The Two Big Upsets For Boeing: KLM & Qantas Order Airbus
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- Опубликовано: 1 янв 2022
- While it’s been a tough couple of years for Boeing, December 2021 seemed to just add insult to injury for the US planemaker. It was around the middle of the month that two historically loyal Boeing customers switched camps and decided to go with Airbus for their future fleets. Let’s take a look at these orders and their significance to the overall industry.
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The a320 still has a long future ahead of it, not to mention the a220. It makes so much sense to invest in a family of plane that is more future proof. The 737 has certainly reached its max
Great comment!
Pun intended? ;)
Pun intended!
Yes indeed. That’s why the latest version is called 737MAX
The A320 ceo has already made its last delivery, there’s rumors of Airbus already planning an A320 replacement. The efficiency stats for both are pretty close aswell.
The A220 has filled a crucial place in the market for short haul low-capacity narrow bodies, and as others have said the A320 family has a bright future ahead so makes sense to switch wholesale across to Airbus now. That with all the problems the MAX has had will clearly have played into the minds of Qantas. For AF-KLM, having a standardised short-haul fleet across their carriers has always made sense for flexibility in terms of crewing, and maintenance, and with AF heavily invested in Airbus, and with KL and HV needing to choose short haul successors it again makes sense to go for Airbus.
Yes, and it was originally the Bombardier designed CSeries aircraft. But Boeing sued and prevented Bombardier from selling it in the US market. Bombardier simply formed a limited partnership with Airbus and renamed the CSeries to the A220.
Correct on the a220 ..wrong on the a320.. scare bus is really controlled by France with a dash of schnitzel wafting in the background.. the KLM purchase was heavily influenced by the partnership with air France .. they really wanted the a220 and to get a discount scarebus offerd some side cabbage with the steak tartar..
@@thomasburke7995 Could you elaborate on ,,, 'scare bus' ?
Beyond standardization... it has also become evident that Boeing/FAA have become too lax and complacent with regulations, consistently cutting corners and rushing planes to production. Another Boeing disaster and AF-KLM customers may well choose to take Lufthansa for their next flight. It's possible there may have been political considerations as Thomas so enthusiastically points out; but Boeing's recent safety record is a more likely explanation imo.
@@thomasburke7995 If Airbus is controlled by France is open for discussion. A fact is that KLM, a very loyal Boeing customer, switched to Airbus.
I can imagine the reaction in Boeing HQ when these orders were confirmed. It really is a vote of no confidence in Boeing.
In the meantime, news from Boeing: NMA is confirmed cancelled again.
@@jnqt55 It takes real solid leadership to have the bravery to do so. (Sarcasm)
Atlast! Its about time companies recognised Boeings shady business practices and string of failed promises.
Boeing is fast becoming a minor player in the commercial market, just like McDonald Douglas was in the nineties. That merger was the worst thing that could happen to Boeing in its history. The last successful new program was the Boeing 777. Every program after the merger has had some sort of problems. The current BIG problem seems to be the undisclosed problems with the 777x. I would not be surprised to see some of those customers cancel their orders and switch to Airbus.
As for the A220, while Boeing was screaming and kicking in court over the subsidies given to the Bombardier C series. Boeing could have and should have done exactly what Airbus did in taking over the program and marketing. Instead they were more concerned with the C series infringing on the Boeing 737 family territory. Hence the time and money that was wasted in court. Only money made here was by the lawyers.
Is there a solution? At this point probably not. But a start would be to STOP the Profits over Quality mantra. Fire the board of directors without any sort of perk packages, no medical, no pension, no severance. They were the ones that crashed the company and now they must pay for their short slightness.
BRING back the true aviators and engineers to run to company like it was in the past. If there is such a thing as aviator/engineers around today. And last, move the company’s headquarters back to Seattle where it belongs. Boeing was a Seattle based company before the merger.
@chuggs the future is laid out for Airbus to overtake now, Boeing would struggle to survive the future if it weren't for military contracts.
Boeing's narrowbody portfolio has indeed maxed out. They will have to come clean and offer something new and exciting.
yes, the 737 has MAXed out, LOL
@@frenchpaddy2111 Ba-dum-tsh
I think boeing has to dust off the plans middle of the market planes and look elsewhere for the future for narrow bodies, like rebranding the 757 and the 797 turn it into a narrow body plane that can compete against Airbus offerings
Both airlines have been so loyal, this is a sad turn!
@@donaldstanfield8862 win some customers and lose some customers, boeing came out with a aircraft that should've put them leaps and bonds but due to one test pilot and trying to get something out that could beat airbus, they shot themselves in the foot, right now boeing is recovering from the blow, I still believe in boeing to recover from the hit
Honestly, Boeing had it coming for a long time. As a long time Boeing fan, it’s obvious they are just making the same mistakes in philosophy as McDonnell Douglas did. Profits over safety.
You may be a Boeing fan but, you are above everything else, wise.
Greetings from Brazil.
The ironic part is MD was never that profitable on the commercial side since they were not investing in new models for years. Just rehash of the DC-9 and DC-10s. Any value of MD was on the military side. It certainly didn't help Boeing that most of the senior management came from MD during the merger.
It's more like quarterly returns over everything, than profits over everything. If they wanted to maximize profits they wouldn't sacrifice their reputation for a few quick bucks.
RIP boeing
You mean THE AMERICAN DREAM🤮🤮🤮🤮 The wole world except the Americans are tired of that dream....
Its about time America realizes that.
As an Australian and frequent QANTAS flyer, I am happy they'll be getting A320's instead of 737 MAX's. I will miss the 737-800's though as I have so many memories of flying them over the years. They were a great workhorse for QANTAS but the A320 is a good buy for the future.
you should make a video explaning "option for buying" "mou" and purchase rights. those are always mentioned but never explained
Do this!!
This is a great idea. Maybe a broader video covering the process of an airline purchasing aircraft from initial selection to delivery?
@@alunesh12345 it's ok to preach your religion but it is completely and utterly unrelated to this topic
@@Superamazing110 I reported it as spam. If it reapers you can do it too.
@@alunesh12345 why should I repent and confess my sins when Jesus loves me anyway? Otherwise it sounds pretty conditionally to me. 🧐
As a frequent flyer in Australia, this makes me feel happier about the aircraft I'll be sitting in.
Boeing has created major trust issues for the flying public that will be hard to get over any time soon.
Obviously public pressure leads to purchase decisions for the carrier as well, whether unfounded or not.
@@carrisasteveinnes1596
Bonza won't affect me.
My company is always Virgin or Qantas 👍
@@semsemeini7905
You don’t hear a great deal Airbus’s problems. Because these sites a focusing on destroying Boeing in favor of Airbus.
@@carrisasteveinnes1596 Bonza, if it survives, is aimed at leisure flying to smaller airports. The only mainstream challenger to Qantas and Virgin Australia is _Rex_ (Regional Express) which is competing on some of the interstate routes using some older ex-VA 737s.
@@mariombrbovic8188 Lmao what? Simple flying has been covering the A350 paint problems extensively
What a load of BS people get over aircraft issues quickly. Once the 737 Max has been flying flawlessly for over a year, maybe you will care but most people won't. I have flown on this same aircraft in the USA before the crashes and I'm here in the land of the living and happy to fly on it again with no concerns whatsoever.
The most powerful concept in sales is ‘new’. Airbus has it, Boeing doesn’t.
*There are many Complex Factors involved in their decision making.*
@@alunesh12345 nowhere is it promised that good humans go to heaven. That is the real of the spirit, not the flash. Stop peddling falsehoods . . .
@@alunesh12345 how about no
A 320 isn't new. It's 80ies design
@@jouniairplanevideos it is newer
Qantas Group is a major A320 operator through its Jetstar subsidiaries and will be able to get economies through sharing resources throughout the Group. The A220 was the only choice as a 717 replacement as Embraer lacks Australian based support.
You say that but Qantas Link has got leasing orders for serval E190’s with only 2 or 3 actually delivered
@@filledwithvariousknowledge2747 The QantasLink E190 leases are needed to plug the gap until the A220s can be delivered as some of the 717s will achieve maximum cycles before the A220 delivery dates. Heavy maintenance for the E190s will be conducted offshore. Some wet leased F100s may also be used to fill the gap during E190 maintenance and during seasonal traffic increases. If Qantas was looking for a longer term use of Embraer aircraft in QantasLink it would have opted for the E2 versions with around 14% reduction in cost per available seat kilometre against the E190.
@@grahambaker6664 how on earth can Alliance afford to run and maintain their Embraers.
@@ytlurker220Alliance is using an operational model similar to early low cost carriers of acquiring second hand aircraft to minimise capital cost. The heavy maintenance is carried out in Singapore pending expansion of its own capacity to maintain the aircraft. Alliance also has the capacity to use F100s from its charter fleet to fill gaps when an E190 is offline. Qantas needs its aircraft to average over 8 flying hours per day and cannot afford to wait a week for spares from Brazil when Airbus is offering less than a day.
@@grahambaker6664 Embraer has several distribution centers around the world, so much so that most of its customers sign contracts for the Pool Program, which offers full repair coverage for components and parts, maintenance of aircraft structures and unlimited access to a large inventory components in all the company's distribution centers.
I think Boeing needs to focus on getting the issues with it's aircraft fixed first. Stop focusing on the competition for now and pick up when it's all done.
Maybe a idea for Boeing to start take the safety into account. What happened around the max is unforgivable. It's all about the customers confidence , something that Boeing lost with the 737 Max.
I think we are watching the demise of Boeing. The industry has lost confidence in the company. One screw up after another all caused by the bean counters trying to put money in front of technical prowess. Sad.
But that is a huge problem for us too, Boeing and Airbus should stay at the same level all the time, only so will they push each other up. If Boeing goes down for the next decade, Airbus will do pretty much nothing.
I think (and hope) that’s not the case, purely because there should be competition. Otherwise Airbus can just sell their current models forever. I do think Boeing may become a smaller player in commercial aviation. But I would like to see them as a challenger to Airbus.
@@genadidimov5206 I wouldn't complain if they keep growing as a company with more advanced and safer planes over the next decades, but, as history has show us, when there's no real competition, companies become stagnant and won't change anything so they can maximize their profits, competition is ESSENTIAL for the industry and our safety.
As a QF frequent flyer, I participated in a Qantas Survey about the 737 some months ago. The survey was concerned about public perception of the MCAS software issue and subsequent grounding. I responded that I had no concerns. But I just didn't like 737, plainly because it felt small. The windows sits too low, it is narrower than its competitor A320. It is a really old 60s design renewed too many times past its use by date.
literally the other day I was thinking how much better KLM would be with airbus planes, can't wait to see that and experience them🤩🤩🤩
Perhaps if Engineers rather than cost cutting executives dictate aircraft designs perhaps the 737 max debacle might never have happened.
The engineer would make a new jet
Qantas Group already has orders for 109 aircraft, consisting of 45 A320neos, 28 A321LRs and 36 A321XLRs mainly for its LCC subsidiary -Jetstar
The JQ XLR order was meant to allow the 11 787-8s currently with JQ to be transferred to QF. I wonder if the now 56 firm 321XLR order will change this.
They still need to pick something to replace the QLink Dash 8s.
@@magical_catgirl - The current order of 109 Airbus that Qantas Group had ordered, 45 A320neo and.28 A321lrs are supposed to be earmarked for JQ. I have heard the rumour that JQ's B787-8's are suppose to be transfered to QF as replacements for the A330-300's and the some of A321xlr to replace the A330-200's,. With the current and additional orders for the A321xlr will be replacing the B737-800's. Time will tell.
The Boeing 737 has been stretched enough. Boeing has to come up with new and better airplanes. I believe these carriers made the right decision by going with the Airbus A320/A220 families of jets. The future is brighter with these airplanes.
fun fact the body of the 737 is actually the same body of the 707.... so the design is 70 years old. vintage :)
A updates 757 would be a solution. Can land and take off on almost every runway, yet can take a lot of passengers.
I am late, but best part about this is that the 737 is at the end of its life while the Airbus jets can still be upgraded and future proofed and both KLM and Qantas will be able to switch their orders to the newer versions if all their orders have not been delivered yet. This also means that they will be able to not retrain their pilots as often for sometime as well
Boeing did this to themselves.
I think the main thing that turned these airlines away (and will hurt!) is safety. Due to the incidences with the Boeing 737 MAX, a lot of passengers will now be scared to fly the Boeing 737 MAX. If Qantas and KLM order these aircraft, just imagine how passengers will receive of it?
Max, Schmax! It's not just the Max, folks today are leery of the entire 737 series, and by extension, all Boeing products, given the ongoing revelations about NG and earlier 73s as well as 777 and 787 QC issues. Boeing is under the microscope, and the image isn't pretty.
I think that the Boeing 737 has reached its max capacity and hence many are doubtful about its future, whereas, the Airbus a320, a321 families has a bright, long future ahead of it. Maybe this is the case for these airlines' "future fleet" choice.
Maybe Boeing should ditch the corporate culture that infected them from the Mcdonell-Douglas purchase and go back to the engineering-focused excellence that brought us the 747.
That's going to be tough considering the hiccups they're having with the 777X development.
I think one of the main factors that made Qantas and Airfrance group choose Airbus is that their new planes will make them save money beacause they are more efficient and eco-friendly.
Boeing should have negotiated with Bombardier the purchase of the C Series program and would already have a replacement in part for the B737 max.
Boeing has caught the mediocrity of MD
@@alunesh12345 what?!?
MD people are on Boeing's board.
MD bought out Boeing with Boeing's own money.
@@alunesh12345 Go do your god bothering somewhere else!
@@davidtaylor4975 You can simply ignore it or scroll away
Boeing is sadly symbolic of the trouble the entire U.S. is afflicted with. A sense of entitlement that prevents them from recognizing their faults or problems, government giveaways to the super rich & corporations that do not encourage innovation, and a focus on short term stock benefits over long term stability & success. Instead of building new aircraft, Boeing went the cheap route and modified an antique design. The results were catastrophic and deadly. Unfortunately, they’ve done nothing to indicate any semblance of change, so it is no wonder businesses with eyes on the future have turned to Airbus.
Well said, I couldn't agree more. The fall of Boeing is a clear indicator of the fall of an empire
Boeing needed this massive wake up call. It has and it should have unravelled for a company that prioritised short term profits over trust and doing the right thing. Especially when the cost is counted in human lives
"What do you think the US planemaker can do to regain it's lost market share?" Stop prioritizing shareholder value over safety and invest in new platforms that aren't twice as old as I am, it is really that simple. I love Boeing but right now they need some tough love.
Agree. It feels like Boeing had a huge advantage when they struck gold with the 777 and managed to make enough of a nuisance to the A380 with the updated 747, and then proceeded to waste it with making the 787 while restructuring the company to a more shareholder friendly approach. While it's the right plane for the right time, the 787's teething problems plus the time spent restructuring would have been better served making a new narrowbody, and now there at a point where the Max was a launch disaster and I wouldn't be surprised if the 777 update also has teething problems and runs even more late, while airbus has brand new planes for those market segments.
Unless they have an ace up their sleeves and spend more of their now limited time resources in restructuring, again, while designing a new narrowbody for the next gen update, I'm not sure if they'll be successful enough in the civilian market to hang around.
Personally, I feel more comfortable flying Airbus at the moment, which is a non issue in the skies in Mexico as the 2 dominant carriers use Airbus while the flag carrying Aeromexico is facing an uphill battle and is the only one still using Boeing.
As a European, and having flown KLM several times in Europe and to North America, I'm really happy they have gone to the Airbus A320/A220 family. I was dreading the Max. I loved their B737-700, 800 and 900's but now Airbus makes more sense. After all, Air France, the sister company, has a close tie with Airbus.
That's great. Finally
Good choice going with Airbus. When I travel, I try to fly on a plane built by Airbus.
I sorta expected this with Qantas because they’d been looking for a whole to align their fleet more closely with JetStar. With KLM I did not expect because AF and KLM were moving towards their own preferred supplier
dayum gonna miss flying on the 737 for domestic in australia, when i was young i was sorta disappointed because i never got to go on the "big planes" (a380, etc) i didnt realise how much i liked flying in them till now. gonna miss em
Wow! Project sunrise uses A350.😃❤✈
Lovely Congratulation AIRBUS good job done
It is really mind numbing that Boeing keeps losing these orders to Airbus and Boeing used to make planes that served the market Airbus is now dominating. If Boeing had kept the 717 in production and even updated it with more efficient engines there would be no market for the A220. Several airlines wanted Boeing to continue production, but since plane was a hold over from McDonnell Douglas they 86'ed it. I also don't need to go into the many ways an updated 757 would have given them a competitive product to the A321 market. They put all their eggs in the 737 Max, a plane that wasn't even ready for prime time and was poorly designed and it cost them dearly in money and trust. You cant get back the time you lose to bad management. Sometimes there are more important things than cost cutting when you lose quality. You get what you pay for whether it's parts or labor.
Most passengers do not like engines at the rear fuselage as in the B717 ((DC-9)).
@@andreasgasser5823 But many airlines liked that plane and they write the checks.
The 717 is also a decades old design, as it is based on the DC-9 (first flight in 1965, which makes it older than the 737), so I don't see why this would have been a good idea. What Boeing should have been doing would have been to create a replacement for the 737 from scratch instead of doing another revamp of the 737NG. The 757 is dead, too, so the only way to go forward would be something that is on the upper part of the 737 range with potential to enlarge it into the NMA range.
@@MattBlue I'm sure you are right on this, sad that the A220 has had over 700 orders because Boeing could not come up with an alternative
@@MattBlue My point was...they should not have killed them but improved them. The design was already there. As for the 717, while the outside might look the same, the technology in the cockpit was state of the art at that time, and interior wise was much nicer than any DC-9. Boeing was limited with the 737 because it was designed to be close to the ground. They would have been better off with a whole new design because they could not push the 737 further, but Boeing had 2 form types that still could have been taken further...they just chose to scrap them. That is hindsight since I am aware that they ceased production. I think that was a mistake
It makes sense for QANTAS, their pilot feeder airline, Jetstar, operate the A320/321.
Hi Simple Flying.. Just subscribed.. Always enjoyed your content.. A quick question.. In plane orders.. I always hear “options” for more.. Significant for pricing? Assuming purchase price was much much lower.. So same price..
kind of weird to see a KLM livery on the A321.
It actually looks really good lol
@@alunesh12345 Stop bothering us with your dead prophet and repent of your spam. You're worse than Viagra.
It hurt my eyes
@@passantNL Dad profet? He is alive, rose from the dead and He will come back. Nothing will remain, neither Airbus neither Boeing only what we can find in His Word. On this final judgment day an A321 or a 737Max will not save you. Only Jesus can if you accept He died for our sins.
@@alunesh12345 im already a Christian so but also your topic has nothing to do with my comment
Boeing really needs to develope the 797 soon because currently Airbus is dominating
They scrapped the NMA aka the 797
The NMA makes zero sense especially since the pandemic...
the problem of the 737max is in my oppinion the biggest argument against boeing. Also the Airbus A320neo Family is in my Opinion the better choice in general
I love the A320 family. Excited to hear the news… the Neo’s are future proof and in my opinion a better product
To regain market share? I suspect that moving Boeing HQ away from Chicago, IL, would be a good beginning.
And go back to Seattle.
or get the US Govt to start a war in Europe therefore instating trade embargos with its allies
As soon as Boeing starts delivering the 777X, they should focus all their attention on the 737/757 replacement. Perhaps use some of the technology developed for the 787 to recoup costs 🤔
Wrong they need to start now... they cant wait and wait...they are falling Airbus are killing them slowly.
boeing is a large enough company they will already be developing 737/757 replacements
Boeing definitely should have scrapped the 737 years ago and invested in the 757.
@@art8311 i hope they will
That would be in 2024
So nice...
Qantas needs the longer range of the A321neo Family planes. We forget that one end of Australia to another is quite a distance, and the A321neo family planes willy fly these distances at a reasonable cost. And the range of the A321XLR allows Qantas to use the plane to much of eastern Asia from SYD.
That's why Qantas has 93 options. They plan to mix in the A321XLR's eventually.
The longest domestic route in australia is probabl cairns to perth which is easily covered by an A320 CEO, they dont need the range of A321's for domestic use. Assuming it for the larger seating and the flexibility the range will give
I'm watching this Video on Airbus & Boeing plus I fly with them alot so this Awesome Video will have more to say on this.
I’m a huge fan of Boeing and IMO their cockpit design on the 777 and the overall design of the 787 shows what an engineering company can do.
Boeing isn’t an engineering company anymore. An engineering company never would have made the 73x max.
I’ve flown on the max and love it, but it’s basic design constraints make it far less of an aircraft than its competition
It is interesting that Boeing 777 came about before the McD aquisition..
Good. Hopefully it will cause both companies to do better
Quite surprisingly, Qantas recently has a wet lease fleet of Embraer e190 from Alliance but now they take a220 instead of E2. (unlike KLM using E2 for short haul routes)
Considering the strength that Airbus gains by jointly negotiating the A220 and A320 family models it's not all that surprising.
Airbus is amaizing
While Qantas operates the 737NG and 717, the fleet also has the A330 and A380. If you include Jetstar, there's long experience with the A320. It makes sense for Qantas to consolidate the Airbus fleet. Boeing doesn't have an equivalent to the A220, and the 717 fleet is very long in the tooth. The current mixed fleet must be expensive to maintain in terms of repairs and pilot training as well as crews. If Qantas had decided to buy the 737 max, a lot of people would have voted with their feet. Boeing just doesn't have the same range of options as Airbus anymore.
PS I'm not even sure about the 787 for Qantas once they get the A350.
Qantas still has a need for the 787, besides JetStar also uses it (no Airbus widebodies planned) despite their all Airbus narrowbody fleet so that’s the only thing both have in common currently which lines up with how Qantas wants it fleet much closer aligned
@@filledwithvariousknowledge2747 why does Qantas need the 787 in the future? The A320XLR, A330 and A350XLR cover a much wider range if requirements. Having said that, the A330 fleet will need to be updated too, some are getting long in the tooth.
@@filledwithvariousknowledge2747 PS I was surprised to see a Qantas A330 on a flight from Melbourne to San Francisco this morning. I didn't realise the it had the range.
"What do you think the US planemaker can do to regain it's lost market share?" Put all engineering resources and invent a time machine. Go back in time and fix the management problems at that company. Or to give another analogy, if Boeing is the Titanic, it has already hit the iceberg; trying to pump out water will only slow the inevitable. If the Titanic should avoid sink, it should have avoided hitting the iceberg to start with.
Boeing being American will force through sanctions
@@bungkusi2432 But how is this going to sell more airplanes (outside the US)?
@@todortodorov940
Let me rephrase:
USA: "There is trade imbalance between our country, you need to buy more Boeing or weapon, or we put tariff of you're product"
Japan: "I will buy more weapon"
India: "I will buy more weapon"
Canada: "I will buy more Boeing"
@@bungkusi2432 That works only as long as you do not have a trade agreement. If you do have one, you cannot just put tariffs. Likewise, if you do this with the bigger economies like the EU or China, they are big enough to successfully put reciprocal tariffs. And finally, in smaller democratic countries, people would be pissed when the US put tariffs just because a private airline company in this country has chosen another airplane manufacturer than Boeing. They will then just boycott US products. This tactic may work in some middle-eastern countries - who knows. I would not put my eggs in that basket, as I don't see this to be the solution to Boeing's problems. At best, this is life support.
@@todortodorov940
USA did this to South Korea, Japan & India too.
You just need to read not from western media to know/understand this.
As a belgian, I did not expect our northern neighbours to do this. It’s weird because we all get used to KLM with boeing aircraft.
I've always praised KLM for Boeing loyalty that has served both companies so well, it's a sad shock, but, hopefully, they will be back! 🥰
@@donaldstanfield8862 True. They are european so it was interesting indeed to see their boeing loyalty. But to see them change their short haul to airbus speaks volumes. Still, we have the 777X and I’m sure they’ll incorporate that giant in their fleet one day.
Klm did always have one type of Airbus in their fleet since the 80s: A310 and current A330. Will be strange but neat to now see A320's in the fleet.
@@zaltmanbleroze I know but their ratio is much more in favour of boeing. It is indeed neat nonetheless considering they are retiring their a330s.
I hope they order the a320 with PW engines.
All I can say is, as a frequent short to medium route economy traveller, that extra inch in seat width on the A320 family makes all the difference to me in comfort. No neighbours' elbows digging into my sides! Plus the aisle is wider, all in all a much less cramped experience than on the dreaded 737! I haven't flown on the A220 yet, but I hear its seats are also more generous
While maybe true, that's not the deciding factor for airlines and their choices of aircraft. Shown time and time again that carriers don't get a fare premium from it.
@@johniii8147 But it is a deciding factor for many customers. In this case, the customer chooses the airlinewith the right airplane.....
@@andreasgasser5823 Actually a small minority. I'm a consultant in the industry and much research has been done on the topic. Especially in economy, it almost always comes down to price and schedule. That's why LLC's have flourished. "Comfort" ranks way down the list for most economy passengers, especially on short haul routes narrow bodies are focused on. Also, a vast majority have no idea what aircraft they will be flying on and don't really care. Comfort and amenities really only matter on longer haul and premium cabins
A 320 may be wider seat pitch is less compared to a 737... It's an illusion.
@@jouniairplanevideos The real complaints are almost always on pitch but people still keep booking the low fares so they cram them in. It's the proven way to make money.
The 737 has pretty much seen the end.
Especially two of their monster creations. Will never set foot in one of them. The 777 is ok though
@@unggrabb the 737 is fine now
Its time to end this old guy to much plastic surgery. 😂
The 737 has made a good work a long of this years now he need to go for good.
Like the 320
@@Tolpuddle581 how rude of you to say that.
Not that hard to see why an airline would prefer an aircraft that is:
* More comfortable for passengers
* More fuel efficient
* More reliable, with a name that isn't feared
* More modern design likely to have fleet interoperability for decades instead of an ancient airframe at the end of its life
* Better features at the gate like containerized baggage
* Allows you to cultivate a relationship with a company with good leadership, principles, and clear future plans, instead of a company that is by most metrics turning into an unapologetic disaster
Hahaha, you're a yoke
You forgot to mention that Qantas already operate the A330 - we traveled on one from Brisbane to Hong Kong in 2020 before the pandemic.
This question is not related to this video but I was wondering on what other platform can we find your videos
Boeing needs a proper update or replacement to that 737 if they want to survive really :/
@ Vince Andrew Mahinan , I agree they need to replace the 737 with a new design but they also need a nma to replace the 757 and 767 aircraft if they want to maintain their share of the airliner market
They will survive, don't worry. They have an arsenal of lobbyists, former company executives in government and the lot to give them bailouts if necessary and huge amounts of government funding every year. If the MAX program fails, they will lose A LOT of money, but they most likely won't be allowed by the US government to close its doors for good.
@@ryanjonathanmartin3933 I agree they wont fail completely, they still have a lot going for them in the military and freighter markets and in addition to the lobbyists and government bailout options if things get bad, there is always the possibility of another manufacturer, most likely lockheed imo, going for a merger or buyout like boeing did with Mcdonnell Douglas.
Boeing accused Airbus in the past for getting government money but will get government money in the future themselves.
@@dandegelder3807 They can replace the 737 and 757 simultaneously with the 797 just like Airbus did with the A321-A320 LR/XLR its not a problem they need to figure it out. About the 767 why they made 787? it supposed to replace them.
The 757 and 767 are the best workhorses and the best plane that Boeing ever made.I will like to see them a challenge for them (Boeing) to make something better.
The A320 always had the advantage of being designed around turbofan engines, unlike the 1960's designed 737 which was built around the old style 1st generation pure jet engine with the thrust nozzle at the back of the wing which became an obvious problem where the new generation Max engine nozzles were near the front of the wing which needed this (tucked away) MCAS to compensate for the obvious performance changes until that horrible day in 2018. The 737 is definitely at its end.
In order for Boeing to save face they must launch a “ NEW” aircraft non - related to the 737 .
Michael O'leary must be on cloud 9 right now, losing these key operators is huge for Boeing, he can now push them for even steeper discounts when he buys another 100 737s
Who knows? He might find it more and more difficult to sell the 737s he already owns.
@@haukewalden2840 for how many years does Ryanair hold on to their 737s? I don't think he'll have trouble selling to airlines in Asia, the Americas or Africa though.
@@marcelbischof7203 : Selling new ones for cheap automatically lowers the price for used ones, I'd say. If even an airline like Allegiant can afford to buy brand-new 737s from Boeing, they have no more (or at least: less) need to buy used ones, which will lower the price.
Buying new for cheap only really pays off if you're willing to keep the plane until the very end.
@@haukewalden2840 well then why would Ryanair ask for steep discounts every time they order?
@@marcelbischof7203: Obviously because it is nice when YOU have to pay less. It's not so nice if all the OTHERS can buy for cheap.
Good luck with the airframe skin
Cool
Because of the MAX’s former “issues” Boeing was probably wanting to make up lost revenue on the program so they priced the 737 MAX’s accordingly, since Airbus didn’t have these struggles they were able to offer KLM and QANTAS cheaper prices and a better deal.
I think the opposite is true: Boeing are desperate for any cash revenue and have 737s ready for sale so will discount hard. Airbus on the other hand have a full (more than full) order book especially for the A220 / A320 families so have no need to discount (more than they do anyway).
I thing the change is because of what goes with the name Boeing and especially the outdated 737MAX
@@alunesh12345 Don’t eat yellow snow.
I would think a look at the residual values of these two aircraft types, the A32*xxx-neo versus B73*M 5 to 7 to 10 years on, may afford (pun intended) clue as to what a lessor / owner wants to see on their books.
as a Dutchy, I'm quite happy that KLM chose for the a320! Its a more comfortable plane imo with wider seats, and I feel a lot of people won't be comfortable stepping into a 737 max.
@Simple Flying also one more thing, Turkish Airlines recently cancelled their 40+ Boeing 737 MAX orders as well.
Good siting in anything from 737 to a 777 is beyond loud, airbus are calm lovely feats of engineering
Boeing Lowkey deserves this.
Not lowkey. They've been getting away with too much for too long. This is long overdue.
the a321xlr and the a220 are key for narrow bodys. as seen with the max the 737 is already at its limit so they need to start form scratch or redesign the 757 ot 767. Not to mention both United and american had 50 each of the a321xlr on order.
KLM is gonna switch to full airbus in the longterm and Air France to full Boeing so they have bonuses that I believe and since Transavia is a part of KLM that also goes for mainly Airbus
Quality matters.
In these difficult times the 737 max was not able to convince airlines to buy it. It is more expensive to operate and the recertification has been a major concern of liability.
Serve Boeing right. Short sighted profit over quality and safety.
God I wish Air Canada had stuck with the A320 family and ordered the A320neo and A321LR.
Bet it was a quick and easy decision too
Did they look at the MC-21?
Qantas' LCC Jetstar has A320 in their fleet already, and QF mainline flies A330 and A380. They've already announced they'll be taking on A350-1000 in the future. Type commonality between Airbus aircraft means they can train existing pilots on the new types rapidly. They would have crew training facilities already for the A320 from Jetstar, already have maintenance equipment and staff in place to handle the type, and after the A380 incident above Singapore I'm sure they got a great deal from Airbus.
What happened in Singapore?
@@osasunaitor An engine on an A380 climbing out of Singapore blew up, damaging control systems. This was really the fault of Rolls Royce, the engine manufacturer, rather than Airbus. Despite the plane being barely controllable, the pilots managed to get it back on the ground again with no loss of life - they were heroes in my opinion.
@@ronwest7185 wow I was unaware of this incident, I'll look more into it, thanks
@@osasunaitor ...really the incident happened 2010
Part of Qantas' reason for the change might be that Virgin Australia has streamlined its fleet to 737s at present and Qantas (and its budget carrier Jetstar) might want a point of difference domestically to its main rival.
Add to that Rex, a new player in the domestic inter-capital city market in Australia, is also flying 737s (I think a few of them were previously owned/ leased by Virgin Australia).
I like the a320 more than the 737. Just such a clean looking design
agree
the amount of extra crew needed to ramp the a320 is gonna get more jobs soo all good, just wish virgin would go the same route
The MAX debacle and known problems with one of Boeing's assembly lines pretty much sealed the company's fate.
Compensation from Australia for the submarine debacle....
Probably, but I will miss the 717 on the short hops in AUS
Indeed all is politics
you could speculate about the merits of each plane... the A220 is a looker for sure. however the strong dollar and the crash in the price of the euro which is going to be down for a long time to come... pricing your new purchases in euros VS dollars could be a very nice saving indeed. if the orders are for delivery a long way off, there could be further upgrades to the a320 as its being continuously. updated. boeing on the other hand still have computer chips from the 1980s that are very hard to find these days.
I hope more carriers order more Airbus than boeing, the over all experience on an Airbus is so much better then being on a boeing aircraft.
I love a320 family also the a220
Qantas A220 Wow!!! Is future A220 Operator In Australia🇦🇺 😍😍😍I hope Infinite Flight will add Qantas A220 Soon!
What are "purchase rights"? Does it mean if they do decide to order them, they'll be delivered sooner?
My understanding it buys you a slot in the queue.
@@richardthomson4693 i figured it'd be something like that, thanks
Probably the trust issues with both 737 Max and 787 Dreamliner contributed for the airlines decision. You may put profits ahead safety, but sometime soon it will be a problem hard to deal with.
I think the fuel efficiency of both the A220 and A320neo are greater than the carrier's 373-800 fleets. And QANTAS' 717-200 were bound to be retired eventually as they are going onto over I think 30 years of use.
The A220 and A320 are just so much more advanced than the antiquated 737. That companies with all-Boeing fleets (like KLM) are switching to Airbus just shows how dramatic it is. Boeing still needs to be punished for the MAX disaster. Otherwise they should be boycotted anyway.
I’m happy Qantas and KLM have gone for the right choice.
Lol, good decision. They don't want their whole narrow body planes grounded.
Way to go Airbus!
It makes sense to invest in more future proof, fuel efficient planes that (if I'm correct) have basically the same control panel layout across narrow and wide body short, medium and long haul planes. Short term they'll have invest in retraining pilots to get them up to speed with the differences between Boeing and Airbus but long term it'll allow for greater versatility with what routes they can put pilots on. That's my thinking anyway. The 737max issues probably had something to do with it too. Another thing I'm thinking is that even though the A380 is being made redundant, the impressive technology that went into building that plane was probably a good advertisment for what Airbus is capable of.
Nothing is future proof.
@@scotttild I was speaking relative to the age of their current fleet
I very much agree, the a380 might not have been the most successful airbus aircraft but it advertises how technologically inept and advanced they are to get that whale to fly safely, with four engines while keeping it as quiet as it is. The a350 reinforced this fact. As well as the new concept of narrowbody long haul aircraft, again tells airlines the quality of airbus aircraft. Thank God Boeing has the 787 or they'll pretty much be out of business.
A pilot isn't allowed to fly more plane types.
@@jouniairplanevideos Airbus plane cockpits are relatively very similar, so the pilots only need a type-rating to switch form aircraft to aircraft.
They ditched Boing because of the bad rep of the MAX-8, plus the NEO line offers better fuel efficiency + long-haul capabilities
It is time to revise Boeing strategy urgently!!!
Public perception would have been a consideration for sure.
Thank you very much for the informative video! :-) Why have Qantas and Air France/ KLM ordered Airbus? It would become a very long comment to discuss this. Btw.: Today Allegiant published an order of 50 B 737 MAX - Allegiant is until now a pure Airbus-Customer. So...
Yes they gonna buy 50 Boeings the other 100 they gonna order are Airbusses. You also know the shares went down 8.8% after they published the order?
Allegiant use to fly Boeing 757-200 and they even had MD 80s.