Maybe the universe is the friends we made along the way P.s. This universe so grat n well get other spimoffs and 60% pf of story Only issue was got show s7 n 8😅😅😊
I've lost almost all hope but imo ASOIAF and especially it's characters are incredible even without an ending. It changed my life! I'll never regret falling in love with it.
I know I’m being foolish, but I still hold out a small amount of hope that he was writing winds of winter and a dream of spring at the same time. I know how ridiculous that sounds but a person can dream
I hope so but sorry unless he’s lying about his progress in blog posts the chance he’s writing ADoS is quite low. Arya hadn’t returned to Westeros yet in an update in 2021/2022.
I think that once WoW is out, the last book is already going to be set up and thus quicker to write. And even given how slow GRRM has been, I don't think it's going to take as long as more recent titles. I'm calling it here, Dream of Spring is gonna come out 4-5 years after WoW.
That's a great and optimistic point, but if George decides to write Dunk and Egg and Fire and Blood 2 before ADOS... then I don't think your estimate holds up
@@orlanswf Yeah, that's the thing isn't it? My estimate assumes that George get a hold of himself and stops working on 15 different side-projects at once.
@@MorgothBagluir We can never know what his work ethic is unless we literally watch what he does every single day. Yes, George is rather slow and his updates don't inspire faith. But for all we know, he could be driving himself mad trying to finish 3 separate novel series AND producing multiple different TV shows.
My main question is has GRRM told the sub writers and all the editors enough about what he plans the ending to be, and does he give them the legal right to finish the series. Don’t expect him to survive it. I want to know if he allows all the other editors to finish it
I think I remember heard somewhere that he has explicit said that he dont want anybody else finishing the story post mortum. Maybe that was a long time ago.
@@julioulloa5403 if I had millions of readers each dedicating hundreds or thousands to the world I created I would want to give them a payoff. Sure there's no contract. We don't have to read but it's still messed up he thinks that way.
@@jeffreyschueler2223 agree, shouldn't forget that the fans are the first that made him who he is, without the appreciation of his audiences his books would hsve never been what they are today
My guess is that even if we never get Dream, be it by Martin or some guy he allowed to work on his material with - that there will be a fanfiction that most fans see as definitive. It has just too big of a fanbase to just fade away incompleted.
Years ago, I'd say that the final book would be faster to finish, but not that I'm an published author, I can say for sure that the ending of a book is THE HARDEST part to write!!! Like, we have everything planned in mind to work with, but to put everything on paper in a way that makes sense, is badass/memorable and wrap up something somehow? Yeah, that's... And my book series has, like, nine stories being told in 12 POVs, including flashbacks and a couple of flashfowards here and there. I can't imagine how GRRM deals with more than double of this for decades 😅.
@@marcusappelberg369 It's two book series that I'm writing: Asas de Sangue (Wings of Blood) and Uma História Asas de Sangue (A Wings of Blood Story) 😄. One is about a world where vampires, angels and witches are preparing themselves to battle against demons, werewolves and fallen angels in the Apocalypse, after a vampire found the New Messiah and Lilith found the Antichrist. Like, finishing unresolved topics and making alliances. And other is a anthology series showing decades/centuries before the point where the main series started, each book focusing on a completely different event that defined its History, with only a few immortal ones from the main series that were alive back then appearing once in a while, and stuff 🤗. What about you, what's the name of your book, dude ^^?
@@RodrickMarsMoon That sounds interesting! My book is a Swedish fantasy novel, though I am translating it into English since the market for adult, Swedish fantasy is really small in Sweden. Most read crime or feelgood here. It is called Vinterkrig in Swedish, and will be called A Winter's War, if I decide so. It is about a woman who has to defend her city from an army of monsters in the middle of winter, and a youngest son who leads the people against his tyrannical father, as the king is dead and the country is about to be thrown into civil war. It is inspired by Scandinavian medieval history and culture as well as by books like ASOIAF and other epic fantasy.
I personally don't think he has ANY INTENTION of finishing this series. He's already been paid, new TV series, and , ending the GOM series on HBO effectively ended the series in his mind
I heard that GRRM asked his wife to burn his drafts if he dies before publishing them. If this is true, then it's becoming increasingly likely that we will never see A Dream of Spring, even though it seems that Winds of Winter will come out soon enough.
This ☝️ I can’t believe how many people, the author of this video included, talk about someone else finishing ASOIAF. The way Martin has set it up, it simply cannot happen for legal reasons 😢 Sure, you can’t prohibit someone to finish writing the series, but without legal “blessing” from Martin and no access to his drafts it won’t be considered anything more than fanfiction 🤷♀️
@@elliecat78, yeah, unless he changes his mind and appoints a creative successor. I can see this happening in case he doesn't die abruptly, but instead slowly loses the ability to write.
We are definitely getting winds and I hope that by the end of it everything falls into place to the point where the road to the finale is clear to him thus making a dream of spring easier to finish But we're definitely getting other books in between he said specifically that he put all his books on hold till he finishes winds so he definitely plans for stuff like fire and blood part 2 and maybe finish the hedge knight? Because it will definitely connect to the events of the final book
I just can't understand how he stated in 2016 that his finishing of the book was "months away" and that he'd already missed deadlines in 2015, there is no way you miss a deadline by 8 years plus if you are actually working on it. He's gotta be writing a dream of spring now and just revising winds of winter when he needs to, rather than releasing winds and then regretting certain things he'd put in winds when writing dream. This is the only thing I can see as an excuse without calling grrm a liar about his progress at that time.
I don't think "A Dream of Spring" will ever be released and I'm ok with that. I'll be happy with "Winds of Winter" and the awesome first five novels. It does bum me out but the series has brought me so much joy that I'm cool with it.
I think a lot will depend on what happens in Winds (assuming we actually even get that). If Winds legitimately wraps up a lot of plotlines and serves as the climax of the story, Dream shouldn't have too much trouble being the falling action where we see the consequences of Winds. If George continues to let the story get away from him though and Winds fails to consolidate the plot into something manageable, no way. It's also unfortunate that George has no de facto heir apparent to carry on the story from his notes, like Christopher Tolkien or Brian Herbert.
A Feast for Crows came out a mere 3 months after i was born, I am now less than 5 months away from being an adult, wild. I will honestly at this point be content with just at least getting TWoW.
Skepticism is for the existence of Bigfoot. Skepticism is for when your bud says they're sober enough to drive home. When it comes to your favorite author finishing a book that I KNOW you are excited about? Come on guys, BELIEVE IN SOMETHING! What's that? You say the chances of him finishing it are less than 50%? Great, well I think he's gonna finish it. If there were less than a 10% chance of him finishing the series, I'm still saying he's gonna finish it. I think he's gonna make it happen, and you know what? If he doesn't end up finishing the series I will be heartbroken, but at least I won't be walking around saying "I told you so"
Some of us have been hurt before. I started reading Wheel of Time when I was twelve and spent decades waiting for the ending. Then Robert Jordan died and it's only thanks to his widow and Brandon Sanderson that we got any sort of ending.
Zero shot lmao. Maaaaybe winds of winter. I have just embraced it. GRRM wrote amazing work and he still is, seems he just has new passion projects. Maybe in the future the rights are sold to a gifted author who works with GRRM’s team to finish the work he has written. He’s supposed to have 3/4ths of winds
I don’t know about marketing, but as someone with a background in publishing, editing the book should not take a whole year. That’s not how publishing houses work. Also books aren’t usually released for Christmas (that’s movies). The publishing year typically revolves around autumn and spring. Like how most of the other ASOIAF books have been released between August and November.
I'm have to stay positive but I do know it could go both ways, it's gonna be a close call but we gotta hope that George can finish his story even if Bran becomes king at the end lol. We also have to factor too that he's also been working on dunk and egg and his Targaryen history books as well
@Ashley of Naath thank you ash! As always I appreciate your support! Tbh idek if I want Bran to become king of the north or lord I'm cheering for jeyne for that role but it definitely would be more suiting than king of the 7 Kingdoms
That's why he will never finish this series, he can't focus on just one thing. and I don't see how he can wrap up the story in just 2 more books, i'd say he needs 3 to 4 books to finish it properly, but ofc that is never gonna happen.
George has enough money to hire a team of writers to help him write A Dream of Spring. He could have a writer's brainstorming session and then assign 20 or so writers to produce one or two draft chapters each. George can then edit the draft, write the bits he wants to write, and get it done in one to two years.
Most probably not but I still have that tiny speck of hope, I mean the guy’s rich on a first world country so unless his genetics betray him I see some ten years left at least, extra weight and all.
I think with Winds having at least 4 battles, it'll be easier to narrow the plot, if he ever planned to, or otherwise cut down some branches. Once George has written the climax, it'll be much easier to work toward an ending, since it's mostly shining a light on the aftermath. I think since George said to have done ¾, at worst he's now approaching the manuscripts for the climax of the series, which is a huge task
Honestly, i believe is way more possible we will read the end of this story, than say....having a cancelled netflix show be renewed for its final season (looking at you GLOW, damn). If its George alone who writtes it or not, is not really relevant. He already knows his end game, it will be his setup and words, for the most of it, i have no doubt. Meanwhile, i think is better to stop making the old master feel anxious everytime every fan talks about his death as a annoyance, like having weather move the date of a party. Its dumb, and really not decent. The work will have an ending, it will. Let the guy enjoy the accolades and work without the pressure of having to please so many people that will forget his face anyway, just weeks after reading the damn book (that is not good for anything). I for once am greatful to have found this author and read his awesome work. Good nite.
I hope he's secretly working on both simultaneously so he can drop winds then do a surprise announcement that a dream of spring is done and will drop 2 months after winds. That would blow er body away
Something I never understood. It's said that half the realm supported Daemon Waters' claim, but from the looks of things, most of the major houses (Arryns, Tullys, Lannisters, Tyrells, Martells) supported Daeron. Who were the houses who really through their weight behind Daeron, and did any of the great houses support him?
I truly believe that the 7 books of the main story will come out. He may not give us all of his planned Dunk and Egg short stories, but the main story will see the light of day.
This world is so complete I think it could be finished by other fantasy writers who get the whole horror creepshow he likes to insert - has inserted in the tale ALREADY. I'm a gardener too - in my garden, and I know you have to do some WEEDING at some point.
Without watching, my prediction is, the only end of the story we will get, is the one we got from HBO. As trash and unfulfilling as it was, just remember, George has had plenty of opportunities to do a better ending, but he is satisfied with it.
No, I don't think so. And that's fine. Not everything has to be finished, and there is more than enough already there for people to work their own ending out.
I think the big hard one to finish is Winds, if he can complete that one and his health holds he will be able to do Dream. Poor man, I feel for him. I am old myself and I feel the time crunch all the time. It is really frustrating to know you have things you want to accomplish but your physical body is weakening.
I think of George RR Martin the way I think of James Clavell. Clavell started writing novels in the early 1960s with his best selling semi-autobiographical King Rat. He wrote his first novel while trying to break in to the lucrative and glamorous film business. He later wrote Tai Pan, Shogun and Noble House. All of his novels were immensely successful and all were adapted to the big or small screen. He also directed a half dozen movies (including To Sir Withn Love starring Sydney Poitier) and wrote screenplays for hire. At some point Clavell started tying his books together as one big crossover series that was dubbed The Asian Saga. The last two novels were Whirlwind, a sequel to Noble House and Gai Jin, a prequel to Shogun and Tai-Pan. By this time Clavell was in his early 70s and was diagnosed with Cancer. He died in 1994 at the age of 73 of a stroke. My thought is that Clavell had a MAGNUM OPUS in him that he never got around to writing. He was anticipating the return of Hong Kong to China in 1998-1999, which would have been the perfect setting for a final novel to cap off his Asian Saga. But time caught up with him. I think time will catch up with George RR Martin, leaving us with an unfinished corpus of work. His interests in doing television and movies, and fleshing out his fictional world with prequel and side novels is just going to gobble up what precious time he has left on this planet without his finishing the novels for which he is best known and which will have assured his literary posterity. Leave it to literary historians to rifles through his belongings, looking for clues as to what he had in mind for Dream of Spring. From what I have been hearing, unlike Tolkien, he won't be leaving behind outlines for the last two books. He's a gardener, not an architect. He's more like F.Scott Fitzgerald, who left several unfinished works, like The Crack Up and The Last tycoon.
A tiny, optimistic part of me says... he's been writing this since 1991. With the finish line in sight, he'll find renewed motivation and Dream will be done much faster. But then I remember him saying how he wants to finish Fire & Blood 2 and the Dunk & Egg series first, among his TV projects. I feel for Patrick Rothfuss fans going through the same thing, at least he's only 50.
He will never. He never knew how his story would end and doesnt have the capacity to write something this big. He is a novella short story writer. Brilliant but he doesnt have the endurance or capacity to write a great story to conclusion
Ungrateful for what? He doesn't owe readers his writing? That's a toxic fan's mindset. Look at Patrick Rothfuss dealing with mental problems because of fan expectations. Undisciplined? GRRM continues to write many books (just not in the ASOIAF series). Unhealthy? Yeah... Very unhealthy. It's simply his writing style. He's a pantser who can't exactly end books in a smooth way. Take Tolkien. Many don't know Tolkien is a pantser. That guy kept editing his already published works. Like the Hobbit was edited when he changed the Ring into an evil object. Tolkien even wanted a massive rewrite of the Hobbit, but was stopped by his editors. That's kind of the problem of pantsers, or gardeners, using GRRM's terms.
I sort hope that George RR Martin works with writers on a Dream of Spring instead of writing the book himself, depending on his health condition. From what I can understand, he personally does not like that people speculate over his death when they talk about the book coming out. So I can imagine he might feel immense stress after Winds comes out to finish Spring, which could be bad for an older person's health. It would be bad for anyone's, truthfully. Having a team of writers for that book might take some pressure off him and get people to stop speculating about what will happen if he dies, because everyone will know the book will come out. I'm also guessing that he already feels stress to finish Winds, which has led to the book taking longer. Being pressured to actually create art of any kind can take away one's motivation, especially when someone's fanbase is so large.
I think that either GRRM is writing both the winds of winter and the dream of spring at the same time and will release them near enough at the same time, or will have quite a bit of a Dream of Spring written before he goes out and will end up like some of the lord of the rings books where someone will have to put the peaces together and releace it as an anthology of chapters rather than a complete book
@2:40 This is why you will NEVER see TWOW much less ADOS. Give up. Martin has been playing people for years. He is enjoying his retirement which, honestly, would be fine except for all the absolute BS he says about TWOW to maintain people's interest in him.
Yeah A dream of spring would be finished by someone else. I doubt someone can imitate George's unique writing style, which can be melancholy, brutal, glorious ..., all in the same page. Unfortunately.
GRRM said it himself, he will finish WoW and then go on to other projects. Seeing his age and how obees he is, it feels like a heartattack away from not finishing ADOS. I don't think he will ever finish it. Also he said he didn't want anyone fiinihsing the story after his death. If that isn't telling something then what does.
I don't believe George will ever finish the story. He is in his seventies, he is no in the best of health, and still haven't finished winds of winter. There is no way he is finishing this story plain and simple
George should focus on finishing his book series first and foremost. George has the rare opportunity of making huge history and be remembered as one of the great and spoken in the same manor as Tolkien and Laying a foundation of a huge franchise that will live on for ages. Or he can be remembered as the man who never finished any of his book series because he fancied making other things instead.
Haha I am slowly regretting I let the show put me in this obsessive state over this world I’m so invested in the books I’ve basically completely abandoned the show and the books are my head canon for the story I kinda look at AGOT S5-S8 is “Dan Fic”😉 And everything else(1-4) is a just visual adaptation of the first 2-3 books in a big mereneese knot
He distinguishes between writers who plan and those who proceed more “organically.” He says he is the latter. Let me translate: he has only a vague idea of where this is going and almost no idea of how to get there. Moreover, he clearly enjoins the TV process and his high level role more than he likes writing. If he finishes the series, and it is a letdown, all the side projects might come to a crashing halt. Without finishing the series, any disappointments (like the end of the TV series) can be blamed on someone else. Other side projects can continue and the money can keep rolling in. Thus, even if he finishes or comes close to finishing the books, we aren’t going to see the last book until after he’s dead. We will almost certainly see it in some form thereafter. Releasing it earlier could kill the goose that lays the golden eggs.
I haven’t even watched the video but the answers NO. I’m starting to doubt we are getting winds, I love these books so much, it really sucks coming to that realization. So that means well have an absolutely horrible mess that Dave and Dan called an ending and we’ll have NO ending in book, how depressing is that? Lol
i think he needs to get a writer with a similar writing stiyle to help him finish AWOW and after he probably passes on for the other writer to finish ADOS kinda like with Christopher Tolkien and Brian Herbert. like George needs to write out his plan for the end of the story and give it to some author after he dies
I have started reading Song of Ice and Fire, and nearly finished book one. I will definitely be carrying on with the series but I don't think it will be finished because of his age. This must be causing him loads of stress.
Enjoy the unplanned double upload lmao! Oops no video saturday since that video got uploaded today instead!
I'm slowly starting to regret that I fell in love with this world.
Maybe the universe is the friends we made along the way
P.s. This universe so grat n well get other spimoffs and 60% pf of story
Only issue was got show s7 n 8😅😅😊
The heartache of the Red Wedding and putting that book down to just start over again and again and again...
Is not the end goal, but the journey. Regret nothing.
Yep
I've lost almost all hope but imo ASOIAF and especially it's characters are incredible even without an ending. It changed my life! I'll never regret falling in love with it.
I know I’m being foolish, but I still hold out a small amount of hope that he was writing winds of winter and a dream of spring at the same time. I know how ridiculous that sounds but a person can dream
It would be a good excuse to why he's taking so long .
It doesn't sound so ridiculous. I know I've had that thought myself too.
A person can dream… of Spring 😂
I’m a pessimist, but I admire people like you. You give a grumpy cynic like me some hope ❤
I hope so but sorry unless he’s lying about his progress in blog posts the chance he’s writing ADoS is quite low. Arya hadn’t returned to Westeros yet in an update in 2021/2022.
Dream of a Sixth Book, followed by Crazier Dream of a Seventh Book
The real Dream of Spring is the friends we made on the way
''I am the Song of Ice and Fire'' 😮
taking 11 minutes to say "fuck no" is wild my guy
I think that once WoW is out, the last book is already going to be set up and thus quicker to write. And even given how slow GRRM has been, I don't think it's going to take as long as more recent titles.
I'm calling it here, Dream of Spring is gonna come out 4-5 years after WoW.
That's a great and optimistic point, but if George decides to write Dunk and Egg and Fire and Blood 2 before ADOS... then I don't think your estimate holds up
@@orlanswf Yeah, that's the thing isn't it? My estimate assumes that George get a hold of himself and stops working on 15 different side-projects at once.
@@Bioguy5 to be fair if he didn't help work on the side projects they probably wouldn't be good
@@Bioguy5 He doesn't have work ethics, that is why he will fail and never finish ASOIAF
@@MorgothBagluir We can never know what his work ethic is unless we literally watch what he does every single day.
Yes, George is rather slow and his updates don't inspire faith. But for all we know, he could be driving himself mad trying to finish 3 separate novel series AND producing multiple different TV shows.
As long as G.R.R. Martin lives, there is hope. Depending on the situation, maybe he should employ a ghost writer.
or mentor someone or a group of people
My main question is has GRRM told the sub writers and all the editors enough about what he plans the ending to be, and does he give them the legal right to finish the series. Don’t expect him to survive it. I want to know if he allows all the other editors to finish it
I think I remember heard somewhere that he has explicit said that he dont want anybody else finishing the story post mortum. Maybe that was a long time ago.
@@julioulloa5403 if that's true it's kind of messed up. He's kind of disregarding his obligation to give the fans an ending.
@@jeffreyschueler2223 i do remember reading that he said "authors dont have obligations to readers"
@@julioulloa5403 if I had millions of readers each dedicating hundreds or thousands to the world I created I would want to give them a payoff. Sure there's no contract. We don't have to read but it's still messed up he thinks that way.
@@jeffreyschueler2223 agree, shouldn't forget that the fans are the first that made him who he is, without the appreciation of his audiences his books would hsve never been what they are today
My guess is that even if we never get Dream, be it by Martin or some guy he allowed to work on his material with - that there will be a fanfiction that most fans see as definitive. It has just too big of a fanbase to just fade away incompleted.
Years ago, I'd say that the final book would be faster to finish, but not that I'm an published author, I can say for sure that the ending of a book is THE HARDEST part to write!!!
Like, we have everything planned in mind to work with, but to put everything on paper in a way that makes sense, is badass/memorable and wrap up something somehow? Yeah, that's... And my book series has, like, nine stories being told in 12 POVs, including flashbacks and a couple of flashfowards here and there.
I can't imagine how GRRM deals with more than double of this for decades 😅.
Your story sounds complicated in its own right too. 😊 I am also a published author so I know what you mean. What is your book called?
@@marcusappelberg369 It's two book series that I'm writing: Asas de Sangue (Wings of Blood) and Uma História Asas de Sangue (A Wings of Blood Story) 😄.
One is about a world where vampires, angels and witches are preparing themselves to battle against demons, werewolves and fallen angels in the Apocalypse, after a vampire found the New Messiah and Lilith found the Antichrist. Like, finishing unresolved topics and making alliances.
And other is a anthology series showing decades/centuries before the point where the main series started, each book focusing on a completely different event that defined its History, with only a few immortal ones from the main series that were alive back then appearing once in a while, and stuff 🤗.
What about you, what's the name of your book, dude ^^?
@@RodrickMarsMoon That sounds interesting! My book is a Swedish fantasy novel, though I am translating it into English since the market for adult, Swedish fantasy is really small in Sweden. Most read crime or feelgood here. It is called Vinterkrig in Swedish, and will be called A Winter's War, if I decide so. It is about a woman who has to defend her city from an army of monsters in the middle of winter, and a youngest son who leads the people against his tyrannical father, as the king is dead and the country is about to be thrown into civil war. It is inspired by Scandinavian medieval history and culture as well as by books like ASOIAF and other epic fantasy.
@@marcusappelberg369 Sounds like a great premise; I even noted the title here, to take a look when it gets published 🤔🤗.
Honestly i don't think he'll even finish Winds
I personally don't think he has ANY INTENTION of finishing this series. He's already been paid, new TV series, and , ending the GOM series on HBO effectively ended the series in his mind
short answer: no (unless he's cleverly writing both Winds & Dream at the same time)
GRR MARTIN HAS LET US DOWN VERY BADLY
I've made my peace that this story will never have a conclusion.
I heard that GRRM asked his wife to burn his drafts if he dies before publishing them. If this is true, then it's becoming increasingly likely that we will never see A Dream of Spring, even though it seems that Winds of Winter will come out soon enough.
This ☝️
I can’t believe how many people, the author of this video included, talk about someone else finishing ASOIAF. The way Martin has set it up, it simply cannot happen for legal reasons 😢 Sure, you can’t prohibit someone to finish writing the series, but without legal “blessing” from Martin and no access to his drafts it won’t be considered anything more than fanfiction 🤷♀️
@@elliecat78, yeah, unless he changes his mind and appoints a creative successor. I can see this happening in case he doesn't die abruptly, but instead slowly loses the ability to write.
He never said that. If he did the deep fandom would be talking about it all the time. What you heard is just a rumor
It could still be finished even if she does this.
I doubt he'll finish A Dream of Spring. He'll finish Winds.
don't think he will finish winds or dream of spring 1 cannot work without the other hopeful obviously that he finish both but doubtful
As long as they keep pumping out HBO spin-offs he won’t write another page as far as I see it
We are definitely getting winds and I hope that by the end of it everything falls into place to the point where the road to the finale is clear to him thus making a dream of spring easier to finish
But we're definitely getting other books in between he said specifically that he put all his books on hold till he finishes winds so he definitely plans for stuff like fire and blood part 2 and maybe finish the hedge knight? Because it will definitely connect to the events of the final book
He’s gonna die before he finishes it. Ghost writer confirmed.
It's simply pressure, the pressure of wrapping up the greatest Book series of all time, i'd be hyperventilating if i were in that position
Yes exactly. He said something like that in a recent interview. That he questions his wife on where his talent went
@@marcusappelberg369 Where did he say that? Do you possibly have a link to that interview
It won’t be the greatest book series if he doesn’t finish it. It’ll be a ‘it could have been one of the greatest’.
"Dream of Spring" is a play on words. Its not meant to be finished. You're supposed to dream about it 😂
Winds of winter won't even be out for years because Grrm doesn't even write 100 a year and he's got 500 pages left to go on winds of winter
I just can't understand how he stated in 2016 that his finishing of the book was "months away" and that he'd already missed deadlines in 2015, there is no way you miss a deadline by 8 years plus if you are actually working on it. He's gotta be writing a dream of spring now and just revising winds of winter when he needs to, rather than releasing winds and then regretting certain things he'd put in winds when writing dream. This is the only thing I can see as an excuse without calling grrm a liar about his progress at that time.
I don't think "A Dream of Spring" will ever be released and I'm ok with that. I'll be happy with "Winds of Winter" and the awesome first five novels. It does bum me out but the series has brought me so much joy that I'm cool with it.
I think a lot will depend on what happens in Winds (assuming we actually even get that).
If Winds legitimately wraps up a lot of plotlines and serves as the climax of the story, Dream shouldn't have too much trouble being the falling action where we see the consequences of Winds.
If George continues to let the story get away from him though and Winds fails to consolidate the plot into something manageable, no way.
It's also unfortunate that George has no de facto heir apparent to carry on the story from his notes, like Christopher Tolkien or Brian Herbert.
A Feast for Crows came out a mere 3 months after i was born, I am now less than 5 months away from being an adult, wild. I will honestly at this point be content with just at least getting TWoW.
Shoot he might die tomorrow and you won't even get Winds of Winter.
Skepticism is for the existence of Bigfoot. Skepticism is for when your bud says they're sober enough to drive home. When it comes to your favorite author finishing a book that I KNOW you are excited about? Come on guys, BELIEVE IN SOMETHING! What's that? You say the chances of him finishing it are less than 50%? Great, well I think he's gonna finish it. If there were less than a 10% chance of him finishing the series, I'm still saying he's gonna finish it. I think he's gonna make it happen, and you know what? If he doesn't end up finishing the series I will be heartbroken, but at least I won't be walking around saying "I told you so"
Some of us have been hurt before. I started reading Wheel of Time when I was twelve and spent decades waiting for the ending. Then Robert Jordan died and it's only thanks to his widow and Brandon Sanderson that we got any sort of ending.
He just needs to make sure the remaining characters go out with a bang
Maybe the real Dream of Spring is the friends we made along the way.
81 is still young enogh, but no way he'll finnish ados in 5 years
Zero shot lmao. Maaaaybe winds of winter. I have just embraced it. GRRM wrote amazing work and he still is, seems he just has new passion projects. Maybe in the future the rights are sold to a gifted author who works with GRRM’s team to finish the work he has written. He’s supposed to have 3/4ths of winds
My sweet summer child…. We are never getting winds of winter
I agree with you. It makes me so irate that he is actually working on other stuff and not finishing his books
I'd like to point out that Stephen King is even older.
But Stephen king is in good physical condition and he has strong work ethics unlike Martin, so...
I don’t know about marketing, but as someone with a background in publishing, editing the book should not take a whole year. That’s not how publishing houses work. Also books aren’t usually released for Christmas (that’s movies). The publishing year typically revolves around autumn and spring. Like how most of the other ASOIAF books have been released between August and November.
Interesting I did not know that! Will take that into consideration for the next time I talk about this subject!
I just bought the series. It’s crazy that I’ll probably catch up before wow comes out, if it does at all.
A fellow goblin I see haha and yup sadly
I'm have to stay positive but I do know it could go both ways, it's gonna be a close call but we gotta hope that George can finish his story even if Bran becomes king at the end lol. We also have to factor too that he's also been working on dunk and egg and his Targaryen history books as well
Uplifting the people as always. Well done, Your Grace. Let's just hope Bran becomes King of the North rather than Westeros lol.
@Ashley of Naath thank you ash! As always I appreciate your support! Tbh idek if I want Bran to become king of the north or lord I'm cheering for jeyne for that role but it definitely would be more suiting than king of the 7 Kingdoms
That's why he will never finish this series, he can't focus on just one thing. and I don't see how he can wrap up the story in just 2 more books, i'd say he needs 3 to 4 books to finish it properly, but ofc that is never gonna happen.
Will grrm ever finish A Dream of Spring? He'll never even start it.
I think the more reasonable question would be will he ever start writing a dream of spring
A Dream of A Dream of Spring
George has enough money to hire a team of writers to help him write A Dream of Spring. He could have a writer's brainstorming session and then assign 20 or so writers to produce one or two draft chapters each. George can then edit the draft, write the bits he wants to write, and get it done in one to two years.
That's not how writing works...
@@freddybaumgartner3096 It can be.
Kinda depressing to think about. I have hope!!
He also mentioned he wants to do a total of 12 Duncan egg books and blood and fire and more.....
Most probably not but I still have that tiny speck of hope, I mean the guy’s rich on a first world country so unless his genetics betray him I see some ten years left at least, extra weight and all.
I think with Winds having at least 4 battles, it'll be easier to narrow the plot, if he ever planned to, or otherwise cut down some branches. Once George has written the climax, it'll be much easier to work toward an ending, since it's mostly shining a light on the aftermath. I think since George said to have done ¾, at worst he's now approaching the manuscripts for the climax of the series, which is a huge task
Brandon Sanderson will probably end up writing "A Dream of Spring." It will only take Brandon about a year and a half to write the book.
Honestly, i believe is way more possible we will read the end of this story, than say....having a cancelled netflix show be renewed for its final season (looking at you GLOW, damn). If its George alone who writtes it or not, is not really relevant. He already knows his end game, it will be his setup and words, for the most of it, i have no doubt. Meanwhile, i think is better to stop making the old master feel anxious everytime every fan talks about his death as a annoyance, like having weather move the date of a party. Its dumb, and really not decent. The work will have an ending, it will. Let the guy enjoy the accolades and work without the pressure of having to please so many people that will forget his face anyway, just weeks after reading the damn book (that is not good for anything). I for once am greatful to have found this author and read his awesome work. Good nite.
Words are Winds. George should write some.
I come from the future and he's still writing 😔
My hope is that most of the plot webs will be cleared up in Winds of Winter, and that will free up GRRM to release Dream of Spring much faster.
I personally believe George will never finish A Dream A Spring. He might finish Winds of Winter one day but not the final book.
George will finish ADOS when Quentyn Martell dies.....so unlikely
He'll never finish it. There will be multiple different versions finished by different authors.
The Social Security Administration actuarial table shows that George (on average) has 11.05 years to live.
After reading the first five books multiple times, I would just be happy to get any more pages period.
I like how between 2 books,we will have gotten a full-on show and 1 season spinoff
I hope he's secretly working on both simultaneously so he can drop winds then do a surprise announcement that a dream of spring is done and will drop 2 months after winds. That would blow er body away
I really hope GRRM finishes Dream of Spring, but I do think at least part of it will have to be ghostwritten by someone else because he dies
Something I never understood.
It's said that half the realm supported Daemon Waters' claim, but from the looks of things, most of the major houses (Arryns, Tullys, Lannisters, Tyrells, Martells) supported Daeron. Who were the houses who really through their weight behind Daeron, and did any of the great houses support him?
I truly believe that the 7 books of the main story will come out. He may not give us all of his planned Dunk and Egg short stories, but the main story will see the light of day.
Damn, I AM old lol! I was 12 in 1996, way before I knew there was such a thing as Game Of Thrones, even Lord Of The Rings. I'm 40 now lol!
This world is so complete I think it could be finished by other fantasy writers who get the whole horror creepshow he likes to insert - has inserted in the tale ALREADY.
I'm a gardener too - in my garden, and I know you have to do some WEEDING at some point.
Yes i have faith
I hope he doesn't die before Dream of Spring 💀
Without watching, my prediction is, the only end of the story we will get, is the one we got from HBO. As trash and unfulfilling as it was, just remember, George has had plenty of opportunities to do a better ending, but he is satisfied with it.
No, I don't think so. And that's fine. Not everything has to be finished, and there is more than enough already there for people to work their own ending out.
Has Martin said if he’s going to work on FaB2 after he’s done winds but before dream? I’d heard that he has but wasn’t sure
He did say that, though it seems like his writer's block doesn't translate at all to the supplementary stuff
I think the big hard one to finish is Winds, if he can complete that one and his health holds he will be able to do Dream. Poor man, I feel for him. I am old myself and I feel the time crunch all the time. It is really frustrating to know you have things you want to accomplish but your physical body is weakening.
I think of George RR Martin the way I think of James Clavell.
Clavell started writing novels in the early 1960s with his best selling semi-autobiographical King Rat. He wrote his first novel while trying to break in to the lucrative and glamorous film business. He later wrote Tai Pan, Shogun and Noble House. All of his novels were immensely successful and all were adapted to the big or small screen. He also directed a half dozen movies (including To Sir Withn Love starring Sydney Poitier) and wrote screenplays for hire. At some point Clavell started tying his books together as one big crossover series that was dubbed The Asian Saga. The last two novels were Whirlwind, a sequel to Noble House and Gai Jin, a prequel to Shogun and Tai-Pan. By this time Clavell was in his early 70s and was diagnosed with Cancer. He died in 1994 at the age of 73 of a stroke.
My thought is that Clavell had a MAGNUM OPUS in him that he never got around to writing. He was anticipating the return of Hong Kong to China in 1998-1999, which would have been the perfect setting for a final novel to cap off his Asian Saga. But time caught up with him.
I think time will catch up with George RR Martin, leaving us with an unfinished corpus of work. His interests in doing television and movies, and fleshing out his fictional world with prequel and side novels is just going to gobble up what precious time he has left on this planet without his finishing the novels for which he is best known and which will have assured his literary posterity. Leave it to literary historians to rifles through his belongings, looking for clues as to what he had in mind for Dream of Spring. From what I have been hearing, unlike Tolkien, he won't be leaving behind outlines for the last two books. He's a gardener, not an architect.
He's more like F.Scott Fitzgerald, who left several unfinished works, like The Crack Up and The Last tycoon.
A tiny, optimistic part of me says... he's been writing this since 1991. With the finish line in sight, he'll find renewed motivation and Dream will be done much faster. But then I remember him saying how he wants to finish Fire & Blood 2 and the Dunk & Egg series first, among his TV projects. I feel for Patrick Rothfuss fans going through the same thing, at least he's only 50.
The editing company is going to drop everything else when George hands it in. It's also their moneymaker
He will never. He never knew how his story would end and doesnt have the capacity to write something this big. He is a novella short story writer. Brilliant but he doesnt have the endurance or capacity to write a great story to conclusion
Yes, he will finish it. Don’t put out negative vibes.
it's called being realistic
Sadly, at this point I think George is too ungrateful, undisciplined & unhealthy too ever finish. I do hope I'm wrong about him but I doubt it.
Ungrateful for what? He doesn't owe readers his writing? That's a toxic fan's mindset. Look at Patrick Rothfuss dealing with mental problems because of fan expectations. Undisciplined? GRRM continues to write many books (just not in the ASOIAF series). Unhealthy? Yeah... Very unhealthy. It's simply his writing style. He's a pantser who can't exactly end books in a smooth way.
Take Tolkien. Many don't know Tolkien is a pantser. That guy kept editing his already published works. Like the Hobbit was edited when he changed the Ring into an evil object. Tolkien even wanted a massive rewrite of the Hobbit, but was stopped by his editors. That's kind of the problem of pantsers, or gardeners, using GRRM's terms.
I sort hope that George RR Martin works with writers on a Dream of Spring instead of writing the book himself, depending on his health condition. From what I can understand, he personally does not like that people speculate over his death when they talk about the book coming out. So I can imagine he might feel immense stress after Winds comes out to finish Spring, which could be bad for an older person's health. It would be bad for anyone's, truthfully. Having a team of writers for that book might take some pressure off him and get people to stop speculating about what will happen if he dies, because everyone will know the book will come out.
I'm also guessing that he already feels stress to finish Winds, which has led to the book taking longer. Being pressured to actually create art of any kind can take away one's motivation, especially when someone's fanbase is so large.
I think that either GRRM is writing both the winds of winter and the dream of spring at the same time and will release them near enough at the same time, or will have quite a bit of a Dream of Spring written before he goes out and will end up like some of the lord of the rings books where someone will have to put the peaces together and releace it as an anthology of chapters rather than a complete book
@2:40 This is why you will NEVER see TWOW much less ADOS. Give up. Martin has been playing people for years. He is enjoying his retirement which, honestly, would be fine except for all the absolute BS he says about TWOW to maintain people's interest in him.
Yeah A dream of spring would be finished by someone else. I doubt someone can imitate George's unique writing style, which can be melancholy, brutal, glorious ..., all in the same page. Unfortunately.
GRRM said it himself, he will finish WoW and then go on to other projects. Seeing his age and how obees he is, it feels like a heartattack away from not finishing ADOS. I don't think he will ever finish it. Also he said he didn't want anyone fiinihsing the story after his death. If that isn't telling something then what does.
Ah to be 23 again and have life all figured out… a dream of youth.
Only one way to get it donechat gpt and AI George RR Martin
George has them done but won't release until after his death to avoid fan criticism
I don't believe George will ever finish the story. He is in his seventies, he is no in the best of health, and still haven't finished winds of winter. There is no way he is finishing this story plain and simple
GRRM’s priorities are TV shows. He has virtually no interest in writing anymore nor in his biggest claim to fame.
Please please George finish the aGoT books Please
I think we’ll get Winds, just not Dream. Not from George at least.
George should focus on finishing his book series first and foremost. George has the rare opportunity of making huge history and be remembered as one of the great and spoken in the same manor as Tolkien and Laying a foundation of a huge franchise that will live on for ages. Or he can be remembered as the man who never finished any of his book series because he fancied making other things instead.
You are absolutely right.
No.
No he won’t finish the whole story.
GRRM proves the rule of ‘fail to plan or plan to fail’.
Haha I am slowly regretting I let the show put me in this obsessive state over this world I’m so invested in the books I’ve basically completely abandoned the show and the books are my head canon for the story I kinda look at AGOT S5-S8 is “Dan Fic”😉 And everything else(1-4) is a just visual adaptation of the first 2-3 books in a big mereneese knot
be lucky too finish winds of winter never mind dream of spring
He distinguishes between writers who plan and those who proceed more “organically.” He says he is the latter. Let me translate: he has only a vague idea of where this is going and almost no idea of how to get there.
Moreover, he clearly enjoins the TV process and his high level role more than he likes writing. If he finishes the series, and it is a letdown, all the side projects might come to a crashing halt. Without finishing the series, any disappointments (like the end of the TV series) can be blamed on someone else. Other side projects can continue and the money can keep rolling in.
Thus, even if he finishes or comes close to finishing the books, we aren’t going to see the last book until after he’s dead. We will almost certainly see it in some form thereafter. Releasing it earlier could kill the goose that lays the golden eggs.
I haven’t even watched the video but the answers NO. I’m starting to doubt we are getting winds, I love these books so much, it really sucks coming to that realization. So that means well have an absolutely horrible mess that Dave and Dan called an ending and we’ll have NO ending in book, how depressing is that? Lol
he will never finish winds of winter and dream of spring, he old.and getting slower due to old age,
i think he needs to get a writer with a similar writing stiyle to help him finish AWOW and after he probably passes on for the other writer to finish ADOS kinda like with Christopher Tolkien and Brian Herbert. like George needs to write out his plan for the end of the story and give it to some author after he dies
GRRM will not finish it. We will get them finished by his close friends
I have started reading Song of Ice and Fire, and nearly finished book one. I will definitely be carrying on with the series but I don't think it will be finished because of his age. This must be causing him loads of stress.
Of course it won’t get finished.
No, he will not.
"NO!"
50% chance he finishes winds.. dream of spring will happen when the sun rises in the west and sets in the east