What's The Difference Between a V5 and V13 Climber? (in-depth comparison)
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- Опубликовано: 17 июл 2023
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Развлечения
This is brilliant - the video comparison should be a series. Eye opening seeing a direct comparison and analysis between two climbers really makes taking away workable ideas so much easier.
I agree this format is great, I hope you do more like this! I think it would be good aswell for sam to repeat the problems after the comparison even if you just show the parts were the biggest improvements can be made.
Its so informative seeing other people being coached!
I couldn't agree more!
Yes, pure gold!
Agreed!
Agreed. This format is elementary yet genius. I hope there's gonna be more!
Definitely would have liked to see Sam's follow-up attempts after seeing Louis' betas.
Agreed
Same I'm a v5 climber but have a few v7s and v8s when I know the betas
When they just cut straight to the outro after Louis literally told him to try the betas, I couldn’t believe it
Exactly what I was thinking
YES
Highest Grade: V8
Weight on 20mm edge for 5 sec: 170% (105 lbs added)
Hopefully this helps with your data collection :)
ur a monster man 💪
Highest grade V8
Weight in 20mm edge for 5 sec:
142% (27kg added).
I’m hella weak
damn man respect
@@palomeraleonbut u climb v8 thats awesome good shit
Please make this a series!
This is so interesting and helpful as an intermediate climber! ☺️
Maybe even on harder (over the limit) boulders.
Seeing a pro do a hard climbs sometimes looks so easy and doable. So having a „normal“ climber to compare and pick apart is super interesting!
This is the type of content that makes me so enthusiastic to improve. Although I try to record my projects to look for bad technique I can improve, there must be so many things I must miss because of lack of experience or knowledge. would love to see more of this so I can apply it to my own mistakes!!
The underrated aspect of finger strength is that it gives you more room for error to experiment with different moves and body positions on a climb.
Highest grade: V9
Total weight on 20mm lattice test rung for 10s: 183% (+60kg)
I think that would work out to ~190% for 5s on the BM1000 edges
Really nice to see the small differences!
U need to work on other aspects of ur climbing I think lol
Would love to see more of this kind of stuff! I would be willing to bet that most of your climbing viewing audience (myself included) is in the V4 - V6 range, so the things that Sam was doing are very relatable, and it's nice to get feedback on how to improve.
Sharing this type of analysis is helpful. Please do more of these. I'm a V5 climber and I probably can't do a body weight 5 second hang on a 20mm edge. So, I'd like to see these comparisons explore how people get to V5 with their various weaknesses and strengths. And how to improve those specific weaknesses.
I'd struggle at bodyweight too, on the 20mm. I've done a few V7 boulders, mainly V5 though, and sport climbed 7a+. I'm not sure he's a V5 climber TBH, seems like he's got all the strength to be much higher - just technique and confidence.
@@donnyburgerI agree, if really is a v5 climber that doesn't use fingerboards, must do a ton of weighted pulls to be able to hang over body weight.
edit: the next video is v5-v8 climber in 1 session so that says a lot
Pretty interesting how I also can't do bodyweight on 20mm edge, however I flash half of V6 problems and highest grade was V8 outdoors. I don't train with finger boards.
Hangboard performance shouldn't indicate grade, but I'm really interested to see how much correlation there is. The variance is pretty high between campus board vs climbing grade, but I reckon climbing grade would be a good proxy to estimate finger board performance.
Loved this. I'd love to see someone climbing who is weak and how to overcome that (aside from get stronger!). I can't hang on the 20mm edge at all nor do any pull ups, but I climb at V3 or maybe techy V4s. Sometimes it feels like very strong people just don't realise how much they can 'just pull up' when it's needed.
ahaha "just pull up bro" 😂
Hahaha it is hard when you're trying to coach a weaker climber and the only thing that comes to your mind is "just pull up!"... not realizing you need a lot of strength to do it.
I guess some climbs will always require a lot of strength, but focusing on more techy/delicate climbs will be the forte of a physically weaker climber. Obviously, slabs come to mind as walls that tend to have setting mostly around balance, stretch, and so on. I think there are some good techniques that are relevant to overcome a lack of strength (better use of momentum, maximizing biomechanical advantage by positioning your body correctly, etc), but they're more "case-by-case" than a general statement
Yeah, I come from strength training quite recently into climbing and could do V6 pretty easily by just abusing a good hold and pulling me up with one arm. Feels like cheating and burns a lot of strength. So I fall off quite rapidly as I exhaust my energy. When it comes to technique and and foot work, I struggle quite a lot, but get better fast.
So raw strength is an advantage, but it also can keep you from learning good technique and hitting a plateau in your learning curve.
I climb V5 and can only hang on a 30mm edge for about 8 to 10 seconds. I can't hang on the 20mm edge at all either. I have by far the weakest fingers of anyone I know climbing at my level, and not my a small margin. I have hyper mobility in my finger joints, so they're naturally weaker, but man I wish I could just magically have strong fingers. I genuinely believe if I had the finger strength of one of my friends climbing the same level as me, I could add a full grade or more to my climbing.
@@bibblybopbops441 If you train your hands regularly by climbing or separate, get enough rest (48 h) between and have a good intake in protein and essential fats, your fingers will become stronger and stronger for years. So you will get better and won't reach a plateau for a long time. Just keep going! :)
it would be nice to see Sam trying the boulders with the new aproach, and see how much he can improve just by changing small things, not just by geting stronger.
Fantastic video. The side by side comparison is so interesting and shows the difference of confidence over time, mental problem solving over time, efficiency, etc. Terrific.
Absolutely incredible. I feel I learned so much more from this video than many other ‘coaching-style’ videos. Also great to have the comparison gains someone at my level. But I think the format would work for Louis vs someone at all grades. Best video you’ve put out for ages. More like this please ❤
As a fellow tall V3-V4 Sam, definitely would love to see more Sam on the channel!
Louis this is easily the most helpful video I've seen from you so far, the side by side video analysis is huge. Make more of these please! 😊
Yes. do more of these. Movement is so key in climbing. Really interesting to see the toe vs heal, and how you can rotate it later. Thats key.
I'm confused. If he's the camera man, who's filming?😂
Camera man’s camera man
The cat
the most chill cat ive ever seen
Super interesting ! Keep going on making this side by side comparison ! it's super helpful to understand mistakes that i make without even realising it 🙂
This was a great video and props to the editor for visuals during the technique comparisons! Would love to see more videos in this style/manner!
I climb V8 outside and Sam has better finger strength than me lol (20mm for 5 with 25kgs = 135%)
Always so impressed by people with less strength than me climbing way higher grades (160% but V6)
This is one of my favorite videos you've done. Absolutely top notch stuff!
Loved this! At first I thought the gap between v5 and v13 would be too wide to be interesting, but the analysis/comparison of movement was really helpful.
This was awesome! As a fairly inexperienced climber, super helpful to see the in-depth breakdown of the technique differences here. I've often noticed that people with more experience than me seem to do the same climbs much more efficiently, but it can be pretty hard to put a finger on what they're actually doing differently. Would love to see more like this
Fantastic format, I’d love to see more analysis like this. Super helpful and the dynamic with Sam makes it fun as well as a great learning exercise.
Loved the video! I feel like I always get some great info from Louis' coaching perspective and ability to communicate what makes movements successful. I think it would be very cool to see differences between climbers of different heights at similar grades
This is really helpful- I would love to see more coaching videos like this!
Great video and definitely a lot of takeaways I can focus on as a V5ish climber.
That said - I think the thing about readjusting your grip on the holds, and fluid motion is definitely something good to aspire to, but nothing to beat yourself up over. Clearly a V13 climber can waltz up a V4 (notice how Louis just campuses up to the finishing hold?), but that won’t be the case climbing at the limit. A 9a climber climbing 9a will have the same kind of controlled and methodical movements (IMHO 🫡)
Also - Sam’s heel to toe hop swap was insane. I was like 🤯 when I saw that 😂💪🫡
This is stellar! Would love more videos like this! It really helps to see the same problems projected on different skill/experience levels. Seeing just really good climbers, do problems that I'll probably not do in 5 years is still good content, just way less helpfull and give less insight into climbing and possible improvements. The more of this kind of content with different climbers, experiences and body types the better!
Thank you so much for this great video again, Louis! ❤ You are always explaining so precisely all the differences and all the "small" things we can do to improve, that's so fantastic and always motivating! Would love to have you as climbing coach, if I wasn't living in Germany.. 😅❤
This was awesome! Really hoping you put more of these out! Thanks Louis
This is a genious video - the comparsions were really great and the explainations were really fund and well understandable too. Please more of these.
Yes- please more videos like this 🤩 So educational to see how you analyze the climbs 🙈
Fantastic video. I've been thinking a lot about balance, body position, footwork drills, no-hands climbing lately thanks to Catalyst and Lattice videos as well as Libby Peter's excellent book Rock Climbing. Awesome seeing these ideas applied in a side by side comparison. Quality of movement is such a fascinating concept
Love this! More like this! The in depth video analysis is so so valuable!
Thank you so much for this: have already subscribed!
Just started this great activity (bouldering) a few weeks ago and it’s changing my life @ 52!
Can’t wait to get mileage in tomorrow! Love from an NYC Yank in Osaka Japan!
Would love to see more content like this - I find is really helpful!
Such a nice video with very precise description of the big and small differences between both of you! The side-by-side comparison is sooo useful! I will add that it would have been nice to see Sam climbing again those boulders following your technique/advices to see if he was able to do it at his level
What an incredible demonstration of technique, stage, and teaching. Being able to analyse someone’s climbing and always find a really positive angle and yet also be able to show the possibilities of what that climber could achieve with better positioning is inspired teaching.
I really loved this, and would love to see more with different levels, and different climbing styles. Maybe super skilled static climbers with beginner dynamic climbers, or different level climbers on different types of climbs. Just a lot more, I really loved this
I think it's more reasonable to assume that Louis is not trying as hard relative to his strength level as Sam is, and that's why he appears to be gripping the holds less hard in the video. I'm not saying that he's always pulling harder than Sam, but simply the fact that Louis feels like he isn't pulling hard and it does for Sam doesn't mean he's actually putting less force into the hold than Same is.
Imagine two dead-lifters trying to lift a 200 lb bar, one of which has a 225 lb max deadlift, the other has a 375 lb max deadlift. They play back the video and the stronger guy says "Yeah, you can see you're putting way more force into this 200lb deadlift, look at how hard you're trying. I put a lot less strength into my 200lb deadlift, I didn't try very hard and the deadlift felt much more relaxed for me." I feel like some of that is going on in Louis's speculation here.
Loved the video, it's great to see the differences and your analysis Louis ! Would definitely love more !
This is genuinely a great video- so interesting to see from a coaches point of view and i love the in depth analysis and comparison of the boulders, i feel like i could apply this to some of my own climbing!
Such good information in this video. Answers a ton of subtle questions I always have as to why experienced climbers seem to use such little force.
Best video I have seen aimed at the competent climber looking to see what is needed to take it up a level.
I see people breeze up problems I have just struggled on and think mainly, oh they are just stronger.
Can see now I could gain a lot paying attention to every little difference in their approach.
More of the same video please.
It's probably the best video you ever posted! Please make this a series
This video is going viral! Get ready for worldwide fame Sam the cameraman! This comparison was awesome though. 🙌
That decision for the toe vs the heel was awesome. I never like to opt for a high toe, but they always seem to be the optimal way to position the foot when your about to be standing on top of said foot. Thank you for this video!!!!!!!!!!
This was great to see, and really made me reflect on my own climbing!
This was fascinating! So cool to see those subtle differences between the two of you. A follow up video where we see Sam's attempt to use some of the differences found to improve his ascent of those climbs would be super cool. I think a video where you take climbs that a climber can already do and improve their flow and efficiency would also be super useful as well.
10:50 Every climbing gym needs a chill kitty like that!
Also fantastic climbing advice!
This was very instructive! Awesome content as usual :)
very effective comparison of two climber abilities. Learned a few tips.Thanks!
Love watching coach Louie climb! So floaty. The momentum is really on display here.
As a V5 climber, this is a fantastic video!
I reached v8/v9 and could only crimp barely my body weight for 5 seconds on a 20mm board. The 9c strength test said my power was V9 and that was 100% accurate. I've sent 7 v8-v10 routes (my gym does boulder grades in ranges of 2) to date and 49 v6-v8s. I weigh 173 lbs and came into climbing with incredibly weak fingers. It took me 7 months of climbing and at minimum 5 of hanging just to reach the point where I could hold my own weight.
That being said, because my fingers were so weak, my technique progressed incredibly quickly and I've learned how to do every possible thing I can to minimize the weight my fingers are actually holding, hence why the grade I actually Climb is consistent with my projected grade based off of my strength.
Yeah i had the same experience whit 9c test whit that coming out to 7c sport and i already had 2 7c but i could barely hang my weight, i bet u are realy stronger at 3finger Open drag right?
Same
Tendons are Holding me back
@@goncaloskim 3 Finger Drag is by far my strongest position LOL. I'm way stronger in Open Drag than Half Crimp and when I took the 9c test, in fact, did the first part dragging rather than half crimping
@@Fred-oz3tw That may be the case but I actually think for most people, body awareness and the ability to position themselves and use individual body parts holds them back rather than finger strength. I'm currently climbing consistently v7-v9 but my fingers ARE maxed out. My upper body strength is very high as is lower body strength, flexibility, body positioning (I danced professionally in Hip Hop) route reading, fear management and core strength, which, is kind of how I break down climbing. I'm not maxed out by any stretch of the imagination but BECAUSE my fingers were weak and I was coming from dancing professionally, my ability to use other body parts to get through routes creatively is how I got to v9. At this point, though, there are routes where you actually just have to be able to hold yourself on that one tiny crimp and there ARE no feet so my limiting factor IS finger strength, but for MOST people I see, they actually have fingers that are SIGNIFICANTLY stronger for their body weight than me, but they are stuck on V4/V5 because they only know how to "Pull Harder" on their fingers, rather than drive through feet and engage core and stand up through the body chain and maintain that heel hook for half a second longer to save 40 pounds of downward force on their fingers.
So you totally could be accurate in saying your tendons are holding you back but, in my experience, you can get to v8/v9 before ever being even able to hold your own body weight on a 20mm crimp, and if you cannot then it's probably your technique (which really just boils down to body awareness/ control) and not tendons holding you back
I think this is the most useful and insightful climbing video I've ever seen (and I've watched a lot!) Not so much the strength comparison part, but the direct video analysis after, pointing out not only what the differences in technique were, but showing what those differences actually look like. Brilliant stuff.
Really good stuff, thanks for this! Fantastic video!
Great vid. The strength bit has been done before, as you acknowledge, but the skills comparison is really valuable. More like it please!
Great video! The comparison was really helpful
I loved those video comparisons, very informative!!
I'm glad you focused more on the technique side of things in this video.
love that series i learned so much thanks to this video great work guys
Really great video! I’ve only been climbing for 3 months and I’m progressing fast but with these lessons I believe I can make my sessions last longer and use less energy on problems.
You talk about being able to use confident, riskier beta because of experience and better strength. That reminded me of something my friend once said about gymnastics.
"If you have technique, you don't need to use strength, but strength helps you get technique."
This style of video needs to be a regular thing. So often I follow the same line as a better climber, think I did the same things, can’t send and chalk it up to strength/conditioning. There were a lot of takeaways but just rocking all the way over before reaching for the hold and letting myself swing further out to better use momentum will make a huge difference for me. Thanks!
This was very, very interesting, fun and educational for me. I also vote for a series of these. Well done!!!
Damn the editing is just perfect ! We want moooore
Yeah please do more of these comparison videos, learnt so much thanks
That was so much fun! I'd love to see more vids like this one
Incredibly valuable video. Directly comparing like this is really enlightening for a plebian like myself.
Love this style of video. More in-depth comparisons please!
Loved it! More of this series please!
The Tenzing can placement is perfect in every shot, well played Louis :)
super helpful content, would lvoe to see a series. So many times when I'm at the gym, I see a more experienced climber do a problem I've just completed. But it's like what Neil said, a lot of the times I don't really notice the minute differences between our solutions. This vid definitely gave me a hint as to what better climbers might be doing compared to me.
Would love to see more of this. I finally understand how do pros make it look so easy!
Very interesting and eye opening, I'd love to see more content like this!
very very interesting! edit, I test myself again and now i lift 34kg on 20mm edge (my body weight is 69kg), V4/V5 outdoor, maybe V5/6 indoor. And hello from France :)
Excellent analysis! Great video as always!
I was in this exact climbing gym a month ago in London if not mistaken. Fun to watch!
Would love to see more comparisons in this format. Very helpful.
This style of direct comparison would be awesome for you to continue. Especially if you could include more people - comparing 4 or 5 climbers at the same time and seeing where the similarties are between tackling routes.
Please do more comparison videos! These are really interesting and helpful for a beginner like myself.
Amazing, cat made it to the video! Great to see legendary content made in EustonWall
Genuinely love these style videos.
Climbing is SUCH a spectrum of a sport. So many different styles and stuff.
Thanks for all the interesting insight!!! Really appreciate it
Really enjoyed the video! I am currently about at the same level as Sam (as most climbers probably are) so I can absolutely relate to this feedback. Cheers
such an interesting video, would love to see more for sure!
This is probably the most I've learned from any youtube video about climbing technique
This is so interesting! Please keep doing these 😀
Loved this video. Found it really informative showing the differences
This is a great concept! I would love to see more videos like this. The strength and technique differences are eye opening. There’s a tendency to think harder grades are just strength differences. This needs to be a series for sure!
Probably the best one yet Louis. Very useful information
Straight forward,simple and nice video ❤
This is one of my favorite videos you guys have done! More of this kind of thing, please! It's so helpful for someone who's more like Sam than Louis.
Loved this video, and the super cute cat was an added bonus!! 😍
Would love to see more like this. Very insightful.
Thanks for the video! Super helpful to a V4 climber!
On that heel hook vs toe, the toe also allows your hips to rotate freely whereas the heel locks it in, limiting movement options. Sometimes it doesn't matter, but on that boulder, it made the shift harder.
Dope vid! Would love to see more like it!
Really helpfull! I learned a lot! More like this please!