What do you mean? It's completely inaccurate! Venice actually arrived at the Crusade target instead of sacking Constantinople and calling it a day. Totally ruined my immersion!
@@mirceam7152 You can generally win the campaign before the Mongols or Timurids. And I do play cheesy - the AI cannot figure out how to maneuver around forts especially if you place their zone of control around rivers crossing and bridges. Their armies will siege for one turn, lift the siege and try again - if you place them at all the crossings on the the river by the eastern edge of the map where they will be trapped on that side forever.
@johnstamos4186 the Pope had besieged me at Tangiers while I was fighting Spain, so I went for a kill shot. For the next twenty turns I was fighting Byzantines, Venetians, Milanese, while slowly clearing Italy. I had killed about four crusader armies that came one at a time previously, but they decided to unify this time. I had just knocked Naples and was clearing out armies in the Po Valley, so while I was expecting this, my field armies were a little out of range by the time it happened.
Ironically, the older historical titles have more chaotic campaign and battle scenarios than the fantasy games with literal factions based around the concept of creating chaos to appease unhinged demons
@@carsonnesbit1178 Couldn't agree more, I would love it if I could fight with my AI allies more, or at least fight 2+ stacks of different enemy factions who are allied together. Really hard to make happen though, even with the "military alignment" options in WH3.
@@AleXoEx0 yea I feel that, I love playing dwarves and empire and I really wish Allie’s would show up in battles more often because seeing the two factions fight side by side is always so awesome for me. Unfortunately, when I ask Allie’s to attack a settlement that I want them to, they usually just don’t, or they take a ridiculously long time to mobilize their army. It’s unfortunate, I don’t know how medieval 2 was able to get that right but not any of the newer games.
Multiple crusader armies besieging a single city and poring through the breaches like a floodwater. The visual of Legend trying to get his generals bodyguard back into the city after attacking the ballista unit with the HRE cavalry hot on his tail. His melee infantry being completely ground down and wiped out while holding chokepoints leading to the town square. This battle really nailed the aesthetic of Medieval II and is a testament to the games staying power that it could happen nearly 17 years after the games release. PS: Bonus points for the Papal States controlling Florence and having an army to contribute to the crusade but no doing so. I doubt that will stop the Pope from admonishing the crusaders from failing to take Rome and salting their wounds.
No doubt knowing the MTW2 Pope, all these kingdoms will be swiftly excommunicated by his holiness for their failure to recapture the Rome HE LOST by himself.
@@warlordofbritannia it isn't well not fully at least ..... the castles have been designed to look more like the Renaissance period with parts of medieval thrown in... also some of the place names in the game are modern names and not given their names when they were in the medieval period, like Spain for exampl. despite all this , The game is one of CA best total war games , along with Rome
Panning around at 20:00 or so, armies on the horizon, siege equipment in the distance, fighting in the streets. Old Total War did sieges so much better than what we have now.
Yeah TWWH walls might look pretty but the lack of actually being walls with the enemies just tele up from behind (never heard of layers of defence?) as well as the insanely blocky and ugly layout. Unfortunately, it seems Medieval ai is barely worse that what we got now lol.
@@h4xorzistI see the "reason" why CA changed the sieges. Back in the days we were playing a 1 v 2 siege-series with the defender having about 1/3 less money than EACH of the attacker and sitting in the lowest stone wall castle. No matter the tactics used by the attacker the one defending ALWAYS won by far. E.g. one of us even tried "swiss cheese tactic" where he just obliterated the walls, breaching every single hole and destroying every single tower before the assault. Despite all that the defender still won, using choke points and falling back to the town center to fight until death... Sieges in earlier TW games are very imba for the defender hence why I think CA made sieges a somewhat "different" terrain battle to give the attacker a slight chance. All this flag capturing and open terrain inside the walls or the walls themselves being almost like open terrain is just them trying to solve the imbalance... CA is just to lazy to come up with better ideas...
@@cccpredarmy Tournaments completely aside, walled cities were granting the defenders an about 10:1 advantage (if properly built). So, for the historical game this is very reasonable. But in Warhammer it's so bad the walls are downright worse to man then to do anything else making me question why they built them and don't get me started on the downright retarded towers, literally built in a way to teach cheese to every single person playing the game. TWWH sieges get a 1/10 in every category from all angles except fancy looks.
@@cccpredarmy It really came down to how you use your units in siege battles and what units those are. Never underestimate the usefulness of heavy cavalry and spear units during a siege battle. in medieval it was always about the lack of very damaging skirmishers that the other games had.
I did some math; out of the 3,680 kills Legend got, only 2,115 were caused from his units. That leaves 1,565 kills to be attributed to towers, The placement of those crossbows were paramount to getting this victory!
@@PancakefieldLegend got 3680 kills and 2481 captured soldiers, which sums to 6161 soldiers killed or captured by Legend. Then you can add up all the soldiers the enemy lost which will equal that 6161 plus whatever died to friendly fire. That total would be 6199 total deaths. Which means the enemy's friendly fire killed 38 of their own soldiers. If you look at the detailed stats screen you will find the kills each one of Legend's units got which sums up to 2115. The difference between 3680 and 2115 is the number killed by towers since those kills are included in the total kills but not listed in the detailed screen. Ignoring possible errors in reading the stats since those 0s 8s and 6s are hard to differentiate sometimes. 3680+2481=6161 captured and killed 1430+432+1522+1520+1295=6199 total enemy losses 6199-6161=38 friendly fire deaths 227+115+73+84+239+121+101+111+65+81+142+211+103+70+81+92+60+84+46+9=2115 kills by army units 3680-2115=1565 kills by towers
Hell of a battle. I'm pretty sure the general gained all that dread from that battle alone, as I don't think he was called the Merciless before you started the battle
I like how the general was like 1 dread before the battle to almost having max dread in like one singular battle. (Also Azedine was called "Of Africa" before not "The Merciless", that's how much dread you got)
50 years later: That 1 urban militia: "When granpa was at your age, gramp stood against 100.000 infidels during battle of Rome." The kids: "Oh c'mon gramps, not this story again. you've told us dozen times" the silver chevron urban militia fought severe PTSD and hung himself.
This was amazing! In my head cannon I can so easily imagine the crusaders actually screwing up like this. The imperial pudding heads leaving their seige equipement undefended so it gets burnt down by a few cavalrymen and the emperor going in without support and getting ambushed by a mob, then his whole army leaving when he dies like with Barbarossa after he drowned, the milanese duke squandering a tonne of money on mercs who rout as soon as he catches a spear to the face, the venetians forgetting to bring any seige and arriving at the wrong side of the city then having to march all the way round the walls to the join the battle getting destroyed along the way, the french, having let the italians take most of the enemy arrow fire, charging through their routing italian allies, killing most of them like at agincourt with the genoese then kamakaziing into a wall of spears, almost getting a breakthrough, then running away super quickly the moment it they see 10 knights and a few crossbowmen, and the poles loafing around waiting for the germans to all die or leave before agreeing to commit their forces because of historical differences, then getting trashed because they let their allies die. And of course the English don't even bother showing up because they are too busy fighting the Scots. Any money, if the moors did make it to Rome after taking all of Spain and there was a crusade to take it back, THIS is more or less exactly how it would go down!
it does read like one of those wild ass battles. that for from reason no one talks about and 100% happened with zero embellishments , but only be on youtube as a "history be like" meme
There actually was a battle like this, except it was the reverse and on sea: the Arabs were taking Rome through Ostia in 849 and were repelled by a coalition of Byzantium, Venice, the Italian duchies, and the Papal States all putting aside their disputes temporarily. We don't have numbers, but it seems the Arabs were more likely to have outnumbered them, seeing as how it was planned and the Christians didn't seem too prepared. The Arab fleet was too spread apart, got hit by a storm, was picked off separately by the Christian fleet, the Arabs had a lot of miscommunication and some seem to have left the battle before even getting in the fight. The battle was easily won due to how seriously bad the Arabs bungled it. The battle was considered the greatest Christian resistance to a Muslim fleet up until Lepanto, which overshadowed it.
It's amazing how since Rome 2 CA has advertised you can have giant battles which rarely happened and here's Medieval 2 just casually strolling up like this.
But even if battles like these can happen in Rome 2, you won't be able to repell an army this big. Because that warscape engine doesn't reward circumstance as much as Medieval 2 does. Of course you could do it if you had elephants and chariots. But a pure infantry and missile based army in Rome 2 wouldn't be able to do shit.
Back then there was an own profession of game tester, instead of some retard who never plays games but has the term "quality assurance" which is entirely based on KPIs. The whole industry got overindustrialised. It's not about making a game you'd like to play yourself anymore for these people, but to make a game that is as good as necessary but as simple as possible.
yeah medieval 2 was the peak of siege battles in the total war series. It went downhill from there. The concentric castles with 3 sets of walls were so badass. You could use your archers to shoot them and fall back to the second and third sets of walls and have a last stand at the keep.
@@tzardnickolasthelitromanov Fall of the Samurai's sieges were pretty good, mainly because in Vanilla Shogun 2 its not optimal to spend food levelling up your cities apart from one or two specific ones, in Fall of the Samurai the garrisons were bigger and it could make for more epic fights.
Total War Warhammer has literally been the fallback game for nearly every big RUclipsr in the last 7.5 years, once the early access they get for new games is past they stop promoting them and go back to Warhammer.
Bro, i have no idea how you always do this. Defending such a great city with 2 thousand warriors against like 8 thousand is craxy. You truly are THE LEGENG no shit. Like i am long time viewer, but it always surprises me how you can make an absolutely lost scenario not a win, but a decisive win. I often have problems fighting 2 stacks and you're here fighting off 5 of them. Tf. Respect Legend. Sincerely. Edit: " Thats how usually French march. XDDDD "
Historically siege defense with 2k against 8k army is not that crazy. Example siege of Constantinople the ottomans probably got like 20 times more men against the romans
@@fernandohosea9365 i respect this answer, however i am talkin about the game itself. I am having hard time dealing with 2 stacks, Legend nonetheless deals with like 5 stacked army.
Emperor Heinricus of Holy roman empire: Men deployed 1900, men lost 1520, enemies killed 79. Great job commanding buddy, might want to think about changing proffesion tho.
Pretty cool to see the factions together like that. Interesting that in Med2 the generals go in with the units rather than sitting back like they do in Rome or Shogun 2. This was probably the most impressive win I've seen you pull - it didn't rely on any cheese really, just good strategy and tactics. Well played.
@Freefrost again, I didn't say it was historical, I said it was thematic. But M2's AI is built on Rome's so it was interesting to me that they consciously made that change.
@Freefrost I can see you're immensely dense and there's little point in replying further. I was just making a bloody observation, not passing judgement. Christ.
Not really This is not a difficult battle When the general dies the troops normally can’t break into the town square Ballista towers did half the work I’m not dissing on legend just saying this battle only looks difficult
I don’t think I’ve ever heard Legend say, “I wasn’t expecting the AI to do that” in a positive sense until just the last couple weeks of Medieval 2 content. That’s a pretty strong commentary on the drop in TW AI quality since 2006. Not that it was even particularly good then, but still…
Come on, the AI is not very good in the new titles, but it's much, MUCH better than in the older titles. CA didn't upgrade it much (or rather, it has difficulties learning the new system), but I'll take a Warhammer Total War 3 over a Rome 1/Medieval 2 AI any day 😅
@@MrJeanlebonjambon Maybe Warhammer 2 over Medieval 2 because of fantasy and graphics, I like them both as they satisfy different itches, and maybe WH3 someday if it keeps improving--in my opinion. Have a good one.
@MrJeanlebonjambon The AI was much worse in Medieval 2 than in modern Total Wars. If you sally out they’ll sit still while in range of your cannon/ballista towers and get slaughtered, they charge their king headfirst into bracing spearmen, and in general just send their whole army down one street allowing you to just pick them off with ranger units. It’s not as easy to exploit the modern AI.
A game made by the English-speaking world. In reality, they are the ones who fought the most. The Units of Crusaders, Templars and even Hospitallers came mainly from France, since the First Crusade.
@@tibsky1396 To be fair to this 'game made by the English-speaking world', the French are no slouches in Medieval 2. They definitely have the best heavy cavalry of the Catholic nations, and their position is risky, but very rewarding if you manage to keep the fronts you're fighting on to a minimum. And it is true that all of the Knights Hospitaller are set in the files as French-speaking. They might not quite be as versatile as the HRE and as heavily fortified as the English, but they are definitely a power to be reckoned with in Medieval 2, as well they should be: the French might be the European nation with the greatest track record when it comes to warfare, more so than the English or Germans. They just suffer from having lost their most crucial battles at moments when it mattered the most for them.
WH3 AI is just a fucking coward, they just raid and run as soon as you send any kind of army their way. And yeah, getting any actually good sieges is nearly impossible. Insta attrition system is so terrible.
Which, seeing as Legend kicked their asses, might not have been a bad decision 🤣. Maybe the AI is secretly self-learning and it realised that unless it absolutely screws you over, its battle will be sent in to Legend who will win the unwinnable.
@@kharathos4121 no attrition until reaching the limit, then a brutal 50% per turn. So 100, 100, [...], 100, 50, 25, 12.5, 6.25... instead of a smooth curve
What a cinematic battle. A stalwart force defending their city against five different armies from five different factions. I wish we could see this kind of thing in Warhammer. Excellent performance as always, Legend. Happy to see all this historical variety on the channel lately.
@@alexanderlow919it’s the walls breaking the new windows update for some reason makes games drop every time the wall crumbles pixelated Apollo has mentioned this before
Masterful! I love the Moors as a faction. Those Moorish crossbow militia guys actually have a pretty decent melee attack and defense rating too. The unit that got attacked on the wall held up pretty well I noticed.
Hi there 🖐🖐. Oh yeah i've been following Legend for a long time, learned a lot from his videos, saving the disaster campaign/battle is always a highlight .@@hernanreipp5259
Wow! this is definitely a legendary video!!! New viewer here and I don't usually comment on old vids but this definitely deserves it. I couldn't possibly imagine myself winning this battle. When I saw the vid the first thing to come to mind is that you'd just make a plan to take Rome back. Never have I expected that you'd actually repel those armies. I'd experience something similar with my english and turkish campaigns against the mongols but the lack of siege equipment from them is what wins me those battles. I don't handle multiple breaches so well. :/ Great job! Vid is definitely fun to watch!
Dude, that was legendary. That must be a first take too because i cant see Legend losing that and choosing to try again after it taking 45 bloody minutes lol. Im in disbelief at that battle!!! Good god damn job Legend!!!
What an amazing battle. That's the kind of stuff legends are made of. Those 4 remaining melee guys are absolute heroes. Promotions to General's Bodyguard all-round.
Lmao, that German Balista watching thousands of Allied troops stream into, and then slowly back out of Rome, whilst just sitting there having Lunch "Huh... Guess /that/ didn't go so well hey?"
First of all the French marching backwards joke was still hilarious, secondly I haven't played medieval 2 in years, think this battle has shown how impressive your game knowledge really is, even more so than most of your wh3 battles, keep up the good work Legend! 💪
After ending the campaign several factions i had never experienced this one. That make me restart a new faction and take the rome in early period of campaign before other factions lose the power. I think this is the way to welcome a huge crusade as you had. Wow man i had fun to watch!
Now that legend has started uploading med2 and rome I am watching again his videos. i NEVER liked Warhammer I don't think I am the only one that started watching his channel again since he started uploading historical ones
Reminds me of a game where I had to defend Antioch from the Mongols. I think that was 5 stacks. I was able to set up some spikes inside the city and I think that's what saved me. Still a battle of epic proportions on the town center though.
That reminds me of one campaign as England, where NOBODY fled from my army, because I had so high chivalry and morale stats for my general. Even after he died. Whole army of mine got wiped out. This was during a crusade, when I invaded particularily strong enemy army. NO SINGLE UNIT FLED. This is how strong max Chivalry + Morale boost can be. Enemy got only 1 unit left at the end of the battle. EDIT : Unit stayed in battle even after the general died btw.
Love that the crusaders refused to support eachother for the most part. "If we let those other assholes die we will be in a better position to control the city. You know... for Christ." The immersion was palpable.
An ABSOLUTE LEGEND!!! I watched it all and still have a hard time believing Legend won. Legend IS the military genius the advisor is always saying is needed to win.
Maybe one of your best SYDBs yet. A huge scale, epic battle with great tatics and reactions on your part and it still came down to the wire. Really fun to watch, well done Legend!
I'm actually always playing medieval 2 in windowed mode but I forgot to switch my OBS settings from when I recorded the Rome Total War video. Rome 1 and Medieval 2 require different settings to record. Luckily the Medieval 2 video can run with Rome 1 settings but you'll notice the slight bottom was cut off. Not a big deal.
@@LegendofTotalWar Oh I see, that’s why you were able to see on how many you captured while we couldn’t see that at all. I immediately noticed that there was something off but like you said no big deal. Thanks for letting me know!
This reminds me to a battle I did in a citadel however in Medieval 2. It was also around 2k of my forces (england) vs 8k+ of 5 armys. The battle given it's a citadel with no time limiter enabled took around 2 hours. The moment the battle was about to be won slowly my game crashed. Not sure I managed the win again but i think i didn't my second try. I was so sad but I will never forget those epic battles of medieval 2. Truly the best Total war by miles in siege battles.
@@Bonno95 not in my experience, takes awhile for the Christian nations to truly get involved in war with one another because the pope tends to tell them “No.”
in my experience yes and same for jihads , unless you can confuse the AI with building forts on all the river crossings you'll get swarmed often. @@carsonnesbit1178
They're a fun faction, Arab Cav very useful and cheap from all the towns, militia/peasant crossbows early on are very cost effective garrison troops and Jav Cav very useful for fighting the Christian Cav, urban militia good late game heavy infantry from cities. Bit weak in spears and i don't remember them having pikes or halberds .
I was in a similar situation once in this game, Jerusalem had to defend against several armies from the Timur horde It was an extremely easy battle as the enemy never advanced and just stod there while my canon towers killed them all.
@@FifinatorKlon that's not sallying out. That's giving our noble guests a large gift of super sized stress balls. Long journeys are not known for being calm especially with thousands of people.
In my experience sally out often breaks the ai. It doesn't really matter though since cannon towers will kill them no matter what they do. ballista towers are really strong as well they probably helped quite a bit here.
Really like you going back to the classics. Warhammer was also fine, but there is just something about those old games that the newer ones are missing.
What I learned today is that fear is worse than fighting.
Brought to you by your friendly overlord government
@@NataliaYaremchuk0816 "...and, the only thing they fear... is you"
@@erensametkaratas6593 *Doom music starts playing*
@@erensametkaratas6593theres one they fear, in their tongue, ledeng, legendoftotalwar
In terms of planning and overall competence that was a pretty historically accurate crusade
😂
Lol
The different realms refusing to coordinate with each other is very immersive, 10/10
What do you mean? It's completely inaccurate! Venice actually arrived at the Crusade target instead of sacking Constantinople and calling it a day. Totally ruined my immersion!
They wouldve sacked and burnt down rome worse than the moors.@@DariusOfPersia
I dunno what's more impressive, winning the siege or those 4 infantry that survived the meat grinder.
"survived"
they got hella PTSD after that, they are never setting foot on a battlefield ever again lol
@@Jumka the crossbowmen have ptsd, the 4 infantry had paradise in slaughter
@@Jumka That one guy has 6 xp now lol
That's gotta be one hell of a survivor's guilt
In ALL my time playing, I have never encountered a battle as large as this before. Even when playing against the Romans in Rome 1. Dam impressive.
can easily happen when the mongols/timurids attack you, but then, unless you have a godlike army and are a master of cheese, you lose 100%
I did quite a few, but I was mostly playing with mods.
@@mirceam7152mongols are easy
@@mirceam7152 You can generally win the campaign before the Mongols or Timurids.
And I do play cheesy - the AI cannot figure out how to maneuver around forts especially if you place their zone of control around rivers crossing and bridges. Their armies will siege for one turn, lift the siege and try again - if you place them at all the crossings on the the river by the eastern edge of the map where they will be trapped on that side forever.
In Shogun 2 such battles happen quite often
Oh hey it's my campaign. Didn't think I'd see it out this soon. Thanks again Legend
How did you get in that bad of a situation? LoL....great for all of us though!!
@johnstamos4186 the Pope had besieged me at Tangiers while I was fighting Spain, so I went for a kill shot. For the next twenty turns I was fighting Byzantines, Venetians, Milanese, while slowly clearing Italy. I had killed about four crusader armies that came one at a time previously, but they decided to unify this time. I had just knocked Naples and was clearing out armies in the Po Valley, so while I was expecting this, my field armies were a little out of range by the time it happened.
Always love it in Total War when there's like 5 different factions in a battle.
If only we saw battles like that happen in WH3, would be awesome.
Med 2 is goated though👌
MEDIEVAL 3 will be a fucking disaster if its made by the current CA team so, don't even hope for it@@carsonnesbit1178
Ironically, the older historical titles have more chaotic campaign and battle scenarios than the fantasy games with literal factions based around the concept of creating chaos to appease unhinged demons
@@carsonnesbit1178 Couldn't agree more, I would love it if I could fight with my AI allies more, or at least fight 2+ stacks of different enemy factions who are allied together. Really hard to make happen though, even with the "military alignment" options in WH3.
@@AleXoEx0 yea I feel that, I love playing dwarves and empire and I really wish Allie’s would show up in battles more often because seeing the two factions fight side by side is always so awesome for me.
Unfortunately, when I ask Allie’s to attack a settlement that I want them to, they usually just don’t, or they take a ridiculously long time to mobilize their army.
It’s unfortunate, I don’t know how medieval 2 was able to get that right but not any of the newer games.
Multiple crusader armies besieging a single city and poring through the breaches like a floodwater. The visual of Legend trying to get his generals bodyguard back into the city after attacking the ballista unit with the HRE cavalry hot on his tail. His melee infantry being completely ground down and wiped out while holding chokepoints leading to the town square. This battle really nailed the aesthetic of Medieval II and is a testament to the games staying power that it could happen nearly 17 years after the games release.
PS: Bonus points for the Papal States controlling Florence and having an army to contribute to the crusade but no doing so. I doubt that will stop the Pope from admonishing the crusaders from failing to take Rome and salting their wounds.
No doubt knowing the MTW2 Pope, all these kingdoms will be swiftly excommunicated by his holiness for their failure to recapture the Rome HE LOST by himself.
@@OhNotThat Scumbag Pope
@@OhNotThat
And some say Medieval 2 isn’t historically accurate! 😂
@@warlordofbritannia it isn't well not fully at least ..... the castles have been designed to look more like the Renaissance period with parts of medieval thrown in... also some of the place names in the game are modern names and not given their names when they were in the medieval period, like Spain for exampl. despite all this , The game is one of CA best total war games , along with Rome
This game came out in 2006 😂
Panning around at 20:00 or so, armies on the horizon, siege equipment in the distance, fighting in the streets. Old Total War did sieges so much better than what we have now.
Yeah TWWH walls might look pretty but the lack of actually being walls with the enemies just tele up from behind (never heard of layers of defence?) as well as the insanely blocky and ugly layout.
Unfortunately, it seems Medieval ai is barely worse that what we got now lol.
@@h4xorzist The more complicated they make things the harder it is for the AI to handle it.
@@h4xorzistI see the "reason" why CA changed the sieges. Back in the days we were playing a 1 v 2 siege-series with the defender having about 1/3 less money than EACH of the attacker and sitting in the lowest stone wall castle. No matter the tactics used by the attacker the one defending ALWAYS won by far.
E.g. one of us even tried "swiss cheese tactic" where he just obliterated the walls, breaching every single hole and destroying every single tower before the assault. Despite all that the defender still won, using choke points and falling back to the town center to fight until death...
Sieges in earlier TW games are very imba for the defender hence why I think CA made sieges a somewhat "different" terrain battle to give the attacker a slight chance. All this flag capturing and open terrain inside the walls or the walls themselves being almost like open terrain is just them trying to solve the imbalance...
CA is just to lazy to come up with better ideas...
@@cccpredarmy Tournaments completely aside, walled cities were granting the defenders an about 10:1 advantage (if properly built). So, for the historical game this is very reasonable.
But in Warhammer it's so bad the walls are downright worse to man then to do anything else making me question why they built them and don't get me started on the downright retarded towers, literally built in a way to teach cheese to every single person playing the game.
TWWH sieges get a 1/10 in every category from all angles except fancy looks.
@@cccpredarmy It really came down to how you use your units in siege battles and what units those are. Never underestimate the usefulness of heavy cavalry and spear units during a siege battle. in medieval it was always about the lack of very damaging skirmishers that the other games had.
I did some math; out of the 3,680 kills Legend got, only 2,115 were caused from his units. That leaves 1,565 kills to be attributed to towers, The placement of those crossbows were paramount to getting this victory!
And that was just with ballista towers, would have been even higher with cannon towers and much higher in a fortress/citadel .
?I think it’s more like his units caused 3680 deaths but the total units lost by enemies was 6097 so towers actually got like 2500 kills
@@PancakefieldLegend got 3680 kills and 2481 captured soldiers, which sums to 6161 soldiers killed or captured by Legend.
Then you can add up all the soldiers the enemy lost which will equal that 6161 plus whatever died to friendly fire. That total would be 6199 total deaths. Which means the enemy's friendly fire killed 38 of their own soldiers. If you look at the detailed stats screen you will find the kills each one of Legend's units got which sums up to 2115. The difference between 3680 and 2115 is the number killed by towers since those kills are included in the total kills but not listed in the detailed screen.
Ignoring possible errors in reading the stats since those 0s 8s and 6s are hard to differentiate sometimes.
3680+2481=6161 captured and killed
1430+432+1522+1520+1295=6199 total enemy losses
6199-6161=38 friendly fire deaths
227+115+73+84+239+121+101+111+65+81+142+211+103+70+81+92+60+84+46+9=2115 kills by army units
3680-2115=1565 kills by towers
Thank you. I was looking for this stat.
Now this is Total War i fell in love with.
Hell of a battle. I'm pretty sure the general gained all that dread from that battle alone, as I don't think he was called the Merciless before you started the battle
He was called Azedine al Ifriqi (Azedine of Africa) before that battle, the dread & title was 100% gained during that battle alone.
He slaughtered five armies worth of prisoners
most merciful crusader army @@littlekuribohimposte
I like how the general was like 1 dread before the battle to almost having max dread in like one singular battle.
(Also Azedine was called "Of Africa" before not "The Merciless", that's how much dread you got)
The man who held Rome from the Romans.
50 years later:
That 1 urban militia: "When granpa was at your age, gramp stood against 100.000 infidels during battle of Rome."
The kids: "Oh c'mon gramps, not this story again. you've told us dozen times"
the silver chevron urban militia fought severe PTSD and hung himself.
This was amazing! In my head cannon I can so easily imagine the crusaders actually screwing up like this. The imperial pudding heads leaving their seige equipement undefended so it gets burnt down by a few cavalrymen and the emperor going in without support and getting ambushed by a mob, then his whole army leaving when he dies like with Barbarossa after he drowned, the milanese duke squandering a tonne of money on mercs who rout as soon as he catches a spear to the face, the venetians forgetting to bring any seige and arriving at the wrong side of the city then having to march all the way round the walls to the join the battle getting destroyed along the way, the french, having let the italians take most of the enemy arrow fire, charging through their routing italian allies, killing most of them like at agincourt with the genoese then kamakaziing into a wall of spears, almost getting a breakthrough, then running away super quickly the moment it they see 10 knights and a few crossbowmen, and the poles loafing around waiting for the germans to all die or leave before agreeing to commit their forces because of historical differences, then getting trashed because they let their allies die. And of course the English don't even bother showing up because they are too busy fighting the Scots. Any money, if the moors did make it to Rome after taking all of Spain and there was a crusade to take it back, THIS is more or less exactly how it would go down!
it does read like one of those wild ass battles. that for from reason no one talks about and 100% happened with zero embellishments , but only be on youtube as a "history be like" meme
This is exactly the kind of clown car irl antics I want to see in my total war games
like the boxer uprising: when it came time to breach the walls of Peking - the Eight-nation alliance members had their own operations to breach it
There actually was a battle like this, except it was the reverse and on sea: the Arabs were taking Rome through Ostia in 849 and were repelled by a coalition of Byzantium, Venice, the Italian duchies, and the Papal States all putting aside their disputes temporarily. We don't have numbers, but it seems the Arabs were more likely to have outnumbered them, seeing as how it was planned and the Christians didn't seem too prepared.
The Arab fleet was too spread apart, got hit by a storm, was picked off separately by the Christian fleet, the Arabs had a lot of miscommunication and some seem to have left the battle before even getting in the fight. The battle was easily won due to how seriously bad the Arabs bungled it. The battle was considered the greatest Christian resistance to a Muslim fleet up until Lepanto, which overshadowed it.
It's amazing how since Rome 2 CA has advertised you can have giant battles which rarely happened and here's Medieval 2 just casually strolling up like this.
You speak like battles like this is the norm in Medieval 2.
@@srdjan455if you play till after turn 50 you can counter these a lot
common enough for me 4v1 3v2 3v3 , of course depending on how you play you can avoid some of these . @@chris-ke2dn
Barely see anything happen tho
But even if battles like these can happen in Rome 2, you won't be able to repell an army this big. Because that warscape engine doesn't reward circumstance as much as Medieval 2 does. Of course you could do it if you had elephants and chariots. But a pure infantry and missile based army in Rome 2 wouldn't be able to do shit.
its comical how much more polished this 2006 game is compared to the modern ones
Back then there was an own profession of game tester, instead of some retard who never plays games but has the term "quality assurance" which is entirely based on KPIs.
The whole industry got overindustrialised. It's not about making a game you'd like to play yourself anymore for these people, but to make a game that is as good as necessary but as simple as possible.
It's the joke that seems to just keep giving lmao
It’s a shame how badly they screwed up sieges in WTW 3
Where is the polish?
@@srdjan455 Didn't you watch the video? On the north-western part of the map.
I gotta say, the minimap at the beginning of the battle looks pretty darn intimidating
yeah medieval 2 was the peak of siege battles in the total war series. It went downhill from there.
The concentric castles with 3 sets of walls were so badass. You could use your archers to shoot them and fall back to the second and third sets of walls and have a last stand at the keep.
"Then peaked again with Shogun 2, to then plummet downhill from then on"
@@tzardnickolasthelitromanov Fall of the Samurai's sieges were pretty good, mainly because in Vanilla Shogun 2 its not optimal to spend food levelling up your cities apart from one or two specific ones, in Fall of the Samurai the garrisons were bigger and it could make for more epic fights.
@@taloscal I loved fall of the samurai sieges! Maybe not historically accurate but really epic, the best alongside medieval 2 imo
Yep fought many a defensive battle with layers to fall back on
I think Attila has better sieges, plus the maps are way more historical and not merely copy and pasted.
Medieval 2 siege battles are a thing of beauty. Its truly a costly thing to take a city. Often needing double the strength in online matches.
Please keep doing historial Total War, it honestly great to see after so many WH content.
Total War Warhammer has literally been the fallback game for nearly every big RUclipsr in the last 7.5 years, once the early access they get for new games is past they stop promoting them and go back to Warhammer.
Bro, i have no idea how you always do this. Defending such a great city with 2 thousand warriors against like 8 thousand is craxy.
You truly are THE LEGENG no shit.
Like i am long time viewer, but it always surprises me how you can make an absolutely lost scenario not a win, but a decisive win.
I often have problems fighting 2 stacks and you're here fighting off 5 of them. Tf.
Respect Legend. Sincerely.
Edit: " Thats how usually French march. XDDDD "
Historically siege defense with 2k against 8k army is not that crazy. Example siege of Constantinople the ottomans probably got like 20 times more men against the romans
@@fernandohosea9365 i respect this answer, however i am talkin about the game itself. I am having hard time dealing with 2 stacks, Legend nonetheless deals with like 5 stacked army.
🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
@@fernandohosea9365if we are speaking in historics, then this battle should have taken place over the course of months to years rather than 1 hour
@@fernandohosea9365byzantine weren't real Roman's or they would've won
Emperor Heinricus of Holy roman empire: Men deployed 1900, men lost 1520, enemies killed 79.
Great job commanding buddy, might want to think about changing proffesion tho.
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Haven’t watched your videos for a while now. But I’m totally back for more Rome and Medieval, this was awesome, I had a great laugh as well. Thanks.
It would be great if Legend covered some of the mods for Rome Remastered as there's a lot of old ported mods and many new excellent mods for it .
Pretty cool to see the factions together like that. Interesting that in Med2 the generals go in with the units rather than sitting back like they do in Rome or Shogun 2.
This was probably the most impressive win I've seen you pull - it didn't rely on any cheese really, just good strategy and tactics. Well played.
@Freefrost I didn't make any point about which was smarter, just that it was interesting. It suits the theme of the times, at least.
@Freefrost again, I didn't say it was historical, I said it was thematic. But M2's AI is built on Rome's so it was interesting to me that they consciously made that change.
@Freefrost I can see you're immensely dense and there's little point in replying further. I was just making a bloody observation, not passing judgement. Christ.
It’s somewhat realistic. Kings almost always fought with their men in the Middle Ages.
@@TheAurelianProject don't let Freefrost hear you say that!
you might genuinely be the only person who could have won this battle. It’s insane.
I want to see a battle if LegendOfTotalWar could somehow fight himself and see what happens lol
@@mrspeakman4021it would probably be very chaotic since a lot if his tactics work by absuing the ai and wouldnt do much against a human
Not really
This is not a difficult battle
When the general dies the troops normally can’t break into the town square
Ballista towers did half the work
I’m not dissing on legend just saying this battle only looks difficult
@@sarmatiancougar7556agreed you have to good at the game to pull this off but anyone who has played serious hours on this game could pull this off
I don’t think I’ve ever heard Legend say, “I wasn’t expecting the AI to do that” in a positive sense until just the last couple weeks of Medieval 2 content.
That’s a pretty strong commentary on the drop in TW AI quality since 2006. Not that it was even particularly good then, but still…
Come on, the AI is not very good in the new titles, but it's much, MUCH better than in the older titles.
CA didn't upgrade it much (or rather, it has difficulties learning the new system), but I'll take a Warhammer Total War 3 over a Rome 1/Medieval 2 AI any day 😅
@@MrJeanlebonjambon Maybe Warhammer 2 over Medieval 2 because of fantasy and graphics, I like them both as they satisfy different itches, and maybe WH3 someday if it keeps improving--in my opinion. Have a good one.
Attila was the last competent one
@MrJeanlebonjambon The AI was much worse in Medieval 2 than in modern Total Wars. If you sally out they’ll sit still while in range of your cannon/ballista towers and get slaughtered, they charge their king headfirst into bracing spearmen, and in general just send their whole army down one street allowing you to just pick them off with ranger units. It’s not as easy to exploit the modern AI.
DEI Rome 2 is brutal, same for shogun 2
Hilarious how the french ran the furthest away out of all the routed armies lmao.
A game made by the English-speaking world. In reality, they are the ones who fought the most. The Units of Crusaders, Templars and even Hospitallers came mainly from France, since the First Crusade.
@@tibsky1396 To be fair to this 'game made by the English-speaking world', the French are no slouches in Medieval 2. They definitely have the best heavy cavalry of the Catholic nations, and their position is risky, but very rewarding if you manage to keep the fronts you're fighting on to a minimum. And it is true that all of the Knights Hospitaller are set in the files as French-speaking.
They might not quite be as versatile as the HRE and as heavily fortified as the English, but they are definitely a power to be reckoned with in Medieval 2, as well they should be: the French might be the European nation with the greatest track record when it comes to warfare, more so than the English or Germans. They just suffer from having lost their most crucial battles at moments when it mattered the most for them.
Finally a true ME2 disaster battle! Unbelievable 5 allied stacks vs 1.
Wow, a disaster campaign without a cavalerie doomstack to bail him out?
Now this is an actual challenge!
46:00 "That's very french of them" - Had me rolling :D
If this was TWWH3 the ai would siege the city for 10+ turns
WH3 AI is just a fucking coward, they just raid and run as soon as you send any kind of army their way. And yeah, getting any actually good sieges is nearly impossible. Insta attrition system is so terrible.
Which, seeing as Legend kicked their asses, might not have been a bad decision 🤣. Maybe the AI is secretly self-learning and it realised that unless it absolutely screws you over, its battle will be sent in to Legend who will win the unwinnable.
@@Bl4ckheartyou're right, attrition in reality had been culminative. First turns should be no attrition and then it ramps up
@@kharathos4121 no attrition until reaching the limit, then a brutal 50% per turn. So 100, 100, [...], 100, 50, 25, 12.5, 6.25... instead of a smooth curve
You do realise long sieges are absolutely accurate to history? They crop up a hell of a lot more than just charging in.
What a cinematic battle. A stalwart force defending their city against five different armies from five different factions. I wish we could see this kind of thing in Warhammer. Excellent performance as always, Legend. Happy to see all this historical variety on the channel lately.
This must be one of the best sydc's i have ever seen, WOW
In fact, im going to watch it again right away that was just crazy
Had no idea a battle like this was even possible in Med2, great content legend!
Hopefully that means you're fairly new to Med 2 ? it unfortunately happens to me quite regularly since 2006 🤣🤣
FPS drop so hard man,so bad
@@alexanderlow919it’s the walls breaking the new windows update for some reason makes games drop every time the wall crumbles pixelated Apollo has mentioned this before
That was an awesome siege defense! Medieval 2 siege battles are so much more satisfying than Warhammer ones.
Masterful! I love the Moors as a faction. Those Moorish crossbow militia guys actually have a pretty decent melee attack and defense rating too. The unit that got attacked on the wall held up pretty well I noticed.
We need to do a request to Legend that his next campaign has to be with the Moors.
I love that faction.
1 of the most cost effective Moorish units along with Arab Cav .
@@IceniTotalWar WoW look who is here? Hi buddy.
Hi there 🖐🖐. Oh yeah i've been following Legend for a long time, learned a lot from his videos, saving the disaster campaign/battle is always a highlight .@@hernanreipp5259
The Denmark is my favorite faction. Love the look of some of their units. And well axe units, I like axe units.
Wow! this is definitely a legendary video!!! New viewer here and I don't usually comment on old vids but this definitely deserves it.
I couldn't possibly imagine myself winning this battle. When I saw the vid the first thing to come to mind is that you'd just make a plan to take Rome back. Never have I expected that you'd actually repel those armies.
I'd experience something similar with my english and turkish campaigns against the mongols but the lack of siege equipment from them is what wins me those battles. I don't handle multiple breaches so well. :/
Great job! Vid is definitely fun to watch!
I'm loving this resurgence in historical videos
I would say it's a nice nostalgia trip but i've never stopped playing Med 2 even though i really need a break.
Dude, that was legendary. That must be a first take too because i cant see Legend losing that and choosing to try again after it taking 45 bloody minutes lol. Im in disbelief at that battle!!! Good god damn job Legend!!!
What an amazing battle. That's the kind of stuff legends are made of.
Those 4 remaining melee guys are absolute heroes. Promotions to General's Bodyguard all-round.
Legend this is so awesome that you are doing historical titles again! Im having so much fun watching these! Keep up the great work.
@LegendofTotalWar This is one of the best battles you've ever covered. Incredible video.
Legend, I really tuned in for this one. It looked massive to my standard. Probably what you’re used to though. Thanks for the content!
This was really awsome. Enjoying the historical content.
Loving the historical content!! You sound like you are enjoying it too and I am excited to see more!!
this video has been the best ive seen by far the armies, the map, the defense and hearing you struggle at points
Remember.
Fear is worse than fighting.
Lowkey true though
Lmao, that German Balista watching thousands of Allied troops stream into, and then slowly back out of Rome, whilst just sitting there having Lunch "Huh... Guess /that/ didn't go so well hey?"
like a cartoon lol
Absolute insanity. Not even that cheesy but cheese for the cheese god
First of all the French marching backwards joke was still hilarious, secondly I haven't played medieval 2 in years, think this battle has shown how impressive your game knowledge really is, even more so than most of your wh3 battles, keep up the good work Legend! 💪
And ironically, the Bulk of Crusaders, Templars and even Hospitalliers units were from Duchies and Counties in France since the First Crusade.
Great to see the Med2 content back and with battles like these *chef's kiss*
Makes a change from Warhammer.
After ending the campaign several factions i had never experienced this one. That make me restart a new faction and take the rome in early period of campaign before other factions lose the power. I think this is the way to welcome a huge crusade as you had. Wow man i had fun to watch!
Now that legend has started uploading med2 and rome I am watching again his videos. i NEVER liked Warhammer I don't think I am the only one that started watching his channel again since he started uploading historical ones
"It's easy to be brave behind a castle wall" - Welsh Proverb
Indeed it is, with LegendofTotalWar on the ramparts.
These last infantry men were like ... "there were we, 3 against the thousand" xD
Reminds me of a game where I had to defend Antioch from the Mongols. I think that was 5 stacks. I was able to set up some spikes inside the city and I think that's what saved me. Still a battle of epic proportions on the town center though.
Really great battle. Potentially the best of all time. Good to see you having fun as well!
I liked because of the France joke at the end
That reminds me of one campaign as England, where NOBODY fled from my army, because I had so high chivalry and morale stats for my general. Even after he died. Whole army of mine got wiped out. This was during a crusade, when I invaded particularily strong enemy army.
NO SINGLE UNIT FLED. This is how strong max Chivalry + Morale boost can be. Enemy got only 1 unit left at the end of the battle.
EDIT : Unit stayed in battle even after the general died btw.
You are Legend great to see you back and at your best. We who are about to watch. Salute you.
Love that the crusaders refused to support eachother for the most part. "If we let those other assholes die we will be in a better position to control the city. You know... for Christ." The immersion was palpable.
An ABSOLUTE LEGEND!!! I watched it all and still have a hard time believing Legend won. Legend IS the military genius the advisor is always saying is needed to win.
That polish army reverse marching all the way to warsaw lmao
Good content man. Here I subscribe as long as we will see some old total wars from again.
This is one of your best disaster battles! I was chewing my nails until the end!
Maybe one of your best SYDBs yet. A huge scale, epic battle with great tatics and reactions on your part and it still came down to the wire. Really fun to watch, well done Legend!
I didnt even notice it was a 48 minute Video, felt more like 15, i was this much engaged in this awesome battle.
god its insane how good you are at these games. i could do this battle 200 times and id never get close to your results lmao
The historical content is something I wish were more consistently output from your channel.
That was such a good watch! Always a pleasure to watch a master at work. I really hope to see more content like this ❤
This felt like something out of a history book, it kicked so much ass
The exhilaration of surviving such a battle.
A Comet of Casandora would look real nice in there. Top video as always
I think that’s the first time you’re playing in window mode but props to you legend. That was awesome!
I'm actually always playing medieval 2 in windowed mode but I forgot to switch my OBS settings from when I recorded the Rome Total War video. Rome 1 and Medieval 2 require different settings to record. Luckily the Medieval 2 video can run with Rome 1 settings but you'll notice the slight bottom was cut off. Not a big deal.
@@LegendofTotalWar Oh I see, that’s why you were able to see on how many you captured while we couldn’t see that at all. I immediately noticed that there was something off but like you said no big deal. Thanks for letting me know!
>Plays as Moors so as not to have to deal with the Pope
>This happens
This reminds me to a battle I did in a citadel however in Medieval 2. It was also around 2k of my forces (england) vs 8k+ of 5 armys. The battle given it's a citadel with no time limiter enabled took around 2 hours. The moment the battle was about to be won slowly my game crashed. Not sure I managed the win again but i think i didn't my second try. I was so sad but I will never forget those epic battles of medieval 2. Truly the best Total war by miles in siege battles.
Pretty much unseen to have this many factions in one battle in medieval 2
Nah, this is relatively typical for crusades in med 2.
Is it? Most of the time the Christian factions are all at war with each other so don’t help each other out in crusades
@@Bonno95 not in my experience, takes awhile for the Christian nations to truly get involved in war with one another because the pope tends to tell them
“No.”
in my experience yes and same for jihads , unless you can confuse the AI with building forts on all the river crossings you'll get swarmed often. @@carsonnesbit1178
@@Bonno95 Yes but on higher difficulties and only against the player.
32:50 from 25% to 50% balance of power in 60 seconds! :O
It really can change that fast in Rome 1 / Med 2 you can usually feel the moment it starts to turn in your favour.
Damn what a battle! One of the best disaster battlers ever. The best I have seen in M2TW for sure.
from all disaster campaigns for me this one is the best, this really felt like war
No shit that general has so much dread, he executed like half the world in that one battle 🤣
What a battle legend, one of your best imo
That defence was Legendary. Really living up to the channel name
Great battle! The old historical content is a breath of fresh air. It makes me want to fire up Medieval 2 again.
This inspired me to start a Moors campaign in medieval 2 before I even finished watching the video
They're a fun faction, Arab Cav very useful and cheap from all the towns, militia/peasant crossbows early on are very cost effective garrison troops and Jav Cav very useful for fighting the Christian Cav, urban militia good late game heavy infantry from cities. Bit weak in spears and i don't remember them having pikes or halberds .
I lost it when the french army retreated XD
" In war, numbers alone do not confers anything, do not advance relying on sheer military power " - Sun Tzu
One of your finest battles, Legend
I was in a similar situation once in this game, Jerusalem had to defend against several armies from the Timur horde
It was an extremely easy battle as the enemy never advanced and just stod there while my canon towers killed them all.
Cannon towers are so damn OP
"Sally out" (actually don't) when you have cannon towers.
@@Duke_of_LorraineActually, the canonballs are sallying out. It never says your men have to leave the castle.
@@FifinatorKlon that's not sallying out. That's giving our noble guests a large gift of super sized stress balls. Long journeys are not known for being calm especially with thousands of people.
In my experience sally out often breaks the ai. It doesn't really matter though since cannon towers will kill them no matter what they do. ballista towers are really strong as well they probably helped quite a bit here.
Great battle to watch - appreciate the content
When I read the title, the first thing going through my mind was "Wow, did the Pope really excommunicate himself?"
Gotta love that medieval 2 path finding 😭
Really like you going back to the classics. Warhammer was also fine, but there is just something about those old games that the newer ones are missing.
Great game. Another playthrough is always tempting
Truly hellish bloody battle at one of holiest cities 🔥
Holly city?
5 armies, 5 generals heads adorn legends mantlepiece.. masterfully played
Just seeing the minimap at the start gave me chills
Looked a little foreboding but our man Legend was on the job, so nothing to worry about .
That's one of the best battles I've ever seen
ive never got myself to a point of fighting a battle has big as this holy crap that was tense to watch!
Crusader armies knocking down Rome what an irony lol