the fact the coolant isn't very warm on this engine stock is not necessarily a problem, since kubota likely designed it to operate under load as a stationary engine for very long periods of time, while being as thermodynamically efficient as possible, hence the cold exhaust manifold. by blocking off almost all the airflow to the engine bay with the airomods, the engine is likely now heat-soaking under heavy load, leading to your perceived power loss. additionally, without an oil cooler, the higher than stock RPM is probably getting the oil nice and toasty-you should probably be monitoring the temperature of that too.
Depends how you look at it - diesels are more economical when taking in slightly warmer air (although it will make more power with a cold feed). And it will be less efficient if it never reaches a suitable operating temperature due to 50mph air flow through the engine bay which it's not designed for.
Diesels don't like running too cold. If they're too far below operating temperature, they can't fully combust the fuel. If they're too hot, the intake air is less dense, and they lose power that way.
It's the boot spoiler! Removing that cost you 3 seconds! :-) Everyone know's they make you go faster! I reckon adding a couple of stripes will knock another couple of seconds off!
In all reality, the only thing left is to reduce the rear surface area, and a good strong edge to detach the laminar flow. Technically the spoiler was acting as the edge
Alright, I'll pitch in now. I own an 82 Isuzu I-Mark Diesel. .50 drag coefficient. From the factory, it is equipped with a 51 horsepower, 72 lb-ft 1.8L engine. On the tire size, from the factory, it was equipped with 155/70R13s. Those are difficult to come by where I am, so I run 175s. I also run my tires at 40 PSI. I've been able to pull 62 MPG out of it. 0-60 takes 20 seconds. Fastest I've ever had that car on a test track was 94 MPH. Not kidding. Anyway, just figured I'd toss you that information to give you a base for what was commercially available.
Aero engineer by education here, a couple of tips to consider: 1. The spoiler does actually help with aerodynamics. You probably don't need to put the big spoiler back on, but you can get the little plastic stick on spoilers, or even just cardboard/plastic board plus tape to help the air at the back to separate from the trunk. You just want the air to ramp up a little bit. If the air can "jump off" the spoiler ramp a bit, then it can rejoin the airflow easier and reduce drag. 2. Another cheap thing you can do is try adding vortex generators to the back of the roof, to help the airflow stick to the back window as it flows down. Something like you see on Subaru WRX's. This will also help guide the air into the spoiler. If you want to crank the hillbilly aerodynamics up to eleven, you can add a full undertray and boat tail. The channel "think flight" has a small series about this for a better visual of what I mean.
Agree with you on all points. Vortex generators are however more complex than just sticking them on, they may just as well worsen aerodynamics just as much as they improve them if you don't calculate it correctly, so I'd personally skip them.
@@swecreations true, if you don't know what you're doing. It's probably something that's best done here by trial and error. Try with, try without, see what works best. I figured for how simple they are, and by copying other cars, it can probably get close enough
Thanks! We are getting some feedback on the rear spoiler and folks are saying something should be there in order to reduce drag. We will try a few options and see what works.
And funny enough, the RUclips channel called SuperfastMatt just uploaded a video about aerodynamic drag. He has a 1950 Jaguar that's been converted to electric (it's actually more aerodynamic driving it backwards that forwards), he scans the car and inputs the scan into a program that models the aerodynamics, and brings up the rear design of modern cars (that spoiler like lip on the trunk lid) that helps reduce the drag.
Smokey yunick ran airplane tires on his high mpg car "hot vapor fiero" he built. Not sure why haven't researched. I saw it at the don garlits museum here in florida.
a small turbo with a few pounds of boost would solve every problem with speed, and make it so the car doesnt need to have crazy aero mods. Plus, turbos for diesels increase overall efficiency and can easily lead to more MPGs Maybe a k03 turbo from an older audi / volkswagen turbo engine would do well... The inducer size on those is like 30mm so not too big for the baby sized engine
More fuel equals more heat only to the point that it will flow air. Controlling combustion temps is an art unto itself. Controlling the oil temperature is very important since that also helps control piston temps. The affect of piston oilers is not as great as most people think because oil is naturally being slung up against the bottom of the pistons anyway. Control intake air temp and oil temp and water temp and you find it much easier to control combustion temps. Increase the fuel until you need water injection to control combustion temps. Aluminum melts at 1000-1200 degrees if I remember correctly BUT just because your egt hits 1000 does not mean that's how hot your piston is. The constant cooling of the pistons from the skirts and the oil on the bottom of the piston keeps it much cooler. Keep that oil temp below 190F and it will work wonders to keep your piston the proper size. On the bonus side the water injection gives a bit of a power boost you can feel in the seat of your pants. My experience is via a GM 6.5 turbo diesel marine build in an old van with no intercooler. Just a "devil's own" water injection kit. Extra large oil cooler with auxiliary oil cooler. I've hit 1100 degrees with it climbing some mountain passes. I'm a chicken so I don't push it past that much. I've heard of guys pushing higher though.
If you want to gain 30% more power do the LPG (propane-butane) injection to the air intake. If you never heard of this, search for LPG-Diesel. Actually I have this system mounted in my 2.5 Audi A6 C5 and it is working great. Before I installed proper system, I was experimenting by just putting hose from camp gas tank into air intake,.You can try this for beginning :) (this is short term solution, because without heating system for gas, nozzle will froze after few minutes).
LP fumigation tends to work far better with aspirated (turbo) diesels compared naturally aspirated. Not sure why though. Cost ratio, space to safely carry the LP is an issue though. Seem to recall most report that it tends to work best to use it mostly for hard work events like acceleration and long upgrades. Since you use it..... has this been your experience?
The exhaust on my Cub Cadet with a D600 Kubota gets very hot. It has a stamped metal safety guard. Under heavy load it blows black smoke, 54" snow blade, chains and tractor tires. I use it to plow my drive way over on Fox road by MIchigan ave near your old stomping grounds. In cold weather the tractor runs very cool, the only time I see the temp gauge move is during summer. There were Cub Cadets that came with those diesels. The garden tractor pullers use a turbo from a European smart car, its 3 cylinder, and has the turbo built in to the manifold, you just need an adapter plate. The Military also had d722T on their generators.
Try putting the spoiler back on. Strange as it sounds it might actually cut drag in your case. IF The airflow stays attached going over the rear of the car that can increase the air pressure acting on the rear window which has the effect of pushing you forward slightly or at least pulling you backward less intensely. If you have a pitot tube and/or a magnahelic gauge laying around that you can measure air pressures you can do an a/b test on that or if not you could do tuft testing with some yarn to at least observe the airflow to see if you have a separation bubble
There is a diagram of this car on the Ecomodder forums, thread #40628. The back of the car should taper like the Insight. The top of the spoiler is about 4" too low.
@@discontinuuity it's easy to go too far though and move backwards Without instrumentation you're just guessing. The slight upturn or small deck-lid spoiler to increase pressure on the window and counterintuitively, reduce drag, is the reason a lot of OEs have been doing it. Think the new Hyundai sonata, and every Tesla, among dozens of others.
Yeah see that spoiler is not probably efficient at breaking air flow from the back of the car. The back of the car is shaped such that you need a very clean and sudden break. Although it's probably better than no spoiler. You probably are actually creating a vacuum behind the car instead of what you want which is a vortex/low pressure bubble. It would be really good to just model the Saturn and run it through some cheap CFD. The absolutely most efficient thing is obviously to never break air flow but that's just not possible with the shape of the car. You would need a long sloping tail
Absolutely this. I used to own one of these cars and when I painted it I shaved all the badges and removed the spoiler to get a cleaner look, which actually decreased my fuel mileage slightly. That little lip that you see on the back of the trunk lid on newer sedans fulfills the same purpose. This is why a pickup truck with a bed cover on it will get worse mpg too, because the tailgate acts as a spoiler, which counterintuitively decreases drag. A lot of research went into the aero on these S-series Saturns. They were some of the most slippery cars available at the time with a drag coefficient of between 0.29-0.32 depending on the model and year. I would do any aero mods one at a time because these cars were so good you may make it worse. Another thing is the little plastic pieces that go in the front to direct air to the radiator, along with the ones in the wheel wells. I removed those at one point too thinking lightening up the car would improve mpg and performance, but that also hurt mpg so I put them back on.
A little info on diesel egts, as you said there is no throttle for air so at low power times they'll run extremely lean which keeps the exhaust cool because there isn't enough energy in the fuel to make excessive heat, same reason for high idle switches for cold warm up. With adding a turbo if you can keep it at that point of being lean enough to keep cool it should be very efficient. Many people on the internet will argue this but if you add enough fuel you can keep the egts down as well, and get more power than lean cool. Another option would be injecting straight methanol under boost, I would expect impressive results from that. I would expect that lil engine to hold up to a decent amount of boost if you keep the egts down, don't turn up the timing, and keep the charge temp cool.
The majority of small diesel equipment engines that are turbocharged are running low boost to help with widening the torque bulge and keep revs consistent when the load varies. Typically, manifold pressure is 4-6 psi so an intercooler is not really needed, nor are piston oil sprayers.....however, the majority of turbo Kubota's do utilize a water/oil cooler under the oil filter. An air/oil cooler would probably be easier to fabricate and would greatly help with engine/turbo longevity, especially when holding full throttle for long periods in top gear.
I'm afraid you might have blocked off air intake into engine, so it's possible that after some time of max throttle engine is starved of (cold) air, so maybe installing a cold air intake would work out, and since you have that area on bumper to cut, you don't have to ruin bonnet. Should slightly improve performance on high speed doubling as an inertia supercharger (air resistance in front push more air into engine) Cheers, that's a good project and video, Thanks!
The pyrometer (exhaust gas temperature), is the best way to know just how a diesel engine is performing. you can figure as the exhaust temperature rises water temperature will rise along with it. there is some amount of over fueling that is acceptable. but if your smelling raw unburnt fuel then it's over fueling too much. a small puff of black smoke when shifting gears is acceptable. as long as that is the only smoke that is detected. there is a huge difference between turbo charged and naturally aspirated engines. and you want to have an intercooler with the turbo. but you will really have to keep an eye on the pyrometer. if the temperature rises too possibly nine hundred degrees for that engine. back out of the throttle and the will drop. and on both turbo charged and naturally aspirated engines you will want make sure the exhaust system is large enough diameter. it's important that diesels have free flowing exhaust. and don't ever shut off a turbo charged diesel with the pyrometer over six hundred degrees. I know this from many years of being an OTR truck driver and have ran a lot of turned up diesels.
I'd bet the spoiler did more for aero than you may think. I know all late model cars and trucks have a hangover lip off the truck or tailgate to smooth Eddy currents at the rear of the vehicle. That spoiler might have done just that.
@@Whateverpoopiepants You got me. Eddy current wasn't the right term. But you know what I'm getting at obviously. We'll just call it turbulence. I feel for you serious RUclipsrs. Dealing with trolls would be exhausting.
What you're thinking of is more or less the air 'sticking' to the sloping rear window for a bit before detaching. The trick is that ideally you'd have a long tapering tail like a bird. This is obviously impractical, but it turns out that if you end the car's shape abruptly the air detatches cleanly from the body and flows kind of like that long tail is there, reducing drag.
@@nerd1000ify There is a diagram of this car on the Ecomodder forums, thread #40628. The back of the car should taper like the Insight. The top of the spoiler is about 4" too low.
Hey, I had a diesel swapped SL2 a few years ago. Aero mods on mine were blocking the front ducting with plastic removing the side view mirrors and having mirrors mounted inside the doors that could see outside. They were basically a convex mirror. Worked well. And on the sedan at least the front lights were inset on the body. The lights were mounted on stand offs to ouch them out to be more level with the hood and front bumper. And finally the wheel covers were like the flat ones you see people running at bonneville. Car got about 90-100mpg when driven nicely. And even driven hard it was capable of 50-60mpg.
Fender skirts? Increased tire pressure? Air scoop enclosed directly to intake? Front campaign sign mod increases downforce, try moving top forward and bottom rearward, so it looks like an arrow shape from the side (reduces downforce, reduces drag)? Lower oil viscosity,? Water injection? Continued success! Thanks for the video!
Looking forward to the turbo test! In theory, you’ll be wide open throttle less if you boost it, so your EGT’s shouldn’t be too insane. I’d get a gauge for oil temps just in case, and run an oil cooler with a thermostat.
@@scox7760 I don’t think they’re going fast enough for a ram air intake to be doing much that’s effective. I think it makes 1psi per 100 MPH in clean air if it’s absolutely optimized. If they’re going 65 now, it might make .6psi if it was perfectly setup, which on a ~20hp engine might make .85HP more, and I doubt that would make much difference. A decent 7psi turbo setup would get it to make about 30HP, a bigger difference.
stop messing around and bolt on the turbo, I have this same engine and want to know what its capable of, lol. todays video answered a lot of questions I've had about the fuel enrichment screw, thanks.
on mechanical pumps the optimal pump setting is a little smoke at low rpm and clean burn near top, put a cold air intake because without the engine bay airflow the under hood temps might get really high and especially diesels need really cold air for best performance, if you run out of fuelpump you can raise the inlet pressure to the pump in mercedes mechanical pumps you can raise it from stock 1 bar to 2 bar without problems dont know how much you can raise it on that and if you still dont have enough fuel you can make a water/meth injection system and get a little bit more, pump timing makes a lot of difference especially at higher rpm, 800c egt temps shouldnt be a problem, i havent had any problems on my mercedes om603 without piston oil squirters, thank you for the great videos cant wait for the next one!😄
Seeing the engineering on all other videos I have no doubt you could add oil squirters to this engine. Tap into oil galley and just add them to stand alone rail inside block under rotating assembly. Honestly that would be simple compared to the other wizardry you have already done.
This sort of reminds when I was 9 or 10 years old , riding a Kubota on a rice/padi field in my village.... Never in a watever lifetime a YT content gonna kicked my memory into reverse 😁
WELL SORRY FOR THE CAPS AHEAD OF TIME , CANT SEE THE LITTLE LETTERS. BUT IM LOOKING FOR MORE VIDEOS AND HOPE THERE A LITTLE LONGE THEN THEY ARE NOW.... IM DOING A 4BT SWAP ON MY 2002 CHEVY S-10 4X4
skinnier wheels will indeed have less rolling resistance and provide less air resistance. You can also max out the pressures to whatever the sidewall allows. You can also try to cover the rear wheel wells.
He could also convert the wipers to 1 wiper that Parks in the straight up and down position in the middle of the screen. It's an old DTM racecar trick.
@@vasilis23456 well the max pressure is generally ~50psi and burst pressure is well over 200 in most cases. There's loads of safety margin on them, not like any tire manufacturer wants to expose themselves to undue liability.
I did an experiment on a VW Polo 1.4 TDi a few years back. Reduced weight by as much as possible, aerodynamic mods such as narrow tyres, closing off un-necessary ducts and removing anything that caused excessive drag. Had the engine slightly modified with a custom remap, a more free flowing exhaust. Can't remember exact figures but it achieved slightly over 100mpg and the performance was incredible
You should push the speed in 4th speed higher because it seems that the gearing makes the 5th very "long" for economy. When switching from 4th to 5th you go down to 2400rpm!
I think gearing down from the smaller tires pushes that shift point from 4th to 5th to around 50mph from what the tach said on his dash. it dropped the top speed in 4th but made the gearing such that he can use 5th now to get a higher top speed. I guess the alternative is to put the stock tires back on and see if the aero will allow a higher top speed in 4th and allows 5th to be used without lugging the engine down and slowing it down
@@kasuraga There's not much that can be done for the "gap" between 4 and 5. Maybe a solution would be to optimize for top speed in 4th with tire size and keep 5 for economy. But you only have 4 gears to accelerate. Alternatively you use even smaller tires and get higher rpm in 5th.
@@cmuller1441 Yeah that's what I was thinking too. But also, once it's turbo, it might be better to keep the gearing with the stock tires since the added power should help 4th pull along better, then 5th can be used for final acceleration to top speed and cruising.
The engine is likely heat soaking which would explain the power loss. If you put a hole in the aero mod for the intake air you will get way better power and lower egts. This bit will be very important for turbo charging as without the piston oilers and perhaps a oil cooler, you are going to want the air going in as cold as possible. Remember colder air going in give better power and fuel economy
Cold air does not improve fuel economy, it's the exact opposite. Google what a warm air intake is for example. Cold air slightly improves power and slightly decreased fuel economy.
@@swecreations it absolutely does because this engine is mechanical and burns the same amount of fuel no matter what. So when you give the engine more power potential, the less you are heavy on the throttle for acceleration and the faster you can get back to cruising.
It probably won't be much, if any, faster with the turbo. And the EGT will become lower if you actually get boost. Unless you increase the fuel to use the extra air that the turbo gives the engine. At work, we have a dyno where we do a bunch of shenanigans from time to time in between tuning customer cars. A colleague owns a Mercedes 164 with 5 Cylinder diesel engine and no turbo. Made about 115hp. We slapped a turbo on there, and it made 118hp with no other mods. But then we put a bunch of fuel to it by doing some electrical fiddling to the diesel pump, and with it came the black smoke, and a result of 185hp. :D Sure, EGT probably is pretty high, but a very nice increase in power with easy mods.
Years ago I had a girlfriend and helped her get a 1979 VW Rabbit diesel. Me and a buddy rolled to Springfield for business.......at 80 plus mph that thing got 52 mpg.
To verify if the aero-mods are improvements or not, you could use cotton/textile strings and a camera to see flow separation, turbolence, etc. A Pitot tube or Magnehelic gauge are a bit more expensive but obviously more accurate. Would be cool to see the data of lift and drag before and after mods
@@goosenotmaverick1156 Yes, it is. Julian Edgar has some great simple videos explaining it if you do not want to spend hours on textbooks, wiki and such.
Hey Jimbo, That was a fun video. You can fit a pressure guage to your fuel supply point at the pump, make sure you're not dropping fuel pressure at wide open throttle. That engine should be good for 1 Bar boost, it has a tough sub assembly. You can also safely go to 650 on the egt, but you may want to either intercool the boost or add water/meth injection...keep going !
Thanks! We have a new higher flow electric diesel fuel pump on its way. The pump we are currently using is rated for diesel but is very suspect... especially since it only cost $10.00. The new pump set us back a whole $23.99. If that dosnt help, we will put a pressure sensor on the line and see what is going on.
@@robotcantina8957 Do you have a restriction on the fuel return line? I'm not sure if these injection pumps have one built in, but is necessary on diesel engines. My only experience with these engines is on truck-mounted reefer units, and typically they're equipped with a fairly dinky transfer pump.
Its normal for a Diesel engine to have next to none exhaust heat at idle. Thats a huge problen when it comes to emissions. Thats why modern cars waste some diesel, by injecting it far to late into the powerstroke and so raising the EGT. If EGT get out of hand with the turbski, try adding a intercooler, or even injecting water or methanol into the charge air. Also, the intake header looks terrible, you might want to look into building a better flowing one and enlarging the intake ports in the head.
Try adding water meth when you go about installing the turbo. It will help drop charge temperatures and will also add more fuel into the system. Also that aero is probably a bad idea since you’re going to want that area and air flow for a intercooler. Like another viewer commented rig up a cool air intake, your power loss is most likely due to the engine breathing hot air. It’s not about how much boost you can cram into an engine but how much air density you can feed it.
For sure. And when he adds an intercooler, he can find a used intercooler off eBay for next to nothing. Something from a civic or a fiat 500 would be plenty small enough.
I bet removing the rear seat and front passengers' seat would be help for weight reduction. The best car to put the little diesel in would have been a late 1980's GEO Metro, they only weight 1650 pounds. But we use what we have for experiments. I like how you explain things as you go, it helps us who don't understand everything, understand. Thanks from Michigan.
Ive been looking at small diesel engines for my sand rail so i can use it with minimal to no electronics and if its under 700cc in my state, i can register the sand rail for the streets which is my primary goal for the buggy.
The transfer pump you are using is all the evidence you need of air bubbles in the fuel. Magnetic piston fuel pumps of that type are notorious for causing cavitation bubbles in fuel lines, especially with oil fuels like diesel. It’s a well known phenomenon in the self-installed diesel air heater community. Try mounting your pump on about a 25-45 degree angle with the outlet side up and the inlet side down. This is the first piece of advice given to anyone dealing with cavitation bubbles in a heater. I sincerely hope this helps. Thanks for reading my comment and thanks for all the great content. I have been watching since the insight first got a predator.
Exactly. He has space to spare, channeling the air would be better. He isn't going to hit 120mph, so a smooth undertray with some louvers as the exit would be ideal.
Highway tires with the least rolling resistance, smaller and lighter weight wheels, +15% recommended tire pressure. (Pre turbo) Intake piping to ram air intake, change intake manifold to 3 independent, long, and thinner? tubes. Possibly angle them greatly from the valves to increase turbulence pre-ignition. Someone mentioned lower oil viscosity but I imagine that will need a change of bearing clearance if you intend to change boost. You could get stiffer valve springs and get an increased RPM. Love your videos
Such a fun project to watch! We can't see what the exhaust is doing, but if you're giving it more fuel then it may also not be buring it completely. Maybe consider adding a propane injection when you get the turbo on? Thanks for sharing!
Actually those engines the smoke clears after rpm goes up cause their made without forced air induction and even adding a turbo with it stock no fuel screw would really help
The slight overspeed wont matter in a car because it won't spend prolonged periods of time at max rpm. It's an industrial engine designed for power applications like hydraulic pumps or generators where it sits at the set RPM for hours on end
I think you should use the insight wheels on the saturn to test if the lighter weight, combined with the wheel design could reduce drag and make it go faster! I just looked, and both sets of wheels should have a 4x100 bolt pattern with an offset range around 45. Who knows, maybe even a cardboard and duct tape mock up panel to copy the insight (rear wheel well panel) would help too!
I'm impressed with those numbers. Good as a VW TDI or little Saab TDI. Obviously, the recirculation of the exhaust gas will balance the increased KW Joules nicely. ✌️♥️👍👍 Maybe the drag at the rear should be red yarn tested with three or four 1 meter lengths across the trunk lid. In practice the yarn will likely not fly straight away but instead suck back into the low pressure drag ares created by removing the vortices extending wing. Good for a guy riding your tail on motorcycle but not for acceleration and fuel savings.
Come on turbo, we added a oil cooler with our mod on our old cummins, that was a good move. Might want to watch that oil temp. Have a wonderful week. God Bless
Well, here's my idea on engine performance-Maybe airflow to the engine compartment has been limited by the aero bumper cover and is causing hotter air or a restriction to air flowing into the rear mounted firewall air cleaner. I would like to see what a cooler air intake with more volume of fresh air available to it would do for the engine power. Plus it would be interesting to see a lip spoiler cut some of the air going under the vehicle since these are known for tremendously improving fuel economy and higher speeds. Just a thought though. Thanks for the entertainment.
Excellent progress Jimbo! Do I hear a bad wheel bearing? That is additional mechanical drag if so. Does the Saturn trans use atf or gear oil? If the latter, then a swap to GM Synchromesh oil will reduce drag further. Look forward to the turbo installation!
I took the spoiler off of mine because I liked the clean look without it better but it actually hurt my gas mileage a bit. More modern cars will have a little lip on the back of the trunk lid that would take the place of this spoiler for you. Manufacturers claim 1-3% increase in fuel efficiency from that, so it has to reduce drag significantly.
Also, yes on the cool exhaust. All diesels will run cool at idle, which is why it's not a good idea to try to warm up a diesel engine by idling it. You need to put it under load to heat it up. I'm not sure what the physics are that cause this phenomenon, but I learned this when I bought a medium truck with a 7.3l IDI International diesel. It was the same way. At idle after a cold start I could put my bare hands right on the exhaust even after 10 minutes of running.
I wouldn't worry about exhaust temps without the turbo, there's no way you could reasonably over-fuel that engine to get to a dangerous egt. the black smoke produced in over fuelling is literally unburned fuel. once you exceed 18:1 air fuel ratio, you're just making black smoke, not more heat. once you get the turbo on there and start burning lots more fuel, then you'll need to worry about egt burning valves up and melting pistons. normally turbo engines have a lower compression ratio than their n/a counterparts and this ratio is usually achieved by increasing the size of the combustion chamber. if that turbo is going to destroy the engine, it'll likely be caused by the high (for a super charged engine) compression ratio. as for the drop in performance I think it could be as simple as the engine bay air temperature, a cubic foot of cold air has more oxygen in it than warmer air. try plumbing the air intake through the bonnet or through your new air dam in front and see if that cures it.
2:00 That is 100% correct. It's a thing amongst older Jeep guys to take off the passenger mirror, because it's almost totally blocked by the windshield anyways
That little diesel sounds lovely, though I've always like the noise that 3 cylinder engines make. The fuel delivery on a turbo diesel should be matched to boost pressure, otherwise you'll still get smoke off boost. If you were keen I suppose you could use a servo or stepper to adjust the rack stop automatically if that is a problem.
My Mercedes OM603 turbo diesel had a little gizmo that adjusted the fuel according to the boost pressure. Obviously this Kubota engine doesn't have that, but you are correct and one could be fabricated with a stepper motor on the rack stop. This is kinda the plan, but the engine will have to come out of the car for that mod. In the meantime we will have to deal with a temporary over rich condition as the turbo spools up.
@@robotcantina8957 An interresting test would be how the engine runs with the turbo but the same tuning as it had without the turbo. The alternative used in cars will be kinda hard with this engine: Don't stomp down the go pedal from a start. But rather ease into it until you have boost. But yeah with this little power WOT is probably the only option to get this thing moving.
In my personal experiences with a kioti engine and I believe the same injector pump. Screw out until (while underload) you just start to see smoke then back in ¼-½ to achieve the max HP. Same applies to the turbo install, unfortunately with the kioti you actually run out of fuel adjustment before max HP can be achieved after a turbo install but the difference was WELL worth the effort. Kioti sxs's are lacking terribly in the bottom end for power.
I also thought about that, but for finding the best setting, you would need a dynamometer. I don´t know what diesel he uses, but the engine is probably already tuned really advanced for low grade diesel, so retarding might do the trick.
@@piotrcurious1131 could be pretty hard. To adjust injection timing you need to rotate the fuel pump in relation to the engine. There is plenty of force and any backlash would be bad
@@ReubenHorner As injector follows the cam, and there is adjustment screw allowing offsetting, one can merely install servo to change the offset following the cam angle. That means servo must do it fast, and ofc there will be wear&lubrication challenges, but for one-off experiment this can work and there are servos fast enough to do it without much sweat.
Having a 999cc turbo 3 cylinder gasser in my daily driver, I find this series quite intriguing. My brother has the same car I do but with the naturally aspirated 4 cylinder. We both have five speeds and the difference is very noticeable. His transmission has much shorter gearing and close ratios. Mine has much taller gears and significantly wider ratios which I assume is to give my turbo a chance to spool up and do something. I'm curious if the close ratio transmission is going to be a problem during acceleration once the little Kubota gets the Turbota.
The reason is because a turbo engine (even a smaller one than N/A) has a much more broad torque curve. You can happily make plenty of grunt at 2500rpm where na might have to rev to 3500.
Adding boost to a diesel is not the problem.....adding too much timing is the real problem. As long as the egts are in range, you'll be good. And put in some good oil ( Schaeffers or Lubrication Engineers )
I've seen a video (no site details because yt keeps deleting my comment) of kubota d902 (so almost the same) installed in a snowmobile and claimed to be able to make 80hp (but kept at 65-75hp). I think your engine is going to be just fine. :)
Cool exhaust with no load is common for diesels. Since they don't have a throttle, they're significantly more efficient at idling than gasoline engines. I have a VW TDI and it has a cool exhaust when idling too. The engine has glow plugs in the coolant lines to heat the coolant while idling because the engine won't generate heat while idling. For example, if you're trying to warm your car up. At least, it won't generate enough heat.
@Robotcantina Telegrams reached their peak popularity in the 1920s and 1930s when it was cheaper to send a telegram than to place a long distance telephone call. People would save money by using the word "stop" instead of periods to end sentences because punctuation was extra while the four character word was free. Telegrams were used to announce the first flight in 1903 and the start of World War I. During World War II, the sight of a Western Union courier was feared because the War Department, the precursor to the Department of Defense, used the company to notify families of the death of their loved ones serving in the military, Chayet said. With long distance rates dropping and different technologies for communicating evolving - including the internet - Western Union phased out couriers in the late 1960s and early 1970s. By the way what kind of prize are you talkin here?
@@ocdman202 The Model T was introduced to the world in 1908. Henry Ford wanted the Model T to be affordable, simple to operate, and durable. The vehicle was one of the first mass production vehicles, allowing Ford to achieve his aim of manufacturing the universal car. Telegrams went the way of the Model T..
The lights of the original Model T were not electric. The common lamps used on horse drawn vehicles were the lamps used on the Model T, this meant it used acetylene carbide headlights and oil side lamps. Electric lighting and electric starting became available for the Model T late in production during the 1920’s.
One thing that can help is lighter wheels. I’m sure those little steelies are pretty light but when it comes to rolling only a few pounds means a lot more. I’m sure you knew that though just wanna see some nice rims on the beast performance wise that this is
A small supercharger might be a better bet than a turbo. That fuel pump has no boost compensator so off boost will smoke and on boost will be lean - one or the other at least. A pd supercharger always gives pressure so its just a case of matching fuel to it and so long as there is enough capacity in the fuel system it should work well. The heat build up is more likely to do with cam and injection timing than too much stress at this point. Its set up to work at a low load so its optimised for that. I'm used to car pumps which almost all allow for injection timing adjustment but on yours it looks like you may have to dial the injector cam to get it to move. Looking at that picture - are those ball weights to adjust injector timing for rpm? If so and they're sprung you might be able to play with spring rates to get a gain.
Would the car go faster if you took the black covers off the bumper with the fuel adjustments? Sometimes blocking airflow like that makes a difference in aerodynamics too, and not in a good way.
man this channel is so charming. Just curious, are you getting weird harmonics with that engine or smaller wheels/tires? i hear some odd noise on your acceleration test.
@@robotcantina8957 I try to regard books as if they were like fish, “catch and release.” Once I’ve read a book, unless it is exceptionally special, I donate it to put it back out in the world for others to enjoy.
Some of these have already been said by others, but: Power loss might be due to warmer intake air temps from closing off the grille. (Also, worse aero can notably hurt near-top-speed acceleration.) Maybe could run a hose from the rectangle hole in the airdam to the engine intake? Removing that spoiler might make aero worse (that type of spoiler is probably catching airflow coming off the roof and helping it separate from the car cleanly). Blocking unnecessary air from going into the engine bay with that airdam is good, but a sharp 90-degree transition at the bottom of that airdam is not good for aero. An easy way to make that a nice smooth curve is to get a length of foam pipe insulation two or three inches in diameter; slice it in half lengthwise so it's a semicircle in shape, then glue it round side out to the airdam so the bottom edge of it lines up with the bottom edge of the airdam. So that from the side (with the car aiming to the right), a cross section would look like a lowercase b.
The spoiler helps with drag. It elevates the trunk and helps the flow to reattach. If you want to reduce drag further, look into making sharp separation edges on it and on the bumper.
There is a diagram of this car on the Ecomodder forums, thread #40628. The back of the car should taper like the Insight. The top of the spoiler is about 4" too low.
@@drippingwax even if it's too low, it will help. And there's nothing that says you can't modify it. Wool tufts will tell pretty much everything he needs to know.
Thanks for another interesting episode! That little Kubota is gonna go places :-) Wondering what new thrills and chills (or pitfalls) the turbo is going to bring. We'll see next Sunday :-)
12:10 Cold exhaust at idle. This is typical for a diesel. The excess air running through the cylinders keeps the engine cool. This is why idling a diesel for long periods is a bad thing as it leads to " Wet Stacking" / lots of carbon. Some gas engines during a cooling system failure shut down alternating injectors to limp home the car.
Mount motorcycle tires on the spare wheels! (idk if motorcycle tires are better durability than "temp spare tires", because they don't last much longer on a vehicle that weighs ~1/4 as much, with twice the tires)
Motorcycle tires on a motorcycle last 10.000, mayyyybe 20.000km. They're often really heavily tailored to offering great traction over life span or rolling resistance. It's the reason why some long distance riders mount car tires on their motorcycle. As long as you don't have to corner, it works fine. Motorcycle tires on a car? You'd shred them really quickly.
@@mfbfreak to quote a distance motorcycle tires last without knowing what the use or motorcycle isn't a good idea. IE: the front tire on my CB600 lasts almost 15k miles, the rear lasts just over 7k, but front & rear on my GL1100 last almost 20k, because the tire (compounds & tread pattern) are chosen for intended use, & they are ridden very differently. Also, one of my current projects is a homemade car with a goal of 1200lb curb weight, and I have spare wheels from a car for the front, with cruiser bike tires. I also have a solid front axle with -3+° of camber (lowest possible currently, depending on choices for SAI & caster), for the looks. (it's a ratrod hack of a Locost, because I can)
I heard that mirrors add 1% total drag. Eliminating them and having camera based rear and blind spot monitoring would save millions of barrels of oil a year.
![Stromae, Pomme - “Ma Meilleure Ennemie” (from Arcane Season 2) [Official Visualizer]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/1F3OGIFnW1k/mqdefault.jpg)
the fact the coolant isn't very warm on this engine stock is not necessarily a problem, since kubota likely designed it to operate under load as a stationary engine for very long periods of time, while being as thermodynamically efficient as possible, hence the cold exhaust manifold. by blocking off almost all the airflow to the engine bay with the airomods, the engine is likely now heat-soaking under heavy load, leading to your perceived power loss. additionally, without an oil cooler, the higher than stock RPM is probably getting the oil nice and toasty-you should probably be monitoring the temperature of that too.
Depends how you look at it - diesels are more economical when taking in slightly warmer air (although it will make more power with a cold feed). And it will be less efficient if it never reaches a suitable operating temperature due to 50mph air flow through the engine bay which it's not designed for.
Diesels don't like running too cold. If they're too far below operating temperature, they can't fully combust the fuel. If they're too hot, the intake air is less dense, and they lose power that way.
The mass air density is most likely a greater issue then the engine blocks thermal efficiency
This is funny, I have just said the same about over heating the oil.
you're absolutely right. the engine is from a trailer reefer unit, and its designed to run at a certain steady RPM constantly.
"It's not pretty, but it's, well, it's not pretty"
Brilliant 👏 👏 👏
It's the boot spoiler! Removing that cost you 3 seconds! :-) Everyone know's they make you go faster! I reckon adding a couple of stripes will knock another couple of seconds off!
Dang it, I forgot to paint racing strips on the car.... Thanks for the tip!
That and a loud stereo!
They do aid in aero. Well according to most RUclips videos on the subject anyway. Something about separating the boundary layer.
In all reality, the only thing left is to reduce the rear surface area, and a good strong edge to detach the laminar flow. Technically the spoiler was acting as the edge
Slap stickers add 5 hp
Alright, I'll pitch in now.
I own an 82 Isuzu I-Mark Diesel. .50 drag coefficient.
From the factory, it is equipped with a 51 horsepower, 72 lb-ft 1.8L engine.
On the tire size, from the factory, it was equipped with 155/70R13s. Those are difficult to come by where I am, so I run 175s.
I also run my tires at 40 PSI. I've been able to pull 62 MPG out of it.
0-60 takes 20 seconds. Fastest I've ever had that car on a test track was 94 MPH. Not kidding. Anyway, just figured I'd toss you that information to give you a base for what was commercially available.
I lovingly refer to it as the Angry Singer Sewing Machine. You can see it on my channel.
Aero engineer by education here, a couple of tips to consider:
1. The spoiler does actually help with aerodynamics. You probably don't need to put the big spoiler back on, but you can get the little plastic stick on spoilers, or even just cardboard/plastic board plus tape to help the air at the back to separate from the trunk. You just want the air to ramp up a little bit. If the air can "jump off" the spoiler ramp a bit, then it can rejoin the airflow easier and reduce drag.
2. Another cheap thing you can do is try adding vortex generators to the back of the roof, to help the airflow stick to the back window as it flows down. Something like you see on Subaru WRX's. This will also help guide the air into the spoiler.
If you want to crank the hillbilly aerodynamics up to eleven, you can add a full undertray and boat tail. The channel "think flight" has a small series about this for a better visual of what I mean.
Agree with you on all points. Vortex generators are however more complex than just sticking them on, they may just as well worsen aerodynamics just as much as they improve them if you don't calculate it correctly, so I'd personally skip them.
@@swecreations true, if you don't know what you're doing. It's probably something that's best done here by trial and error. Try with, try without, see what works best. I figured for how simple they are, and by copying other cars, it can probably get close enough
Thanks! We are getting some feedback on the rear spoiler and folks are saying something should be there in order to reduce drag. We will try a few options and see what works.
And funny enough, the RUclips channel called SuperfastMatt just uploaded a video about aerodynamic drag. He has a 1950 Jaguar that's been converted to electric (it's actually more aerodynamic driving it backwards that forwards), he scans the car and inputs the scan into a program that models the aerodynamics, and brings up the rear design of modern cars (that spoiler like lip on the trunk lid) that helps reduce the drag.
@@madmax2069 I just posted saying basically the same thing. I would imagine a lot of us here share similar RUclips habits.
Smokey yunick ran airplane tires on his high mpg car "hot vapor fiero" he built. Not sure why haven't researched. I saw it at the don garlits museum here in florida.
a small turbo with a few pounds of boost would solve every problem with speed, and make it so the car doesnt need to have crazy aero mods. Plus, turbos for diesels increase overall efficiency and can easily lead to more MPGs
Maybe a k03 turbo from an older audi / volkswagen turbo engine would do well... The inducer size on those is like 30mm so not too big for the baby sized engine
More fuel equals more heat only to the point that it will flow air. Controlling combustion temps is an art unto itself. Controlling the oil temperature is very important since that also helps control piston temps. The affect of piston oilers is not as great as most people think because oil is naturally being slung up against the bottom of the pistons anyway. Control intake air temp and oil temp and water temp and you find it much easier to control combustion temps. Increase the fuel until you need water injection to control combustion temps. Aluminum melts at 1000-1200 degrees if I remember correctly BUT just because your egt hits 1000 does not mean that's how hot your piston is. The constant cooling of the pistons from the skirts and the oil on the bottom of the piston keeps it much cooler. Keep that oil temp below 190F and it will work wonders to keep your piston the proper size.
On the bonus side the water injection gives a bit of a power boost you can feel in the seat of your pants.
My experience is via a GM 6.5 turbo diesel marine build in an old van with no intercooler. Just a "devil's own" water injection kit. Extra large oil cooler with auxiliary oil cooler. I've hit 1100 degrees with it climbing some mountain passes. I'm a chicken so I don't push it past that much. I've heard of guys pushing higher though.
If you want to gain 30% more power do the LPG (propane-butane) injection to the air intake. If you never heard of this, search for LPG-Diesel. Actually I have this system mounted in my 2.5 Audi A6 C5 and it is working great. Before I installed proper system, I was experimenting by just putting hose from camp gas tank into air intake,.You can try this for beginning :) (this is short term solution, because without heating system for gas, nozzle will froze after few minutes).
"putting the hose from camp gas tank into the air intake" otherwise known as red neck nitro XD
That's like discount Nitrous.
I don't think he can afford a new engine
LP fumigation tends to work far better with aspirated (turbo) diesels compared naturally aspirated. Not sure why though. Cost ratio, space to safely carry the LP is an issue though. Seem to recall most report that it tends to work best to use it mostly for hard work events like acceleration and long upgrades. Since you use it..... has this been your experience?
@@coachgeo it works better in conjunction with a turbo because lpg displaces air, but with a turbo that effect is negligible
The exhaust on my Cub Cadet with a D600 Kubota gets very hot. It has a stamped metal safety guard. Under heavy load it blows black smoke, 54" snow blade, chains and tractor tires. I use it to plow my drive way over on Fox road by MIchigan ave near your old stomping grounds. In cold weather the tractor runs very cool, the only time I see the temp gauge move is during summer. There were Cub Cadets that came with those diesels. The garden tractor pullers use a turbo from a European smart car, its 3 cylinder, and has the turbo built in to the manifold, you just need an adapter plate. The Military also had d722T on their generators.
Try putting the spoiler back on. Strange as it sounds it might actually cut drag in your case. IF The airflow stays attached going over the rear of the car that can increase the air pressure acting on the rear window which has the effect of pushing you forward slightly or at least pulling you backward less intensely. If you have a pitot tube and/or a magnahelic gauge laying around that you can measure air pressures you can do an a/b test on that or if not you could do tuft testing with some yarn to at least observe the airflow to see if you have a separation bubble
A low profile spoiler made from coroplast or some other flat material might be best
There is a diagram of this car on the Ecomodder forums, thread #40628.
The back of the car should taper like the Insight. The top of the spoiler is about 4" too low.
@@discontinuuity it's easy to go too far though and move backwards Without instrumentation you're just guessing. The slight upturn or small deck-lid spoiler to increase pressure on the window and counterintuitively, reduce drag, is the reason a lot of OEs have been doing it. Think the new Hyundai sonata, and every Tesla, among dozens of others.
Yeah see that spoiler is not probably efficient at breaking air flow from the back of the car. The back of the car is shaped such that you need a very clean and sudden break. Although it's probably better than no spoiler. You probably are actually creating a vacuum behind the car instead of what you want which is a vortex/low pressure bubble. It would be really good to just model the Saturn and run it through some cheap CFD.
The absolutely most efficient thing is obviously to never break air flow but that's just not possible with the shape of the car. You would need a long sloping tail
Absolutely this. I used to own one of these cars and when I painted it I shaved all the badges and removed the spoiler to get a cleaner look, which actually decreased my fuel mileage slightly. That little lip that you see on the back of the trunk lid on newer sedans fulfills the same purpose. This is why a pickup truck with a bed cover on it will get worse mpg too, because the tailgate acts as a spoiler, which counterintuitively decreases drag. A lot of research went into the aero on these S-series Saturns. They were some of the most slippery cars available at the time with a drag coefficient of between 0.29-0.32 depending on the model and year. I would do any aero mods one at a time because these cars were so good you may make it worse. Another thing is the little plastic pieces that go in the front to direct air to the radiator, along with the ones in the wheel wells. I removed those at one point too thinking lightening up the car would improve mpg and performance, but that also hurt mpg so I put them back on.
A little info on diesel egts, as you said there is no throttle for air so at low power times they'll run extremely lean which keeps the exhaust cool because there isn't enough energy in the fuel to make excessive heat, same reason for high idle switches for cold warm up.
With adding a turbo if you can keep it at that point of being lean enough to keep cool it should be very efficient.
Many people on the internet will argue this but if you add enough fuel you can keep the egts down as well, and get more power than lean cool.
Another option would be injecting straight methanol under boost, I would expect impressive results from that.
I would expect that lil engine to hold up to a decent amount of boost if you keep the egts down, don't turn up the timing, and keep the charge temp cool.
I wonder what effect covering the rear wheel wells like with the insight would have
plus entire underbelly
The front wheels can be partially covered too.
@@Oldsmobile69 hmmm you could put a bubble to cover entire thing, but hard to do from cardboard
Slower then a fiat 126 26hp with a 0-60mph in 47 sec😊
@@Aeros-tech because it's monster. In Poland we even towed with this thing.
The majority of small diesel equipment engines that are turbocharged are running low boost to help with widening the torque bulge and keep revs consistent when the load varies. Typically, manifold pressure is 4-6 psi so an intercooler is not really needed, nor are piston oil sprayers.....however, the majority of turbo Kubota's do utilize a water/oil cooler under the oil filter. An air/oil cooler would probably be easier to fabricate and would greatly help with engine/turbo longevity, especially when holding full throttle for long periods in top gear.
I'm afraid you might have blocked off air intake into engine, so it's possible that after some time of max throttle engine is starved of (cold) air, so maybe installing a cold air intake would work out, and since you have that area on bumper to cut, you don't have to ruin bonnet. Should slightly improve performance on high speed doubling as an inertia supercharger (air resistance in front push more air into engine)
Cheers, that's a good project and video, Thanks!
The pyrometer (exhaust gas temperature), is the best way to know just how a diesel engine is performing. you can figure as the exhaust temperature rises water temperature will rise along with it. there is some amount of over fueling that is acceptable. but if your smelling raw unburnt fuel then it's over fueling too much. a small puff of black smoke when shifting gears is acceptable. as long as that is the only smoke that is detected. there is a huge difference between turbo charged and naturally aspirated engines. and you want to have an intercooler with the turbo. but you will really have to keep an eye on the pyrometer. if the temperature rises too possibly nine hundred degrees for that engine. back out of the throttle and the will drop. and on both turbo charged and naturally aspirated engines you will want make sure the exhaust system is large enough diameter. it's important that diesels have free flowing exhaust. and don't ever shut off a turbo charged diesel with the pyrometer over six hundred degrees. I know this from many years of being an OTR truck driver and have ran a lot of turned up diesels.
I'd bet the spoiler did more for aero than you may think. I know all late model cars and trucks have a hangover lip off the truck or tailgate to smooth Eddy currents at the rear of the vehicle. That spoiler might have done just that.
Eddy current ?
Pff ha ha ha , what ?
@@Whateverpoopiepants For sure at 55 MPH!
@@Whateverpoopiepants You got me. Eddy current wasn't the right term. But you know what I'm getting at obviously. We'll just call it turbulence. I feel for you serious RUclipsrs. Dealing with trolls would be exhausting.
What you're thinking of is more or less the air 'sticking' to the sloping rear window for a bit before detaching. The trick is that ideally you'd have a long tapering tail like a bird. This is obviously impractical, but it turns out that if you end the car's shape abruptly the air detatches cleanly from the body and flows kind of like that long tail is there, reducing drag.
@@nerd1000ify There is a diagram of this car on the Ecomodder forums, thread #40628.
The back of the car should taper like the Insight. The top of the spoiler is about 4" too low.
Hey, I had a diesel swapped SL2 a few years ago. Aero mods on mine were blocking the front ducting with plastic removing the side view mirrors and having mirrors mounted inside the doors that could see outside. They were basically a convex mirror. Worked well.
And on the sedan at least the front lights were inset on the body. The lights were mounted on stand offs to ouch them out to be more level with the hood and front bumper. And finally the wheel covers were like the flat ones you see people running at bonneville. Car got about 90-100mpg when driven nicely. And even driven hard it was capable of 50-60mpg.
Fender skirts? Increased tire pressure? Air scoop enclosed directly to intake? Front campaign sign mod increases downforce, try moving top forward and bottom rearward, so it looks like an arrow shape from the side (reduces downforce, reduces drag)? Lower oil viscosity,? Water injection? Continued success! Thanks for the video!
removing the rear spoiler is actually counterproductive, you want turbulent air at the back of the car, and very smooth air at the front.
Looking forward to the turbo test! In theory, you’ll be wide open throttle less if you boost it, so your EGT’s shouldn’t be too insane. I’d get a gauge for oil temps just in case, and run an oil cooler with a thermostat.
How about a ram air intake for more high end speed before you install the turbo?
@@scox7760 I don’t think they’re going fast enough for a ram air intake to be doing much that’s effective. I think it makes 1psi per 100 MPH in clean air if it’s absolutely optimized. If they’re going 65 now, it might make .6psi if it was perfectly setup, which on a ~20hp engine might make .85HP more, and I doubt that would make much difference. A decent 7psi turbo setup would get it to make about 30HP, a bigger difference.
Surely diesels are always WOT, it’s only fueling that alters? That’s why their VE is good
@@garyhargreaves5630 that’s true, but they still do better with forced induction.
Oil cooler for sure
Donuts in the back, all aired up to 45 psi should give a couple mph. A little turbski should unlock 75 mph at least.
stop messing around and bolt on the turbo, I have this same engine and want to know what its capable of, lol. todays video answered a lot of questions I've had about the fuel enrichment screw, thanks.
on mechanical pumps the optimal pump setting is a little smoke at low rpm and clean burn near top, put a cold air intake because without the engine bay airflow the under hood temps might get really high and especially diesels need really cold air for best performance, if you run out of fuelpump you can raise the inlet pressure to the pump in mercedes mechanical pumps you can raise it from stock 1 bar to 2 bar without problems dont know how much you can raise it on that and if you still dont have enough fuel you can make a water/meth injection system and get a little bit more, pump timing makes a lot of difference especially at higher rpm, 800c egt temps shouldnt be a problem, i havent had any problems on my mercedes om603 without piston oil squirters, thank you for the great videos cant wait for the next one!😄
Possibly fuel supply shortage?
A turbo should lower EGT with the help of an intercooler.
Looks good so far Jimbo keep it going 🙂
Agree with fuel supply issue.
Seeing the engineering on all other videos I have no doubt you could add oil squirters to this engine. Tap into oil galley and just add them to stand alone rail inside block under rotating assembly. Honestly that would be simple compared to the other wizardry you have already done.
This sort of reminds when I was 9 or 10 years old , riding a Kubota on a rice/padi field in my village.... Never in a watever lifetime a YT content gonna kicked my memory into reverse 😁
WELL SORRY FOR THE CAPS AHEAD OF TIME , CANT SEE THE LITTLE LETTERS. BUT IM LOOKING FOR MORE VIDEOS AND HOPE THERE A LITTLE LONGE THEN THEY ARE NOW.... IM DOING A 4BT SWAP ON MY 2002 CHEVY S-10 4X4
skinnier wheels will indeed have less rolling resistance and provide less air resistance. You can also max out the pressures to whatever the sidewall allows. You can also try to cover the rear wheel wells.
he could also lower it, considering it does actually benefit aerodynamics slightly
He could also convert the wipers to 1 wiper that Parks in the straight up and down position in the middle of the screen. It's an old DTM racecar trick.
Probably not a good idea to max the pressure in the winter because once it heats up they're over pressure.
So recreate the Honda?
@@vasilis23456 well the max pressure is generally ~50psi and burst pressure is well over 200 in most cases. There's loads of safety margin on them, not like any tire manufacturer wants to expose themselves to undue liability.
I feel the poor gnomes were used to get an early bump in viewers, and now you probably made sure none can get in the shop. Poor little things. 😢
You don't need a wind tunnel, I'm sure a CFD company or a CFD engineer would be happy to help you model the car and run the *simulations*
I did an experiment on a VW Polo 1.4 TDi a few years back. Reduced weight by as much as possible, aerodynamic mods such as narrow tyres, closing off un-necessary ducts and removing anything that caused excessive drag. Had the engine slightly modified with a custom remap, a more free flowing exhaust. Can't remember exact figures but it achieved slightly over 100mpg and the performance was incredible
You should push the speed in 4th speed higher because it seems that the gearing makes the 5th very "long" for economy. When switching from 4th to 5th you go down to 2400rpm!
I think gearing down from the smaller tires pushes that shift point from 4th to 5th to around 50mph from what the tach said on his dash. it dropped the top speed in 4th but made the gearing such that he can use 5th now to get a higher top speed. I guess the alternative is to put the stock tires back on and see if the aero will allow a higher top speed in 4th and allows 5th to be used without lugging the engine down and slowing it down
@@kasuraga There's not much that can be done for the "gap" between 4 and 5. Maybe a solution would be to optimize for top speed in 4th with tire size and keep 5 for economy. But you only have 4 gears to accelerate. Alternatively you use even smaller tires and get higher rpm in 5th.
@@cmuller1441 Yeah that's what I was thinking too. But also, once it's turbo, it might be better to keep the gearing with the stock tires since the added power should help 4th pull along better, then 5th can be used for final acceleration to top speed and cruising.
@@kasuraga I agree. Optimizing it when you know that you'll have a different engine later is just a waste of time.
Can confirm a 26hp Kubota tractor engine has cool exhaust at idle, cooler yet in winter.
The engine is likely heat soaking which would explain the power loss. If you put a hole in the aero mod for the intake air you will get way better power and lower egts. This bit will be very important for turbo charging as without the piston oilers and perhaps a oil cooler, you are going to want the air going in as cold as possible. Remember colder air going in give better power and fuel economy
He may benefit from running a cold air intake pipe out to the front of the car. It'd get the air to the densest area and away from any heat.
@@americansmark plus if the flow of the intake is smooth he will basically gain some free horsepower above 30 mph.
Cold air does not improve fuel economy, it's the exact opposite. Google what a warm air intake is for example. Cold air slightly improves power and slightly decreased fuel economy.
@@swecreations he needs more top end power, so that is what he needs to do.
@@swecreations it absolutely does because this engine is mechanical and burns the same amount of fuel no matter what. So when you give the engine more power potential, the less you are heavy on the throttle for acceleration and the faster you can get back to cruising.
It probably won't be much, if any, faster with the turbo. And the EGT will become lower if you actually get boost. Unless you increase the fuel to use the extra air that the turbo gives the engine.
At work, we have a dyno where we do a bunch of shenanigans from time to time in between tuning customer cars. A colleague owns a Mercedes 164 with 5 Cylinder diesel engine and no turbo. Made about 115hp. We slapped a turbo on there, and it made 118hp with no other mods.
But then we put a bunch of fuel to it by doing some electrical fiddling to the diesel pump, and with it came the black smoke, and a result of 185hp. :D
Sure, EGT probably is pretty high, but a very nice increase in power with easy mods.
Needs a air dog 165gpm lift pump,125hp injectors and a 63mm turbo and it will be golden 🤣
Years ago I had a girlfriend and helped her get a 1979 VW Rabbit diesel. Me and a buddy rolled to Springfield for business.......at 80 plus mph that thing got 52 mpg.
To verify if the aero-mods are improvements or not, you could use cotton/textile strings and a camera to see flow separation, turbolence, etc.
A Pitot tube or Magnehelic gauge are a bit more expensive but obviously more accurate. Would be cool to see the data of lift and drag before and after mods
Magnahelic, isn't that the ones that meausre pressure differential? That could be cool
@@goosenotmaverick1156 Yes, it is. Julian Edgar has some great simple videos explaining it if you do not want to spend hours on textbooks, wiki and such.
tufts are great, they tell you a lot and they're just yarn and tape and whatever camera you already have
I commend the use of A-B-A testing. As much as I love the aero testing, he needs to figure out the power reduction, which is a confounding variable.
LOL a pitot coming off the front would be hilarious
The point on the end of the wing helps the wind "unstick" from the car
Hey Jimbo, That was a fun video. You can fit a pressure guage to your fuel supply point at the pump, make sure you're not dropping fuel pressure at wide open throttle.
That engine should be good for 1 Bar boost, it has a tough sub assembly. You can also safely go to 650 on the egt, but you may want to either intercool the boost or add water/meth injection...keep going !
Thanks! We have a new higher flow electric diesel fuel pump on its way. The pump we are currently using is rated for diesel but is very suspect... especially since it only cost $10.00. The new pump set us back a whole $23.99. If that dosnt help, we will put a pressure sensor on the line and see what is going on.
@@robotcantina8957 Do you have a restriction on the fuel return line? I'm not sure if these injection pumps have one built in, but is necessary on diesel engines. My only experience with these engines is on truck-mounted reefer units, and typically they're equipped with a fairly dinky transfer pump.
Its normal for a Diesel engine to have next to none exhaust heat at idle. Thats a huge problen when it comes to emissions. Thats why modern cars waste some diesel, by injecting it far to late into the powerstroke and so raising the EGT.
If EGT get out of hand with the turbski, try adding a intercooler, or even injecting water or methanol into the charge air.
Also, the intake header looks terrible, you might want to look into building a better flowing one and enlarging the intake ports in the head.
Try adding water meth when you go about installing the turbo. It will help drop charge temperatures and will also add more fuel into the system. Also that aero is probably a bad idea since you’re going to want that area and air flow for a intercooler. Like another viewer commented rig up a cool air intake, your power loss is most likely due to the engine breathing hot air. It’s not about how much boost you can cram into an engine but how much air density you can feed it.
Yup that the best way and you pick up power
For sure. And when he adds an intercooler, he can find a used intercooler off eBay for next to nothing. Something from a civic or a fiat 500 would be plenty small enough.
Mmm yes feed it some meth.
Either it will have limitless power, or it will get face tattoos and a prison sentence.
That intake using hot air from engine bay reducing power and short inlet reducing low end torque...
I bet removing the rear seat and front passengers' seat would be help for weight reduction. The best car to put the little diesel in would have been a late 1980's GEO Metro, they only weight 1650 pounds. But we use what we have for experiments. I like how you explain things as you go, it helps us who don't understand everything, understand. Thanks from Michigan.
Ive been looking at small diesel engines for my sand rail so i can use it with minimal to no electronics and if its under 700cc in my state, i can register the sand rail for the streets which is my primary goal for the buggy.
Or the metro older brother the chevy sprint 1470lbs but people want like $3,000 plus for them.
The transfer pump you are using is all the evidence you need of air bubbles in the fuel. Magnetic piston fuel pumps of that type are notorious for causing cavitation bubbles in fuel lines, especially with oil fuels like diesel. It’s a well known phenomenon in the self-installed diesel air heater community. Try mounting your pump on about a 25-45 degree angle with the outlet side up and the inlet side down. This is the first piece of advice given to anyone dealing with cavitation bubbles in a heater. I sincerely hope this helps. Thanks for reading my comment and thanks for all the great content. I have been watching since the insight first got a predator.
19:15 the aero mods made it WORSE. a flat panels on the front that you made offers MORE resistance than a hole
Exactly. He has space to spare, channeling the air would be better. He isn't going to hit 120mph, so a smooth undertray with some louvers as the exit would be ideal.
Highway tires with the least rolling resistance, smaller and lighter weight wheels, +15% recommended tire pressure.
(Pre turbo) Intake piping to ram air intake, change intake manifold to 3 independent, long, and thinner? tubes. Possibly angle them greatly from the valves to increase turbulence pre-ignition.
Someone mentioned lower oil viscosity but I imagine that will need a change of bearing clearance if you intend to change boost. You could get stiffer valve springs and get an increased RPM.
Love your videos
Such a fun project to watch! We can't see what the exhaust is doing, but if you're giving it more fuel then it may also not be buring it completely. Maybe consider adding a propane injection when you get the turbo on? Thanks for sharing!
Actually those engines the smoke clears after rpm goes up cause their made without forced air induction and even adding a turbo with it stock no fuel screw would really help
The slight overspeed wont matter in a car because it won't spend prolonged periods of time at max rpm. It's an industrial engine designed for power applications like hydraulic pumps or generators where it sits at the set RPM for hours on end
I think you should use the insight wheels on the saturn to test if the lighter weight, combined with the wheel design could reduce drag and make it go faster! I just looked, and both sets of wheels should have a 4x100 bolt pattern with an offset range around 45. Who knows, maybe even a cardboard and duct tape mock up panel to copy the insight (rear wheel well panel) would help too!
Great point!
That's funny, " The Jungle Site"..
( Reminds me of when I refer to their competitor, as " Fleabay") lol 🍺
I'm impressed with those numbers. Good as a VW TDI or little Saab TDI. Obviously, the recirculation of the exhaust gas will balance the increased KW Joules nicely. ✌️♥️👍👍
Maybe the drag at the rear should be red yarn tested with three or four 1 meter lengths across the trunk lid. In practice the yarn will likely not fly straight away but instead suck back into the low pressure drag ares created by removing the vortices extending wing. Good for a guy riding your tail on motorcycle but not for acceleration and fuel savings.
Pizza pans as hub caps for aerodynamic gains. It's a ecomiling thing. So is the passenger mirror delete with RV reverse camera as mirror.
You need one of those little English muffin sized turbos for that engine now
After putting a turbo on it taking the injectors out and putting bigger nozzles on them should really wake that motor up
Come on turbo, we added a oil cooler with our mod on our old cummins, that was a good move. Might want to watch that oil temp. Have a wonderful week. God Bless
Well, here's my idea on engine performance-Maybe airflow to the engine compartment has been limited by the aero bumper cover and is causing hotter air or a restriction to air flowing into the rear mounted firewall air cleaner.
I would like to see what a cooler air intake with more volume of fresh air available to it would do for the engine power. Plus it would be interesting to see a lip spoiler cut some of the air going under the vehicle since these are known for tremendously improving fuel economy and higher speeds.
Just a thought though.
Thanks for the entertainment.
Excellent progress Jimbo! Do I hear a bad wheel bearing? That is additional mechanical drag if so.
Does the Saturn trans use atf or gear oil? If the latter, then a swap to GM Synchromesh oil will reduce drag further.
Look forward to the turbo installation!
Im hearing the wheel bearing as well..
Lower front end lip would likely help.
I took the spoiler off of mine because I liked the clean look without it better but it actually hurt my gas mileage a bit. More modern cars will have a little lip on the back of the trunk lid that would take the place of this spoiler for you. Manufacturers claim 1-3% increase in fuel efficiency from that, so it has to reduce drag significantly.
Also, yes on the cool exhaust. All diesels will run cool at idle, which is why it's not a good idea to try to warm up a diesel engine by idling it. You need to put it under load to heat it up. I'm not sure what the physics are that cause this phenomenon, but I learned this when I bought a medium truck with a 7.3l IDI International diesel. It was the same way. At idle after a cold start I could put my bare hands right on the exhaust even after 10 minutes of running.
I wouldn't worry about exhaust temps without the turbo, there's no way you could reasonably over-fuel that engine to get to a dangerous egt. the black smoke produced in over fuelling is literally unburned fuel. once you exceed 18:1 air fuel ratio, you're just making black smoke, not more heat. once you get the turbo on there and start burning lots more fuel, then you'll need to worry about egt burning valves up and melting pistons. normally turbo engines have a lower compression ratio than their n/a counterparts and this ratio is usually achieved by increasing the size of the combustion chamber. if that turbo is going to destroy the engine, it'll likely be caused by the high (for a super charged engine) compression ratio.
as for the drop in performance I think it could be as simple as the engine bay air temperature, a cubic foot of cold air has more oxygen in it than warmer air. try plumbing the air intake through the bonnet or through your new air dam in front and see if that cures it.
also I would run an oversized intercooler with the turbo to "shrink" the air as much as possible!
Very Nice! Fun times had by all!
2:00 That is 100% correct. It's a thing amongst older Jeep guys to take off the passenger mirror, because it's almost totally blocked by the windshield anyways
That little diesel sounds lovely, though I've always like the noise that 3 cylinder engines make. The fuel delivery on a turbo diesel should be matched to boost pressure, otherwise you'll still get smoke off boost. If you were keen I suppose you could use a servo or stepper to adjust the rack stop automatically if that is a problem.
My Mercedes OM603 turbo diesel had a little gizmo that adjusted the fuel according to the boost pressure. Obviously this Kubota engine doesn't have that, but you are correct and one could be fabricated with a stepper motor on the rack stop. This is kinda the plan, but the engine will have to come out of the car for that mod. In the meantime we will have to deal with a temporary over rich condition as the turbo spools up.
@@robotcantina8957 An interresting test would be how the engine runs with the turbo but the same tuning as it had without the turbo.
The alternative used in cars will be kinda hard with this engine: Don't stomp down the go pedal from a start. But rather ease into it until you have boost. But yeah with this little power WOT is probably the only option to get this thing moving.
In my personal experiences with a kioti engine and I believe the same injector pump. Screw out until (while underload) you just start to see smoke then back in ¼-½ to achieve the max HP. Same applies to the turbo install, unfortunately with the kioti you actually run out of fuel adjustment before max HP can be achieved after a turbo install but the difference was WELL worth the effort. Kioti sxs's are lacking terribly in the bottom end for power.
Id recommend advancing the pump timing to make some power
I also thought about that, but for finding the best setting, you would need a dynamometer. I don´t know what diesel he uses, but the engine is probably already tuned really advanced for low grade diesel, so retarding might do the trick.
yeah, i would just watch because its not a dynamic adjustment, so setting it 15 degrees early may hurt the low end a lot and make it really smokey
@@ramentaryramblings actually it would be interesting to add Arduino with stepper or servo to adjust it on the fly
@@piotrcurious1131 could be pretty hard. To adjust injection timing you need to rotate the fuel pump in relation to the engine.
There is plenty of force and any backlash would be bad
@@ReubenHorner As injector follows the cam, and there is adjustment screw allowing offsetting, one can merely install servo to change the offset following the cam angle. That means servo must do it fast, and ofc there will be wear&lubrication challenges, but for one-off experiment this can work and there are servos fast enough to do it without much sweat.
I’ve heard in the past that those bug deflector help with aerodynamics but not sure at all
Having a 999cc turbo 3 cylinder gasser in my daily driver, I find this series quite intriguing. My brother has the same car I do but with the naturally aspirated 4 cylinder. We both have five speeds and the difference is very noticeable. His transmission has much shorter gearing and close ratios. Mine has much taller gears and significantly wider ratios which I assume is to give my turbo a chance to spool up and do something. I'm curious if the close ratio transmission is going to be a problem during acceleration once the little Kubota gets the Turbota.
The reason is because a turbo engine (even a smaller one than N/A) has a much more broad torque curve.
You can happily make plenty of grunt at 2500rpm where na might have to rev to 3500.
Adding boost to a diesel is not the problem.....adding too much timing is the real problem. As long as the egts are in range, you'll be good. And put in some good oil ( Schaeffers or Lubrication Engineers )
Very interesting stuff!!! Keep it coming!!
I've seen a video (no site details because yt keeps deleting my comment) of kubota d902 (so almost the same) installed in a snowmobile and claimed to be able to make 80hp (but kept at 65-75hp). I think your engine is going to be just fine. :)
You should have left the dirt, it added a low pressure zone causing the air to help push the car forward! Lol I can't wait to see more.
I'm so glad you write the metric values! It is warming up my heart!
it’s good to see another 18v makita impact driver up to no good on cars, at least i’m not the only one
Cool exhaust with no load is common for diesels. Since they don't have a throttle, they're significantly more efficient at idling than gasoline engines. I have a VW TDI and it has a cool exhaust when idling too. The engine has glow plugs in the coolant lines to heat the coolant while idling because the engine won't generate heat while idling. For example, if you're trying to warm your car up. At least, it won't generate enough heat.
Thanks for the info!
Why not remove a shim from the the injection pump to advance the timing. Might not be ideal once it is turbo though.
Thank you for zooming in and showing the heater core is plumbed to the bypass tube. Many thanks!
@Robotcantina Telegrams reached their peak popularity in the 1920s and 1930s when it was cheaper to send a telegram than to place a long distance telephone call. People would save money by using the word "stop" instead of periods to end sentences because punctuation was extra while the four character word was free.
Telegrams were used to announce the first flight in 1903 and the start of World War I. During World War II, the sight of a Western Union courier was feared because the War Department, the precursor to the Department of Defense, used the company to notify families of the death of their loved ones serving in the military, Chayet said.
With long distance rates dropping and different technologies for communicating evolving - including the internet - Western Union phased out couriers in the late 1960s and early 1970s. By the way what kind of prize are you talkin here?
@@ocdman202 The Model T was introduced to the world in 1908. Henry Ford wanted the Model T to be affordable, simple to operate, and durable. The vehicle was one of the first mass production vehicles, allowing Ford to achieve his aim of manufacturing the universal car. Telegrams went the way of the Model T..
The lights of the original Model T were not electric. The common lamps used on horse drawn vehicles were the lamps used on the Model T, this meant it used acetylene carbide headlights and oil side lamps. Electric lighting and electric starting became available for the Model T late in production during the 1920’s.
One thing that can help is lighter wheels. I’m sure those little steelies are pretty light but when it comes to rolling only a few pounds means a lot more. I’m sure you knew that though just wanna see some nice rims on the beast performance wise that this is
The rear wing, surprisingly, helps with aerodynamic drag.
See SuperFastMatt's latest video.
I just want to say thank you for converting those numbers for us, all metric folks out there. Keep up the good work!
A small supercharger might be a better bet than a turbo. That fuel pump has no boost compensator so off boost will smoke and on boost will be lean - one or the other at least. A pd supercharger always gives pressure so its just a case of matching fuel to it and so long as there is enough capacity in the fuel system it should work well.
The heat build up is more likely to do with cam and injection timing than too much stress at this point. Its set up to work at a low load so its optimised for that. I'm used to car pumps which almost all allow for injection timing adjustment but on yours it looks like you may have to dial the injector cam to get it to move. Looking at that picture - are those ball weights to adjust injector timing for rpm? If so and they're sprung you might be able to play with spring rates to get a gain.
I wonder if it’s a intake air temp issue that caused a reduction in power.
Would the car go faster if you took the black covers off the bumper with the fuel adjustments? Sometimes blocking airflow like that makes a difference in aerodynamics too, and not in a good way.
man this channel is so charming. Just curious, are you getting weird harmonics with that engine or smaller wheels/tires? i hear some odd noise on your acceleration test.
Sounds like the space saver spares making a ton of road noise.
Yes, there is a noise... the right side wheel bearing is failing. Good ears!
@@robotcantina8957 I try to regard books as if they were like fish, “catch and release.” Once I’ve read a book, unless it is exceptionally special, I donate it to put it back out in the world for others to enjoy.
Some of these have already been said by others, but:
Power loss might be due to warmer intake air temps from closing off the grille. (Also, worse aero can notably hurt near-top-speed acceleration.) Maybe could run a hose from the rectangle hole in the airdam to the engine intake?
Removing that spoiler might make aero worse (that type of spoiler is probably catching airflow coming off the roof and helping it separate from the car cleanly).
Blocking unnecessary air from going into the engine bay with that airdam is good, but a sharp 90-degree transition at the bottom of that airdam is not good for aero. An easy way to make that a nice smooth curve is to get a length of foam pipe insulation two or three inches in diameter; slice it in half lengthwise so it's a semicircle in shape, then glue it round side out to the airdam so the bottom edge of it lines up with the bottom edge of the airdam. So that from the side (with the car aiming to the right), a cross section would look like a lowercase b.
Looking forward to the turbo test. Diesels LOVE boost
Yup, turbo made diesel mainstream
Robot Cantina: Posts new D722 video
Me: Searching Craigslist/Marketplace for a junker to do the same.....
This would be interesting to run on the salt flats, probably do very well in a power/weight calculated division
I think the spoiler helps drag. It creates a better air separation edge than the curved trunk
The spoiler helps with drag. It elevates the trunk and helps the flow to reattach. If you want to reduce drag further, look into making sharp separation edges on it and on the bumper.
There is a diagram of this car on the Ecomodder forums, thread #40628.
The back of the car should taper like the Insight. The top of the spoiler is about 4" too low.
@@drippingwax even if it's too low, it will help. And there's nothing that says you can't modify it. Wool tufts will tell pretty much everything he needs to know.
@@drippingwax lol what diagram? That template? 🤣🤣🤣
@@heitorbernardes7977 Filling the wake is supposed to help.
@@drippingwax you don't use a template for this. You either test or use CFD to get an idea of how the wake is.
okay so long term veiwer here, you got me into electrical back in the day, always been into cars and now i think this is the best channel on yt.
Thanks for another interesting episode! That little Kubota is gonna go places :-) Wondering what new thrills and chills (or pitfalls) the turbo is going to bring. We'll see next Sunday :-)
Fun stuff as always. I'm excited for the turbo!
I thought I was having another stroke for a moment. SUSCRIBIRSE!! 🤣
12:10 Cold exhaust at idle. This is typical for a diesel. The excess air running through the cylinders keeps the engine cool. This is why idling a diesel for long periods is a bad thing as it leads to " Wet Stacking" / lots of carbon. Some gas engines during a cooling system failure shut down alternating injectors to limp home the car.
Mount motorcycle tires on the spare wheels!
(idk if motorcycle tires are better durability than "temp spare tires", because they don't last much longer on a vehicle that weighs ~1/4 as much, with twice the tires)
Motorcycle tires on a motorcycle last 10.000, mayyyybe 20.000km. They're often really heavily tailored to offering great traction over life span or rolling resistance. It's the reason why some long distance riders mount car tires on their motorcycle. As long as you don't have to corner, it works fine.
Motorcycle tires on a car? You'd shred them really quickly.
@@mfbfreak to quote a distance motorcycle tires last without knowing what the use or motorcycle isn't a good idea. IE: the front tire on my CB600 lasts almost 15k miles, the rear lasts just over 7k, but front & rear on my GL1100 last almost 20k, because the tire (compounds & tread pattern) are chosen for intended use, & they are ridden very differently.
Also, one of my current projects is a homemade car with a goal of 1200lb curb weight, and I have spare wheels from a car for the front, with cruiser bike tires. I also have a solid front axle with -3+° of camber (lowest possible currently, depending on choices for SAI & caster), for the looks.
(it's a ratrod hack of a Locost, because I can)
I heard that mirrors add 1% total drag. Eliminating them and having camera based rear and blind spot monitoring would save millions of barrels of oil a year.
good to see you’re doing better jimbo!! keep up the good work. highlight of my weekends
If under hood temps are higher from aero mods the air intake being warmer might reduce power a hair. Easily remedied by cold air intake.