I just don’t think killing a fetus is on the same level as killing a child. Like they keep saying child when that fetus isn’t even a baby yet. Sure fetus’s aren’t just dead clumps of cells, but they aren’t children either. Obviously I’m not gonna say I’m an expert on the situation, but there’s no way a fetus and child are at the same level of consciousness, And that’s what’s really important to me, stopping the life from growing isn’t the same as murder
Like the Bible says life begins at first breath. Not that I care about religion but the majority of pro-lifers are pro-life solely because of their religion.
Abortion is murder. If not why charge murders twice when they kill a pregnant woman? It’s a human life at conception if not we wouldn’t charge murders twice if they kill a pregnant woman. It’s the same thing just one situation is intentional and the other one isn’t. That’s crazy to me.
My mom was a victim of rape. She had my 3 half siblings at a very young age. Her 4th pregnancy her father and mother made her get an abortion. She didn't want one. She still feels guilty about it. I try to remind her that she was young, pressured, didn't have a choice. I'm so thankful I have my siblings. They are amazing, and have always protected me. Due to my mother's experiences I'm pro choice. I wish my mom had a choice. I don't want to see anyone lose their Bodily autonomy
it's kind of weird to watch these conversations happen. i worked as a doula, midwife, and as a provider of abortions (outside of the usa). i am also a mother. i would point out that every cell, organ, etc inside a human body is a part of human life. a kidney. a heart. a fingernail. a fetus. but we make choices all the time as to what parts of human life we want to live, and what parts we want to die. yes, seeing an aborted fetus is disgusting. but also seeing a kidney taken out of the body is disgusting as well. most things that come out of the human body are bloodied and dismembered and gory. on a moral life level, i think i see it (kind of like, but this is also kind of simplified) similar to the argument: if someone needs a kidney to live. and i have a kidney, i have the right to not give up my kidney. even if that means he will die without it. even though i can live with only one kidney. being pregnant really made me go from being pro-choice to 'pro-abortion' - because my pregnancy was so difficult and i was sick for most of it. and i realized no one should have to go through that kind of bodily torture w/o their consent. i am very happy i chose to be pregnant and to have my kid. she is my life. i love babies, taking care of kids, taking care of pregnant people, birth, and abortions. all of it is part of life, part of the human experience. i am also happy that when birth control failed i had other options. and i have said - i love abortions. because of the relief that it gives people. the way it gives people their lives back. most abortions ive seen are for people who are already a mother and dont want another child because they can't afford it (financially, energetically, physically) - okay i have to go now. maybe i will write more later.
I feel like it's easier to cling to the idea that unborn babies are just cells because women feel like they need to explain themselves for THEIR decision. People just need to stay out of other people's business unless it effects them directly.
Pro lifers need to focus their energy on changing the system (like more resources for single moms, black moms, moms in general) and if they do, then they might have a sort of decent argument. But the truth is, its absolutely terrifying to have a baby in a situation that is not ideal. That means carefully planned. We also need to talk about the simple fact that people need to be a lot more cautious when having sex.
I'm pro life. I don't doubt at all that having a baby in a situation that is not ideal is terrifying. But I would place more emphasis on your last statement about caution when having sex, as I believe an abortion is a termination of a life in progress.
I have exactly your view! I used to be pro-life, I still think human fetuses are persons, but can't support the government banning all abortions because of bodily autonomy.
The problem is people think they have a Kantian approach to ethics when they actually a Humean one. Abortion for me is a case by case basis in terms of right vs wrong. As far as legislation I am pro choice.
By the time I had an abortion I had already decided in Philosophy class what the right answer for me was. True story. I think the only reasonable way to look at it is neutral. Because no one joyfully ends a life. But the 9(ish) month process of bringing a life into the world is not necessarily joyful either. I value life but I value myself the most and I don't think it's wrong to feel that way. Also, whatever happened to pro-choice? I can't believe there's a pro-abortion side, that's real weird.
Humans are so amazingly complex and resilient. While it is annoying, the reduction of a embryo/ fetus(baby) to "clump of cells" is a feat of our mental capacity to bring ourselves through trauma. I might be playing armchair psychology by saying so, but it seems reasonable to me. The trauma of being responsible for ending an *entire* life is certainly greater than the trauma of "getting rid of a clump of cells". In the end, as a mother, pregnancy is an intimate and bonding experience almost immediately, motherhood is long however and draining and the "end" comes at 18 years. (Aka) Being a mother is EXHAUSTING. And going through pregnancy for 9 months is something that has to be worth it. I could never ever give up my own blood and flesh to someone else, especially a system that is so poorly working. Myself, I would regret that more than abortion.
Thank you for covering this topic. With how extreme and oppositional everyone’s views have become (even more so lately) it’s really important that we inject a little nuance into the conversation. It’s like pro choice people believe that admitting a fetus is alive will completely invalidate their beliefs. I agree with you that abortion is horrible but bodily autonomy trumps all, including when it comes to vaccines. You know, I didn’t get the HPV vax either or a single flu shot. My mom is a bit skeptical of medical dogma after getting mutilated by a bad early generation IUD and almost losing her ability to have children. Also my older brother began showing autism symptoms after getting a vaccine. So I’ve def been influenced by her. I just think we need to maintain our right to choose. No mandates.
I agree with everything you said, except children with autism start showing sympoms at the same age they get vaccinated, so it's correlation not causation. Not saying that skepticism is bad, just adding information that could be useful for you to know
@@taina88111 yep, I am actually aware of that, Thanks though. It’s just that the kid gets old enough to make the symptoms become glaringly apparent around the same age that certain shots are due. I don’t think that the vaccine caused it, but my mom has her fears, and it definitely taught me to do my due diligence about researching medical procedures and prescriptions. I should have made that more clear in my wording 😗 😅
@@radrose4864 thanks for the clarification, I understand your position a lot better now. My mom also has medical trauma and is very skeptical of traditional medicine, that's why I also didn't get vaccinated for HPV. I don't agree with her choice, but I also understand why she thinks the way she does
I had to go in for X-Rays awhile back. The technicians asked if there was a possibility that I was pregnant because the radiation could be harmful to the baby. I said: “well, I’d be getting an abortion anyway. So, you’d be doing half the job for me.” ……..Their faces said 😶 I was joking. Still one of my favorites I’ve dropped on someone.
Once again Brittany, thank you for being willing to make the content and hold conversations on topics many shy away from, holding space for these discussions is so important and especially when it's done in a way that cuts through, (as you put so well) the billboard speak. Something I really wish was brought up in this conversation and so often gets left out (although was touched on very briefly by Little Dove) is the immense lack of care, funds and resources around babies and children in foster homes and government care facilities without parents. It's all well and good to be pro life to the point of believing all babies should be brought into this world regardless of whether the parents are able to provide for them or not but what about the hundreds of thousands of children that have been brought into the world and are now without parents or being passed around home after home? There are so many children that are already thinking, functioning junior members of our society that are lacking stable care, love and homes but they are rarely ever taken into account within this conversation.
im so beyond happy ive found your channel, i was seriously going through that 4 turmoil. after finding you and hearing the clairity you have, i hope im on the path to being a 5
I gotta say, after seeing some of Jubilee's other videos, i think they did their best to get a good group for this topic. I deeply felt what Asher was saying around the 7 minute mark. I definitely believe that a man shouldn't have any say over what a woman wants to do with her body, even though the fetus is a result of both a man and a woman, it's still inside of the woman's body. However, I believe it's just as wrong for a man to then be on the hook for a baby that he didn't want to be born. Either way both parents need to be on one accord before a baby is born, else that's just asking for trouble and strife. At the end of the day, people need to discuss these types of things with their partner before they get to the point of actually potentially having a kid together. That's the only way you can pre-emptively mitigate a lot of these issues i feel. I know it isn't seen as attractive to ask these things when you're first getting to know someone, but I dunno, I'm not sure what a better alternative would be.
This is harsh but I straight up do not care if abortion is murder. I don’t care. I still think it’s necessary, and there should be an accessible, safe option for everyone who wants one, even if it’s TECHNICALLY murder. I spent a chunk of my childhood throughout foster homes, and I am deeply traumatized from it, on top of everything else that was happening in my life. I wouldn’t wish that pain on anyone, and I don’t care to hear someone’s opinion who didn’t also have experience in the foster system because they simply do not know what it’s like
Yes. The question " Is abortion murder" presupposes that everybody thinks murder is wrong thus deciding whether abortions should be legal or not. There are many ppl that feel murder is not morally wrong under certain context e.g death penalty.
The line on whether we consider a fetus of personhood is often times inconsistent. My mother in law who works for a school district new a young junior in high school who got into a fight with another student who was pregnant, when she beat the pregnant girl down she made a comment along the lines of “I’m gonna f%@king kill your baby b$?&h!” and proceeded to kick her in the belly. This junior ended up getting arrested and charged with assault and battery, but because of that kill her baby comment she made and the kicking of her belly, she was additionally charged with 1st degree attempted murder and was facing 25 years to life in prison and would be tried as an adult. So in this situation the prosecutors clearly see the baby as a human being. But how come in other cases they aren’t? Questions like that always confuse me.
i loved hearing your thoughts on this topic. i totally agree that it’s way too nuanced to take an objective stance. i am pro choice but i really do understand why people feel so strongly against it. i became even more pro choice after getting pregnant. i had hyperemesis and it was so bad i thought i was going to die. pregnancy is no fucking joke, and although i kept my baby and i’m so happy that i did- i love being a mother- but if i got pregnant again, i would likely abort. BUT i desperately do not want to have to make that choice, just as much as i desperately do not want to endure pregnancy again, so my partner and i are extremely careful in making sure it doesn’t happen.
I think abortion is murder, that said, I (for the absolutely nothing it's worth) have some thoughts. 1- murder is not always "bad." We all know that sometimes self defense is totally justified, but there are way messier examples. Two kids go fight in a stupid war, and one kills the other. I don't feel comfortable saying that is "justified" but I also couldn't punish or shame the person or try to ban that behavior. 2 the conversation around abortion has alot of parallels to the slavery conversation. I spent money on this person, my property my choice vs. your choice ends where it eclipses another persons. I obviously think the abolitionists were correct, but I also don't think that every slave owner throughout humanity's thousands of years of slavery was automatically evil or even necessarily "wrong" given their time and culture. 3 - I think Christians should have the same attitude towards sexual "sins" that they do to all other "sins" like gluttony, greed, etc. There is no where near the same emotional reaction, rhetoric, desire to pry and control around those behaviors. I can think someone should be in shape, but also not make it my business.
Often people who genuinely think that they have a nuanced opinion on this matter downplay and/or conveniently avoid the cold hard fact that an advocation for anti-choice is an advocation to force women (and young girls) into resentfully raising the children of rapists and/or entering motherhood prematurely against their will. Does the value of human life increase or decrease with the acquisition of skill over the course of a lifetime? I cannot fathom a more fitting example for cognitive dissonance than the concept of death before birth. Shall we not strive to provide children with families capable of liberating them from the lifelong struggle of an unintentional existence? Really enjoy your thoughtful input on these types of topics. Keep em comin sista
I'm pro life (w/ the three exceptions) and I struggle to see how I am "forcing" anyone who had consensual sex to not terminate their pregnancy. If they engaged in an action that can result in a life being formed, that person(s) is accountable for their own actions.
I don't think the most important question is defining murder. Aborting is by definition murder, it's that deep. Then you ask yourself is murder wrong. I think it's amoral. We kill for a bunch of reasons whether it's food or our personal interests, it's just part of nature. Murder is a means to achieve an end but there lies the real question. Does the end justifies the mean? This is entirely up to ones moral/value system and why there will never be an answer on this topic.
I think a man should understand the risk of sex - that he could become a father. It's correct that a woman expects us to be prepared, while still having the right to reject pregnancy. They pay a higher price. "I was pro life until I had an unwanted pregnancy"... surely that's not taking responsibility for your actions. I wonder what he was preaching as a pro-lifer up until that point.
This conversation always makes me grateful for my Catholic mother who had a couple miscarriages and a stillborn child, and is adamantly against abortion due to her beliefs and experiences. I became sexually active as a teenager which she obviously did not like, but she still made sure I had access to birth control and sex education. I was so young and foolish, I’m sure I would have had an unwanted pregnancy at some point without her guidance. Thanks to her, I never had to consider getting an abortion.
It makes me grateful for my Christian mom and nana (who lived with us after my dad was killed). My dad was killed when I was 4 by a drunk driver. My mom was asked before if she would have considered aborting me if she knew my dad was going to die so young. A big no no once you already have the baby. But my mom and nana taught me to try and wait for my wedding night and I did. Aside from "try to wait", they gave me the birds and bees talk young and said if I needed birth control to prevent getting pregnant, they wouldn't be thrilled but they would take me the the gynecologist to get put on birth control. I'm so happy that I had them for that, could trust them and have never been faced with a decision to have an abortion.
I'm pro-choice, but I really can't associate with that crowd anymore. For me, I've always supported the legality of abortion because I have known so many children that have grown up in terrible households that I want to basically destroy any excuse or argument for people to be bad parents to their children. By supporting access to abortion, I am trying to instill responsibility back onto the future potential parent to make the choice they are most able to handle. If abortion AND adoption are both valid options, then I see no reason to ever hold back on bad/abusive parents in a courtroom setting. I want every child to be wanted and every parent/legal guardian to take their intentionally chosen job seriously. That said, I can't support the pro-choice movement in it's current form; It scares the heck out of me that there are now so many young women who have no context of how difficult it was to legalize abortion and that by trivializing it they are absolutely re-enforcing every point behind criminalizing it again. It shocks and horrifies me at also how people assume all women support abortion; no. That's not reality. Planet Earth is composed of 51% bio-females vs, the remainer bio-males. The pro-life movement continues to be as strong as it is because so many women support it. Assuming that this issue falls on biological sex or gender identity lines is dumb. If abortion ever is criminalized again, it will be because the pro-choice movement succeeded in alienating enough of it's supporters to stop voting to keep it legal.
Incredibly well said! Every child that comes onto this planet should be loved, cared for and wanted. As a Christian, we're suppose to believe every life is sacred. But how many times has something Christian broadcast shown starving babies and children - abused, neglected, sick without the ability to get healthcare and so on. I'm Christian but pro choice if all other options have been exhausted and if abortion is done early, legally and safely. But the pro choice movement has turned into something I don't want to be a part of either. They don't realize how hard it had to be fought for to do it safely. My great-great grandmother died with a coat hanger inside of her. That's how it was done back then and it seems a lot of the current pro choice doesn't realize that back then all you could do was put a coat hanger inside of you, take literal poison that could kill you too or find an underground doctor if you could afford the hefty fee and pray they knew what they were doing. They don't realize how hard it was to legalize after Roe vs Wade and how many people, women and men fought to provide every woman a safe choice.
thank you for speaking on this! I'm pro-abortion but i find the pro-choice peoples' insistence on their definition of 'life' soooo annoying and (in most ways, though not all) super counterproductive. It literally plays directly into the pseudo christian propaganda that created anti-abortion laws to begin with.
Is abortion murder? No. ❌ And women should never have to argue their position on it, or justify a decision made about it. It is the decision of the individual who may have any number of reasons, but one is enough. And if their decision is difficult, they should be supported and comforted, not doused with the morals of others to leave guilt and shame behind. If it isn't happening to your body personally, either support the person through their decision or shut up, their circumstances are not known to you and they don't have to justify themselves to strangers. It's not about the life of a potential/eventual baby, its about the already existing life of the person who wants to not be pregnant. Which could be due to rape, abuse, maybe they're currently being abused, maybe the foetus isnt doing well (eg in prezeclampsia cases where organs don't form properly), sociozeconomic circumstances mean that the child would grow up in poverty, maybe they're a school-age person or student who wants to achieve their goals before starting a family... maybe they have a rare, debilitating or dangerous health condition or disability that they don't wanr to pass on to another human. Also, people get abortions for miscarriages too when they're not happening naturally because it could cause infection.
Oh my, this is such a hard topic. I have to say i'm quite content with the laws in my country Sweden surrounding this: Able to abort up till week 18 (would presonally prefer to see that down to 13 weeks / first trimester), and then only if the mother's health is in serious danger. No abortions post week 22 (viability). I haven't really thought trough wether it's murder or not. I would say it's not untill baby = viable, but then people can say that humans who are living with help from the outside or they would be dead, wouldn't be human etc. It's a complicated topic, but at the end of the day, murder or not, i am pro choice (up till a certain gestational age).
I'm not necessarily against the abortions but after a close examination of this issue I do think that abortion is terminating one's life, or killing if you prefer. But can murder ever be justified? I'll leave that question for anyone reading to ponder on. Regardless, I don't think in purely black and white terms. From my perspective abortion can be both the right as well as wrong course of action. It can be a morally correct choice or it can be nothing more than running away from responsibility, depending on many different factors and circumstances. That being said, I do strongly believe that so many people choose to think that an unborn baby isn't alive because it makes it so much easier to go through with that decision when you think that nobody is being harmed or killed, unlike thinking in terms of "I'm about to end someone's existence."
This is my honest view: I believe a fetus is alive but I view killing it the same as I view killing a bug or a pest animal if it’s unwanted. Same way a lot of humans will have pets like cats and dogs and value their lives but will not hesitate to kill an annoying mosquito or fly if it’s being annoying.
I think on a moral stand point if we can figure out when the nerves and brain process pain, there is a conversation I would find interesting to have. I don’t think it would make it anymore black or white tho
There are some doctors who have said when they believe pain signals reach the brain but it's all over, depending on who you ask. But you're right - it doesn't make it anymore black and white
Ok that tadpole comparison is funny. I feel like I'd feel HELLA bad if I dumped a bunch of tadpoles. Maybe even more so cuz little dudes can't even jump and run 😭 Dope video, Brittany. U feed my soul~
I wake up everyday thanking God (not God but maybe more like mom, but indirectly) that my mother encouraged me to use birth control. My body doesn't do well with hormones, but I was the sort of teenager to get pregnant (troubled, drugs, victim of abuse) and I could easily have a baby today. She did always threaten me that if I got pregnant, I'd have to have an abortion. I have the same views on it as you, now, but before I was furiously pro abortion you could say. If I'd feel heartbroken over tadpoles, I know I'd be heartbroken over an unborn child or fetus or whatever. And I'm just so grateful I never had to think about it.
my personal opinion its a clump of cells. pregnancy is simply a hugely traumatic thing for women and those are facts no ifs or buts. now imagine being forced to carry it out till the end and the torture of childbirth itself. why should a father have a say in it its not like he goes through pregnancy 🤷♀️ and imagine being forced to carry a rapists baby. i was literally just waiting for the pro lifers to pounce ngl. in two words - PRO CHOICE and mind your own business just like everything else in life
I almost think the question of when does life begin is as complicated as what is the meaning of life. They're similar in the way that everyone will have a slightly different opinion and I don't know if we will ever objectively know the truth
Hey Britt! As a Christian who worships Jesus, I am pro choice. Every child should be wanted, loved and provided for before they even arrive on the planet but sadly, that's not the case. How many times are Christian organizations asking for money for starving, abused, neglected children? But they want to shut down they idea a simple fertilized egg removal is killing life. Even if that "life" won't be wanted. I'm all for other options first - pregnancy prevention (and education) and adoption. If they're already pregnant and adoption is not an option, have an abortion as early as possible. My great great grandmother died with a coat hanger in her. It was that, literal poison or an underground doc if you could afford one back then. And pray the doctor knew what they were doing so the woman didn't die. We have come so far - we can't go back to those dark days. Love your babies, always. You're blessed to have them. A lot of us can't make them.
@@misfitbrit1989 Sure, so then my argument would be who are you to say that your subjective opinion on their living circumstances would justify them not existing at all/an abortion? And what would those standards be? Ok so if the child would go into foster care and live a miserable depressing life for 70 years...ok yeah that one should be aborted. But what about the foster care child who's life sucks and then they end up being taken in by a loving family, go to college, become a lawyer, and have a loving family themselves. 1.) you dont know the future and 2.) there's no way to judge what circumstances are bad enough to warrant an abortion.
@@sambf one question for you, Sam. Do you have the organs to carry a child? If not, sit down and mind your own uterus. I believe in a women's right to choose.
@@sambf there's not always a foster care system behind unwanted babies. You can look up how many people don't care for their children or do worse. There are kids left in hot cars, kids that go to bed hungry, if not starving, dirty, in clothes and shoes they've outgrown, sick, exposed to drugs/alcohol and without help. The sad reality is there's not always someone who comes to the rescue and it's a living hell for those kids. When the system is involved, it doesn't make things better for the child. How about moms like Casey Anthony? Scary enough, women like her who don't want their babies but won't give them up either are alive and well. There was poll done on millennial parents alone recently asking if they ever regretted becoming parents, over a third said they regretted motherhood. And that's in the midst of declining birth rates, notably in that age group. What happens when someone regrets bringing a life into the world and isn't the best person? They end up causing harm and hurt and typically with a target in mind. Or how about the sperm donor who just shot his 3 boys? Or the man who took his one day old baby outside and shot her twice in the head? Those are just a few stories and the ones that made national attention. That doesn't include the stories that don't get media attention. Is it less cruel to wait until they're here and can feel everything to end life or stop it before they can feel anything? As I said in my original comment, I'm for prevention and adoption before abortion. Whatever the individual circumstances are are between the 2 that started it. The final decision is up to the one who has to carry that life. Adoption rates in the US are falling drastically. Many of us can barely take care of what we have on our plates due to inflation and a serious increase in the cost of living. A couple who could be amazing parents may not have the time, money and legal resources to adopt may have to use that 10 grand they had planned for adoption costs alone (not to mention the costs that come with actually raising the child) for emergency savings, retirement, paying down their mortgage or what have you. And our system is already flooded with kids in orphanages or foster care. There's other reasons I stand with a right to choose. Abortion is sad but bringing an unwanted life into this world to only suffer is far more sad. Also, you asked who I am. A mother, a mother of an angel that was born sleeping and proud uterus owner. If you don't have the parts responsible for carrying the life brought into this world, you can speak on women's issues but I don't believe you get much of a say. Mind your own womb and if you don't have one, sit down.
Oh I love seeing the moment when Ethan said the name of the baby.. Thats just a straight up fail. Love that family. And also I am pro-abortion. If I now got pregnant, with my long distance boyfriend in college, with at least 3 more years to go.. I would abort. If I didnt it would quite frankly ruin my life and my baby would come in a instable home, where we could not provide for it. And I want my kids to have a great life. But if someone wants to keep the child, I'm for it. It should be a personal thing, like a case to case thing
Personally I think the problem is most pro-lifers are not pro-life they’re pro birth and they think demeaning, lying, and pushing their religion is the answer. Then on the other side pro choice responds to their anger and bullshit with more anger and bullshit creating lots of anger and a big divide that shouldn’t be there. I don’t care either way so being able to watch it objectively makes it clear that people are arguing just to argue and most do it to side with their political/religious affiliation. Just like they do with everything else.
Great video! You really got me seeing certain points from the sides of the pro-lifers. Sure, we can call abortion murder but I think that’s such a subjective conversation I don’t engage in it much. All I care about, is as you said bodily autonomy trumps the whole discussion. It’s also interesting because most pro-choice people I know in my life don’t “celebrate” abortion, they just want people to have the freedom of choice to do what’s best for their body. Pro-lifers often times are pushing for anti-abortion legislation BEFORE legislation to help our sexual education, foster care and healthcare systems which is my biggest issue. Those should be the components you’re fighting heavily for the most in my opinion before trying to push for what you actually want which is to make abortions illegal everywhere.
Also this might be a stupid comment, but if abortion is murder, then what is the difference between that and a miscarriage? Manslaughter? Maybe someone else has a better idea but I always thought it was weird that the body can naturally get rid of it and abortion is ok purpose kind of thing.
My 2 abortions were chemical abortions done at home w pills I was under 10 weeks pregnant. I love abortions. I also love my son! But I never really felt like I was pregnant until I was involved with a pregnancy that was consciously my choice for a human I wanted to bring in my life. I agree the binary is difficult. But the fact that this is even a debate is a bit exhausting to me. My son has been the most amazing thing. Each abortion I had was a month long. Grueling pain. One was in my rented room. One was in the psych ward. [I was in the ward five months that abortion I remember less than the first one]. And still, I don't have trauma related to my abortions. I dont feel like I murdered anyone. I love life. I don't really pay attention to these debates as much anymore because I also know many pro life ppl have abortions and just are against them for politics or in the public eye or until their daughter gets pregnant. Idk I think announcing I love abortion is necessary because it is not a guaranteed "right" everywhere. To me that's upsetting. Hopefully in future more people get a choice and those that don't want to partake for whatever reason don't have to. I get everyone has nuance but my abortions were a wonderful.
@@nerissagarrett267 I do!! I had sex without my consent and also was not in a state where I was able to consent so the person knew and didn't care. Thankfully I'm in a better place and not still dealing with that part of my life in a way I did not want to nor was ready for BUT!! Even if that wasn't the case I would still LOVE abortion because while it is sad I don't think it is right to shame anyone for needing that procedure. I think the stigma/controversy adds a layer of emotion that is unnecessary.
@@nerissagarrett267 and I have a beautiful son who was my choice who I love and adore because I waited until I was ready! And got pregnant with the intention of having a child! Later on after dealing with myself physically and mentally! Sorry you're disturbed but it didn't feel like I was killing a baby at all! I can understand later term situations being more upsetting but I LOVE having the choice! I love women having agency
Asher was gold. As a woman, I really appreciate and agree with his takes from both sides. No man should be tied to an accidental pregnancy either if they make it clear they don't want it. But man, if you say no baby and then stick around, you better help your baby momma! If you don't want it and she does, you're gonna have to work something out or leave her too. It's a grey area for sure, but I can't imagine keeping a partner around in that situation whose not invested in helping the kid. Or being that partner and just pretending everything is normal after that lol. And in the end, if they disagree that heavily on something so important, it's most likely not meant to be.
I wish they would‘ve gone more into the question of what constitutes murder and how we even define it. Or what makes one life more valuable than another, like how we value human life more than animal life. Interesting stuff and yeah not black and white at all. Also brittany are you gonna make a full podcast on your thoughts on the vaccine cause I would be interested😇
I say this as someone who has seen a baby born at 5 months survive and then a year later you would never have known that they were born at the size of a small baked potato: Abortion is categorically wrong and should be illegal. That life was capable of expressing pleasure and pain. It was capable of learning and taking in new information and I cannot stress enough that this baby would fit in the palm of your hand and looked like something from an alien movie. And yet it had all of the qualities I would argue most define humanity. Bodily autonomy is very important and I would argue perhaps our most sacred right. But it seems like no one values the bodily autonomy of the baby as they're willing to transgress against it in the worst possible way, by ending its life entirely. I think what I may be badly saying is that both of us are arguing about bodily autonomy, one of us for the woman, one of us for the baby. The end results of being anti abortion is not final consequences against bodily autonomy which can never be taken back. In fact, they will return in 5 to 9 months if not sooner in unhealthy pregnancy. Pro choice is final. There are no take backs. A baby is dead. The baby will not be alive again in 5 to 9 months. Bodily autonomy game overed. It's plain wrong. And we can quibble about nuance and agree wrong things happen all the time in life, and this is true. But the point of laws is not to reflect what is and what we are. The point of laws is to call us together to better. To do better. To be more than whatever this mess called life would make us and penalize us if we fail to be better than our naturally poor decision making process would make us. And to scare some of us from ever getting penalized. Nuance is useful, don't get me wrong, that's why I like this channel, but laws shouldn't reflect nuance. They should be firm boundaries to keep us from running amok.
I just can’t see the REAL argument. I see why more conservative ppl don’t want them legal. I get it. BUT when you remove the arguments from either side and break it down to the core. It’s a whole beautiful conscious human being vs. an unconscious “life”. No real argument there.
Scientists doesn't know if a fertilized egg or fetus has a concious. Hypothetically it could have conciousness. You cant see conciousness, only the works of it could be seen just like gravity.
(my current take) abortion is not murder in the first trimester and is self defense if the woman was raped. murder is defined as unlawful but I get the point being presented. Is abortion morally wrong? Presumably there is no consciousness in the first trimester so I think its fine in that case. The rape scenario is a bit different. I think its okay to abort during the entire pregnancy in that case as your body is being damaged and used against your will. I would say that is self defense. I think an early stage fetus is distinct from a coma patient in that they have yet to emerge as a conscious being. you wouldn't be killing a "someone" but a "something". being in a coma is morally tantamount to being asleep. also, at a certain point coma patients are aloud to die.
My mother's side was 'pretty' Catholic. But apparently they were fairly flexible when it came to sex. As long as a daughter is with someone they 'love' and 'care' about and use contraception, then it wasn't a big deal. They were also personally pro-life. Catholics can't get them, but other people can.
I had a miscarriage and no one gave a fuck. Honestly. Not my family, not the 'father' of the fetus. I'm pro-choice and that experience made me double down on my pro-choice stance. People truly do not think of fetuses as 'real babies'. Even when you know the sex of the fetus. Even when you start thinking of names and having celebrations. Not even the 'father' of this fetus WHO IS PRO-LIFE cared that much about the miscarriage. He didn't shed a tear while I was fucking devastated for months. Eventually I got over it.
My thoughts on abortion is as follows: 1: A fetus is a person. I am willing to have some flexibility on just when in the first few months that occurs, but the only reasonable conclusion I have been able to settle on is that well before 6 months it is a separate human life that merits full legal personhood. That being the case, abortion without strong justification is murder. I am not a fan of dictating what people can or can't do, but I think it is pretty universally accepted that murder is wrong and should be illegal. 2: There are plenty of options and ways to prevent a pregnancy. Condoms, contraceptives, plan-B, abstinence, etc, so the risk of getting pregnant is pretty low. 3: With so many options available to prevent pregnancy in the first place, ending a human life as an act of "Oh s**t, I'm pregnant" birth control is highly immoral. However, just with any OTHER human life, there are contexts in which ending it is legal. Just like any other self defense ruling, if the pregnancy is a significant health and safety risk to the mother, then abortion would be legal. Major medical issues for the mother or baby. I would probably include rape in there as well, even though it is less clearly "self defense" because it is a traumatic experience and I would not force a woman to relive that trauma by keeping the child (though I would encourage adoption as an alternative). 4: Women have legal options to turn over the child if they don't want it: The father can take it if he is willing, she can go through an adoption service, or safe haven services mean she can literally drop the baby off at an acceptable gas station. Conversely, the father has no such legal recourse. I have had people say "Once he puts his D in her V, he has given up all choice and all rights in the matter." The only choice a man has left at that point is that IF the mother offers to allow him to be involved in the child's life, he can accept or reject it. The father has no say in abortions. The father has no say in adoptions. If the law gets involved then the father is legally obligated to pay child support. Which brings me to: 5: If men have no say in the life of a fetus, then in the interests of equality, I think women should be bound by the same laws. Once a woman becomes legally pregnant she might have a short grace period (see point 1) where abortion might be an option, but after that she has the same rights and responsibilities as a father. Further more, if the father is laden with responsibility for the child at any point, adoption and safe-haven would require the consent of both parents. 6: I would say it is pretty obvious that we can't prevent teens from having sex. That being the case, I would be fine with government providing free contraceptives to people 16-20. At 21 they are adult enough to take responsibility for themselves and should do so. Do I think this is a good answer? No. I think providing free contraceptives will encourage kids to have sex. But I do think it is the best of a bad set of options. 7: I am not sure how adoption is now, but I think it should be as easy and painless for the parents as possible. The only requirement I would place on young parents giving a child because they don't feel they can adequately take of it, is to prove that they have the legal right to do so. - - - I really see it coming down to three questions: Is a fetus a person? If yes, when is it acceptable to kill a person? How do we move forward based on the other two questions? - - - I've thought about the subject a lot, and I think it is the best compromise we will get. The comment, on the other hand, is somewhat off the cuff, so hopefully I conveyed the information adequately.
This is fantastic! Please do more videos like this. These are the thoughts and conversations we should be having. My position is very similar to yours in a way. I believe you are ending a life with an abortion and us as a sexually active human should understand that when we have sex conceiving a baby is a possibility even if we are taking all the protective measures. As responsible adults we should be aware of the consequences of our actions. Choosing to abort a baby or keep a baby when you don’t have the means to take care of them are both life changing decisions and the Choice we make in this situation is something we will live with forever. Because once you get pregnant you have to make a Choice. I believe we do have the right to this choice because it is our body and I believe we have the right to do what we want to our bodies whether that results in not having the baby or keep them. I believe sexually active humans should think about this situation and ask them Themselves “god forbid I get pregnant unexpectedly, but if it happens at this point in my life, I might have to make the very hard decision of will I keep the baby or will I not keep the baby? And what every Choice I make Am I ready to live with the consequences of that choice. I hope that makes scenes lol.
I don’t like the idea of abortions, and I can see why others can be upset by them. Such as religion and believing that it is life, which I can respect but don’t necessarily agree, I’m pro choice at the end of the day though because it isn’t my choice. People should be able to have full body autonomy.
Bro I’m high as f and I’ve been eating ur vids like candy 23:40 I paused and I’m like in a new dimensions lmao I been getting it but wow I get it fuck lol
My thought process on abortion 1-Abortion is murder. That is a fact but it doesn't feel very descriptive, does it? Underlying the meaning of a word there are certain suppositions. The context in which we use "murder" is 99% extremely different from the context of abortion. Fetus and baby mean exactly the same, yet one is coldness and the other is love. The same thing is appliable to "human", beyond its definition, we have a set of ideas related to "what being a human is" and most of the time they have nothing to do with DNA. 2-Ending a life is wrong. But why the killing of a plant doesn't matter? Is it because it doesn't feel anything, is it the lack of consciousness, or is it the great difference between us that doesn't allow us to master the courage to feel empathy? Why do we have value meanwhile other forms of life have less? We are at the end of the food chain, eliminating us from the planet might be much better for other species than perhaps killing all microbes (causing a chain reaction that will seriously affect ecosystems). Therefore "value" is subjective, some people want as many humans on Earth as possible, and others none. 3-It is a choice that stops someone from being. A simple condom could also do that, should they be illegal because someone who came as a surprise wouldn't have been born if one was used? Should we give birth to every hypothetical human? It seems to me that what we want to protect is the idea of a person that we have internalized, instead of the present human. Generally, mammal's embryos are pretty similar and we could see a picture of one and mistakingly think is a human. 4- Abortion should be illegal because some people are forced to abort. That is the same issue people who desire an abortion face, it is the lack of bodily autonomy that hurts us so deeply, that's why I am pro-choice.
Great video brittany☺. My thoughts on the burning building scenario that you posed would be I would pick the 3 year old, my thinking being that the embryos don't have the capacity to feel pain due to the stage they are in and the fact that they are frozen. If the scenario was instead would you save a 20 week old fetus that is alive lying on a tray or a three year old in all honesty I would do everything in my power to save both and if not possible I would save the three year old simply based on my understanding of a greater capacity to suffer( would take longer for a three year old to die due to smoke inhalation and or burns than the 20 week old fetus) but not because one had more worth to me than the other. I had a unplanned pregnancy and I knew I could end his life if I wanted but I didnt want too. When he was a newborn and I had post partum depression I knew I could end his life if I wanted but I didnt want to and even now I could end his or my other two adorable kids lives. I just don't want too and wont because I see their lives as equal or greater than my own. I dont think anyone can make an induvidual see someone elses worth or even their autonomy unless they want to. R*pest and CMs and murders are usually making a choice to not acknowlage their victims humanity it does not change whether it exist. Not that I'm comparing the two but also I kinda am but I'm not if that makes sense. Thanks for all your effort you put into your videos!
Old video but I'll comment. I think fetuses are alive. Personhood is irrelevant to why I'm pro-choice. People should not be forced to remain pregnant or give birth against their will even if that means ending a life. Pregnancy is not an inconvenience, it increases your mortality and morbidity rates and needs to be consented to. I also don't give fetuses the same value as I do infants, I value embryos much much less than I do fetuses. I'll call it a baby if you want though idc. I would prefer to never have an abortion but there are circumstances where I'd want or need one and circumstances where I might decide to have one or not. And a lot of those circumstances aren't currently legal in my state. In my part of post-roe America, I wouldn't be able to get an abortion if I had a fatal fetal abnormality, my state's laws have made abortion a less accessible option for missed miscarriages, my attorney general personally blocks women who try to get abortions for health reasons and there is also no SA/incest exception. Pro-life legislation is anti-human rights and anti-women's health. I would not even want to carry a wanted pregnancy in my state. I don't feel safe doing so.
I never understood the Christian stance because in the Bible it says breath is life. And there’s nothing in there about actual abortion. So maybe I’m confused about how it’s written
The Hebrew word is "Neshamah" and it means spirit, souls, breath, inspiration and blast. Keep in mind that when you take your first breath it's a countdown til when you'll take your last.
The Bible doesn't have to flat out say every thing you just have to pray for insight and interpretation. Let's say Mary aborted Jesus, that would be catastrophic but there's no words that exist to really describe it. Keep in mind that Mary was a virgin and Jesus immaculate and miraculous birth was foretold all through the old testament. Politically correct people today will say Mary didn't give GOD consent to miraculously impregnate her so that was devine rape. Fyi Mary did agree to the assignment she was so destined for.
I take Destiny's perspective on this... (Roughly his perspective anyway) I value a life if it is experiencing a relatively high level of consciousness OR if it has previously experienced a relatively high level of consciousness that it can be reasonably expected to further experience in the future... If the consciousness was not reasonably high level then people would be monstrous for every insect they unknowingly tread upon... And if the being has never experienced consciousness like this then they would not have lost anything but potential... And potential isn't really worth much, otherwise we'd take into consideration every life that could potentially be created by everyone if the entire world just started engaging in impregnating as many people as possible... As well as also all the potential humans who die before being born... And unless you think those cancel each other out (which they probably don't unless you just want to claim that they do to make it simple...) then people are either going to be terrible for neglecting one of those by not constantly trying to reproduce or by reproducing as much as they currently do (an anti-natalism perspective I guess)... Also you'd need to factor in many other things like preserving the environment by not driving cars and such since the needs of the dozens or even hundreds of billions of potential future humans outweigh the needs for the 7 billion currently to get places faster... Idk, there's a ton more examples you could really consider against taking potential future people's lives into consideration which shows why that's dumb... So you need to figure out personhood and a lot of the ways of doing that (i.e. first heartbeat) seem rather arbitrary compared to the beginning of consciousness... Which would still be something that begins in the womb, but current abortion laws seem fine for when that happens last I checked...
I don't know if the conversation is the same in and outside of the united states...but we've failed everyone if people need to use abortions as a reliable birth control. Just teaching men how to properly pull out instead of abstinence would decrease the problem significantly.
I don't think "Trans women are women" is really looking for a fight, it's quite possible that it became a slogan of sorts of progressive people as a reaction to people saying the exact opposite (which they often have been for a long time and often when they are looking for a fight with someone more progressive on the issue)... If a person constantly insults you and you insult them back, is it because you're the one whose looking for a fight? Reminds me of King Charles XII of Sweden who was constantly fighting defensive wars throughout his life and he is often quoted as saying "I have resolved never to start an unjust war but never to end a legitimate one except by defeating my enemies."
I am pro choice but do not think abortion is the right choice for me. I often have to explain it. I want women to have the choice. And having the baby is just as much a choice as having an abortion.
I say this as someone who has seen a baby born at 5 months survive and then a year later you would never have known that they were born at the size of a small baked potato: Abortion is categorically wrong and should be illegal. That life was capable of expressing pleasure and pain. It was capable of learning and taking in new information and I cannot stress enough that this baby would fit in the palm of your hand and looked like something from an alien movie. And yet it had all of the qualities I would argue most define humanity. Bodily autonomy is very important and I would argue perhaps our most sacred right. But it seems like no one values the bodily autonomy of the baby as they're willing to transgress against it in the worst possible way, by ending its life entirely. I think what I may be badly saying is that both of us are arguing about bodily autonomy, one of us for the woman, one of us for the baby. The end results of being anti abortion is not final consequences against bodily autonomy which can never be taken back. In fact, they will return in 5 to 9 months if not sooner in unhealthy pregnancy. Pro choice is final. There are no take backs. A baby is dead. The baby will not be alive again in 5 to 9 months. Bodily autonomy game overed. It's plain wrong. And we can quibble about nuance and agree wrong things happen all the time in life, and this is true. But the point of laws is not to reflect what is and what we are. The point of laws is to call us together to better. To do better. To be more than whatever this mess called life would make us and penalize us if we fail to be better than our naturally poor decision making process would make us. And to scare some of us from ever getting penalized. Nuance is useful, don't get me wrong, that's why I like this channel, but laws shouldn't reflect nuance. They should be firm boundaries to keep us from running amok.
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Original video: ruclips.net/video/wrQYHeodRio/видео.html
I just don’t think killing a fetus is on the same level as killing a child. Like they keep saying child when that fetus isn’t even a baby yet. Sure fetus’s aren’t just dead clumps of cells, but they aren’t children either. Obviously I’m not gonna say I’m an expert on the situation, but there’s no way a fetus and child are at the same level of consciousness, And that’s what’s really important to me, stopping the life from growing isn’t the same as murder
Like the Bible says life begins at first breath. Not that I care about religion but the majority of pro-lifers are pro-life solely because of their religion.
Abortion is murder. If not why charge murders twice when they kill a pregnant woman? It’s a human life at conception if not we wouldn’t charge murders twice if they kill a pregnant woman. It’s the same thing just one situation is intentional and the other one isn’t. That’s crazy to me.
My mom was a victim of rape. She had my 3 half siblings at a very young age. Her 4th pregnancy her father and mother made her get an abortion. She didn't want one. She still feels guilty about it. I try to remind her that she was young, pressured, didn't have a choice. I'm so thankful I have my siblings. They are amazing, and have always protected me. Due to my mother's experiences I'm pro choice. I wish my mom had a choice. I don't want to see anyone lose their Bodily autonomy
sorry that happened, wishing your family lots of good healing vibes ,they sound like great peeps :)
Beautiful story. Willing to have an conversation, analyzing the pro choice or pro life policies can have in society?
it's kind of weird to watch these conversations happen. i worked as a doula, midwife, and as a provider of abortions (outside of the usa). i am also a mother. i would point out that every cell, organ, etc inside a human body is a part of human life. a kidney. a heart. a fingernail. a fetus. but we make choices all the time as to what parts of human life we want to live, and what parts we want to die. yes, seeing an aborted fetus is disgusting. but also seeing a kidney taken out of the body is disgusting as well. most things that come out of the human body are bloodied and dismembered and gory. on a moral life level, i think i see it (kind of like, but this is also kind of simplified) similar to the argument: if someone needs a kidney to live. and i have a kidney, i have the right to not give up my kidney. even if that means he will die without it. even though i can live with only one kidney.
being pregnant really made me go from being pro-choice to 'pro-abortion' - because my pregnancy was so difficult and i was sick for most of it. and i realized no one should have to go through that kind of bodily torture w/o their consent. i am very happy i chose to be pregnant and to have my kid. she is my life. i love babies, taking care of kids, taking care of pregnant people, birth, and abortions. all of it is part of life, part of the human experience. i am also happy that when birth control failed i had other options.
and i have said - i love abortions. because of the relief that it gives people. the way it gives people their lives back. most abortions ive seen are for people who are already a mother and dont want another child because they can't afford it (financially, energetically, physically) - okay i have to go now. maybe i will write more later.
thanks for sharing your experience!
Thank you for sharing that.
I feel like it's easier to cling to the idea that unborn babies are just cells because women feel like they need to explain themselves for THEIR decision. People just need to stay out of other people's business unless it effects them directly.
Pro lifers need to focus their energy on changing the system (like more resources for single moms, black moms, moms in general) and if they do, then they might have a sort of decent argument. But the truth is, its absolutely terrifying to have a baby in a situation that is not ideal. That means carefully planned. We also need to talk about the simple fact that people need to be a lot more cautious when having sex.
Completely agree with this! 🙌🏻
I'm pro life. I don't doubt at all that having a baby in a situation that is not ideal is terrifying. But I would place more emphasis on your last statement about caution when having sex, as I believe an abortion is a termination of a life in progress.
I have exactly your view! I used to be pro-life, I still think human fetuses are persons, but can't support the government banning all abortions because of bodily autonomy.
Same its a very complex situation.
The problem is people think they have a Kantian approach to ethics when they actually a Humean one. Abortion for me is a case by case basis in terms of right vs wrong. As far as legislation I am pro choice.
By the time I had an abortion I had already decided in Philosophy class what the right answer for me was. True story. I think the only reasonable way to look at it is neutral. Because no one joyfully ends a life. But the 9(ish) month process of bringing a life into the world is not necessarily joyful either. I value life but I value myself the most and I don't think it's wrong to feel that way. Also, whatever happened to pro-choice? I can't believe there's a pro-abortion side, that's real weird.
Humans are so amazingly complex and resilient. While it is annoying, the reduction of a embryo/ fetus(baby) to "clump of cells" is a feat of our mental capacity to bring ourselves through trauma. I might be playing armchair psychology by saying so, but it seems reasonable to me. The trauma of being responsible for ending an *entire* life is certainly greater than the trauma of "getting rid of a clump of cells".
In the end, as a mother, pregnancy is an intimate and bonding experience almost immediately, motherhood is long however and draining and the "end" comes at 18 years. (Aka) Being a mother is EXHAUSTING. And going through pregnancy for 9 months is something that has to be worth it. I could never ever give up my own blood and flesh to someone else, especially a system that is so poorly working. Myself, I would regret that more than abortion.
Thank you for covering this topic. With how extreme and oppositional everyone’s views have become (even more so lately) it’s really important that we inject a little nuance into the conversation. It’s like pro choice people believe that admitting a fetus is alive will completely invalidate their beliefs. I agree with you that abortion is horrible but bodily autonomy trumps all, including when it comes to vaccines.
You know, I didn’t get the HPV vax either or a single flu shot. My mom is a bit skeptical of medical dogma after getting mutilated by a bad early generation IUD and almost losing her ability to have children. Also my older brother began showing autism symptoms after getting a vaccine. So I’ve def been influenced by her. I just think we need to maintain our right to choose. No mandates.
It's so true! My mom also had negative interactions with 80's birth control. Most of the people I know are genuinely concerned.
I agree with everything you said, except children with autism start showing sympoms at the same age they get vaccinated, so it's correlation not causation. Not saying that skepticism is bad, just adding information that could be useful for you to know
@@taina88111 yep, I am actually aware of that, Thanks though. It’s just that the kid gets old enough to make the symptoms become glaringly apparent around the same age that certain shots are due. I don’t think that the vaccine caused it, but my mom has her fears, and it definitely taught me to do my due diligence about researching medical procedures and prescriptions. I should have made that more clear in my wording 😗 😅
@@radrose4864 thanks for the clarification, I understand your position a lot better now. My mom also has medical trauma and is very skeptical of traditional medicine, that's why I also didn't get vaccinated for HPV. I don't agree with her choice, but I also understand why she thinks the way she does
I had to go in for X-Rays awhile back. The technicians asked if there was a possibility that I was pregnant because the radiation could be harmful to the baby. I said: “well, I’d be getting an abortion anyway. So, you’d be doing half the job for me.” ……..Their faces said 😶 I was joking. Still one of my favorites I’ve dropped on someone.
Once again Brittany, thank you for being willing to make the content and hold conversations on topics many shy away from, holding space for these discussions is so important and especially when it's done in a way that cuts through, (as you put so well) the billboard speak. Something I really wish was brought up in this conversation and so often gets left out (although was touched on very briefly by Little Dove) is the immense lack of care, funds and resources around babies and children in foster homes and government care facilities without parents. It's all well and good to be pro life to the point of believing all babies should be brought into this world regardless of whether the parents are able to provide for them or not but what about the hundreds of thousands of children that have been brought into the world and are now without parents or being passed around home after home? There are so many children that are already thinking, functioning junior members of our society that are lacking stable care, love and homes but they are rarely ever taken into account within this conversation.
im so beyond happy ive found your channel, i was seriously going through that 4 turmoil. after finding you and hearing the clairity you have, i hope im on the path to being a 5
You got this 🥰
I gotta say, after seeing some of Jubilee's other videos, i think they did their best to get a good group for this topic. I deeply felt what Asher was saying around the 7 minute mark. I definitely believe that a man shouldn't have any say over what a woman wants to do with her body, even though the fetus is a result of both a man and a woman, it's still inside of the woman's body. However, I believe it's just as wrong for a man to then be on the hook for a baby that he didn't want to be born. Either way both parents need to be on one accord before a baby is born, else that's just asking for trouble and strife.
At the end of the day, people need to discuss these types of things with their partner before they get to the point of actually potentially having a kid together. That's the only way you can pre-emptively mitigate a lot of these issues i feel. I know it isn't seen as attractive to ask these things when you're first getting to know someone, but I dunno, I'm not sure what a better alternative would be.
This is harsh but I straight up do not care if abortion is murder. I don’t care. I still think it’s necessary, and there should be an accessible, safe option for everyone who wants one, even if it’s TECHNICALLY murder. I spent a chunk of my childhood throughout foster homes, and I am deeply traumatized from it, on top of everything else that was happening in my life. I wouldn’t wish that pain on anyone, and I don’t care to hear someone’s opinion who didn’t also have experience in the foster system because they simply do not know what it’s like
Yes. The question " Is abortion murder" presupposes that everybody thinks murder is wrong thus deciding whether abortions should be legal or not. There are many ppl that feel murder is not morally wrong under certain context e.g death penalty.
The line on whether we consider a fetus of personhood is often times inconsistent. My mother in law who works for a school district new a young junior in high school who got into a fight with another student who was pregnant, when she beat the pregnant girl down she made a comment along the lines of “I’m gonna f%@king kill your baby b$?&h!” and proceeded to kick her in the belly. This junior ended up getting arrested and charged with assault and battery, but because of that kill her baby comment she made and the kicking of her belly, she was additionally charged with 1st degree attempted murder and was facing 25 years to life in prison and would be tried as an adult.
So in this situation the prosecutors clearly see the baby as a human being. But how come in other cases they aren’t? Questions like that always confuse me.
i loved hearing your thoughts on this topic. i totally agree that it’s way too nuanced to take an objective stance. i am pro choice but i really do understand why people feel so strongly against it. i became even more pro choice after getting pregnant. i had hyperemesis and it was so bad i thought i was going to die. pregnancy is no fucking joke, and although i kept my baby and i’m so happy that i did- i love being a mother- but if i got pregnant again, i would likely abort. BUT i desperately do not want to have to make that choice, just as much as i desperately do not want to endure pregnancy again, so my partner and i are extremely careful in making sure it doesn’t happen.
I think abortion is murder, that said, I (for the absolutely nothing it's worth) have some thoughts.
1- murder is not always "bad." We all know that sometimes self defense is totally justified, but there are way messier examples. Two kids go fight in a stupid war, and one kills the other. I don't feel comfortable saying that is "justified" but I also couldn't punish or shame the person or try to ban that behavior.
2 the conversation around abortion has alot of parallels to the slavery conversation. I spent money on this person, my property my choice vs. your choice ends where it eclipses another persons. I obviously think the abolitionists were correct, but I also don't think that every slave owner throughout humanity's thousands of years of slavery was automatically evil or even necessarily "wrong" given their time and culture.
3 - I think Christians should have the same attitude towards sexual "sins" that they do to all other "sins" like gluttony, greed, etc. There is no where near the same emotional reaction, rhetoric, desire to pry and control around those behaviors. I can think someone should be in shape, but also not make it my business.
Often people who genuinely think that they have a nuanced opinion on this matter downplay and/or conveniently avoid the cold hard fact that an advocation for anti-choice is an advocation to force women (and young girls) into resentfully raising the children of rapists and/or entering motherhood prematurely against their will.
Does the value of human life increase or decrease with the acquisition of skill over the course of a lifetime? I cannot fathom a more fitting example for cognitive dissonance than the concept of death before birth. Shall we not strive to provide children with families capable of liberating them from the lifelong struggle of an unintentional existence?
Really enjoy your thoughtful input on these types of topics.
Keep em comin sista
I'm pro life (w/ the three exceptions) and I struggle to see how I am "forcing" anyone who had consensual sex to not terminate their pregnancy. If they engaged in an action that can result in a life being formed, that person(s) is accountable for their own actions.
I don't think the most important question is defining murder. Aborting is by definition murder, it's that deep. Then you ask yourself is murder wrong. I think it's amoral. We kill for a bunch of reasons whether it's food or our personal interests, it's just part of nature. Murder is a means to achieve an end but there lies the real question. Does the end justifies the mean? This is entirely up to ones moral/value system and why there will never be an answer on this topic.
I think a man should understand the risk of sex - that he could become a father. It's correct that a woman expects us to be prepared, while still having the right to reject pregnancy. They pay a higher price.
"I was pro life until I had an unwanted pregnancy"... surely that's not taking responsibility for your actions. I wonder what he was preaching as a pro-lifer up until that point.
This conversation always makes me grateful for my Catholic mother who had a couple miscarriages and a stillborn child, and is adamantly against abortion due to her beliefs and experiences. I became sexually active as a teenager which she obviously did not like, but she still made sure I had access to birth control and sex education. I was so young and foolish, I’m sure I would have had an unwanted pregnancy at some point without her guidance. Thanks to her, I never had to consider getting an abortion.
It makes me grateful for my Christian mom and nana (who lived with us after my dad was killed). My dad was killed when I was 4 by a drunk driver. My mom was asked before if she would have considered aborting me if she knew my dad was going to die so young. A big no no once you already have the baby. But my mom and nana taught me to try and wait for my wedding night and I did. Aside from "try to wait", they gave me the birds and bees talk young and said if I needed birth control to prevent getting pregnant, they wouldn't be thrilled but they would take me the the gynecologist to get put on birth control. I'm so happy that I had them for that, could trust them and have never been faced with a decision to have an abortion.
I'm pro-choice, but I really can't associate with that crowd anymore.
For me, I've always supported the legality of abortion because I have known so many children that have grown up in terrible households that I want to basically destroy any excuse or argument for people to be bad parents to their children. By supporting access to abortion, I am trying to instill responsibility back onto the future potential parent to make the choice they are most able to handle. If abortion AND adoption are both valid options, then I see no reason to ever hold back on bad/abusive parents in a courtroom setting. I want every child to be wanted and every parent/legal guardian to take their intentionally chosen job seriously.
That said, I can't support the pro-choice movement in it's current form; It scares the heck out of me that there are now so many young women who have no context of how difficult it was to legalize abortion and that by trivializing it they are absolutely re-enforcing every point behind criminalizing it again. It shocks and horrifies me at also how people assume all women support abortion; no. That's not reality. Planet Earth is composed of 51% bio-females vs, the remainer bio-males. The pro-life movement continues to be as strong as it is because so many women support it. Assuming that this issue falls on biological sex or gender identity lines is dumb. If abortion ever is criminalized again, it will be because the pro-choice movement succeeded in alienating enough of it's supporters to stop voting to keep it legal.
Incredibly well said! Every child that comes onto this planet should be loved, cared for and wanted.
As a Christian, we're suppose to believe every life is sacred. But how many times has something Christian broadcast shown starving babies and children - abused, neglected, sick without the ability to get healthcare and so on. I'm Christian but pro choice if all other options have been exhausted and if abortion is done early, legally and safely. But the pro choice movement has turned into something I don't want to be a part of either. They don't realize how hard it had to be fought for to do it safely. My great-great grandmother died with a coat hanger inside of her. That's how it was done back then and it seems a lot of the current pro choice doesn't realize that back then all you could do was put a coat hanger inside of you, take literal poison that could kill you too or find an underground doctor if you could afford the hefty fee and pray they knew what they were doing. They don't realize how hard it was to legalize after Roe vs Wade and how many people, women and men fought to provide every woman a safe choice.
thank you for speaking on this! I'm pro-abortion but i find the pro-choice peoples' insistence on their definition of 'life' soooo annoying and (in most ways, though not all) super counterproductive. It literally plays directly into the pseudo christian propaganda that created anti-abortion laws to begin with.
Is abortion murder?
No. ❌
And women should never have to argue their position on it, or justify a decision made about it. It is the decision of the individual who may have any number of reasons, but one is enough. And if their decision is difficult, they should be supported and comforted, not doused with the morals of others to leave guilt and shame behind. If it isn't happening to your body personally, either support the person through their decision or shut up, their circumstances are not known to you and they don't have to justify themselves to strangers. It's not about the life of a potential/eventual baby, its about the already existing life of the person who wants to not be pregnant. Which could be due to rape, abuse, maybe they're currently being abused, maybe the foetus isnt doing well (eg in prezeclampsia cases where organs don't form properly), sociozeconomic circumstances mean that the child would grow up in poverty, maybe they're a school-age person or student who wants to achieve their goals before starting a family... maybe they have a rare, debilitating or dangerous health condition or disability that they don't wanr to pass on to another human. Also, people get abortions for miscarriages too when they're not happening naturally because it could cause infection.
Oh my, this is such a hard topic. I have to say i'm quite content with the laws in my country Sweden surrounding this: Able to abort up till week 18 (would presonally prefer to see that down to 13 weeks / first trimester), and then only if the mother's health is in serious danger. No abortions post week 22 (viability). I haven't really thought trough wether it's murder or not. I would say it's not untill baby = viable, but then people can say that humans who are living with help from the outside or they would be dead, wouldn't be human etc. It's a complicated topic, but at the end of the day, murder or not, i am pro choice (up till a certain gestational age).
I'm not necessarily against the abortions but after a close examination of this issue I do think that abortion is terminating one's life, or killing if you prefer. But can murder ever be justified? I'll leave that question for anyone reading to ponder on. Regardless, I don't think in purely black and white terms. From my perspective abortion can be both the right as well as wrong course of action. It can be a morally correct choice or it can be nothing more than running away from responsibility, depending on many different factors and circumstances. That being said, I do strongly believe that so many people choose to think that an unborn baby isn't alive because it makes it so much easier to go through with that decision when you think that nobody is being harmed or killed, unlike thinking in terms of "I'm about to end someone's existence."
This is my honest view: I believe a fetus is alive but I view killing it the same as I view killing a bug or a pest animal if it’s unwanted. Same way a lot of humans will have pets like cats and dogs and value their lives but will not hesitate to kill an annoying mosquito or fly if it’s being annoying.
I think on a moral stand point if we can figure out when the nerves and brain process pain, there is a conversation I would find interesting to have. I don’t think it would make it anymore black or white tho
There are some doctors who have said when they believe pain signals reach the brain but it's all over, depending on who you ask. But you're right - it doesn't make it anymore black and white
Ok that tadpole comparison is funny. I feel like I'd feel HELLA bad if I dumped a bunch of tadpoles. Maybe even more so cuz little dudes can't even jump and run 😭
Dope video, Brittany. U feed my soul~
I wake up everyday thanking God (not God but maybe more like mom, but indirectly) that my mother encouraged me to use birth control. My body doesn't do well with hormones, but I was the sort of teenager to get pregnant (troubled, drugs, victim of abuse) and I could easily have a baby today. She did always threaten me that if I got pregnant, I'd have to have an abortion. I have the same views on it as you, now, but before I was furiously pro abortion you could say.
If I'd feel heartbroken over tadpoles, I know I'd be heartbroken over an unborn child or fetus or whatever. And I'm just so grateful I never had to think about it.
my personal opinion its a clump of cells. pregnancy is simply a hugely traumatic thing for women and those are facts no ifs or buts. now imagine being forced to carry it out till the end and the torture of childbirth itself. why should a father have a say in it its not like he goes through pregnancy 🤷♀️ and imagine being forced to carry a rapists baby. i was literally just waiting for the pro lifers to pounce ngl. in two words - PRO CHOICE and mind your own business just like everything else in life
I almost think the question of when does life begin is as complicated as what is the meaning of life. They're similar in the way that everyone will have a slightly different opinion and I don't know if we will ever objectively know the truth
Hey Britt! As a Christian who worships Jesus, I am pro choice. Every child should be wanted, loved and provided for before they even arrive on the planet but sadly, that's not the case. How many times are Christian organizations asking for money for starving, abused, neglected children? But they want to shut down they idea a simple fertilized egg removal is killing life. Even if that "life" won't be wanted. I'm all for other options first - pregnancy prevention (and education) and adoption. If they're already pregnant and adoption is not an option, have an abortion as early as possible.
My great great grandmother died with a coat hanger in her. It was that, literal poison or an underground doc if you could afford one back then. And pray the doctor knew what they were doing so the woman didn't die. We have come so far - we can't go back to those dark days.
Love your babies, always. You're blessed to have them. A lot of us can't make them.
You do realize there are millions, if not billions, of people that are not adequately wanted/loved/provided for their entire lives?
@@sambf and what type of "life" do those people have? Are they living or merely existing? What about those that are children in those situations?
@@misfitbrit1989 Sure, so then my argument would be who are you to say that your subjective opinion on their living circumstances would justify them not existing at all/an abortion?
And what would those standards be? Ok so if the child would go into foster care and live a miserable depressing life for 70 years...ok yeah that one should be aborted. But what about the foster care child who's life sucks and then they end up being taken in by a loving family, go to college, become a lawyer, and have a loving family themselves. 1.) you dont know the future and 2.) there's no way to judge what circumstances are bad enough to warrant an abortion.
@@sambf one question for you, Sam. Do you have the organs to carry a child?
If not, sit down and mind your own uterus. I believe in a women's right to choose.
@@sambf there's not always a foster care system behind unwanted babies. You can look up how many people don't care for their children or do worse. There are kids left in hot cars, kids that go to bed hungry, if not starving, dirty, in clothes and shoes they've outgrown, sick, exposed to drugs/alcohol and without help. The sad reality is there's not always someone who comes to the rescue and it's a living hell for those kids. When the system is involved, it doesn't make things better for the child.
How about moms like Casey Anthony? Scary enough, women like her who don't want their babies but won't give them up either are alive and well. There was poll done on millennial parents alone recently asking if they ever regretted becoming parents, over a third said they regretted motherhood. And that's in the midst of declining birth rates, notably in that age group. What happens when someone regrets bringing a life into the world and isn't the best person? They end up causing harm and hurt and typically with a target in mind. Or how about the sperm donor who just shot his 3 boys? Or the man who took his one day old baby outside and shot her twice in the head? Those are just a few stories and the ones that made national attention. That doesn't include the stories that don't get media attention. Is it less cruel to wait until they're here and can feel everything to end life or stop it before they can feel anything?
As I said in my original comment, I'm for prevention and adoption before abortion. Whatever the individual circumstances are are between the 2 that started it. The final decision is up to the one who has to carry that life. Adoption rates in the US are falling drastically. Many of us can barely take care of what we have on our plates due to inflation and a serious increase in the cost of living. A couple who could be amazing parents may not have the time, money and legal resources to adopt may have to use that 10 grand they had planned for adoption costs alone (not to mention the costs that come with actually raising the child) for emergency savings, retirement, paying down their mortgage or what have you. And our system is already flooded with kids in orphanages or foster care.
There's other reasons I stand with a right to choose. Abortion is sad but bringing an unwanted life into this world to only suffer is far more sad. Also, you asked who I am. A mother, a mother of an angel that was born sleeping and proud uterus owner. If you don't have the parts responsible for carrying the life brought into this world, you can speak on women's issues but I don't believe you get much of a say.
Mind your own womb and if you don't have one, sit down.
Oh I love seeing the moment when Ethan said the name of the baby.. Thats just a straight up fail. Love that family. And also I am pro-abortion. If I now got pregnant, with my long distance boyfriend in college, with at least 3 more years to go.. I would abort. If I didnt it would quite frankly ruin my life and my baby would come in a instable home, where we could not provide for it. And I want my kids to have a great life. But if someone wants to keep the child, I'm for it. It should be a personal thing, like a case to case thing
Personally I think the problem is most pro-lifers are not pro-life they’re pro birth and they think demeaning, lying, and pushing their religion is the answer. Then on the other side pro choice responds to their anger and bullshit with more anger and bullshit creating lots of anger and a big divide that shouldn’t be there. I don’t care either way so being able to watch it objectively makes it clear that people are arguing just to argue and most do it to side with their political/religious affiliation. Just like they do with everything else.
Great video! You really got me seeing certain points from the sides of the pro-lifers. Sure, we can call abortion murder but I think that’s such a subjective conversation I don’t engage in it much. All I care about, is as you said bodily autonomy trumps the whole discussion.
It’s also interesting because most pro-choice people I know in my life don’t “celebrate” abortion, they just want people to have the freedom of choice to do what’s best for their body. Pro-lifers often times are pushing for anti-abortion legislation BEFORE legislation to help our sexual education, foster care and healthcare systems which is my biggest issue. Those should be the components you’re fighting heavily for the most in my opinion before trying to push for what you actually want which is to make abortions illegal everywhere.
Also this might be a stupid comment, but if abortion is murder, then what is the difference between that and a miscarriage? Manslaughter? Maybe someone else has a better idea but I always thought it was weird that the body can naturally get rid of it and abortion is ok purpose kind of thing.
My 2 abortions were chemical abortions done at home w pills I was under 10 weeks pregnant. I love abortions. I also love my son! But I never really felt like I was pregnant until I was involved with a pregnancy that was consciously my choice for a human I wanted to bring in my life. I agree the binary is difficult. But the fact that this is even a debate is a bit exhausting to me. My son has been the most amazing thing. Each abortion I had was a month long. Grueling pain. One was in my rented room. One was in the psych ward. [I was in the ward five months that abortion I remember less than the first one]. And still, I don't have trauma related to my abortions. I dont feel like I murdered anyone. I love life. I don't really pay attention to these debates as much anymore because I also know many pro life ppl have abortions and just are against them for politics or in the public eye or until their daughter gets pregnant. Idk I think announcing I love abortion is necessary because it is not a guaranteed "right" everywhere. To me that's upsetting. Hopefully in future more people get a choice and those that don't want to partake for whatever reason don't have to. I get everyone has nuance but my abortions were a wonderful.
It’s very disturbing to hear that you LOVE your abortions…
@@nerissagarrett267 I do!! I had sex without my consent and also was not in a state where I was able to consent so the person knew and didn't care. Thankfully I'm in a better place and not still dealing with that part of my life in a way I did not want to nor was ready for BUT!! Even if that wasn't the case I would still LOVE abortion because while it is sad I don't think it is right to shame anyone for needing that procedure. I think the stigma/controversy adds a layer of emotion that is unnecessary.
@@nerissagarrett267 and I have a beautiful son who was my choice who I love and adore because I waited until I was ready! And got pregnant with the intention of having a child! Later on after dealing with myself physically and mentally! Sorry you're disturbed but it didn't feel like I was killing a baby at all! I can understand later term situations being more upsetting but I LOVE having the choice! I love women having agency
Asher was gold. As a woman, I really appreciate and agree with his takes from both sides. No man should be tied to an accidental pregnancy either if they make it clear they don't want it. But man, if you say no baby and then stick around, you better help your baby momma! If you don't want it and she does, you're gonna have to work something out or leave her too. It's a grey area for sure, but I can't imagine keeping a partner around in that situation whose not invested in helping the kid. Or being that partner and just pretending everything is normal after that lol. And in the end, if they disagree that heavily on something so important, it's most likely not meant to be.
I wish they would‘ve gone more into the question of what constitutes murder and how we even define it. Or what makes one life more valuable than another, like how we value human life more than animal life. Interesting stuff and yeah not black and white at all. Also brittany are you gonna make a full podcast on your thoughts on the vaccine cause I would be interested😇
I say this as someone who has seen a baby born at 5 months survive and then a year later you would never have known that they were born at the size of a small baked potato: Abortion is categorically wrong and should be illegal. That life was capable of expressing pleasure and pain. It was capable of learning and taking in new information and I cannot stress enough that this baby would fit in the palm of your hand and looked like something from an alien movie. And yet it had all of the qualities I would argue most define humanity.
Bodily autonomy is very important and I would argue perhaps our most sacred right. But it seems like no one values the bodily autonomy of the baby as they're willing to transgress against it in the worst possible way, by ending its life entirely.
I think what I may be badly saying is that both of us are arguing about bodily autonomy, one of us for the woman, one of us for the baby.
The end results of being anti abortion is not final consequences against bodily autonomy which can never be taken back. In fact, they will return in 5 to 9 months if not sooner in unhealthy pregnancy.
Pro choice is final. There are no take backs. A baby is dead. The baby will not be alive again in 5 to 9 months. Bodily autonomy game overed.
It's plain wrong. And we can quibble about nuance and agree wrong things happen all the time in life, and this is true. But the point of laws is not to reflect what is and what we are. The point of laws is to call us together to better. To do better. To be more than whatever this mess called life would make us and penalize us if we fail to be better than our naturally poor decision making process would make us. And to scare some of us from ever getting penalized. Nuance is useful, don't get me wrong, that's why I like this channel, but laws shouldn't reflect nuance. They should be firm boundaries to keep us from running amok.
I was literally watching this video and wondered what your opinion would be. Great timing I would say
I'm pro choice so people can have the choice. Each person's life is a complex multi layered cake.
I just can’t see the REAL argument.
I see why more conservative ppl don’t want them legal. I get it. BUT when you remove the arguments from either side and break it down to the core. It’s a whole beautiful conscious human being vs. an unconscious “life”.
No real argument there.
Scientists doesn't know if a fertilized egg or fetus has a concious. Hypothetically it could have conciousness. You cant see conciousness, only the works of it could be seen just like gravity.
(my current take) abortion is not murder in the first trimester and is self defense if the woman was raped. murder is defined as unlawful but I get the point being presented. Is abortion morally wrong? Presumably there is no consciousness in the first trimester so I think its fine in that case. The rape scenario is a bit different. I think its okay to abort during the entire pregnancy in that case as your body is being damaged and used against your will. I would say that is self defense.
I think an early stage fetus is distinct from a coma patient in that they have yet to emerge as a conscious being. you wouldn't be killing a "someone" but a "something". being in a coma is morally tantamount to being asleep. also, at a certain point coma patients are aloud to die.
This is a well rounded argument, and your commentary reflects a lot of my thoughts as well.
My mother's side was 'pretty' Catholic. But apparently they were fairly flexible when it came to sex. As long as a daughter is with someone they 'love' and 'care' about and use contraception, then it wasn't a big deal. They were also personally pro-life. Catholics can't get them, but other people can.
wasnt expecting this to rlly challenge me bc this is one of the things i thought i disagreed w u on. great stuff
🙏🙏🥰🥰
THAT SHIRT LOOKS SOOOOOO FUCKING GOOD ON YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This was really an eye-opening analysis- this changed my original opinion about this jubilee video!
Brittany: sorry I'm stoned
Me: hehe girl me too
😜😜
Love how u really want to keep the thought process and conversation going, I could be at this all night. Have a nice week!
I had a miscarriage and no one gave a fuck. Honestly. Not my family, not the 'father' of the fetus. I'm pro-choice and that experience made me double down on my pro-choice stance. People truly do not think of fetuses as 'real babies'. Even when you know the sex of the fetus. Even when you start thinking of names and having celebrations. Not even the 'father' of this fetus WHO IS PRO-LIFE cared that much about the miscarriage. He didn't shed a tear while I was fucking devastated for months. Eventually I got over it.
My thoughts on abortion is as follows:
1: A fetus is a person.
I am willing to have some flexibility on just when in the first few months that occurs, but the only reasonable conclusion I have been able to settle on is that well before 6 months it is a separate human life that merits full legal personhood. That being the case, abortion without strong justification is murder. I am not a fan of dictating what people can or can't do, but I think it is pretty universally accepted that murder is wrong and should be illegal.
2: There are plenty of options and ways to prevent a pregnancy. Condoms, contraceptives, plan-B, abstinence, etc, so the risk of getting pregnant is pretty low.
3: With so many options available to prevent pregnancy in the first place, ending a human life as an act of "Oh s**t, I'm pregnant" birth control is highly immoral. However, just with any OTHER human life, there are contexts in which ending it is legal.
Just like any other self defense ruling, if the pregnancy is a significant health and safety risk to the mother, then abortion would be legal. Major medical issues for the mother or baby. I would probably include rape in there as well, even though it is less clearly "self defense" because it is a traumatic experience and I would not force a woman to relive that trauma by keeping the child (though I would encourage adoption as an alternative).
4: Women have legal options to turn over the child if they don't want it: The father can take it if he is willing, she can go through an adoption service, or safe haven services mean she can literally drop the baby off at an acceptable gas station.
Conversely, the father has no such legal recourse. I have had people say "Once he puts his D in her V, he has given up all choice and all rights in the matter." The only choice a man has left at that point is that IF the mother offers to allow him to be involved in the child's life, he can accept or reject it. The father has no say in abortions. The father has no say in adoptions. If the law gets involved then the father is legally obligated to pay child support. Which brings me to:
5: If men have no say in the life of a fetus, then in the interests of equality, I think women should be bound by the same laws. Once a woman becomes legally pregnant she might have a short grace period (see point 1) where abortion might be an option, but after that she has the same rights and responsibilities as a father. Further more, if the father is laden with responsibility for the child at any point, adoption and safe-haven would require the consent of both parents.
6: I would say it is pretty obvious that we can't prevent teens from having sex. That being the case, I would be fine with government providing free contraceptives to people 16-20. At 21 they are adult enough to take responsibility for themselves and should do so. Do I think this is a good answer? No. I think providing free contraceptives will encourage kids to have sex. But I do think it is the best of a bad set of options.
7: I am not sure how adoption is now, but I think it should be as easy and painless for the parents as possible. The only requirement I would place on young parents giving a child because they don't feel they can adequately take of it, is to prove that they have the legal right to do so.
- - -
I really see it coming down to three questions:
Is a fetus a person?
If yes, when is it acceptable to kill a person?
How do we move forward based on the other two questions?
- - -
I've thought about the subject a lot, and I think it is the best compromise we will get.
The comment, on the other hand, is somewhat off the cuff, so hopefully I conveyed the information adequately.
This is fantastic! Please do more videos like this. These are the thoughts and conversations we should be having. My position is very similar to yours in a way. I believe you are ending a life with an abortion and us as a sexually active human should understand that when we have sex conceiving a baby is a possibility even if we are taking all the protective measures. As responsible adults we should be aware of the consequences of our actions. Choosing to abort a baby or keep a baby when you don’t have the means to take care of them are both life changing decisions and the Choice we make in this situation is something we will live with forever. Because once you get pregnant you have to make a Choice. I believe we do have the right to this choice because it is our body and I believe we have the right to do what we want to our bodies whether that results in not having the baby or keep them. I believe sexually active humans should think about this situation and ask them Themselves “god forbid I get pregnant unexpectedly, but if it happens at this point in my life, I might have to make the very hard decision of will I keep the baby or will I not keep the baby? And what every Choice I make Am I ready to live with the consequences of that choice.
I hope that makes scenes lol.
I don’t like the idea of abortions, and I can see why others can be upset by them. Such as religion and believing that it is life, which I can respect but don’t necessarily agree, I’m pro choice at the end of the day though because it isn’t my choice. People should be able to have full body autonomy.
Bro I’m high as f and I’ve been eating ur vids like candy 23:40 I paused and I’m like in a new dimensions lmao I been getting it but wow I get it fuck lol
24:18 😳 jfc
I’m on a journey
This video is like an acid trip
My thought process on abortion
1-Abortion is murder. That is a fact but it doesn't feel very descriptive, does it? Underlying the meaning of a word there are certain suppositions. The context in which we use "murder" is 99% extremely different from the context of abortion. Fetus and baby mean exactly the same, yet one is coldness and the other is love.
The same thing is appliable to "human", beyond its definition, we have a set of ideas related to "what being a human is" and most of the time they have nothing to do with DNA.
2-Ending a life is wrong. But why the killing of a plant doesn't matter? Is it because it doesn't feel anything, is it the lack of consciousness, or is it the great difference between us that doesn't allow us to master the courage to feel empathy?
Why do we have value meanwhile other forms of life have less? We are at the end of the food chain, eliminating us from the planet might be much better for other species than perhaps killing all microbes (causing a chain reaction that will seriously affect ecosystems). Therefore "value" is subjective, some people want as many humans on Earth as possible, and others none.
3-It is a choice that stops someone from being. A simple condom could also do that, should they be illegal because someone who came as a surprise wouldn't have been born if one was used? Should we give birth to every hypothetical human? It seems to me that what we want to protect is the idea of a person that we have internalized, instead of the present human. Generally, mammal's embryos are pretty similar and we could see a picture of one and mistakingly think is a human.
4- Abortion should be illegal because some people are forced to abort. That is the same issue people who desire an abortion face, it is the lack of bodily autonomy that hurts us so deeply, that's why I am pro-choice.
Great video brittany☺. My thoughts on the burning building scenario that you posed would be I would pick the 3 year old, my thinking being that the embryos don't have the capacity to feel pain due to the stage they are in and the fact that they are frozen. If the scenario was instead would you save a 20 week old fetus that is alive lying on a tray or a three year old in all honesty I would do everything in my power to save both and if not possible I would save the three year old simply based on my understanding of a greater capacity to suffer( would take longer for a three year old to die due to smoke inhalation and or burns than the 20 week old fetus) but not because one had more worth to me than the other.
I had a unplanned pregnancy and I knew I could end his life if I wanted but I didnt want too. When he was a newborn and I had post partum depression I knew I could end his life if I wanted but I didnt want to and even now I could end his or my other two adorable kids lives. I just don't want too and wont because I see their lives as equal or greater than my own. I dont think anyone can make an induvidual see someone elses worth or even their autonomy unless they want to. R*pest and CMs and murders are usually making a choice to not acknowlage their victims humanity it does not change whether it exist. Not that I'm comparing the two but also I kinda am but I'm not if that makes sense. Thanks for all your effort you put into your videos!
As always, love your commentary!
Old video but I'll comment. I think fetuses are alive. Personhood is irrelevant to why I'm pro-choice. People should not be forced to remain pregnant or give birth against their will even if that means ending a life. Pregnancy is not an inconvenience, it increases your mortality and morbidity rates and needs to be consented to.
I also don't give fetuses the same value as I do infants, I value embryos much much less than I do fetuses. I'll call it a baby if you want though idc.
I would prefer to never have an abortion but there are circumstances where I'd want or need one and circumstances where I might decide to have one or not. And a lot of those circumstances aren't currently legal in my state. In my part of post-roe America, I wouldn't be able to get an abortion if I had a fatal fetal abnormality, my state's laws have made abortion a less accessible option for missed miscarriages, my attorney general personally blocks women who try to get abortions for health reasons and there is also no SA/incest exception. Pro-life legislation is anti-human rights and anti-women's health. I would not even want to carry a wanted pregnancy in my state. I don't feel safe doing so.
I never understood the Christian stance because in the Bible it says breath is life. And there’s nothing in there about actual abortion. So maybe I’m confused about how it’s written
The Hebrew word is "Neshamah" and it means spirit, souls, breath, inspiration and blast. Keep in mind that when you take your first breath it's a countdown til when you'll take your last.
The Bible doesn't have to flat out say every thing you just have to pray for insight and interpretation. Let's say Mary aborted Jesus, that would be catastrophic but there's no words that exist to really describe it. Keep in mind that Mary was a virgin and Jesus immaculate and miraculous birth was foretold all through the old testament. Politically correct people today will say Mary didn't give GOD consent to miraculously impregnate her so that was devine rape. Fyi Mary did agree to the assignment she was so destined for.
Never met anyone with my exact thoughts on abortion.
I just found your channel and I already love you
Anyone else get a planned parenthood add after watching this?
yes, it is. I don't need to watch any of this. Have a nice day
Saying you love abortion is just weird. You can agree with abortion for women who are not ready but to say you LOVE abortion is not the one
I take Destiny's perspective on this... (Roughly his perspective anyway) I value a life if it is experiencing a relatively high level of consciousness OR if it has previously experienced a relatively high level of consciousness that it can be reasonably expected to further experience in the future...
If the consciousness was not reasonably high level then people would be monstrous for every insect they unknowingly tread upon... And if the being has never experienced consciousness like this then they would not have lost anything but potential... And potential isn't really worth much, otherwise we'd take into consideration every life that could potentially be created by everyone if the entire world just started engaging in impregnating as many people as possible... As well as also all the potential humans who die before being born... And unless you think those cancel each other out (which they probably don't unless you just want to claim that they do to make it simple...) then people are either going to be terrible for neglecting one of those by not constantly trying to reproduce or by reproducing as much as they currently do (an anti-natalism perspective I guess)... Also you'd need to factor in many other things like preserving the environment by not driving cars and such since the needs of the dozens or even hundreds of billions of potential future humans outweigh the needs for the 7 billion currently to get places faster... Idk, there's a ton more examples you could really consider against taking potential future people's lives into consideration which shows why that's dumb... So you need to figure out personhood and a lot of the ways of doing that (i.e. first heartbeat) seem rather arbitrary compared to the beginning of consciousness... Which would still be something that begins in the womb, but current abortion laws seem fine for when that happens last I checked...
No one else is noticing the person getting they booty ate on her earrings?
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@@BrittanySimon I love it haha great video btw enjoyed ur commentary 🤗
I don't know if the conversation is the same in and outside of the united states...but we've failed everyone if people need to use abortions as a reliable birth control. Just teaching men how to properly pull out instead of abstinence would decrease the problem significantly.
I don't think "Trans women are women" is really looking for a fight, it's quite possible that it became a slogan of sorts of progressive people as a reaction to people saying the exact opposite (which they often have been for a long time and often when they are looking for a fight with someone more progressive on the issue)...
If a person constantly insults you and you insult them back, is it because you're the one whose looking for a fight?
Reminds me of King Charles XII of Sweden who was constantly fighting defensive wars throughout his life and he is often quoted as saying "I have resolved never to start an unjust war but never to end a legitimate one except by defeating my enemies."
I am pro choice but do not think abortion is the right choice for me. I often have to explain it. I want women to have the choice. And having the baby is just as much a choice as having an abortion.
Yes
I say this as someone who has seen a baby born at 5 months survive and then a year later you would never have known that they were born at the size of a small baked potato: Abortion is categorically wrong and should be illegal. That life was capable of expressing pleasure and pain. It was capable of learning and taking in new information and I cannot stress enough that this baby would fit in the palm of your hand and looked like something from an alien movie. And yet it had all of the qualities I would argue most define humanity.
Bodily autonomy is very important and I would argue perhaps our most sacred right. But it seems like no one values the bodily autonomy of the baby as they're willing to transgress against it in the worst possible way, by ending its life entirely.
I think what I may be badly saying is that both of us are arguing about bodily autonomy, one of us for the woman, one of us for the baby.
The end results of being anti abortion is not final consequences against bodily autonomy which can never be taken back. In fact, they will return in 5 to 9 months if not sooner in unhealthy pregnancy.
Pro choice is final. There are no take backs. A baby is dead. The baby will not be alive again in 5 to 9 months. Bodily autonomy game overed.
It's plain wrong. And we can quibble about nuance and agree wrong things happen all the time in life, and this is true. But the point of laws is not to reflect what is and what we are. The point of laws is to call us together to better. To do better. To be more than whatever this mess called life would make us and penalize us if we fail to be better than our naturally poor decision making process would make us. And to scare some of us from ever getting penalized. Nuance is useful, don't get me wrong, that's why I like this channel, but laws shouldn't reflect nuance. They should be firm boundaries to keep us from running amok.