and commenting
Terry thank you for the shout out. I appreciate that so much. Is the Edelbrock a Hydraulic Roller? Or a flat tappet? I know they make a flat tappet. I did not know if they had a roller. Sorry you're not feeling well. Take care, Ed.
Yeah Ed it's a hydraulic roller and the reason I like it is it offers a little more performance in my opinion than other cams in it's class the only thing I dislike about it is that it has the old school firing order like the earlier 289 engines have instead of the 351 firing order which surprised me being a hydraulic roller cam and you are very welcome Ed
This is only the second cam I have degreed. B303 went straight up in my first and an E303 had to be advanced 4 degrees to make it match up the centerline angle. Got to check everything right!? Have a great day.
Yes we have to check everything when it comes to cam shafts especially valve to piston clearance which alot of guys neglect to do when using smaller lift cams, thanks for watching and your input good luck to you
couple things, Eds machine is the best!... Edelbrock does not grind their own camshafts, they are actually 30 year old grinds, however they work. When they are referred to as "Lazy" what they are talking about is the opening and closing rates are slower than the "Fast" cams today, or the "lobe intensity" is much slower. Quick way to check intensity is to subtract the advertised duration from the @.050 duration. The higher that number, the lower the intensity. The old RPM grinds are going to be much "lazier" than a modern Xtreme energy/asymetric grind.
If the initial and total timing are good then it's all good. My thing is the price point The package for a 302 is like 3000 from Edelbrock I can use twisted wedge 170s a voodoo 268 air gap and a 650 vacuum secondary and be just as fast for cheaper
In most cases the 351 Windsor head is best but the 302 head sometimes have a smaller combustion chamber which will raise the compression I would use either head but the 351 has a slight advantage when it comes to flow numbers, thanks for watching hope this is helpful
I can belive this claim. 224/234/110 +4 is like a single pattern 224/224/107.5 + 1.5 camshaft modified with early exhaust opening so yes, that should work nicely as most camshafts have way to high LSA.
I use multiple porting tools I use grinding stones, sanding rolls , and double cut carbide bits the stones do not work well on aluminum and the double cut takes longer then a single cut bit sanding rolls are great for either one but you go thru alot of them but you want 60 or 80 grit in most case's unless your polishing
looking to cam/valve spring my explorer 5.0/gt40 engine in my Datsun(1984 200sx)...I more interested in the low torque down low vs having higher horsepower.... I know its a compromise I will consider this Edelbrock cam
If it's a stick car you will be fine the only thing I don't like about this cam is that it has the old school 289 firing order on it not the 351 firing order, sounds like you have a nice little ride there an Anderson n41 cam would work out great too
It very well could be I don't know, these companies do rip each other off I do know that the trick flow cams were nothing but a rip off of crane cams as far as the numbers went stage 1 stage 2 and stage 3 but I don't know if that's still the case today , thanks for watching
@@terrygrover6440 Absolutely. My TFS2 is in fact a crane cams version. I'm gonna do some dogging. The edelbrock one I'm referring to I believe they call the rolling thunder cam. This one you have may be different. Thanks for the sbf content!
That Edelbrock cam isnt bad. The only bad thing i would say is it's a little bit old technology on the ramp rates. In a pickup or something heavier might be better if it was a straight pattern.
I base this on 302 base engines with a decent head for the street in mind but also I consider this to be a stickshift cam , my son's car that this cam is in pulls like a freight train and weights 3600 lbs the thing I don't like about the cam is that it has a 289 firing order instead of the 351 w firing order but it makes more power then most of the alphabet cams , we've experimented with alot of cam shafts, compression and where you degree this cam in plays a big part as with any other cam , thanks for watching
This car is full weight that this cam is in and it pulls like a freight train even with stock gears in the rear I would think it's an 11 second car as it sits taking a stab at it thanks for watching my video
This car runs great its getting a 1000 dollars worth of coil packs on it he's changing it over ,it has a 100 dollar short block motor and runs 11s , which I would take any day
The car was not running at the time I made this video everything was being upgraded with the electrical system but it sounds healthy with a little radical idle
Ed Machine is a GREAT channel!
Had to chime in on the Edelbrock RPM cam since I have used it and witnesses the same results!
The Edelbrock RPM flat tappet is a .496/.520 lift 224/234 dur @.050 110* (3* of advance ground into in the camshaft)
The engine it was in my '78 Mustang II -- 1974 302 block, flattops, approx 9:1 c/r (lower than it should be for this cam) extensively ported '66 289 heads w/SBC 1.94/1.60 valves, roller rockers, Weiand Stealth Intake and 735 cfm Holley (factory '66 390 Ford GT carb) Cam was dot to dot because at 21, I didn't know about degreeing, or cared...lol
C4 auto, 2200 stall, 3.50:1 rear ratio w/spool, and 26" tall Street tires. Also had SouthSide Machine bars (like Cal-tracs in a way)
This setup produced insane amounts of low end grunt! Much more than I'd ever expect from a 302, especially at 9:1 with this cam. It would also continue to make power up through 6500 rpms. But on the bottom, it would pull hard. I'll link a video, but there is a spot at 2:17 where I'm just barely on the gas holding it at 2000 rpms and it EASILY boils the tires. ruclips.net/video/UWs1ZGtXqH4/видео.html
Check it out for yourself. It's an old video, but illustrates the potential this cam has with the right equipment around it.
Now I'm not an Edelbrock fan boy for anything, actually not usually that impressed by their products, but this cam and setup works!
If you were to run this cam with a stock set of heads, manifolds, and smaller induction, i can easily see how it would be lazy on the bottom. The SBF's biggest problem is breathing, the stock heads un-touched, are horrible. But opened up mid-late 289 heads DO really perform. I actually had these heads flow tested and they out flowed a set of E7TE's (the hot budget piece at that time)
Fords with stock heads also seem to respond really well and MUCH better bottom end with a split lift and split duration cam. I have noticed good gains in the bottom end over single pattern cams. Now, once the stock head is opened up considerably (namely the exh side) then the single pattern cams start showing similar gains.
Currently the car has a 289 with the same heads, Erson .504 lift 228 dur cam and a dual quad tunnel ram. (as seen in later video)
Thanks for the mention Oly, I really appreciate you.
@@edsmachine93 any time! Sorry I don't comment as much on your vids, but most the time there's nothing to say because you cover it well, or I'm learning something new!
Yes you touched on a lot of good things there and I agree with you and I'm not an edlebrock fan myself you have to pick and choose their products thanks so much for the input and watching 😊
The Edelbrock 302 Performer RPM cam is 224/234/112 and the Edelbrock 351W Performer RPM cam is 224/234/110, with a different firing order. The Summit 218/228/114 makes great power in a 302. The Edelbrock 302 Performer RPM intake seems a bit big and I always get a bit more power. quicker ET's with the 302 Weiand Stealth intake, which give both higher torque and power in a stock stroke 302 for me.
Great video Ford powered forever baby love learning new things about my Ford engines
I know it's a year old video but this brings back memories of running this cam( Wolverine offered the same grind in a hyd flat tappet.) bought at the Englishtown swap meet!
ok, so I built an early 302 block with the old TRW solid dome L2249F30 pistons, stock crank and rods, HV oil pump, deep oil pan. early 351W heads backyard(well, shed) ported by me. screw in studs & guide plates, RPM intake, holley 750dp, equal length shorties/off road pipe/flowmasters & turndowns. into a buddies 79 Capri RS turbo rolling shell. at first with a C4 and a 2400 stall converter, 3.73:1 gears and some basic suspension. ran strong, wanted 100 octane. then went to a T-5. At Englishtown it ran down to a 13.05 @105/107mph depending on weather. needed a 4:10 or 4:30 gear, long tubes and probably more/better port work and a good valve job. ran well for what it was and definitley pulled hard from 2500rpm & up! thanks for the memories!
Appreciate your comment and your very welcome for any memories I brought to you, you had a nice little running car there , thanks for watching
Better get a hold down on that distributor 👍🏼
I’ve got a comp XE266HR12. My setup is 331 cu in, aluminum 190 heads 2.02/1.60 springs good to .575 lift, heads flow 250 @ .500, 544/555 lift, 218/224 @ 050, 10:1 compression, dual plane w/ 1” open spacer, 600 cfm vac carb, but I’m in a manual bronco, plenty of gear relatively speaking. It runs decent, not a dog for what it is.
BTW, my wife and I had a stomach bug lasted two days, stabby pains/gas. Weird… thx Terry feel better
🔔😎
Just passing on info:
I always heard that back in the day Crane ground the letter cams for Ford.
Modern versions like "E+" etc being marketed with more agressive ramp rates probably are worth a few more area under the curve.
As you pointed out, most people fail to degree in cams with a piston stop for each specific combination and just hope dot-to-dot gets close. Few seem to realize that maybe they need +1, +3, or even -2*. ONLY TESTING can determine exactly. As you said Terry, Think "combination" !!
David Vizard has shown that 302s need a 110* LSA (E cam) or a shade less, depending on valve diameter. The other letter cams and most companies' shelf-cams are wide 112, 114, or 115* LSA for computer purposes and definitely require tunes.
I've found that stock cams with 1.7 rockers do well on street cars that rarely see over 5500 rpm. Remember agressive lift cams require more spring, rockers, and pushrods due to base circles and valve train flexing and lifter collapse. DV recommends PRW/Comps steel roller tip ball pivot rockers for budget builds.
Just info for the guys.
Be well and prosper, have a joy-joy day.
YeeeeeHaaaaw!!!! 😁😎 BTW the E cam is just a roller version of the 289 HIPO/ BOSS 302 (same) cam numbers and rates with a little more lift.
+.027"
I noticed the kinked radiator hose 😳
Your spot on Ray I don't know why I'm just seeing this comment from 2 months ago sorry my friend thanks for watching appreciate all of your knowledge and input 😊
nice call out for Ed's Machine!
I had this cam in my 289 with 1970 351w ported heads, Edelbrock F4B Intake 650 double Pumper 4-speed 3.50 gear in a Mustang. I kept it looking fairly stock with painting the Intake Blue and running Dual Exhaust thru the 351w Cast Iron Manifolds.
It would rev, but was sluggish down low. It was about 4 10ths slower in the 1/4 mile than with 69 302 heads and stock cam. I did something wrong.
Sometimes it's hard to figure out what's wrong but it's usually minor things , I went a second slower due to my carburetor not being tuned right I never thought it would make that much of a difference and even the cam shaft being degreed in off by 2 degrees could do that , but it sounds like a nice little combo outside of that, thanks for watching and commenting
Good info thanks, never paid much attention to those cams
Terry thank you for the shout out.
I appreciate that so much.
Is the Edelbrock a Hydraulic Roller?
Or a flat tappet?
I know they make a flat tappet.
I did not know if they had a roller.
Sorry you're not feeling well.
Take care, Ed.
Yes both
Yeah Ed it's a hydraulic roller and the reason I like it is it offers a little more performance in my opinion than other cams in it's class the only thing I dislike about it is that it has the old school firing order like the earlier 289 engines have instead of the 351 firing order which surprised me being a hydraulic roller cam and you are very welcome Ed
This is only the second cam I have degreed. B303 went straight up in my first and an E303 had to be advanced 4 degrees to make it match up the centerline angle. Got to check everything right!? Have a great day.
Yes we have to check everything when it comes to cam shafts especially valve to piston clearance which alot of guys neglect to do when using smaller lift cams, thanks for watching and your input good luck to you
Now that’s an interesting setup 😉
I love the Anderson n92 best myself
couple things, Eds machine is the best!... Edelbrock does not grind their own camshafts, they are actually 30 year old grinds, however they work. When they are referred to as "Lazy" what they are talking about is the opening and closing rates are slower than the "Fast" cams today, or the "lobe intensity" is much slower. Quick way to check intensity is to subtract the advertised duration from the @.050 duration. The higher that number, the lower the intensity. The old RPM grinds are going to be much "lazier" than a modern Xtreme energy/asymetric grind.
Thanks alot Scott.
You're the best also.
I appreciate your comment.
If the initial and total timing are good then it's all good.
My thing is the price point
The package for a 302 is like 3000 from Edelbrock
I can use twisted wedge 170s a voodoo 268 air gap and a 650 vacuum secondary and be just as fast for cheaper
Wich head is better for a 306 . 69 351w or the 302 same year to get more horse power and torque
In most cases the 351 Windsor head is best but the 302 head sometimes have a smaller combustion chamber which will raise the compression I would use either head but the 351 has a slight advantage when it comes to flow numbers, thanks for watching hope this is helpful
I can belive this claim.
224/234/110 +4 is like a single pattern 224/224/107.5 + 1.5 camshaft modified with early exhaust opening so yes, that should work nicely as most camshafts have way to high LSA.
You sound very knowledgeable and I appreciate you watching thanks for your input 😊
1:04 performer edelbrock cam. TL;DR version.
🥝✔️ My wife tries Kiwi fruit, but this Kiwi tries her. Peppers, now that's a fave of mine. Take care, Mr G.
Thanks Terry
What carbide you use for cast heads? Same as aluminum or you switch?
I use multiple porting tools I use grinding stones, sanding rolls , and double cut carbide bits the stones do not work well on aluminum and the double cut takes longer then a single cut bit sanding rolls are great for either one but you go thru alot of them but you want 60 or 80 grit in most case's unless your polishing
looking to cam/valve spring my explorer 5.0/gt40 engine in my Datsun(1984 200sx)...I more interested in the low torque down low vs having higher horsepower.... I know its a compromise I will consider this Edelbrock cam
If it's a stick car you will be fine the only thing I don't like about this cam is that it has the old school 289 firing order on it not the 351 firing order, sounds like you have a nice little ride there an Anderson n41 cam would work out great too
I find the Edelbrock cams a bit lame compared to the other brands. Not that they're no good, just find other brands ramps and grind options better.
recommended x machine ? gotta link please mate 😁
I think that's the one that's the rip off of the motorsport e cam no? 220/220 @ .050" on a 110?
It very well could be I don't know, these companies do rip each other off I do know that the trick flow cams were nothing but a rip off of crane cams as far as the numbers went stage 1 stage 2 and stage 3 but I don't know if that's still the case today , thanks for watching
@@terrygrover6440 Absolutely. My TFS2 is in fact a crane cams version. I'm gonna do some dogging. The edelbrock one I'm referring to I believe they call the rolling thunder cam. This one you have may be different. Thanks for the sbf content!
That Edelbrock cam isnt bad. The only bad thing i would say is it's a little bit old technology on the ramp rates. In a pickup or something heavier might be better if it was a straight pattern.
I base this on 302 base engines with a decent head for the street in mind but also I consider this to be a stickshift cam , my son's car that this cam is in pulls like a freight train and weights 3600 lbs the thing I don't like about the cam is that it has a 289 firing order instead of the 351 w firing order but it makes more power then most of the alphabet cams , we've experimented with alot of cam shafts, compression and where you degree this cam in plays a big part as with any other cam , thanks for watching
Looks like your distributor hold down and bolt are missing
Yes the distributor is just sitting in there , the coil packs and distributor are new he is working on this, thanks for watching
Bring it to your local... Dyno.... And we'll know exactly how that...CAM...works...
This car is full weight that this cam is in and it pulls like a freight train even with stock gears in the rear I would think it's an 11 second car as it sits taking a stab at it thanks for watching my video
Terry you touching cotton bud or shit threw a screen and never touch a wire lol dam peppers
What's up with the rats nest of wires there?
have a hard time listening to someone with a car that looks as if it doesn't run !
This car runs great its getting a 1000 dollars worth of coil packs on it he's changing it over ,it has a 100 dollar short block motor and runs 11s , which I would take any day
You didn't even let us hear it?
The car was not running at the time I made this video everything was being upgraded with the electrical system but it sounds healthy with a little radical idle
Sir you have Instagram or something ? I wanna do some questions im planning a 302 build
No only you tube my son Adam has Facebook you can always shoot him a message, sorry I just seen this