Dungeon Dudes DETHRONE Echo Knight!? Commander Fighter Subclass Review - D&D 5e Subclass Series

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  • Опубликовано: 19 авг 2024

Комментарии • 96

  • @Xtra_Medium
    @Xtra_Medium 10 месяцев назад +60

    This feels like the Subclass that Purple Dragon Knight wanted to be

    • @chrisvossler8795
      @chrisvossler8795 10 месяцев назад +8

      Based on the Dudes' video about fixing the weakest subclasses, I'm pretty sure that is the case.

    • @Jimbo5900
      @Jimbo5900 10 месяцев назад +2

      Genius insight in this comment wow

    • @robertsilvermyst7325
      @robertsilvermyst7325 10 месяцев назад

      My thoughts exactly.

  • @tylerbarnick8750
    @tylerbarnick8750 10 месяцев назад +27

    To quote the dungeon dudes " Take that purple dragon knight"

    • @URGE
      @URGE  10 месяцев назад

      Thanks for watching!

  • @glitchking666
    @glitchking666 10 месяцев назад +27

    This in my opinion is not just the most powerful fighter, but the most interesting, it gives you a heal as a fighter, not for yourself,but for allies and it scales pretty well. I foresee a lot of players asking their dms to allow this in their games. Great video. Great subclass

    • @URGE
      @URGE  10 месяцев назад +2

      Thanks for watching!

    • @ThatoneGuy-zd4rl
      @ThatoneGuy-zd4rl 10 месяцев назад

      I agree, this definitely does not dethrone Echo Knight on power level but RP wise - man it’s right there.

    • @jizburg
      @jizburg 5 месяцев назад

      And the RP is great. "YOU THERE! GET BACK IN THE FIGHT!" *breaks fear/charm condition*
      "WARLOCK. YOU DONT DIE UNTILL I ORDER YOU TOO" *Trows heal*
      "HEY BARBARIAN AND PALADIN, DO YOU WANT TO LIVE FOREVER?! ATTACK!" *gives them each free extra turn*
      And then attacks 4 times themself.

  • @tiredoldfraggle12
    @tiredoldfraggle12 10 месяцев назад +12

    The Move It! command could be really helpful for shuffling the field. "Barbarian! Get to the front! Wizard! Are you daft? Get away from those!" All of these features combined let you make sure the rest of the party gets to use their abilities to better effect. Your fighter gets to shine as 'the caller' for the group.

    • @URGE
      @URGE  10 месяцев назад

      The battle strategist! Thanks for watching!

  • @tylerfry3930
    @tylerfry3930 10 месяцев назад +13

    I might start a war here, but this feels like a fighter I can run as an NPC directly designed not to steal the spotlight. And so simple to run I'm not filling my attention with bardnor cleric spells.

    • @URGE
      @URGE  10 месяцев назад +4

      That’s a great idea! Always fun to see unique and versatile options for players AND dms! Thanks for watching!

  • @richard_n
    @richard_n 10 месяцев назад +18

    This is a very well designed subclass. It's powerful, but the abilities come online at a reasonable levels. So it's strong, but not overpowered. Plus it gives a fighter tools and roles they normally wouldn't be able to do.

  • @chrisvossler8795
    @chrisvossler8795 10 месяцев назад +7

    This subclass lends itself to weapons that fighters don't normally lean towards: sword-and-board or longbow (weapons that don't give you a bonus action attack).

  • @evansmith2832
    @evansmith2832 10 месяцев назад +11

    Really cool design and a great angle to tackle the martial caster divide. All I have are a couple nitpicks.

    • @URGE
      @URGE  10 месяцев назад +3

      Dungeon dudes did not disappoint with their book! Thanks for watching!

  • @KnicKnac
    @KnicKnac 10 месяцев назад +10

    Not a fan of fighter class, but this fits as a great tactical style of play. Could be ranged or melee too. Feels like a pseudo paladin. Very much enjoy Dungeon Dudes content. Awesome to see others enjoying too

  • @thefloridaman41
    @thefloridaman41 11 месяцев назад +13

    Feels like if the Samurai and PDK had a baby; also I feel like you guys are underrating how good movement mid-initiative can be for a squishy caster. They are effectively getting a free dash action a turn

    • @juamibenito2558
      @juamibenito2558 10 месяцев назад +1

      can't cast shield/absorb elements/silvery barbs/counterspell so it's good but not free

    • @URGE
      @URGE  10 месяцев назад +2

      If you see our ratings, I don’t think you’d say we underrated it ;) also, it is solid but definitely not free as using a reaction can be a big deal sometimes. Thanks for watching!

  • @1rotzy
    @1rotzy 10 месяцев назад +11

    This subclass is everything Purple Dragon Knight wanted to be. How early it was released and the fear of being to strong probably made it weaker, but this fixed everything.
    With Call to Arms amd getting a new turn, does this reload your reaction? So you can counterspell, shield or opportunity attack again? Because that alone makes it so much better.

    • @ZMSKfullpower
      @ZMSKfullpower 10 месяцев назад +2

      " They made purple dragon knight weaker because of feer to not make it op ".
      Meanwhile paladin auras, some eldrith incantations or 5,6,7,8,9 level spells " Am I a joke to you ? ".

  • @joshuabeatty7371
    @joshuabeatty7371 10 месяцев назад +10

    You mentioned an extra fighter, imagine the insane combos you could do with both fighters picking this subclass if the dm allowed it.

  • @griner65
    @griner65 10 месяцев назад +8

    Oooooh I may be rolling up a 10ish level character with my group to go save our OG party from magical jail in Eberron. I was going to a bit of an odd paladin build where it is 5 levels of fighter + cleric. I think this fighter in particular would be perfect for that! I am looking forward to playing the holy fighter that is different than the actual paladin class, and now I am super excited for these extra goodies.

    • @URGE
      @URGE  10 месяцев назад +2

      That sounds awesome! Let us know how it goes! Thanks for watching!

  • @lukesandadordoceu4835
    @lukesandadordoceu4835 10 месяцев назад +12

    reaction attack is great for the party rogue, almost guaranteed sneak attack twice on a round

    • @dakkon74
      @dakkon74 10 месяцев назад

      That is what I immediately thought,

    • @URGE
      @URGE  10 месяцев назад +2

      Yep! That is one of the main points we wanted to mention. With just a little forethought and positioning, it’s basically guaranteed for the rogue! Thanks for watching!

  • @MisterDiceGuy
    @MisterDiceGuy 10 месяцев назад +2

    This feels like a Purple Dragon Knight, Echo Knight, and Champion.
    Echo Knight in power. Purple Dragon Knight in flavor. Champion in simplicity, however not boring.

  • @libertatempugnator9643
    @libertatempugnator9643 10 месяцев назад +4

    I've got character who is pretty much a roman centurion that this is perfect for.

  • @thiagofrias2471
    @thiagofrias2471 10 месяцев назад +2

    I`ve imagine this class being given to the veteran when he is in charge of a group of new DnD players. The roleplay blows to the roof if people in game "respect" the hierarchy that the subclass suggests.
    Through lvls 1 and 2 this player is being prepared to command with this new squadron (the party) and on LvL 2 to 3 some event makes him take the lead.

  • @karatekoala4270
    @karatekoala4270 10 месяцев назад +5

    It's the tactician figure I've always wanted.... Seriously

  • @jonnymazzola7124
    @jonnymazzola7124 10 месяцев назад +1

    I bought the PDF and it's fantastic! This subclass is one of my favourite of the book and I loved your review, I totally agree with everything. I would love to watch an interview with the Dungeon dudes about the book and some more review of their subclasses!

  • @sauceboy8046
    @sauceboy8046 10 месяцев назад +1

    XD this subclass is one of the very few subclasses ive seen that actually made me smile!
    Lol imagine 2 level 20 Commander Fighters run up against a boss with one of them with the new UA alert feat.
    commander #1 sets his initiative right ahead of commander #2 using the Alert feat.
    Commander Fighter #1 attacks four times, and bonus action command the Commander Fighter #2 to attack. Then ends turn with commander #2 up next.
    Commander #2 attacks four times, bonus action command the Commander #1 to attack. Commander #2 The Action Surges, and give Commander #1 an additional turn directly behind him.
    Commander #1 gets a additional turn and attack 4 times, bonus action command the Commander #2 to attack, then Commander #1 Also Action Surges to give Commander #2 ANOTHER TURN! (lol i hope you can see where this is going xD)
    Max lvl fighters have 2 action surges..... They can LITERALLY play Combat Leapfrog!!! XD this is Bonkers!!

  • @mikeunderwood734
    @mikeunderwood734 10 месяцев назад +2

    Definitely enjoying your reviews from this book. This particular subclass might be enough to actually tear me away from my customary spell casters and actually play a Fighter for once.

  • @Ilithrya
    @Ilithrya 10 месяцев назад +1

    Glad to see this kind of build finally in the game. Looking forward to seeing your review of the cosmic warlock.

  • @NegatveSpace
    @NegatveSpace 10 месяцев назад +1

    This class has some interesting features but the main thing that stands out to me is how difficult it might get to try to remember which characters have benefited from the abilities and which havent and which ability they have or haven't benefited from yet. I know there are many people out there who don't like giving abilities limited uses but I wonder if that would make it easier to track than the way it is here.

  • @Leif47
    @Leif47 10 месяцев назад +1

    Don’t forget that with the Move It! Command that it helps anyone who find themselves in melee combat get out of there without having to spend their turn disengaging or running and risking the opportunity attack :)

  • @maw5646
    @maw5646 10 месяцев назад +3

    Alright, they’ve won we back in this book. 🤓

  • @iskandarthegreat0487
    @iskandarthegreat0487 10 месяцев назад

    The commander was one of the only subclasses i hadn't really looked at but WOW! I love this. I dont think ive ever seen a character built around teamwork to this extent and its amazing 😊

  • @julius2790
    @julius2790 10 месяцев назад

    This is EXACTLY the template for the kind of non magical ranger/archer I've wanted to play. Buffs to social skills and great options to empower your teammates. I love, love this subclass and thanks for the review :)

  • @WolfCry791
    @WolfCry791 10 месяцев назад

    Please do more of their content!! I'd also love to see y'all interview them

  • @DandDgamer
    @DandDgamer 10 месяцев назад +1

    I have to think Adaptive Strategy is intentional, as is For Glory!
    For the former, it's a level 3 ability and cantrips are just way stronger than weapon attacks once they scale (especially booming blade).
    For the latter, no one weapon attack is that broken at level 15 that this is unfair (very few attack spells) even if it might be better at some things than others.

  • @Husky_Passion
    @Husky_Passion 10 месяцев назад +1

    2:15 stangely looks like the imperial commands of w40k

  • @Elohist2009
    @Elohist2009 10 месяцев назад +5

    This sounds amazing; the commands really feel like a more powerful battle master adjacent character. I’m something of a fighter main myself. Do you guys review amateur submissions? I just finished two fighter subclasses and was looking for a good place to get some professional feedback if not a full-on review? Cheers!✌🏾

    • @URGE
      @URGE  10 месяцев назад +1

      We are always open to viewer submissions! You can contact us via the email on our page. Thanks for watching!

  • @isaacgraff8288
    @isaacgraff8288 10 месяцев назад +1

    Call to Action has so much that you could do with it, allied mage dispelling a lot of ugly magic, rogue going ballistic with sneak attack, Paladin Smites, Caster dumping insane spells on someone. Call to Action with Adaptive Strategy though.... It is very strong, but doesn't feel broken. Yes the capstone is REALLY strong, but, its a capstone, they're supposed to be strong.

  • @meep0455
    @meep0455 10 месяцев назад +1

    To be fully effective as this class you'd either have to be the first or the last in the initiative order

  • @andyirwin3883
    @andyirwin3883 10 месяцев назад +2

    An interesting class but just like the cosmic warlock is OP as it has resourceless features. The battle commands should have a limited number of uses in line with the battle master.
    I do like the flavour of this one and I don’t normally like fighters. I would take the inspiring leader feat on this character to fit the theme.

    • @ThatoneGuy-zd4rl
      @ThatoneGuy-zd4rl 10 месяцев назад

      Yeah exactly the perfect feat with this

  • @rsgvormax
    @rsgvormax 10 месяцев назад +3

    Do the oath of the hexes next pls

  • @erikwilliams1562
    @erikwilliams1562 10 месяцев назад +1

    You been practicing that disclaimer boy!!

  • @1rotzy
    @1rotzy 10 месяцев назад +1

    If I was gonna make a character with this subclass it would have to be a Drill Sergeant character. Like Soldier from TF2, or G1 Michigan from AC6, or Major Payne.
    "Show me your War face! AAAAAAH! Not good enough, work on that!"

  • @AdorkableDaughterofNyx
    @AdorkableDaughterofNyx 10 месяцев назад +1

    this actually fixes the rogue's damage by itself at level 3.

  • @theblindbuildergrandminuti5648
    @theblindbuildergrandminuti5648 10 месяцев назад +1

    Commander supports a samurai would be pretty nutz.

  • @TheMoisku
    @TheMoisku 10 месяцев назад +1

    I have a nightmare of two of these guys "call to action" each other.

  • @toms9738
    @toms9738 10 месяцев назад +2

    Free skills make me smile

    • @URGE
      @URGE  10 месяцев назад

      Gotta love it! Thanks for watching!

  • @vladimirserpov6773
    @vladimirserpov6773 10 месяцев назад

    Also a good subclass for a newbie player. Not as boring as champion, not trash as PDK, easier to manage than battlemaster and/or echo knight + holds goos potwntial for persuasion-based approach in out-of-battle situations
    Most importantly, newbie would feel themselves part of the team in every situation

  • @Phoenixcaptain46
    @Phoenixcaptain46 10 месяцев назад +5

    I feel the level 3 abilities are just way too much. Double proficiency/expertise is stronger than many fighters get at level 3. The basically unlimited use of the Battle Commands I also see just being way too powerful. Fight On! being a heal and not temp HP makes it one of the best heals in the game. It basically gives the entire party Second Wind, which itself could be a level 3 ability (which gives me the idea of a Battlefield Medic subclass, not a Commander). Coordinated Command basically breaks the action economy with For Glory! The last two abilities feel more fairly balanced for the levels they are received at. I like the concept of it, but just too overpowered.

    • @URGE
      @URGE  10 месяцев назад

      Best part is that a DM can easily adjust it if it feels too strong. Put proficiency uses per day or rest or once per character per day etc. etc. several tuning “knobs” the DM can adjust if desired while still keeping the same abilities and functionality.
      Having the ability consume the players reaction does have a cost, so it isn’t completely free. Also, the healing is once per character per rest which puts some limitations on it, but again can be tweaked by DM by having it once per player per day, X uses total per day, etc. Thanks for watching!

    • @DatLeafyBoi
      @DatLeafyBoi 10 месяцев назад

      One of the big things is that even the BATTLE MASTER thought it was wise to heavily limit giving another creature a weapon attack by making commander's strike take a reaction, an bonus action, an attack, and a superiority die. Having no limit is absolutely insane

    • @AnaseSkyrider
      @AnaseSkyrider 6 месяцев назад

      @@DatLeafyBoi And in One D&D Playtest 7, Commander's Strike no longer uses up a bonus action. You give up 1 attack to give your ally the ability to make a +1d8 damage attack as a reaction.
      Commander, meanwhile, is giving up a bonus action (huge when you talk about the space of many fighters taking things like PAM and GWM) and an ally's reaction, without the +1d8.
      This kind of feature is great for any party member who has more on-hit damage than you do or who has 1/turn features like Sneak Attack, but otherwise, giving up a bonus action is not a trivial cost in the modern space of 5e. So many multiclasses and feats are rendered significantly less impactful. PAM's butt-strike does less damage, GWM's trigger occurs infrequently.
      You become less of an island of DPR and work more as a team. Odds are that the best person to use that command on isn't you, and also doesn't have the best defense, which means them going down before you do is more likely, which makes your command less powerful. Everyone points to the Rogue with their sneak attack, who have much less HP and likely much less AC than you will.

  • @ThatoneGuy-zd4rl
    @ThatoneGuy-zd4rl 10 месяцев назад

    This is pretty awesome - another way to make fighter not feel so white bread boring. Feels really good too - DD’s took their time with this one.

  • @ShrankTheFirst
    @ShrankTheFirst 10 месяцев назад +1

    This feels like a 5e version of the Tome of Battle's (Book of Nine Swords) White Raven Crusader or Warblade.

    • @ShrankTheFirst
      @ShrankTheFirst 10 месяцев назад

      I mean Call to Action works a lot like "White Raven Tactics"

  • @Tusitala1967
    @Tusitala1967 9 месяцев назад

    Take Inspiring Leader and Healer and you're passing out 1d10+15 +1d6+19 x # in party in healing, and 18 temp hps (with 16 Cha) x # in party per short rest.

  • @umusuarioqualquer5491
    @umusuarioqualquer5491 10 месяцев назад +1

    This seems fucking awesome to play

  • @pauldobos2982
    @pauldobos2982 10 месяцев назад +1

    Over tuned, you can't give unlimited uses of the command 3rd level feature, needs uses like psi warrior double your proficiency bonus uses per day, battle Master can only pull of like 5 commanding strikes, the commander's unlimited gifting of reaction attacks is broken.

    • @URGE
      @URGE  10 месяцев назад +2

      I think it’s more tuned than you give it credit. For example, battle master gets 4 superiority dice that refresh on short rest (and long) and at 15 if you start combat without any you get one back. So with 2 combats in a day and no short rests, you’d have 5. With 1 short rest you’d have 9 uses. I believe the typical average short rest is 2 or 3 per day which would give you around a dozen uses per day on average. Also on average combats last 3 rounds (these are general averages, so take with a grain of salt depending on your play group and averages). With this subclass using your ability on EVERY turn would for 4 combats would on average be 12 uses. Of course it’s unlikely that you’d use it every turn on either subclass, but average number of uses is about the same per day. Also, don’t forget that Commander’s Strike adds your die to the damage which is an extra d12 of damage. With this subclass, there is no bonus to the attack. Another point of comparison is there are more options for the battle master and some of them do not use any of your action economy (such as Bait and Switch or some of the on hit abilities like Disarming Attack) whereas this subclass uses your Bonus Action AND an ally’s reaction. There is a cost to using the abilities. I think in general, for most playgroups, it’ll end up being pretty balanced, but of course for some groups play style and resting/encounter tempo, it may be a bit much. I hope that at least gives you some additional insight to consider. Also, it’s Homebrew/unofficial content anyways, so the DM could always just put a number cap on the uses per day like proficiency bonus or something if it feels a bit much too often. Thanks for watching!

    • @pauldobos2982
      @pauldobos2982 10 месяцев назад

      I guess it is situational, my party having just survived a 14 round fight the Commander would come out ahead, shorter fights and more short rests the battlemaster does compete. Its just every other subclass gets a resource pool (sorcery points, psionic dice, superiority dice, soul knife, ki etc..., this keeps things balanced regardless of adventuring day length, number or combats, number of rests. Not having a resource pool makes this an outlier. I would allow the class but give it the psi warrior double your prof bonus uses per day, or match battlemaster with fewer uses but recover on short rest.@@URGE

    • @pauldobos2982
      @pauldobos2982 10 месяцев назад

      Also thanks for taking the time to chat.

  • @theonlymatthew.l
    @theonlymatthew.l 10 месяцев назад

    I believe u can only take "Resilient" once

  • @Wildctas6552
    @Wildctas6552 4 месяца назад

    PLEASE COME BACK!!!!!

  • @ApollyonEx
    @ApollyonEx 10 месяцев назад

    That 18th level feature seems a little too late if imo I wish it was a lot earlier and gets more uses or something at certain levels

  • @BaronVonMonkey
    @BaronVonMonkey 10 месяцев назад

    Looks fun

  • @optimus2200
    @optimus2200 9 месяцев назад

    big claim but darn thats strong !!!!
    my issue it doesnt gove anyting for the fighter themselfs

    • @darkersix6148
      @darkersix6148 2 месяца назад

      I don't know, Wisdom save proficiency and advantage against frightened and charmed are pretty huge, and expertise in a fighter (even if limited) isn't half bad either. The fighter main class chassis gives lots of good stuff, this covers a major Fighter weakness of "single target damage and not much else" really well.

  • @karatekoala4270
    @karatekoala4270 10 месяцев назад +2

    Dude, pair this character with a rogue....

    • @URGE
      @URGE  10 месяцев назад

      Best friends for sure with the rogue! Thanks for watching!

  • @ZMSKfullpower
    @ZMSKfullpower 10 месяцев назад +1

    The whole idea is quite nice but the subclass itself does not boost the fighter himself, wich he desperatly need as martial class ( mainly because WOTC designed martials SO poorly and lazily ) and again like for literally every fighter subclass this one too has really weak final ability as for level you gain it. Mages on 13-14 lv may literally clone themselfs but this fighter on 18 lv I remind !!!! can.......... just toss his action surge to someone else.......

    • @AnaseSkyrider
      @AnaseSkyrider 6 месяцев назад

      Anything YOU contribute to the party is YOUR powerlevel, not somebody else's. Pass Without Trace, and so many other support spells, are amazing because of what YOU do to your PARTY. Nobody is out here trying to argue that Twinned Spell + Haste is worthless because it doesn't increase YOUR powerlevel, so why would the same be true here?
      Fighter has the most consistent single-classed scaling of the martial classes, with some of the best defenses and higher HP. Healing your allies, getting them out of dangerous positions, removing certain conditions, giving them reliable extra attacks, and buffing their damage -- are all incredibly strong things that we constantly give spellcasters high credits for being versatile enough to be capable of.
      Putting that kind of spread of utility/support on the Fighter chassis is incredibly strong since the class itself already does well. And while there's more competition for your bonus action if you do so, you CAN still take those penultimate combos like PAM+GWM that does as much as it does to make an optimized Fighter that competes with broken spellcasting. Not to mention that you get most of what you need at level 3, so there's still lots of room for optimization within multiclassing too.
      Frankly, I don't even know what to say about your distaste for Call To Action. You've giving up an action to give someone an entire second turn. That's so insanely powerful. Everyone in your party should be begging for a short rest just so you can give one of them a second turn on round 1.

  • @ceerawlins3412
    @ceerawlins3412 10 месяцев назад

    Battle command is busted....you can bring up a downed party member from 120 feet away

    • @RocKaFella57
      @RocKaFella57 9 месяцев назад

      Also there's basically no limited uses for half of the commands...

  • @RLKmedic0315
    @RLKmedic0315 10 месяцев назад +1

    I like your content, but your sound is horrid. Please consider improving your sound quality.

    • @URGE
      @URGE  10 месяцев назад +1

      We just started using this new system and are trying to improve it asap. Thanks for watching and feedback

  • @thefloridaman41
    @thefloridaman41 11 месяцев назад +2

    First

    • @yasch3696
      @yasch3696 10 месяцев назад +2

      How is this video 11 minutes old but you commented 3 days ago 😂

    • @URGE
      @URGE  10 месяцев назад +1

      That’s what I’m saying!?

  • @nathanbrehm1085
    @nathanbrehm1085 10 месяцев назад +1

    I love this, but my current dm would never allow it...

  • @refinedbrass
    @refinedbrass 10 месяцев назад +2

    Anyone else think of making a drill Sargent or Lt.Dan..... omg what about a giff major Payne

    • @URGE
      @URGE  10 месяцев назад

      Brilliant :D thanks for watching!