I feel like people who hate fatigue never actually played Thracia lol. It's such a natural way to use a majority of your army. Also, it's a crime we never got a snow map in Fodlan
Forcing people to use most of the army isn't a bad idea in theory, but the problem with fatigue I've heard about is that as always, experience is finite. As such, not only do you have to make sure all your units are appropriately leveled, but you can't just focus on your best units; you have to use everyone and potentially risk everyone becoming underleveled. One possible solution would be to have some sort of system in which inactive units get some experience, but I'm curious as to what people think.
@@artificialaceattorney6822 I see what you mean, but I don't think even leveling was a huge deal in Thracia. For example: even tho I used a big portion of my army, I still benched some characters and was able to redistribute their potential exp to better units. Like, I never used Glade or Selfina. Also, stat caps are very low in Thracia, so leveling isn't too impactful late game. And, if your smart with using scrolls, reaching stat caps became easier. Lastly, you still get plenty of stamina potions (allowing you to use fatigued units) throughout the game. By the end of the game, I think I had some stamina potions I never even used, so the game was pretty generous and would let you use more powerful units more often if you really needed too.
Yeah, sure. Instead of actually designing maps and units to have niches to exploit in every map, make a mechanic that forces the player to rotate their army. What if the player runs out of units? Leif, I guess.
@@marcoasturias8520 I don't rly get your point lol. What if the player runs out of units in any fe game? It's the same outcome. And the maps are still well designed and characters still had their own niches. Like Tina had her own utility that would allow some maps to play out differently.
Honestly while I wasn’t a huge fan of Thracia itself, I did like engaging in the stamina mechanic a lot. I would also argue that a mixture of the rescue dropping and gauge system might be the best way of incorporating it. IE if you rescue someone they play defense gauge and so on. Battalions I’m a fan of as well but god those animations were……..something. Anyways great video as always man, love your editing style and can’t wait to watch your channel grow 👍
@@Bicken I feel as if that would make it fair. As having a guard unit essentially gives you a free block every 4 to 5 attacks regardless of damage. I think allowing you to rescue drop and keep this guarding would need to be balanced by imposing some sort of stat penalty. The only issue I feel would be that that would encourage bringing units whom are only there to give a better unit some extra defense. I feel as if there would need to be some incentive to not keep them as a guard unit, otherwise you just have an extra body there as a meat shield.
Glad to see a fates enjoyer! Horrendous story aside, i love everything else about that game. Every mechanic seems so fun and the pair up system is SO MUCH better than awakening and has brought the most fun to any fire emblem game ive played so far. I really hope that the new fire emblem game takes notes from fates gameplay or at least just tries something similar if they dont take something straight off of fates, but yeah fates is fun.
I played Fates before Awakening and the latter was almost unbearable. The amount of pointless RNG and problem causes by the pair up mechanics totally ruined the experience. I once died from criting too much
My favourite mechanic is bonus xp from fe9/10. It discourages boring/safe play in favour of more exciting/quick play. Fe9 is my favourite fe game due to this mechanic as I'm normally a heavy turtler, and I also don't like having my Jagen character taking a lot of kills. In fe9 I sent Titania sprinting down one half of the map whilst the rest of my units fought the other half because of bonus xp and I finished most of the maps really fast.
2:20 I think it'd be cool to see wind effect projectiles and flier movement. If the wind is favorable you can get an extra tile on arrows and magic. If not you just lost range and the enemies can snipe you out.
Your editing is always great. I definitely want most of these to come back or I'm at least neutral on them besides Duel Gauge (I don't really like pair ups, because half my army ends up as pair up bots) and Fatigue (It make me feel bad for using my units).
i think for fatigue it could benefit to take a mechanic from xcom where if a character loses hp in a battle they are injured, so fatigue really only affects an enemy if they participated and were hurt in the battle. if they bring back the calendar system from 3h then they could add a “rest” action for the end of the week which essentially removes the fatigue from allies, preventing softlocking, but also skipping the week edit: this would also remove the ability to just continually level up your units through mini missions until they absolutely decimate the end month battle
Top 3: Marriage system with children that grow up in a time chamber without their parents and then immediately thrown into the battlefield regardless of the game's narrative, weather changing at random during maps to reduce your units' movement speed in tedious maps, and of course BIORYTHM! Throw all these three mechanics in FE17 and I will watch the world burn >:D
I think another way that gets you to use more of your roster could be something fe10 where for some maps certain units will unavailable for story reasons. Even if a game doesn't go full multiple armies it could help make the players play with more of the cast and see if there is anybody they like that they wouldn't otherwise use.
I have been playing through the new versions of Bloom Patch (i.e. not the one on Serenes) and I actually appreciate how stamina is reworked there. Anyone can be deployed at any time. Once fatigue exceeds max HP - AS, hit, avoid and movement begin dropping at a rather rapid pace. At very high values units can't dance or staff anymore and their movement drops to 1. This makes it really hard to cheese fatigue with keeping a unit just below their max HP and going ham with them on the next map with no consequences. Also, hit and avoid are affected even when current HP drops below the fatigue value. What I don't particularly like about the hack's implementation is that staff units are the ones being screwed over the most, with higher level and personal staves adding literally 10+ fatigue per use. I understand the developer's intent of nerfing staves (in terms of uses and the fact they can't be hammerened), and staffers, but man does it feel steep, compared to pure combat units. I just wanna rewarp Sara around the map and do the funni Wrathferatu. I'll be honest and say that I kinda dislike My Castle, specifically how food and crafting works with needing to grind resources online. I'd rather be given a limited amount of crafting resources throughout the game, if the devs wanted to limit it, beyond requiring obscene amount of money. Food could just cost gold or be an alternative to tonics, like in Berwick. Speaking of Berwick, just give me a menu hub, or at least an option of managing shit entirely with menus. I have really mixed feeling on Pair Up overall. It's well implemented in Fates, but I just can't get myself to like it. Simply doesn't click with me. The defence stance is probably my least favourite aspect of the mechanic. I simply don't like how you can stick a loser as a backpack onto a combat god, effectively removing them from the battlefield and any danger, while the carrier becomes even more of a juggernaut, with attack negation at no HP loss and flat stat bonuses all at once. Maybe I'd enjoy something more akin to Super Robot Wars Support Attack and Defence. They're both skills that a unit needs to posses or learn. The former enables something akin to attack stance, while the latter allows a unit to take a hit for an adjacent ally. Both can be done a limited number of times a turn. Of course they'd need to adjusted, considering how huge ranges are in SRW, but it can be done. For example, make Support Defend a little like Berwick Guard in that the defender's defence is cut in half or something. And yeah, I understand that this cuts some fun movement options Pair Up enables, but I'd rather have Rescue back, perhaps with some change, like an infantry unit being able to jump onto horse, without needing to be rescued. Also, if we're talking about fun, gimme Rewarp back.
Wow that's alot to read. I see your point with pairup being overtuned, but in Conquest Lunatic, it never felt as if I was just juggernauting through the maps. I'm sure some builds can do so, but most people aren't looking up whats explicitly optimal. I'll definitely need to try out that hack. The way you described the fatigue makes it sound super interesting.
@@Bicken I remember even on my first Lunatic playthrough an unoptimized Dark Knight Corrin with a Gunther pair up, along with Xander oftentimes felt like jaugs in quite a few maps, but that's not the solution to every map in the game, because CQ is an overall very well designed game. I just don't like how... costless defence stance feels, when the only negative effect it often has is disabling attack stance. Removing a unit into the complete safety of another's pocket at no detriment also doesn't jive with me. It's probably more so a vibes problem I have with the mechanic. I don't mind it, but still not a huge fan. I see why it's loved by many others tho. As for Bloom Patch, I'd maybe wait a bit, because it's still actively being worked on and, while its story is roughly translated into English, the UI is still entirely in Japanese. The dev doesn't have the knowhow of implementing it, so he's waiting until the devs of Lil' Manster are able to help him with that. It's really damn ambitious in terms of sweeping changes and rebalances it makes. Branching promos for all units, completely altered weapon balance, massive changes to basically all formulas, FE4 style arenas (well, just in the fact that units don't die after defeat, it's the normal Thracia arena otherwise), new items like arms scrolls, etc. There's also entirely different recruitments and alternative sets of units, depending on which characters are captured and what chapters are skipped. Not a huge fan of all the decisions, but it's really fun overall and interesting nonetheless. It's much more challenging than vanilla Thracia, I'll say that much. Also, massive fan of making Olwen a Ballista killer (Bolting is effective against them) and making Stone a really powerful 1-2 range tome with infinite uses and stat boosts... that Sara is also capable of using to cheese the final chapter.
@@Bicken They proved that you don't need them. I like the stronger weapons having drawbacks or trade offs. I think fate's S and some A tiers weren't up to snuff but that was a minority. Also, why not meet in the middle if you have to. Give the Silver tier+ weapons like, 5/10 charges and after the drawbacks kick in. Then you have to repair (or wait until the next map) to fix them.
@@fortello7219 I've seen that proposed before (only the high tiers have durability) and I think that would be an excellent compromise. I typically only use iron weapons anyways since I suck at managing inventory, so it'd be huge for someone like me
@@Bicken I would prefer some higher tier weapons have little to no drawback. Not as good as a silver sword or a +2 iron. But close with a quirky effect. Good to give to a select few units since they're hard to grind or limited in drops.
Getting to use boss units like the unique portrait Oni Chieftan is soooo fun. You basically get to use something you can't get anywhere else, increasing replay value even further
What I wish were brought back were rescue strats, thiefs utility (increased fog of war visibility and stealing non droppable loot) and other gba stuff *No. 10 is rescue strats* ....alright, I'll hear you out
There are neat things to steal in Three Houses. The game just does such a poor time advertising this that if you're not going out of your way to look for it, then you won't even notice. Also, I feel like the number of times its applicable plummets after timeskip (I think there's one map on a certain route that I've noticed one?), so it's more for early Evasion Rings and a Magic Ring, which isn't a bad payoff, but just... less than it could have been.
These are some controversial picks....I love them! Honestly, one mechanic I would love for them to bring back (even though it was universally hated by everyone but myself hahaha) was how we got to separate our armies into separate groups for a few chapters at the beginning of part 4 in radiant dawn. Maybe let the player know what type of terrain/battles are gonna be in certain paths so it is not universally hated again hahaha but I thought this was super cool imo. Great vid btw!
Stamina is great man, I absolutely agree that some old mechanics need to come back, the only thing you didn't mention that I'd want to see are movement growths, because they're super funny, and have caused some of the hypes moments in all of fe for me.
I’m not done watching this video yet so I will likely end up editing this comment; but as someone who did *not* start this series out with Fates (I still love the game though, no worries there), I *really don’t* want MyCastle back. I found it to be pretty awful, at the end of the day. Yes, Garreg Mach Monastery is too big in a way (in a weird way though, because I always want to explore the places you can’t go to and I always distract myself running around, trying to find a new vantage angle to look at buildings from, that I haven’t seen before); but I think that the Camp from Fire Emblem Warriors Three Hopes was a good in-between! Maybe they could make whatever the next location is a bit more esthetically pleasing than the Camp, but functionality-wise it was good! A mechanic that *really needs* to return though, is the “train one class, while using another” that Three Hopes introduced! Damn, that made things so smooth! (This is assuming that any unit can develop any skill in the next mainline game, like in Three Houses. If not, I’m sure the training-class thing would be redundant.) [EDIT: Okay yeah, I disagree with most of the rest of the list, sorry haha! The buddy-mechanic felt like it endorsed super-niche pairings over anything else, and that just isn’t fun if you want to explore Supports, IMO.]
I was waiting the whole video to write a comment about how we need Force dismounting indoors and fatigue back but nope, you covered fatigue. Thanks for that, but we still need dismounting indoors and the stat debuffs that come with it to make it all the better.
No mention of ledges from RD surprises me. A mechanic that instantly increases the depth of maps by allowing even the weak units of the Dawn Brigade to hold from high ground needs to come back.
I like the ledges in RD but I would be fine with never seeing them again. I'm not sure what new you could do with them. Plus they disable combat animations
I personally never had a problem with the size of the monastery in Three Houses, especially since you can fast travel anywhere in the monastery. The size of the monastery is somewhat believable for a place like Garreg Mach, and I enjoyed being able to go around and talk with all the units between missions. Then again, I will concede that having Three Hopes get a base camp worked well for that game.
Gonna second what I believe Bicken implied: it's fine, fun even, on your first or second playthrough. By your fifth or so? It's an absolute drag. To add my personal take that it exacerbates the games already long list of issues into making it painful to play for me, and several people I know, which is a shame because I love FE and want to love 3H, but don't/can't and monastery is a core part of the reason why.
@@Bicken In all fairness, I've played it for even longer and I didn't mind. The only part where the between-mission time got repetitive was on my Maddening NG+ playthrough of Azure Moon, in which most of my characters maxed out their stats and don't have much room for growth(Lysithea got up to S+ Reason, faith and authority without using Renown to increase skills).
@@miahmagick I will agree that the monastery can definitely become a drag, but I feel like the game was designed to allow you to skip the monastery phase if you wanted to and instead do the aux battles and seminars. I'll agree that pre timeskip there's a lot of moments where they force you to do the monastery phase, but other than that you can just skip it and do some other useful stuff instead.
@@mtk77621 "This game is so good, you can skip the majority of it to make it not bad!" ... does that sound like a good game? Literally every other FE I've played I've never had to actively play worse and avoid game mechanics to have fun. This isn't a "but ackshually" for Three Houses. It's further proof it's the worst title in the series.
One thing I wish they had done with battalions is letting them get upgraded/level much further, like being able to make the Remire Militia eventually relevant to endgame? What about Jeralt's Mercenaries? The narrative implications would have been so intriguing!
I wish we could get some combination of the Tellius base mechanic and the fates/3H mini games that came with exploration. Let most things be done through menuing and then let the player do optional shit like gardening, lottery shop, hot spring, arena ect. Also let the arena be fe 4 style so they can gain xp.
@@Bicken If I was in charge I'd have an arena for every map but you can only have one unit go through it. I like the limited grinding element. I think there should be a cost to enter as well.
raged at the fates enjoying comment, felt blessed at the thracia comment, truly a balanced approach. nah fr lmao, there's def some changes I want to see that 3h kinda already addressed, ie revamping fates skill system. also please talk more about how fatigue is good actually. everytime I play thracia I end up using every single unit I recruit, and I feel no other fe comes even close to that level of flexibility
Fatigue only works when you know the next two or three maps ahead of time. Playing blind, you could just waste your flier before a desert or underutilize them anticipating a map that doesn't exist. It just feels bad. Could work tho if the story goes to lengths to hint the conditions of future maps, which would also make the game feel more like a war. Like there's a campaign
I'd say fatigue arguably works better when you don't know the future maps because it makes the player plan ahead for multiple possibilities. I like it when the games poke and prod at your plans, and throw in wrenches that make you adapt
I agree with all additions, but I would add two more, leadership stars and the crit coefficient thing from Thracia, the leadership stars because they really make certain units more compelling to use, especially for me, since I have the bad habit of avoiding prepromotes like the plague, but if you gave them a couple of stars, I might reconsider, and the crit thing because I find it funny, not much else.
I kinda see FCC and Fates Attack Stance as serving the same function, lowering the bar of entry for what a "good" combat unit is while also keeping individual battles very short and attacker favored.
Okay first off we'll edited video, and I agree with most of the stuff on the list. And the fatigue take is based. I'm always on the edge of the scale about what I want. Which is the genealogy skill system to be back, with some added skills of course. Things like pursuit are why I'm on the fence about it, but it also makes each character feel unique and can give different builds to each character. Idk it's something I find really cool, and would love to see revisited in a more balanced and thought out cast.
I think Pursuit gets a bad wrap. It does what it was meant to do, which is empower specific characters that are meant to be fast in the world of the game. The only difference from the normal speed system is you can't grind or RNG your way out of it.
@@Bicken true, though it leaves certain characters feeling awkward requiring a brave weapon for compensation. Like I said I'm on ice about it. Alec (imo) is not very good even with pursuit being in his base kit. I'd just like to see how it's executed, and hopefully give us an armored bow knight. That last part is just my dream though
Stamina is actually alot cooler than I think most people give it credit for, I'm always all for anything that incentives me to experiment with new units or use my whole army instead of playing it safe. Id love to see bonus EXP from Tellius come back too
I actually think they should implement something that forces you to interact with your whole army. The only FE where that's possible is FE4, FE5 & FE10. If that's stamina's job, then so be it.
while it was in 3h i think that canto after attacking should stay.ik i sound biased as an fe4 fan but it really does allow for a ton of interesting movement options similar to rescue.definitely one of those simple mechanics with a lot of depth.and yk what maybe the fe4 style canto that allowed you to change your weapon isnt so bad espescially since you can basically already do it in game so this would just make it more convenient
The problem with fatigue, and capturing, is that the game has to be built around them. If you can capture enemies, there can't be weak enemies with good equipment, like FE6 soldiers with Killer Lances. And with fatigue, they have to adjust the enemy difficulty to expect that you may not have trained units on your team (which also lends itself to permadeath-based game design, but that's kind of out-of-fashion nowadays). Far from impossible, but it does take consideration to be done properly.
you have to design around any mechanic. Awakening is pretty emblematic of what happens if you just stick a mechanic like dual gauge in without any consideration for how it should affect enemy placement.
@@Bicken Fair enough. Though, I feel like having every mechanic on this list would be very difficult to design around, more so than I think IS is capable of handling. Three Houses has so many mechanics, I feel like they gave up on map and enemy design for the most part. That game was extremely over-ambitious to begin with though.
I've enjoyed the last two games in the series. They're not my favorites, but I enjoyed them. One thing I'd like to see for the next mainline game is not having separate routes. I feel like having separate routes has caused some... heated discussions among the fanbase based on the routes and route specific characters that I would just like to not have to deal with for awhile. Maybe instead of having four different routes of middling lengths, as Three Houses had, maybe we could just have a much longer campaign.
Yes on a singular well-made route. No on more length. I'd rather they have good systems to encourage replaying through a well-paced and solid length game than it turning replays into slogs through a game of considerable length that ends up being longer than it needs to be.
Ngl I do kinda enjoy experimenting with child units, being able to just make monsters, or do really weird stuff, like me attempting to build magic caeldori for some reason. Shoehorning the mechanic does inherently involve timey wimey nonsense, so honestly, I would like a 2nd generation division. Really IS just give me a genealogy remake with modern supports, explorable castles and maybe broken up maps.
I would play the older game but I guess Awakening kinda scared me since they gave me Casual mode, I never liked seeing my units die even if I played pretty well. I played Shadow Dragon and I believe lost only 2 or 3 units during the whole game, though losing any of them still sucked. Also make Generals be Lances and Bows again, that'd be sick to have back.
Some good games for getting adjusted to perma death are Echoes on classic mode, since it has revival fountains, FE4 with the revival staff, and Sacred Stones, which allows you to make your units essentially unkillable. Adjusting to classic takes some doing, but it makes the games waaay better in the long run imo.
@@rockowlgamer631 Then I'll echo his sentiment to play Echoes (heh). I think it handles conversations and story better than Awakening (as someone with an Awakening tattoo), though one character's actions can be seen as really stupid (though I argue it's in character for them, as they're a devout follower of a faith that basically goes "Humans? We can't do shit. Praise the goddess and the goddess shall provide."). Still the production values of the game, the OST, and the art direction? I'd be very surprised if you don't like it.
@@miahmagick Other then Celica's questionable actions the story was pretty good as well as Berkut, I do feel sorry for his love interest though since she basically gets sacrificed and becomes a wisp for him. If only she had said her encouragement carefully she could've kept him from going mad
Stamina would be cool, but the biggest upside (making you use all the units in your army) probably just isn't that appealing to most FE fans who just want to use their waifus / husbandos, especially if customizing / building up your favorite units is a major gameplay element in a theoretical new game
@@Bicken It’s that thing from the Tellius games where a unit’s hit rate and avoid fluctuates up and down in a set wave-shaped pattern (except with generic enemy units where it’s a randomly chosen wave pattern) I thought it added a unique element to battles
I would prefer stamina to be a toggle. I am perfectly capable of choosing to use different characters on my own and it annoys me when a game tells me i can't use the character i want.
If a Fire Emblem clone that crosses the line boldly into an M rating and never looks back ever comes about, I'll be more than down for those sorts of features. As long as we get what we're getting though, I'd just rather not. Fates didn't have near the controversy Xenoblade Chronicles 2 had in this regard, for example, but I know IRL people who found people blowing on their 3DS's mic (which is just a hole on the console...) to blow on their anime waifu/husbando, or all the rubbing stuff strange. Now, I know "who cares what they think?", but I like having people like things I like, so when systems like that have some people I know giving the games side-eye for no tangible benefit (in or out of game, imo, though if you disagree that's fine)... it's just not worth it. That said, you wanna take that Number 0 and pair it with a game that can fully appreciate the limits of those mechanics? There's an unserved market niche there, and there's a lot less of "people going to object to a thing due to things that aren't integral to the core experience" within that context. Feel free to get the spray bottle.
I have mixed feelings about bringing stamina back, mostly because I play like a three year old and love training an army of juggernauts who obliterate everything in their path, so I think keeping stamina drinks would be better I feel it would need some sort of incentive to not use them, though. Maybe there's a limited number per chapter and you can only use them for that chapter, either to increase stamina or to idk buy cool hats, or crafting materials. Renown if we keep that a thing? Or maybe you can hoard them as much as you want and can exchange them for a weapon or item in like the second to last chapter. Something like that Broadly I'm not sure if I agree that all of these mechanics should be brought back, especially not all in a single game, but I would like to see most of them again, they're interesting and add some nice spice to life, and I can see why you chose these ones specifically
The way they work in Thracia is that they're available in one shop fairly early in the game, and I don't think you can get any after that point. I think putting a hard cap on them would be for the best. Plus if you were looking to arena abuse units to make them overpowered, you can just alternate which juggernauts you used per map.
But I liked the monastery... ._. Well, to get a bit more into it, I feel the monastery wouldn't have worked in any other FE, and it works in 3 Houses, at least before the timeskip. After that, yeah, it is a bit weird, but hey, I managed to do Protection of Garreg Mach chapter of Azure Moon, on Maddening, and after that, I spent 3 hours fishing to unwind, so I might be *slightly* biased, but in general, I like the downtime Monastery provides
I've heard that from friends as well. My problem isn't that it gives the option of downtime, its that it forces the downtime. When I play these games I generally like to do 1 or 2 maps in a sitting, and being forced to use the entire time I have allotted for the game for the day on something that's not even the main game feels really bad.
Oh no, I totally get that part. Due to my dumbass decision of doing a Maddening run as my first time, I am forced to take it really carefully, since I refuse to let anyone die, so my pace is really slow, so I definitely can understand the argument for the forced downtime. It wasn't bad in the Academy time, but something else should have been put in place of it, in the post timeskip, in my opinion
As much as like the list, isn't Fates's capture and Thracia's capture kind of redundant/incompatible on the same list? I know they're not identical and I read the description, just seemed weird. If Thracia style fatigue came back, I hope it gets reworked a little, because I found it was a minor inconvenience at worst, even without Stamina drinks.
I mean if fatigue were more intrusive, I probably wouldn't like it as much. I just like having a system to encourage players to use more of their army than just their top five favorites all the time.
I think the idea and objective of stamina is great. But the implementación sucks, I think the main problem is that De doesn't have any system that allow for bad units to catch Up without allowing Grinding that can be use by everyone. Also, they need to get better at balancing individual unit and avoid things like Ashe in 3H has literally nothing unique to him. So, make everyone someone you want to actually use.
Ok, so let me explain what I thought about stamina: Q:Why would stamina be a thing? A: Because battle fatigue is a real thing. Counter argument: Okay, but most battles in recent FE games happen weeks apart. It could be an interesting thing to have come up sometimes, when battles supposedly happen one after another. There's no reasonable explanation otherwise (Taking video game logic into account, ofc) Also, I played Fates, my first FE was 7. I Disagree with everything you said. Awakening was better than Fates in every way. Up to and including the fact it wasn't 3 thirds of a game sold for different prices.
I like Radiant Dawn, but I think Fatigue is a bit more of an elegant way of doing it. Quite frankly I don't know how you don't feel it. Maybe i overcompensate for it whenever I play
I don't know if I agree with your stamina take, even though I see your intention and understand it. What I want is the Fates reclass system. I hate Three Houses for how every physical unit is going through Fighter, Brigand, and Archer, and how every magical unit is going through Monk and Mage (and probably Archer too), and yeah you diversify after, but it's into Wyvern, Pegasus, Sniper, Punchboy, Caster, preferred Swift Strikes delivery system, or meme. It doesn't sound that bad, but when you're playing an all of your units are Fighters and Monks, Brigands and Mages, and so on, taking the worst part of the game (early footlock boring hell) and exacerbating it further... Meanwhile other titles suffer from different problems (that are less bad, to be fair!): you wanna use Neimi? Archer, Sniper; Ranger: choose one. I don't hate this, but compare this to Fates: Nyx, okay at base she's a Nosferatu unit, so with proper play she can EP with tonics and pair-ups to support her, despire her accuracy and bulk issues, she starts close to promotion, so can early promote for those sweet Dark Knight short-term solutions to her problems, and even has Adventurer for the premier backpack for Leos everywhere. Then you consider her marriage to Niles, screwing both in exchange for Diviner Nina, which is interesting, or marrying Odin for another Vantage/LoD Sorcerer, which is interesting, or having the madness to invest Corrin into her for Diviner, or Dragon, or getting out there and giving her Silas because Elbow Room is still STACK, Defender is still STACK, Shelter makes her have more utility, and I could go on. - and that's ONE UNIT in a game with a massive roster. Even if you don't bring back children, the amount of replay value this reclassing system gives is just way more than almost anything the rest of the series has to offer, and is why I'm still playing Fates to this day.
My main gripe with the reclassing in Fates is that it just feels so out of the way to do it. Usually I'm going on my own strategies without any online assistance, so I'll end up making a weird build on like one, maybe two characters per playthrough. Meanwhile in three houses, everyone can get a wacky build every playthrough because they're all the same level of investment. I think the series is going in the direction of making units more customizable, and Fates is a good model, but I think there's a ton of room for improvement there.
@@Bicken If you wanna IMPROVE Fates reclassing, I'm with you. If we get another Three Houses-style system, I may no longer just auto-preorder special editions of FE titles anymore, and have to wait and see if the new title is for me before purchasing. I genuinely find 3H to be a miserable gameplay experience, and such a huge departure when Fates was peak FE (for me). That said, when you point out how the depth of the reclassing system might be lost on a lot of players due to its implementation, I would definitely be down to see them improve it so it's a more natural part of gameplay, and less something you have to have a college degree in Fates to appreciate.
I kind of want to talk about two points, mostly because I just want to get my thoughts out. I mostly agree with the list. With the monastery, the biggest issue is honestly that it is too time consuming for how shallow it is. There are like six things to do, and before long most people tend to just jump to eating seven lunches, some training, and maybe a teatime here or there. Persona has this more fleshed out and so it works better there, as while it is not as stressful as typical combat, it is part of the standard gameplay loop, whereas the monastery interrupts that loop for Three Houses. It is an interruption that the player can't avoid rather than a core part of gameplay. And with Stamina, I think given the nature of the series as it become more focused on customization, I believe the stamina system should probably be associated with a change of how skills work. One option would to simply be to take the skill system of the Tellius games and use them. Alternatively, they could have it tied to equipment, such as armor or accessories, and allow for customization that way as well. If they do go with that option, I hope they take an idea from Xenoblade 1 and have the outfits change based on what armor the character is wearing. I just think that would be neat.
The problem with trying to make fire emblem more like persona is that persona is completely built around the real world sections. The combat is super dumbed down when compared to SMT and that's because if it outshines the overworld, alot of players will start to get frustrated with those sections. Fire emblem can't really pull that off without stripping away a ton of core gameplay mechanics. If they did go down the persona route and did that, I wouldn't be opposed but I think those sections being in a mainline game is inevitably going to ostracize certain players no matter what you do with it.
@@Bicken Which is a good reason why I wish there were FE spinoffs. Wanna keep doing child mechanics, but doesn't make sense in your mainline narrative? Spinoff where inheritance matters. Wanna keep doing husbandos/waifus, but doesn't make sense in your mainline narrative? Spinoff with heavier dating elements. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed Pokemon Conquest (not really an FE spinoff, but play it and you'll see why I put it here) and TMS#FE, but a problem the series has now is there are very different fans who love the series for different reasons, and instead of just abandoning things every time a new console comes out, if they'd just go, "Okay, people who spend more time in inheritance-planner.herokuapp.com/ than actually playing Fates, this is for you.", "Okay, people who just wanna pair husbandos and waifus to make the ultimate OTP chart, have at it." - and so on. Alternatively, it's why I hate that there are so few FE clones. FE keeps introducing things that could easily define whole franchises of games, and then just abandons them with no one stealing those ideas, and it's maddening. That said, yeah no. I don't want PersonaxFE in a way different than TMS#FE. My Castle from Fates is how you do out-of-combat for an FE title right. Anything beyond that, especially to the point of the monastery, is a great way to top Three Houses as the worst FE game in the franchise as far as my personal rating goes.
I feel like people who hate fatigue never actually played Thracia lol. It's such a natural way to use a majority of your army. Also, it's a crime we never got a snow map in Fodlan
Forcing people to use most of the army isn't a bad idea in theory, but the problem with fatigue I've heard about is that as always, experience is finite. As such, not only do you have to make sure all your units are appropriately leveled, but you can't just focus on your best units; you have to use everyone and potentially risk everyone becoming underleveled.
One possible solution would be to have some sort of system in which inactive units get some experience, but I'm curious as to what people think.
@@artificialaceattorney6822 I see what you mean, but I don't think even leveling was a huge deal in Thracia. For example: even tho I used a big portion of my army, I still benched some characters and was able to redistribute their potential exp to better units. Like, I never used Glade or Selfina. Also, stat caps are very low in Thracia, so leveling isn't too impactful late game. And, if your smart with using scrolls, reaching stat caps became easier. Lastly, you still get plenty of stamina potions (allowing you to use fatigued units) throughout the game. By the end of the game, I think I had some stamina potions I never even used, so the game was pretty generous and would let you use more powerful units more often if you really needed too.
Yeah, sure. Instead of actually designing maps and units to have niches to exploit in every map, make a mechanic that forces the player to rotate their army. What if the player runs out of units? Leif, I guess.
@@marcoasturias8520 I don't rly get your point lol. What if the player runs out of units in any fe game? It's the same outcome. And the maps are still well designed and characters still had their own niches. Like Tina had her own utility that would allow some maps to play out differently.
I like mechanics where the enemy gets to take advantage of it as well, it makes it feel more like a fair fight.
Honestly while I wasn’t a huge fan of Thracia itself, I did like engaging in the stamina mechanic a lot. I would also argue that a mixture of the rescue dropping and gauge system might be the best way of incorporating it. IE if you rescue someone they play defense gauge and so on. Battalions I’m a fan of as well but god those animations were……..something. Anyways great video as always man, love your editing style and can’t wait to watch your channel grow 👍
That's an interesting idea. Were you thiniing they'd still get the speed/skill penalty?
@@Bicken I feel as if that would make it fair. As having a guard unit essentially gives you a free block every 4 to 5 attacks regardless of damage. I think allowing you to rescue drop and keep this guarding would need to be balanced by imposing some sort of stat penalty. The only issue I feel would be that that would encourage bringing units whom are only there to give a better unit some extra defense. I feel as if there would need to be some incentive to not keep them as a guard unit, otherwise you just have an extra body there as a meat shield.
@@jordanfranklin-garza849 I mean, there are gonna be weak units in any game. I don't see whats wrong with giving them an extra bit of utility
Funny that they mostly took notes for the story of fates
Glad to see a fates enjoyer! Horrendous story aside, i love everything else about that game. Every mechanic seems so fun and the pair up system is SO MUCH better than awakening and has brought the most fun to any fire emblem game ive played so far. I really hope that the new fire emblem game takes notes from fates gameplay or at least just tries something similar if they dont take something straight off of fates, but yeah fates is fun.
Did he play Conquest?
@@pn2294 idk
@@splatoongoon968 never liked Conquest. Preferred Birthright.
@@pn2294 I've played all three routes, but conquest is far and above my favorite
I played Fates before Awakening and the latter was almost unbearable. The amount of pointless RNG and problem causes by the pair up mechanics totally ruined the experience.
I once died from criting too much
My favourite mechanic is bonus xp from fe9/10. It discourages boring/safe play in favour of more exciting/quick play. Fe9 is my favourite fe game due to this mechanic as I'm normally a heavy turtler, and I also don't like having my Jagen character taking a lot of kills. In fe9 I sent Titania sprinting down one half of the map whilst the rest of my units fought the other half because of bonus xp and I finished most of the maps really fast.
Bonus XP was very close to making my list.
2:20
I think it'd be cool to see wind effect projectiles and flier movement. If the wind is favorable you can get an extra tile on arrows and magic. If not you just lost range and the enemies can snipe you out.
Your editing is always great. I definitely want most of these to come back or I'm at least neutral on them besides Duel Gauge (I don't really like pair ups, because half my army ends up as pair up bots) and Fatigue (It make me feel bad for using my units).
i think for fatigue it could benefit to take a mechanic from xcom where if a character loses hp in a battle they are injured, so fatigue really only affects an enemy if they participated and were hurt in the battle. if they bring back the calendar system from 3h then they could add a “rest” action for the end of the week which essentially removes the fatigue from allies, preventing softlocking, but also skipping the week
edit: this would also remove the ability to just continually level up your units through mini missions until they absolutely decimate the end month battle
I mean the calander system has its own problem, but making stamina recovery be a tradeoff for other benefits isn't a bad idea
Top 3: Marriage system with children that grow up in a time chamber without their parents and then immediately thrown into the battlefield regardless of the game's narrative, weather changing at random during maps to reduce your units' movement speed in tedious maps, and of course BIORYTHM!
Throw all these three mechanics in FE17 and I will watch the world burn >:D
Great vid! Really felt the personality with this one, and I’m looking forward to more!
Thank you fellow Thracia enjoyer for this list. Fatigue is a great mechanic and it also plays so well with the capture system.
Great list!!!
I think another way that gets you to use more of your roster could be something fe10 where for some maps certain units will unavailable for story reasons. Even if a game doesn't go full multiple armies it could help make the players play with more of the cast and see if there is anybody they like that they wouldn't otherwise use.
I have been playing through the new versions of Bloom Patch (i.e. not the one on Serenes) and I actually appreciate how stamina is reworked there. Anyone can be deployed at any time. Once fatigue exceeds max HP - AS, hit, avoid and movement begin dropping at a rather rapid pace. At very high values units can't dance or staff anymore and their movement drops to 1. This makes it really hard to cheese fatigue with keeping a unit just below their max HP and going ham with them on the next map with no consequences. Also, hit and avoid are affected even when current HP drops below the fatigue value.
What I don't particularly like about the hack's implementation is that staff units are the ones being screwed over the most, with higher level and personal staves adding literally 10+ fatigue per use. I understand the developer's intent of nerfing staves (in terms of uses and the fact they can't be hammerened), and staffers, but man does it feel steep, compared to pure combat units. I just wanna rewarp Sara around the map and do the funni Wrathferatu.
I'll be honest and say that I kinda dislike My Castle, specifically how food and crafting works with needing to grind resources online. I'd rather be given a limited amount of crafting resources throughout the game, if the devs wanted to limit it, beyond requiring obscene amount of money. Food could just cost gold or be an alternative to tonics, like in Berwick. Speaking of Berwick, just give me a menu hub, or at least an option of managing shit entirely with menus.
I have really mixed feeling on Pair Up overall. It's well implemented in Fates, but I just can't get myself to like it. Simply doesn't click with me. The defence stance is probably my least favourite aspect of the mechanic. I simply don't like how you can stick a loser as a backpack onto a combat god, effectively removing them from the battlefield and any danger, while the carrier becomes even more of a juggernaut, with attack negation at no HP loss and flat stat bonuses all at once. Maybe I'd enjoy something more akin to Super Robot Wars Support Attack and Defence. They're both skills that a unit needs to posses or learn. The former enables something akin to attack stance, while the latter allows a unit to take a hit for an adjacent ally. Both can be done a limited number of times a turn. Of course they'd need to adjusted, considering how huge ranges are in SRW, but it can be done. For example, make Support Defend a little like Berwick Guard in that the defender's defence is cut in half or something.
And yeah, I understand that this cuts some fun movement options Pair Up enables, but I'd rather have Rescue back, perhaps with some change, like an infantry unit being able to jump onto horse, without needing to be rescued. Also, if we're talking about fun, gimme Rewarp back.
Wow that's alot to read. I see your point with pairup being overtuned, but in Conquest Lunatic, it never felt as if I was just juggernauting through the maps. I'm sure some builds can do so, but most people aren't looking up whats explicitly optimal.
I'll definitely need to try out that hack. The way you described the fatigue makes it sound super interesting.
@@Bicken I remember even on my first Lunatic playthrough an unoptimized Dark Knight Corrin with a Gunther pair up, along with Xander oftentimes felt like jaugs in quite a few maps, but that's not the solution to every map in the game, because CQ is an overall very well designed game.
I just don't like how... costless defence stance feels, when the only negative effect it often has is disabling attack stance. Removing a unit into the complete safety of another's pocket at no detriment also doesn't jive with me. It's probably more so a vibes problem I have with the mechanic. I don't mind it, but still not a huge fan. I see why it's loved by many others tho.
As for Bloom Patch, I'd maybe wait a bit, because it's still actively being worked on and, while its story is roughly translated into English, the UI is still entirely in Japanese. The dev doesn't have the knowhow of implementing it, so he's waiting until the devs of Lil' Manster are able to help him with that.
It's really damn ambitious in terms of sweeping changes and rebalances it makes. Branching promos for all units, completely altered weapon balance, massive changes to basically all formulas, FE4 style arenas (well, just in the fact that units don't die after defeat, it's the normal Thracia arena otherwise), new items like arms scrolls, etc. There's also entirely different recruitments and alternative sets of units, depending on which characters are captured and what chapters are skipped. Not a huge fan of all the decisions, but it's really fun overall and interesting nonetheless. It's much more challenging than vanilla Thracia, I'll say that much.
Also, massive fan of making Olwen a Ballista killer (Bolting is effective against them) and making Stone a really powerful 1-2 range tome with infinite uses and stat boosts... that Sara is also capable of using to cheese the final chapter.
@@Bicken Just as a heads up, the Bloom (Blume) Patch now has English UI. If you want to to try it out, it's available on FEUniverse.
I'm glad to see other people really love the fatigue mechanic as much as I do.
You may not know how to start or end a video, but you certainly know how to make good content.
Love the dual gauge.
Also would like Fates unbreakable weapons and hidden weapons to return. Chrunchier that way
Hate durability. I get why it exists, but it has ALWAYS been my least favorite aspect of these games
@@Bicken They proved that you don't need them. I like the stronger weapons having drawbacks or trade offs. I think fate's S and some A tiers weren't up to snuff but that was a minority.
Also, why not meet in the middle if you have to. Give the Silver tier+ weapons like, 5/10 charges and after the drawbacks kick in. Then you have to repair (or wait until the next map) to fix them.
@@fortello7219 I've seen that proposed before (only the high tiers have durability) and I think that would be an excellent compromise. I typically only use iron weapons anyways since I suck at managing inventory, so it'd be huge for someone like me
@@Bicken I would prefer some higher tier weapons have little to no drawback. Not as good as a silver sword or a +2 iron. But close with a quirky effect. Good to give to a select few units since they're hard to grind or limited in drops.
Getting to use boss units like the unique portrait Oni Chieftan is soooo fun. You basically get to use something you can't get anywhere else, increasing replay value even further
What I wish were brought back were rescue strats, thiefs utility (increased fog of war visibility and stealing non droppable loot) and other gba stuff
*No. 10 is rescue strats*
....alright, I'll hear you out
lmao. The only reason I dont want the theif fog of war thing back is because I dont want fog of war back
@@Bicken ironic, considering fog of war itself didn't go anywhere, but the utility thieves brought sure did
There are neat things to steal in Three Houses. The game just does such a poor time advertising this that if you're not going out of your way to look for it, then you won't even notice. Also, I feel like the number of times its applicable plummets after timeskip (I think there's one map on a certain route that I've noticed one?), so it's more for early Evasion Rings and a Magic Ring, which isn't a bad payoff, but just... less than it could have been.
Bruh i agree with all of these,is it normal?also the editing is masterful
I doubt it
@@Bicken you forgot to add that they have to make a better oc
@@an_intruder5677 Greg Emblem 17
@@Bicken 1000 times better than the toothpaste oc
Fates Pair Up enjoyer detected, opinion respected
These are some controversial picks....I love them! Honestly, one mechanic I would love for them to bring back (even though it was universally hated by everyone but myself hahaha) was how we got to separate our armies into separate groups for a few chapters at the beginning of part 4 in radiant dawn. Maybe let the player know what type of terrain/battles are gonna be in certain paths so it is not universally hated again hahaha but I thought this was super cool imo. Great vid btw!
Stamina is great man, I absolutely agree that some old mechanics need to come back, the only thing you didn't mention that I'd want to see are movement growths, because they're super funny, and have caused some of the hypes moments in all of fe for me.
I’m not done watching this video yet so I will likely end up editing this comment; but as someone who did *not* start this series out with Fates (I still love the game though, no worries there), I *really don’t* want MyCastle back. I found it to be pretty awful, at the end of the day.
Yes, Garreg Mach Monastery is too big in a way (in a weird way though, because I always want to explore the places you can’t go to and I always distract myself running around, trying to find a new vantage angle to look at buildings from, that I haven’t seen before); but I think that the Camp from Fire Emblem Warriors Three Hopes was a good in-between!
Maybe they could make whatever the next location is a bit more esthetically pleasing than the Camp, but functionality-wise it was good!
A mechanic that *really needs* to return though, is the “train one class, while using another” that Three Hopes introduced! Damn, that made things so smooth!
(This is assuming that any unit can develop any skill in the next mainline game, like in Three Houses. If not, I’m sure the training-class thing would be redundant.)
[EDIT: Okay yeah, I disagree with most of the rest of the list, sorry haha! The buddy-mechanic felt like it endorsed super-niche pairings over anything else, and that just isn’t fun if you want to explore Supports, IMO.]
I was waiting the whole video to write a comment about how we need Force dismounting indoors and fatigue back but nope, you covered fatigue.
Thanks for that, but we still need dismounting indoors and the stat debuffs that come with it to make it all the better.
'Tank' is a perfect way to start a video
No mention of ledges from RD surprises me. A mechanic that instantly increases the depth of maps by allowing even the weak units of the Dawn Brigade to hold from high ground needs to come back.
I like the ledges in RD but I would be fine with never seeing them again. I'm not sure what new you could do with them. Plus they disable combat animations
I personally never had a problem with the size of the monastery in Three Houses, especially since you can fast travel anywhere in the monastery. The size of the monastery is somewhat believable for a place like Garreg Mach, and I enjoyed being able to go around and talk with all the units between missions.
Then again, I will concede that having Three Hopes get a base camp worked well for that game.
it probably doesnt help that i have like 200 hours in three houses
Gonna second what I believe Bicken implied: it's fine, fun even, on your first or second playthrough. By your fifth or so? It's an absolute drag.
To add my personal take that it exacerbates the games already long list of issues into making it painful to play for me, and several people I know, which is a shame because I love FE and want to love 3H, but don't/can't and monastery is a core part of the reason why.
@@Bicken In all fairness, I've played it for even longer and I didn't mind. The only part where the between-mission time got repetitive was on my Maddening NG+ playthrough of Azure Moon, in which most of my characters maxed out their stats and don't have much room for growth(Lysithea got up to S+ Reason, faith and authority without using Renown to increase skills).
@@miahmagick I will agree that the monastery can definitely become a drag, but I feel like the game was designed to allow you to skip the monastery phase if you wanted to and instead do the aux battles and seminars. I'll agree that pre timeskip there's a lot of moments where they force you to do the monastery phase, but other than that you can just skip it and do some other useful stuff instead.
@@mtk77621 "This game is so good, you can skip the majority of it to make it not bad!" ... does that sound like a good game? Literally every other FE I've played I've never had to actively play worse and avoid game mechanics to have fun. This isn't a "but ackshually" for Three Houses. It's further proof it's the worst title in the series.
One thing I wish they had done with battalions is letting them get upgraded/level much further, like being able to make the Remire Militia eventually relevant to endgame? What about Jeralt's Mercenaries? The narrative implications would have been so intriguing!
Yeah. That would've been really cool
I wish we could get some combination of the Tellius base mechanic and the fates/3H mini games that came with exploration. Let most things be done through menuing and then let the player do optional shit like gardening, lottery shop, hot spring, arena ect. Also let the arena be fe 4 style so they can gain xp.
I don't like the fe4 arenas, but other than that, that's actually a great idea
@@Bicken
If I was in charge I'd have an arena for every map but you can only have one unit go through it. I like the limited grinding element. I think there should be a cost to enter as well.
You can't convince me that stamina is good because I already know it's good.
Jokes aside love your editing hope ya pop off in the FE community.
raged at the fates enjoying comment, felt blessed at the thracia comment, truly a balanced approach. nah fr lmao, there's def some changes I want to see that 3h kinda already addressed, ie revamping fates skill system. also please talk more about how fatigue is good actually. everytime I play thracia I end up using every single unit I recruit, and I feel no other fe comes even close to that level of flexibility
Fatigue only works when you know the next two or three maps ahead of time. Playing blind, you could just waste your flier before a desert or underutilize them anticipating a map that doesn't exist. It just feels bad. Could work tho if the story goes to lengths to hint the conditions of future maps, which would also make the game feel more like a war. Like there's a campaign
I'd say fatigue arguably works better when you don't know the future maps because it makes the player plan ahead for multiple possibilities. I like it when the games poke and prod at your plans, and throw in wrenches that make you adapt
I agree with all additions, but I would add two more, leadership stars and the crit coefficient thing from Thracia, the leadership stars because they really make certain units more compelling to use, especially for me, since I have the bad habit of avoiding prepromotes like the plague, but if you gave them a couple of stars, I might reconsider, and the crit thing because I find it funny, not much else.
I forgot about leadership stars, but yeah that's cool. The crit coefficient thing is so broken tho
I kinda see FCC and Fates Attack Stance as serving the same function, lowering the bar of entry for what a "good" combat unit is while also keeping individual battles very short and attacker favored.
Okay first off we'll edited video, and I agree with most of the stuff on the list. And the fatigue take is based.
I'm always on the edge of the scale about what I want. Which is the genealogy skill system to be back, with some added skills of course. Things like pursuit are why I'm on the fence about it, but it also makes each character feel unique and can give different builds to each character. Idk it's something I find really cool, and would love to see revisited in a more balanced and thought out cast.
I think Pursuit gets a bad wrap. It does what it was meant to do, which is empower specific characters that are meant to be fast in the world of the game. The only difference from the normal speed system is you can't grind or RNG your way out of it.
@@Bicken true, though it leaves certain characters feeling awkward requiring a brave weapon for compensation. Like I said I'm on ice about it. Alec (imo) is not very good even with pursuit being in his base kit. I'd just like to see how it's executed, and hopefully give us an armored bow knight. That last part is just my dream though
Stamina is actually alot cooler than I think most people give it credit for, I'm always all for anything that incentives me to experiment with new units or use my whole army instead of playing it safe. Id love to see bonus EXP from Tellius come back too
BEXP is nice. After seeing a bunch of comments on it I kinda wish I had put it on the list
perfect intro
I actually think they should implement something that forces you to interact with your whole army. The only FE where that's possible is FE4, FE5 & FE10. If that's stamina's job, then so be it.
SoV as well. The double army thing was cool
@@Bicken True! SoV did the split army thing better too. How did I forget about that?
2:56 made me choke on my cereal
i absolutely love fatigue but i am a thracia fangirl so
while it was in 3h i think that canto after attacking should stay.ik i sound biased as an fe4 fan but it really does allow for a ton of interesting movement options similar to rescue.definitely one of those simple mechanics with a lot of depth.and yk what maybe the fe4 style canto that allowed you to change your weapon isnt so bad espescially since you can basically already do it in game so this would just make it more convenient
I think Fe4 only lets you do it because it doesn't have trading options
@@Bicken huh ig but regardless i would like to see it.maybe not let you use items like vulneraries and stat boosters tho
The problem with fatigue, and capturing, is that the game has to be built around them. If you can capture enemies, there can't be weak enemies with good equipment, like FE6 soldiers with Killer Lances. And with fatigue, they have to adjust the enemy difficulty to expect that you may not have trained units on your team (which also lends itself to permadeath-based game design, but that's kind of out-of-fashion nowadays).
Far from impossible, but it does take consideration to be done properly.
you have to design around any mechanic. Awakening is pretty emblematic of what happens if you just stick a mechanic like dual gauge in without any consideration for how it should affect enemy placement.
@@Bicken Fair enough. Though, I feel like having every mechanic on this list would be very difficult to design around, more so than I think IS is capable of handling. Three Houses has so many mechanics, I feel like they gave up on map and enemy design for the most part. That game was extremely over-ambitious to begin with though.
I've enjoyed the last two games in the series. They're not my favorites, but I enjoyed them. One thing I'd like to see for the next mainline game is not having separate routes. I feel like having separate routes has caused some... heated discussions among the fanbase based on the routes and route specific characters that I would just like to not have to deal with for awhile. Maybe instead of having four different routes of middling lengths, as Three Houses had, maybe we could just have a much longer campaign.
Yeah. I would prefer if the series stepped away from route splits, but who knows
Yes on a singular well-made route. No on more length. I'd rather they have good systems to encourage replaying through a well-paced and solid length game than it turning replays into slogs through a game of considerable length that ends up being longer than it needs to be.
>capture
Lloyd and Linus deserve their revenge
Also for me i'ld want more ridiculous animations like the gba games again, so goofy but i love it
Ngl I do kinda enjoy experimenting with child units, being able to just make monsters, or do really weird stuff, like me attempting to build magic caeldori for some reason. Shoehorning the mechanic does inherently involve timey wimey nonsense, so honestly, I would like a 2nd generation division. Really IS just give me a genealogy remake with modern supports, explorable castles and maybe broken up maps.
It'll be any day now. Please IS
Fatigue is bad... in SoV, of course.
Didn't really touch the exploration in SoV so i never really interacted with it's fatigue mechanic
I would play the older game but I guess Awakening kinda scared me since they gave me Casual mode, I never liked seeing my units die even if I played pretty well. I played Shadow Dragon and I believe lost only 2 or 3 units during the whole game, though losing any of them still sucked.
Also make Generals be Lances and Bows again, that'd be sick to have back.
Some good games for getting adjusted to perma death are Echoes on classic mode, since it has revival fountains, FE4 with the revival staff, and Sacred Stones, which allows you to make your units essentially unkillable. Adjusting to classic takes some doing, but it makes the games waaay better in the long run imo.
@@Bicken also due to Awakening I'm more for the conversations and story then the game play
@@rockowlgamer631 Then I'll echo his sentiment to play Echoes (heh). I think it handles conversations and story better than Awakening (as someone with an Awakening tattoo), though one character's actions can be seen as really stupid (though I argue it's in character for them, as they're a devout follower of a faith that basically goes "Humans? We can't do shit. Praise the goddess and the goddess shall provide."). Still the production values of the game, the OST, and the art direction? I'd be very surprised if you don't like it.
@@miahmagick Other then Celica's questionable actions the story was pretty good as well as Berkut, I do feel sorry for his love interest though since she basically gets sacrificed and becomes a wisp for him. If only she had said her encouragement carefully she could've kept him from going mad
Stamina would be cool, but the biggest upside (making you use all the units in your army) probably just isn't that appealing to most FE fans who just want to use their waifus / husbandos, especially if customizing / building up your favorite units is a major gameplay element in a theoretical new game
Yeah, but I can dream
I’d be fine with them bringing Biorhythm back, as long as they made some big balance changes
Biorhythm?
@@Bicken It’s that thing from the Tellius games where a unit’s hit rate and avoid fluctuates up and down in a set wave-shaped pattern (except with generic enemy units where it’s a randomly chosen wave pattern)
I thought it added a unique element to battles
@@CGFillertext ah i know what you're talking about now. I always wondered what the little radiowave looking thing on the character screen was
I would prefer stamina to be a toggle. I am perfectly capable of choosing to use different characters on my own and it annoys me when a game tells me i can't use the character i want.
I miss BDG... everywhere i go, I hear his voice
Number 0 : pet your boyfriend/girlfriend
That was Fates best feature. Hands down.
don't make me get the spray bottle
If a Fire Emblem clone that crosses the line boldly into an M rating and never looks back ever comes about, I'll be more than down for those sorts of features. As long as we get what we're getting though, I'd just rather not. Fates didn't have near the controversy Xenoblade Chronicles 2 had in this regard, for example, but I know IRL people who found people blowing on their 3DS's mic (which is just a hole on the console...) to blow on their anime waifu/husbando, or all the rubbing stuff strange. Now, I know "who cares what they think?", but I like having people like things I like, so when systems like that have some people I know giving the games side-eye for no tangible benefit (in or out of game, imo, though if you disagree that's fine)... it's just not worth it.
That said, you wanna take that Number 0 and pair it with a game that can fully appreciate the limits of those mechanics? There's an unserved market niche there, and there's a lot less of "people going to object to a thing due to things that aren't integral to the core experience" within that context.
Feel free to get the spray bottle.
I have mixed feelings about bringing stamina back, mostly because I play like a three year old and love training an army of juggernauts who obliterate everything in their path, so I think keeping stamina drinks would be better
I feel it would need some sort of incentive to not use them, though. Maybe there's a limited number per chapter and you can only use them for that chapter, either to increase stamina or to idk buy cool hats, or crafting materials. Renown if we keep that a thing? Or maybe you can hoard them as much as you want and can exchange them for a weapon or item in like the second to last chapter. Something like that
Broadly I'm not sure if I agree that all of these mechanics should be brought back, especially not all in a single game, but I would like to see most of them again, they're interesting and add some nice spice to life, and I can see why you chose these ones specifically
The way they work in Thracia is that they're available in one shop fairly early in the game, and I don't think you can get any after that point. I think putting a hard cap on them would be for the best. Plus if you were looking to arena abuse units to make them overpowered, you can just alternate which juggernauts you used per map.
But I liked the monastery... ._.
Well, to get a bit more into it, I feel the monastery wouldn't have worked in any other FE, and it works in 3 Houses, at least before the timeskip. After that, yeah, it is a bit weird, but hey, I managed to do Protection of Garreg Mach chapter of Azure Moon, on Maddening, and after that, I spent 3 hours fishing to unwind, so I might be *slightly* biased, but in general, I like the downtime Monastery provides
I've heard that from friends as well. My problem isn't that it gives the option of downtime, its that it forces the downtime. When I play these games I generally like to do 1 or 2 maps in a sitting, and being forced to use the entire time I have allotted for the game for the day on something that's not even the main game feels really bad.
Oh no, I totally get that part. Due to my dumbass decision of doing a Maddening run as my first time, I am forced to take it really carefully, since I refuse to let anyone die, so my pace is really slow, so I definitely can understand the argument for the forced downtime. It wasn't bad in the Academy time, but something else should have been put in place of it, in the post timeskip, in my opinion
Also, my first FE, was actually Awakening, so I definitely know the feeling of being biased XD
Definitely inheritance. It is fun making your perfect child soldie... Er I mean units through inbreed... Sry pairing up.
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As much as like the list, isn't Fates's capture and Thracia's capture kind of redundant/incompatible on the same list? I know they're not identical and I read the description, just seemed weird.
If Thracia style fatigue came back, I hope it gets reworked a little, because I found it was a minor inconvenience at worst, even without Stamina drinks.
I mean if fatigue were more intrusive, I probably wouldn't like it as much. I just like having a system to encourage players to use more of their army than just their top five favorites all the time.
I think the idea and objective of stamina is great. But the implementación sucks, I think the main problem is that De doesn't have any system that allow for bad units to catch Up without allowing Grinding that can be use by everyone.
Also, they need to get better at balancing individual unit and avoid things like Ashe in 3H has literally nothing unique to him. So, make everyone someone you want to actually use.
Ok, so let me explain what I thought about stamina:
Q:Why would stamina be a thing? A: Because battle fatigue is a real thing.
Counter argument: Okay, but most battles in recent FE games happen weeks apart. It could be an interesting thing to have come up sometimes, when battles supposedly happen one after another. There's no reasonable explanation otherwise (Taking video game logic into account, ofc)
Also, I played Fates, my first FE was 7.
I Disagree with everything you said. Awakening was better than Fates in every way. Up to and including the fact it wasn't 3 thirds of a game sold for different prices.
Stamina is something I don't really notice when playing. I feel like if you want to get the most of your units Radiant Dawn has the best approach.
Yeah gimme the separate armies approach. It made the game feel gigantic too and really helped shape the narrative. Great mechanic
I like Radiant Dawn, but I think Fatigue is a bit more of an elegant way of doing it. Quite frankly I don't know how you don't feel it. Maybe i overcompensate for it whenever I play
@@Bicken I lead the Frontlines with Leif, and mix up my army anyways because of how caps work in that game.
I don't know if I agree with your stamina take, even though I see your intention and understand it.
What I want is the Fates reclass system. I hate Three Houses for how every physical unit is going through Fighter, Brigand, and Archer, and how every magical unit is going through Monk and Mage (and probably Archer too), and yeah you diversify after, but it's into Wyvern, Pegasus, Sniper, Punchboy, Caster, preferred Swift Strikes delivery system, or meme. It doesn't sound that bad, but when you're playing an all of your units are Fighters and Monks, Brigands and Mages, and so on, taking the worst part of the game (early footlock boring hell) and exacerbating it further...
Meanwhile other titles suffer from different problems (that are less bad, to be fair!): you wanna use Neimi? Archer, Sniper; Ranger: choose one. I don't hate this, but compare this to Fates: Nyx, okay at base she's a Nosferatu unit, so with proper play she can EP with tonics and pair-ups to support her, despire her accuracy and bulk issues, she starts close to promotion, so can early promote for those sweet Dark Knight short-term solutions to her problems, and even has Adventurer for the premier backpack for Leos everywhere. Then you consider her marriage to Niles, screwing both in exchange for Diviner Nina, which is interesting, or marrying Odin for another Vantage/LoD Sorcerer, which is interesting, or having the madness to invest Corrin into her for Diviner, or Dragon, or getting out there and giving her Silas because Elbow Room is still STACK, Defender is still STACK, Shelter makes her have more utility, and I could go on. - and that's ONE UNIT in a game with a massive roster. Even if you don't bring back children, the amount of replay value this reclassing system gives is just way more than almost anything the rest of the series has to offer, and is why I'm still playing Fates to this day.
My main gripe with the reclassing in Fates is that it just feels so out of the way to do it. Usually I'm going on my own strategies without any online assistance, so I'll end up making a weird build on like one, maybe two characters per playthrough.
Meanwhile in three houses, everyone can get a wacky build every playthrough because they're all the same level of investment. I think the series is going in the direction of making units more customizable, and Fates is a good model, but I think there's a ton of room for improvement there.
@@Bicken If you wanna IMPROVE Fates reclassing, I'm with you. If we get another Three Houses-style system, I may no longer just auto-preorder special editions of FE titles anymore, and have to wait and see if the new title is for me before purchasing. I genuinely find 3H to be a miserable gameplay experience, and such a huge departure when Fates was peak FE (for me).
That said, when you point out how the depth of the reclassing system might be lost on a lot of players due to its implementation, I would definitely be down to see them improve it so it's a more natural part of gameplay, and less something you have to have a college degree in Fates to appreciate.
I kind of want to talk about two points, mostly because I just want to get my thoughts out. I mostly agree with the list.
With the monastery, the biggest issue is honestly that it is too time consuming for how shallow it is. There are like six things to do, and before long most people tend to just jump to eating seven lunches, some training, and maybe a teatime here or there. Persona has this more fleshed out and so it works better there, as while it is not as stressful as typical combat, it is part of the standard gameplay loop, whereas the monastery interrupts that loop for Three Houses. It is an interruption that the player can't avoid rather than a core part of gameplay.
And with Stamina, I think given the nature of the series as it become more focused on customization, I believe the stamina system should probably be associated with a change of how skills work. One option would to simply be to take the skill system of the Tellius games and use them. Alternatively, they could have it tied to equipment, such as armor or accessories, and allow for customization that way as well. If they do go with that option, I hope they take an idea from Xenoblade 1 and have the outfits change based on what armor the character is wearing. I just think that would be neat.
The problem with trying to make fire emblem more like persona is that persona is completely built around the real world sections. The combat is super dumbed down when compared to SMT and that's because if it outshines the overworld, alot of players will start to get frustrated with those sections.
Fire emblem can't really pull that off without stripping away a ton of core gameplay mechanics. If they did go down the persona route and did that, I wouldn't be opposed but I think those sections being in a mainline game is inevitably going to ostracize certain players no matter what you do with it.
@@Bicken Which is a good reason why I wish there were FE spinoffs. Wanna keep doing child mechanics, but doesn't make sense in your mainline narrative? Spinoff where inheritance matters. Wanna keep doing husbandos/waifus, but doesn't make sense in your mainline narrative? Spinoff with heavier dating elements. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed Pokemon Conquest (not really an FE spinoff, but play it and you'll see why I put it here) and TMS#FE, but a problem the series has now is there are very different fans who love the series for different reasons, and instead of just abandoning things every time a new console comes out, if they'd just go, "Okay, people who spend more time in inheritance-planner.herokuapp.com/ than actually playing Fates, this is for you.", "Okay, people who just wanna pair husbandos and waifus to make the ultimate OTP chart, have at it." - and so on.
Alternatively, it's why I hate that there are so few FE clones. FE keeps introducing things that could easily define whole franchises of games, and then just abandons them with no one stealing those ideas, and it's maddening.
That said, yeah no. I don't want PersonaxFE in a way different than TMS#FE. My Castle from Fates is how you do out-of-combat for an FE title right. Anything beyond that, especially to the point of the monastery, is a great way to top Three Houses as the worst FE game in the franchise as far as my personal rating goes.
What no bonus exp
If you like Fates so much, why don't you marry her?
Transformation units should definently come back. Gimmick or not it was a cool motif present in most of the series