Can Electric Cars Tow? We Max Out A Tesla Model X & Kill The Battery to Find Out! Adventure X Ep.1
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- Опубликовано: 2 окт 2024
- ( www.Transwest.c... ) Towing with a Tesla Model X is not as simple as you might think. With 4,500 pounds behind the Tesla we found range to be highly compromised. Just how far can you go while towing with a Tesla? We find out the hard way.
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#tesla #modelx #adventurex
Tesla should add a spot on their towing software where you input the towing weight to give you a more accurate range calculation.
I believe the main factor here is drag, more than weight
@Kristofer Olsson
Well said
@Zoltán Kárpát
Well, the speed can be predicted based on what the speed limit is. Other factors would be minimal (with the exclusion of shape).
It wouldn’t be a perfect fix, but it would make the estimate more accurate.
@@USUG0 weight plays a role but at higher speeds drag is by far the biggest factor. Drag is a function of area and velocity squared, so having that massive flat area pulls heavily on the car hurts, but going at higher speed makes it much worse.
As they reduced speed from 70 to 55 mph (21% less) they reduced drag by 38%.
I really considered getting a Model X but mainly because it costs 2x my yearly take-home pay, I decided to go for a Nissan Versa instead.
*"do I need to bring a generator?"*
-kent the tow truck guy
The funny part about that is you have to use an inverter and it has to be grounded to earth or else the computer wont take the charge. Even if you get that right it takes a lot of gas and a long time to charge a tesla with a generator.
@@christopherwilson9140: Since they were at a truck stop, there would be plenty of gas available for the generator.
"Sure, if you have a 350kW geny sitting around... connected to a Tesla supercharger." Even then, it would take several hours to fully charge.
LOL!
😂😂💯👏
Results are quite similar to your F-150 ecoboost test. It dropped from 24 mph to 8.7 mph on the same 66-mile, 70 mph test. That's 2.75 times the fuel to drag the trailer vs. empty.
Suddenly, 42 mpge doesn't seem quite so bad.
Conclusion: Trailers are a real drag. :)
@@loganholmberg2295 how many things do you tow over 150 miles? And on mountainous terrain no less. One single charge just before they started towing would have gotten them there easily.
Besides, they're not comparing an EV pickup truck to an ICE pickup truck. They should be reserving this test for when the Rivian, Tesla, and Ford EV pickups are out. A luxury SUV, whether electric or ICE, is not a pickup.
True, but you also have the battery capacity of 2 equivalent gallons of gas.. so
Towing any significant amount with anything except a diesel engine, is going to absolutely kill fuel efficiency.
Perforator2000 It will kill Diesel engine mpg just as much. The newer diesels get worse mpg with all the emissions requirements. They aren’t worth it anymore. Electric vehicles make even less sense.
Diesel engines lose a bit less efficiency than gasoline engines while pulling loads, unless I'm mistaken. It still decreases a lot, but not to the insane level seen with gasoline engines. The Tesla beats them all in terms of cost per mile and overall energy efficiency, but its usual efficiency and range seemed to be destroyed by this test, to the surprise of nobody. Like others have pointed out, they maxed out the weight and aerodynamic drag and drove 70 mph. The outside temperature was high and the internal temperature of the batteries was likely higher than optimal as well, making things worse. I'm surprised the car didn't need to stop and cool itself.
30% of the charge was consume just from playing with the dash 🤣
Why in the world are you towing at 70MPH? That is insane. No one should tow over 60 if they have any sense at all.
Was wondering the same. In Finland it's illegal to go over 50 mph if you are towing.
Your kidding, right? Drive the speed limit or stay off the highway. Come on Finland 50mph that’s ridiculous. Small countries do weird stuff
Reality in my state people towing 30 ft 5th wheels 70 -80 mph
Drive 55 to 60 mph on the interstate when the speed limit is 70 mph in high density areas and up to 80 mph in rural areas is dangerous.
And yet almost every pickup towing a trailer down I5 is running 70+....
Notice in some of the video even at the speeds they were running there was a huge line of cars backed up behind them? THAT's why they were towing at 70 mph. Because in the real world even here in CA where the towing limit may be 55, nobody actually drives that slow on the interstate.
Turning off the A/C was pointless, since it was a negligible percentage of the total consumption. Turning the windows down at speed was worse, due the to increase in drag.
Opening the windows creates a negligible amount of drag compare to an AC compressor.
@@user-tb7rn1il3q
Wrong! Engineers have debunked this myth.
@@Sig721Tau my expedition goes from like 15mpg to 11 12mpg with the ac on and cruise set at 70. I can cruise at 70 with the Windows opened and get 15 all day. Can't debunk real world numbers. My truck eats fuel with the ac on.
@@finerthingsinlife4494 Something is wrong with your truck then. Either that or it's horribly non-aero to begin with. It's almost always better to use the A/C on the highway as compared to rolling the windows down. This has been tested countless times and is backed up by the very engineers who designed these cars and trucks.
Okie Rider I am an engineer and can confirm Brian is right.
Mainly due to financial reasons, I'll never own a model X. BUT, I love these test videos.
You’ll get there soon Brother plus the prices of EVs will drop in the near future, 👍🏾👊🏾✌🏾🇳🇬🇺🇸
And I suspect the Tesla truck will cost about the same amount. If it costs only $60k I'm not sure most people with trucks will want to mess with this kind of nonsense. $75-90k maybe 1% of truck will buy. $90k+ maybe less than 0.5% will buy. Good luck Mr. Musk.
Tesla has only been profitable 2 mos but that didnt stop them from making cars yet so..
@@johnbradley2016 then how do they still exist. I wish I could be like that where I don't work and live in a mansion
Stephen Ferris $10+ Billion (yes with a “B”) in debt
Man you guys should have started the tow portion with full battery lol. This really shows how much further electric vehicles need to come for pickup trucks and towing.
but it alrady came this far even going one mile with that much is such a shock
Two guys in a tesla listening to elton john tiny dancer on repeat killed it.
Next time play AC/DC Thunder. It might help.
Don't judge us, axxhole 😂😂
whats wrong with tiny dancer?
Jackson Brown - Running on Empty, seems appropriate. ;-)
Or how about: Kind of a Drag - The Buckinghams
You guys really should have used a range mode from the start. In my EVs, I nearly always use a version of range/eco mode on the highway. It saves a ton on energy. It doesn't mean AC won't work, it just won't blast as cold or hard as auto mode.
@@carrollshelby8690 they used range mode for the last 30 miles, genius. Like they should have been for the entire test.
but muh instant acceleration
Who needs A/C?
Range mode might decrease watt usage but physics says it takes a certain number or horsepower to pull that trailer at a given speed, clearly at this time tesla isnt up to the task
32:12 I thought Andre went on a swearing rampage but it was just a truck in the background.
Andrew Automotive same 😂😂
Hahaha, I thought it was just me.
Haha i was like yup he lost it 😅
me to
Really enjoyed this video, but have they heard of spreadsheets?
Pretty awkward switching between Microsoft Word and a cell phone calculator. They should have someone make a MPG spreadsheet for them.
@@thedopplereffect00 The Excel icon was next to Word icon. Yet.
My Excel subscription was having a bad day :(
Excel uses waaaay too much battery - they would have been stranded.
@@matthewnelson5680 ROFL!
$14 for all that driving and towing!!! I'm impressed!!!!
Yeah, and they only had to buy an $86,000 vehicle to do it!
im not. it couldn't tow for more than 100 miles.
@@ElectronicsForFun it could, if they had a full charge to begin with.
That was to top it off at the start, they never showed how much it cost to do a full complete charge and even that was going to be limited to 80%.
@@andyharman3022 better off with a yukon diesel
I wager the Tesla cares less about the weight and more about the wind resistance coming from the trailer. When you look at the front end of that thing it's almost a giant sail. I would be interested to see you repeat the loop in a flat deck with the same amount of weight. Either way, towing really exposes how little energy batteries can actually store. The car seems to have no difficulty pulling, the trouble appears to be the capacity of the battery.
@aurelio milaor cabal Maybe you shouldn't tow with your Volkswagen then?
"towing really exposes how little energy batteries can actually store" I guess it depends on how you look at it... Cause a fully charged Model X battery has the capacity to power the average house for up to a week... That's a LOT of energy considering "average house" means using AC, microwaves, TVs, charging phones, lights, etc...
@@ghostthough7874 They have electric delivery truck/van in europe, they make them aerodynamic as they can and the batteries weigh literally a ton. They don't go 70 mph either. The storage just isn't there for electric power.
@@robertkubrick3738 I disagree since the Tesla Semi was successfully able to pull 75,000 LB for a range of 500 miles as recently proven. Here's a news article about it: electrek.co/2019/08/15/tesla-semi-electric-truck-exceeds-range-expectation-test-driver/
Tesla has the battery storage technology capable for long distance, heavy load hauling.
@@ghostthough7874 the amount of joules of energy available in the pack is equivalent to 2 gallons of gas. And ICE car wastes 90% as heat … so that 2 gallons doesn’t quite translate as 20 gallons but in real life I tell people a full Tesla is 1/2 to may 2/3 of a tank of gas in real world conditions .
Shame you didn’t fully recharge before taking the trailer tests. I think you’d have a more accurate comparison because the battery has lower power output as the battery discharges?
real world tests, you can't just charge 4 times during the day.
The energy content of 30 gallons of gasoline - a large gas tank - is 1000 kW hr. The Tesla battery is 100 kW hr, or equivalent to 3 gallons of gasoline. So, I think it performed pretty decently in this test.
Yup i agree. Even a gas f150/1500 gas engine would have been drinking fuel. Only issue here was limit access to charging vs gas stations.
@@joevsyou gasoline is super mainstream but tesla superchargers aren't that widespread
I think electric cars wont make sense until they have at least 4 times the energy density.
@Matter you realise they said halfway through the video lets just we can skip this charger? There are enough chargers at least in urban states.
Big difference is the typical ICE is only about 18-20% efficient at using that 1000Kw hr of energy, so you basically only have 180 - 200Kw hr of usable energy. The typical electric motor is 85% to 90% efficient. Also, you can't add gas back to the tank by using the brakes like you can with the Tesla battery.
I think you all discovered why the Telsa semi truck has been taking so long to develop and produce.
This is not the reason for the delay in the production of the Semi, Tesla always takes time to produce any vehicle.
It was another fictional car.
I worked at a place with a decent sized electric aircraft tug. It remained on the charger between uses, only driven a few miles between charges. It was very nice to drive due to its incredible and smooth pulling power. So I can see a use for an electric semi around yards and local deliveries even if the range is rather limited. Issue is if it can be used enough in a day, or has special capabilities to justify the cost.
And wait and see how many trucks are at the Loves, waiting for hours and hours to charge up. Hope the produce in their trailers stays fresh. And, where will the batteries be for the refrigeration units on the trailers be charged?? How many more trucks will be needed on the roads to haul the same weights of products, due to the weights of the batteries being added to the trucks and trailers?
@@jeffreytreleaven66 All those problems could be solved, all new advances need some time... Petrol/diesel engines needed a lot of research to be as good as you know nowadays... Not only Tesla, nobody can't make a heavy lorry fully electric in no time and make as good like a diesel truck
1 hour and 15 minutes vs 10 mins at a gas station. Tesla has a LONG way to go. Great video BTW!!!
Typically you woldn't charge to 100%. The battery charges WAY faster at a lower state of charge. If you only charge enough (plus a bit) to make it to the next convenient supercharger, you will save a lot of time. Its worth noting that on a day to day basis, you will typically charge at home, and don't have to spend any time at a charger, because it is always charged in the morning, superchargers are meant for road trips.
Fun fact, the Model 3, and the latest generation of supercharger can refill 75 miles of range in 5 minuets, and 175 in 15. Plenty enough to make it to your next pee break and do it again.
@@HappinessInSeconds is right @hyperXism, you just charge 10% to 80% and that can be around 30 minutes, so for many people it's 2.5 hours driving, 20 to 30 minutes break. The speed to charge goes up every couple of months, so soon enough, 200 miles driving, 15 minutes charge for a Tesla is going to be normal. A decent pace for most people doing long 600 mile days.
HyperXism actually they don’t. They’ve already come out with v3 chargers. The one that they were at was probably the first ones already made. The ones nowadays are 10X’s faster than that one. So if by long way you mean today, then that’s more accurate
A friend has a huge ICE pickup. He told me that on the highway without towing, his consumption was 12.6 litres/100km... but towing his travel trailer he was 36 litres/100km.... so lesson learned, towing reduces efficiency, plan accordingly.
I agree with the guy who asked to see pulling a standard 17- 19ft travel trailer. It's Summer, lots of people have travel trailers, not so many with horses.
a friend of mine has a '02 silverado with the big Vortec 8100. he can get 20mpg out of it unloaded and light on the throttle, but when he puts a trailer on it don't even bother asking, you might as well ask where the fuel gauge is at
I tow for a living. With a pick up truck and with my semi and I never do 70mph... it's so much less efficient than sticking to 65mph. You basically set the Tesla up for failure. Drop down to 65 and you could have kept the AC on the whole way to the charger.
I agree, in the UK I tow 1900kg and the speed limit is 60mph, plenty fast enough, especially if you suddenly have to stop!
Set up for failure? They only drove 65.7 miles, driving 65mph gets you what at best 100 miles range starting with the same battery percentage? Its not a great towing vehicle obviously.
Bad Beard Offroad this is exactly what I was thinking, it’s significantly higher when you’re going that fast.
@@practicalguy973 they drove 202.4 miles. 65.4 were towing under close to max load at 70mph. Which is a significant amount of force against a vehicle. Especially one pulling a horse trailer that sticks 4 feet over the top of it. They need to switch to a flatbed with the water ballasts on it for a more real world test.
The Tesla Model X is an SUV not a pick up truck. Yes it can tow but it is not designed for regular towing.
Towing a small boat, wave runner or other small trailer is more of what a SUV would be used for.
nah i've seen a few SUVs towed trailers like these with horses, i've even seen an old FJ40 towing a trailer with 2horses earlier this week..
I wonder if the extra motor (3 total) on the Tesla truck will help or hinder. The higher range will definitely help of course.
@@mtbse789 Part of the current Model X's inefficiency is that it uses two induction motors, so it never really has an opportunity to rely on a much more efficient permanent magnet or switched reluctance motor. Just look at the difference a single switched reluctance motor made for the Model S (Raven). All other things stayed the same, yet it saw a ~10% increase in range.
I can't resist another comment. Talking about mpge The EPA calculates that 33.7 kilowatt-hours of electricity is the equivalent to one gallon of gas. This is misleading as 33.7Kw is the TOTAL amount of energy estimated in a gallon of gas. But gas vehicles only use a portion of that for moving down the road, the rest is wasted as heat, friction and incomplete burning. So only 9Kw of energy is used from a gallon of gas to move down the road. So tesla 65.7 miles divided by 19.3 Kw used gives 3.36 Kw/mile. Truck getting 15 mpg for 65.7 miles would use 4.8 gallons * 9 Kw gallon for 43.2 Kw used or 1.52 Kw/mile. Or 3.04 Kw/mile for a 30mpg gas vehicle. So in reality the Tesla unloaded at 70mph is geting about 33mpg equivalent (good). HOW CAN THIS BE?!?!? Well you see in the real world you take a hunk of metal and move it a specific distance at a specific speed, it will always require the same energy to move it REGARDLESS of the engine used. Why do diesels seem to get better gas mileage? Because they are extracting a bit more energy from the gallon of fuel most likely. (side point): Since waste heat is one of the main losses in gas cars, it is easy to use that to heat cars in winter with little to no loss in mpg. Electric cars do not have this advantage and so battery drain is greatly increased to heat interior of car.
Imagine if they ran this test in the cold
This was extremely interesting yet frightening. Thank you so much TFL!
Right??? 👍🏾👊🏾✌🏾🇳🇬🇺🇸
David N I hope they can redo the test with a full charge and range mode on at 75 mph for one with significant road trip stretch. And one at 55 miles?
@@capn2289 yeah, the real fear is for electric car drivers who don't have a buddy with a truck and flatbed trailer nearby.
Who hasn't driven a gas or diesel vehicle with the needle close or at 'E"? That was the same feeling.
Frightening?? You need to get out more.
Thank You Everybody for All that you are doing for our Planet Earth.... Peace.. Shalom.. Salam.. Namaste
🙏🏻 😊 ✌ ☮ ❤ 🕊
For the Ike guntlet, tow the trailer there with the Ram Rebel, than it should have enough power to just do the grade, than tow the trailer back with the Ram.
@Quix ya buddy
I just don’t get it. Why are you putting the biggest empty trailer in back of this Tesla. Most people will put small trailer with some material or small boat. The consomption will be more realistic of what people do with model X. Nobody carry the biggest inefficient aerodynamic empty trailer for fun. 🤷🏻♂️
I'm sure there is nothing stopping you from doing this test yourself?
Maybe the point in using this trailer was to show a worst case scenario, not so much real world.
I believe it's because most other trailer towing tests they do use a very similar trailer, making it more apples to apples with the loaded weight and the vehicle itself being the only two variables.
The purpose of the test was to verify the manufacturer's claims regarding towing capacity. In the real world, people tow big, square campers or utility trailers that are much less aerodynamic than that v-nose trailer. Again - this is the real world, not a staged test to make the Tesla look good.
Michel Picard bluff body dynamics are a thing, not everything needs to be streamlined to have low drag
I’d like you tow a small tear drop camper trailer that is more aero dynamic and test the range. Doing some road trip camping with an EV is what I want to do and I think would appeal to a lot of EV viewers
@@loganholmberg2295 Shape is fine, its just too tall and wide.
@@loganholmberg2295 Back of the trailer is more important than the front. Not saying the wedge shape isn't helpful, but it's probably not as big of a deal as you'd think. That's why I look at the Aliner Ascape and laugh.
The best reported by Tesla owners (myself included) is an Airstream Bambi. I had a teardrop trailer and it was awful. Traded it for the Airstream.
@@anselmolastra Airstreams seem to be about the only trailer designed for great towing. I'm not shocked at all. Which teardrop did you have and what did it do poorly?
@@corystansbury I had a Little Guy Max. I'd say it cut the MX mileage to about 1/3 or normal. I was afraid to go 100 miles without charging. To be fair, it's a large teardrop. However, it's smaller than the 22' Bambi. The aerodynamics of the Max must be terrible.
So how many vehicles do you know that can tow 4500lbs and still get 42mpg????? Perfect vehicle for the weekend boater...
As long as the trip to the lake and back is less than 100 miles, and the boat ramp is flat ...
Get a diesel and do anything you want and get 20+ mpg all the time.
@@701chevy9 I own a diesel (2008 Duramax) I only get 20 mpg empty. Loaded with a 3000lb slide in camper I get 13-14 highway
Well, they did have to slow to 25 mph under the speed limit and shut the music and air conditioning off. Lol
Good luck when you are climbing a mountain with it
It is not the weight that is killing the efficiency. It is the drag and frontal area that is killing range.
Not to mention the speed. 90kph would help a lot with range.
BigSam 5349 bluff body dynamics ARE a thing. Not everything needs to be streamlined to have low drag
Exactly no one with a model x is going to be towing a horse trailer. While I love the video and the testing these guys do I would like to see a more realistic towing with a model x, like small utility trailer, trailer with motorcycle/dirt bike/4 wheeler, jetski or small camper or pop-up camper. That would give a more realistic range I can't imagine a trailer with jetski or motorcycle would effect range much unlike that huge horse trailer.
@@Jonb01z28 in Europe it wouldn't be that bad. I can't imagine towing a horse very far.
LOL, "frontal area", I need to work that into my life... "Suck my frontal area!"
Yeah, I'll keep my F-150 FX4 with 650 miles range. Gets me all the way from Houston to Destin, FL on one tank.
I guess I'm keeping my diesel for a while ...
trailer weight is not all that significant when compared with trailer drag. There's a reason RVers tend to drive 55 mph. They don't want to pay triple for fuel; double is bad enough at 55 mph.
shoulda told that to my parents when we took an RV on vacation. my stepdad was so obsessed with getting there quickly that he had no issue doing 80, I remember even passing a couple supercars on our way, of course they were only doing 70 though lol. made it in only 14 hours if curious Buffalo NY to just south of Jacksonville Florida
This is not about weight, but drag. Slow down, and you will be fine.
Tire rolling resistance increases as weight increases.
Best practice is to remain 55mph or lower. Drag is logarithmically increased with speed. That would be your main issue.
@@loganholmberg2295 Yeah, was kinda weird for me not being from the US. My towing experience was in 90's something Nissan Maxima. I found anything over 60mph totally destroyed consumption lol..
In California (the largest EV market in the US) if you tow a trailer the maximum speed limit is 55mph. I would like to see this test with the Airstream 22 foot single axle Bambi Sport.
Point of the video is can you replace a regular suv that can tow and drive the speed limit under load. The Model X frankly failed miserably. It couldn't do the 62 mile loop at even 5 mph under speed limit for one leg or well below at 55 for second. So formula is when towing large frontal load trailer, divide advertised range by 3.
@@reggiebuffat In the driving handbook it says 5mph over is the max you can go (legally) due to deviations In every vehicles speedometer
No, the main issue is that electric cars can't do as much work in a day as combustion cars.
That's probably why the Tesla Semi production date keeps getting push back silently.
The test prototypes haven't made it back yet.
Maybe. The numbers are supposed to be better though. It's going to be interesting to see the way the Tesla Semi is set up for towing.
It's going to need a LOT of battery unless it's just pulling light goods.
I wonder how many miles would be a good stop for charging compare to gas vehicle while towing?
Is it 200 or 300 miles for a regular truck?
They are saying 1kw per km on the semi, but it will also have model 3 motors which are more efficient compared to model x
Umm, still, 42 MPG while towing anything is pretty freaking amazing! Maybe always draft while towing. #GOELON #GOELON #GOELON #peace2u
I don like the Tesla, but 42mpg daaam...
@@YENKOGT What the H could be wrong with Tesla?!? It's got freaking F-35 quality computers running it, advanced safety quality & features that are impossible for anything ICE (ultra low center of gravity, brake pads last life of car, no fluids to ever change, play driving games while parked using the steering wheel & pedals, perfect weight distribution, etc, etc, etc) Don't hate on the ONE person (Elon) who gives a crap enough to over engineer everything to outlast everything else, and he's JUST getting started! ALL of the sniveling, whining, complaining for no reason hate-filled haters should be thanking him and supporting the entire "save the world because no one else in history gave a shit to make it happen" movement! #peace2u
@@StephenMattison66 holy shit man, you put all your life savings into Tesla stock?
You're off your meds if you think electric cars are going to save the world. Check that - you're off your meds.
I’m wondering how the re-gen braking will perform with 4000 pounds pushing it down the mountain...
It wouldn't make it to the top of Ike.
very good question, i wonder if the batteries will overheat??
42 mpg is entirely meaningless in the real-world. It's not a well to wheel efficiency rating, it's not a measure of time efficiency, it's not a measure of how economical it is.
The battery won't die or "brick" if the car stops due to lack of electricity. There is built in safeguards to make sure you can recharge the battery
So my 9 hour road trip with a Tesla will only take 12 hours . I’ll stick with my dinosaur juice for a while longer
Don't forget the inevitable fill ups, that 12 hours might be 13 if you factor that.
@@KristoferOlsson I don't know about other people, but the only time we stop to eat on a road trip is while towing, and that's at Truck stops 90% of the time so there is no charging points.
@@okigojuryu so just swap out supercharger sites for truck stops.
Trucks stop at truck stops because there is fuel and food. Teslas stop at superchargers for exactly the same reason.
Also with the new v3 superchargers a model 3 can add 200 miles of range in 20 min or less. Sure it is not the 450 miles in 15 min that I get in my sedan when I refuel, but given that I normally need to take a leak and stretch my legs too, my total stop time is normally around 30 min. So in 2 stops I get 900 miles range in an hour, in the model 3 that would be 600 miles range in an hour (but with 3 stops.)
So, an extra 30 min over 900 miles in the Tesla, not fantastic, but its it's hardly the end of the world for a journey I would do maybe once a year at most.
I should point out that I'm not some Tesla fanboy, I own a bog standard ICE sedan, Teslas are not available where I live and even if they were and I could afford an EV, I wouldn't buy a Tesla.
@@Chilukar I doubt one of those places are Trailer freindly, that and we don't eat EVERY SINGLE STOP, just maybe Either the first or last stop, and I doubt people will want to eat every 200 or so miles.
37:35 So let me get this straight. You guys were towing 5000 lbs and got an equivalent of 40 mpg and you’re surprised / disappointed? Not many cars can get that without towing so I’d say that’s pretty impressive.
The efficiency would improve significantly by dropping just 5 or 10mph. Over here we have a towing speed limit of 60, when towing at the limit I use significantly less fuel than towing at 70.
Yea but a 100 mile tank while towing followed by a 1-2 hour charge just to go another 100 miles. Tesla really needs to up the battery density to start being able to actually tow with these. I drive 90 miles round trip to work everyday typically always towing a trailer and our roads are 80mph here. I ordered a tesla truck but this really scared me from ever wanting to own one until they can get some better batteries in them.
@@RecreationCertified the truck would be great for your daily commute. It’s the 500 mile road trips with a trailer that worry me. If you do that 4 times a year or more you’d be living with a compromise for sure.
And they were over 30% over the rated weight.
They should have started off on a full charge and they should have been towing at 60-65 mph. It appears that a Tesla has about a 100 mile range towing, that is not too good. Ok for around town. The super chargers are not set up for a vehicle that is towing a trailer. Looks like Tesla has even more things to work on.
not really. not at all actually..
In terms of mileage, they weren't going all that far. If you have to leave your house with a full charge every time, that's seriously impractical. You don't have to do that in a gas powered car. I fill my gas tank once a week. That once refill takes 5 mins. There's a lot more preparation and having to think ahead and possibly screwing yourself should you forget to plug in at home with an electric car.
palebeachbum - you don’t forget to plug in when you own an EV, you pull up and plug in. Speaking from experience, except for long trips, over 300 or so miles, an EV owner never has to take 5 minutes to stop for gas. So over a year at 5 minutes a pop, an EV driver could save 4 hours a year in stopping. Obviously not the case if you drive on road trips. Plus driving a Tesla is way more fun than a regular car 😊
Sean Ryan- exept for when your in a hurry and end up having to wait 30min to drive. In a perfict world your math makes sense but in real life nope.
But that's not realistic. If you want to pickup a uhaul trailer, you'd have to drive from your home to the uhaul station to pickup the trailer. Unless the uhaul has been moved to your home so you can start with full charge at home. But that's the 2nd day, not the 1st day.
There was a Plugshare charger (Not Tesla) 8 miles away in Fort Lupton. You could have gone there. It doesn't charge as fast, but better than sweating the drive to a Tesla charger. Get the Plugshare app and Charge Point app. Another charger in Lochbuie 7 miles down I-76
70 mph is so inefficient to tow at .
David Macdonald 🤔 tell us wise one. What speed should they tow on the highway?
In most states the speed limit while towing is 55 and waaaaay more efficient
Keith Spencer are you an idiot or just an idiot sandwich?
You must be a child. Have you driven on a highway? No car truck or semi is going 55 mph or less on any highway. 70 is the low end. What you are suggesting is dangerously slow.
R P what he “suggests” is the law. www.doityourselfrv.com/state-towing-speeds/
70 mph is how fast they normally go. The efficiency of the given speed is besides the point. As long as they stay the same speed when comparing to other vehicles is what matters.
You should try this test when it's -20C out.
Yes, park it outside in the frigid winter cold overnight, and see how it does on a couple loops.
It would be finished at the first turnaround of the tow loop.
Cool max load video. Do some boats, jet skis or other common non-farm equipment please!
they can't, that stuff is too heavy.
I seen to much drama than normal, the people who buy a Model X I don't think gonna tow a horse trailer and if they do, probably gonna charge the battery complete before do the trip.
I saw you guys on 76! I wondered what the heck was going on with a slow tesla following a trailer, thought you were helping him tow or something...
Neat!
I saw them pulling this trailer on the north side of Boulder at Jay and 119. I thought it looked ridiculous, but figured "Eh, it's Boulder. Of course someone is towing horses with a Tesla."
Is there any other vehicle that could get 40+ MPG(e) towing that trailer? What is the next closest option? I understand the energy density makes range an issue, but I don't have a good perspective on towing efficiency.
I laughed so hard when Andre came out of that trailer with the Unicorn. I love these guys for their humor & efficient testing methods
Wow that last drafting @52mph even beat my i3 efficiency on a 5700+lbs SUV well done
So, should the driver of the electric car pay the driver of the gasoline car for half his gas cost? OH, come on, chip in a little for dinner!
If you haven’t “owned” a Tesla and experienced it for more than a test drive, any experience one cites is anecdotal.
You are not obliged to charge at a Tesla supercharger, just like you aren’t obliged to fuel up your ICE vehicle at Amoco. Tesla Bjorn did exactly what you demonstrated for a few years in Norway.
When Tesla chargers become scarce, you can charge up at third party chargers at 400v DC (350 km/hr charge rate) or slower 208v AC chargers (35 km/hr charge rate). There are many locations where destination chargers are available (@50 km/hr). No, not in Death Valley.
While the slower rate is far from ideal, it’s not much different than siphoning gas from a passer by. You have options. A dryer outlet, an oven outlet, an RV Park, your 110v standard house plug (@3 km/hr). While stupidly slow, it beats having no fuel at all.
If you must drive for a living, you probably aren’t Tesla’s demographic. The cars are very expensive, and even too expensive for most people. Just because there are dozens of RUclips channels about Tesla, and some RUclipsrs flaunt multiple units, this isn’t typical.
Sounds like an utter pain in the ass. People have lives to go about and business to take care of. Sweating over where to refill your vehicle is a thorn in the side.
palebeachbum While my response may make it seem onerous and a burden to keep figuring out where we need to charge, in practice, the Tesla computes that for you and will navigate you to the next charge point, and the next charge point in case the first suggestion isn’t convenient.
Tesla collects data, with your permission, that keeps track of state-of-charge of your vehicle and where you are with respect to a convenient charger. As the data rolls in, Tesla “learns” where chargers need to be built. It happens quite quickly.
These guys made it look like a project. It really isn’t. You need to “think different”. Or not think at all and go for the ride.
There are level 2 chargers in death valley. Not sure about Tesla I can't charge there.
@@AllanKobelansky If you don't want to 'think at all' (i.e. obsess over range anxiety) you don't want to fret over any EV, least of all a Tesla.
@@KristoferOlsson Ah yes, the old 'you must be stupid' response. Tired and sophomoric as it is, another scrap of twaddle thrown out to justify the idiocy of buying an EV.
The market has spoken...REPEATEDLY. If you're too dense to understand it, too arrogant to accept it, and too delusional to see it, you have no business judging someone else's intelligence or lack thereof.
You have a short window to enjoy your golf cart and throwback to the 1910s. I wouldn't waste that time trying to get others to make that same mistake.
So the conclusion is: towing with a Tesla asks for reasonable drivers using their brains. All in all not a drama.
Yes but the RUclips views!!!!!
How to completely solve their problem
1. Drive the speed the limit for towing of that vehicles weight and number of axles, 55 mph
2. Stop at the supercharger that they literally said they just want to skip
🤦♂️
logan holmberg Not if they stick to the right lane.
Tommy, Excel is your friend.
Tesla should make trailers that have a battery bank that you can plug into the car that would help range anxiety
Here's a guy that made a DYI prototype of that: ruclips.net/video/Qb7vg08zluQ/видео.html
That's an awesome idea!
@neepercreeper not for the environment
@@MCP647 and we keep working on that! facebook.com/EVTRex.1/
Should have had Kent bring a portable diesel generator to charge you up.
all about the aero dynamics lol, towing a box
Ayush Malpeddi bluff body dynamics ARE a thing. Just because something isn’t streamlined, that doesn’t mean it has a high drag
Its a V nose. Better then 90% of the trailers sold currently. Afterall, ive seen a videk of a minivan with a 4 banger pulling a 32ft enclose trailer flat nosed.
Plenty of range left at the end. I'm not sure why you guys were so worried.
Adam Cza $90k car and had to drive with NO AC when its 93+ degrees outside
They could have used the AC. Was a bunch of unnecessary drama and over reaction
He had 2% after he had it to the charger. That isnt alot not to mention he had to draft Andre
Nice use of hindsight there to question their concern.
I have ran my BMW I3 to zero miles and kept driving around my block until I was bored.
One of your best episodes, well done!!!
Huh, 42 MPGe makes the tesla while towing is about 4.9 times as efficient as a Gladiator? Sounds good to me... The real test is to see if you can go from charger to charger the way the Supercharger network is setup with max load. It might still be a nail biter though.
I ran a test case of towing from Denver to SLC on a better route planner using an 900 wh/mi assumption at 65 with tesla long range, and you can do it, but you have to charge to about 100% (takes about an hour it estimates) every time at the supercharger to make it thru wyoming, and there are a lot of extra stops, it would be pretty costly ($85) compared to driving without the tow ($20) that same route... But then, driving the Gladiator would be $63 without towing (assuming a real 22mpg highway) and $164 while towing (assuming the 8.5 mpg they got in the tow test) to do the same 560 mile route. so, still a lot more efficient!
more than about "efficiency" but reliability, easy of maintenance, safety, ease on the driver, etc etc. Tesla wins hands down.
uhhh... sorry to break it to you but MPG isn't MPGe also you can't change physics (the Gladiator is still like 1k LBS lighter).. sure EVs like Tesla is cool but they too expensive and isn't really made to do real work, maybe things would change in the future but for now its a no go if you plan to do this for a living.... but don't worry the F150EV is going to put to the test if EVs can tow or not for the near future..
42 MPGe is entirely meaningless in the real-world. It's not a well to wheel efficiency rating, it's not a measure of time efficiency, it's not a measure of the economics of it all.
no you all are wrong. "30 miles from the nearest Railhead"/port/Wal-Mart Distribution Center is all that's needed. most vehicles including semi-trucks just sit around all day. Tesla=HUGE WINNER
@@georgedoolittle9015 Teslas are some of the most unreliable vehicles in the industry. You're clearly smoking dope.
That low battery is my nightmare with an electric car. I can't stands my phone to be below 30%. I'd be a ball of nerves with the car being like this.
So in current electric suvs towing a brick at max weight would be better left to a internal combustion engine
Yep. You would probably be OK with a smaller trailer though. Bjorn Nyland seems to do fine towing in his model x all over the place.
So just horsey people excluded for now. Although I think they should be OK with the rivian when that comes out, the thing looks like a brick anyway and has like 600 mile range, you should get at least 300 miles towing a trailer in it.
@@Chilukar They could gave just gone a bit slower and they would have been fine too.
Greater than 42MPGe while towing -- you'll never get a gas- or Diesel-powered truck to get mileage that good while towing. And yet it still ripped through the battery like nobody's business. Couldn't have a clearer demonstration of the difference in energy-density between a battery and gasoline or Diesel fuel. Imagine if that battery had the same energy-density as fuel?! I don't know if battery technology will ever be that good... The internal combustion engine will be with us for a very long time, still -- definitely not everywhere, like it is today, but for certain specific applications, it will be here for many decades to come, no doubt.
1 gallon of gasoline is equivalent in potential thermal energy as 33.7 kWh of electricity. So the X with that 100 kWh battery had to do that whole test with a “fuel tank” that held the equivalent of 2.97 gallons of gasoline. It really is impressive how efficient those electric traction motors are.
The problem with ICE is that there is not much room for improvement, now for batteries it's totally different. This is why EV's are the future, not hydrogen cell, not ICE vehicles but EV's. 3 - 5 years it will be more evident...
Carlos Gómez Hydrogen Fuel Cell Stack powered vehicles are a type of EV.
EVs that are charged from a plug a known as Plug-In Electric Vehicles (PEV), this category is made up of Battery Electric Vehicles (BEV), and Plug-in Hybrid Electric Vehicles (PHEV).
FYI it's well documented the car has about 15-20 miles more range when the battery charge is at zero. Many youtube channels have tested out how long they can go before the car completely stops.
Yep, but with a trailer that drops to 5-6, and you really don't want to depend on it.
@@loganholmberg2295 agreed and when I pushed my 2006 F250 6.0 while towing our travel trailer, it ran out of fuel when it said it had 6 miles of range left. Prentice, not all Model X owners will be aware of all the "well documented" data to which you refer.
Whenever I do stupid stuff with my car I blame the manufacturer too
Pretty amazing! Show me another vehicle that gets 42 mpg while towing 6k pounds down the highway.
Who cares what the MPGe rating is? It tells us nothing about the well-wheel efficiency, and it's not safe to be driving 52 mph while semis blow past you at 70 mph, and it's not practical to be driving way out your way and be forced to wait for a battery to charge up.
LOL the problem is where the hell can you recharge it? With a regular truck, you can just fill up in minutes anywhere. I had a nissan xterra tow a trailer to drive maybe 30 miles or so used a lot of gas yes, but don't have to worry about finding charging station. And that charging station they went to was the last spot available.
I’m a lineman work on power lines customers have been telling me that they have been about $300-$500 more a month on power bills after buying Tesla but no more buying gas. So good news will keep me busy at work.
A lower trailor would have much much less drag and fit in the shadow of the model X no point carrying an empty trailor at max capacity
Conor Nugent 😂🤣 how many horse trailers are low? How is Tesla going to make a truck? This can’t go 50 miles towing an empty and quite light aluminum trailer.
People don't always tow low trailers
With a V nose trailer you reduce frontage by about 40%. The trailer is actually quite aerodynamic. Why have a tow vehicle that limits your choice of trailers to nothing an average person would want to use? What if they had a “travel trailer” in the weight range wanted? Some campers are a little more aerodynamic, but the kinds people really want to use are every bit as tall as this trailer. This test is very accurate. I am not getting a tow vehicle for 5,000 lbs and then having to limit my choice to very low slung and specifically aerodynamic trailers. I haul tall things, short things, all variety.
That said, the Tesla is NOT a reasonable tow vehicle. You go maybe 100 miles and sit at a charging station for two hours, another 100 miles and another two hours. Drive for 1.5 hrs sit for 2 hours (minimum). For my purposes???? It’s a paper weight.
No it’s not a paper weight it’s our future. Sit around and wait.
The Jackal Smith - I hear ya. Really, but I’m a rancher/farmer. I have tried electric motorcycles and quads. The range just isn’t there yet........ yet.
I use solar a lot on my farm. I have my personal shop with everything but a 220 welder, we have rebuilt and restored several trucks, and I maintain my personal vehicles, park 1 or 2 of my classic vehicles, heated in the winter, air conditioned (when in use) in the summer. Everything.
I live in Southern Alberta so we get temperatures from minus 35 to plus 35 Celsius (-35 to + 93 F) all on electricity.
I try, but I think even Rivian/Ford are going to struggle with towing for a few years yet. The killer is the recharge time. When working or like in my case farming, there is about 40 hours of work to do in every 24 hour day!! Hahaha
To the future!
Before continuing the video from the initial distance check, I did my own calculation based on a 1200lb trailer loaded up to 5000lbs and got an estimated distance of 302.5 miles for your trip, just based on change in mass. Add 20% more drag and you'd need a range of 363 miles to have finished your trip. Good thing you guys slowed down and turned off that A/C!
And this is what we call Range Anxiety. Helps to charge your vehicle before each test.
Very cool test .. good to see what the X can do even being push hard, one other test I would like to see is a towing test at the speed limit 55mph my area on high ways .. normally anyone towing tow at the speed limit .. still very good to see the results going 70+mph towing .. keep the cool test coming .. very good results .. also does other car manufacturers gives out brake controller? Or you buy it aftermarket?
LoL so amateur. Bjørn Naylan has towed a lot bigger trailer uphill and so pro. You need to call him for help to plan better.
The failures are intentional. Just look at their other videos. I wonder who is really funding these episodes..
Anyone else get nervous when Tommy backed into the charging station? I wasn't nervous at all on the battery level, but Tommy + Tesla + Reverse = intensity.
Somehow every Model X owner covers the top part of the windshield . Why have such a large glass if nobody wants them?
I love it, I don't cover it
Quite the opposite, it’s the best view and I love it. Especially love trips through forest , suspension bridges and cities. Where objects are towering above. The infrared and UV coating + tint they use made it comfy that I don’t usually need the sun shade even. And it’s sunny often in San Diego so that’s saying something.
Shade
Cool video guys. Keep up the good work.
May I suggest doing another tow test with a trailer that is a little more aerodynamic. Drag force increases by the square (x2). So when you double the speed, say 50 mph to 100 mph, the drag force is 4 times higher. Essentially it takes 4 times the power to double the speed. So dropping the vehicle speed from 70 mph to 60 mph actually reduces drag by 36%. (i.e. 70 squared = 4900 and 60 squared = 3600, and 49/36 = 1.36.
I would like to suggest trying a utility trailer loaded with steel or a boat trailer. I remember reading that the Honda Pilot could tow an extra 500 lbs if it was hooked up to a boat trailer.
DAMN lol 70 while towing? Isn’t it suppose to be 55 but I’ll do 70 to pass someone then cruise around 60-65
In Europe the limit in most contries with a trailer is usually MAX 50 mph .... - some have like 60 mph limit with traction control on a trailer and max. 6 yrs old tires on the trailer.... 70 mph with a trailer is completly illegal due to safety.
That is what I was thinking. 70mph is fast for towing and 55mph saves you SO much in gas/electricity when towing. Drag is a cube function, so it's saves a lot of energy to slow it down some.
@@ChainringTours Up to 50-60 mph drag does not affect the fuel consumption that much.
The safety speeds with trailer are made from different reasons. The trailer is very prone to do the shimmy moves over 60 mph or even at lower speeds when the weight distribution is incorrect. Also side winds or going downhill with too much speed can end in a ditch as the trailer pushes you downwards.
Going 70 could very easy end like this ruclips.net/video/klwaZrDkrpg/видео.html
In Texas the max speed limit is 70 unless posted other wise, which is usually about what I run, and for safety reasons i wouldn't run any slower
The posted regular speed limit is the limit while towing in the USA except for California where it’s 55mph.
When you add a trailer to a vehicle the speed limit becomes the truck limit. Driving 70 is actually breaking the law.
Im so glad people arent just ripping on electric cars in here. Hybrid and electric trucks are the future, the technology is evolving. Btw how much did it cost to charge from 2% compared to filling a 28gal tank?
I also think that tesla wasant really designed for long distance towing. It needs a bigger battery.
What's your time worth? 48 Gallons of diesel in under 10 minutes versus 3 hours. the choice is yours. Once they making battery charging as fast I'll consider an EV, the torque and efficiency of the motor is great. Wasting my time is not efficient.
@@realrvlife7964 that is a good point. I think you should be able to tow for at least 2 hrs and then recharge in 20 min. That almost falls in line with how often you should be taking breaks on a long trip. Also are you going to have to drop the trailer every time you pull into a port?
I think the logical next step for towing, hauling, and off road is hybrids and plugin hybrids. If I could just plug the camper or whatever else into the truck or SUVs power source instead of bringing a generator I think that would be really cool.
@@christopherwilson9140 Agreed. If thy can get something like that I think it would really help.
Best Tesla video I've seen so far on the tube. I'm surprised the speed limits when towing are so high though, in the UK it's 56mph for heavy trucks and 60mph for cars or pickups with trailers. Unfortunately I sometimes tow a twin axle car trailer and while a 4cyl diesel BMW can manage the weight, it can do it for 350 miles on a tank that takes 5 mins to replenish, I know I know, but super impractical to go electric currently.
Tommy is a drama queen! 🤣🤣🤣
Yes he is
Wow!! That's a lot of stress added to making a simple drive. Interesting seeing some real world testing with this technology. My take is it's not ready for prime time at this point. I don't imagine most people would like hanging around a hotel parking lot for close to three hours watching their car charge. That's a long boring fill-up!! I'm looking forward to the IKE pull !!
I'd say the moral of this test is drive a lot slower when towing ,to Save battery power.
Great video tho. Thanks for doing it.
Take care R
Kind of why the national speed limit for towing is 55mph.
Yeah, these guys are silly. 70mph is where drag starts to be a real problem.
Driving slower with a petrol fuel is equally beneficial, but most people are willing to sacrifice a big hit on fuel economy to save a (relatively) few minutes.
Moral of the story is buy a normal pick up
I think they forgot the horses in trailer. That definitely could kill the battery much worse. Nice work though..
I cannot wait for the Tesla Truck.
I can't afford one, but I'll be looking forward to your videos on it. Please tell us you'll pre-order one.
The Rivian will be much better.
Their suppose to be starting under $50,000. That's cheaper than most pickups on the road so you actually can afford one.
@@Pekirt79 "cheaper than most" you do realize the Ram 1500 Classic starts at $17K right? sure it's only a 2WD V6 but it'll tow the same trailer here no problem
@@cpufreak101 most, the ram is an exception.
i know that loves the joys of being a truck driver
I don't even tow at 70 with my diesel truck. What gives? seriously?
Do you tow in 75 zones?
I do run this route on a regular with a semi. Mileage is best at slower speeds. I don't understand why folks gripe about speed limits. Slower speeds are welcome on the highway and most hwy show the minimum limit of 45 mph.
@@MakingCentsInTrucking its almost like people enjoy the heavy trucks around them driving dangerously.
*Speed limit in the UK Towing is 60 mph on Motorways and Dual Carriageways.*
@@GrrMeister you are allowed to tow at 110kph in France which is close enough to 70. When I tried it my caravan started bouncing. I think that 70 might be okay for a little camping trailer but for a horse box or caravan it isn't really safe.
The dashboard display range is based on a calculated estimate based on driving experience. Since you’ve probably not driven the MX long-distance a lot, the estimate is a bit optimistic. This is discussed in the owners manual.
Did you have head/tail winds on the trip? Headwinds just eat battery capacity in a MX. I know this from experience, particularly last spring crossing Missouri & Kansas west-bound on I-70.
Lots of RUclipsrs have towed big loads with MX’s, and 900 - 1000 Wh/mile has been observed in these cases. Careful trip planning is needed, along with a CHAdeMO adapter to use those chargers to supplement Superchargers. This is how Bjorn Nilson has towed trailers with his MX for many thousands of miles in Norway. It is quite a technical feat that we have an electric vehicle that can safely tow 5000 lbs, but I don’t think it’s practical to do so long range on just Superchargers alone. Use A Better Route Planner and buy/borrow a CHAdeMO adapter before your next big towing attempt.
Thanks but towing in Europe is not like towing in America. There’s a reason they don’t have HD pickups in Europe. They don’t have the vast open areas that we have here. Lots of open space with no population and zero chargers. Bjorn’s experience does not translate to America.
And that my friends is why I will never buy a EV, don’t need more stress in my life!!! Awesome video!!!
Absolutely fantastic video guys!
But having to disconnect a trailer every time you recharge is going to prove really inconvenient, don’t you think?
Yep, towing at 70mph will do that. CA has a 55mph limit for towing vehicles, would have made it.
This is so strange as the trailer basically doubles the weight of the vehicle so by that account you would assume that the range would halve, but it actually fell to 1/3rd. Obviously there are a few reasons for this, number 1 aerodynamics of the trailer, the trailer brake due to it being a not regenerative brake so it is energy going to waste vs. regernerating. And finally friction, the friction in the neutral axels of the trailer and tire friction make up the rest.
Awesome job boys. Loved the video. Very entertaining. Thanks.
Try towing at 60mph not 70. Huge fuel or power savings.
I had to pop popcorn for this video.😮
I find the towing tests interesting, The only pointer I would give you guys is to talk more about the driving dynamics of how the vehicle tows. We already know that range will be a problem. An average truck holds 30+ gallons of fuel whereas a 90kw battery pack has the energy equivalent of only a hair over 3 gallons of gasoline. This is not news. What I would like to find out is how the vehicle actually handles the load when towing. Kind of like how you review other vehicles...
just drive slower.. it's the wind resistance sucking your battery dry
No!
also, for when ylu guys do Ike gauntlet, bring a generator with you that does 240V, charge it to full before ascending. the descent though, you can expect to make a bit of range back, the regen is quite strong, and this might be the first vehicle to do zero brake applications.
GREAT!!! all I need now is a V8 Hummer SUV to create drafting...
A lorry would work much better.
considering the electric pickup will likely have up to a 200 kilowatt pack it's not too bad. Though that the reason we're not getting it till the 2020's
You knew you wouldn't make it to Boulder at your turn around point. However had you continued 26 more miles on I76 you would have reached the Brush, CO Supercharger. You chose to push it instead. This is not the same decision that would have been made in a traditional car. You'd have topped off the tank. Same logic applies to electric vehicles. Don't make a poor decision to push the vehicle when a closer charging/fuel stop was available.
I enjoy your content but making the infrastructure seem worse than it is is a bit short sighted.
Using the built in navigation and perhaps adding abetterrouteplanner.com makes long distance travel, even when towing, really simple in an electric vehicle.
Going to the brush super charger would completely defeat the purpose of our efficiency LOOP wouldn’t it?
If you had topped off at Brush and then recorded the data from the Wiggens exit you'd get the same results. Without the perceived drama of range anxiety. Even doing the loop backwards, starting from the Brush supercharger would have been better. Slightly longer loop but the data would still be good.
There is even a Love's in Brush, CO around the corner from the Supercharger for the weigh in.
It just seems like you shorted the Tesla and could have shown a more likely real-world example of starting with a full tank and doing the efficiency loop. Unless you'd do the same thing and start a traditional truck off with the same handicap.
You wouldn't need a tow if you parked there trailer and drive to a charger. Also what other charges were around besides Tesla's?