Abandon Ship! Coast Guard Rescue Beneteau 523 in the Atlantic
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- Опубликовано: 8 фев 2025
- What would cause the captain and crew to abandon ship in the Atlantic ocean? There was no sailboat disaster here, but a coast guard rescue helicopter plucked them from the ocean after they called mayday from their Beneteau Oceanis 523. Captain Thomas Hackspiel and his crew of two men set out from Norfolk and were rescued 150 miles off Cape Hatteras. Weather expert Chris Parker chimes in on what might have caused this sailboat crew to need rescue.
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Kind of similar story from 1979. I participated in a rescue of a 54 ft. ketch SV Laurca in rough seas off the Riviera as a crewman of a US destroyer DD-968. Businessman and his family were caught in a storm, incapacitated by seasickness, engine barely running (likely clogged filters), running rigging a hopeless tangle. After 24 hours of bashing, they issued a Mayday. By the time our ship arrived, seas had calmed enough for myself and another sailor to swim over and board the boat. With engine idling and a small sail set we arrived in St. Tropez 24 hours later. The crew was fine except for seasickness, fatigue and they were all terrified by the experience. Don't underestimate the group dynamics that occur in extremis, if one crew member freaks out and goes down the rabbit hole of fear they can easily carry the rest of the group with them. Seems like a possibility here.
Or a credit card captain
@zoomee99 Served on DD-969 (Peterson) in the early 90's. :)
@@petercharles6462 Hey brother, Peterson was with us for that Med cruise in 79 and sadly drew the short straw...they were detached to the Persian Gulf while we stayed on the Riviera 🙂.
Agree, I'm from Australia and our 2019/2020 far south coast fires so startled the "rural fire service" captain freaked out scaring every one in the fire truck, except for the one person of twenty years. The captain freaked out and all went to water. 506 houses burnt to the ground. Couldn't get them back out after that. Then turned on the veteran. It happens.
@@zoomee99 Very interesting and pertinent on - Running Rigging being in a hopeless tangle, as I find the present move away from Strong Mainsheet tracks into lots of string and. Low. Friction Rings to be a particularly disturbing move frankly, and pretty rapid wear and tear of the string sure doesn’t appear to be helping. Things that appear to trigger seasickness, are things like loss of a fixed sight of a stable horizon, and definitely getting cold, there also seems to be a factor concerning balance involved, and maybe simple things like not having a really good breakfast well before going aboard. Once Sea Sick, the very worst thing seems to be when you have emptied yourself of anything to throw up ? That gets really nasty very fast indeed. Huge Seas tend to lose you any sight of the horizon , which even if for short time periods, may well interact badly with Balance, and something stable to look at that doesn’t move may help, even if tucked in behind a Sprayhood, though I am not volunteering to be made sea sick to rest if it works, but literally everything moving all over the place externally does seem to rapidly result in everything internally moving all over the place as well. My bout of being Sea Sick was so severe, and lasted for so long, I have absolutely no wish to repeat the experience, and wouldn’t wish it on anyone. At the end, I was so dehydrated and exhausted, the closest I got to that was Respiratory Failure followed by Pneumonia then Kidney Failure followed by a heart attack about 12 months ago now, and what got me through it Was Meditative Deep Breathing Exercises which I managed to keep up non stop for literally Days and Nights. The ICU Breathing Technique that they tried to get me to use, simply wasn’t working, and neither did their Nebulisers which only produced Steam. That Meditative Deep Breathing Exercise though, helped by disgusting Fisherman’s Friend Lozenges, worked well enough, that when the heart Attack arrived, it was only a mild one, and my being in the ICU already, meant Imwas in the right place.,But the level of Physical and Mental exhaustion ? Identical to three and a half days of being severely Sea Sick. A year later ? I’m still recovering, but things look up. All the Best. Bob who is still landlocked unfortunately. But I’m Still Vreathing.,👍🌟🌟🌟❤️⛵️
As a delivery skipper, I have made numerous trips in both directions around Hatteras. 5 or 6 just in 2023..
I have the utmost respect for that area and never traverse it lightly. I did one trip several years ago from Little Creek, VA to Beaufort, NC in December on a Baltic 51. We waited for the right wx window, knowing it might not come for a while. Actually, it was one of the best trips I have ever done around Hatteras and in December!
We left the Chesapeake Bay with a west wind and stayed close in, in the lee of land..the wind eventually went NW and stayed out of that quadrant long enough to get us around Cape Lookout and into Beaufort in time for New Years Eve.
Hatteras in Dec can be done safely. Chris Parker is the best, I use him on all of my deliveries..don't leave home without Chris !
I know we don't know what took place on the Beneteau, but to abandon ship on a fully functional vessel and ask the USCG swimmers to potentially risk their lives really annoys me. Yes, shit happens however it doesn't sound like the case here. Glad all are safe.
Nobody ever seem to think of just turning around and going back and waiting for better weather. I did this a couple of times on the east coast and never regretted it.
This. Before I leave port. I have a destination, a second destination and a close by emergency abort destination.
A great opportunity for a salvage crew. Nice boat with fuel ready to pickup. Hopefully someone was monitoring 16 and got it.
This is it!
As a former petty officer of Brazilian Navy, I used to love tough sea while almost all crew got sick, really sick, with it.
The most incredible: I'm a terrible swimmer. I simply trusted the boat.
While a lot of people give back lunch, I just sleep listening the waves slapping the boat... like a baby!
I also follow a sailing channel of a Nordic guy which loves this kind of challenge, but it's not for everyone, indeed.
the best sailors can't swim, they make sure the boat doesn't sink
It’s interesting to see how this sort of content always seems to attract self-aggrandizing “badasses”.
@ BadAss? Me? 🤣🤣🤣🤣 Thanks, bro! I wouldn't expect that, but thanks!
Erik JSNB
I was in Beaufort NC at that time waiting for a window south to Florida. I chose not to depart that week as there was some very serious weather and fronts were pushing through every two or three days making a passage difficult. There were 60kt gusting winds forecast along the gulf stream creating highly hazardous conditions. This is the second boat that I'm aware of that was lost between Charleston and Hatteras in the same time frame. The stream was running very close to the coast adding to the concern. Much of what we do is pre-planning and risk management. It's difficult to understand running low on diesel 100 miles offshore when you have just departed, and the skill of the crew needs to be considered and factored in to departure planning. Glad all are safe, but this may have been avoided with better planning. Sometimes you just don't go if it doesn't look right.
Or they just jumped ship because they couldn't handle it. No amount of planning could have changed it. 6 to 10 foot seas? .... come on.
good to know there are nice free boats out there!!
This story reminds me of my only Mayday in 40 yrs of sailing. One I regret to this day. I was on a 36ft Catalina in the Pamlico Sound in heavy winds (26-28kts) broad-reaching towards Hatteras. I had 2 friends on board with no sailing experience whatsoever. I asked one friend to steer for a second and he caused a violent accidental jibe which snapped my steering cable. Even dumping the sails the weather helm was too great for the emergency tiller to do anything but keep it hard over. The engine still worked, but all we could do was go in circles. After 30 min of wrestling the emergency tiller, we were all exhausted. I called a Mayday because we were drifting to a hard-sand shoal which, with the 4ft short-period swells you get in the Sound, was going to pound the keel so hard I felt the boat hull would likely crack after slamming for 30 minutes. The Coast Guard advised me to throw the anchor, but it was inaccessible beneath the dinghy, and the thought of unlashing the dinghy and securing it safely was more than I thought I could do. It's hard to express how much energy it takes as a captain just to reassure a frightened, inexperienced crew that it's all going to be ok while at the same time managing an emergency. In the end there was a TowBoat US boat nearby who came and towed us in. In hindsight I should have merely gone up and un-lashed the dinghy and thrown out the anchor and called TowBoat without issuing a Mayday. And if I'd had my sailing buddies onboard we would have done exactly that and laughed about it while doing it (but then none of us would have caused that jibe, so...). But having 2 souls, scared-to-death requires crew management and time that sapped my energy. In that sense I understand what this captain might have gone through. There's a point where psychologically, you just want pull the fire alarm and know someone's on the way.
I can see why you called it and it doesn't sound like a rash call to me.
A panpan would have been appropriate probably because you could have hit an issue.
Certainly around the UK the RNLI would have come out without much of a question.
@@unperdants yep, it should've been a panpan, absolutely, rather than a mayday.
I think it's ridiculous to abandon ship under those conditions until I remember that one time I was so sick in the comfort of my own home I could barely lift a finger, let alone sail a boat.
Sure, things like that can certainly happen, but the three sailors certainly did not look to be incapacitated while sitting in the chopper
Late 1980's, In my 20's, my brother (in his 30's) was captain of a 65ft min-maxi, fin keel, spade rudder, flat bottom racing sloop. We delivered it from New Haven CT to Ft lauderdale, 7 DAYS. One female chef/cook, 6 male crew (20's,30's.40's). Shifts, 2 hours ON , 4 hourS OFF, for SEVEN days. We went ACROSS & out side of the gulf stream becuz OBVIOUSLY the gulf runs south to north at 5 knots.
One day, we ended up in 30 foot seas and were SURFING down the backs of these 30' waves doing 25 knotts for 8-10 hours. It was quite the experience. Sleep deprivation for 7 days does your a number on your HEAD.
NO GPS back then... poor LORAN instead, paper charts, parallel rules, pointer & a PENCIL.
At midnight, one night, our main halyard TORE THE aluminum SAIL HEAD OFF THE SAIL, flew to the top of the mast & HELICOPTERED OUT all our mast head equipment, Windex, LX360 wind speed/direction, tri-color light.We had to wait a day or two B4 someone went up the mast to retrieve the main halyard back (a mangled wire coil now) & jury-rig to get the main sail back up a bit.
Our crew was young, experienced & competent.
What a wonderful experience. 😮 Sounds like a very competent crew. That makes for a more "comfortable" sail...less anxiety. Your experience is one to savor for a lifetime of sea tales to relate from your rocking chair
The vast majority of sailors are weekend sailors who never stray very far from their home port - this is probably a good thing for many of them.
These guys were clearly out of their depth mentally and physically (and probably skill wise too).
Their boat was never in any danger but it’s so sad to hear about that boat being simply abandoned. She deserves better ownership and hopefully, she now has it.
The owner/ captain had already crossed the Atlantic. I am sure he picked up a bit of experience along the way.
My entire family was lost at sea in 1967. I was ten years old at the time. Only recently, after going through some of my parents things, did i find a plaque they had made to celebrate the event. We sank on December 8th. I immediately started asking remaining family members why we motored from Florida towards Panama in December instead of waiting until the calm seas at the beginning of summer so we could reach Panama before the first hurricanes (they don't go to Panama). No one knows why we went during the rough, windy part of winter. I think Dad was oblivious to the danger and shipwrecked us by being an incompetent captain.
Sorry to hear this story. How did you survive?
💔❤️🩹♥️
@@johanwithag2432Yes, same here
Perhaps ... remembering that the captain is only 1 person ...very sad to lose family at sea.
I wonder how experienced the two crew members were. I can easily see two neophytes completely freaking out in rough conditions.
Crew is as strong as the weakest crew member
If the Captain gets sick can the other crew member take over?
I find a skipper calling a Mayday because they were at risk of capsizing unrealistic in stated conditions…… but that’s what they believed.I suspect they were sitting beam on a few times and got thrown around plus fatigue and maybe some sea sickness thrown in for good measure. The coast guard has to believe the skipper and ask questions later. A good training exercise at best. The crew is likely embarrassed .
Thanks PS for stories that we can learn from .
@
Perhaps I'm being a little bit conspiratorial, but this boat is now an insurance claim, and a complete write off, and, no doubt in my conspiracy mind one of his "friends" will happen to "find it floating around in the ocean all by itself" and FREE for the takin... and the guy is an insurance sales... enough said! 😳🤔👌👍👍👍
A wider beam vessel is more likely than not to have a terrible snap roll.
Have a similar story to the Navy sailor. 1978 aboard the USCGC Vigorous we removed a charter captain and his crew in almost the same area. Captain was the only one not disabled from seasickness and was totally exhausted. Can imagine his paying guest just wanted off and that probably influenced his decision. The seas were big but not that crazy when we arrived. Able to transfer them with our small boat. I had to drag a couple of them onboard as they would not make the. jump on their own. We brought the boat toward Wilmington were it was picked up by a private tow. I know it can get bad there. Returning from Gitmo during the blizzard of 78 we buried the forecastle so deep the ship came to a stop and listed severely as the water took some time to spill from the bulwarks.
I used to fly expedition air support on Denali in Alaska. It seemed like every season there'd be at least one call to have the high altitude rescue helicopter (an Aérospatiale Lama) fly out to pull some wealthy climber off of the mountain for something frivolous. In one case, a "rescued" climber attempted to convince the helicopter crew to fly him to a different (more distant) town so that he could attend an important business meeting. Certainly not saying that this sort of highly privileged entitlement was at work here, I just couldn't help but be reminded of it.
It is possible seasickness affected some or all of the crew, so badly they called the US Coastguard. A similar situation happened to a vessel departing from my home port in Beaufort SC about 15 years ago.
A home made trimaran was sold on Ebay. The new owner arrived with his adult son and a kid around 12-13. They proceeded to clean the vessel, (which had gaping holes in the decks, rotted wood, ruined sails, no engine, rat infestation etc) with the intention of taking the vessel to Central America for a dive-boat, run by a charity. They received lots of advice concerning lack of experience and seaworthiness, mostly ignored. No lifelines, no jack-lines, no liferaft..., They planned to go offshore and departed on Christmas Day with a crew of five. The engine was an outboard, which had to be steered by crouching at the stern. The forecast was NE winds gusting to 30+ with seas to 8-10 feet.
They made it as far as Cape Canaveral before some of the crew were 'close to death' from seasickness. The CG chopper arrived, and gave them a choice, all stay, or all go. They left the boat, still afloat and undamaged.
Am an old man now but in my youth spent 12 years on a 75' commercial fishing vessel offshore in the North Atlantic. It was not uncommon to work in the winter on deck in face of 10' seas and 40 knot wind and to make the fun even more interesting the vessel was often covered in ice. These guys were clearly in over their heads.
Good question on what the humans can handle. I could definitely see myself worn out to the point of not being able to go on. Without blue water experience, and the ability to plow through it, I could very well be tempted to give up. But I would try to avoid that situation at all costs.
Old sayig fro an old sailor, "The boat can take more than the crew can."
Heaving to will calm the boat, reduce or relieve seasickness, and allow some rest. It is more difficult in a small, fin keel than in a boat with a more substantial kneel but can often be done. In November 2012, we had similar conditions in nearly the same location on the way from Norfolk to the Virgins Islands. We hove to overnight, got some rest, and enjoyed the rest of the trip.
Sort of reminds me of that Trevor guy jumping out of his vintage plane. It has an insurance vibe to me, too much is hard to explain. I'd say the insurance company will ask questions before paying. Thanks Tim, keep us posted. 🇦🇺 ⚓ 🇨🇦
Glad everybody is ok most important . Trust captain decisions , safety first 👍
I might trust that captain with a crew, but not with a boat
Although I am not a fan of this particular production boat, there is no indication of structural or functional compromise. This was a combination of poor planning (assessment of crew competency, and weather window) and failure to execute heavy weather tactics (heaving to, adjusting course off-wind, running bare poles, deploying a drogue etc…). This is a notoriously difficult area of the mid-Atlantic during a time of volatile cold fronts.
That said, it was a hard lesson for this captain and I do hope his boat was returned to him…and I hope that he made a healthy donation to the Coast Guard’s mutual assistance fund! Semper Paratus!
crew competency
I doubt the Coast Guard gave him a choice of a donation. If he called mayday for a rescue, the CG probably billed him $50k. I'm sure his boat was returned to him for a price too. Salvage experts don't work for free, and this sounds like an easy one. Once a salvage crew gets on board and claims salvage rights, they own the boat. Charge the owner $30k or $40k to get his boat back, or sell it. The price of being an incompetent sailboat owner, and hiring incompetent man-bun crew
@ "man bun crew'= nail-> head😁
Mid-Atlantic??? They were 100 miles off shore
I presumed you have sailed this area? I have a few times. Crossing the gulf stream when the wind has a north component can be testing.
Waves get steep and seem bigger, often standing, and this is referred to as a washing machine...
Good info. However, in such circumstances, the boat shall be still safer than people in the water???
I find it crazy that you would abandon a fully working vessel. I have just crossed the Atlantic Mindelo to Martinique.
I lost my autopilot 1 week in and had to hand steer for 2 weeks. As a single-handed vessel, it was a very challenging experience. At one point, I steered 27 hours straight. I fought fatigue, hallucinations from lack of sleep and food. After constantly looking at the compass for so long , the symbols started to look like hieroglyphics
That’s crazy. I took my boat in the gulf for 36hr and hand steered cause I’m poor and no autopilot and couldn’t lift my arm to shoulder height after arriving. I didn’t stay awake the whole time but only slept 3-4hr in that time and was at one point falling asleep standing up
@Monkeywrenchmotorcycles I did fall asleep standing at the helm, the only thing that woke me up was hitting my chin on the helm on the way down
Could you have rigged sheet to tiller steering? If not why not?
@@pg-mtl8815 i did for a short time , but deemed it to harsh on steering system, not a tiller, wheel steering it was too violent
@@willags super interesting. I never considered that. Food for thought
so true Tim theres always the human element to consider
The majority of my sailing experience was on a Beneteau 27' around Long Island about 30 years ago. However, I also spent more time than I care to remember on USN birdfarms in the Atlantic/Mediterranean fleets. I saw those 60kt winds and 23' waves when they LEFT Norfolk and my immediate thought was "Why in the HELL did you untie from the dock?!?!" My thought is an insurance claim on this one.
A small amount of sail is infinitely more stable in seas than motoring. Less of everything from seasickness to being tossed about. That presumes one is quite conservative about how much sail area is deployed. But sailboats don't handle large seas well under power alone, so the crew will be tossed about unmercifully if the numbers were as represented.
Reality is best for weather predictions.
I been kitesurfing twenty years and use multiple weather sites which are rarely correct . Sometimes so far off it’s truly amazing .
I am am trying to imagine myself in a situation where I would abandon the boat, and what would lead up to that. Here is a sequence of events that potentially could make me make a misguided decision:
1. exhausted to the point of not making sound decisions
2. faulty instruments telling me the situation is worse than it is
3. currents against the wind making the sea really confused and angry
So if a faulty anemometer told me we had 60 kn winds, and the boat is churned by waves resulting from the Gulf stream fighting into the wind (we are talking Cape Hatteras after all) I find it possible that I would make such a decision.
Interesting story, thanks.
I sailed the coast of Alaska for 20+ years for months at a time with no drama but I didn't do that in the middle of winter.
In my experience, there can be a lot of pressure from the crew on the skipper. And if the skipper is seasick or otherwise not in best shape, I can easily see how this happened. More than 30 years ago i was stuck in december in Biscay in anything between a force 8 to 11 with up to 40' seas. That was at a time when weather forecasts were 24 hours with an additional 24 hours more like guesswork;) There was a lot of pressure from some very frightened crew members to alert the Spanish Coast Guard. Myself, I was not too tough either, but I knew the boat could handle it, and it did. Almost all boats can handle more than the crews, and this is something to keep in mind. I am sure the boat will be picked up, she has solar and Starling and probably AIS, so her position should be known.
Many years ago I intended to sail 14 days as crew from Hamburg/ Germany to the Shetlands and Norway. The boat was very seaworthy - a long keel Colin Archer- having just completed a tour around the world. Just before my intended journey the boat came back to Hamburg on a similar trip and experienced a heavy summer- storm in the North- sea/german- bay. The crew was an experienced young skipper, his girlfriend and 4 to 5 paying guests. In the storm only the skipper was able to operate the very heavy stearing, the guests were unable to do anything, the girlfriend helped the skipper with some tea and snacks. They broached 2 or 3 times and the skipper was more and more exhausted. He made a pan- pan - call. Shortly after a rescuing helicopter was over the boat and 3 or 4 danish fish- trawler cruised around the boat. The paying crewguests( and the helicopter? I don't know?) then forced the exhausted skipper to leave the boat and they were rescued by the helicopter. The very seaworthy, unharmed yacht was towed into Esberg/ Denmark by the fishtrawlers. My intended trip didn't happened because of unsolved legal problems with the inshurance, fisher, owner and so on.
All valid points.
Even though all rescued were reported in good health, the way the captain presented coming aboard the chopper suggests exhaustion. Without experienced crew & say auto-pilot turning back would sound reasonable however not knowing the state of the crew, leaves that open to being a contributor.
Secondly & probably a little more concerning, having sailed with stoic Captains before, who would find it hard to admit fatigue or any frailty of any kind, this may have been another factor. Having arrived at the option of leaving the vessel sometime ahead of the mayday call, fatalism (for want of a better word) may have taken hold & from that point on, the outcome was set.
Anyone who has been anyway involved in having to leave a boat will be aware of the extremes witnessed in crew, their own thinking, the unknowns etc. Revisiting the events need to be managed too - +vely what to attend to on all future sails etc. However thoughts or views of failure can destroy people if not attended too.
Really enjoy your presentations & look forward to all that is to come.
Thank you.
Thanks for the report Tim. I have to think that there's more to the story we don't know. Was the captain also the owner? What owner would abandon a perfectly good sailboat if it wasn't a medical emergency?
Interesting. Thank you :)
Sea sickness can be debilitating, particularly for men. I suspect that this is at the route of the issues as the actual weather conditions, whilst not fun, were easy for a competent and able bodied crew.
You said people think of what conditions their boat can handle but they sometimes don't consider what conditions the skipper/crew can handle. True. Reminds me of a time when some dock mates came in from a trip to Santa Cruz Island. They ran into more wind and seas than they wanted, rough anchorage, and so they left out of the anchorage in the middle of the night to return. Their boat is the same as ours (a Catalina 320). The skipper said the boat handled the conditions just fine, a lot better than the skipper and crew!
Was the vessel salvaged? Can’t imagine why anyone would challenge Hatteras in Dec especially if the forecast is bad. Fronts move through regularly at that time of the year, all you need to do is wait it out, then the weather is great for sailing for several days. Methinks the Capt’n didn’t know what he was doing. TransAt with the ARC in the fall is one thing, Hatteras in Dec is quite another
Great Video! Seasickness cannot be under-estimated, either. I've had 3 person voyages offshore where all but myself were incapaccitated for 2 days. Can you make a Video on Sea Sickness Plan B making? Thanks Again.
@@CannibalSailingUSA Seasickness is easy, don't get on the boat! 😂
Yep. Sea Sickness can be an absolute nightmare, and despite various bad weather Situations I have been in, only once have I been seasick, and I was incapacitated for three and a half Days in a Beaufort Scale 10.5 gusting much higher and in Mountainous Seas and felt totally helpless as Inwas no use to man or beast. Since and due to not wanting to experience that ever again, I have worked out an effective preventative with STUGERON Tablets, which unfortunately are not available in the USA- I ignore the directions to take two tablets, as that dose means fast asleep for about twelve hours. Instead I take half a Stugeron about thirty minutes before going aboard. Then for the following four to five days I take half a tablet with a pre breakfast drink of juice, tea, or coffee. By the end of the course, I now have my sea legs. I think you can buy Stugeron in the BVI, other not USA islands, Mexico etc, plus from international online sellers. I like to have two minor first aid kits plus one big Main First Aid Kit on board,m each of which has a packet of Stugeron in them. So far, no problems, other than waking up people who have taken two tablets.mThe speed with which two tablets can cure bottle green coloured sufferers can be really dramatic and precedes them just falling into a deep sleep . One of the major Yachting Magazines was deeply involved in the Development and Testing of Stugeron, and I was watching that development work very closely . I even carry a packet when using Ferries on long crossings, as it is amazing how many people start suffering with Sea Sickness, but today, I start with half a tablet, and add another half if there is no improvement within about half an hour then leave them with a just in case full tablet for their return trip. The two tablets dose for really badly affected sufferers, has left me single handing on several occasions, prior to working out an effective dosage routine, but on each occasion they were straightforward trips that stayed unstressful thankfully.,
Stay out of the cabin and do not lay down. Seasickness is caused when visual stimuli do not match your sense of balance. This happens inside, where you see walls stationary but feel movement. Go up on deck and stare at the horizon to lessen the seasickness. Going in the cabin and laying down makes it worse. Staring at the deck makes it worse, look at the horizon.
@@ninehundreddollarluxuryyac5958 Great advice, but the best cure for seasickness is to hug a tree. It works almost instantly.
Hi Tim. The first thing that kept to mind, was Hatteras ugh ! plus the boat was not ICW compatible for Draft, and likely not for Mast Air Draft either, so impossible to dive into the ICW for shelter, anchoring or a Marina Berth or refuelling for that matter as well. I was actually heading to Hatteras to lay a wreath there for my friend, whose uncle was killed as a Cabin boy aged 16 on his first trip in a tanker to pick up aviation fuel during WW2 but the ship got torpedoed by a U boat off Hatteras and Blew up with no Survivors.,I had clearance from USCG to contact them for permission to lay the wreath at sea when I got there, plus to lay another at the Cemetary onshore where some of the bodies of the crew were buried after washing ashore. Sadly I lost my boat before I got there, but next Sailboat, I plan to approach from within the ICW, and her Uncle and Crew Mates will be remembered. This is why easy access to as many places as possible needs to be facilitated for Cruisers and Voyagers by having boats with shallow Draft and low air draft height Masts, because even with places like the ICW helping, places like Hatteras can be really tricky, which was why my last Sailboat had a Draft of just over 4feet, and very ICW friendly Mast Height. Not really in a position to comment on why they abandoned ship, as not enough information. But a valuable lesson on only setting Sailmin Favourable conditions Insuppose which reinforces not being bound by schedules and things like times with Visas running desperately short, which forces boats to leave harbour into very bad weather windows, which is why I gave up on my Fathers ambition to do a Circumnavigation which I shared with him. Too much Bureacracy and the risk of heavy fines, and even the confiscation of the boat for failure to leave, that exists today, for me says the only way to Win, is not to play their silly little games ? Still, they all got off safe, SomWell Done the truly excellent USCG. Bob.👍🌟🌟🌟⛵️
We're scared and don't want to do this anymore. Please come and rescue us. Good God.
Reminds me of that saying that goes something to the effect of: “most ships can handle more than her captain can”
Let's be clear. This captain has been sailing for 2 years and has an Atlantic crossing on his resume. He's not simply a weekend sailor in over his head. While it appears on the face of it they abandoned a perfectly good boat, or that they dramatically misjudged their abilities, it could be something as simple as being so sick that it became dangerous to remain.
I think it's likely the captain exaggerated the condition of the boat and of the weather, likely because he's a bit embarrassed, but he still made the right call. If he and the crew are not able to control their vessel, for whatever reason, remaining is just an invitation for something tragic to happen. Perhaps he underestimated the weather or maybe they all ate some bad oatmeal and got ill, but whatever the reason he took the safe route for himself and his crew by getting pulled off by the coasties.
Don't make an embarrassing situation fatal by being too proud to ask for help.
FACTS!
2 years sailing? Typo??? At year 2 we are still very inexperienced in terms of making crossings and blue water in general, IMO
not sure an ARC rally counts as an atlantic crossing - more like a milk run convoy 🙂the hatteras passage is legit; I did it a bit earlier this fall in similar conditions and it wasn't all that fun
I Amy not going to argue if they were right or wrong. Or you are right or wrong. BUT.. personally it’s not about saving face. When you set out YOU take responsibility for your own safety. When you call for help and others must respond YOU are now responsible for someone else’s life and safety as you are asking them to risk their lives to come save you. And if your asking the while NOT REALLY a life threatening situation you are asking someone to attempt a rescue (which is not with out dangers to those flying in coastguard helicopters and air lifting you off a pitching boat with a mast and rigging) if you are just asking this because your uncomfortable but nit actually in any real danger. The rescue itself could be more dangerous then just staying on your boat and sailing it to safety yourself.
Problem with most people is they simply never sail when there is high winds and big waves so they may have years sailing experience but ZERO sailing in heavy weather experience. Fo many their heavy weather plan is drop all sails and motor. They have no storm sails they have never practiced sailing in 30-40knot winds with 10ft or greater seas. They don’t know how or even own a droug (sea anchor) and of course it’s a modern production yacht they don’t heave to well at all they can be hard to balance as the don’t have a stay and the fin keel does not set into a heave to attatude well and they ten to start to make way even with bare poles.
My point is this was a crew and boat combination that together were a recipe for disaster. So many people on these production boats with so called class A ratings these boats are simply not comfortable in heave seas and high winds. Ya the point well and sail great in light to moderate air, but there is a reason so many old salts swear by full keel heavy displacement boats it’s comfort ratio!! Ya that boat could handle the conditions but the crew in the boat in those conditions couldn’t. Put that same crew ina heavy displacement full keel battle axe of a boat ad they probably would have kept going or if smart hovetoo and waited it out in relative comfort. (If they had since enough to study and learn storm tactics before setting out.
Being a good heavy weather sailor is not just knowing what to do but also what type of boat you choose to go out there in. As that make a world of difference in how the storm feels when your out there.
I Amy not going to argue if they were right or wrong. Or you are right or wrong. BUT.. personally it’s not about saving face. When you set out YOU take responsibility for your own safety. When you call for help and others must respond YOU are now responsible for someone else’s life and safety as you are asking them to risk their lives to come save you. And if your asking the while NOT REALLY a life threatening situation you are asking someone to attempt a rescue (which is not with out dangers to those flying in coastguard helicopters and air lifting you off a pitching boat with a mast and rigging) if you are just asking this because your uncomfortable but nit actually in any real danger. The rescue itself could be more dangerous then just staying on your boat and sailing it to safety yourself.
Problem with most people is they simply never sail when there is high winds and big waves so they may have years sailing experience but ZERO sailing in heavy weather experience. Fo many their heavy weather plan is drop all sails and motor. They have no storm sails they have never practiced sailing in 30-40knot winds with 10ft or greater seas. They don’t know how or even own a droug (sea anchor) and of course it’s a modern production yacht they don’t heave to well at all they can be hard to balance as the don’t have a stay and the fin keel does not set into a heave to attatude well and they ten to start to make way even with bare poles.
My point is this was a crew and boat combination that together were a recipe for disaster. So many people on these production boats with so called class A ratings these boats are simply not comfortable in heave seas and high winds. Ya the point well and sail great in light to moderate air, but there is a reason so many old salts swear by full keel heavy displacement boats it’s comfort ratio!! Ya that boat could handle the conditions but the crew in the boat in those conditions couldn’t. Put that same crew ina heavy displacement full keel battle axe of a boat ad they probably would have kept going or if smart hovetoo and waited it out in relative comfort. (If they had since enough to study and learn storm tactics before setting out.
Being a good heavy weather sailor is not just knowing what to do but also what type of boat you choose to go out there in. As that make a world of difference in how the storm feels when your out there. Now that said an experienced sailor who knows his boat well could probably handle that boat even in heavy weather. And I mean experienced in heavy weather sailing. People often say they have years and many miles experience but the reality is even among sailors that have circumnavigations to brag about have still limited time actually sailing in heavy weather. Why? Becuase most people avoid it. (And smartly so) but many people with far less over all miles and may have never crossed any ocean can have more actual experience sailing in bad weather. Why because they race offshore these sailors go on the day the race is scheduled not necessarily when the weather is best. Many also sail in waters of high latitudes were high winds and big waves are common. (As any South African sailor how many times they sail in winds over 40knts) so having cross on the trades from Europe to the Caribbean does not mean a person has experience in heavy weather sailing. A coastal cruiser who sails the North Atlantic waters regularly but NEVER crosses oceans or makes long passages could have experienced more and know how their boat will handle in big seas and high winds then someone who has two or even more Atlantic crossings, (most sailors I know will tell you they spent far more time with not enough wind then too much wind when on long passages) and I have faces bigger waves and higher winds on a one day sail then they did on their Atlantic crossing. And faced in on a much smaller boat.
@4:15-4:51 That looks like perfect weather to take my Scamp out for a good challenging sail, but NOT enough to shut down a big boat like a Bene 523... errr ... ummm... did someone say he was an insurance salesman? 🤔🙈🙈🙈
Before I went on my big sailing adventure crossing the Pacific as crew on a friends' boat I had a dream. We were off Alaska and came upon an abandoned but almost new, "Oyster 55' that was down at the stern from a partially filled engine compartment. The interior of the boat in the dream was that of at least a 60'. I knew the difference, but in my dream.... and 'Oyster' just meant really good and expensive. So I stepped aboard, discovered no one, but also that I could with a lot of labor pump out the engine compartment and sail her.
My friends on the cat (whom I'd yet to meet in person...) decided to just leave me. So I figured out how to unfurl the sails and..... In my dream it was now my boat. A really fun dream!
But then I Googled salvage rights. I don't fully understand it, but had I sailed that dream boat to the nearest port and said it took me a couple of days to get it back in running condition I wouldn't own the boat, instead I could hit the owner up for a few thousand bucks.....
So who gets that Beneteau? This video makes me think, if someone could figure out how to get out there, have a few friends in the Coast Guard... they might be able to....
I'm not a great sailor but (17 -23 mph) 20 knot winds and 6 - 10' seas? That's just a good sailing day on a crossing. I might not go out with my 45' boat in that, but only because I'd be sailing near the coast which makes 10' waves more intense. Out at sea we often had 3m (so 10') waves a lot of the time, wasn't a problem. And 20 knots? Just good sailing.
Never sail off shore unless you're prepared for the conditions. Glad no one was seriously hurt !
read the comments and expected to see, but didnt, an old saying... the most dangerous item on a boat is a calendar... something i think about anytime departure and routing decisions are being made...
Many will never understand ocean sailing. Movement is nonstop, and it takes a toll on the body.
I’m contemplating going to look for that beautiful boat drifting in the Atlantic. What are the laws regarding salvage on that?
We are in the Bahamas right now, we sailed offshore from Newport RI to Chub Cay in conditions that were never less than what was described by the CG here. Yes Hatteras wasn't fun mid-November but there must be something more to this story. Maybe they'd just never been in those conditions? I must admit though, my Valiant 42 cutter is way more seaworthy and seakindly than that Beneteau...
I can’t image abandoning any vessel unless I’m going down… more to this story for sure!
Glad nobody was hurt.
So you're telling me there's a perfectly good 523 out there for the taking? ;)
Excellent reporting - is there ever a full NTSB-style government report available for these type of incidents? Or is it up to journalists following up with the captain and crew? What happens to the boat - is it up for salvage? Is the EPERB still operating - for how long?
Was the boat ever recovered? I have been around Hatteras but in calm conditions. Motored from Beaufort NC to Annapolis. We left just ahead of the weather and it was a go now or go up the ICW situation. A boat that left a few hours later got into bad weather. Cape Hatteras can be dangerous.
There's definitely something to be said for fatigue. Beating into 10 ft with no sails up in a monohull would be horrible for more than a few hours, you understand that after the first time you try it. Sails up, hard to wind is not that much better for long periods of time. I can't even drive a car for more than 8 hours.
So many things wrong with their decision to abandon ship... from our perspective of course. Not sinking, not on fire, and obviously not in danger of capsizing. Tough weather, but certainly sailable... even for a Beneteau, though that boat would be very fatiguing. Fatigue in my opinion is perhaps the biggest thing contributing to unsafe conditions aboard any vessel, but not worth abandoning ship in that sea state, especially with a boat in that new and good of condition. And as I've commented before, the most disconcerting part of this is they didn't scuttle the boat. I find that very irresponsible, as you've made your decisions in life, and must live up to the consequences, and always be a "responsible mariner". That may be the missing part of this tale, and maybe not a good sailor either. As you pointed out, there were several options; heave to, sail a broad reach (in basically moderate winds and seas) or run bare poles. Scuttling an abandoned boat is unfortunately, (un)written maritime law, but for centuries has been the rule of thumb. In many similar situations, even the CG will suggest you scuttle. That is a very highly traveled maritime area, the batteries probably would not have lasted long to keep AIS running, and so the boat would be a dangerous uncharted hazard to navigation, same as an uncharted reef or rock. I think "they" were scared. But that prompted a rescue that put the CG personnel's lives in jeopardy. They obviously did a great job. Cudos to the USCG!
Who has the vessel now?
As we plan our long term "escape" on a sailboat the human factors are a significant factor. I (lifelong sailor with many thousands of bluewater miles) and my wife (recent ASA graduate) have vastly different experience levels. One of my burdens as "captain" is ALWAYS considered the capabilities of of ALL the crew (including an honest assessment of myself at 60, not the memory of myself at 24) and sail within the capabilities of the least capable crew.
An overnight cruise down the coast will have a different risk profile than a week long trip to the islands. I know I can still hand steer for 18+ hours before exhaustion starts to set in so some lumpy weather on a short trip is no big deal. But starting a long trip in marginal conditions would be foolish for us. The trip will wear you down slowly...there is no sense in starting a trip already behind the "exhaustion curve".
So many of these "sad stories" (and you seem to be posting a lot if them recently!) could have been avoided or at least mitigated through an honest risk assessment before setting out or reevaluation of the plan when conditions worsened.
I put this one squarely on the owner's shoulders. Departing in a questionable weather window when waiting a day or two would make for a smoother passage, (apparently) motoring excessively to maintain an unrealistic course, and not exercising basic storm survival techniques when the crew could barely carry on all fall on the captain.
Wish I had heard about this when it happened! There was nothing wrong with the boat. Charter a good sea worthy trawler to run out to this boat and sail her back to port. A couple hundred gallons of diesel and we would happily sail her for the next decade. :)
"Including an honest assessment of myself at 60" Reminds me of a funny saying among old Motorcycle racers "the older I get the faster I was" I was out in that area in November years ago with a very experienced crew , I remember telling younger me to NEVER attempt anything like it myself...
Fear! made these decisions.
Bullshit!!! 800 $€£ a week a "fair" share of expenses. That boat was a weekly charter without owner having to acquires the proper documentation.
Have to agree with you 💯
Me too, 100% a charter boat without the paperwork. I wonder how his insurance will view this.
So,what happened to the boat?
I'm just happy that Practical Sailor is sponsoring him.
So what happened to the ship? Still floating out there?
Found onshore??
Im confused
always head back. the ocean doesn't care about your onward plans.
I doubt if Benito I was going to heave too. Very well with that crappy keel. You certainly could have run off the window unless it was pushing you into shore
wait what happened to the boat?
i sailed newport to brunswick solo in late december 2018. i'd done a lot of warm weather soloing, but in the snow flurries, wind and waves i was more exhausted than i'd ever been, and i did make several very poor decisions out of pure exhaustion. i made it though and got drunk then slept for 48 hours.
I’m only one that’s thinking about sailing and has never done it so am relying your expertise does sound like they couldn’t do it and by that footage I can honestly say I prob wouldn’t be able to either
Happening even more often these days!
What happens to these boats left adrift? Doesn’t that become a safety issue for other vessels?
it appears to boil down to one of the most important questions a captain must ask. does he have confidence in his boat?…I’d say he answered that clearly…
Does that become a free boat once abandoned at sea like that ?
Sounds like classic case of getting beat up by the Gulf Stream with a northerly component....and throw in inexperience & fear.....to the point of total collapse of captain & crew ! Boat did just fine!
I do know this sailor and I was supposed to be on that boat
With some boat design training, I say that there is a big difference between actual seaworthiness and seakindliness. And I think this particular crew found themselves on the wrong side of this divide.
Although the boat is arguably quite seaworthy, its seakindliness probably has a lot to be desired. Being light for its length and beam, and having a bulb, fin keel, it is likely to be quite corky, with a quick, uncomfortable motion. Going upwind in relatively rough conditions magnifies this.
A shorter, heavier boat, with a long keel and more slack bilges, would have definitely been slower. But it would also have been more comfortable.
What happened to the boat?
Did you just say......" THE AUTO PILOT USUALLY STOP WORKING WHEN YOU NEED IT"? ..Are you kidding me?, No thank you, I think I will die a LAND LOVER.
What @zoomee99 said , also I can't imagine beating into the wind for no reason except for the fun of it , on a passage the boat decides on what point it's happy with , forcing it is a fools errand and hard on the boat an crew , can see three older guys just saying they had enough lets go home this isn't fun anymore and someone maybe will get hurt even if looking back the weather doesn't seem as though it was that bad , does look like they missed out on a wonderful brisk sail though , I bet that boat is pretty fast on a broad reach 🙂
Buoys recording conditions confirmed the conditions were much worse when distress call made. Winds and waves at the max rating for the boat actually.
It is true that the sea separates the men from the boys. I don’t intend to demean people who for some reason get scared, but the problem is that when you call for a Mayday when no Mayday exists you put into danger those who might direly need it and the resources would not be available as a consequence.
. In a sinking boat in blue water which I thought and did manage to make land with, with a tow, i called Securite not even Pan Pan.
Never been off shore but “hove to” seemed like a better solution. Get a bit off rest and hope for better weather and take another crack at it.
If the latter didn’t work Coast Gaurd could still be called. I’d have trouble giving up the boat had it been mine.
Yes I agree with your assessment in thinking the crew was scared and didn't want to be at sea anymore. I had a similar situation oh winter of 1996 I just purchased a William Atkins Thistle 32' sailed to the Isthmus Hbr, Catalina Isl with a friend a SCUBA instructor and 2 of his students to do their final checkout dives. Well we were done with the dives I was on a mooring in Isthmus Hbr when the Santa Ana winds blew in. The harbor very early that morning folded up the dock so now we could not go ashore. I do not know the exact wind speed but it was blowing hard 20 - 30knts with waves pounding. I asked my crew of 3, well we can stay here on the mooring pounding all day or we can head back to Long Beach, CA pounding on our way home? They asked can the boat handle the weather? I said yes the boat can handle this stuff fine the real question is can we handle the pounding for 5hrs back to Long Beach? We decided to head back to Long Beach, we motored all the way hand steering, I was exhausted. The crew of 3 were below the whole trip except my friend who relieved me for a spell so I could recuperate. The point, being on a small vessel in rough weather is scary you need to be prepared for it.
very many New sailors cant handle 5+ days non stop bad weather even if the boat is in good shape,,, scared,stress. never been in that position before, some sailingboats are extremely uncomfortable in weather...
Need a proper detailed debriefing.
Cape Hatteras is 25 feet deep out 40 miles. It’s the most treacherous section of the east coast. The fetch is thousands of miles and water piles up and then the Gulf Stream adds to it. It’s scary. And can make you sick. These guys were not used to it. They were also well out of the shoal. I’ve been in 40 foot waves and 50 kt winds for 24 hours just above Provo in the T&C on a 46 ft Beneteau. No excuse for this. They have a classic mast. I bet no one had the balls to go up to the mast and rise the sail to the first reef point. But you certainly want a postage stamp up on the headsail. Rank amateurs.
The only viable reason comes to mind is the owner/skipper is down with some sickness and other 2 aren't sailors. 🤷♂️
The conditions were rough, but based on that I heard it would be tough but doable for my lightweight trailet sailer. 52ft Bene should be perfectly safe there 🤷♂️
Abandon ship (for me) is not the last resort.... It's resort after the last resort after last resort.
It been said the owner/skipper is in late 60s... A health issue may be a very valid reason to abandon ship.
I hope the S/V will be saved
How do I find out what are my rating / seas and wind. ????
so what happens to a boat abandon? If some one goes and retrieves it, whos boat is it
My understanding has always been that an abandoned boat can be taken by anyone who wants to go recover it and it is owned by the person who recovers it.
Hi Tim. Totally Off Topic, but has practical Sailor Magazine done any testing of UV Protection for PvC Inflatable Dinghies, such as covers, and outside of the box thinking of perhaps coating them with high Factor Sunscreen ? I was thinking of getting aPvC Tender, just to see how well covers work, plus seeing if there was any chemical reaction with Sunscreening lotions ? Could be a good and very useful article for the Magazine, especially as there are new better UV resistant materials available? All the Best. Bob. 👍🌟🌟🌟⛵️
Know your crew, Don't expect other people to do what you can.
Will starlink work in heavy seas?
yes we've had it on board for 2+ years and it was flawless through some real $#!T
So what happens to boat left adrift? Can someone go out and find it, get on board, sail it to port and claim it? For those of us who are not familiar with maritime law please fill us in. Interesting report.
Can anyone claim that boat if they abandon it? What is the associated law? Who has jurisdiction?
Puzzling.
I’m a former navy guy. I used to enjoy the rough seas. Less cleaning and painting to do.
today when folks get full coverage insurance its all too easy to just abandon ship when things get uncomfortable
There are three elements to a passage in a sailboat, the vessel, the weather and the crew. If one is not capable then the passage will become difficult or impossible. I have turned back to port twice in a career of 50 years offshore sailing racing, once because the crew were not up to it, and secondly the weather turned out far worse than the forecast. In this case I would venture to say the crew were not up to it and the methodology used to crew this boat was patently flawed.