Elden Ring Lore - Who Are The Black Knife Assassins?
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- Опубликовано: 12 сен 2024
- Welcome to our lore dive on The Black Knife Assassins. This was our most highly requested community video to date, and we hope you enjoy our take on these enemies and the theories surrounding them.
I'm certain that Alecto was imprisoned by Iji. He works for Ranni, he has the skills to imprison in evergaols and that particular evergaol is only accessible after you finish Ranni's questline. I think this is why Black Knives are coming after Ranni, she betrayed them at some point.
That area was home to a two-fimgers, so it might be the opposite.
I think the Black Kinives betrayed Ranni on the very night of the Black Knives. I think she aided in the conspiracy because the Black Knives told her Radahn was to be the target. As Ranni would need to eliminate him to fully realize her ambitions with Godwyn dead in Radahn'splace only part of her scheme came to fruition and she was literally left spinning her wheels for an age and beyond should the Tarnish not step in on her behalf. Hence the imprisonment of Alecto in the Evergoal on the Moolight Altar as punishment for betraying Ranni. Furthermore I think sidelining Ranni was all part of plan of the leader of the Black Knives real and unnamed leader behind Godwyn's death hence when Ranni slays her 2 finger the Black knives were sent again to take out Ranni and her crew because she just become a real threat again.
I believe that the Black Knives in truth served and continue to serve none other than Miquella. Think about it we know that Miquella became disillusioned with the Golden order and struck out establish his own order. And where is the one place in the game where we find multiple Black Knive Assassins and their armor set no less? At the secret entrance of the Haligtree. So many things about Miquella all remind me of Griffith from Berserk and that sort of elaborate planning and hidden ruthlessness would be very fitting even Mogh's apparent kidnapping of Miquella may have been all part of his plan. Miquella was able to conceal his location and plans from even outer gods strange then that not only was Mogh able to find Miquella but leave with him seemingly without a fight or anyone kicking up a fuss even Melania seems to be merely awaiting his return with no alarm or concern about his apparent disappearance.
The baleful shadows can take the appearance of anybody so it’s not guaranteed to be the black knife assassins.
This was my guess also. Maybe yhe black knife assassins were helping ranni because she had their ringleader imprisoned. Also iji having 3 assassins around him at the time of his death would make it reasonable. But why was he burning with the black flame?
@@palesmichael Alecto was plainly imprisoned after the Night of Black Knives read the description of Tiche's Ashes she died while helping her mother Alecto escape from the capital in the aftermath of assassinating Godwyn. As I said in my previous post its fairly clear that Ranni Black Knives came into direct conflict immediately after the Night of Black Knives. Exactly why is unknown. Personally I think its because they enlisted Ranni's aid by telling her they were going to kill Radahn instead of Godwyn and that by changing the target the Black Knives effectively stalled out Ranni's fate indefinitely.
Iji was burning with the Black flame because the Black Knives were able to kill him with their titular black knives which are imbued with destined death which burn with a lingering black flame.
One missing detail about the Black Knives' role in the setting is missing from this video: in the game, the Black Knives outside the Evergaols seem to be serving the Golden Order, as incongruous as that sounds. They guard the remaining demigods at Leyndell and Haligtree, and when it seems that Ranni's quest to replace the Golden Order with her own might actually come to pass, they swarm to kill her advisor and advance on her base of operations, only to find the half-crazed Blaidd, instead.
This, to me, increases the credence of the idea that the Black Knives serve Queen Marika behind the scenes, though whether they also agreed with the Shattering is unclear. It also suggests to me that Ranni and Marika were cooperating to obtain the Rune of Death each for their own reasons, but their alliance was only a temporary convenience, two different schemes briefly coinciding.
Not to mention the Black Knives surrounding Iji's body.
Well said.
It could be Ranni took advantage of Marika's plan and decided to enact her own plan of killing her body by also allowing Godwyn to die.
Here's my main problem with Marika being in on the plan to kill Godwyn as part of a scheme to subvert the Golden Order and the greater will that no one who subscribes to that theory can seem to answer: How would/did killing Godwyn in particular further that end and serve that purpose?
Also the primary connection between Marika and the black knives is that like her they are Numen they hail from the same pre-golden order civilization from beyond the Lands between their close ties very much be no more than that. Given what Marika and the Golden order did to the Numen: banish them underground then send Astel to wipe most of them out, it seems more like they would, deeply deeply hate and resent Marika which very much explain their willingness to kill Godwyn purported to be her favorite child.
While I fully believe given what goes down with Blaidd and Iji the Black Knives did not an do not serve Ranni and merely enlisted her aid in the conspiracy on that night I think the person they truly served on that night and continued to serve was not Marika but Miquella sowing the seeds to bring down the Golden order and establish his own order(I mean it is flatly stated that Miquella became disillusioned with the golden order and sought to establish his own order). More over I think Ranni was lied to about who was to be the target of assassination that night. That Ranni was told it was Radahn who was to be killed not Godwyn. As Ranni needed to have another demi-god killed in the same moment to die bodily through the curse mark however with Radahn alive her fate would remain suspended indefinitely sideling her in the conflict that was to follow unless the Tarnish steps in on her behalf. In this Fashion Miquella removed Ranni as a rival while rocking golden order to its core creating an opening for his new order. This would explain Ranni's seemingly imprisoning the Black Knives leader in the evergoal in the moonlight altar in revenge and also why the Black Knives moved on her crew the moment she killed the two fingers assigned to her and became a real rival to Miquella again. After all where is the one location in the game where we find multiple living Black Knive Assassins in one location and their very armor set no less? At the Secret location of the Haligtree that even Gideon and the greater will were unaware of. I mean if all that lines up Miquella would very much be deserving of Melina lending him the title of the most Fearsome of the Empyreans.
@@Terminalsanity I think that Godwyn had to die because he was too powerful and charismatic to fit Marika's plans for the Shattering. He could have persuaded the Demigods to work together to restore the Elden Ring, or at least Marika feared that would be a possibility.
Miquella is such a cipher that I try not to speculate too much about him at this point, we'll probably learn more about his motives in a future DLC.
Rogier was too pure for this world
Tiche is a variant spelling of Tyche, a greek goddess of luck who was associated with the Erinyes, one of whom was Alecto. The Erinyes dwelled underground, and their sphere was vengeance and rage, specifically against those who swear false oaths. They were the daughters of the goddess of night, Nyx, whose name in the Roman pantheon was Nox.
This implies that they sought vengeance against either the Golden Order generally or possibly even Godwyn specifically. We don't really get much information about what he was like before his death, other than his founding of the dragon cult.
That makes sense. It says that, while the Numen are not of the lands between, it is also said that that they are scions of the subterranean Eternal Cities - of which are occupied by the Nox.
I thought the name sounded familiar. Perhaps Fromsoft will introduce their own versions of Megara and Tisiphone? :P
If you continue Ranni's questline, kill Blaidd after he goes mad, and then tell Iji, he gets murdered by Black Knife Assassins. Interestingly, his body isn't burning with the dark red flame of destined death, but the black flame of the Godskins
Probably just error or bad texture.
@@NathienSK no...
I wonder if after he killed the assassin's he set himself on fire with black flame. Idk why he would kill himself exactly but the way his body is positioned makes me think maybe he did it to himself.
@@Drawnartist he was too prideful to let someone else kill him
The black flame of the Godskins was derived directly from destined death and was the original form of it... pretty sure the reason it has not red in it is because the the black knives only had a fragment of destined death and so like the Godskin flames are a weaker less potent form of the destined death that Maleketh wields.
Important distinction: Melina's moveset is actually a buffed version of Alecto's, not just any of the assassins'.
My personal headcannon is that Ranni and Marika plotted to steal the Rune of Death and Marika elicited the Black Knives, who she is tied to through her relationship with the Numen. The plan was to assassinate Godwyn's body (but not soul) although Marika did not anticipate Ranni would also simultaneous use the Black Knife on herself to rid her body and break free from the two fingers/Greater Will.
Ranni, in a way, double-crossed/used Marika who then lost her son, Godwyn, and realizing what she had done went into mourning and broke the Elden Ring.
Ranni was the only other person to know the assassination plot and its too coincidental that Godwyn and Ranni both 'died' at the same time.
Ranni was so absorbed in breaking free of the Greater Will and getting out of the Lands Between, I don't believe she really cared what happened so long as she achieved her goal. Also, Godwyn is not her 'immediate' family (in a weird way) so she didn't feel as guilty. Keep in mind Ranni also gave Rykard, her brother, the Blasphemous Claw to use later to to challenge Maliketh
There is just one critical flaw in this: Ranni states that she had no desire to follow the Two Fingers, and refused to take part in Empyrean matters. It almost seems that Ranni chose a really bad time to terminate herself, as both hers and Godwyn's deaths set off everything, with the Black Knives taking the fall for it.
So Melina may or may not have been an exception to the rule regarding maidens.
There are a lot of black knife assassins who remain without a body. If you try to get into The Haligtree you’ll know what I mean.
She was given orders to bring us to the Erd Tree and to burn it, though she says she’s doing this of her own accord now.
She could bring us to Faraam Azula without us knowing how or what she was bringing us to, meaning that she knew about The Destined Death.
While we don’t have a perfect picture about the nature of Maidens aside from the fact that they can bring about the burning of the erd tree, I believe that maybe she and all the maidens were Black Knives, or born from this event, who came away with something from the demigods to that made them Maidens.
I’ve always believed Marika was involved with the plot. It just seemed a natural conclusion I came to after playing the game and paying attention, and I’m glad someone else is talking about it.
I see a lot of mischaracterization and misunderstanding of Marika in this fandom. Some people I know think Marika was some kind of Greater Will Omegasimp and poor wittle meow meow Radagon was trying to stop her unending tyranny and dogmatic nature, although…if you pay a single shred of attention you’ll find the reality is the direct opposite of that. Marika seems to be trying to liberate The Lands Between from the tyranny of the Greater Will, and Radagon is the one trying to repair and uphold the Order.
The probability that Marika created/gave birth to Melina is another piece of evidence that leads us to conclude that Marika wants the Erdtree burned and a new era to be born.
I think Marika plotted to cause a series of events that would destabilize the golden order. Even going as far as killing her son, Godwyn. She must have know he would come back or could be resurrected. But I feel as though Ranni found out about this plan and hijacked it for her own means, to liberate herself. As a result Godwyn death is incomplete and Marika feels at fault at some level.
Yeah that's very plausible
Nah, Marika and Ranni worked together. They both were disgusted by the Golden Order, and Ranni’s ending achieves an order seperate from the world- unable to be tampered with. It’s what Marika would have wanted imo.
Ranni and Marika were working together in the assassination plot against godwyn. We know this because ranni imbued the black knives daggers with the rune of death after stealing it from malikieth which Queen Marika probably helped ranni in stealing it. Queen Marika ordered the assassination against godwyn because she is the only one who has a direct connection with the black knives.
The purpose for killing godwyn was a means to end/weaken the greater wills control and destroy the golden order. Godwyn was favored by the greater will and was to be the next Elden Lord. Princess Lunar Ranni was fated to be next in line to be Queen because of her empyrean lineage like Queen Marika. We know that ranni didn't want this fate because it meant enslavement to the greater will so she would destroy her empryean body the same night of godwyns death which was planned by both Ranni and Queen Marika.
With Godwyn assassinated and Ranni's empyrean body destroyed it gave Queen Marika the opportunity to cause the shattering of the Elden Ring which would give anyone else a chance to bring about an age of change.
In the place where we find Melina's dagger, there is clothes in which it is directly said about the order of secret agents. Who did the dirty work (not like an executioner dung eater) and all sorts of spy stuff. Some of them became the Black Knives. But not all. Melina is an example.
The officials attire and related set pieces say nothing about the black knife assassins. It's an interesting idea but I don't think there's much evidence to back it up outside of its location.
Personally, I've come to believe that the Black Knives serve the Two Fingers, and that it was them who orchestrated the assassination of Godwyn.
Ranni being the sole mastermind never really clicked with me, and neither did Marika, but we have evidence that the Black Knives serve the adherents of the Golden Order in some way, namely in that, at the end of Ranni's questline, when the Two Fingers are intent in halting her plans, it's Black Knives that show up to take everyone out, and the Baleful Shadow, explicitly stated to be working for the Fingers, even had Death Blight imbued in its blade.
Why? I think Marika's sealing Destined Death went against the designs of the Greater Will, and the Fingers ordered Ranni (who would opportunistically use this chance to sever herself from their influence) to steal the rune of death from Maliketh and imbue it into the assassin's knives. It's stated that the Black Knives are all Numen with close ties to Marika, and I believe that is why they were chosen; they were close to the royals in a way that would allow them to strike how no others could. And why Godwyn? He was a celebrated hero, the greatest of the Golden Lineage. His killing was meant to outline to Marika that disobedience to the Greater Will's machinations would result in grave consequences, even for those who seemed pure and untouchable. But even in their attempt to beat her into submission, it only pushed her over the edge of despair and fury, fueling her resolve to go through with the shattering of the Elden Ring, the greatest act of defiance. It could also explain some of Ranni's own resentment towards the Fingers, who forced her to play a part in her step-sibling's murder.
To leave off, I'll cite a line from the Song of Lament, sung by the harpies: "O Golden One, at whom were you so angry?"
Yes, this has been my theory too, since finishing Ranni's and Blaidd's questlines. Always thought it was too much of a coincidence that on the final act of Ranni's defiance and the slaying of her Two Fingers, it was a squad of Black Knife Assassins that was sent to kill her and her vassals.
I honestly believe the Black knife looked more normal like melina’s dagger and heres why: The dagger has its main blade and its 3 other blades, jutting out in random directions and if you see the sub-blades are not fashioned in a matching way, they jut out in weird contortions that make you wonder how the hell was this blade even used efficiently? Well You guys all know what it looks like to be death-blighted, right? Doesn’t the Black Knife dagger look like its been “death-blighted” with all those sub blades jutting out? So yeah I believe it took that form after being imbued with the Rune of Death.
Oh boy, fighting your first one of these is a fun time. For me, it wasn't even in the Black Knife Catacombs, it was one of the other dungeons, can't remember which. Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if Markia was involved in the Knight of Black Knives somehow: considering how many of the assassins you fight out in the world, shows that most of them got away on that night in question. Or they were helped out of the capital...
You know, if Miquella and Malenia are the direct spawn of Marika alone, dose that make them full-blooded Numen? And since their mother was an Empyrean, perhaps that could act as an explanation for why they’re both Empyrean.
No cause radagon isn’t
@@trustee8503 Isn’t Radagon a aspect of Marika brought about by the Greater Will? All I know is that, while Malenia is the daughter of the two, it’s clearly said she is born of a single god. And in case anybody has forgotten, Radagon used to have blond hair before being cursed by the last Fire Giant.
@@AlbertusSalvatierra we can only assume that Radagon was an aspect of Marika from the limited info we have. Based on the fact that he had married and sire children before he married Marika, what could also be true is that Marika and Radagon were two separate beings, but after the hounding of Godfrey, which I believe was ordered by the Greater Will and Marika did it out of reluctance (based upon her love of Godwyn which was her and Godfrey’s child), the Greater Will probably felt it needed to tighten its grip in Marika, so it forced her to marry Radagon who was loyal to the Golden Order. When Marika shattered the Elden Ring, the Greater Will likely fused the two and forced Radagon to try to fix it. Radagon is only ever seen as a tool and was fused with Marika to become a controllable god for the Greater Will since Marika had gone off the deep end. Purely my take though, cannot wait for DLC
@@AlbertusSalvatierra it is implied that radagon and marika didn’t begin as the same person, and melina isn’t the daughter of radagon or marika or at least not confirmed, so this whole thing is just speculation. The one problem with her being a daughter of marika is that she maybe is the gloam eyed queen and is enemy to the golden order and marika
@@trustee8503 it is never implied that radagon began as his own entity, only that he and marika were separate entities during his time with Rennala
You have a great narrating voice and pace. Great work sir!
Thank you very much!
Considering D is two bodies, one soul such as Marika/Radagon and that Godwyn appears to have two bodies.
Could it be that Melana, and Ranni are somehow the same being as well? If Godwyn got split into two bodies, perhaps Ranni got split into two souls?
Elden Ring timelines are super clear: "Long before the shattering of the Elding Ring... soon, the Elden Ring was smashed" smh
I like playing your lore videos at night because your voice helps me fall asleep. Very calming
I love how calm and good your voice are for storytelling. It’s very cool to dive in the lore of specific character. What I’m very intrigued about is Hoarah Loux and how it links to the the Hero class.
That fight with the black knife in the sages cave was like my favourite fight in the game it was so cool seeing her appear and shank me then disappear before I can hit her was so bad ass, and having to watch the water to see where she was made the fight interesting and a really fun challenge.
Unintentional ASMR is the only ASMR i like. Your voice is incredible.
And i really like this theory, im on this side as well, marika planed everything
Really blown away by all the positivity around my voice, this is baffling to me.
Imagine when we get the dlc it takes us to the past it’s us who plants the death rune into the black knife assassins leading us to the events that happen
If you look at the sheath on the black knife assassin armor it matches the blade of calling so that means that the misshapen blades are after
So my head canon, is that Ranni saw how her mother was Broken by Radagon leaving her for Marika, so ranni recruited the black knives (who were marika’s kin) to kill Godwyn (marika’s son, obviously payback for ruining her mom mentally) she may or may not have trapped Alecto in the evergaol as a safety measure for Alecto (being the leader of the knives)…
I theorize that the knives are just like the baleful shadows, while not created by the GW, they are bound by oath to serve. So this betrayal to the order sends Marika into a frenzy, shatters the ring, the knives cant be punished properly at the time, so they just get shoved off into guard duty for the crypts.
As far as why the black knives are attacking ranni’s group, its possible that they are seeking some form of retribution to regain their place as honored (“relatives”?) to marika.
We know that Marika wanted to be free of the GW, so its possible Ranni used her vision of her destiny apart from the GW, to basically kill two birds one stone. No physical body with ties to gold, and a shattered state of the world to move freely, only Radahn her brother standing in th way
Is there any lore on why they're dripping like a damn faucet.
That's actually the concealing magic falling off their cloak
Cuz if they didn’t drip, they’d drown
There is something so pleasant about Rogier's VA
Very interesting, I think I might make a black knife assassin that would try to distance themselves from the pack of assassins, and try to live their life as a peaceful nomad warrior who wields a custom bloody twin blade. Unfortunately for them, their urge for the former thrill and fun of being a black knife assassin causes them to develop PTSD as well as insomnia, as sleeping would cause them nightmares. So once the call of grace beckons them back home to the lands between, their urge grows and they become a black knife assassin once more.
Nice video!
I definitely think you're on to something with these theories. I've been wondering if the Black Knives were Marika's personal assassins in the early days of her rise to power, perhaps even being given access to the Rune of Death to perform their missions long before the Night of Black Knives. At least until one of their number used its power to rebel, becoming the Dusk-Eyed Queen of the Godskin cult and forcing Maliketh to defeat her and finally seal the Rune of Death away
If, as many people theorize, this was Melina, it could explain some things. Like how the Dusk-Eyed Queen could have access to the power of Death or be an Empyrean. Perhaps Melina was, in fact, Marika's first child even before Godwyn, but her existence was kept a secret because of how it would make Marika look, given her history as an assassin and a traitor (very Hela in Thor Ragnarok). And that's not even getting into whether everything with the Night of Black Knives was just Marika's backup plan, with her being behind Melina's acts as the Dusk-Eyed Queen in the first place
See this was exactly the reason we didnt go too deep into Melina, it's an absolutely wild ride trying to figure out the specifics of her background. Personally I agree with a lot of your theory here.
@@square-table-gaming Yeah, it's a doozy lol
But the Black Knives being loyal to Marika and already having experience with the Rune of Death makes their involvement with Ranni's plot, as well as their skill with those knives, make more sense to me. Plus, it's more narratively satisfying than them just being a random guild hired for a job. It also might make sense this way that they come after Ranni and her allies near the end of her questline. They still want whatever Marika's plan is to succeed, and though it has aligned with Ranni's actions up to that point, once they realize the Age of Stars might actually happen, they start trying to prevent it. It's just a little too late by then
Thanks for making this video clearing up the miscommunication that the black knives work for ranni when they don't.
I'm pretty sure there was some lore implication that sometime before or during the events of the game the assassins were hired by either Marika or the two fingers to kill Ranni. That's why we find Alecto in the Evergaol in an area associated with Ranni. Alecto tried to kill her but Ranni imprisoned her.
I like the black knives a lot. To me they seem like an assassin guild that just do what they do out of money and not loyalty. They were hired by Ranni to kill Godwyn and were later ironically hired by someone else to kill Ranni.
That would explain why a Black Knife Assassin awaits trespassers right outside the Queen's Bedchamber at Leyndell Royal Capital.
Great video as always!
You touched on something so close to what I wish you talked about but you focused on the Marika part instead. Rogier is probably the best lore dump we get on the night of the black knives outside of the equipment. He says,
“You recall our conversation about the Night of the Black Knives, yes? They say the assassins who carried out the deed were scions of the Eternal City. A group entirely of women, arrayed in armour of silver under cloaks which fooled the eye.
The knives they wielded though, were imparted with the power of the Rune of Death through sinister rite.”
This makes, in my opinion, a lot more sense when you realize the eternal cities’ allegiance through the following:
“Long ago, the Nox invoked the ire of the Greater Will, and were banished deep underground. Now they live under a false night sky, in eternal anticipation of their liege. Of the coming age of the stars. And their Lord of Night.“
After this it should be obvious Ranni and the Eternal Cities are in coordination with one another, especially when you consider that her ending ushers in the Age of Stars, and Ranni’s questline has you exploring that area. The Black Knife Assassins are likely agents of the eternal cities, which is well within their characterization as the eternal cities wish to usurp the greater will and the black knife assassins assist the one who will bring about that Age. Their connection to Marika I think is interesting but there is in my opinion a lot less substantial lore surrounding that than anything else.
The hard part about Marika's involvement with the Night of Black Knives is that while from a lore standpoint, it makes a certain sense, but from a logical standpoint, it's unnecessary.
Keep in mind that the shattering of the Elden Ring, was unexpected for pretty much everyone. Ranni's lines in the story trailer paint this picture well with saying how Marika was driven to the brink and the mystery around who broke the Ring and why. And yes, taking a trailer as canon is shaky, I acknowledge that. But when you look at it, the only person who really benefits from the death of Godwyn is Ranni. Marika didn't need to have her firstborn killed just to break the Elden Ring. But this is just my interpretation.
Also, I want to acknowledge the ghost close to the Walking Mausoleum calling the soulless demigod Marika's unwanted child. That may tie in somewhere, maybe. idk, the mausoleums are confusing. just wanted to cover all bits.
Its possible that Godwyn the golden was so powerful demigod that not only could kill other demigods for their great runes but completely loyal to the golden order like radagon. Marika had to kill him for the destabilization to end
@@snowi8650 Maybe...idk, that could be the reason but it feels like something's missing. Out of all the demigods, why Godwyn? It's assumed that he was Marika's favorite but there really isn't enough to paint that picture. And if he was, why have him killed over any of the other demigods?
@@parceustheawesome1298 The reason for godwyns assassination was because he was favored by the greater will to be the next Elden Lord and lunar princess ranni was fated to be the next Queen because of her empyrean lineage like Queen Marika. If Queen Marika was to shattered the elden Ring before the assassination of godwyn and ranni destroying her empryean body nothing would change. The greater will would still have enslavement over ranni to tend the Elden Ring after replacing Marika and godwyn would still be alive to uphold the golden order through the greater will.
When you're editing these videos, it would help to have an overlay showing the specific items or weapons that you mention.
Anybody have any theories on the prince of death? Like, once you find him under the capitol, the one in stormveil doesnt disappear or anything, so what is the second one and where did it come from?
His body (without soul) just sprouts everywhere like a tree. And that face is just his offspring. The Tree of Death, the First Living Dead.
Its clearly his entire body since we can see his shoulder poking out.
Maybe his body is more mutated than we thought?
After all stormveil is roughly above the deeproot depths perhaps the two bodys are actually a single massive one that reaches from the dephts up to stormveil
@@MogulMogul I dont know man, I have to double check but fias final location is under leyendell, that means if the head in stormveil is connected to the same body ot would have to stretch all the way throug liurnia, that seems preposterous. In the opening it seems like fia was trying to lay with godwyn to revive or rebirth him, but that was stopped. I was thinking maybe someone tried to revive him by throwing him into the crucible, but it created a monster body without a soul that skittered off and eventually burst through the wall in stormveil and died or was killed in the process. That one is also missing its eyes, unlike the one fia is next to. There is also the matter of the identity of the body on the altar that the gate in that room takes you to, but i feel like we'd need more info to come to a more solid conclusion. Maybe in the dlc.
His actual body is under the Capitol, the game directly states that. I believe the face under stormveil is more of a symptom of his body in undeath corrupting the roots. There's a lot of mentions of the death curse in him leading to corruption, and I believe some items reference it starting to corrupt the roots themselves. This also makes sense as to why, if you look at random root clusters through the world up close, there are also faces similar to his face there
@@tonyawwwno3364 I feel like if the giant face in stormveil was a symptom there would probably be another one somewhere, i also saw a video describing it as a husk, which was interesting, by why would it bleed when you hit it? I looked at the clusters by the liurnia tower and summon water, but im not seeing any kind of face on them, is there a group youve seen elsewhere that a face is more visible?
Your vids are just pleasant to listen to
Thank you :D I am truly surprised every time someone says something nice about my voice
@@square-table-gaming You should get used to it if you keep making quality content like this lol
The soothing narration , the brilliant OST .. everything is flawless
great work really good getting such well made vids so soon after the previous keep it up
They are so cool! Love that they can glide around.
Given that Melina's moveset is nearly one to one with the other black knives we fight, I think it would be safe to say she was at the very least a daughter of a black knife (perhaps another of Alecto's?) And since Melina tells us that her mother started her on her quest maybe the knives offered one of their own to serve as kindling when Marika was outlining her plans to establish a new world order...
In the place where we find Melina's dagger, there is clothes in which it is directly said about the order of secret agents. Who did the dirty work (not like an executioner dung eater) and all sorts of spy stuff. Some of them became the Black Knives. But not all. Melina is an example.
But doesn't Melina explicitly say that her mother is inside the Erdtree = Marika?
@@Flymerick exactly!
Night of Black Knives seems inspired by "Night of the long knives"
perhaps Marika feared the strength Godfrey was gathering, plotted to kill him, but Ranni happened to be doing the same to herself at the time, resulting in Marika's plan failing as Godfrey only died in spirit not body.
just a loose connection i made today
My theory with Godwyn is that he was murdered at Stormveil and subsequently moved to the roots of the Ertree\Great Tree. This might explain why none of the demi-gods were interested in the castle other than Godrick. Still not entirely sure why there are two Godwyn corpses though but maybe he shed a skin or something. Also, the trailer pre-launch showed the Nights Cavalry riding through a forest and I've heard other channels show that scene and talk about the Black Knife assassins but if the Nights Cavalry worked for Morgott as indicated in item descriptions then showing them riding out might indicate them leaving the capital to ride to Stormveil. Maybe.
So two things. If you watch that trailer closely you can see the riders on those horses are black knife assassins. They're wearing hoods and cloaks not armor or helmets. The horses look similar but they definitely aren't knights cavalry. Also, we thought it was possible godwyn was slain in stormveil too, but the lore around the black knives specifically says that after the murder they fled from layendell, which means he must have been in the city when they killed him. I could also be wrong about this, but I believe the face above and below ground are all 1 body. If you stack the map you can see how they'd be connected.
@@square-table-gaming just watched the trailer and you are right indeed, close up shot is not Nights Cavalry. However, Stormveil is nowhere near Leyndell on the map and the body of Godwyn is directly below Leyndell not Stormveil.
Godwyns body is below The Three Fingers, flame of frenzy. His body is where the Fia quest ends.
So I don’t think it’s the same physical body but I’m going to have to log back into the game and do some more research on this.
This game has crazy depth.
@@square-table-gaming Further research reveals this from Tiche ashes description:
“……was killed protecting her mother during their flight from the royal capital”
So yes, totally sounds like Godwyn was killed in Leyndell by the Black Knife Assassins but I’m still not sure about the body under Stormveil being physically linked to Godwyn since he’s directly underneath the capital.
I think I need to keep a bloody journal. Just when I think I have it straight in my head I find out I’ve misremembered or completely overlooked something. 🤯
@@demonfandango I think that technically speaking his body is spreading out across the lands between. It just keeps expanding and that's why we can find deathblight in so many areas. The face also looks like the faces that we can find on deathblight infected crabs.
@@square-table-gaming So I agree that having Godwyns living corpse intertwined with the Great Tree has caused the death blight to appear in multiple places but that is Godwyns blood infecting the extended roots of the tree and still doesn’t really explain to me the corpse below Stormveil, which still bleeds when you hit it….so is it really dead?
Actually, that one thing might lend credence to your theory but if you look at the underground areas on the map there are none beneath Stormveil and site of grace for Godwyns body is beneath Leyndell.
So I can see where you are coming from in terms of them being connected but they are not topographically co-located, so why is Stormveil the only place this visage of Godwyn has manifested?
Not to even try to explain how the Godwyn in the trailer became the Godwyn in the game. 😵💫
speaking of Assassins, anyone know what the deal with the Ravenmount assassins is? I'm curious about these dudes.
I think it likely that the knives of the assassins became misshapen after they were imbued with death. The Blade of Calling (melina's weapon) appears to be a version of the black knife imbued with golden order magic. It's ash of war is identical to that of the black knife, allowing the player (and Melina) to mimic the signature leap and slash of the black knife assassins, firing either a death projectile or a golden projectile depending on which knife youre using. What I find most interesting is that Melina uses this weapon. I wonder if this is meant to imply that she is a former member of the black knife assassins, and left their order because she disagreed with the plot, thus her knife went unaltered.
Edit: I spoke too soon
Question: Why do the assasins doon't seem to have heads? Are they headless? Are their heads turned invisible by some magic? It doesnt seem to be a numen characteristic due to the fact that we can create a numen character for ourself that posseses a head...
I believe it's just a stylistic choice or perhaps due to prolonged exposure to their concieling magics.
It may be part of the ritual involving the rune of death. Mah. Melina is bodyless too. The hell if I know what that means.
If the melina theory is true they do posses heads theyre just concealed heavily
Am sure dlc will shed light on these assassins
When you battle Maliketh phase 2 when he pulls out his blade aka Rune of Death the blade handle is missing half of it aka the Black knives stole a part of rune of death.
ok do banished knights next pleas
I think that the assasins are loyal to Marika and that Ranni wasnt aware of the murdering Godwyn part ,she probably had plotted with Marika only to commit suicide and be free of the greater will and the fingers.On the night of the black knifes Godwyn was killed at the same time as Ranni by order of the queen and succesively all of her demigod children were murdered one by one by the assasins except for the ones that were unreachable, highly protected or were against the greater will's wishes to begin with.
I think Marika had a reason to murder all of her descendants.Marika was once able to separate herself into two halves, she lost that power once Radagon was created.If Radagon has the power to separate a being in two who is to say that he cannot do that to the demigods to create a full Empiryam. If that is the case and Marikas drive was to stop the greater will from finding a succesor then, it makes sense why she would want to get rid of her demigod descendants including Godwyn. The reason why I think that the other demigods arent killed is not cause they go against the greater will's wishes but cause in some way all the demigods are unsuited to become rulers .Malenia bears scarlet rot and she might be infertile or corrupted by the outer god of rot, Miquella is a child and cannot bear children and hasnt risen to godhood yet,Morgot and Mogh are Omens so they are corrupted as well,Rykard was eaten by the world serpent and mixed with the outer god so he is also corrupted,Radahn seems to bear the curse of the giants(red hair and growyn in size) and by the time we find him he also is corrupted by the Scarlet Rot. Godrick has his divine blood diluted, either by the grafting or also by being a descendant of other demigods and thus only having a smithering of Marikas linage.
Or.... Radagon pretending to be Marika to obtain Destined Death from Maliketh, but he cannot do it in person as Maliketh was bound to Marika and would find out as soon as he stepped into range that he wasn't Marika, hence engaging black knives to steal it from Maliketh but they only managed to steal a fragment. And then holding Godwyn hostage to force Marika to order Maliketh to hand over the entire Great Rune to which she refused because she knew the consequences. "You wouldn't dare!" "So be it!" Dead firstborn son. Marika becomes tilted and smashes Elden Ring, Radagon panics and tries to repair it, doesn't work. Elden Beast intervenes and holds both of them in stasis and by proxy, the shattered Ring as well.
Dunno if anyone mentioned it, but Tiche is pronounced more like "ty-key" than "teesh" . With her mother's name being Alecto, it's more likely that her name is both greek, and could perhaps draw from Tyche
While working on the video I found at least 5 different pronunciations for Tiche. This one seemed the most agreed upon within the community, but your reasoning makes a lot of sense.
Hey could you do a lore video on the Erdtree Burial Watchdogs?
Adding to the list!
I'd like to mention that Maliekaths blade was also kinda fucked.
Was watching while trying to do the malenia puzzle lol
I like em cause they’re funky and they look cool
Marika sent black knife assassin's after Ranni after Ranni betrayed her and killed her golden boy Godwyn's soul when the plan was to give him a true death--but Ranni would not have been freed of her Empyrean body. Marika's command to the Black Knife assassin's; kill Ranni and pose an obstacle to whoever wants to be next Elden Lord, to prove their worthiness (if you can't kill a BKA you ain't fit to be Lord)
So the highest concentration of black knife assassins are in the Gaol version of Ordina, the town you have to solve the puzzle for to go to the Haligtree. I think they serve him, not Marika
The assassins in ordina are likely looking for a way to Miquella so they can kill him. This is where you find a murdered black knife. To me this reads as the assassins and albinauric are not allies.
@@square-table-gaming That could be the case, but I read the black knives and albinuric archers as being allies! Elden Ring has many locations where enemy npcs fight each other, and this isn’t one of them
I'm still wondering, why did Ranni choose Goldwyn, of all the demigods? Also, sorry if it a obvious part of the plot but why did she needed to kill another demigod? i know she wanted to destroy her body to escape her empyrean fate (which make no sense considering her parentage and is quite ironic considering the Star ending), did she needed to kill another demigod to slew herself without really dying?
8:10 Did also Marika planned to be crucified by the Elden Beast? I have some doubts that's a futur she could desire unless she really want to die.
I think the assassins' bodies died, leaving them bodyless souls trapped in their armour as a result of the 'sinister rite' that imbued their daggers with the rune of death.
This is probably why they have no face and are immune to bleed and other statuses.
Damn, seems like the only people fit to rule at this point are Goldmask and Miquella. Severing ties with outer gods seems to be the only way to make things better.
Also, it seems that BKA are female Zamor, not Numen, as male Zamor in the mountains fight in a very simmilar, flowing fashion.
We point out that Melina's move set is exactly like the Black Knife Assassins, but we shouldn't be. Watch how Malenia the Severed dodges. While her moveset is distinctly different, many of her dodges are similar to the Black Knife Assassins.
Malenia is the daughter of queen Marika, a Numan (and Radagon who is Marika). Melina is speculated to be the daughter of Marika as well.
It could just be that's how Numan women move.
The weapon she uses is also seems to be the same blade as the assassins only before it's infusion with h the rune of desth
If melina really is the gloam eyed queen, being a part of the night of black knives falls within her original goals
What's that whipping dagger you have? It looks handy.
Melina is a Leader of Black Knives and The Gloam Eye Queen aka Godskin apostles leader.
Melina is most likely not the Gloam Eyed queen but she did inherit her power. Also, Alecto was the leader of the black knife assassin's
if you choose 3 finger ending, meline promise you true death, i suppose only assassins can actually do that
Melina herself can now do that, as she wields the power of the Gloam Eyed Queen
I don't think Marika and Ranni worked together. Ranni sees Marika not really very positiv as we learn in the game. Which should probably comes from the fact, that Marika is the reason Rannis Mother is in her depressive state and nothing more but a shadow of her former self.
I think Marika tried to use Ranni for her plot against the Erdtree and against the greater will and Ranni saw an opportunity to smash her own destiny and by doing so also stopping Marikas plans. Thats why the black knife assassins are trying to stop Ranni when her plans set in motion and become more clear. They are still working for Marika.
I also think they started as a group of mercenaries but I think Marika was the one who put Alecto into the evergale so she could be the knew leader of the black knife assassins.
Regarding Melina I am not sure what to think about her motives. She is very loyal to Marika that one is clear but she does not oppose you if you deside to ally you with Ranni or any other one. Except for the three fingers. And I don't know if this is because that is clearly evil or because that is against Marika.
I honestly thought the Black Knives killing Iji and attempted to kill Blaidd was Ranni's doing. As some sort of tying up loose ends after she went to the moon.
Definitely not. They are absolutely salty about their leader being locked up.
I thought the 2 fingered hired the assassins to kill ranni which is why they show up and kill ranni servants
I found it . 3:28 black blood . The one i was talking about 🙂
Gotcha! I think the black blood may be the color of numen blood, but don't hold me too that. I'd need research.
keep in mind that there is a secret path to Deeproot Depths next to Three Fingers entrance, which begs a question: "Why is Frenzied Flame and Godwins body so close to one another?"
I'd say it's likely they're so close together because godwyns body was buried at the foot of the erdtree and the frenzied flame was locked away below the city. I don't believe the 2 things are connected in any way, moreso the golden order locking their secrets below leyndell
The goons of ER.
What armor is he wearing? Also freaking amazing video
Blaidd's armor altered with the Noble hood, and thank you!
@@square-table-gaming right back at ya🧡
Wait, the "BLACK KNIFE ASSASSINS" had something to do with the "NIGHT OF BLACK KNIVES"?
idk man seems like a stretch to me. 🤔
😂
Theres alot of good speculation but answer me this if the assasins did work for the golden order should the ring be restored. Or did rannis ends justify the means
That's completely up to your personal belief.
They are the anbu black ops
I belive thar Marika was plotting something, and had her own contingent of the Black Knives planned on Killing Ranni to stop her from killing becoming the next God. Marika would kill her and then only Godwyn, her loyal son, would be under her control and would not ascend to godhood. This did not occur in time.
Because, at the same exact time, Ranni betrayed the two fingers who controlled their own part of the assassins. Using them in her own plan of killing Godwyn and herself with destined death with the assurances that she is now the only heir to godhood. At this point she was now able to hide within the Carian Manor from retaliation by anyone and still deceived her two fingers while plotting further subtle moves.
As soon as she received the fingerslayer blade, her moments became in the open, leading to Blaid and Ijis deaths from her two fingers. But she would go on to kill her two fingers.
With Marika imprisoned for shattering the Elden ring, summoning the Tarnished and all the other demi-gods dead, only Ranni and Marika could be the new gods.
The Tarnished could now only choose to free Marika or put ranni as the new God. Both were bad for the Golden Order. Hence Radagan and the Elden Beasts involvement in the final battle. Horax Louge was Marikas last chance to have more control. Instead the player becomes Elden lord.
So it is all a loop of betrayals.
Whaaat?!? The Black Knife assassins are associated with the night of Black Knives? Boyoo, Did not see that one coming
I know right!? Nuts.
somebody explain pls why do we able to kill demigods without the death rune? like there so much around the godwyn murder but we do the same all along our journey and nobody gives a shit. that's kinda strange so i think i've missed some important info
The death rune was needed to kill Godwyn and then the shattering threw all order out the window. Also, when we kill a Demigod their essence returns to the Erdtree so it shouldn't be considered a true "death" until we burn it.
@@square-table-gaming isn't the death rune is also a part of elden ring? if yeah then the shattering was definitely before the murder. and i don't think there should be a difference between death and "true death" speaking of gods and demigods because there was no actual reason to kill Godwyn this way. anyways i think the answer to this in starting cutscene where we maybe can actually see a border between death-runic murder and common one doing by tarnished. or maybe only tarnished can kill them and the black knives were made for numans only idk
The annoyng people that will stab you while invisible.
What sword and ash of war are you using.
Royal Greatsword with its unique ash of war
@@square-table-gaming thank you 🙏
You might want to specify that the assassins sent after Rani are NOT black knife assassins but are shadows of the Greater Will. You can see their corpses on the ground by Blaidd and they are clearly not the same.
Actually if you watch any high quality footage you can see they are clearly black knives and even have the black knife weapon in their hands that's only held by their order.
Nice
Marika's homies
We think so too
How is he going to say it happened during the golden age of the erd tree long before the shattering of the elden ring, then say soon after his death the elden ring was shattered???
How about the vulgar militia? What are they defending?
I just want to know why they have no head
It's the effect of their magical cloak. Hides their face/head
@@square-table-gaming I wish it would do the same to the Tarnished
"this will be a massive video in its own right"
11mins
Me: I watch lore videos 3 times as big regularly 😅😅😅
Cool, for us at the time, this was a big one. Not so much these days, but to a channel in it's infancy yeah, it felt big haha
@@square-table-gaming lol yeah. Tbh 10 minutes is pretty reasonable. I'm just teasing 😂
A guild master called Alecto but pronounced electo?! Alrighty then...
The black knife assassins seem to not have a face. There's literally nothing beneath the hood.
That's their magical cowl hiding their faces
@@square-table-gaming I think the assassins' bodies died, leaving them bodyless souls trapped in their armour as a result of the 'sinister rite' that imbued their daggers with the rune of death.
This is probably why they have no face and are immune to bleed and other statuses.
It would be cooler if instead of calling them "black knife assassins" just call them *The Black Knives.* Figures so infamous their profane weapons and the wielders themselves are mentioned as one and the same with absolute fear and loathe. The less words the cooler they sound!
Rogier:
“Assassination happened looong before the shattering of the Elden ring”
The next sentence
“Assassination was the catalyst. Soon the Elden ring was smashed. Thus sprang forth the Shattering.”
What the fuck? A complete contradiction
No? The assassination was the catalyst. What's being said here is that there was time between the assassination of Godwyn and when Marika shattered the Elden Ring.
I don't buy that Marika was behind the night of the black knives. Why would she hire assasins to kill her beloved son ? Unless she didn't know they would pick target Godwyn it doesn't make sense.
Ranni specifically says that the black knife assassins work for her, iirc.
Where does she say this? I've been through all of her dialogue multiple times and while she does say she forged the black knives that killed godwyn, she says nothing about the black knife assassins working for her directly.
@@square-table-gaming huh, i thought she did, maybe i got it mixed up or my mind just put dialogue in that wasn't ever there lol
@@kiba_the_lucky I think that happens a lot with elden ring. There's so much info and the theories get muttled with the dialogue easily.
WAIT
COULD MELINA BE THE LOST DAUGHTER OF THE BLACK ASSASSIN RING LEADER?
The ringleaders daughter is a tiche, we can summon her as spirit ash
For me i think the greater will plot the assasinsation of godwyn the golden...i think ranni stole the rune of death on malekith because the greater will cant take the rune....and after ranni get rune...she give it to the black knife assasins but not all the fragments have been given...she know that the assasins will gonna kill godwyn so at that moment she kill her self ..intervine godwys destine death or death by body and soul...
Think of this if ranni order the assasinsation why she did not mention it to her consort...she show no shame on the deed so why she hidden that information to you...and if ranni is the one that order the deed..why marika did not take revenge on ranni ...instead she smashed the elden ring ..right...for me the black knife assasins are assasins that served the greater will same for the baleful shadow ..the assasins of the 2 fingers.....when ranni kill her 2 fingers and the baleful shadows that hunt her...one of the black knife assasin can be found dead on rannis tower ...i think blaidd kill that assasin to protect ranni...and the other assasin can be found on the town where you can portal on miquel hailig tree...i think the greater will order to assasinate miquela cuz miquela is making his own ertree ..and i think the greater will cant get the rune of death on maliketh cuz maliketh is half brother of marika..meaning maliketh is loyal to marika...so when the greater will choice ranni to be marika's replacement...the greater will give blaidd to ranni so that if ranni betrayed the greater will,her shadow will kill her...
Using your own kin to kill your beloved son drove marika to the brink so she take revenge on the greater will...and will all know that in the game...the greater will is not so good...
Anyone got any ideas why all the Black Knives were female? I think there should be a reason.
Marika did not kill her son. She was betrayed by the BKA and the two fingers.
It's very possible she was responsible for it based on the lore we have available. Not saying it's an absolute truth, but the possibility is not unfounded.
@@square-table-gaming Marika is everywhere but as we move through the game we know the least about her. I think there is evidence that much if the story can be explained by viewing Marika as a mother, literally torn in two by her humanity and the elden beast.
@@EJ_7715 view her as a tyrant too, Gideon knew something we don't and he was terrified