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Is Micaiah good here? OUTREALMS EMBLEM RING TIER LIST! Fire Emblem Engage!
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- Опубликовано: 15 авг 2024
- I played over 200 Outrealms online custom battles and went undefeated while attacking. Check out my livestreams in my Fire Emblem playlist, and check out my other gaming content!
00:00 - Intro
01:00 - Marth
03:25 - Sigurd
06:44 - Celica
08:08 - Micaiah
11:42 - Roy
15:34 - Leif
19:36 - Lucina
23:18 - Lyn
26:12 - Ike
29:50 - Byleth
32:41 - Corrin
36:37 - Eiriphraim
38:50 - Alear
39:52 - Edelmitraude
41:01 - Tiki
41:59 - Hector
43:13 - He who SHALL NOT be named!
44:56 - Camilla
47:00 - Rhobim
49:07 - Veronica
50:40 - Outro, thanks for watching!
I'm guessing you probably already know, but Eirika has a special interaction with her inheritable skills, lunar brace and Gentility, where when she engages or switches she swaps her allies versions of the skills to whatever she has. I am a big gentility user, and because of how sometimes she randomly switches to ephiram, I can't stand using her on defense. But it also means that you can have her on offense give any unit you have gentility on free extra damage or you can have her give her allies healing when they attack with lunar brace, which sometimes does come up. Gentility is really nice imo against Lunar brace, because I believe it's one of the few effects in the game that can actually reduce the damage you take from lunar brace and it's not bulk in stats, so lunar brace doesn't scale off it, and effects like luna or flare don't mess with it. which is minor, it's only 5 dmg per hit, but that can be significant imo.
edit:paused the video to comment and then you mentioned the skill switching
@@samkeiser9776 I've noticed the weird interaction between gentility and lunar brace, how it prevents some of the "true damage." I'm still a little confused by the interaction.
Even on a pretty good day, I don't think Eirika matters a whole lot in the big picture compared to Sigurd, Lyn, Soren, Byleth, etc. I'm probably a bigger lunar brace user compared to gentility, usually have 2 lunar brace users on my offense and defense, I don't think the eclipse brace has made much of a difference for me, although it is a minor cushion to keep HP topped off.
Chrom is like magical marth funny enough, he gives a 10 magic bonus when you're engaged, and he gives speed as one of his stats, so if you're a magical attacker who attacks a lot with nova or a speed build he can pump up your damage pretty easily. rally spectrum is also a good tool sometimes. his engage attack is weird and bad. I think he's funny because he actually makes high priests do a solid amount more damage with their arts because he gives 3 strength and 10 magic.
@@samkeiser9776 Hmm, I think I agree. Chrom just feels way too confused, but I could see it being good on a speedy magic user, I've seen him paired with Celine often and it looks decent enough.
I've wanted to explore his "+1 mov while engaged with covert" more, but even in theory I haven't thought of much that sounds good. Maybe Alcryst? I tend to value buffing move and range A LOT in this game, as I tend to in many of these "turn based grid battle" games.
Bruh I only realized the other day that Engage had aether raids from FEH lol. There’s a whole chunk of the game that nobody talks about 😭
I’ve been enjoying your videos on this game mode.
Ye, there's a lot of ignorance/disdain on the internet when it comes to comes to Engage postgame, for some reason. The tower of trials modes are hella fun, people are scared of tryna cook against the high roller endgame players especially in outrealms.
Thanks for watching 💪🏻 glad you enjoy
Lyn's biggest issue on defense is that I basically always kill her turn one, because people don't usually put her on characters with actual bulk
@@samkeiser9776 I don't really think it matters whether you put her on a character with bulk or not. She gets entrapped and killed super often. I'd bet most units die in any combination of 2 combats/engage attacks, at least if offense players are utilizing their units decently.
@@unhingedmanchild I've had a Nel for a while that used Lyn, and at the cost of some of astral storm's power she was way better at taking hits than most lyns I've came across, and I didn't give her hold out. like obviously if she was getting ganged up on by 8 units she'd die, but usually she had way more staying power than the typical unit, I've since turned her into a defensive team roy user though. I feel like most players will go for lyn automatically just because she's unpredictable and has flyer effectiveness, so making her take hits even just a little bit better is like the only way to improve her build. I currently have her on a thief because thieves are faster than snipers and are still covert while having 1-2 range, and mulagir is 22 Mt anyway so i don't need to bring my own bows. I kinda just want people to have to burn engage attacks to kill the lyn user.
I think spd/res+5 can take a lot of classes from taking magical hits pretty badly to being good enough at it that it's possible to have units that just have solid bulk all around.
My favorite byleth build by far is byleth celine, She gets 100% accurate attacks, 1-4 (5) range with her tomes, more speed, and 2 engage weapons that she's really solid at using. nothing can counter the combination of 4 range attacks and arts except a lief mage cannoneer. I just put a little more speed on her and canter+ and she can deal with pretty much anything if she gets enough opportunities to attack, Canter+ is so unfair because she can attack from 4 tiles away with excalibur, move back 3 spaces, and then get danced by seadall without him needing to extend at all, and then she can attack again, or retreat, or use a staff which is also 100% accurate.
@@samkeiser9776 I'm shocked I don't see more Celine on people's teams for the stupid high luck and her otherwise very reasonable stats. I probably should consider her on offense, but I like my defense miracle physic bot too much 😆
If I got this right: Defensive teams want long-ranged nukes and/or units that waste enemy actions and position themselves to out-grind offensive teams with superior unit count. They also want to avoid giving units additional supportive actions like Reposition since the AI typically blunder its use.
With that in mind: here's some ideas.
- Roy on a Cavalry Unit for defense is like a mini-Camilla with a +1 Mov bonus on Rise Above. Not sure if it's worth it, but a funny idea nonetheless.
- I'm not sure how good Byleth is on defense if the logic is just free Divine Pulse. It seems too prone to blundering Goddess Dance and Instruct on paper which is a lot more potent when controlled by a player.
-Tiki just seems like she has too little range to do much other than give an Ike user an extra health bar. I don't think she's worth it on defense knowing she just gives a unit in range a revival crystal as her Engage attack. In offense, General or Mage Cannoneer Tiki could be used to Freeze miracle users and gain more opportunities to deal with them. Her breath attacks also hits all units in a T-shape and can kill multiple units.
-Edelgard with House Unite+ probably has better value than an AI randomly clicking Shielding Gambit. I'm not sure if Raging Storm is worth it, but a potential extra turn is still amazing to kill not just one, but two Hold Out units in 1 turn with the same unit.
-Hector seems like worse Ike. It thrives in an environment where a bunch of units would run into it with an attack it and counterattack like Tempest Trials, but most good defending teams are firing Engage Attacks or harassing you with things like Mage Cannoneers. Maybe Hector's best case use is to challenge multiple Miracle users on EP...?
Yes, the AI operates in a pretty straightforward way, so, higher move/range for first strike and/or for more flexibility in seeking weaker units to kill seems like the primary MO for a good defense team. And I agree with you, the extra actions like reposition, instruct, and rally seem generally detrimental to your defense units functioning in a useful manner.
Roy on a cav was something I specifically brought up in my vid 😆 I put in a picture of my own defense Fogado (in his royal class, +boots and longbow) who uses Roy, and I mentioned that Roy + cav seems like one of his best use cases due to rise above mov+1.
You are correct on Byleth - I mostly advise Byleth for offense bc the player is not as likely to use instruct and goddess dance stupidly. I suggested Byleth on defense only for 2 reasons: divine pulse comes for free from wearing him (so that unit has more space for threatening skills,) and his goddess dance is to be considered a random wildcard, bc the AI does occasionally get 3+ units in a dance, and that generates a shitton of momentum for the defense team when it happens. There's probably a way to build your defense map/units to trick the AI into getting better dances, but that's not something I know how to do yet.
Good points for Tiki. Even with what you say here, Tiki doesn't seem very powerful/useful either way, kinda just mild.
For Edelgard, I totally blanked on raging storm, and even the HU+ bonus thing with Byleth. That's probably double the reason to use her and Byleth on offense 💪🏻
Hector you make a good point, many engage attacks are devastating, but doesn't he give you enough defense to shrug most of them off? Without actually having used hector, I agree he feels like Ike-lite. However, IIRC while engaged with cavs they are immune to freeze, and I would love to test that combo in my own defense a few times just to see if it pulls anything off.
Thanks for watching and commenting 😁
HMM! I also just remembered another minor point for Byleth on defense - On armor and mystical he gives... Aegis Shield and Thyrsus respectively? IIRC these give some % chance to reduce incoming damage by half, and this absolutely works to tone down the engage attack damage they take. I've 100% been annoyed by a Celine Vidame and Rosado Mage Cannon who took a whole extra round of combat bc those items proc'd on attacks/engage attacks that were otherwise ORKO.
Perfect timing!! I was just writing up my own team & trying to figure out where to put my emblems
For the DLC, I’ve used Veronica a lot in regular play & I will say she could be used for either mode I think
On offense you could get another Emblem Summoned (except Ephram) which could be great, you get a Dance effect, & you could heal/Vantage-Vengeance with her
On defense, I also don’t know how she’d play, but Cav summons with +1 move sounds good~ same with the thought of her possibly Contracting a Soren/Long ranged unit, then you could Vengance with Holdout XD
Hector I think suffers from the same problem people fall into with Ike, that is, don’t put them on Generals, put them on a class that would like to act like a general!! I think Cav classes would like him the most, his Engaged attack locking down the terrain looks great in the players hands (Especially with Lyn) but if you could build a unit who could survive, that terrain Lock down looks good on paper
As for Leif, man I’ve been looking up how the heck adaptability works for so long XD
I wish Weapon Surge worked on all his weapons, but I’m surprised you considered offense over defense :O
To be fair, I am tempted to go offense on him, but if you can put him on a Lance Backup (Timmera or Hero for example) & max up a javelin, you could avoid issues from the master lance on defense, you could also augment it with an effectiveness you don’t think attacks at range often~
Timerra I think is the best so far because her Sandstorm could trigger in the engaged attack (except for the light brand)
Overall, thanks for the rundown!! It’s definitely painted a good picture of what I should go for~
Veronica seems better than I initially gave her credit for. When I made the video I completely forgot about her engage fortify staff and her reprisal skill 😆 yeah you are correct, she should go into the "either" tier.
IIRC cavs engaging with hector makes them immune to freeze, and I personally think that's pretty good for defense team usage, maybe a paladin or great knight? I haven't really seen enough Hector stats/combat numbers personally to know if he can tank the way I use my Ike on offense, but I imagine it's comparable. Hector just doesn't seem... like an emblem? He feels weak based on what I've seen, almost like Leif, not super useful.
Leif is hella tricky. Maybe I should try him on my defense team... my basic defense philosophy seeks to increase move/range/survivability, and ig Leif technically does increase survivability... I really enjoy using his weapons on offense though. I have eff armor, horse, and flier between his 3 weapons so he's a swiss army knife for me, gets lots of breaks and effective damage.
Regarding the javelin/spear for his adaptable, I'm not sure adaptable Master Lance is something I would try and fight against. Don't forget, Master Lance can be augmented with +dex, +speed, +def, and +res which, IMO, will make your unit more survivable than whatever any +5 spear (even engraved ones) would give you. The augment boost to speed is enough for me, I like reducing my chances of getting doubled and/or making more doubles on the enemy, and +def/res will help you go further in surviving engage attacks.
I like the idea of Timerra proccing sandstorm on engage attacks, and I think that's a legit use for her, but I've found more value in Racket of Solm, personally. Unfortunately I haven't found her pickett class to do enough for me on offense, and I have seen her on other players' defenses (usually she's with hector or Ike) and she hasn't been much of an issue to work around. That might be more hector/Ike sucking on defense than her class, though.
Great comment, tysm for your thoughts 👍🏻
@@unhingedmanchild you’re right on Hector, he just doesn’t give any burst damage to him, the best he does is sit there & occasionally be a wall prevented follow-ups & breaks (only on his engage attack) at least his engage weapons have effectiveness (except his Mag Sword but that heals him lol)
I guess you could think of him as a 1 turn Michiah Obstruct staff (I think his X pattern gains 1 more range when using it adjacent to Lyn), he’s a Defensive unit that needs to be used offensively
As for Leif, yeah I was thinking about Spd Augments, he is a bit of an Either emblem because of his versatility on offense, but I like the thought of him on defense, though I cannot think of a good class lol, something with Long Bow access could be nice, maybe a nice Mag stat for Vantage Hurricane Axe? XD
@@drew_gon1617 For 3-range access Leif (this is a good idea IMO, it is annoying to kill when I've had to face it) you probably have 4 major choices: Fogado royal class, Warrior, Bow Knight, and Mage Knight (maybe also mage cannon but idk if they retaliate/counterattack at range 3+ with their cannon? I can't easily test so I'll ignore this.) Ofc Fogado doesn't have axe access and Mage Knight is using Thoron instead of Longbow, and perhaps that calculates differently in Leif's adaptability switches/calculations.
My gut says that BK and MK probably don't have the stats/utility to seriously compete though. I have seen Fogado and Warrior Panette with Leif, and they only stick out in my mind bc I had to spend some time figuring out how to kill them 😆 mostly bc of Fogado's speed (almost impossible to double him) and Panette's HP & crit.
I feel like Corrin is a bit underrated because she's at worst a functional micaiah freeze staff on offense, and freeze staffs are almost as good as entrap staffs imo.
@@samkeiser9776 Yes, freeze is one of the best staves for sure. This might be why I put Corrin as a defense emblem - it's one of the only ways to have something doling out the freeze effect against people attacking your defense (bc the defense AI is too dumb to use freeze staves.)
On offense I'll just use freeze staves, especially with Micaiah.
Soren is actually also pretty broken for another reason, he has an ability assign decoy, that he can use to manipulate the AI into attacking a unit of your choosing, which can be used to have the AI attack something stupid, I personally build veyle on my defence to be a soren bolting user because I think veyle is too slow to actually nostank decently, and arms just break her and then she dies.
@@samkeiser9776 I personally think bolting is Veyle's strongest role, it's something not really offered in any other unit (at least with this much crit/killing power.) But, similarly to Lyn, Veyle/Soren is usually one of the hottest targets on people's defense teams and often gets killed t1 by entrap or other long range options.
Veronica is really good, the AI is just stupid. she comes with reprisal+ which is a nutty ability, albeit it has to deal with Hold out, but if you have it on an emblem with an AoE it can do some insane nuking, it can make berseker look like a good class. though that's just an inheritable, you can control the stupid summon you get with her, and it can do random jobs, or just be used as bait, sometimes you can get emblems that have gutted kits of what they normally have, but sometimes that's really strong, she can summon lucina who can bonded shield, she can summon herself to be a contract bot, she can summon sigurd who will actually have like 14 movement, contract is overpowered too, I think people use her on defense because she has the potential to let your soren or canoneers fire twice, but like defense team Seadall she's just too stupid to actually be anything more than unpredictable, she will use contract sometimes but not enough.
@@samkeiser9776 Yes, I think you got it. She probably is better on offense, she offers a lot, and the AI seems to squander her potential pretty significantly. I don't think it'll even use her fortify+ staff? Which, since it sounds like she's better on offense, makes dealing with defense Corrin/freeze cannons even easier.
If the goddess was an emblem I be the goddess teir
Sothis would BE ABOVE ALL 😊
I used to think hector was dogshit, but now I think he's alright, but only if you know how to build him right, generals are garbage so don't use them, instead give him to a halberdier or timerra maybe even a swordmaster, and then invest some into that unit's defense and resistance, my favorite is timerra, give that unit spd/res+5 (camilla inheritable) and maybe some more bulk investment, and then Timerra can get like +60 defense and solid res while being fast enough to deny most magical units follow ups, and can use quick riposte to double units even if they are faster than her (all of this provided only if she's being attacked) the thing is timerra has sandstorm, and hector gives her a ton of defense so her sandstorm starts doing completely insane amounts of damage. his emblem ability is still shit though, because unless you bring your own sword or axe, you can't use it with good 1-2 range, (hectors 1-2 range weapon is a magic sword, that bases it's damage off half your strength so it's completely useless except for the smallest of self heals if you can cheat a way for it to actually do damage.)
@@samkeiser9776 I'd love to see what you use your hector on. I've seen Hector paired with Timerra a huge number of times, and every time I've just broken her with an axe and killed her afterward, so quick repasta doesn't do anything. Hector/Diamant was probably the second most common pairing, but suffered the same fate, easy break and KO. That's why I like the idea of Hector on armors, armors can't be broken by combat and they will double with QR, although only range 1-2 at best, but it's a unique unit IMO compared to most other units that I can usually hit with a break and finish off with little problem.
Unfort, I don't think the AI utilizes his engage attack, his memesword is bad, he tends to have weak player phase and he's pretty immobile/easy to freeze, so seems to add up to a unit that is just slightly more tanky than most units, but lacking the great utility like Sigurd move bonus/freeze immune, or Roy Hold Out and cav bonus move, Byleth with DP+ and his engage weaps, etc.
@@unhingedmanchild yeah I think ultimately all he really does is make a unit harder to remove, the thing is as someone who uses byleth Celine on offense Generals are basically always the easiest units to kill. They’re basically completely hopeless against her because she easily doubles them and they have basically no res, and she attacks from 4 tiles away, and canters afterwards, hold out and honest bulk are a little contrary imo so i don’t want to give my hector user hold out, and having a unit that is so easily obliterated by magic is a liability imo.
Timerra gets a little extra offense from Hector because he gives her 5 defense with is 7-8 atk with sandstorm, and armads is actually really strong on timerra. Especially because it gives her even more defense. And if for some reason someone were to attack timerra and let her get an attack off, she’d deal damage as if she had 93 strength if sandstorm trigged.
I think it’s pretty easy to avoid counter attacks between break, out ranging, engage attacks, etc, and generals only get around one of those.
There’s probably an argument to be made that the best hector user is a swordmaster just because you make a fast unit harder to remove without needing to worry about being doubled.
Idk it’s definitely hard.
@@samkeiser9776 My argument is that there's only 1 Byleth user on a team to hit at 4+ range on an armor, compared to a potential 2 or more axe users on a team to break a non-armor hector user. I know I run 2 base axe users and I have access to at least 1-2 more pseudo axe users via engage weapons.
But, we could probably go in circles, armor is 4 move and can easily be frozen or even fractured (thus broken anyway 😆). I actually carry fracture on my offense for Ike/Hector armors (also for Marth/Nel cuz she's annoying with Dragon stone + Divine Speed + Holdout) bc of how bulky and dangerous they can be with QR when I don't have Soren or a Byleth Thyrsus user on my offense.
Ig I'm thinking that Hector armor seems to have more niche/specific counters compared to Hector infantry.
Shouldn't Edelgard be offense because of her ability to attack twice in one turn?
Yes, after reading some comments (and especially being reminded about the Houses Unite+ thing with Byleth too) I think I'd put Edelgard in offense.
Should be noted that I don't have DLC and so I don't really know what the DLC rings do except some of what I've seen on outrealms defense teams that I've fought 💪🏻