Psychonauts 2 - #19 - Green Needle Gulch
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- Опубликовано: 20 авг 2024
- Everything here has been through a lot.
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Edited by Carrie Floyd
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#PlayFrame #Psychonauts2
When Dan started talking about the amount of empathy in this game, it just hit the nail on the head. This game is so good
Yeah. While I appreciate the edgier humour in the first game, I really do love the approach to storytelling here.
@@KeybladeMasterAndy for myself, the humor was a big turn off. So the sequel has been fantastic
I love how Bob's Vine is just an extension of himself, begging for help under the years of alcoholism and self-loathing. Especially when the door is placed on Bob's forehead rather than the back of his head, showing that he really wants help but is too afraid to actually ask it himself.
This is what i got. Even if the vine isnt technically Bob himself, its someone close enough to him to ask someone to help him.
I never realized, but that really is the case throughout the series: forehead mind entry is generally more willing than the back of the head. An interesting, if slightly uncomfortable, realization.
@@sillykola50
My favorite tidbit from the first game is that if you try to use the pyschic portal on other kids, you are not allowed. They knew that while it's iffy to enter the mind of someone without their permission (even if it's to benefit them), it would be HORRIBLE to have that power over children.
The euphemisms used to help show the isolation from alcoholism: searching at the bottom of a bottle for answers, being literally the only one on an island unto yourself, worrying about drowning out your sorrows. I wonder what his mental garden is going to look like when it dries out.
Also bottles in the ocean - the last ditch method of those marooned (alone, on a desert island) to get a message out, to seek help from anyone. An uncomfortable, if apt, metaphor.
The song playing is also a variant of "what do you do with a drunken sailor."
"But I was young and I panicked. But that's no excuse." Nice to see Ford actually taking responsibility.
7:32 certainly brings new meaning to the lyric "drowning in my fears".
So I'm just gonna give you all a fun coincidence(?) I stumbled across.
Lucy (Nona) and Ford were an item, so it's almost like Ford is Raz's great uncle. A 'Grunkle Ford' if you will.
Add to this that Ford was messing with forces beyond his control, in the woods behind a tourist trap, and well...
...All we need is a one eyed triangle.
It is a coincidence that if Ford and Lucy got married he would be Grunkle Ford, ranger of the Questionable Area.
“Grunkle Ford” I need to see art of that now!!!
A particular piece of praise I've seen for Psychonauts 2 is how *well* it deals with the mental states of it's chatacters.
Unlike the first game, every time you enter someone's mind, it's either with their explicit permission, or at the request of a loved one who's worried about them. And while the game is a comedy at heart, it's always respectful enough to never directly make light of what people with various mental disorders experience, or what the people around them go through.
(For ethical purposes, sentient vines count as loved ones.)
@@timothymclean they do when they are the only companion of a psychic that can talk to plants thats isolated in the woods. In all other circumstances, make sure the plant has a power of attorney to make decisions on behalf of someone else.
In a slightly less irrelevant tone, it's also great that also enemies and hazards seen to be symbolic of the characters problems. Like theres regrets in Bob's mind sure, but the biggest hazard is all the alcohol flooding the area. It's almost as if Bob's regrets are less of a problem for him as opposed to his drinking and isolation
It's a pleasant surprise that Raz actually took a very serious lesson to heart, instead of glancing over it like much media of children making mistakes does. He learned that fiddling with people's brains is a bad idea, sure, but he also took away the more critical lesson that what they can do is very powerful and shouldn't be inflicted on anyone without their express consent or a very good reason and responsible oversight.
It also shows how raz has matured
I love that the Bad Moods see Raz as a psychiatrist in a chair.
It's a nice touch. Especially since when you are just in a terrible mood, anyone trying to help feels like an enemy since you want to stay mad.
Man, Psychonauts is SO GOOD! The way the enemy design is grounded in psychology and how the feelings they're based on make you feel, like the Bad Mood giving you tunnel vision, is some of the best narrative use of game mechanics I've ever seen. And they hit it out of the park with every enemy!
I just realized while watching this episode that Panic Attacks move super-fast, multiply, and are susceptible to Time Bubble for the same reason…another great example of theming informing gameplay and Double Fine’s dedication to humanize (and not trivialize) mental health struggles.
@@chrisj.3978 Yup. And doubts slow you down, regrets weigh on you heavily, and bad ideas blow up in your face. Just, y'know, literally in this case.
Not to mention the best way to deal with judgement is to take the power away from them. This game is VERY thoughtful in it’s design.
I love the usage of "What shall we do with the Drunken Sailor" in the music when sailing in Bob's mind.
Haha, is that what the theme was! I always loved it, but now I can see how fitting it is.
I started to suspect that Bob's mom may have had a drinking problem after the first two lines of dialogue that we heard from Child Bob: he told her that it was time for his recital (making me think that she was inattentive or forgetful) and he announced that he had made dinner (showing that he had an unusual amount of responsibility for managing the household as a child).
And that final scene with all the hidden bottles "blooming" out of the shrubbery. In short, Psychonauts is good.
The level design dealing with Bob's mothers alchoholism did ring home with me a little. Having had a mother with the same issues, I can see the cleverness of the level. The hidden bottles of booze strewn across the entire level a sign of alchoholism. My mother would hide empty bottles in places she thought no one would look, such as cupboards, so having all the bottles hidden in the shrubbery makes perfect sense.
Sorry, I accidentally commented using my dads account. I'm using the phone he gave me.
The bottles are also hidden under the water...until Bob gets close, which point the deception is revealed (because he knows all her hiding places)
And then the final room where the bottles are revealed looks like a church/funeral service. The secret finally comes out when alcoholism becomes deadly. My dad was a (pretty obvious, in retrospect) alcoholic for a long time, but we never put two and two together until he ended up in the hospital.
Man, I'm ashamed to admit I didn't get that Bob's mum was an alcoholic until this video. I assumed all the references to the greenhouse were depression causing her to hyperfixate on gardening. I missed the line about the plants dying.
My father was in a similar situation. He would always hide alcohol in his bathroom or just random cabinets. I cried a little the further Dan got in, but they were happy tears! 🥲 this game is SO good.
So if Raz is related to Lucrecia, is it possible his family has an affinity for hydrokinesis, and that his belief in the curse is what makes the water come to life and grab at him?
He's doing it to himself?
Addressed in the post-game.
So, Hatboxes. Hats became incredibly popular as a status symbol in Victorian Britain. Having a fancy hat, such as a top hat, implied you were a fancy person. But, as now, fancy things are kind of impractical. Most people just wore them to parties or formal occasions. So, you got a box to protect your hat, as well as store all your hat accessories. Oh yeah, hat accessories, like a brush to brush your hat which - if you were a real high society man - was probably made of felted beaver fur.
Everything that happened reminds me of all the truly messed up psychological experiments of the 60s and 70s, back in the age of experimentation.
But like, slightly better because (outside of what Ford did at the finish), they were only experimenting on themselves and didn't know what they were getting into because they were on the bleeding edge of the tech rather than because some scientist behind a mirror didn't tell them what was happening.
I love how the elderly have that "elderly person" tremble to them. Nice touch.
Edits: WOW, THAT HIDEOUT IS PRETTY!
The crazy part about this whole maligula reveal is that Granny is the one who warns you away from "fortune tellers" the strongest, so she's basically dropping big hints not to trust her.
I love how Dan is talking to Raz "after this we are teaching you how to swim buddy", or just "wachaa doing buddy?" when a jump goes wrong:D it really sells how good the characterization is and how Raz is just a sweet kiddo and how it makes the player want to help him out
You never know when you could trigger a mental urge and unleash a Molotov wielding security guard upon the world
I am the milkman my milk is delicious
I freaking love the touch with Lili's voice too, just such a clever idea. Same with the Bad Moods - it's cool to see them find combat applications for every one of your mental abilities this time around, and their design definitely throws an interesting wrinkle into any combat encounter from how differently you have to approach them.
"the cuteness aggression response" yes this
Fun thing: Yes, hat boxes are for fancy hats :) One needs to have a safe place for their fancy hat so it doesn't get squished and misshapen, or eaten by moths or something. The hat boxes in Psychonauts are really tall, maybe they're for top hats.
Less fun thing: Alcoholism, or at least the propensity for alcoholism, tends to run in the family. Part of it might just be the likelihood of repeating your parents' patterns but, iirc, there is an actual genetic trait that increases the risk of getting addicted. If Bob's mom had a drinking problem, he was liable to develop one too. :/
Hatboxes were used to keep your good hat (that you'd wear to special occasions or to church) safe from being crumpled, crushed or weathered by the elements. It was probably cheaper for a lot of folk to have a container to keep one fancy hat safe than to buy a second fancy hat should the first get ruined.
I love how this game manages to tackle very serious subjects and manages to keep it very fun, interesting and tasteful! That's hard to balance!
I want to shout out the convos between ford and raz at the start of the mission. They are done so beautifully between the tones and the animations, and I absolutely think having that ability to choose what dialogue comes first is a beautiful piece of mechanical work. In a book or film those lines would come one after another, like clockwork every time, but in a game... maybe raz is too afraid or takes pity to challenge ford with the "what you did was wrong", maybe it gets said first as anger, maybe last as a person tries to work out if he regrets it, truley, under everything. Ford's reaction sells it. He knows it's deserved, and the way it's played makes it feel like a natural piece of the conversation every time.
And again, before this, when Raz is gushing over the facility, and you can see every comment is a stab at Ford's heart. People only know the good, and never the bad.
There goes Dan, opening the psychoisolation chamber first try and skipping the (admittedly simple) puzzle that stumped me for a solid hour. This playthrough is an absolute joy.
Was it something to do with the seagulls landing in front of the switches? I noticed it was a different number each time...
@@azukar8 It's a puzzle he's solved before as well - colored switches, with a key telling you the correct order. The tricly part of this one is just that it's *really* easy to miss the key on the side of the chamber.
And of course Dan lucked into the correct solution on his first blind guess, didn't even realize it was a puzzle.
@@Riyshn Actually the seagulls are a secondary clue to the solution. The first one has one seagull land by it, the second two seagulls, and the third three seagulls.
The voice actress for the Moth was driving me crazy because I couldn't place where else I'd heard her, but she (Amber Hood) also played Kuro and the Divine Child in Sekiro.
Huh, I wouldn't have guessed it was her--I thought the moth was voiced by the English VA for Kyubey.
Amber Hood also voiced Little Oly and some of the Rainbow Squirts in Psychonauts 1!
His mom's alcoholism is significant because alcoholism can be genetic. I have to be very careful around alcohol because I have a long family history of alcoholism, so if I get started in that direction I'm basically screwed.
Although I am confused that his mother's name is the Spanish word for Aunt. Is Tia a common name?
Hatboxes are for storing fancy hats, especially in the time when fancy ladies were expected to wear giant hats festooned with ornaments. They're definitely one of those oldfashioned oddities now, since we don't have much of a fancy hat culture anymore.
Tia could've been short for something like Tatiana.
Tia can be a nickname (Tiana or Tatiana) and sometimes is just used as a name (especially in the 1970-90s). I wonder if the overlap between it and "Tia Maria" (the name of a sweet liquor) was also an intentional choice to further underscore the alcoholism.
Honestly this whole situation with Lucy and Maligula is just such a mess that I blows mind how real it feels.
-FINALLY!! the Zanotto mix-up has been cleared, also him (un)attending the Gulch would explain why the vines grew Bomb & Carnivore parts
-yeah back then Hats used to be far more predominant & high maintenance, Baseball caps really revolutionized the Hat quality
-congrats, you found one of the Figments that gave Jirard the most trouble, I'm not even kidding that grass & the palm tree next to Tia's bottle are weirdly well hidden
-I'm so glad they found a way to make the Clairvoyance useful outside of just visual comedy
“I used to keep the cinnamon over there”
Ford: OH NO THE MEMORIES
Poor Bob! I feel so much pain and empathy from him! And I kind of figured that Bob would be in the worst mental state of the Psychic Seven because while everyone lost contact with each other after The Battle of Grulovia and the other couples in the group (Ford and Lucy, Compton and Cassie) just became seperated from each other, Helmut DIED (kinda, until recent events) at the Battle! Bob lost the love his life that day! No wonder he's so closed off and repressed! I can't wait to see how Bob and Helmut are going to be reunited with each other because it's going to be so cute and emotional!
Im glad they dont get too deep into the morality of the situation, other than firmly proclaiming its wrong, since it would be such a deep and serious subject. Not that i wouldnt like the discussion but i feel it would basically take up 2-3 more minds minimum to handle it.
You'd have to handle it like FOrscythe or Cruller, where there's multiple "minds" for a single individual, representing them at different moods/states/etc. Or just have a really massive level, which might involve overstaying your welcome: the formula really works best with just a dip.
@@treyslider6954 exactly. There would have to be a firmer stance on the subject which i feel would require much more time to unpack and characterize.
@@treyslider6954 a physical neural implant would be place to start from, I think. That said, I acknowledge this may not be the time/place to dive into such things.
They are meant to start discussion
Ford is such a broken man (emotionally) and getting to experience and dig through (and reassemble mentally) that breaking gives us such a great device for psychonauts to explore.
I agree. The mind of Bob level brilliantly clever. I'd like to add that carnations are symbolic of a mother's love.
4:00: "I'm too busy doing story things to be completionist," Dan says as he goes out of his way to grab a collectible. I think Dan might have his completionist-o-meter calibrated differently than mine...
28:20: I love this simple little gag.
9:45: Raz should never play Pokémon Go, for his own good.
20:50: Friggin' names.
28:00: That prompt is pretty hilarious when you can so clearly see the emotional baggage, as Raz says that.
29:20: I guess they're for hats you really don't want to crush?
42:40: Thanks for the cue, Raz!
So clever done! I love the commentary. "What are you doing out here?" " Honestly don't know". Same.
I'm guessing the "water" in bobs mind is so aggressive because it's not water at all, more like stomach acid, explains the color, the bubbles, the burping and the instant grabbing for everything.
I think it's meant to be alcohol
I did not expect to tear up at Bob asking Raz not to go but...then again, this has just been heartbreak again and again with these characters
when you are deep in a funk your mind turns into a swamp, this game is incredible
Before you turn on the Astralathe, you can complete Green Needle Gulch and all previous mental worlds.
Mission now, angry later.
also known as - the part where Dan registers that Truman isn't a member of the Psychic 6.
22:40 Kinda waiting for the storm which lifts the island into space.
Lemme guess: hopped back into Outer WIlds when the DLC dropped?
9:44 you can't tell me the developers didn't deliberately put that gap there for this very reason.
Considering how many players I've seen fall into that gap doing PRECISELY that, I think you might be right xD
Said the same thing to myself when it happened to Dan. Cant remember if i did it too but i wouldnt be surprised.
Wow, still surprised that the studio was allowed to give the characters vices like smoking, chewing, and drinking.
EDIT: I should probably state that I posted this comment before Dan hopped into Bob's mind. Alcoholism is no laughing matter.
This is my favorite level in the game. I feel that it hits its themes perfectly, and you really feel for everything Bob has gone through.
Even thoufh these characters are new, they still feel known and well written.
Wait... Did the two gay men get the most beautiful minds in the game? I like it
Its part of what attracted them to eachother. You'll see when they get to the Helmut portion.
Hate to break it to you, but Dan beat that level at least two parts ago!
I would love to see a psychologist talk about the different minds of this game
Because so far Bob is probably my favorite mind just for being absolutely mood kindred.
@@CommissarMitch I'd recommend thought bubble
So I just realized I guessed the Lucy thing based on the artwork of young Lucy,it's the nose,which just goes to show how well the characters are designed that a drawn image of a character as a young woman can be seen in the older version
This game just gets better and better the further it gets.
worth noting that alcoholism and addiction tend to run in the family to some extent: you see your parents using alcohol or whatever to cope, and that suggests to the young mind that it is a good means of coping.
Big fancy hats with delicate decorations on them don't do well if you let them get crushed. I mean, even modern cheap hats tend to become worse for wear if they get crushed. But these days we don't have a habit of wearing hats in the same way. Hat boxes tend to vary in size and shape depending on the hat they were designed to contain.
Also I love how Bob's headspace is full of bodies of water that are actually alcohol. It's a subtle piece of world building.
The Bad Moods are definitely a good enemy to introduce this late in the game.
Oh man, this level is so pretty... but I kinda had trouble with it on my first go-around. Those stupid Bob bulbs never stopped talking...
so Raz went into Ford's mind in the post office... and exited his mind running in the woods in the questionable area, with Ford feet away running to tackle him.
WTF were their bodies DOING while Raz was having his little psychic adventure!?
I assume Raz, upon returning to his body, bolted out of the room and Ford had to chase him down. Raz got all the way to the woods before Ford caught up to him. (Yes, Ford can teleport, but he's reeling from the same revelations he's dropping on Raz right now, plus being mentally whole for the first time in what is almost definitely decades)
I think Ford just teleported them there. It's his speciality after all.
I guess Ford came to his senses and dragged Raz out there because he knew what he had to do.
I suspect Ford did some teleportation of his own, but Raz is young, and wily, and pissed. He'd lead Ford on a merry chase before he could be intercepted in the Questionable Area.
Please don't make me cry again before class
Burning everything in Sasha's room is one of if not the best way to farm psitanium
I would have loved it if after Ford tells the truth of the curse that Raz suddenly can swim.
It will not unlock any areas, he just does not die in water.
That'd be really damn funny.
To be fair, a lifelong traumatic fear of water doesn't go away that easily.
But in the post game Raz does get a different animation for falling in water, and it's cute.
Also, even if Raz knows it's okay to be in water, now, nobody's ever taught him how to swim, before, so he would still drown, anyways.
Bob is my favorite. This is my favorite level
I like Bob a lot, but Psi King sets a VERY high bar for "best" that I'm afraid just didn't cut it.
@@treyslider6954 the Psy King level is fun but it’s a lot. I don’t know, I just really want to give Bob a hug. Poor man’s been through so much.
Just realized that it's called green needle gulch, because of that thing where you either hear "green needle" or "brain storm"
Does this mean Raz is technically the mole, inadvertently?
Will have to watch the rest of this video and find out...I hope we find in this episode.
He might be an inadvertant agent of whatever force(s) have a mole in the Psychonauts, but if so, he's not the only one - he might be a mole, but he's not the mole.
Fun fact: the sailing tune comes from the old "What do you do with a drunken sailor" shanty
Bob is Lili’s uncle. By helping him, he’s effectively healing her family
HAH! Hilariousl random glitch, when Raz is jumping into Bob's head at 21:56 a bottle on the side table vanishes. Literally between one frame and the next
I was wondering why you would want/need invulnerability while using clairvoyance. That makes sense.
Gotta be careful that Lily doesn't developp that kind of drinking problem in the futur...
This mind be hitting me straight in the Outer Wilds nostalgia
Hopefully there aren't any anglerfish
The story reveals are pretty cool, but even if the "curse" that affected Raz's family isn't a curse Psychonauts is a series with enough odd things that curses probably do exist in some unconventional form.
9:03 Whoa whoa wait what?! Isn't that exactly what the Delugionists want? That sounds a mite like what *the mole in the psychonauts* would want to happen.
Hearing Bob say dont go really hit me in the feels.
Yes, hat boxes are for hats, and yes, they do need custom luggage and/or specialized protective storage. Most modern hats are either resilient enough they don't need protection or of a type where it isn't worth bothering but look up some vintage styles. Hell, look up some of the stuff reenactors and period dress enthusiasts wear!
I saw a Steam review saying this games is sadness and mental health problem, but with a funny hat.
Oh, surviving secretly is TIGHT!
wow wow wow. Wow.
Brian Sommer who dose Bob is a great voice actor but his voice for Bob always make me think of Steve Smith of The Red Green Show.
Bob...makes me increddible sad...
Only Raz's father has the blocked memory because it happened when Raz's father was a kid
28:26 My theory... If they age up the characters in a future game... THIS will be her voice, I mean she DOES sound older.
Yes, some people did have specific boxes for their hats, especially if you have a felt top hat, or something similar.
I thought Bob was a plant psychic, not a diVINEr.
That made me spit out my drink, hahaha
Outer Wilds DLC out, are you going to be playing it? I'd love to see your take on it, now that I've completed it :) Also, as to your comment "maybe you weren't the one with the drinking problem, maybe *she* was," as someone with drinkers in my family I can tell you that it tends to get passed down. Old habits are even harder to break when they go back multiple generations.
I could swear that the voice of those head plants uses the same voice actor from Pey'j from Beyond good and evil
29:18 - Do the cases we put our marching band hats (shakos) in count as hat boxes? Cause, yeah... that's about the only "hat box" I would've ever seen.
25:35 That... That hit hard.
interesting how Rasputen does the thing (on a much smaller scale) that was done here at the beginning of the game. Nice foreshadowing.
Not sure what "thing" you're talking about?
@@treyslider6954 messing with people's minds irresponsibly
29:00 wow, that dang figment took me HOURS to find!
Hat boxes tend to be a bit more squat. I think they were mostly used for top hats, which could very easily crumple if damaged.
Often for very fancy ladies' hats, which would be covered in all kinds of ornaments.
Hey, Dan, did you know that Bob Zanotto is not voiced by Jack Black ??
Ok, this one got me better than it should have. Congrats.
This was the only level I really struggled with for figments... the blending in ones were... irksome.
Many people did. The banana in particular seemed to be a problem.
They've really gone above and beyond on this.
Bob Zanotto kinda sounds like a Jim Henson designed character. Kinda looks like one too.
In a way I guess ford could be considered raz great uncle
i don't own a hatbox...
except that I cut up a larger cardboard box to fit two hats so they wouldn't get crushed when I pack them.
I'm always conflicted watching Dan be a himbo when playing games between charmed and frustrated.
This is where it all ended parappa
I expected Psychonauts 2 to be good but this is just special. 😙👌
The song from the trailer is pog
Bob's mind is my favorite :)
So does this sequence happen within a mind, or are they back in the real world?
EDIT: Nevermind. I guess it's just difficult to tell when we exit Ford's mind.
Can't You revisit Ford's mind to get back to that missed conversation?
Maybe. If you go back postgame, there's nothing there. Not sure if he could go back for it now. (I made the exact aame miatake on my playthrough.)
Last time I was this early playframe was in the middle of psychonauts 1