You can replicate that in Shogun 2: Fall Of The Samurai with Gatling Guns as well. It is as satisfying - if not more satisfying - to see them mulch & break the enemies' units the moment they get in range or when you activate that Fire-At-Will button 😂.
@@lukmaanpratomo6866 Or you can do that at 550 range with Armstrong guns (or several kilometers range with naval ones) since they shoot shrapnel shells rather than solid shot to begin with. ;)
I was practically shouting at the screen when the Swedish line turned their entire forward line towards the battery "USE ROUND SHOT!". So glad you caught it in time. The AI definitely knows never to do that maneuver, but because you tricked them into thinking the rest of the line was out of range of the cannons, they did it anyway and the instant you fired round shot they scattered like crazy, but that one shot you got off probably killed a good 60-80 men just by bouncing on the ground. Incredible game, well commanded.
Wellington is an overrated fuck to be honest... Glorified by brits as some sort of hero because he supposedly succeed to beat the frightening war monster that was Napoleon. Because brits are annoying dicks trying to rewrite their own history the most glorifying way possible (even if it means bullshitting reality and facts), they pushed hard the "Napoleon defeat was ALL ABOUT us brits, us Wellington and us Waterloo fight", the same way their illegitimate son USA pushed forward the "WW2 was winned single-handlely by us USA and nobody else. We ze best. We save the day, nobody else existed or contributed to the win..." We got a really fresh example with how Ridley Scott handled his Napoleon """biopic"""" movie, embracing the Brits' national romance 200% instead of, well, History... It's truely annoying... The truth is, Napoleon's defeat was about MANY things among which Wellington was just a part, and really not the decisive part. Wellington was definitively not that much of the genius UK want the world to think (to glorify their side of Napoleon's era). He would have been, Napoleon would have been defeated much earlier by him... But he didn't... And wellington wasn't even that great of a man as he didn't even contributed to the world beyond the "hey, i was that brit guy here when Napoleon got a decisive fail". Just an overly glorified dude by Brits propaganda.
@@ROCCATEER92 yeah the formation was use since the Roman time "The formation was described by Plutarch and used by the Ancient Romans; it was developed from an earlier circular formation. In particular, a large infantry square was used by the Roman legions at the Battle of Carrhae against Parthia, whose armies contained a large proportion of cavalry"
People who play Napoleon swear by Howitzers, but I've always loved 8/9 pounders the most. They're in between a 6 and 12 pounder, have just enough power to deal with cav at long range and can tackle infantry at the same range as skirmishers. Like other straight firing cannons, however, they suffer against hills. I know forts are non existant in Napoleon but its still good to have cannons even when you have access to howitzers because they deal with cavalry a lot better than Empire.
Medium cannons are sweet, but i can't live without horse arty anymore. The flexibility it grants to your army is priceless, but I guess it depends on your playstyle... I tend to be offensive and on the move, so I use artillery mainly for counterbattery and for dealing with cav. In that role the 6 pounders accuracy is nice, it lacks in range and damage, but I never find myself wanting for more of those.
Idk i prefer 12 pounders, this was my last army with any 8 pounders in it, and in my opinion i should have never sent it out 2ith this arty setup, i always have 5 12 pounders 4 cav, a general and the rest infantry
Russian Unicorns mate, best defensive artillery in the game (if used right). The 10-pdrs melt through infantry while the 20-pdrs can devastate entire armies with near-impunity.
lol I love todo this with 1 unit of 12 pounders that can run, and send them of to the side of the map with 1 unit of infantry and 1 unit that can form square. The AI simply just ignore you
I'm glad to see you putting your cannons in the battle line. Canister shot is the most powerful ability in this game, and with your big guns in the line they can get some serious hits on them, and can continue to shoot round shot as they advance
It’s just such a shame the battle AI is so poor in what is otherwise such a great title. The graphics and immersion are great, spoiled by painfully stupid AI. And having played Ultimate General we all know a decent AI is possible.
The AI would have been acceptable if you weren't so limited with only 20 units in a period that depicted probably the most large scale battles at the time. The reinforcement mechanic is so stupid its such a shame they copied shit from ETW instead of optimizing this issues
it was such a joy hearing all the nations speaking (mostly) their own languages in Empire/Napoleon, even the Eastern nations. Adds to that element of immersiveness that I usually don't care for if they get right or wrong, but in this case it very much enhanced my experience by a LOT.
I really liked the garrison buildings in Napoleon that you could put your boys in random houses shooting out the windows. Very bad for their health if the enemy has cannon though!
They work better in Napoleon than Empire for sure, although I'd say the best is when in a desperate situation baiting the enemy to commit significant amounts of full strength troops into taking a building with some of your own brave, but damaged, lads garrisoned, then leveling said building to kill essentially everyone inside.
I had a great battle in Empire where the enemy were engaged in melee down a street with my guys shooting out the windows onto them, it was a lot of fun.
Witnessing Canister Shot in a real battle must be unimaginably brutal just seeing men around you get ripped to shreds while you keep marching forward hoping you somehow miss the hail of shrapnel and bullets.
There's a Russian movie, Union of Salvation, while not the most historically accurate, shows grapeshot used to horrifying effect at relatively close range. fantastic scene in an otherwise mid movie.
Check out the book Waterloo by Bernard Cornwell. In it he quotes hundreds of in person accounts including one about how British canister shot would kill by the hundreds. They would double pack the barrels. Round shot first then canister on top. The canister to decimate the front of the line while the round shot could pass through an entire column of men.
I remember researching cannister shot for the first time in Empire Total War. I remember the first time I used cannister shot in battle and saw it demolish a whole charging unit of cavalry. Such beautiful memories.
I LOVED Napoleon as a sequel to Empire. I would have liked to see it developed a bit more as the 1800s was a time of massive change. Like America: Civil War, Crimea: A peninsula at War, The Franco-Prussian War, the Spanish-American War, The Mexican American war, etc. Wish they made other sequels to the game because Total War got me into Grand Strategy games but Paradox picked up where Creative Assembly lacked
Nice vid, happy to see you playing more napoleon! A little bit of tech that I didn't see you using is to wait until the very last second to put lines into square formation. You'll get a full volley in on cav which compounds with the square formations strength against mounted units to break cavalry quite a bit quicker than if you were exclusively using square. It's tricky to get the timing if you need to micro a bunch of other units, but if I remember correctly your line gets the bonus after a second regardless of their actual positioning~
if you micro your art you can easily take out all the enemy cav as they walk towards you. aim at the ground in front of the cav since the rounds bounce but the autoaim sends most of the rounds over. when i was a kid i used to cheese this all so hard
Ahh! Det här är hans hjärna ! Ta bort den från mig ! Ahh ! this is his brain ! Take it away from me ! -One of the swedish voicelines that the cavalry said while under fire from legends cannons XD I remember that voiceline from Empire total war first playing as sweden.
Bro puts so much thought into his battles? I usually just leave my army as the line they come in when the battle starts and only rearrange my artillery lol
Very nice fight, played a lot of empire recently, and watching the enemy line shifting along yours presenting its flank to canister shot was extremely satisfying to watch(but why they scrapped fire by rank moving from empire to napoleon will ever remain a mystery to me...) On that note, from what i've heard the common opinion is that gunplay in fots is superior to empire/napoleon(might be wrong), i only played both of the latter, but it seemed to me from your recent video with fots artillery, that there you only need to form a firing line, and then wait as the enemy gets decimated since the artillery in fots is just that powerful. But in ETW/NTW you actually need to incorporate your artillery in your line, and maintain battlefield control with other units to actually win. Artillery is strong, but won't win without proper support, which makes it more interesting imo. So why do people consider fots to have better gunplay?
Several points: 1) The sheer spectacle of satisfying audio and visuals: Empire/Nepoleon gunfire isn't completely impotent the same way it's in Warhammer, say, but it just doesn't measure up to absolute roar of artillery that you can hear even from the other side of the map, or battlefield being covered with gunfire smoke. 2) It actually works": Shogun 2 isn't utterly blameless (there are broken pathing behaviors in larger siege maps for instance) but especially in Empire but also in Napoleon the systems simply break. Aside from the AI that simply suicides, not because of sheer volume of well-positioned firepower that cannot be attacked head-on, but because it can't even in good conditions effectively set up a firing line (the sort of behavior you see in this battle on the left flank where it just eats canister without even trying to fire back), it's glitchy with units simply not functioning, especially in sieges. From players' perspective this battle went pretty smoothly, but trust me, it doesn't always work nearly as well while in FotS it mostly does. 3) Battles seen in the recent disaster battles tend to be mid-lategame armies and line warfare works closer to Napoleon with early game armies: in fact, traditional units and line infantries counter each other (at the very start of the game you only have spear and gun militia levies available and I could decisively beat an AI army with one with the other, or a mix of both - it just requires tactics): guns mowing down everything that even looks at them funny isn't true for the entirety of the game and in actual campaign gameplay getting to that point feels like a deserved reward. 5) Related to the above point, the campaign systems are far more robust and that matters too in a game that's a mix of TBS and RTT. For instance, getting those Armstrong guns is a real, tangible, opportunity cost. I actually tend not to rush for them at all despite their power, and try to work with line infantries for a while. There actually are some things that Empire/Napoleon do better, like different firing drills for line infantries, but on the balance it's not really even close.
From what I can tell the FOTS gunpowder units are more powerful to begin with, but also the firing lines we've seen Legend form at the start of his videos have been packing 3x or more the punch because they've ~all been 3 ranks deep firing over each other's heads from the sides of hills. It's been the line infantry shredding the enemies as soon as they get in range, while the artillery chunks them bit by bit on the approach.
@@rushi5638 Quite a bit more powerful: based not on stats (which might mean different things in the games) but ascertaining firepower from "number of enemies killed per volley" and reload rate from just counting seconds, levy militia would beat Old Guard, at least in a shooting match (perhaps not if Old Guard charges home). They'd get the first shot off too on account of higher range. But overall they're at least kinda comparable: elite units (French/British/United States marines or Imperial/Shogunate/Republican guards) on the other hand have perhaps 5-10x firepower compared to the best Napoleon units.
Hey Legend, note with charges - they can friendly fire on your troops. 2 cavs attacking one routing target will charge each other during a pursuit so only set 1 cav per unit. Also make sure their line of charge is clear, if they cross during a charge then, yep, you take losses. That's Empire's quirk. If you also order a charge from behind your lines, the infantry will take mass losses as your cav charge through them. Historically accurate I'd say - aristocratic cav storming through their own pleb infantry sounds right!
In Napoleon, you never want to use multiple cavalry units to run down a single routing unit. They tend to cause friendly casualties when charging. That was the reason the cavalry got wrecked in the previous Napoleon disaster battle.
I was just checking out your old napoleon tw france playthrough earlier today! Youve gotten better that was some 6 years ago ! Ive been watching this whole time! Hope you do a new one soon , campaign that is
I've played hundreds of hours of campaign and always loved artillery, especially on river crossings. I remember I would always bait the AI to attack an army that had minimal infantry and cavalry, but at least four cannon units, and place them just inside the enemy controlled section of a bridge on the grand campaign. They would always attack and then I'd achieve ridiculous casualty ratios. Oh and also howitzers are absolutely devastating if you target the ground where the center of a marching infantry regiment is going to be. Instead of blowing up above the infantry regiment, the shells would blow up at their feet. A good shell can easily take out 1/5 of a full strength regiment, especially the Russian howitzers. To balance artillery they should've not given them unlimited ammo. I should start playing again
This was basically my strategy on most flat maps in Empire Total War as well. Rushing canister shot was important for that reason. Fire by rank after that.
Hopefully CA can get back to their properly scoped, unique games and give us an empire / napoleon 2 after the latest debacles. I've been jonesing but the newer games' QOL improvements would be very welcome.
18:44 This is called Oblique order which was a favorite tactic of Frederick The Great of Prussia, one flag (weaker one) tries to at all cost avoid direct combat, while the other one wraps around and pushes hard
yeah, it got really deadly during WW1. 3/4 of the casualty from artillery alone... and that was about 5 years of slaughter with no major changes on the front line....
If the damage to cavalry is the same as in Empire total war, there is a simple if annoying solution to it. Make the cavalry run into the routing unit without charging it, then order to attack, which will cause them to chase instead of charge. It's the charging that gets cavalry killed and it's very stupid when chasing down fleeing enemy.
Very impressive. It makes that they attacked your left flank on the second wave but at the cost of exposing their own left flank to canister shot is nuts.
You can use your cavalry after taking out the artillery to run distraction - threaten their reinforcements then back off as they break off to follow you. That reduces the power they can bring against your line at the same time and can be vitally important.
Back when I used to play Empire: Total War I would place my line infantry in a "staggered" sort of formation, almost as if zig-zagging. Does anyone know whether this actually helps their effectiveness in any way or was it just in my head?
Like for the video, frowny face for the grammatically incorrect it’s when you meant ‘its’ in the title. It’s (with apostrophe) is used when meaning a contraction of ‘it is’. Its is for the possessive. Sorry for the pedantry.
I remember playing a battle against a friend in Empire TW. It was a fortress siege. I lost horribly. All I had left was 4-5 cannon units. My friend sallies forth with his troops from the fort. I stopped firing, changed to canister. Waited until his guys were point blank charging in. All the cannons unloaded at once. It wrecked his units so bad, his entire army broke and I got the win. Was so funny. He was left stunned.
good to see you playing some NTW. I love shogun 2, it's vanilla game is basically an entire well done mod, but NTW is very solid, it's just missing some stuff that mods have to fix and add. However, I still enjoy it and I love the same as shogun and empire, but otherwise enjoy your videos man
- Swedish cavalryman: "Sir, they're forming squares." - Swedish officer: "So? Just keep going." - Swedish cavalryman: "Should we at least sound the charge?" - Swedish officer: "No, we shall advance at a leisurely pace, as to intimidate them." - Swedish cavalryman: "But s--" - Swedish officer: "I SAID LEISURELY"
Hey Legend! it's nice to see you covering some non Warhammer TW games. One thing I have noticed though is that the recording quality is starting to look kinda dated. At first I thought the video was just 720p when it was actually 1080p. I guess that is encoder related. Consider finally upgrading your vernerable 1080ti for one of the current gen GPUs that have a built-in AV1 encoder. This should give you quite a boost in image clarity. I know upgrading a GPU is a price proposition, but consider that even a 4060ti will blow your 1080 out of the water AND get you better looking streams and VODs with more stable framerates.
"I am expecting heavy frontal attacks, so I am gonna have heavy ... frontal ... anti ... shit I don't know ... I will canister shot the hell out of em ..." - 1st Duke of Wellington, 18th June 1815
I played the Peninsular campaign extensively, I can safely say that you can do the whole campaign as the British by only liberating towns to spain and relying on artillery and skirmishers and it taught me how fucking valuable these two units are, even when heavily outnumbered you can still beat the ever living hell of attackers with a plan and artillery.
I would reccommend playing the infantry a little differently in napoleon. Since artillery friendly fire is so brutal at short range from regular cannon balls see 8:37 if you're using them for canister shot anyway put the infantry in the same positions you want them in just a little behind the cannons and then right before the enemy is in canister shot range quick pause and redraw the lines and make the infantry all run to their positions with r. They take minimal fatigue from running such a short distance and the cannons don't do nearly as much friendly fire.
![True Size of Napoleon's Army - The Infantry [c. 1808] 3D DOCUMENTARY](/img/1.gif)
A more historically accurate Napoleon-era battle than anything in Ridley Scott's new movie.
His movie was awesome even if it wasnt historically accurate
@@Fire-jk8ye His movie was pissed vomited shit. If you appreciated it you're an irdiot 👍🏻.
@@Fire-jk8ye it sucked ass even if you ignore the historical inaccuracy
nah@@milkyway208O
Why?@@Fire-jk8ye
“Artillery adds dignity to what would otherwise be an ugly brawl”- Frederick the Great
This game really lives by those words.
Can you translate in German ?
@@strategosaurus "Artillerie verleiht einer ansonsten hässlichen Schlägerei Würde" - Friedrich der Große
@@FrederikSeerupNielsen boah hätte nicht gedacht eine Antwort zu bekommen. vielen dank für die Hilfe 😔
Napoleon said that God is on the side with the most artillery, and it shows in his game
@@strategosaurus google translated this almost perfectly!
Nothing better than leaving gaps in your infantry and putting in cannon with cannister shot in between
You can replicate that in Shogun 2: Fall Of The Samurai with Gatling Guns as well.
It is as satisfying - if not more satisfying - to see them mulch & break the enemies' units the moment they get in range or when you activate that Fire-At-Will button 😂.
@@lukmaanpratomo6866 Or you can do that at 550 range with Armstrong guns (or several kilometers range with naval ones) since they shoot shrapnel shells rather than solid shot to begin with. ;)
@@KimmoKMartillery in fots is so devastating
I loved doing that when I played Napoleon. Seeing the enemy melt in front of a well timed cannister shot was always a bless
It's basically Napoleon way of warfare -Put the artillery in the front for f sake, this is not medieval anymore
“To cannon, all men are equal.”
But horses are not men hence it is a good in game target for arty
Napoleon as he turn Germans into swiss cheese:
"Cannon is god. "
- Napoleon
I was practically shouting at the screen when the Swedish line turned their entire forward line towards the battery "USE ROUND SHOT!". So glad you caught it in time. The AI definitely knows never to do that maneuver, but because you tricked them into thinking the rest of the line was out of range of the cannons, they did it anyway and the instant you fired round shot they scattered like crazy, but that one shot you got off probably killed a good 60-80 men just by bouncing on the ground. Incredible game, well commanded.
At which time?
@@saladedefruit2529 About 20:04. Artillery used round shot and got enfilade fire on the infantry columns and fucked them up big time.
Mutually supporting infantry squares. Wellington would be proud
Wellington is an overrated fuck to be honest... Glorified by brits as some sort of hero because he supposedly succeed to beat the frightening war monster that was Napoleon.
Because brits are annoying dicks trying to rewrite their own history the most glorifying way possible (even if it means bullshitting reality and facts), they pushed hard the "Napoleon defeat was ALL ABOUT us brits, us Wellington and us Waterloo fight", the same way their illegitimate son USA pushed forward the "WW2 was winned single-handlely by us USA and nobody else. We ze best. We save the day, nobody else existed or contributed to the win..."
We got a really fresh example with how Ridley Scott handled his Napoleon """biopic"""" movie, embracing the Brits' national romance 200% instead of, well, History...
It's truely annoying...
The truth is, Napoleon's defeat was about MANY things among which Wellington was just a part, and really not the decisive part.
Wellington was definitively not that much of the genius UK want the world to think (to glorify their side of Napoleon's era).
He would have been, Napoleon would have been defeated much earlier by him... But he didn't...
And wellington wasn't even that great of a man as he didn't even contributed to the world beyond the "hey, i was that brit guy here when Napoleon got a decisive fail".
Just an overly glorified dude by Brits propaganda.
Napoleon already made use of infantry squares during the Battle of the Pyramids in 1798.
@@ROCCATEER92 yeah and davout at battle of jena-auestedt in 1806 and even in more
battles. He used it very commonly as far as I know
@@ROCCATEER92 yeah the formation was use since the Roman time
"The formation was described by Plutarch and used by the Ancient Romans; it was developed from an earlier circular formation. In particular, a large infantry square was used by the Roman legions at the Battle of Carrhae against Parthia, whose armies contained a large proportion of cavalry"
@@sometingwong2733 didn't work very well!
The musket's ball makes a small hole
The cannonball makes an even larger one
- Fridericus Rex Grenadiermarsch - marching song.
People who play Napoleon swear by Howitzers, but I've always loved 8/9 pounders the most. They're in between a 6 and 12 pounder, have just enough power to deal with cav at long range and can tackle infantry at the same range as skirmishers. Like other straight firing cannons, however, they suffer against hills. I know forts are non existant in Napoleon but its still good to have cannons even when you have access to howitzers because they deal with cavalry a lot better than Empire.
Medium cannons are sweet, but i can't live without horse arty anymore. The flexibility it grants to your army is priceless, but I guess it depends on your playstyle... I tend to be offensive and on the move, so I use artillery mainly for counterbattery and for dealing with cav. In that role the 6 pounders accuracy is nice, it lacks in range and damage, but I never find myself wanting for more of those.
Well you cant say no to some good ol HAUBITZEN
Idk i prefer 12 pounders, this was my last army with any 8 pounders in it, and in my opinion i should have never sent it out 2ith this arty setup, i always have 5 12 pounders 4 cav, a general and the rest infantry
The Grand Battery from Napoleons Army (France) are the best cannons in game. I always use them in battle
Russian Unicorns mate, best defensive artillery in the game (if used right). The 10-pdrs melt through infantry while the 20-pdrs can devastate entire armies with near-impunity.
“The cannon ball did so much damage bouncing horizontally…” is called Enfilading Fire.
Indeed it is, but with a cannon needs good timing!
lol I love todo this with 1 unit of 12 pounders that can run, and send them of to the side of the map with 1 unit of infantry and 1 unit that can form square. The AI simply just ignore you
I'm glad to see you putting your cannons in the battle line. Canister shot is the most powerful ability in this game, and with your big guns in the line they can get some serious hits on them, and can continue to shoot round shot as they advance
NTW still looks visually stunning after all these years.
Fr this was my first campaign in the game and i really enjoyed it, the graphics are amazing, especially the gunpowder clouds
It’s just such a shame the battle AI is so poor in what is otherwise such a great title. The graphics and immersion are great, spoiled by painfully stupid AI. And having played Ultimate General we all know a decent AI is possible.
The AI would have been acceptable if you weren't so limited with only 20 units in a period that depicted probably the most large scale battles at the time. The reinforcement mechanic is so stupid its such a shame they copied shit from ETW instead of optimizing this issues
@@antoniodelaugger9236if battles were the size of warhammer total war everyone’s computer in 2010 would fry, mine would’ve at least
@@antoniodelaugger9236 having more units on the field would be even more taxing for an already struggling AI, so the very opposite would be the case.
The general's unit just w a l k i ng while being obliterated by artillery
@@antoniodelaugger9236 Use DarthMod with the updated Bran revisions. It is a superior game and you can have 40 unit armies.
This video was a better depiction of Napoleon than Ridley Scott's shit movie
😂
tbh, i wouldnt be surprised if the guy offs himself over how badly it turned out
@@PilvenugaNah he'll cope by just blaming kids on their phones again like last time lol
Were you expecting an action-packed war movie?
@@asraarradon4115Given that he was one of the most significant military figures of all time, yes.
7:11 Swedish guy goes "agh, that's his brains!" Haha holy crap I've never heard that before
it was such a joy hearing all the nations speaking (mostly) their own languages in Empire/Napoleon, even the Eastern nations. Adds to that element of immersiveness that I usually don't care for if they get right or wrong, but in this case it very much enhanced my experience by a LOT.
19:48 that "Just spewing out bloody Sun Tzu" rant was beautiful xD
I really liked the garrison buildings in Napoleon that you could put your boys in random houses shooting out the windows. Very bad for their health if the enemy has cannon though!
They work better in Napoleon than Empire for sure, although I'd say the best is when in a desperate situation baiting the enemy to commit significant amounts of full strength troops into taking a building with some of your own brave, but damaged, lads garrisoned, then leveling said building to kill essentially everyone inside.
I had a great battle in Empire where the enemy were engaged in melee down a street with my guys shooting out the windows onto them, it was a lot of fun.
@@saint4life09that’s such a mad lad move, and I’m all for it 😂
Witnessing Canister Shot in a real battle must be unimaginably brutal just seeing men around you get ripped to shreds while you keep marching forward hoping you somehow miss the hail of shrapnel and bullets.
There's a Russian movie, Union of Salvation, while not the most historically accurate, shows grapeshot used to horrifying effect at relatively close range. fantastic scene in an otherwise mid movie.
Check out the book Waterloo by Bernard Cornwell. In it he quotes hundreds of in person accounts including one about how British canister shot would kill by the hundreds. They would double pack the barrels. Round shot first then canister on top. The canister to decimate the front of the line while the round shot could pass through an entire column of men.
I remember researching cannister shot for the first time in Empire Total War. I remember the first time I used cannister shot in battle and saw it demolish a whole charging unit of cavalry. Such beautiful memories.
I LOVED Napoleon as a sequel to Empire. I would have liked to see it developed a bit more as the 1800s was a time of massive change. Like America: Civil War, Crimea: A peninsula at War, The Franco-Prussian War, the Spanish-American War, The Mexican American war, etc. Wish they made other sequels to the game because Total War got me into Grand Strategy games but Paradox picked up where Creative Assembly lacked
Love seeing this! Warhammer has felt so stale lately, and seeing some historical total war and Legend kicking ass is the best!!
I mean just this battle alone is way better than Ridley Scott's new movie.
Nice vid, happy to see you playing more napoleon!
A little bit of tech that I didn't see you using is to wait until the very last second to put lines into square formation. You'll get a full volley in on cav which compounds with the square formations strength against mounted units to break cavalry quite a bit quicker than if you were exclusively using square. It's tricky to get the timing if you need to micro a bunch of other units, but if I remember correctly your line gets the bonus after a second regardless of their actual positioning~
LEGEND using Frederick the great tactics without realizing it. That's how you recognize true legend.
Old Fritz's Oblique Order of Battle
I really like the way you positioned your infantry.
if you micro your art you can easily take out all the enemy cav as they walk towards you. aim at the ground in front of the cav since the rounds bounce but the autoaim sends most of the rounds over. when i was a kid i used to cheese this all so hard
Ahh! Det här är hans hjärna !
Ta bort den från mig !
Ahh ! this is his brain !
Take it away from me !
-One of the swedish voicelines that the cavalry said while under fire from legends cannons XD
I remember that voiceline from Empire total war first playing as sweden.
This video brings me back... First PC game I owned on steam
also 13:37
Bro puts so much thought into his battles? I usually just leave my army as the line they come in when the battle starts and only rearrange my artillery lol
He is outnumbered
Very nice fight, played a lot of empire recently, and watching the enemy line shifting along yours presenting its flank to canister shot was extremely satisfying to watch(but why they scrapped fire by rank moving from empire to napoleon will ever remain a mystery to me...)
On that note, from what i've heard the common opinion is that gunplay in fots is superior to empire/napoleon(might be wrong), i only played both of the latter, but it seemed to me from your recent video with fots artillery, that there you only need to form a firing line, and then wait as the enemy gets decimated since the artillery in fots is just that powerful.
But in ETW/NTW you actually need to incorporate your artillery in your line, and maintain battlefield control with other units to actually win. Artillery is strong, but won't win without proper support, which makes it more interesting imo.
So why do people consider fots to have better gunplay?
Several points:
1) The sheer spectacle of satisfying audio and visuals: Empire/Nepoleon gunfire isn't completely impotent the same way it's in Warhammer, say, but it just doesn't measure up to absolute roar of artillery that you can hear even from the other side of the map, or battlefield being covered with gunfire smoke.
2) It actually works": Shogun 2 isn't utterly blameless (there are broken pathing behaviors in larger siege maps for instance) but especially in Empire but also in Napoleon the systems simply break. Aside from the AI that simply suicides, not because of sheer volume of well-positioned firepower that cannot be attacked head-on, but because it can't even in good conditions effectively set up a firing line (the sort of behavior you see in this battle on the left flank where it just eats canister without even trying to fire back), it's glitchy with units simply not functioning, especially in sieges. From players' perspective this battle went pretty smoothly, but trust me, it doesn't always work nearly as well while in FotS it mostly does.
3) Battles seen in the recent disaster battles tend to be mid-lategame armies and line warfare works closer to Napoleon with early game armies: in fact, traditional units and line infantries counter each other (at the very start of the game you only have spear and gun militia levies available and I could decisively beat an AI army with one with the other, or a mix of both - it just requires tactics): guns mowing down everything that even looks at them funny isn't true for the entirety of the game and in actual campaign gameplay getting to that point feels like a deserved reward.
5) Related to the above point, the campaign systems are far more robust and that matters too in a game that's a mix of TBS and RTT. For instance, getting those Armstrong guns is a real, tangible, opportunity cost. I actually tend not to rush for them at all despite their power, and try to work with line infantries for a while.
There actually are some things that Empire/Napoleon do better, like different firing drills for line infantries, but on the balance it's not really even close.
From what I can tell the FOTS gunpowder units are more powerful to begin with, but also the firing lines we've seen Legend form at the start of his videos have been packing 3x or more the punch because they've ~all been 3 ranks deep firing over each other's heads from the sides of hills. It's been the line infantry shredding the enemies as soon as they get in range, while the artillery chunks them bit by bit on the approach.
@@rushi5638 Quite a bit more powerful: based not on stats (which might mean different things in the games) but ascertaining firepower from "number of enemies killed per volley" and reload rate from just counting seconds, levy militia would beat Old Guard, at least in a shooting match (perhaps not if Old Guard charges home). They'd get the first shot off too on account of higher range. But overall they're at least kinda comparable: elite units (French/British/United States marines or Imperial/Shogunate/Republican guards) on the other hand have perhaps 5-10x firepower compared to the best Napoleon units.
Really enjoyed this. Very educational for own battles aswell. Great commentary
Ahh Legends anticlockwise wheeling clock of death formation.
Napoleon was my most played tw before warhammers. Thanks legend to remind me of how good it was.
I started Napoleon in 2024, it's far more polished then Empire and I had very good times, they gotta make 15-16th century new modern game too
I truly love Napoleon Total War, really only beat by Warhammer 2, Medieval 2, and Rome 1
Agreed
Hey Legend, note with charges - they can friendly fire on your troops. 2 cavs attacking one routing target will charge each other during a pursuit so only set 1 cav per unit. Also make sure their line of charge is clear, if they cross during a charge then, yep, you take losses. That's Empire's quirk. If you also order a charge from behind your lines, the infantry will take mass losses as your cav charge through them. Historically accurate I'd say - aristocratic cav storming through their own pleb infantry sounds right!
i dont see you so happpy to play TW game long time. no more complain pure fun to play and fix battle for player :D happy to see.
In Napoleon, you never want to use multiple cavalry units to run down a single routing unit. They tend to cause friendly casualties when charging. That was the reason the cavalry got wrecked in the previous Napoleon disaster battle.
I was just checking out your old napoleon tw france playthrough earlier today! Youve gotten better that was some 6 years ago ! Ive been watching this whole time! Hope you do a new one soon , campaign that is
Wow this was a masterclass in pulling-off an Oblique Order, big ups Legend and Frederick the Great! 🙏
I've played hundreds of hours of campaign and always loved artillery, especially on river crossings. I remember I would always bait the AI to attack an army that had minimal infantry and cavalry, but at least four cannon units, and place them just inside the enemy controlled section of a bridge on the grand campaign. They would always attack and then I'd achieve ridiculous casualty ratios.
Oh and also howitzers are absolutely devastating if you target the ground where the center of a marching infantry regiment is going to be. Instead of blowing up above the infantry regiment, the shells would blow up at their feet. A good shell can easily take out 1/5 of a full strength regiment, especially the Russian howitzers.
To balance artillery they should've not given them unlimited ammo.
I should start playing again
I really like the story of the last few weeks, which is legend discovering linear infantry tactics :)
love watching you do your stuff , a fav game of mine
This was basically my strategy on most flat maps in Empire Total War as well.
Rushing canister shot was important for that reason.
Fire by rank after that.
Being on that battlefield with the canister shot firing range would have been absolutely terrifying.
Hopefully CA can get back to their properly scoped, unique games and give us an empire / napoleon 2 after the latest debacles. I've been jonesing but the newer games' QOL improvements would be very welcome.
18:44 This is called Oblique order which was a favorite tactic of Frederick The Great of Prussia, one flag (weaker one) tries to at all cost avoid direct combat, while the other one wraps around and pushes hard
Man 6 million people were killed in napolionic war, just imagine how deadly were cannons and gunpower
yeah, it got really deadly during WW1. 3/4 of the casualty from artillery alone... and that was about 5 years of slaughter with no major changes on the front line....
Half of them are civilian casualties, though, and the great amount of casualties was not done by cannons or gunpowders, it was disease.
Im currently in a Napoleon campaign and this is sooooo satisfaying to watch! Aweseome you keep pumping out this vids Legend.
Nice clean victory! I very much enjoyed overseeing this bloodshed!
If the damage to cavalry is the same as in Empire total war, there is a simple if annoying solution to it. Make the cavalry run into the routing unit without charging it, then order to attack, which will cause them to chase instead of charge. It's the charging that gets cavalry killed and it's very stupid when chasing down fleeing enemy.
Very impressive. It makes that they attacked your left flank on the second wave but at the cost of exposing their own left flank to canister shot is nuts.
just watched legend pulled a tactical masterclass even napoleon would go wow
You can use your cavalry after taking out the artillery to run distraction - threaten their reinforcements then back off as they break off to follow you. That reduces the power they can bring against your line at the same time and can be vitally important.
If you hit "square" at the absolute last moment, it still counts as "square" and you'll get the anti-cavalry bonus. If you doubt me, try it.
There are no hills to play with, but at least there is grass on the field.
Nice work on this. I like that Napoleon always referred to his cannons as his "beautiful daughters".
"The last argument of Kings"
Engraving on Louis the XIV's cannons.
Can we have a gunpowder livestream next either FOS or Napoleon? You got us craving it!!!
Enfilade - a volley of gunfire directed along a line from end to end.
Back when I used to play Empire: Total War I would place my line infantry in a "staggered" sort of formation, almost as if zig-zagging. Does anyone know whether this actually helps their effectiveness in any way or was it just in my head?
In fact legend is Napoleon, you should do a stream dressed as him
LOVED them square formations!
I really need to play this game finally... lolol fuck new total war games, man... rip ca...
Like for the video, frowny face for the grammatically incorrect it’s when you meant ‘its’ in the title. It’s (with apostrophe) is used when meaning a contraction of ‘it is’. Its is for the possessive. Sorry for the pedantry.
Glad to see some Napoleon: Total War!
But when im playing they straight up just charge the battery no matter what happens
You had them boxed in that killing field was awesome
I remember playing a battle against a friend in Empire TW. It was a fortress siege. I lost horribly.
All I had left was 4-5 cannon units.
My friend sallies forth with his troops from the fort.
I stopped firing, changed to canister. Waited until his guys were point blank charging in.
All the cannons unloaded at once.
It wrecked his units so bad, his entire army broke and I got the win.
Was so funny. He was left stunned.
Legend: see that horse artillery?
Chasseur a Cheval: yes sir
Legend: I don't want to see it anymore!
That bouncing shot down the line was disgusting!
Loving the recent content, please could we have a fall of the samurai campaign soon?
i wish napoleon had modern tw qol and controls
Man I love this game's music
Crazy how Miltiade's battle plan in Battle of Marathon became a Hannibal Barca's one nowadays.
He kinda pioneered the tactic
Hannibal perfected it
Watching the enemy general get headshot by the artillery on their first shot at him sent me into orbit
I've just always been such a fan of gunpowder in Total war. Even in Warhammer, using Empire Handgunners and artillery made the Empire my fav faction.
I am so used to seeing the French flag as "enemy" that I kept wondering for the entire half-hour _why_ he's so chuffed that the enemy's won.
good to see you playing some NTW. I love shogun 2, it's vanilla game is basically an entire well done mod, but NTW is very solid, it's just missing some stuff that mods have to fix and add. However, I still enjoy it and I love the same as shogun and empire, but otherwise enjoy your videos man
The Hill Master posts yet another total war video
Dam you legend, now I'm installing the game
- Swedish cavalryman: "Sir, they're forming squares."
- Swedish officer: "So? Just keep going."
- Swedish cavalryman: "Should we at least sound the charge?"
- Swedish officer: "No, we shall advance at a leisurely pace, as to intimidate them."
- Swedish cavalryman: "But s--"
- Swedish officer: "I SAID LEISURELY"
Loved it! Please, do more napoleon and empire battles!
I played the vanilla game for a while but I really like the NTW3 mod. It really adds some better mechanics.
Hey Legend! it's nice to see you covering some non Warhammer TW games. One thing I have noticed though is that the recording quality is starting to look kinda dated. At first I thought the video was just 720p when it was actually 1080p.
I guess that is encoder related.
Consider finally upgrading your vernerable 1080ti for one of the current gen GPUs that have a built-in AV1 encoder. This should give you quite a boost in image clarity. I know upgrading a GPU is a price proposition, but consider that even a 4060ti will blow your 1080 out of the water AND get you better looking streams and VODs with more stable framerates.
"I am expecting heavy frontal attacks, so I am gonna have heavy ... frontal ... anti ... shit I don't know ... I will canister shot the hell out of em ..." - 1st Duke of Wellington, 18th June 1815
Loved the maneuvering in this battle!
Infrantry men in the left line, probably:
PIVOOOT! PIVOOOTTT!
I played the Peninsular campaign extensively, I can safely say that you can do the whole campaign as the British by only liberating towns to spain and relying on artillery and skirmishers and it taught me how fucking valuable these two units are, even when heavily outnumbered you can still beat the ever living hell of attackers with a plan and artillery.
That force started off already picked to pieces. With the line infantry so small I would be really worried.
The old total war titles AI makes the warhammer 3 one look like some genius mastermind ...
Ok, starting to watch just to check if legend learned about carré formation. Wish me luck
Yes, he did! Finally
This game is such a masterpiece.
I would reccommend playing the infantry a little differently in napoleon. Since artillery friendly fire is so brutal at short range from regular cannon balls see 8:37 if you're using them for canister shot anyway put the infantry in the same positions you want them in just a little behind the cannons and then right before the enemy is in canister shot range quick pause and redraw the lines and make the infantry all run to their positions with r. They take minimal fatigue from running such a short distance and the cannons don't do nearly as much friendly fire.
Exactly
As a man who loves this style of warfare but has no idea what the fuck I am doing in this game. Thank you xD
How was the Ridley Scott Napoleon movie? Did @LegendofTotalWar enjoy it?
Handeling the second wave made me think of oblique order battlefield tactic: let your strong flank fight and not you weak one
awesome battle mate, real fun to watch.
cant watching how you streaching your infantry to limits of possibility i just cant xD
Its*
No apostrophe with possessive of "it"
Better than the Napoleon Movie