Next Time Someone Tells You That, Show Them This-Two Turntables Compared
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- Опубликовано: 8 окт 2023
- Turntable videos inevitably attract trolls who don't think turntables can make much of a difference once they're spinning at the correct speed (never mind that the ear is super-sensitive to micro speed variations). "In a double blind you can't hear differences" type comments are all over the Internet and on this channel, so on this video you will hear two turntables-the OMA K3 and the TechDAS Air Force III Premium both fitted with the SAT CF1-12 tonearm and Lyra Atlas Lambda SL cartridge plugged into the CH Precision P10 phono preamplifier.
The only difference is the turntable.
The music is a 1977 East Wind album sold only in Japan- "The Great Jazz Trio at The Village Vanguard" (EW ST-5307 featuring Hank Jones, Ron Carter and Tony Williams-definitely a great trio-recorded live at The Village Vanguard by the late, great David Baker.
Listen to both versions and first do you hear a difference? If so, which do you prefer? Pay particular attention to the piano sound and the kick drum that Tony Williams precisely hits.
Do you need a double blind test to distinguish between the two? Also note: both set-ups were carefully accomplished: in other words there's more involved than simply moving the arm from one turntable to the other, because of arm mount height. The set ups were identical as were the tracking forces applied so the only difference was the turntable.
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The first one! The stereo separation was superior, and the kick bass was haunting! The whole soundstage was deeper. Please do more of these comparisons!
I'm surprised how many people prefer the 2nd one, citing it's more alive and warmer. To me it sounds warmer yes, but almost muddy and distorted. The first one had incredible separation, articulation, and dynamic range. I'd rather get my warmth from my amp or speakers. Second was perfectly balanced. Great demonstration.
Of course. The first one gets you in the room with the musicians performing although sometimes that can be a kick in the gut for the unaccustomed. It is no contest really.
Agree. Had no idea a high end turntable could make such a difference. Wow.
Both sound excellent - but preferred second one, sounds a little warmer
Same feeling. But he didn't tell us if that was same amp and speakers. That says, he didn't mention the recording way that he used, or do I missed it ?
@@mygarart2764 we were not hearing an amp or speakers. It was most likely a recording from the output of the phono preamp or maybe the tape record out of the preamplifier. Maybe Micheal can clarify.
@@mygarart2764 I believe he was vividly clear that the only difference was the two turntables.
I am absolutely astonished by this demonstration, not because I didn't think the turntable would make a difference but by how enormous that difference was, especially on two such highly developed 'tables. The difference was shocking. I found the OMA table more impressive, in the sense that it was obvious in its approach, like a Tesla Plaid. The TechDas was more like a Rolls Royce, elegant and flowing. It's a good thing I won't ever have enough money to make that choice! Brilliant work, Michael.
Your analysis is spot on IMO!
@@trackingangle929 Mike this is very interesting BUT at the same time it is kind of concerning for me.
At this price point, both companies should had spent all they have to ensure the turntable will delivery real true HI FI, which translate, if am not mistaking, both units should reproduce the music as close as the original file was initially recorded without any modification or coloration of the sound.
I mean, that is what I think. If I spend this kind of Rolls Royce money in a turntable, I want to hear what ever happened at The Village Vanguard as close as it was recorded.
Most of the comments I read were related to the surprising difference from one turntable to the other. How could this be? where did the true fidelity go? These two devices should be delivering what any audiophile is searching for. True clean, crystal, unmodified, uncolored sound. But they sound different which is the opposite of true fidelity Something is wrong
Second one sounds way warmer and more alive, punchy. I'd want to have that one.
I thought the exact opposite. The first one sounds much more alive than the second one. The second one sounds pretty "dead" to me compared to the first one.
My thoughts exactly
Glad to hear I get to keep the second one for myself.
I have the second one, with an under $50K tonearm. It is far from suffering I'll tell you for sure.
Agreed!
These both sounded very good. I think the first one sounds a little better, maybe because I heard it first. I don't think I've ever heard drums sound so good on the internet.
Normally when I get hi-fi comparisons on RUclips I listen on my smartphone and usually I can’t tell difference between them , but this demonstration is incredible well done 👍 👌
THE 1st TT KNOCKS IT OUT OF THE PARK - IMHO.....
i agree.
I agree too
First is Superior 😮😮
Yeah, and the differences weren't as subtle as I expected.
Wow, that's a huge difference! From an audiophile standpoint, 1st one is much better, very even top to bottom - it actually sounds like r2r tape. The second one is less dynamic and more mellow, the mid band is more pronounced (more like a live concert listening?), and has a better timbre on the piano. Honestly, I could live with the TechDas given how ridiculous the price on OMA is. Great video Michael!
You are a sophisticated listener
I completely agree with your listening notes, could hear it clearly even over Pixel phone built-in speakers!
East wind did a bunch of great recordings I love the Clifford Jordan one with Hank Jones, and the LA 4 l'apres midi de une faune, that one is pretty spectacular too.
I play them on a rebuilt TD 125 with a Sorane tonearm, and a Hana cartridge, which is definitely in the turntable #2 lane of sound here, but of course not with that level of clarity.
Actually you can really hear it in the ride symbol the wash of the ride cymbal clear as day, the difference between the two. And I find that jazz drummer is like that darker sound and that is more what I hear on the second turntable, if I look up what symbol Tony Williams was playing in that era that's a good way to check which one is actually more accurate to that sound.
Yep, I agree. There is a specific spot in the track (7 min mark for the first turntable, 13 min mark for the second), the kick drum sounded better on the first turntable. I can't explain why, but my mind processed the audio and leaned towards the first turntable.
Heard the same difference!
The first turntable sounds far richer with more depth and punch. That’s what I hear. This was a great simulation. Thank you.
I prefer the third turntable.
Yeah, same here. The platter is machined from unobtainium.
And the moon rock needle
This is the best comment.
yeah the one that was playing when I lost my virginity
Not an audiophile, can’t hear anything between the two that would convince me to get one over the other.
You’re right, those RUclips video shootouts are useful as a bike for a fish.
@@CapitanHarlockisbackHe is wrong. You are useless.
For real? Plain as day. Why did you even watch the video? Advice: buy some iPods and stick with those.
@@michaels639 hey, at least I admitted that I wasn’t an audiophile.
I heard the difference that the first was better hearing it with my Samsung 46 inch led tv with it's own speakers 😁
Dear Mr. Fremer, for me this was not a comparison to define the best, both are wonderful, just different, and will please different ears. In fact, the best thing about the video is the opportunity to experience this, I could easily watch the same thing many times with music of this level. Thank you very much for making this possible for us.
Greetings from Brazil.
To answer the main question; yep, they sure sound different. As far as which one sounds better, I like the first one which has more detail. Second one sounds less detailed, but I agree with those who said it’s warmer and more real sounding. Thanks for taking the time for this interesting comparison. 👍
Prefer the first one. Well balanced. Drums are integrated. Bass could be stronger. Second on drums too forward. Piano in background but bass is better. Prefer first one for listening.😮
Great recording and magnificent choices.
Thank You Sir!
I prefer #1 at least as much as I can discern via RUclips. Great video!
Excellent video Michael. Please do more videos like this one. Highly informative and enjoyable. Many thanks for sharing
I can't afford either turntable so I got the album instead :-). A nice way to asses my own system. It's great music, and thank you for the comparison, mr Fremer.
The kick drum sound is phenomenal in both of them! I found both excellent in terms of speed/dynamics, transients and instruments separation and projection. Probably the Techdas a little bit more analytic... Thanks Mr. Fremer for this fantastic set-up in double dose!
Yep, I much preferred #1 - especially that I could zero in on any instrument if I wanted or sit back and listen to the whole. The bass on the second was muddled a bit. Both very good, but the first really appealed to my preferences. A great example of how seemingly low impact things can make a big difference.
2:00 OMA K3 (Start track) Drum solo start 4:56
8:05 TechDas Air Force III Premium (Start track) Drum solo start 11:00
Question Michael, I see you've been using the SAT CF1-12 tonearm more than the 3D printed tonearm lately, any reason why?
I prefer the SAT. I probably should post a comparison!
Thanks for the time stamps, Pepper 👍
@@NickP333 Sure, no problem Nick. They help me go back & forth quickly.
Wow I was listening to this through my DELL PC speakers while making breakfast 20ft away and I could hear a difference; the first demonstration had more impact the drum solo was very live sounding, a great demo, more please
TT No.2 is perfect for me. Excellent piano and very clear distinct drums. Maybe a bit analytic and perhaps sometimes a bit nervous for some poeple but that I don't mind - I love it. Many many information transmitted through this turntable. Great.
Agreed!
I believe the 2nd one is my preference. The clarity is much better than the first one is.
............so is the tempo......and the tone....
It’s no contest here, the first table had a more engaging performance, the bass was deeper, the piano notes were more precise. The kick drum just stood out more. The music just had more drive. With the second table, it was as if half of that tone of the music was hidden in the mix. You made your point loud and clear, here Michael.
My wife thought that I was nuts because I went through three turntables in two years because the speed was off and I kept hearing it, it drove me nuts, until I got my current turntable. You proved what I believed that all turntables are different and I will be showing her this, thank you.
Interesting how people hear the same differences but have differing preferences.
The kick drum on the first one is amazing: natural, while at the same time hitting you in the guts. And the music in general is more alive and more organic
Both sound excellent! It all comes back to what flavor you like ! Never heard the OMA but I’ve heard the Techdas many times ! It’s truly an outstanding table ! I’ve done head to head listening with this table and the legendary Nachamichi TX 1000 and it’s tough to choose.
I found it easier to follow Tony's solo on the OMA as the timing of the cymbal and drum hits seemed more precise. Differences in note volume and duration were clearer so his different statements of the theme were easier to follow. That hooked me immediately and held me rapt til the end.
Both tables are freaking awesome!!!
Thank you for doing this comparison. The turntables do sound quite different. I happen to think the AF3P sounds more natural and I prefer it. There is more tonal color, more weight and body, better tone. The K3 sounds grey and flat to me, with very thin white cymbals. The K3 is more hifi sounding, the AF3P more natural and more like real music. Is the mic placed at the listening seat so that only the video portion is recorded by phone? I think these videos are going to become more and more popular with reviewers and dealers who want to increase exposure.
Can you tell us why they sound different, and which ones you would lean towards for different sorts of music and/or pressings? Thanks, fascinating demonstration.
magic
A good start would be oma site where they explain what goes into their tt
My guess the big difference is in the Direct drive Vs Belt
Good stuff Mike..I think I liked the OMA...a bit more attack maybe? Great track and recording, too.
Definitely more snap on the high end. I mention above the cymbals sound like cymbals from a drummer point of view; on the AF3P the cymbals are definitely rolled off up top, sounding a bit dull; if I heard the cymbals sound the way they do on the AF3P as a FoH engineer, I'd move the mic to pick them up better.
I prefer Turntable 1.
Great video! Really impressed by the first one. It is the directness, the more real feeling of the recording venue, the punch! Second presentation sounds like kind of phase issues (not that you wired it wrong, it is in the signal). What is your opinion on the root causes for these differences, is it the drive concept? If so, I wonder if I made the wrong choice when I bought the 3-motor Feickert Firebird instead of the big Technics. Certainly there is more than just the belt.
at least one can argue the Feickert is almost 1/2 the price of the Technics ;)
Looking forward to a comparison of the Continuum Audio Labs Caliburn :)
wow, they both sound very good. 1st one sounds like its 2 generations closer to the tape.
Great video, Michael. The k3 is definitely more natural sounding. I found the techdas a little beat fatiguing, specially on the cymbals. I have no doubt that turntables sounds different. Changing my VPI to Acoustic Signature was a huge difference in my system. However, others could argue that this difference perceived on your video could be caused by the arm setup.
No doubt they sound different, but which is better depends on your tastes I would think. Your point on the setup is an interesting one. Not sure how you eliminate that concern, perhaps by having multiple people do the set ups (or the same person do them multiple times) and then do multiple blind play backs.
Very close, I would go with the 2nd table. More airiness between instruments, warmer sounding. Ron Carter's bass detail and the overall sound stage is slightly better on the 2nd turnable. Still, despite owning some decent tables myself, they are in this category of esoterica far beyond what I could afford or would spend if I had the money. I can achieve really good sound setting up older way more affordable used tables that do the job nicely.
First one sounds like excellent transistor with mosfets or germanium and the second sounds like modern tube . Thanks Michael.
Vacuum hold is the winner for me. Very realistic even on YT. Thank You! Great video!
1rst one has proper depth, timing and placement. Really easy on the ears, draws you in.
The second is also very good but flat in direct comparison. Less easy to follow the music everything comes at you at the same time and when the music becomes busy it looses focus. The drums are not the same on both turntables. The OMA is really something 😮
This is great! I most likely will never be able to afford anything in this price range, but I always assumed there would be less variance between the highest end tables. The disparity demonstrated here is pretty vast! I'm recalibrating my preconceived notions.
Well, the disparity in price is vast too; I think the OMA is like 400k, while the TechDAS is "just" 40k.
you can get a good DD at much cheaper prices. a TOTL vintage Japanese DD table with plinth would be 2-3k. if you can find someone knowledgeable, $1500 would net you a good DD that would beat most belt-drives (assuming you liked the DD presentation) .
Brilliant feature Michael. Thanks
Hi Michael.
Thanks for this wonderful comparison. The difference between this 2 turntables is astonishingly. Even by listening to the video on the iPhone it is obvious that the OMA is for example able to present the stupidly fast impulses of the drum kit more articulated than the TechDAS.
I’m just wondering how much the record clamp on the OMA influences the result. To my experience it should, but I don’t have a clue about the significance.
Keep up your outstanding work 👍🏻
Second one brings me into the music - more warm and dynamic to my ears.....did Mike switch recordings?
Same everything but TT!
Impressive and humbling for a youtube video.
Thank you, Michael.
I perceived the first one to sound more congested and brittle, but can appreciate how others might prefer what could be described as a more precise or analytical rendering.
The first one imparted a greater initial sense of excitement (PRAT), but eventually failed to keep me engaged per what I heard as reduced dimensionality (possibly due to digital/youtube limitations).
The second one was more "romantic" without sounding dull or thick, and was overall more inviting and let me hear more deeply into the music without feeling guarded, or developing uncalled-for tension in my body.
To the contrary, the engagement that I felt in my body while listening to the second one had me moving, even if limited by the headphone cable.
The timbre on the second one sounded notably more like the actual instruments than the first, and along with the better timbre was a natural attack, sustain, decay (dynamic envelope) that provided an overall greater sense of effortlessness and swing.
Also, more groove modulation (sometimes mistaken for wow) could be heard before the music began on the second.
I don't think I would would be fooled to think either was tape--in spite of the humorous irony that I'm attempting to evaluate analog playback through a digital medium.
Relative to tape the first one sounded rushed (versus "drive"), and the second one didn't have quite as much drive as I would "imagine" the tape would have.
Only Michael could say to what degree the digital transfer and playback through youtube compromised the comparison, or possibly highlighted certain characteristics of either table over the other.
Needless to say, my duty is now to find a good pressing and hear it in full analog glory in my home, free of "visceral robbing" headphones.
Wow the first one is on a different level! Sounds less fatiguing!
Mike: awesome demo. For me, the first TT sounds better. More life in the music and the drum solo did it. It sounded so natural and full of life. The second TT sounded thin and lifeless. It would put me to sleep. To sum it up, I definitely heard the difference using my headphones. I wonder how the VPI HW40 turntable would sound in this demo.
I really enjoyed the comparison but my take away was the record - found a pristine copy in Japan and it was delivered today- now one of my new faves thanks!
1st is definitely better to my ears & my preferences 👍 also, love the new video ideas. Keep it up
I could hear a difference. The piano stood out louder and more clearly in the mix and the decay of the notes was more apparent on the 1st table. The drums also had more detail and crispness to them . The overall presentation sounded faster in my opinion. I wonder if the clamp was emphasizing certain frequencies and giving it that extra slam? The second table sounded slower and more smeared. It had a warmer more analogue sound. Thank you for the video and comparison. I can only imagine how great both sound listening in a chair at ear level in the triangle.
I never thought that choice of turntable would factor into overall system synergy very much at all but the differences are pretty dramatic. There's no doubt the OMA is more 'hi-fi' & clinical sounding, while the TechDAS sounds more 'musical' to my ears (a plus or a minus based on preference). Really great concept, probably a ton of work but would definitely appreciate more like this.
Will be doing more for sure
Personally, I prefer #1. It sounds more balanced overall with nicer detail. Tighter lows, nice airy highs, instruments have more realism. The 2nd seemed a bit too laid back for my taste. Thanks, Michael.
Great video. The OMA K3 sounds noticeably better in terms of clarity and liquidity. I didn't need the video to prove the proposition. The best part of the video was hearing your OMA K3. It's an amazing turntable. I would love to hear it in a side by side comparison with a Basis Audio Transcendence, Super Arm 12.5 and Lyra Atlas SL.
I have an idler (Thorens 124), a Gyrodec, a Thorens Td160S, a Technics SL 1000R and a Denon DP80. I rank my Thorens 160S as my most enjoyable table. Just about all these tables have at least 1 SME arm so it’s not the arm, cartridge or the pre. Each one has its own characteristic.
I have the 160S as well, with a Rega RB3000 arm & Lyra Etna Lambda.
@@stephenchen1420 the 160s when tuned for its suspension correctly is truly one of my all time favorites.
Great comparison, thanks so much! Shocked how smoothed over the belt drive sounds in comparison. But those brass screw heads in the direct drive's platter would make me dizzy, if I owned a K3 (I wish!), I'd need to place it out of sight.
I couldn't finish the first track and was getting dizzy!
I actually scrolled down so the turntables were hidden while I listened, especially that hypnotic first one.
#2 is much better, more dynamic and resolution...Nice job Mike
Pretty clear that the TechDAS delivers more punch and more well-rounded bottom end. Would be interesting to hear the "in room" differences with speakers.
It’s remarkably well preserved through speakers
The belt drive turntable sounded "fat". I could see audience "fat hands" clapping at the end. Jonathan's turntable sounded precise without bloat. Thank you for setting everything up!
Your point is well taken. Even at this high a level, there are differences. As to one over the other is like what coffee we prefer.
As I suspected before listening, a primary difference is in the bass. Specifically, the bass instrument itself had better definition to my ears on the second turntable. Way back in the day, I was a nightclub, radio, and party DJ. One time, I had to use a spare Technics Sl-1800 MKII in place of a broken 1200 MKII, and the difference in sound caused me to have to individually EQ one of the phono inputs while remixing a song (taking two copies of the same song and blending them to make the song longer, etc.). Both copies were the same pressing, and when I first brought the second copy into the mix, I could hear the bass quality changing, so I brought it out of the mix, eq'ed it in cue, and then proceeded.
Both sound Quite Beautiful on my Lowfi cell phone....
I Believe you about Different sounding equipment.
I've experienced it on average priced Equipment as well.
😊
Michael, how was this recorded - with a microphone from your speakers or digitised from the phono stage?
Lynx HiLo A/D converter into computer.
With the second, the drums were louder, overwhelming the clarity of the piano that I heard on the first. Second sounded muddier. On both, I'm not hearing much bass. Funny, I had that album when it first came out. Very interesting test Mr. Fremer; hope you'll conduct more.
Number 2 sounds more open and I can hear the bass better. A lot of resonances.
Good point. Lots of decay. But no initial attack like the first.
Thanks for the video. I prefer the sound of the Oma. It’s way more dynamic and “crisp”. The TechDas sounded flat all the way through. The drum solo part is super crisp and alive with the Oma whereas for me the TechDas the drum solo doesn’t sound special.
A few questions:
1. Why was not weight used with the TechDas? Is this a general limitation of belt drive turntables, e.g. that additional weight shouldn’t be placed on the record?
2. I’d be interested in seeing a spectrogram of both outputs, aligned preferably for easier analysis. Would you be able to capture and share those?
Thanks again!
Which one do you prefer Mr. Fremer?
TT 1 is livelier, more exciting- A drive down the A24 in Italy in a Ferrari. TT2 is mellow, soft on the edges- a cruise down the avenue in a 66 caddy.
Enjoyed the video. But there is a HUGE difference in price between the AF3 and the OMA K3! imo: not a fair fight for the AF3 and easy pickings for the OMA K3.
The OMA is so much more open - instantly I hear it.. effervescent and snappin'. TechDas is organic though. Both are superlative! WoW...
First one, unbelieveble. Thanks, Michael! ❤
When I listened to the tracks yesterday evening via my TV I thought that the OMA hat much more bass, but today I listened again with my computer via headphones and I could hardly hear any difference - maybe the OMA had a little more impact on the kickdrum, but that´s about it. The TechDAS seemed a tiny bit smoother to me which I personally prefer.
Also the TechDAS looks much better and we have to honor the late Nishikawa san.
My preference is the second unit, not only do I think it would be less fatiguing but much more pleasant to look at. The first table was making me dizzy. 😵💫
I agree. The first one sounded uninteresting compared. Probably would be bored after a while with it. The drums are much better on the belt drive deck and much more involving although the music isn't my taste.
In the seventies I owned a Thorens TD 124. It had a Grado tone arm, and I had a low end Micro Acoustics 2000 E cartridge installed. It had magnificent sound. To make a few audiophiles cringe, I used the phono input on an inexpensive Sherwood Receiver. Appreciate the comparison of the two turntables. To me they both sound very good each one with their strong points.
Thanks for this video. The OMA turntable is direct-drive and the Tech Das turntable is belt-drive. My first(I will be coming back to this video.) impression is that I like the Tech Das(i.e. the second one played) better.
The first one sounds like music. The second sounds like a fantastic recording of music.
PRAT in spades on the OMA, lots of sweet smooth love on the TechDas. But I'm a jaded AF5 owner... :-)
Thank you, Michael.
I noticed that TT1, the OMA, was used with a DS Audio ION-001 Anti-Static Vinyl Ionizer, and the second was not. Did that contribute to the differences between the two turntables?
The cymbals are much more real on the OMA, where they sound slightly rolled off on the top end on the AF3P - there's definitely something missing.
On the other hand, the piano sounds perhaps a bit richer on the AF3P.
Direct vs. Belt differences? Vacuum hold-down effect? Couldn't say.
But the difference is obvious from note one.
The Direct Drive is exciting to hear and the turntable that feels more rhythmically accurate but also sounds more dynamic too! WOW I'm sold on Direct Drive motor!
I prefer the 2rd one as it seems to have more mid-range. I would be happy with either one!
Yes seems more articulate and lively there. (Glad I dont spend too much time and money chasing down "perfection" )
I’m surprised how much more I enjoyed the music on the the Air Force. Tonality was lovely on both, but Hank Jones sounded less in control on the OMA and I could hear Ron Carter better on the second table. The bass drum had a fuller sound too, a touch more depth
Second one for sure offers a nicer spatial presence of instruments I would say possibly closer to the live rendition. Thx for the comparison.
Hope you could add a top Idler wheel turntable to this comparison. Great job!
I can hear the difference on my computer speakers🙂....but as I have an every day player and a super high grade player I already know that. I once put the same cartridge on both and it was clear to me. Thank you for doing that.
I was tapping my foot before I knew it on the second, however they are both dream machines, Fremer you are one lucky guy
I far more preferred the second table. Cymbals were much tighter and crisp, toms during the drum solo had more significant tonal differences one to another, and the piano was more realistic. This to my ears. As noted in other comments, different doesn't necessarily mean better. Wow! I'd like to try testing those two set-ups with some rock, folk (acoustic), and orchestral to give a full trial. No worries, I can afford neither.
The first had a more pronounced bass drum during the solo, while the second has a clearer tom-tom sound and the cymbals had less shimmer. Both sounded goo, but I liked the second one better.
Hi! It is 2:30 am in Massachusetts. Yup when you are a nut you are a nut. So anywho… they don’t sound the same. The first one is more balanced, the second one is equally agile but the drums are more forward. Don’t know yet which one I like best. They are both wonderful. Although I honestly take a slightly more sympathetic view of the second one. But that is entirely subjective. This was fun!
I think the second TT sounded better because I like the smooth polished steel platter more than the TT with the brass bits, good sir.
Carry on.
Those are brass plugs. Each caps a channel filled with a liquid damping material.
@@trackingangle929 Ahhhh I see. Did I pick the right TT, squire?
While I agree that the first table creates a more transparent, etched sound, I do think there is a larger point at stake here. Is anyone going to tell me that they wouldn't enjoy music through the second table - be moved by it, and indeed even astonished by how life-like the sounds it produces can be through a well-set up system? At what point, if any, do differences cease to mater - not in A/B comparisons but in terms of sustained listening pleasure? If the answer is - "they always matter" - then I start to wonder. Perhaps the pleasure comes rather from the capacity to afford each "upgrade." As long as you can hear just that bit more shimmer on cymbals, the financial sacrifice is justified, no matter if three months later, you are listening with no greater engagement or joy than before you made the change. If that is true, it would not, I think, the most noble definition of our hobby.
In isolation the Tech Das is great but once you hear the OMA it's all over. The OMA is so much more in every way, just no contest...and for those of you that mention warmth, change the Atlas for an Epoch 3, now you got it all.
I like the second one.
WOW, I am stunned 🤐... what a difference, even through youtube and computer 😯
I can only imagine the difference in your rig😍
This makes me wish for a turntable ..... there is no way I can afford it 😓
I believe the K3 there is a prototype, is that mechanically identical to the production model?
I like both tables. I find it very difficult to “prefer” one or the other when they re both excellent but different flavors. BTW, were they on the same platform? One used a record weight or clamp while two was bareback. Platforms and weights make major differences.
The one without the clamp has vacuum hold-down making weight superfluous. Both were on outstanding platforms….
Although the AF3 has a vacuum hold down TechDAS recommends their disc stabilizer nonetheless. In a German Analogue Forum they have made an interesting sound comparison between the 2 different disc stabilizers that Tech DAS offers and the super-expensive tungsten one seemed a little bit better @@trackingangle929
do the styli have the same hours of use?
same arm-wiring and cartridge. Same, not 2 identical.
Some of the difference I am hearing seem to possibly static/ discharge? e.g. 2:36 in there is some compression distortion right before a batch of what sound like static clicks. The same passage at around 8:41 lacks the compression distortion and following static clicks.
After repeated listening to both renditions, I definitely prefer the OMA. Great music!!! think why some people prefer one over the other may have something to do with the differences of the head phone. I am listening thru the GRADO SR325 Prestige series...
Just to get some clarity, are the tonearm and cartridge physically the same items in the two turntables OR are there TWO tonearms of same model and TWO cartridges of the same model? I just want to make sure there's no manufacturing discrepancies if they are two different items of same models. Yes, I do hear the sonic differences between the two videos. Thanks for the upload!
I had it hooked up to my main amp and I actually got warmth and sound stage from #2. I wonder what I would get if I listened to it on my phone?
I listened on my phone and still have flat bass on #1 and brighter drums. With #2 I can really hear the bass with clarity, warmth and the drums and piano seem a little warmer. I think everyone has different tone reception though. I know some people who can’t hear the buzz of a CRT TV and others who have to leave the room from the same noise.
Just a question, was the wiring in the tone arm from the same manufacturer? Same type? Witnessed here at the UK Audio Show huge difference in sound between brands of internal wiring with same turntable, cartridge, tone arm, etc etc down the line. Both audio and in spectral response. Of course both arms on both same turntables were aligned.
The arm is wired straight through from cartridge clips to RCA plugs so wire not a variable
@trackingangle929 Both arms use the same model and make of wire?
You should do some testing on various makes of wires used in tone srms. Huge differences heard at the UK show with same cartridge, same turntable, same arm, same RCA to RCA interconnects to same pre amp and amp etc..
OMA K3 for the win, no question in my mind. One sounds like the locomotive, the other like the caboose.