American Meat Eater VS Vegan Activist
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- Опубликовано: 24 сен 2022
- Is it ok to eat dumb animals? (Debate)
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Should intelligence dictate an animals rights? Or should we be more concerned with their sentient experience? Leave your comments down below!
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Human supremacists are the dumbest animal of all.
Thank you for all that you do for the animals, Joey! 👏 👏 👏
Dear Sir,
Why are you limiting your ethicality to sentient ? Because no one can’t survive without eating . So this makes you to put some kind of restriction to your ethicality. You got the sentient argument to justify your restriction like the guy took intelligence argument.
That’s a double standard too.
@@sunnyvictor1
In the scriptures things like insects can be eaten Genesis 9:3-4, but things with blood which would be sentient beings people are not to eat. Also Genesis 1:29 shows a plant based diet as does Leviticus 19:26 and prior where people are not to consume anything with blood. The scriptures speak of the life being in the blood and the blood crying out from the land after a slaughter has happened.
A sentient beings would be those with blood and things like bugs 🐜 🐛 would be allowed to eat, sometimes bugs can be eaten unintentionally like when people pull plants and little bugs can be on the plants and they don’t always get washed away etc. the least harm possible is the best thing though.
@@sunnyvictor1 Well what do you consider a good ethical limit?
There is no good argument against being vegan.
*Tru dat*
Agree !!!!
agreed
but there is no good justification for vegan activism too.
being vegan is a personal thing.
one can’t force ones ideology on others forcibly and illogically
Yes there is, its that everybody decides what they do and don't eat. You are in no position to judge other people for doing legal things like eating meat. Also morality is subjective, so don't act like a moral supremacist.
@@sunnyvictor1 there's no justification for trying to help sentient beings from going to slaughter? 🧐🧐
“They don’t have a concept of life or death.” What an absurd statement. Every animal knows what life and death are. Even ants create piles of deceased colony members.
I heard something about them having hormones that signal when they die to other ants.
I think he has not lived with other animals. Most people who have spent time with pets or large animals think that other animals have emotions and a rich life.
Ya even I thought that statement was odd. The strongest wille can be observed in pray animals, also they have evolved for thousands of years to avoid predators.
@@TheShockedboy . “Jeffrey Dharma, M🔴Donald’s 🔴” ruclips.net/video/HmqW9jViEyk/видео.html
No they dont. They have natural fight or flight survival instinct. Thats different.
I love how easily you change your activism style depending on the person you are talking too. You did an amazing job despite not being the normal style of conversation you have with the public. Amazing job!
superb observation!!!
I once read a book called "Are We Smart Enough To Know How Smart Animals Are." Although it was more about science and not veganism, it was enlightening. Most of the time, we're just as bad at understanding animals as they are at understanding us and other species. We have to ask the right questions, in the right way. If you don't think animals know what death is, you aren't smart enough to know how smart they are.
This man in the beginning reminds me of me before I went vegan almost seven years ago. :) I came at it from an intellectual approach primarily, trying to debunk the legitimacy of the claims made by vegans over the years. He's open minded and has the intelligence to comprehend more complex issues. Very cool. This conversation was productive.
Could you tell me whether or not abortion is vegan?
@@moufbreava Why, are you planning on having one?
@@moufbreava I think it depends, if the baby is sentient when the abortion is done it may not be. If they aren’t then I think it’s more likely to be “vegan”. Abortion is also highly context dependent.
@@kaiden_and so what defines sentience? A fetus at 8 weeks is thought to have the sense of touch. Should we ban abortions after 8 weeks, since they now developed a since of the world? Context? Under what context would it be OK to kill a sentient human being?
I think the more careful approach is the be cannibals . See , if we can't eat animal then we can eat ourselves together . Ok let me explain , do you watch Hannibal Lector cook a dish , looks way to damn good . Jk2
Apparently, spinach is the richest vegetable source of coenzyme Q10 (CoQ10). Other sources include broccoli, cauliflower, legumes, such as peanuts and soybeans, and foods such as tofu.
CoQ10 can also come from many plant-based products such as soybean oil, rapeseed oil and sesame oil. Other plant-based products containing CoQ10 include walnuts, peanuts, azuki beans, wheat germ and whole grains.
Thanks
👍👍👍
Thanks!
Hey@@kaisers91. i prefer to get my nutrition from food where possible.
@@vietnamd0820Glad to be able to share good news my Friend.
Coenzyme Q10 is an antioxidant/vitamin-like substance that our bodies need. It is generated naturally automatically in the body through the same enzyme that produces cholesterol. We can also get coenzyme Q10 through dietary sources, but it's found in plants as well, not just animals:
Food CoQ10 concentration (mg/kg)
Nuts
peanut 27
walnut 19
sesame seed 18-23
pistachio 20
hazelnut 17
almond 5-14
Vegetables
parsley 8-26
broccoli 6-9
cauliflower 2-7
spinach up to 10
Chinese cabbage 2-5
Fruit
avocado 10
blackcurrant 3
grape 6-7
strawberry 1
orange 1-2
grapefruit 1
apple 1
banana 1
Additionally, after people eat leafy-greens and other plants which contain chlorophyll, the sunlight-activating that chlorophyll within our bodies may help to regenerate coenzyme Q10.
Thank you for explaining
Lots of good info here, but sunlight activating chlorophyll in our bodies sounds very "out there", and I couldn't find any reliable source to suggest this.. Any studies on this?
@@MariaT-95 Try your own experiment. Stand in a strong ray of sunlight for at least 10 minutes. Absorb the sun in your eyes while being careful never to focus directly in the sun's direction (for obvious reasons). Go inside to a darkened kitchen and wash your hands. You'll see the tips of your fingers glowing green.
Maybe it's just me because I eat tons of dark leafy greens, but try it yourself.
@@MariaT-95 Well the first thing to understand is that our bodies are not impervious to light. It's been long established that light can go through the skin. There was a 2012 study called "Dietary Chlorophyll Metabolites Catalyze the Photoreduction of Plasma Ubiquinone". Ubiquinone is another name for coenzyme Q10. Dr. Michael Gregor did a video called "How to Regenerate Coenzyme Q10 (CoQ10) Naturally" which featured that study and that's where I got that bit of info.
@@lutherevans968 Thanks for the reference! Sadly it's behind a paywall, but nevertheless. I searched some more and it seems like an interesting and rather unexplored topic. :) Sun can at least modulate reactions in skin cells, such as in the process of vitamin D production, but I found it strange to think that the dietary chlorophyll would be available in high enough concentrations in the skin for the sun to influence it noteworthy.. Time (and further science) will tell.
Vegans 1 - Intellects 0
In this case, maybe he is more intellectual than Joey. Joey would probably concede that.
Some intelligent, widely admired people who chose not to eat meat- Pythagoras, Socrates, Leonardo da Vinci, Voltaire, Newton, Benjamin Franklin, Nikolai Tesla, Albert Einstein, Gandhi, Albert Schweitzer, George Bernard Shaw, Tolstoy, Thoreau, Saint Francis of Asisi, Nobel laureate and holocaust survivor Isaac Bashevis Singer, and many more. Some on this list switched late in life, but stayed on it to the end. Ben Franklin switched at age 16.
"Nothing will benefit human health and increase chances for survival of life on Earth as much as the evolution to a vegetarian diet." -Einstein (Of course today, he would be vegan. So would the others on this list.)
The famous Professor of Physics Brian Greene is vegan. You may have seen him on PBS hosting science shows for the layman. Jane Goodall recently went from a long time vegetarian to vegan. Greta Thunberg is vegan. Jon (Daily Show) Stewart is not only vegan, he owns a farm animal sanctuary!
As you imply, Joey won this debate.
Wow! More debates like this please with intelligent, non confrontational
people such as this .
I actually feel I've learnt a lot from Joey having a discussion with a well read chap.🙂
It's cruel to take the life of an animal who doesn't want to die.
Its ignorant to think humans are going to repudiate nature amd adopt the diet of hampsters just because your feelings are hurt
@@EVIL-en1ym you're extremely ignorant if you think that without animal products we eat anything like hamsters. Sounds like you've just read too many vegan hate articles etc.
If a plant could choose, it also wouldn't want to die, so that's irrelevant. The important thing is that they shouldn't suffer.
@truth hurts what species of plant are you then?
@truth hurts absurd is basing your whole argument on the assumption that a chicken or sheep is a person and has human emotions and cognitive ability. And even more absurd is the vegan totalitarian mindset where everyone is expected to lie about everything all the time.
Coenzyme Q10 - well, surprise surprise, commonly found in certain vegetables and peanuts.
👋
CoQ10 can be found in spinach, broccoli, cauliflower, peanuts which are legumes also soybeans and other legumes so CoQ10 is also plant based and the animals that the people eat to get it are most likely getting it from a plant based diet.
Great comment JB. Prompted me to investigate further. Apparently, spinach is the richest vegetable source of coenzyme Q10 (CoQ10). Other sources include broccoli, cauliflower, legumes, such as peanuts and soybeans, and foods such as tofu.
CoQ10 can also come from many plant-based products such as soybean oil, rapeseed oil and sesame oil. Other plant-based products containing CoQ10 include walnuts, peanuts, azuki beans, wheat germ and whole grains.
Love your comment JB. Many thanks :~}
He's too smart to not be vegan. Unfortunately smart people are more adept at mental gymnastics to justify terrible things, so I hope he approaches it honestly and critically as he continues to think on it.
I agree. Some intelligent, widely admired people who chose not to eat meat- Pythagoras, Socrates, Leonardo da Vinci, Voltaire, Newton, Benjamin Franklin, Nikolai Tesla, Albert Einstein, Gandhi, Albert Schweitzer, George Bernard Shaw, Tolstoy, Thoreau, Saint Francis of Asisi, Nobel laureate and holocaust survivor Isaac Bashevis Singer, and many more. Some on this list switched late in life, but stayed on it to the end. Ben Franklin switched at age 16.
"Nothing will benefit human health and increase chances for survival of life on Earth as much as the evolution to a vegetarian diet." -Einstein (Of course today, he would be vegan. So would the others on this list.)
The famous Professor of Physics Brian Greene is vegan. You may have seen him on PBS hosting science shows for the layman. Jane Goodall recently went from a long time vegetarian to vegan. Greta Thunberg is vegan. Jon (Daily Show) Stewart is not only vegan, he owns a farm animal sanctuary!
Look at haw an intelligent person like Sam Harris is able to avoid recognizing the fact that paying for the needless killing of innocent sentient beings cannot be justified.
This is my friend Elias he's just fucking with him the whole time I've seen him eat meat with a ferocity that would rival a starved lion he ain't thinking on it
This kid is on his way to being vegan. He obviously wanted to keep talking to Joey. He’s going to need some time to allow his paradigm to shift but it seems that he’s willing to let that happen if he finds the arguments convincing enough…and they are certainly convincing enough.
He was so impressed at how clever Joey was. He basically said nobody in Seattle has the intellect to actually carry on a conversation.
He mentioned that he is Jewish.
Fun fact- Israel has the highest percentage of vegans of any country.
@@larryllama5225be actually said it’s “impossible to find it” in the USA, which is one of the many asinine things this dude said. I personally found him to be insufferable. I’m pretty sure nobody wants to participate in intellectual conversation with him because nobody wants to talk to him 😂
Joey you blew this young man's mind!
Lmao I know that young man he's one of my best friends. He was also 100% fucking with him the whole time
Atleast this guy didn't give me a headache like many others. He will be Vegan before he knows it. Great job Joey love the way you handled it all! 👏 #4TheAnimals
20:46 the human body is meant to consume "these things" (being animals)... Okay, then why do we have to cook meat before it's safe to eat?
"this isnt australia, this is the UK"
uh, what? Muslims seem to have some hot takes whenever they appear in these videos....
At least by the end he recognized he doesn’t have a logical rebuttal against Joey & couldn’t argue further while admitting he needs to learn more
When they check their phones and say something like "oh no, I have to go now", I'd say that is usually the recognition moment. Lol
Logical rebuttals are wasted on the absurd.
Try this parayil.... describe animal ag in 5 words or less, and if you arent prepared to share that with a clinical psychologist, reassess your opinion instead of trying to convince yourself and everyone else you have a point.
@EVIL'S BROWN DOG Disconsolate, unnecessary, inhumane, insidious and immoral.
Describe animal ag in 5 words?
Unnecessarily killing animals for food.
Awesome work. Reverse psychology is pretty good at opening people up.
Though I agree, this conversation immediately turned into the normal approach and no reverse psychology was used, once this guy realised what was happening.
Cow, dogs and pigs are completely different? Looking at their embryo halfway through gestation I bet this person couldn't tell them apart. By the way, humans have gills and a tail during the first stages of embryonic development. In a way we're not even that far off from fish. As Pythagoras already knew thousands of years back, all beings share one and the same essence.
Atherosclerosis affects only herbivores. Dogs, cats, tigers, and lions can be saturated with fat and cholesterol, and atherosclerotic plaques do not develop . The only way to produce atherosclerosis in a carnivore is to take out the thyroid gland; then, for some reason, saturated fat and cholesterol have the same effect as in herbivores.
Although most of us conduct our lives as omnivores, in that we eat flesh as well as vegetables and fruits, human beings have characteristics of herbivores, not carnivores . The appendages of carnivores are claws; those of herbivores are hands or hooves. The teeth of carnivores are sharp; those of herbivores are mainly flat (for grinding). The intestinal tract of carnivores is short (3 times body length); that of herbivores, long (12 times body length). Body cooling of carnivores is done by panting; herbivores, by sweating. Carnivores drink fluids by lapping; herbivores, by sipping. Carnivores produce their own vitamin C, whereas herbivores obtain it from their diet. Thus, humans have characteristics of herbivores, not carnivores.
- The National Center for Biotechnology Information .gov
That's an appeal to nature fallacy, we should look to nature to how we conduct ourselves, so if I woke up in the morning and had claws and fangs etc, I can then kill animals?
@Sara Andersson Well that settled that. Who needs official government backed facts from biologists when we have your wisdom to debunk it all in 5 words.
LOVE you! You're my hero.
I like how at the end when he says "you made me think today, I never get intellectual conversation" the Classy lads in the background ready to debate immediately bounced lol
Classy? Quite pretentious if you ask me!
Ok, all animals from the smallest fish have a great understanding of not wanting to die. Because not wanting to die is not an intellectual factor, it is an instinctive factor. Even in humans! Animals who want to live more in the wild, try harder to stay alive. This is why natural selection favors such instincts.
I find many people who eat meat that guess how other beings feel. Knowing how little we know about other beings, guessing how other beings are or feel and judging based on such is very ignorant. Many animals have better senses of of awareness than human do. All animals feel enough and are aware enough to have a significant view towards not killing, abusing, or caging them.
Especially, for God’s sake! We do not need to eat animal products! Fact is the majority are unhealthy, and can now be replaced with better options. Killing animals, especially today is an absolute needles act of barbarism.
And there are levels of omnivore state. Pandas are more omnivorous than humans, yet they only eat bamboo. We humans are more herbivores than pandas, and we eat a variety of plant products.
So vegans being unhealthy is total garbage!
I cannot possibly be wrong because it's nuanced you see!
10 years?! That's 2000+ lives he could spare from unnecessary killing. ✌️
His point about lab grown meat making meat eating a non-issue in about 10 years is nonsensical. He posits that veganism lacks bioavailable nutrients that can only be readily found in meat. Where does he think that lab grown meat will get those same nutrients from? Animals used to get things like B12 from their environment but in factory farms they must be given supplements or they themselves become deficient. Lab grown meat will therefore have to be pumped full of the very same supplements so there would be no benefit from eating the lab grown meat to receive the supplemented nutrients compared to just taking the supplements as a vegan. Joey should do a whole debate just on synthetic meat because a lot of people would never eat it even if it was presented as functionally identical to the flesh of a real animal.
Different animals have different digestive tracts
This debate was refreshing compared to your last debate which was painful to watch! This man was present and had somewhat of an open mind. The vegan message is so simply and profound that it doesn’t take high intellect to to grasp. Once you make the connection it changes you! When my dog died my husband and I swore we would never eat an animal product again. How could we love someone so dearly and eat another? Crazy crazy crazy.
Finally someone who didn't fail school biology! 🙌
Did you know they still force students to dissect frogs and fetal baby pigs in school biology? God knows what else they teach them.
Luckily, vegetable sources of CoQ10 include spinach, broccoli, and cauliflower. Legumes such as peanuts and soybeans are the best non-animal sources of the substance. Though CoQ10 is a nutrient for vegans to be aware of in their diet, the good news is that deficiencies have not been noted in the general population.
Another complete and total non-issue.
Great video ❤
Impressive that an American can actually talk without saying “like” every other 5 seconds.
Your evolution is astonishing, Joey! You've gotten so good at debating with random people that you can talk to teenagers in their language and then switch to this register in the blink of an eye, I'm so impressed! keep up the great work!
This guys actually thinks he made some good points. 😂
Ultimately, with all their words - rational - mental backflips - and sideways logic …these people are justifying killing someone who doesn’t want to die.
How inferior do you need to regard someone to take their life ?
And when you find the answer, hope no one regards you with that inferiority because you’ve abandoned the right to protest
Your transformation is beautiful to watch Joey! 💚
@Linus Gallagher love that film, what a beautiful character. Although he was autistic I believe so not sure if you were just referring to the kindness they both share? Would be great if all men were kind and not idiots, then we wouldn’t have the problems we have today!
It’s always interesting when people use scripture for flesh eating especially when Genesis 1:29 shows a plant based diet and again after the flood in Genesis 9:4 it shows that people are not to eat flesh as flesh contains blood, in 9:3 it shows that bugs 🐜 🐛 can be eaten. Locust were eaten also swarms is another word used. Then again in Leviticus 19:26 it shows again that anything with blood is not to be eaten.
When it came to sacrifices, there were non animal sacrifices and when an animal was originally brought for sacrifices it was not to be slaughtered and that can be seen in Genesis 4. Animals were originally taken care of and looked after and used for things like wool when sheep were shorn and the lanolin from the wool when the sheep were shorn. Originally tails were not cut and the animals would get their coats cut in certain seasons to keep them healthy and their coats could then be used in clothing like Joseph and his coat of many colors.
People choose to eat flesh because it’s how they were brought up and they live in a fleshly state of being. They look for ways to twist the scriptures to their own downfall especially as flesh eating would be breaking commandments. Breaking commandments gets people into idolatry, similar to when the Israelites were leaving Egypt and complaining about not having flesh, only for The Almighty Most High Creator to allow them to have it then wipe them out after. People claim to follow the scriptures, but really they are following doctrines of demons and traditions of men which the very scriptures people claim to stand by say not to follow.
The flesh eating brings more diseases, and when people get sick from those diseases they go vegan to reverse the diseases they created with a flesh based diet.
A vegan and/or vegetarian diet is the original diet given in scripture. Even with a vegetarian diet there are different types as some people still consume byproducts from animals that are not living like bone broths and gelatin etc. where there are vegetarians who may use milk and eggs from living animals or babies who drink their moms milk etc. some vegetarians have their own chickens and animals for those and others do use factory farming so there are variables even in that. With a vegan diet it cuts majorly of the unsure things out and was the original diet so it’s good.
The bible is crap there are better books to read.
Well said
Detailed study...but certainly common and same for every religion,ppl in all religion does the same...as mentioned by you,no religion tells to eat meat...not on this earth...today someone on facebook was arguing wheather the great buddha ate meat or not...i donno if you have seen the video of an very elderly buddhist man debating with joey....
I have Asperger's I have an IQ where at school my mental disability rendered me isolated and bullied at school, I've never had the cognitive function to be independent and require a carer to look after basic functioning to have support to do things that I wouldn't never be able to do independently, but at school was excellent at art gaining the top 1% in my GCSE thanks to a compassionate teacher helping my special needs, in history I was among the top of my class because my teacher was compassionate to all mental disabilities, in English literature I gained the highest GCSE in the entire school because my teacher was compassionate and understood mental disabilities, science again I was in a special class for mental disabilities and I gained the highest marks in my class for GCSE because my teacher was compassionate towards mental disabilities but my brother who has autism and is mostly mute living with a full time carer does that mean all people who have mental disabilities deserve to be murdered to be perceived as weaker somehow? No because that would be a hate crime on mental disability an act of violence on the basis of intellect which only Nazis did saying kill those don't kill those, only a dark road of violence would follow that path
about CoQ10
Vegetables: Spinach, cauliflower and broccoli. Fruit: Oranges and strawberries. Legumes: Soybeans, lentils and peanuts. Nuts and seeds: Sesame seeds and pistachios
Very interesting chat… love when people do listen to each other
Religious person: "IDEOLOGY THO"
People talking about us being omnivores is always a dead end argument because we by definition, omnivore means nothing is obligate, everything is a choice. Therefore an omnivore can choose not to cause sentient beings to suffer.
"Omnivore" is also descriptive not prescriptive. It just describes what we observe, not what ought to be. Saying we should eat meat because we're omnivores amounts to a tautology "we eat meat because we eat meat". It's logically worthless.
The only people that use being omnivorous as a justification to eat meat, and worse support industrial animal farming, really haven't thought about it deeply at all.
@@JM-lz1oi just about every non vegan I interact with uses the omnivore "gotcha" .
Moderate animal/plant ratio returns far better results than very low, animal/plant ratio, so..I'm an omnivore! Of course, I could choose to survive on a slave diet but don't find such to be appealing.
The whole point of veganism is speaking up for the animals and trying to save animals from being slaughtered. I highly commend Joey for caring so much to help the voiceless.
It seems he forgets that emotions/feelings are evolutionarily relevant for most animals. It's important that they experience emotional responses. It was those emotions that allowed reproduction to flourish. Same with the ability to experience pain, of course. Negative and positive emotions are not at all unique to humans. What has separated us from most other animals is the development of self awareness. Emotions don't require self awareness to be experienced. Think about it.
I mean to say, babies, for example, experience emotions... Even when they lack awareness of their Self (as it hasn't developed yet). The survival instinct is what created emotions. Babies cry when a need has to be met or a solution to a problem is required. They can't rationalize why they react emotionally. They can't control their emotional reactions. Does that mean they should not be considered equal to humans in the stage of development where awareness of self and some level of reasoning is developed? Besides that, the survival instinct is alive inside a sentient being regardless of how aware they are of it or why it is there etc.
Exactly. I wish this was brought up now..
@@Masilya111 This guy might have been able to engage on that level. Just asking why animals evolved the ability to move would make him think, because he is an evidence-based thinker. And ask him why human mothers form bonds with their children, why humans feel danger when seeing another human being killed, why humans don't get hungry when watching slaughter, why humans instinctively react when hearing another human scream, etc. The same goes for non-human animals, particularly mammals.
Maybe Joey doesn't go that route because the majority of the RUclips audience would tune out.
@@TXRhody Not sure what you mean by "evolved the ability to move." Do you mean animals used to be rocks or plants, and when did this ability to move appear? Seriously, just want a simple explanation as to why evolving to move would be "evidence based."
@@Empathy4Animals411 The first 3 billion years of life on earth did not include any animals. Animals have existed for about 560 million years, so animals were pretty late to arrive and make up a small portion of the tree of life. Living organisms evolved from single-cell to more complex organisms, eventually including a tail or other apparatus that enabled movement. Life forms that could move toward food, toward light, away from danger, etc. had a higher likelihood of survival and, thus, a greater change to reproduce. This is based on evidence. I hope this answered your question.
This kid is pretty smart and knows quite a bit about logic, but still didn’t quite connect the dots to live consistently. I have hope that after this interview he will further explore Veganism now that he is seeing the contradictions.. Most logical people once revealed the truth and having it laid out to counter their dissonance or biases , they usually tend to hate continuing a lifestyle of contradictions and hypocrisy. Well done JOEY!
My daddy knows more than a peer reviewed study and the professional position of 50,000 experts.
He was right about Q10, but didn't tell everything and had a hole in argument ;-)
@@retropan1c A broken clock is right twice a day.
@@retropan1c CoQ10 is easily found in a plant based diet.
Vegetables: Spinach, cauliflower and broccoli
Fruit: Oranges and strawberries
Legumes: Soybeans, lentils and peanuts
Nuts and seeds: Sesame seeds and pistachios
Oils: Soybean and canola oil
@@CeravvvEgan Ok, so you copied Google Results.
Now read it more carefully and look at the amount per gram :-)
Animal products have like 3 to 6 times more mg/100g than closest vegetable (in fact broccoli).
The trick is that most animal products need to be cooked - and coenzyme q10 is very sensitive to temperature and during heat treatment a very large part of it is simply leveled. And that's what he didn't say.
For me, in my opinion, everyone, regardless of diet, should sometimes supplement q10
Anyone got a link to the colour plate experiment? Nothings coming up online when I type it in.
A co-worker once asked if I thought eating an animal was a sin. My opinion doesn't matter, it's about what you think. Do you think it is wrong to needlessly hurt a person. Do you think it is wrong to needlessly abuse a cat or a dog. Do you understand that we do not need to eat animals to be healthy. I believe most people ethically agree that animal abuse is wrong, but our society has a shared and commonly accepted cognitive dissonance when it comes to animals and food. The true question isn't if someone else believes somthing is a sin; the real question, the hard question is do your actions align with your ethics.
48 weeks Vegan ✌️
I've been completely vegan for week after a heat attack and a very long hard think about my life and have been wondering if it makes me a hypocrite that I breed reptiles for a living, am I not exploiting them for the pet trade?? I love animals and treat mine very well and also check the setup of buyer beforehand to make sure they are going to someone who knows what they are doing. Any opinions would be appreciated
Well done for becoming vegan. Breeding any animals is considered unethical.
You are a hypocrite you are not a vegan. You are plant based because of the career path you took. If you worked in a office building or had a career that requires a higher education then you would be considered a vegan
Could you turn it into a not for profit sanctuary instead?
@@dgollas How would he make money if non profit
@@dgollas How would he make money if non profit
Thank you, Joey!!! ❤❤❤
The fact that he keeps saying, in 10 years it won't matter, proves he doesn't give a shit about animals suffering. He doesn't get it.
Beautiful debate mate 😊🙏
If this guy thought Joey got him intellectually, he definitely has never come across Ed.
Joey > Ed
@@a.3160 they have their own unique styles and strengths.
stop fighting it people-abusing animals is dead wrong. just be vegan. stop being nasty, reductive, shallow, and cruel. evolve. cmon you can do it. don’t revel in evil and pretend you’re operating in a dignified, rational manner. admit your fault and move on to trying to be a better person.
People are not going to change just because you want it
No
Very pleasant conversation 🙂
The coloured plate experiment amongst other: ruclips.net/video/QevWGsd96xQ/видео.html
Funny hearing a Muslim talking about "mental ideology...your delusion", the irony. 🤣
Hero shit 👊🏽
This is me, literally, me 8 years ago, soon before going vegan. Smart people is where we can make progress. He KNOWS that what he's saying isn't solid, ethical or logically consistent. He is testing you to see if you can clarify it for him and you did a great job Joey. Much love.
Intelligence is only important in so far as it is related to suffering.
Intelligence in and of itself isn't important when deciding how to treat an individual.
Amazing clever experiment Joey😊💚 thankyou my hero
What did he say?! Co-Enzyme Q-10? Wtf is that?! 🤣🤣🤣
*Food Sources of Coenzyme Q10*
Vegetables: Spinach, cauliflower and broccoli
Fruit: Oranges and strawberries
Legumes: Soybeans, lentils and peanuts
Nuts and seeds: Sesame seeds and pistachios
Oils: Soybean and canola oil
@@tez4792 Thank you, was about to look it up. I figured like with a lot of carnist arguments they are very wrong and there are plenty of plant sources.
@@tez4792 looks like it's in peanuts, soybeans, spinach, whole grains, broccoli. Seems extremely easy to get to me.
Fancy that, a carnist educating vegans on food nutrition (accidentally/unintentionally :~) i did have to research CoQ10 myself. Some people are too intelligent for their own good/arguments...
@@RichardAStonemasonNOTfreemason Indeed.
Great job as always Joey👍
This guy says that it will be a moot discussion when lab grown meat exists. Animal exploitation and speciesism won't cease to exist just because lab grown meat exists. Reducing supply and demand of animal products is good, but it's not the solution to speciesism and oppression. How we view animals affects how they are treated.
Great work. He certainly was brought down to size.
This was an amazing discussion! Seriously, I think one of your best. That guy seems to be under the impression we need animal products and he mentioned coenzyme Q10 and implied it's only found in animal products or perhaps more abundantly in animal products. I didn't know what that was so I looked it up and it's found in meat, fish, and nuts. However, there isn't enough of it in food to affect the amount in your body. So it's not something we can really get from food anyway. Funny enough, having heart disease seems to weaken your production of this antioxidant. Guess where heart disease comes from? Eating too much saturated fat. lol. But he seems like a smart guy so he might eventually come across that info.
I always wondered how you did the reverse psychology ones without people noticing your tattoo. Turning the V into an M with Sharpie 🤣
“I don’t want to wait 10 years to be moral. I want to be on the right side of history now.” Great inspiration!
Intelligence hierarchy tho. He hesitated too long
If you had to kill the animal yourself and it was a requirement to maintain eye contact with them the whole while as you slit their throat and watch them fade away and you chose to go ahead with it and in the end it didn't bother you.. you'd have to be sadistic. Who would do that and be okay or would you just focus on the cut and avoid eye contact? Why would you avoid eye contact? Just my thought process.. The sentience argument always wins in my opinion.
"next time you wanna kill a man look him in the eye"-Jane "The Soldier" Doe
The idea of seeing the life leave something or someone's eyes is disturbing to me, how do hunters even look through the scope?
Horse shit what a cpmplety ignorant statement. Do you even know what sadistic means?
@@otakunthevegan4206 I don't use a scope I use open sights. Due to the heavy woodland terrain. You would get a poor sight picture. I have never got a instant kill on anything. Mainly deer I would shoot them in the spine, legs, anywhere but in the vitals. So I would have to cut their throats. You pretty much have to look at them because you don't want to get cut yourself.
My parents are retired slaughter house workers. My father did the slaughtering and my mother did the processing. They never had a problem doing it because of growing up in a farming community. Unlike vegans who most of them spent their lives in cities.
Me I had to move when I was nine due to getting bullied. I was home schooled and did commercial fishing in Alaska for salmon. I had gut those fish while most of them were still alive. Never bothered me once I got done with all my education I moved back.
Bought the family business selling hunting and sport fishing gear.
@Sara Andersson sadism is to gain sexual gratification from inflicting pain or humiliation onto others. For vegans to insunuate sadism is part and parcel of animal ag is the epitome of ignorance and dishonesty.
“Coenzyme Q10 (CoQ10) is an antioxidant that your body produces naturally. Your cells use CoQ10 for growth and maintenance.
Levels of CoQ10 in your body decrease as you age. CoQ10 levels have also been found to be lower in people with certain conditions, such as heart disease, and in those who take cholesterol-lowering drugs called statins.” -Mayo Clinic.
I know Mayo Clinic isn’t the pinnacle of medical research but this is what 10 seconds of research looks like.
Are cows smarter than dogs? All things considered, dogs and cows are of roughly the same intelligence. They both form bonds with other humans and animals and can remember them, and they can both be trained to perform certain actions for a reward. The difference in how they are perceived results mostly from the fact that a lot of people keep dogs as pets and interact with them on a daily basis, while cows play a much smaller role in most people’s lives.
Cows are known to have quite complex social interactions. Not only do they form friendships and cliques, but a herd of cows also works according to a multifaceted social hierarchy. Cows that are newly introduced to the herd have to “network” and get to know various members before being fully accepted. They are also known to remember things like faces or directions for a long time.
A study from the University of Cambridge has found out that cows even enjoy learning - when they have learned something new or have solved a problem they display excitement by wagging their tails, jumping, and running around happily, not unlike dogs do.
In a test done at the University of Sydney, cows were trained to solve mazes, like lab rats or mice often do. They learned to connect a certain sound with the promise of food and then followed this sound through a maze. This process showed their abilities for decision making and their executive function.
People always try and justify animal cruelty for their own selfish needs
They taste so damn good though. Worth it in my opinion.
Proper nutrition isn't selfish! It's simply a matter of physiology.. unless someone has the mindset of a sappy, 9yo schoolgirl.
The humane argument needs to stop…
Very intelligent and respectful discussion. Thank you and keep on the good work. Your making a difference.💪
Thank you for all you do Joey.
this dude commits a lot of special pleading basically applies rules and caveats that plug holes in his line of thought but are ultimately unsound and inconsistent.
Thank you Joey 💜
💜🌱 Vegan
This guy is smart, love his ability to be logical and honest! If nothing else this will hopefully spin his thoughts up to question what he’s grown to accept
And what's the city?
3:25 Ok so to not sound like a hypocritic right now, let me say the dumbest thing i can think of real quick. because sounding stupid is much better than sounding/being a hypocrite 😏😶
Does eating brains make one smart?
Good on you Joey.....you got him on every point. Well done as always!
29:46 Joey sounded like Peter Griffin 🤣
Is it okay to give more rights to an AI robot that can do all types of maths & scientific research than a 6yo human? The logic doesn't make sense...
Drink every time he says "that's a strawman", when it was just his own opinion recited back to him.
dude definitely doesn't know what a strawman is.
People who think they're clever love dropping the word nuance as though it makes them sound more intellectually sophisticated but often through deeper exploration of their thoughts you learn they haven't got the basics right first. Credit to this kid though for being resistant but still able to concede some ground even if he can't yet get with the simple common sense that animals want to live and we don't have to deny them that.
A good source of Coenzyme Q10: (CoQ10) is vegetable oils. So his point that you need it from flesh is simply in error...
a top American gastro enterologist he says.
8th! LoL. Who are we to decide what level of intelligence any other creature has?! How would we like to be treated the way we treat our fellow animal? God help the human race Joey! Love you!🙏👍♥️♥️♥️
Well your God is the one that came up with this retarded system in the 1st place
Who are we to decide the sentience of a living being then
Who am I to decide who lives and dies? If an alien came and treated me like a human treats an animal how fair would that be? I treat other beings how I would want to be treated in their position.
@@sunnyvictor1 observers doing the best we can with what we have. If you got a better explanation let's hear it.🤯
@@otakunthevegan4206 Exactly!! Do as you would be done by 🙏👍
Lmao got him and he knows it
Those lads at the end heard the American mention the words "intelligent conversation" and thought "nah, this isn't for us" xD
Thank you Joey you are Amazing
It’s freeing to be able to enjoy food without deliberate harm to sentients.
Wild hogs been shot dead to protect crops is harmful to wild hogs
11:38 LOL Joey doesn't get Jews 😃
That was a pleasant exchange.
"You're making me want to go vegan." This is next level advocacy.
Jesus christ the ONLY reason you est meat is because we have been doing it for thousands of years
IT'S TIME FOR CHANGE
UGHHHHHHHHH
We haven't even been doing it for thousands of years. In times of extreme shortages of plants, such as during harsh weather conditions and during migrations due to poor growing conditions we have subsisted on animal flesh but in general, humans have forever been almost entirely herbivores and/or frugivores.
He's using debate words improperly. Joey misunderstanding and asking whether he understood is NOT a strawman... And saying "maybe you don't know much about cows" is not an ad hominen! 😂
I dunno if it's just whatever way the camera focuses, but it kind of looks like they are speaking in front of a green screen.
Joey: "Kosher and halal slaughter is identical"
Dude: "No, that actually a really common misconception"
Joey: "So what is different about kosher?"
Dude: I don't know enough about halal slaughter."
So painful to watch, really. He claims that halal slaughter and kosher are different but he doesn't even know how a halal slaughter look like. When people overestimate how smart they are 🤦♀️