Bambu Lab X1 Carbon - The AMS Review
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The Bambu Lab Automatic Material System - AMS - has changed the game when it comes to material and filament management, but what are the downsides and should it stop you getting one?
We’ve put our AMS through its paces the last six months and it has coped easily for the most part… but there are a couple of things that still get to me with the multi-color and multi-material printing!
The question is… if the multi-color/material printing isn’t quite there… is the AMS worth it Hopefully we’ve given you enough information so you can make your own mind up… but for us.. its a no brainer, the AMS is worth every penny!
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I think multicolor printing is not everything when it comes to the AMS. Just the simple swapping between filaments in technical printing is awesome. I no longer have to go through a more or less tedious process of changing the filament every time, but instead I select the right filament in the slicer and that's it. The AMS does the rest. This value alone is unique and offers an advantage that no one else has.
I agree with you, that will be the only reason why I could purchase an ams. Others seems ok with the waste, I am not, but I don't print a lot of presentation piece.
This exactly. And even though I don't like the fillament waste, it allows me to print in multi-color when I want to, and depending on your slicing settings you can actually get away with way less wasted filament.
theres gcode you can add to your slicer files to reduce the waste. Just adding a little retraction of the filament before it cuts. @@gzaos
@@gzaosI agree about the waste but for the most part the Bambu printers are just reliable. How many failed prints have you had from other printers 3 days into a print. That is a real waste and if your actually designing your own stuff in CAD it obviously goes through a few iterations, most of which are thrown away I watched a video the other day where someone printed a speaker housing with a 3D printer, no infill and took a week to print and he had 3 fail mostly towards the end so a month total of print time.
Multi tool heads are obviously the best solution but they aren't feasible from a price perspective right now. As long as you limit the color changes to mostly horizontal and not vertical your okay. For those prints you're almost better off printing a bunch of small parts in different colors and glueing the together or finding some method of assembly. It won't be as clean looking though
One thing I like that they are doing is selling filements rolls. The spoils come apart and the RFID chips are attached to the filement and the spool and they are super easy to swap out. Saves about 5 dollars and you can reuse spools.I wish more filement manufactures would do this.
Lastly, it's not like the plastic waste from 3D printers is a drop in the bucket compared to actual plastic products thrown away. Every plastic product has a recycling rating from 1 to 5 +possibly higher). They tell you to recycle them all but only 1 and 2 can be recycled, nor can they be indefinitely recycled.. It's not like we didn't have landfills full of plastic before 3D printing but that's a much bigger issue.
The Prusa MMU has been able to do that for at least 5 years
Honestly just being a storage device on top of never needing to swap out rolls mid print is enough of a buy. While color printing is cool. Its not for me. I got the printer to go fast not slow lol.
Yeah this is pretty much my thought exactly! The convenience alone is worth it… multi colour is nice to show off a design though 😝
I like being able to do a color print should I so desire. I get it, it’s wasteful, but on the rare occasion I want to print in color it’s nice to have. I mostly use it for different materials and being able to quickly choose what I want to print with.
@@matthewtaylor3301 yep completely agree! I reckon we have done about 10 big full multicolour prints in the time we’ve had it, but it’s nice to be able to do it for sure 😁
I agree, I have 3 black PLA+ in the AMS and a random color (sparkly stuff or whatever) in the last slot. I like the automatic filament continueing when one roll is empty.
Just storing my filament in a dry box while connected to the printer is a nice feature. Also not needing to worry about running out of filament is worth it like you say. It’s a shame the system has to purge so much material for multicolor prints.
The AMS is amazing. I have 4 units for both of my X1C printers. I do many multi-color prints. This printer with the AMS units is phenomenal. I wouldn’t have been able to do my current project without it.
Love that you’ve got four!!! Do you use the hub? How are you finding it?
I'm curious what type of prints you are doing. Is it mostly prints with a color change on certain layers? Because it just seems so impractical to be changing colors on every single layer. So much waste and so slow.
@@ddd42809 I’ve been printing 1 to 2 inch people and animals in multiple colors. I print mainly PLA silk. The printer is quite fast when printing in a single color. The multicolor prints do take much longer but it is so worth it. There is no way I would hand paint all of the little figurines I’ve been making. I love this machine and the AMS units.
How much filament waste do You have on average? Grams of the print vs. grams of waste.
I know that depends on how are color layer vhanges per color. It would interesting to know, and, if posdible, a link to where to see one if your printings.
At what cost though? You're creating lots of waste doing it.
I like the phrase... "The future of multicolor printing still isn't here". Instant-subscriber for having a balanced opinion and telling the truth instead of jumping in the BL glorifyers wagon.
Thanks, appreciate that! We will always give our honest opinion, even if people don’t agree! That’s the beauty of RUclips right! 😃
Interesting video. Personally I’m mostly interested in multicolour just one one or two layers, to add labels or designs to prints. I’ve done that manually on the Prusa before, but having that automated sounds like a real boon.
You definitely wouldn’t regret it, for things like badges, labels or even full layer colour changes it’s fantastic!!
One benefit of the AMS is also being able to do a different material for a support interface. For example running a PETG print and making an interface layer of PLA or vice versa. It should come off a lot easier.
And since you're only printing the interface, if it's not slanted too much it won't waste too much material. It can also enable some almost impossible prints where supports would get stuck to the model but doing it with a different material makes it practical.
I was a diehard Prusa MK3S+ owner until I purchased my Bambu Carbon X1 a couple of months ago (I've already put 700+ hours on it). Even though I regularly printed multi-colored layer prints with manual filament changes on the Prusa, I needed to expand my capabilities. After purchasing the Prusa MMU, I realized I didn't have room to set it up and needed a different solution. I could not be happier with the Bambu's performance in both speed and multi-material printing (I own two AMS units and about to purchase a third). I print multiple multi-color prints on a weekly basis and could not do it without the AMS units which works with nearly every filament I've thrown at it (over 30 spools of different brands/types). Most of my multi-color prints are three or four colors but I've done several with six and even eight colors, and the AMS has proven to be an excellent solution for me.
As far as the waste goes, save print time and filament by disabling the prime tower as it is not needed with the filament change extraction set correctly (I've done dozens of prints w/o it). Also, who cares about the waste which amounts to a few cents a print when the time savings is substantial (i.e. print multi-color models overnight or unattended)? As far as the poop bucket goes, I'm in the habit of emptying it on a regular basis and/or before doing a large and/or unattended multi-color print . . . it literally takes 5 seconds to pour it into the trash can I happen to have next to the cabinet my printer sits on.
So.... does the color improve sells? If so how long does a print take and what's your profits on that print? Just curious
Great info! I just ordered a Bambu P1P and was on the fence about the AMS. Now, I'm still on that fence. Not really, I am glad to hear the pros and cons. I think the switching of same colors is probably the key for me. I am old school and my brain (or my wallet) cannot handle seeing the waste! Maybe it will go on sale soon.
I have X-1C with AMS at work. I use it mostly for fast prototyping and making tools/fixtures for the factory. I don't use AMS for multicolor printing, rather for keeping spools with different materials handy and always ready to go (usually 2x PLA, ABS and PETG). With normal day-to-day use there's no problem with pile-up of waste. I think for such use X-1C+AMS are more than you need (in a positive way), but the multicolor printing either is not mature yet, or comes with cost higher than most reasonable people could agree to.
Seems like a lot of this could be saved with the design of certain multicolored objects. I know having to glue things isn't ideal but for example the top of the rocket could easily be a separate piece that is designed with a male and female attachment like they do for figurines. Same goes for the side fins on the rocket. Gotta weigh the pros and cons. You might have to just put some dots of glue and waste time but save filament and potential issues. Also if its printed in parts you run less of a risk of losing the whole print when something goes wrong.
It’s a good point, the thing with some models, the rocket especially, is the red frame around the door most the way up requires a colour change anyway, so having the fins coloured wouldn’t make a difference to the purge.
I agree though, as designers we are definitely going to be taking purge into account when designing…
I am glad I watched your video before buying. My favorite material is TPU and I was planning some PETG and TPU combo prints but I guess I won't be using an AMS now that I know it doesn't do TPU. Super bummed about that!
I do agree that multi color prints create a huge amount of waste, so it's not something you'd do regularly, it's still nice to be able to when in the need. However, the single biggest advantage of the AMS is the ability to print the interface layer for supports in a different material. It will only produce the waste once (well twice) per support, but allow printing the support interface with 0 distance and 0 spacing. So the supported side of the print will print near to perfect while the support is still easy to remove (i.e. using a single PETG layer in a PLA print works perfect)
This is great, and something I haven’t actually tried yet, we do most our designs no supports but this could be a game changer! So you just do the final touching layers as PETG?
@@playconveyor Yep. Printing something with supports, set the "Support Base" to the same material as the print, e.g. PLA, but set the "Support interface" to PETG. Set the "Top Z distance" to 0, set the "Top Interface layers" to 1 (well, could also do 2 for even better results I suppose), set the "Interface pattern" to the one you like and make sure "Top interface spacing" is set to 0.
If you have supports building up *on* the print, do the same with the bottom interface settings. When printing with PETG, you can use PLA for the support interfaces, but be a bit careful with the temperatures (Bambu Studio will warn adequately).
The same is actually valid for the special support filament offered by Bambu. You don't want to print the entire supports in that support filament as it's much more expensive than regular PLA and it would require the wasteful material swap for every layer. Instead you print the support base in PLA and only use the support filament for the single interface layer.
@@michaelzanetti7994 right this is being tested out straight away! Great info, thanks!
careful though... prints will get knocked off easily due to lack of adhesion between the petg and pla. I've been there
pteg to pla... or pla to petg, or you can use support from bambu... do just the interface layer@@playconveyor
The only multi color printing I do is perhaps a top colored layer or lettering. So mostly I use the AMS as a filament changer and holder. Certainly going to add a second. Perhaps a 3rd. Being able to send prints off in different colors and not even look at the printer until it's done is amazing.
Absolutely luv the filament runout features saves me a lot of headaches and time
Oh totally agree, I would pay the 350 just to have that on all my printers!
Put a wrap of electrical tape around the edge of the cardboard spools. Works perfectly in my AMS.
I have been using cardboard spools from Elegoo, Polymaker and Overture without any issue. I have used 10+ and they work just as good as those with plastic spools.
We’ve heard about build ups of cardboard dust in the rollers, which does hold them back a bit!
@playconveyor Could you prevent that - to some extent at least - with, say, gaffer tape around the edges?
The AMS has really allowed me to do so much more. The waste issue can be slightly controlled with adjustments but that is a drawback. I agree the AMS is well worth it.
Was never ever able to print abs or asa on any other printer I own. Had some 2 yr old abs and It printed the entire roll flawlessly.
This is great to hear!
The AMS is the number one reason I bought the X1 Carbon and not primarily for multicolor prints. It is super convenient to have 4 colors ready to go on demand. I do some multicolor printing, but I design my parts to minimize filament changes and wear and tear on the unit. I learned my lesson early and just buy AMS friendly ready to go filament. I have no desire to respool, add rings, or any thing else that requires me to fiddle. My Kickstarter unit has performed well for me and seems to be holding up well.
Sounds like a lot of people are using the AMS mainly for the convenience rather than the multi colour, which is the same as us! It’s really interesting to see Creality and Qidi being out printers to compete with the Bambu, but no AMS!! Seems strange
@@playconveyor I agree! It was very difficult to load filament in my first printer, a Robo3D R1+,, so ease of filament loading was a priority for #2. I was surprised by how many printer manufacturers assumed you had full access around the printer for loading filament. I don’t have that kind of space, so the AMS right on top works nicely. That said, I have a y connector and a side mount so I can easily use non AMS friendly filament.
Here is a question: Can you slice one model, and then load it to the Bambu, and then AT PRINT TIME select which color of the 4 you want to print it in? I have a few products that I print in pretty much whatever color people want, and that would be a game changer for my workflow.
The ams has really helped my wife. Helps greatly with just loading filaments for her.
Agreed, especially compared with all the other enclosed printers that load from the back 🫣
Great vid!! Didn’t even know half these features 😂
Thanks so much! 😁 it’s such an impressive bit of kit, let’s hope other companies are taking notes!
Thanks a lot for this video! Almost ordered this one just for the purpose of printing loads of colored stuff. But seeing the amount of waste this thing produces is a giant dealbreaker.
i love the AMS. it makes keeping my nylon and carbon fiber filaments from picking up moisture while i print.
I dont have a Bambu yet - ive got a Prusa Mk3S. Ive used MMU2 and Palette2 and didn't really get on with either of them. I'm going to wait for reviews of the Prusa XL and then make a decision on which to get.
Good call, I’d love a Prusa XL, but we just couldn’t justify the outlay for the multi tool version!
I love the AMS, but it can be finicky about the type of filament you feed through it, as mentioned in the video. TPU will jam, so no bueno. Silk PLA tends to strip and jam inside the tube manifold. I ruined my first AMS trying to run a silk PLA. I will not do that again.
As far as multicolor printing, I have learned that part orientation can help reduce the waste. I also have quit using the purge tower altogether without any bleed problems.
BL is really doing a great job with making printers but they need to seriously step up their support game. It takes days and days to get a response from them through the ticketing system and if their initial response isn't what you desire that's pretty much it. You're done. I love my printer but if I had it to do over again I would buy a prusa just for the support
That’s not great to hear, we haven’t had to use support yet luckily, but I’m no up for having to wait that long…
@@playconveyor Yeah if you take a look at the groups and from my own experience they really either are struggling or just don't care about prompt or thorough support. It's definitely something they're going to have to fix otherwise they're going to be in trouble going up against the reputation of companies like prusa
@@DoRCoutside Prusa who have you dealt with for 3D printer support that was useful. I can already tell you they are all terrible to deal with. At least Bambu has everything VERY well documented and when there is an error it throws up a QR code or the app takes you to a page for general troubleshooting. This is not something other printers do and it's part of Bambu's success and why all the clones that came after didn't do as well. They are more user friendly.
Now, they do need to step up their support but that's true for every manufacturer outside Prusa who actually factors that into price. Good support costs a lot of money. It's hard to do with the razor thing margins on some of these printers but if you spend 2K or more, good support should be expected.
@@JoshFisher567 I agree with this and to be honest with you I have changed my opinion somewhat in the last 10 months. Between the way BL is handled the problems that have occurred with their printers which has been pretty much exemplary as far as I'm concerned and the way prusa pretty much completely botched the release of the XL I don't really feel like prusa has that much of an advantage anymore in the doing things right area
Huge fan of it. BUY IT, TRUST ME!
I made a silicone mold of a dragon egg. I then put in the poops and melt them in a toaster to then have a solid unique 1 of a kind dragon egg to sell along with my other products. The filament switcher is super nice too.
Oh that sounds well cool! Have you posted it on any socials?
I'd be curious to see a video on that
Desiccant handling tip: Buy a pack of those bags used to hold bird seed/rice for use in weddings or I suppose the more expensive reusable tea bags could work as well. They're extremely inexpensive, they hold a good bit of desiccant, and they easily fit in the center of a spool in a vacuum bag or in the space(s) between the AMS 'extruders'. When tied off they don't spill though I haven't tested drying the desiccant inside of the bags as they seem to be made of a super cheap plastic polymer. I think lower temps for longer duration might be okay and I plan on getting a food dehydrator soon to test it out.
This sounds great!
Great video mate!
Thanks so much!!
I'm a first time 3D printer and I got the P1S combo. While I'm still just dabbling with it, the fact that it holds 4 spools and automatically changes them over is exactly why I bought the system! It's really neat and works perfect. Not to mention, the printer itself is nearly flawless. The only failures I've had so far were entirely user error and just looking around the system. I can't express the words "idiot-proof" enough! It's super intuitive.
I do agree, the poop issue would be nice to reduce or eliminate, but if they're going for perfect prints then I'm not sure of any other way to do it besides run a 3rd material/ cleaner through the feeder and then pick up the new stuff (I'm no scientist on how the switchover is done in the first place, but I imagine it's similar to painting where it just can't be avoided).
Either way, my only regret with getting this system is now I'm kind of wishing I had bought the X1C instead of the P1S. The S is certainly functional and good for the price, but the screen system seems to be really nice on the C and it wasn't honestly all that much more for the combo, considering how much I've spent on laser systems. Oh well, I'll probably end up buying one eventually if I get to the need for a second printer. I'm pretty happy with the S overall so far.
Anyone have a link to any good multi material videos with the AMS? I'm not finding any... Just multi color. I'm actually really curious if the AMS can handle multi material changes without issue, seeing how it would have to change temp, and feed rate settings mid print. Plus the way the Bamboo cuts the filament, this would cause issues when going from a high temp material to a low temp material, unless the slicer knows that it has to push out the last bit of filament before dropping temp for the following filament. How does the Bamboo handle these temperature swings?
We’d love to check these out too if you find one! We will try and test some abs etc prints out in the coming few weeks!
so can you make a video how to save filmant with multi color? what the best settings?
Does the ams switch to another reel when the current one runs out?
I have 2 AMS and find them great. Auto switchover is a winner but also support filament to allow clean removal of supports. I have it set as interface layer to reduce waste and cost. Also AMS is great to give you quick switching of colours print to print.
Oh that’s good, tell me more about the interface layer and the hub, haven’t tried either of these yet…
Actually the AMS produces a lot more waste than MMU2,ERCF, Chameleon etc. On unloading the Filament is cut inside the printhead, so you get a perfect filament tip. This makes the next time loading the filament much more reliable. Also more beginner friendly: You do not need to fine tune ramping profiles for each filament and temperature to get a (mostly) usable filament tip on unload. The big downside: heatbreak and nozzle still contain the old filament. Thats quite an amount. Thats actually the "poo". Still you have the wastetower to prime the nozzle and clear the remaining traces of the old filament. The poo is mostly extra waste.
Actually the SMuFF uses a simular aproch.
Automaticly cutting the filament in the printhead is the key feature for relaibility.
The second key feature is the "Filament Buffer". It actually just "buffers" less than an inch of filament. There is a slider with a spring. In the slider is a long magnet. Under the slider is a hall-effect sensor, so the electronics know exactly, where the slider is. This way the feeder in the printhead and the feeder in the AMS for the spool you use at the moment are sychronised.
Su unlike all the other filament changers, the AMS-feeder does not only load and unload (and is detached while printing), it also pulls the filament from the spool and pushes it to the buffer.
So the feeder in the printhead need much less force to pull filament.
In my opinion the poo could massivly reduced by software on PLA prints. Ramping still works. So with well tuned ramping profiles, a cut inside the printhead is not needed. So on a pure multi-colour-PLA-print you could unload the old filament completly, so just the wastetower (for cleaning and primeing) is needed. Or instead a purge object (a print, which colour does nor matter, as its either functional or painted afterwards anyway).
Hopefully bambu integrates a coulourchange without cutting mode. Which would be a very expert function (tuning in the ramping profiles) but could save a lot of waste.
So the video is irretating in one point: The transition matrix only applys to the wastetower. The poo is the filament left in heatbreak and nozzle. This has to be purged and is the same amount of plastic every time.
I have been using abs a good bit and the X1 is handling it very well. Maintains print speed and have had few issues with warping. You definitely need the chamber fan on to not get any fume leakage. I have found 30% to be a great value to keep negative pressure without loosing chamber temperature. Still have it hooked up to a vent outside just in case but in a garage or aux room there are no worries.
This is interesting, amazed ABS at that speed is still good quality, they have really nailed it! We have a completely sealed workshop so definitely need to hook up a vent before trying it!
After I found out that using petg for supports on pla and using pla for supports on petg results in perfect support separation it’s worth at least using an AMS for that. Plus the auto switch feature is highly attractive and has made me completely 180 on the don’t need must have scale. I’ll be buying at least 1 AMS for auto switching filament. The question I’m trying to answer is do I buy the x1c combo or another p1p and AMS.
Great video. Don’t understand why this channel doesn’t have 10 000+ subs yet
Thanks! That’s very nice to hear, hopefully we will get there!
All my filament is on cardboard rolls. So better start printing covers before my AMS arrives. My main reason i want AMS is that auto swap filament when one spool runs out as i have about 15 spools with 60-100g on them.
I get the comment about a lot of companies moving to cardboard spools, but I also think that bambu labs selling filament refills that aren’t on any spool as an even better solution. Perhaps more companies could offer that
I do have the AMS but don’t really multicolour print. Just use it as a convenient to have multiple different colour filaments to hand and dry.
It seems most people use it for that judging by the comments, which it definitely is amazing at!
Very true with the refills too, we try to do this when we can! I do love seeing filament companies focussing on it!
"room for improvement" in terms of waste ? Yes. Pretty much every AMS function here can run perfeclty clear at a 0.4 factor instead of the "0.8" you stated. Even in hard cases (white to black). The values Bambue Autocalculates are notorioiusly conservative.
The biggest upside of the AMS however to me is the way it allows very cheap removable support structures, using PETG+PLA combos (in both ways) to produce extremely easy to snap-off support structures using a 100% solid interface layer without the need for rather expensive dedicated support filaments. The only reason to use those these days are to tackle "hollow prints" which have no other way to be removed other than dissolving.
PETG+ABS/ASA combo works pretty well too. Not as spectacualr as the PETG/PLA combo, but still very much worth using that combo too.
Having used MMU2 and Mosaic in the past, I can say that though not flawless, the AMS is a totally underestimated piece of kit which is at least as much as a gamechanger as the Bambu printers themselves are.
Couldn’t agree more, the Creality K1 that has just been announced perked my interest, until I saw no AMS system and immediately lost interest!
The 0.4 is good to know, we dropped to 0.6 once for a red to black change and it bled quite badly, so gave up, maybe we need to persist a bit more!!
@@playconveyor Qidi's new line is rumoured to add a multi-material addon too. The presence of a (extremely) similar filament cutter system seems to acknowledge that rumour. At 325*325 it's also larger than the K1 Max. could be an interesting machine if the multi-material addon emerges before BL comes with a larger addition to the current line-up, although i'd prefer a 350*350 size as smallest unit.
AMS is great but TPU/soft filiament is a no go I just found out (by trying it!). You can reduce the purge poop between reels and it saves quite a bit.
How do you reduce waste
I have done some quick sums and here in the uk you can get the bambulab x1 carbon for roughly 1,500 quid, if the prusa is 3,500 quid and your filament cost a penny per gram which I'm hopping it will go back down to then it would take 2 tons of purging material to make up the cost difference, that's a lot and if you had 400kgs of purge material a year then that would take 5 years to make up the difference, by then there could very well be new technology that is better and is cheaper.
Whaaaaatt?? Mine always pauses and tell me that the poop path is blocked. I clear it out and it gets back to printing. Was the lidar on?
What? Haha yeah the LiDAR was on, how frustrating it didn’t tell me! It’s happened a couple of times and never paused!
A multiplier of 0.3 for the flushing volume should also be enough. At least I read this number in a comment somewhere.
But an IDEX solution for me is - for the moment - the way to go with 2 material (1 color and 1 support filament) or 2 colors.
If the model is setup correctly even multicolor would be possible with IDEX with a spool change in between when one color is not needed anymore.
The other possibility could be that this multi toolhead idea (which is also already there in some Voron Mods) gets more popular so that Creality, Sovol and Artillery also take a shot.
An Ender 5 with 5 - 8 toolheads could be fun ... for very, very less money. And the thing with multicolor is: when the printer does not cost a fortune (more than 800 bucks) it easy to argue that a second, smaller printer is still in the budget ... =D
Agree with all this! IDEX does seem like the best option at the moment, but just wish multi tool (5/6) would hurry up and get cheaper/more reliable!
Thanks for the support!
ASA prints absolutely amazingly with the AMS.
Is the recycled paper spool considered 'cardboard'?
Did you try it with the ones in the video?
When I think cardboard, I think corrugated cardboard...
I really wish Prusa made an AMS
I tend to uses my AMS for having different materials installed rather then multi colour prints. I can have pla and petg ready to go whenever I need them.
Exactly this! Love the convenience
Don't see myself needing the AMS, as cool as it would be to have available. But I also think I will wait for Gen 2 of the X1 printers before I dive in.
Already dealing with early adoption of DDR5 and the new X3D chip...my threshold of paying for Beta testing this year has been reached. 😅
We have been burnt a few times on alpha or beta printers in the past but so far this has been great!! What printers have you got so far?
@@playconveyor Just a heavily modified Ender 3 (doing the Marlin firmware was more than a bargained for, but it works...my first printer) and an Elegoo Saturn. Would like an X1 Carbon as a daily driver FDM and keep the Ender for "other". Kinda hoping Elegoo does an 8k+ version of the Jupiter. Or find something similar. Love the Saturn but want to print larger things all too often.
Absolutely LOVE the Ender for doing car parts with reinforced filament. Been a game changer.
Not sure what issues you have with being an "early adopter" of DDR5. I have been using DDR5 with my 7950X since 10/15/22...6 months....not an issue. Did hear about the x3d burn out issue...ouch...
good job mate and ty
Thanks you!! Thanks for the support! 🙏
Good video! But I was a bit shocked at your conclusion. 😜
After seeing you go through lots of the pros and cons I was fully expecting, and would have agreed with the boring old; "It depends".
Even though I've been in the camp who says; "I want multicolor printing because my painting skill is at the level of a 5-year-old.". Seeing you confirm the insane waste we've seen other AMS users have reported before. My current stance is: "I guess maybe I should put some effort into learning how to paint instead.". 😅
Off course, for professional use, the added cost of the wasted filament can be reduced somewhat the more objects you can fit on the build plate, as the amount of purging will be largely the same whether you print 1, 2, or even 4 rockets at a time. Still though, even at 4 rockets at a time, that'd still put more filament in the waste bin than on the build plate. So this is definitely an issue for professional use as well.
Have you done the math? Like with the Prusa XL example as an alternative? Say you buy some fairly good 30-dollar filament to avoid clogging and get the most popular colors. That's just 67 spools of filament you have to waste before you break even with the 2000 dollars up to the Prusa XL. So for a private individual printing only single items like your rocket, you'd only have to print ~18(!) spools worth of actual objects on the build plate before you break even. That's really not that much. And even a professional user who manages to get the waste down to say 50%, that's 67 spools of filament on the plate, but also 67 spools in the trash.
Yeah, I just don't know how it makes sense to anyone other than "rich" people who don't care about the waste. Because for frugal consumers, and profit-minded professionals it doesn't make much economical sense. 🤷
Haha I’m completely with you with the painting skills, I had started spending time on learning to paint models properly, then the Bambu Lab came out and I haven’t picked up a brush since… damn you Bambu 😅
We had done the maths, and you’re right the Prusa would work out cheaper in the long run, I guess the big thing for us is that up front cost, trying to get $3,500 past my wife would be difficult for ANOTHER printer 😂 for now we rarely do multi colour prints because of the purge, but I would love to be able to do them more, so fingers crossed the tech comes down in price soon!
@@playconveyor I backed the AnkerMake M5 + the promised V6 "color engine". Unfortunately the V6 hit another snag in production and is now not expected to ship until September I think. Interestingly they still claim 6 colors in one print without using purge blocks at all. And since the mechanism is super secret juju juice or something. AnkerMake hasn't even provided an * yet.
It will be interesting to see what they come up with. They just last night launched a FW update for the M5 that doubles the max printing speed up to 500mm/s (And upped acceleration to 5000mm/s^2). It can actually produce an OK looking Benchy in just over 17 minutes now. Which is very good for a bedslinger. So they seem to have some fairly good engineers over there. Maybe the V6 will surpise us all? 😅
How is it for water-soluble supports?
I use the AMS only for convenience and just have different materials in it.
Colorful knickknacks I do not print at all or if it should be colored, I use an airbrush. that goes under the line even faster.
Yeah convenience is king for us with the AMS, worth every penny just not having to load up a different filament everytime
Cardboard on polymaker is working fine for me for the record
The part that concerns me is were it says using cardboard spools may invalidate the warranty… cardboard spools will leave dust in the runners of the AMS, and they could say that is the cause of certain issues
Have you done a review on Bambu Labs privacy statements. There seems to be a lot of invasive web site tracking on any users web ,once you are on the cloud with these printers.
Have you dived deep into any TOS for any device you have purchased? You can set them up in LAN only mode and if you have any decent networking skills you can set it up on a VLAN or subnet that can't reach the internet. It's their mobile app that seems to be heavily reliant on cloud services.
It still surprises me how much this worries people. If they got caught sending any network traffic back that wasn't specifically about the printer and network issues people would find out. If you're worried about data tracking worry about your phone and specifically what apps are installed, and permissions granted. Google.makes.the majority of their money off add revenue so Android is free for a reason. That and social media sites will sell your data to anyone. Lastly, the NSA has all your info in a data center in Utah that holds 1000 exo bytes of data and builds profiles on every US citizen but people are worried about their printer stealing information. Granted, the NSA don't look at probably 98% of it, but they have it
While you lose some features without the cloud they are minimal, like using the app and the camera I believe. Sending data also helps troubleshoot and solve issues.
I get it , it's China but they make 90% or more of all 3D printers and most connect to the internet these days.Even when open source, they do tend to throw in some customizations which may phone home.
At the end of the day you can use any slicer you want and use the SD card like you did before 3D printers connected to the internet. It's still best to use their slicer for multi color prints but it doesn't have to connect to the Internet.
ive gotten the purge multiplier down to 0.1 with decent results
If the coloured print comes out without failing like the MMU2 nightmare, use the purged material in a resin art. In my opinion its worth it.
A couple of people have mentioned that, definitely something we need to look into
Interesting stuff, moving from a Mk3 with mmu to a X1C the little turds are easier to repurpose or recycle if I could be arsed to separate the two colours in the turd it would be easy to literally use it to create my own filament.
Repurposing being mainly packing material for small objects.
Way easier than the bloody big multicolor brick my Prusa would produce as a space hogging 'feature' IF the mmu didn't shit itself part way through.
My daughter prints big objects that clip/glue together that take days and spools of filament so she just loads all the bays with the same product sometimes hot swapping as the jobs leave empty spools behind.
This made me chuckle! Great point about repurposing, using the poop as packaging is genius!
Have not had any issues with ABS and PETG on the AMS.
Great to hear! Print quality good too?
@@playconveyor Yes, I print things for my farm and can print threaded mounts for M2 in both materials that work well enough.
I recently saw one that is crowd funding that switches the hot ends.
Interesting, What was the name? I saw one on YT a while back that had a spinning wheel on the side of the printer to swap hotends, seems like flawed tech to me!
@@playconveyor that is the one I saw I believe
if you want to print with 16 colours without waste you just need a idex printer with 16 heads .
So it doesn't matter if you are using the prusa mmu or bambu ams you will waste material in poop or a block.
Does such a printer exist? 16 heads sounds like a beast!
@@playconveyor not sure what the limit is , but on the e3d toolchanger each head fits at the back of the printer and it selects a full extruder for each colour or material so not cheap .
The AMS is much better for dual colour printing than the 2 heads together method like the creator pro 3d printer.
@@peteradshead2383 I suppose the more competition and tech advancements that happen, the sooner it will reduce in price and be more available to everyone, exciting thought!
I feel like you answered your own question about the cardboard spools twice in this video... 1 the AMS keeps out moisture and dust... 2. The printed spools you talked about breaking down... now imagine how much dust/debris would be created by cardboard breaking down from being spun forward and backward. Hence no cardboard in the AMS. They may be able to make this less likely if they had some bearings in there for the spools to run on, but they don't so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
You can print things with the flushed filaments instead of having it wasted. As long as you don’t care it will be multicolored
I’d rather use white filaments and do the paint job myself, I believe the results are more refined than the AMS, and save both money and time
These plugins just keep on getting crazier, Have you tried out the monopoly plugin? I think it's german but it's still really cool!
I feel that the issue with AMS purging is nothing new. It's been like that with injectiin molding, which is based on plastic extrusion , is also the basis of FDM 3D printing. Only way, it could be optimized, is through redesign of the passive hotend(big heated chamber attached to fixed nozzle). If the chamber is inductively heated with a screw extruder(which in this case will allow for mixing, without compression) with a very low chamber volume and thermal mass. This would improve heatzone, while reducing volume of purge. It might even eliminate filaments and allow using pellets, and even mixing them to create unique colors(in a predictable manner), which is impossible, with any existing AMS systems available today. Just some 💭
Can you do multiple colors manually without the ams?
You could do layer changes, but different colours in the same layer would be impossible 😫
I once tried printing TPU 95A with the ams and it was by far the worst experience i‘ve ever had on this machine (i know they say don’t do it but i still wanted to try xD). Tho TPU 98A worked without problems, just like PLA
This is interesting! I might have to try 98A out, I love a bit of TPU! Although I just bought (and did a video) on a $70 printer and I’ve just managed to put TPU through that with great success!
Honestly, im surprised this thing prints at all.
Doesn’t the MMU have less waste because it retracts most of the filament instead of cutting it? Just wondering.
If i do multi colour for signs or layers i simply Pause print pull the release leaver yank the filament out the Direct drive hotend/extruder and stuff the next colour straight in and resume print. Creality's Efit extruder with a E3D volcano works great for this. If your quick you get no mixing as you pull out a majority and leave tiny traces behind. Obviously you have to be there for my way but, Im a hobbyist, The waste wouldnt make the AMS worth it for me.
foamed plastic has the added weight of the air trapped in the foam. in a direct weight comparison you may be mislead. grind the foam or dissolve to get a clear compare.
I love the printer, but i have had so much problems with the AMS. Cant recomend it. first one of the plastic arms the holde one of the rollers broke off. had to glue that back on and still working. then it jammes every single time i run out of fillament on one of the slots. Have to open it up and pull out the rest that is locked inside the tubes. and now i havent printed in a while and the PLA just snapped off and got stuck inside
had mine for a week now, faulty out of the box with two bad first stage feeders, haven't even been able to do one multi color print, and bambu tech support is........ yeah.
I feel like people complaining about multi-material waste are always comparing it to single-color prints. That's apples and oranges. I have a Mosaic Palette and where this guy is talking about a 63% purge on total filament... I'm dealing with more like 80 - 90% purge. So there is something to be said for the system being better than alternatives.
I also feel that it wouldn't be hard to repurpose the waste into new filament.
It isn’t really, but only once you have the machine to do it… (which are expensive) - we are saving all ours then will either buy one or see if we can take it to someone who has one
@@playconveyor Have you looked at the ARTME 3D?
@@playconveyor people make diy plastic bottle sourced filament with home rig machines very simple.
if you print 4 of those rocket models, the purge waste will be the same.
Yeah, when we first noticed this I was shocked (not sure why 😂, it makes sense) but the print time also only goes up marginally… so a 34 hour single print is 36 hours for two, or 38 hours for three.. shows how much the purge time is taking up!
@@playconveyor hopefully ams mark 2 solves the multicolour printing challenge
@@playconveyor Yeah printing multiple items of the same thing is the best way to use the AMS.
Of course unless you don't need multiple items.
But, it's great if you are selling the items.
We need a printer that combines the x1c and the prusa xl
Probably a daft question, but can the AMS be used for jobs which require more filament than is on the reel, i.e. if two reels in the AMS are of the same material and reel one runs out will it automatically feed in the second reel of the same material?
Yeah, that’s my favourite feature, the auto switch filament! It’s a game changer
Why not design better rollers or update the first stage feeder my bearing spool holders are very smooth and easily moved all that is needed is a different set of rollers
Print farm operator said cardboard is not eco friendly.
Why do you tell people to get rid of the pouches? Those pouches are reusable also, as you can dry them out in the oven the same as the individual beads. Often they are the same exact beads, but enclosed in a pouch. At least this is my understanding, and I could be incorrect.
I think that they shouldnt advertize it as much as for multicolor prints that as for convenience to have spools rdy.. or for some simple colorswitches at a layer height... Anything else makes the fastest printer the slowest and also expensive comparing material and energy cosumtion... The whole ams unit is not expensive but multimaterial printing is not solved by it.. i dont know how prusa and other manufacturers will come around that toolchanging and powering toolheads thru connectiors are patented by someone (as i heard on mihai design channel)... We will have to wait a bit more
This printer is good until you have to talk to the technicians…. I’m having trouble with a defective part and I’m 3 weeks writing with them because the printer has a defective part that they don’t want to change it . Since day one this part was defective but the post service of bambú labs is a piece of ……..
This doesn’t sound good.. what part is it? Interesting to hear the good and the bad on these printers!
@@playconveyor the carbon rod
u can flush filament in other models so theoretically there is no waste u can live with iffy colored models and e3d havbe tool changer for years now(i my opini9on e3d exsample is more apropriate or maybe i;m bit salty cuz prusa geting to much hype)
I’ve not seen anyone flush into other models before, can that be done easily enough?
@@playconveyor ruclips.net/video/bFZZP5zS8CY/видео.html
You should probably learn how to setup the purge settings before making a video trashing the purge amounts... You're using default settings to get that much purge for that model.
We’ve tinkered around with the settings a fair bit but strong colours purging into white does have some bleeding issues in our experience, and for the purge amount it saves we found it wasn’t worth the risk of ruining a whole 1 or 2 day print for…
What settings have you got yours set for? Would love to find a way to get it down a bit even if it is only marginal.
It's actually only 250 if you buy it with the x1.
Bambu lab AMS does not work. it has been a month since I got the AMS, not able to print even once. I am now struggling to get a refund. Worst customer support team.
cardboard spools are not really eco friendly, they waste a whole lot more energy to produce than polymer spools. if you would like to go eco friendly go with recycled polymer spools or refillable spools.
Agree that refills are the way forward, but a lot of companies still aren’t offering it. Cardboard I guess is more sustainable, more sustainably sourced and ‘if’ it ends up in landfill it will biodegrade in a short time compared to plastic… you are right though, cardboard spools and a bit of a temporary fix, not long term!
You're commenting on something you don't have... do you have anything in your head at all? (rhetorical question)
The AMS pays for itself -- or whatever the opposite of that aphorism is -- in filament poop.
Hahaha. "What is the AMS..." 0:44 "... this wanky-looking bit of kit..." hahaha.... oh, wait, I guess he said "swanky", and sadly, the auto-captions agree.
Haha! It’s swanky I promise…
Hey just so you know there's a $500 bounty on the encrypted log files that your printer is sending to bamboo from another channel get hacking I'll stay waiting for prusa that's completely open source, by the way a little bit slower and you can run an MK4 it has the same features except it's not locked down
😮
Good review, but the title is total clickbait
When applicable....print by object....not by layer
The AMS and MMU solutions are "half baked" at best. They solve some of the issues..but at a high cost and potential inconvenience with back up and no TPU, etc. The Prusa XL is the only printer on the market (at least that I know of in the hobby range) that will solve all these issues. What is often argued is that Bambu is way faster printer. Well.. as we see already, and no input shaping yet, the XL (and MK4) can print at about 1/2 the speed.. maybe more once input shaping kicks in. But more importantly in a huge way.. is not JUST the ability to switch up to 5 colors.. but individual heads are heated to the temps needed for the material it will print. You're going to see much faster multi material and color print speeds with no waste from the XL soon as people start putting them through their paces. One will argue the 2x price.. more with a cabinet to put the XL in. True.. but if that rocket ship print is anything to go by.. with just a couple colors, you wasted 1/2 a roll.. or about $12 or so worth of filament, let alone a massive print time to do so.. add that up.. if you were to print that once a day (given the 1 day print times).. you're talking > $300 a month in wasted filament. Over the course of just 1 year.. if you were to print that same small rocket ship every day.. you would already have enough money to buy the XL and benefit from the individual heads to boot. To me.. the AMS only makes sense to have backup filament in a print.. and not having to toss a few wraps or so of filament to avoid a run out. That is indeed nice. I am curious if the XL will offer a similar option.
All very good points, and is where I stand… the AMS is definitely worth it for the features but the multi colour just isn’t worth it for us… which is fine for now! The Prusa looks amazing, and your comments about the cost racking up are spot on… but finding that initial outlay is tough! Maybe one day we will get our hands on one and we can test it too 😅
The AMS shines quite a bit when printing multiple items with color changes.
A lot of people are printing multiple of the same item with the same colors changes and that cuts down the waste quite a bit.
I do like the thought of the XL. My MK3S+ is a decent machine, just slow print times.
I know the XL is saying it was can 150mm/s, which is about 30-40mm/s faster than I can get my MK3 to print while maintaining decent results.
The XL won't be much faster with multi material yet because the tool head change is pretty slow. They might be able to speed it up though.
But that $3500 price point before taxes is just nuts.
Seeing Prusa's past, the prices won't come down either.
if u paint objects it produces even more poop... because it basically just doing the outer walls and still using the other filamen in the middle... best is to do the 3d file like u need it...
AMS is good for their first iteration but no doubt it is overpriced and will eventually be nothing more than an after thought.
Why would anyone get this and not use multicolored prints lol. There’s cheaper ways to single color