Also why run Palafin in regs where Urshifu is banned, when you can use Basculegion as your water type, you don't need to switch your Basculegion, and since Basculegion is also a Ghost-type it is immune to fake out assuming you don't tera it into a pure water type. Compared to Urshifu and Basculegion, Palafin suffers from a too high opportunity cost IMO, since you need to switch it out and back in to get the full benefits of Zero to Hero and by the time you get Palafin back in you might be down 1 pokemon.
@@ZAPRST8879They did technically nerf single strike urshifu by reducing wicked blow to 75 power whereas it was 80 power previously. I don’t think they did this for balance purposes though, I think they just wanted it to have the same effective base power as surging strikes.
@@noahtaylor1721 heck give it a better Flying move, Hurricane specifically, so that way it has a high damage second STAB that the rest of the forms have. Though I'd just give Rotom adaptability across the board or something like that
Oh like Rotom-H give it Drought, Rotom-W give it Drizzle, Rotom-F give it Adaptability, Rotom-M give it Grassy Terrain, Rotom-Fr give it Snow Warning and Rotom base give it Electric Terrain.
i really dont get why Return and Frustration where removed in gen 8, it had no business to get axed cause of how good they are, and now the options for physical normal moves is really limited
@bulborb8756 right? Like if the point was the power, then why are any of the 100+ moves still in the game? Like I get it, no one really used frustration and return was spammed on everything from Lopunny and Steelix to Snorlax and Klinklang, but damn man they really should've been replaced with a new move for Normal STAB at this point. Heck even Hidden Power got reworked for Unknown in PLA for it to always be Super Effective regardless of typing
There is no way we aren't talking about Zacian. He was the second most picked pokemon after incineroar at 2022 worlds. Now he is not even top 8 in all the restricted pokemon.
I was expecting Zacian on the list too. I keep hearing about how awesome it is, then suddenly it gets nerfed, and isn't so broken anymore. I think it was a nerf to attack stats, and its ability only triggering the first time it enters battle, instead of every time it switches in. That and now that dynamaxing isn't a thing, the added damage to giants doesn't matter.
Pretty much. Granted, Zacian is still a very good Pokémon, but to go from what was considered to be the single best Pokémon in the entire game during Gen 8 to being pretty whatever in Gen 9 is an insane drop off. Meanwhile, her brother, Zamazenta, is having the time of his life in Gen 9, lmao
Honestly, I feel like it just deserves an "honorable mention" shoutout. It still has some potential, and was used more than Regieleki and Palafin (AFAIK). Still very, very notable, as it is (again, AFAIK) the sharpest, fastest viability drop in VGC history.
My top-of-head list was Tauros, Mewtwo, Snorlax, and Persian. Although, Persian might just be for Pokemon Stadium rentals. I don't remember how good it was in Gen 1.
@@solitare4602Gen 1 Persian was basically Tauros, but worse. But it turns out that Tauros is so good that having a second one, even a worse second one, ain't half bad.
@@kamelo2219 Exeggutor was more viable Psychic type due to better moveset and superior bulk. Alakazam can be one of the fastest Pokémon with one of the highest attacking stats and the best type in the game, but when two of the Big 4 are the most busted special walls in the metagame, the third resists all your attacks, and the fourth just annihilates you with ease, AND you get crippled to the ground with Paralysis, you just aren't as viable as you want to be. You ain't fit for the top if you can't throw hands with the top.
Scizor is kinda a sleeper pick in this category. We had a meta with flutter mane, a physically weak fast fairy type that could sweep teams if positioned correctly, getting like 50+% usage. The perfect environment for bullet punch scizor to go off. And... it just didn't. It couldn't get it done anymore. Despite everything seeming to go its way. We had tera to cover its quad weakness, we had amulet to stop intim drops, we had pelly being stronger then ever as a great partner, etc etc. Didn't matter. Scizor just isn't it anymore.
One thing missing from the regieleki segment: its one remaining niche, electro web speed control, was also power crept because speed booster Fluttermane is faster and has icy wind.
tbh i don't understand why game freak doesn't do patches, there's nothing stopping them from doing maybe minor adjustments for the really unbalanced stuff on a yearly basis or whenever a major content update like dlc happens, except that they probably don't really care enough about balance to warrant it
If they get rid of Water Spout from the whale then he definitely can go on the list, but he'd have to be dominating for such a hit to happen. Which means good ol' reliable rain boosted, stab boosted, Water Spouting Kyogre will remain untouched.
@@ButterSpreeuntil they give Water Spout to another high HP/SpAtk legendary with some ability that summons rain and gives it a Specs Boost to its SpAtk. Like imagine 120 HP 176 SpAtk + a Miraidon ability for rain, it's horrific
if you're wondering, the singles equivalent of biggest fall off... is snorlax, from top 3 in gen 1 (bar mew and mewtwo), to undisputed top 1 in gen 2, all the way to untiered in gen 9, poor snorlax
@@variumi “I woke up this morning to find my Landorus Therian that was carrying my team through the Elite Four now takes hits like a wet noodle I’d like my money back”
@@bulborb8756 Maybe Game Freak thought it would be too good or something, which I'm not even sure it would. Yes, it would be better, but It wouldn't be too broken.
Yeah way back when, i understand that it getting slack off would have been too strong despite how thematically fitting it is. but yeah now it should get it
It is interesting how there are three main reasons a Pokemon falls off The first two being direct nerfs and general power creep is understandable but the third being “there’s a Pokemon that is just a direct upgrade” feels somewhat unique to competitive Pokemon Rotom getting a buff to it’s bulk would be nice Snorlax getting a normal type version of Hammer Arm, Crabhammer, or even High Horsepower would definitely help with a possible speed drop being a benefit in trick room
They do adjust everyone to be better when there's a new character coming so at least it makes it manageable in GGST. If one character is busted, let's make other characters busted too. GF on the other hand barely touches old pokemons and let new ones wreck the meta game.
Excellent video as always good sir! As for Singles - off the top of my head - Tauros being only second to Mewtwo is RBY to being downright abysmal in GSC due to the Special Split is the most cataclysmic fall off I can think of.
Man's picked Strive where the developers said upon release "We made the character broken on purpose for plot reasons, we will properly balance him on the next patch"
The singles Equavilant would 100% include Pokemon like Tyranitar due to Gen 9, Tauros after Gen 1, Snorlax (again) with Gen 8 and 9, Mew after Gen 4, Deoxys Defense with Gen 9, and could make another case with Exeggutor
Snorlax really is the saddest one. Going from one of the big normal types in Gen I alongside Chansey and Tauros, than Tier King in Gen II with Curselax, and even a reliable, if occasionally niche, high damage tank that especially gave special attackers a bad time with a strong 110 base Sp. Def, to one of the most unusable Pokemon in the game with every normal type in the higher tiers outdoing it and the relevance of brutal ghost, fighting and steel types severely limiting its power.
Snorlax's falloff is even worse, in Nintendo Cup 2000 (Nintendo Cup being the predecessor to VGC in *that it was official,* and apparently aired on TV in Japan), much like in GSC OU and Ubers, *it was the strongest Pokémon of all-time* back then. GSC Snorlax was an unholy beast that you NEEDED to have if you wanted to win in GSC. So while it was crazy in Gen7 VGC, it's fall from grace is even worse than you make it out to be. This excerpt from the GSC Ubers page on Snorlax should give you an idea of how busted the guy was *"Snorlax's sole presence warps the entire metagame around it, forcing teams to pack not only one but multiple answers for it...",* remember that this is in the same tier as f**king Mewtwo and Mew. I'll close this with the Smogon description of GSC Snorlax for OU. Pretty much everything here applies to the Nintendo Cup format which was 3v3 with Species and Item Clause was well as what would later be Restricted and Mythicals being banned. "Behold, the single most dominant Pokemon in any OU tier in history. Snorlax combines power and resilience with deadly unpredictability, a set of traits that lands it a spot on virtually all serious teams. *Its presence defines the GSC metagame,* all but forcing teams to play one or more sturdy Normal-resistant Pokemon while simultaneously killing off the viability of manifold special attackers with its enormous HP and sky-high Special Defense. Snorlax is a constant threat to offensive teams as a Curse sweeper, a team sweeping machine as a Belly Drum user, a relentless battering ram as a mixed attacker, and a reliable wall as a RestTalk user. However, it isn't completely unstoppable. Snorlax's Defense stat is on the low side, meaning that despite its massive HP stat, Explosion from common OU Pokemon like Cloyster and Exeggutor is enough to take it out with minimal prior damage. It will usually be forced to use Rest if it gets poisoned, giving the opposing team a reprieve that they can use to gain an advantage. Defensive teams will nearly always have Skarmory for Snorlax and usually pair it with a semi-reliable counter to mixed Snorlax as well, which can sometimes leave Snorlax unable to do any meaningful damage by itself. However, make no mistake: these constitute but minor flaws among Snorlax's array of overwhelmingly powerful attributes."
The pinch berries weren't introduced in gen VII, they were just massively buffed to the point where they might as well have been new items. From gen III-VI they only gave a measly 12.5% when at/below 50% HP
Imagine either Regional Variant Rotom, or a Rotom Evolution that permanently locks the appliance in, but gives a stat boost and a Terrain/ Weather Effect as an ability
The largest single gen dropoff in singles is probably tauros gen 1->2 where it went from being the best mon in OU to unviable. This was mostly due to mechanics changes like the hyperbeam nerf and the splitting of the special stat. Over time it might be snorlax. It went from being the best mon in ubers in gen 2, to decent in ou in gen 3, to bad in gen 5 and now its running around in zu.
I know he mentioned it got banned in singles but im surprised he didn’t mention how in singles Regieleki’s jump from gen 8 to gen 9 was the opposite of its VGC experience as it went from not being viable in OU to being almost instant banned to Ubers. Why? Terastalization and coverage. Went from pretty much having no coverage outside of its electric attacks to having the best offensive combination of ice and electric if it terastalizes to ice.
I like the point that Archaladon is such a good counter to palafin it just one shots it to oblivion with electro shot in the rain. Archaladon benefits a lot from urshifus absence and it is a case that even lower powered formats could not save the dolphin. In regulation h Archaladon is one of the greatest Pokémon in competitive history. One of the things I liked about urshifus different forms was that they effectively shut it down because without rain both urshifus out speeds it and every move always crits so it does not matter how many times it’s defenses get buffed. But without urshifu Archaladon runs rampant in tournaments as a result because now you have to respect its stamina ability or in the global challange always assume that it has stamina cause you don’t want to be wrong about a Pokémon’s ability on closed teamsheet.
What each Rotom form got a unique ability? Rotom-Heat with Flash Fire/Well Baked Body/White Smoke, Rotom-Wash with Hydration/Storm Drain, Rotom-Frost with Refridgerate, Rotom-Fan with Wind Power/Wind Rider, and Rotom-Mow with Motor Drive/Seed Sower/Contrary/Sharpness/Harvest
For singles, I would highlight Keldeo. That thing used to be so scary with Hydro Pump in the rain. In fact. Keldeo is usually one of the key mons brought up for why defense isn’t very strong in Gen 5 OU, trying to play a slow game against Keldeo is stupid. It is arguably defines rain as a playstyle more than politoed, the pokemon setting the rain. Move to Gen 6 and literally nothing good happened to Keldeo. Rain was limited, fairies got introduced and a similarly powerful pokemon that could do its job, manaphy, got unbanned. It still hung on to OU but went from being THE threat to more niche. Then Gen 7 happened and everything went to hell. If Keldeo got slowed by Clefable, the tapus and Magearna getting added to that eas just a cruel and unusual punishment. Not to mention, Toxapex. The defining defensive Pokemon that basically half of all viable teams wanted to use was outright impervious to Keldeo. And of course, we now have the second gen in a row where a banned Pokemon who competed with Keldeo got unbanned. Pelipper made Rain meta again in Gen 7 and you somehow never see Keldeo because Greninja and Manaphy outclass it ridiculously hard as special sweeper, punishing offensive and defensive teams respectively. Keldeo went from the main villain to sideshow really quickly.
My favorite Regieleki era was during the qualifiers for the Player's Cup 4 where all the Japanese players were using Scarf Regieleki. I used Scarf Eleki for the rest of the season
This gen has had a lot of big falloff’s in singles. Toxapex is a notable one since it lost access to scald and knock off which makes it way more passive and it can become setup fodder.
Arguably the biggest fall off is Thunderous, due to prankster in gen 5 being STUPIDLY busted as well as a lot of status nerfs coming in gen 6, gen 5 thunderous would just dominate the field as a support mon with taunt, thunderwave and basically any other status move it could run, but now thanks to the ridiculous nerfs that its toolkit took, it's the least used of the 4 genies by a wide margin
Mew is the poster child for singles meta falloff. Uber tiered for the first four generations of the game, only to go all the way into Underused. Between gens 5-8, it fluctuated between OU and UU, and then Gen 9 came around and dragged it all the way to NUBL. In a similar vein, Deoxys-Defense was Uber for 7 straight generations, got dexited and then returned in generation 9 as another NUBL mon
For singles theres a couple of fall offs this gen, salamence, Magnezone, tyranitar, deoxys defense, toxapex, terrakion, staraptor and list could go on for long
Till this day, I still wonder why Rain and Sunlight gets to keep 50% boost still to water and fire type moves, respectively, after all this time. While most environmental sets (Terrains) and Transistor gets nerfed from 50% to 30%.
i think a funny (if kinda sad) contender for Singles would be Deoxys-Defense. it's been a slow one for sure, but that guy was the second best Deoxys in ADV and was slowly falling off in Ubers up until it got canned from Galar, and now in Gen 9 it's like RUBL or something also Snorlax from Gens 1-3 to now but you mentioned that one
Another prime example I would give is Thunderus. It was the most nerfed mon in history. As of gen 9 Thunderus is considered a niche pick by many players
Biggest singles fall-off of all time has to be Weavile in BDSP. It lost its 2 best STABs in Triple Axel and Knock Off, plus its best coverage in Low Kick. Not to mention that the first year of Scarlet and Violet was rough for it with the addition of Chien-Pao as a direct upgrade to it
Pokémon is that type of game where you have to constantly change your teams and the Pokémon on them to stay relevant and that’s what makes competitive Pokémon interesting. Nothing lasts forever as this list shows.
My favorite Pokemon of all time is Mow Rotom, but the one I have the most experience in using is Crobat. I remember the days when we could outspeed everything… now we’ve got stealth bomber salamanders and bouncy neurons hogging all the limelight. Then again, it’s hard to outspeed anything when you’re not even in the ‘Dex. Couldn’t outspeed the cuts :,)
I’m surprised Zacian wasn’t mentioned here. It was an absolute monster back when Dynamax was a thing, but the nerfs it got coming into Gen 9 absolutely spiral Zacian down to irrelevancy.
Politoed, Kingdra and Ludicolo would have probably been a trio I'd throw on here. Latios also tanked a ton over the years, especially considering it was nowhere near the same level of dominance it was in Gen V Oh and Thundurus
Tornadus-Incarnate is in ZUBL now. Staraptor is in NU after 4 straight gens of UUBL placements. Suicun is NUBL. Heatran is UU after 5 gens of OU dominance.
-Garchomp dropped to UU(BL) -Tyranitar dropped to UU and even RU at some point -Gengar, Salamence, Azelf, Hippowdon, Terrakion, and Slowbro are all RU now -Togekiss and Scolipede also dropped further down to RU(BL), last time they were available -The likes of Gyarados, Mew, Espeon, Swampert, Breloom, Infernape, Lucario, Reuniclus (at some point) all being NU(BL) -Kingdra in ZUBL
@@goGothitaLOL man, Infernape in NU breaks my heart the most. One of the best movepools of all time shackled by an ability that wants to use weak moves and offensive stats that just don't cut it anymore, even in RU.
sure the low speed is one thing but Snorlax has good bulk to make up for it, the problem is his consistent lack of recovery, why he STILL cannot learn slack off is just stupid when it makes perfect sense for him to learn it unlike infernape
Regieleki, along with every electric type, for some reason lost access to the TM Rising Voltage. Eliminating my favorite set. Except for Raging Bolt for some reason
The most extreme falloff in singles would probably be Tauros, but gen 1 is essentially a different game, don't think it's fair to count it. Speed boost Blaziken is a big one, ubers for multiple gens but is now UU I think; Deoxys speed and/or defense (can't remember which fully fell off) were also Ubers for many gens but are now UU or below. Weavile at the beginning of gen 9 went from being one of the best mons in gen 8 OU to being ok in like RU; lost its most important moves and was fully outclassed by chien pao in every way, luckily got its moves back and chien pao was banned, so I think it's solid now. I'm sure there are plenty more, but those are ones I could think of
Singles: Talonflame - do I need to say it? Gengar - do I also need to say it? + Dragapult existing the gen after Greninja - isn’t it obvious? and also Ash-Greninja: the form is gone Metagross (non-mega) - what Ghost and Dark being neutral to Steel does to a motherfucker, the buffed Knock Off and more broken ghost-types also didn’t help matters Breloom - Power Creep, fairy-types like Tapus and Iron Valiant, 70 Spe and none-existent bulk being more and more of a eyesore over the years, and if all that isn’t enough the Gen 9 OU sleep ban (thanks Darkrai and Iron Valiant) Blaziken - 3 words: Heavy-Duty Boots, 4 more words: Hidden Power is gone. Not even the additions of Close Combat and U-Turn can offset the drop-off from fucking Uber to UU(BL). And I didn’t even mentioned Uber power creep by gen 8. Garchomp - Landorus-T and fairy-types are one thing, but lots of competition is another. Between Roaring Moon and Baxcalibur (pre-ban) from dragon side, Great Tusk, Ursaluna, and Ting-Lu from the ground side, and Iron Valiant (and pre-ban Flutter Mane + Iron Bundle) outspeeding it. Garchomp can’t take it anymore dropped to UU(BL) for the first time. Had a good run tho. Blissey - Lost Toxic, Lost Teleport not long after gen 8, recovery max PP reduced in half from 16 to 8 Toxapex - Lost Scald, Lost Knock Off, recovery max PP reduced by half from 16 to 8 and General power creep across the boar. Surprise it hung in OU for as long as it did Tyranitar - Between general power creep (again), competition from Kingambit, Ting-Lu, Chien-Pao (pre-ban), and even Garganacl, sand not being what it used to be, not being to Tera to anything but Rock/Ground/Steel, and the final nail in the coffin Great Tusk being one of if not the most used pokémon in gen 9 OU whiling also power creeping Excadrill in the process, it is beyond Joever for Tyranitar, had a good run tho I may be missing a few but can’t pinpoint why they have fallen (mostly many Gen 4-6 OU mons that are now RU, if not NU or even PU), but these are the biggest ones from my head
The worst falloff of all time in singles has to be Talonflame. It went from being the most dominant Pokemon in the metagame in early Gen 6 OU to being unable to even make UU in any subsequent generation. While other Pokemon have had larger falloffs overall, like Snorlax and Tauros, none has been quite as meteoric as Talonflame's.
I think a good video idea would be the yugiohfication of Pokémon, in that as time goes on things get not only more powerful but more complicated (which isn’t necessarily a bad thing imo)
![BLACK BAG - Official Trailer [HD] - Only in Theaters March 14](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Du0Xp8WX_7I/mqdefault.jpg)
Palafin really going from Hero to Zero the second Urshifu showed back up
Also why run Palafin in regs where Urshifu is banned, when you can use Basculegion as your water type, you don't need to switch your Basculegion, and since Basculegion is also a Ghost-type it is immune to fake out assuming you don't tera it into a pure water type. Compared to Urshifu and Basculegion, Palafin suffers from a too high opportunity cost IMO, since you need to switch it out and back in to get the full benefits of Zero to Hero and by the time you get Palafin back in you might be down 1 pokemon.
it's not even it's fault, it's urshifu's for being too busted and the devs won't nerf them for some reason
@@ZAPRST8879They did technically nerf single strike urshifu by reducing wicked blow to 75 power whereas it was 80 power previously. I don’t think they did this for balance purposes though, I think they just wanted it to have the same effective base power as surging strikes.
I still don’t understand why Palafin isn’t Water/Fighting when Fighting is the “good guy” Type. Dude even gets Superpower!
Now in regulation H, palafin went from zero to zero
Gen 7 snorlax was just him waking up from gen 2 and realizing he wasn't done just yet.
To be fair, Rotom Fan / Ice has had permanent residency on the clearance shelf from day 1. Unfortunately.
People just haven't run Air Balloon on it enough
They need to rework rotom fan to have hurricane over air slash. Also give all the rotoms a healing move or an HP buff.
@@bigmonke3348That, or give Rotom a hidden ability to give fan’s typing a bit more merit
@@noahtaylor1721 heck give it a better Flying move, Hurricane specifically, so that way it has a high damage second STAB that the rest of the forms have. Though I'd just give Rotom adaptability across the board or something like that
Oh like Rotom-H give it Drought, Rotom-W give it Drizzle, Rotom-F give it Adaptability, Rotom-M give it Grassy Terrain, Rotom-Fr give it Snow Warning and Rotom base give it Electric Terrain.
Nah the Rotom appliances on Black Friday sale is diabolical
lol
11:10 Tyranitar's Singles crash out must be studied.
Yeah, pursuit is a powerful move, and without it ghost type are running rampant
Staraptor's too. Went from UUBL for 4 gemerations in a row since its introduction to dropping to NU in gen 9
Meet went from Ubers to NUBL
Ttar? Try deoxys defense.
Ubers staple to nuble with a pathetic d rank in ou. This thing is not washed its drowned
@@Gold_Gamer_100vgc video
I really wish they'd bring back Return, so many Normal and Steel types out of a powerful STAB or Coverage move
i really dont get why Return and Frustration where removed in gen 8, it had no business to get axed cause of how good they are, and now the options for physical normal moves is really limited
@bulborb8756 right? Like if the point was the power, then why are any of the 100+ moves still in the game? Like I get it, no one really used frustration and return was spammed on everything from Lopunny and Steelix to Snorlax and Klinklang, but damn man they really should've been replaced with a new move for Normal STAB at this point. Heck even Hidden Power got reworked for Unknown in PLA for it to always be Super Effective regardless of typing
@@bulborb8756 Friendship values changed in Gen 8. It got drastically reduced so that's probably why they got removed
@@bulborb8756 Having seen many solo runs, I’m kinda glad they’re gone as they’re very generic.
Steel?
There is no way we aren't talking about Zacian. He was the second most picked pokemon after incineroar at 2022 worlds. Now he is not even top 8 in all the restricted pokemon.
we’re definitely not he/him-ing zacian
I was expecting Zacian on the list too. I keep hearing about how awesome it is, then suddenly it gets nerfed, and isn't so broken anymore. I think it was a nerf to attack stats, and its ability only triggering the first time it enters battle, instead of every time it switches in. That and now that dynamaxing isn't a thing, the added damage to giants doesn't matter.
Pretty much. Granted, Zacian is still a very good Pokémon, but to go from what was considered to be the single best Pokémon in the entire game during Gen 8 to being pretty whatever in Gen 9 is an insane drop off. Meanwhile, her brother, Zamazenta, is having the time of his life in Gen 9, lmao
She was too much of a girl boss last generation.
Honestly, I feel like it just deserves an "honorable mention" shoutout. It still has some potential, and was used more than Regieleki and Palafin (AFAIK). Still very, very notable, as it is (again, AFAIK) the sharpest, fastest viability drop in VGC history.
Ursaring getting sick of GSC Snorlax and training its whole life to mog it as Ursaluna is a beautiful character arc
one must imagine snorlax happy
For fall offs in singles, there’s no greater fall than Tauros
My top-of-head list was Tauros, Mewtwo, Snorlax, and Persian. Although, Persian might just be for Pokemon Stadium rentals. I don't remember how good it was in Gen 1.
@@solitare4602 I'd like to add Alakazam, twice.
Tyranitar: Hold my crown... cuz I don't own it anymore
@@solitare4602Gen 1 Persian was basically Tauros, but worse. But it turns out that Tauros is so good that having a second one, even a worse second one, ain't half bad.
@@kamelo2219 Exeggutor was more viable Psychic type due to better moveset and superior bulk. Alakazam can be one of the fastest Pokémon with one of the highest attacking stats and the best type in the game, but when two of the Big 4 are the most busted special walls in the metagame, the third resists all your attacks, and the fourth just annihilates you with ease, AND you get crippled to the ground with Paralysis, you just aren't as viable as you want to be.
You ain't fit for the top if you can't throw hands with the top.
8:09 Snealser jumpscare
Scizor is kinda a sleeper pick in this category.
We had a meta with flutter mane, a physically weak fast fairy type that could sweep teams if positioned correctly, getting like 50+% usage. The perfect environment for bullet punch scizor to go off.
And... it just didn't. It couldn't get it done anymore. Despite everything seeming to go its way. We had tera to cover its quad weakness, we had amulet to stop intim drops, we had pelly being stronger then ever as a great partner, etc etc. Didn't matter. Scizor just isn't it anymore.
@@Joeybanananas No more Roost
@@MaahirMomtaz12Not like this really mattered for VGC, though.
Was sciz ever actually good in vgc to begin with?
@@jmcbango Flashback to Gen 5.
@@jmcbango Yes. Go to the limitless results page. It won German nats and 2 Italian nats. Plus plenty of top cut results circa 2012-13
Tyranitar despite seeing nowhere near the same usage as past gens: "Yeah, I still got it."
This is in a Doubles perspective but yeah
Ttar is good in regional formats still
Tyranitar is demolishing Reg H rn
@@MaahirMomtaz12 he asked for singles equivalents
Landorus T downfall was not a thing in my new gen chart
Also Guilty Gear Mentioned 🗣🔥
One thing missing from the regieleki segment: its one remaining niche, electro web speed control, was also power crept because speed booster Fluttermane is faster and has icy wind.
Me, a Wolfey fan: Zacian Zacian Zacian its Zacian
tbh i don't understand why game freak doesn't do patches, there's nothing stopping them from doing maybe minor adjustments for the really unbalanced stuff on a yearly basis or whenever a major content update like dlc happens, except that they probably don't really care enough about balance to warrant it
I know right? especially for scarlet and violet could have also used more bug fixes and optimization patches
Cuz it would be a nightmare
Glorious King Kyogre could never be on a list like this
If they get rid of Water Spout from the whale then he definitely can go on the list, but he'd have to be dominating for such a hit to happen. Which means good ol' reliable rain boosted, stab boosted, Water Spouting Kyogre will remain untouched.
@@numberhunter62 if Miraidon can get away with it, the original stacking multipliers will get away with it (or people riot)
@@ButterSpreeuntil they give Water Spout to another high HP/SpAtk legendary with some ability that summons rain and gives it a Specs Boost to its SpAtk. Like imagine 120 HP 176 SpAtk + a Miraidon ability for rain, it's horrific
@@numberhunter62 not to mention the Terrastal and Specs Boost on said Kyogre
@@grantdaily9662 they will never do that cause Kyogre is King
if you're wondering, the singles equivalent of biggest fall off... is snorlax, from top 3 in gen 1 (bar mew and mewtwo), to undisputed top 1 in gen 2, all the way to untiered in gen 9, poor snorlax
The thumbnail being a call back to the "Pay to Win" video was a nice surprise
Seriously, it might be an unpopular opinion, but I think the pokemon games should start doing regular balance updates.
problem being: how do you touch competitive without snuffing casual?
Or buff weaker forgotten mons.
@@lilharmyeah, imagine having a move on a playthrough mon that gets banned or their stats get nerfed
@@lilharmthat’s why if they were to do that they should prioritize buffing weaker mons rather than nerfing stronger ones
@@variumi “I woke up this morning to find my Landorus Therian that was carrying my team through the Elite Four now takes hits like a wet noodle I’d like my money back”
Snorlax being beat by the Ursalunas and Urshifus is so sad. When will the Bear on Bear violence end?
Give Snorlax Slack Off already lol
no idea why to this day he STILL can't learn it cause its the perfect fit for snorlax due to how fitting it is
@@bulborb8756 Maybe Game Freak thought it would be too good or something, which I'm not even sure it would. Yes, it would be better, but It wouldn't be too broken.
Yeah way back when, i understand that it getting slack off would have been too strong despite how thematically fitting it is. but yeah now it should get it
Probably they want Snorlax to be associated primarly with Rest because it's a sleeping pokemon. And who would use Rest if there is a better option
Ah yes, the four Tapus: Tapu Koko, Tapu Fini, Rillaboom, and Tapu Lele
Tapu Bulu deserves to know Grassy Glide. I mean come on
@@Oscarus4250no that's a signature move
@@Oscarus4250give him a physical fairly move
@@dbt4869 Grassy Glide has NEVER been a signature move. Lots of Grass Pokemon can learn it.
It is interesting how there are three main reasons a Pokemon falls off
The first two being direct nerfs and general power creep is understandable but the third being “there’s a Pokemon that is just a direct upgrade” feels somewhat unique to competitive Pokemon
Rotom getting a buff to it’s bulk would be nice
Snorlax getting a normal type version of Hammer Arm, Crabhammer, or even High Horsepower would definitely help with a possible speed drop being a benefit in trick room
Palafin is a Gen 9 mon that got outclassed by the Gen 1 Gyarados my man got reverse powercrept
0:15 maybe not the best example of adjusting for power creep.
They do adjust everyone to be better when there's a new character coming so at least it makes it manageable in GGST. If one character is busted, let's make other characters busted too. GF on the other hand barely touches old pokemons and let new ones wreck the meta game.
@@peeenguinne3858Arcsys also loves to keep top tiers top tier
@@peeenguinne3858ppl who say this stupid fucking bit really need to learn what busted means…
Rest in piece axl low
6:42 Landorus Therian staring at incineroar...
lando t is not outclassed by incin lmfao
@@nikzito2 Like I guess bc they have diff use cases but incin is the much more used intimidate pokemon (usually a team wouldn't have both)
0:14 guilty gear in a moxie video nice
Ikr
Rotom's fall from competitive grace is the real reason it spends most of its time these days as a phone. It had to go find a day job.
Excellent video as always good sir! As for Singles - off the top of my head - Tauros being only second to Mewtwo is RBY to being downright abysmal in GSC due to the Special Split is the most cataclysmic fall off I can think of.
A bulky grass fairy is kinda unique, if bulu got a couple move changes I could see him having a niche use
Rotom-Washed 😔
Man's picked Strive where the developers said upon release "We made the character broken on purpose for plot reasons, we will properly balance him on the next patch"
The singles Equavilant would 100% include Pokemon like Tyranitar due to Gen 9, Tauros after Gen 1, Snorlax (again) with Gen 8 and 9, Mew after Gen 4, Deoxys Defense with Gen 9, and could make another case with Exeggutor
Today, just not being Untiered counts as a competitive accomplishment, with so many outstanding Pokémon not being viable for even RU.
Snorlax really is the saddest one. Going from one of the big normal types in Gen I alongside Chansey and Tauros, than Tier King in Gen II with Curselax, and even a reliable, if occasionally niche, high damage tank that especially gave special attackers a bad time with a strong 110 base Sp. Def, to one of the most unusable Pokemon in the game with every normal type in the higher tiers outdoing it and the relevance of brutal ghost, fighting and steel types severely limiting its power.
Snorlax's falloff is even worse, in Nintendo Cup 2000 (Nintendo Cup being the predecessor to VGC in *that it was official,* and apparently aired on TV in Japan), much like in GSC OU and Ubers, *it was the strongest Pokémon of all-time* back then. GSC Snorlax was an unholy beast that you NEEDED to have if you wanted to win in GSC. So while it was crazy in Gen7 VGC, it's fall from grace is even worse than you make it out to be. This excerpt from the GSC Ubers page on Snorlax should give you an idea of how busted the guy was *"Snorlax's sole presence warps the entire metagame around it, forcing teams to pack not only one but multiple answers for it...",* remember that this is in the same tier as f**king Mewtwo and Mew.
I'll close this with the Smogon description of GSC Snorlax for OU. Pretty much everything here applies to the Nintendo Cup format which was 3v3 with Species and Item Clause was well as what would later be Restricted and Mythicals being banned.
"Behold, the single most dominant Pokemon in any OU tier in history. Snorlax combines power and resilience with deadly unpredictability, a set of traits that lands it a spot on virtually all serious teams. *Its presence defines the GSC metagame,* all but forcing teams to play one or more sturdy Normal-resistant Pokemon while simultaneously killing off the viability of manifold special attackers with its enormous HP and sky-high Special Defense. Snorlax is a constant threat to offensive teams as a Curse sweeper, a team sweeping machine as a Belly Drum user, a relentless battering ram as a mixed attacker, and a reliable wall as a RestTalk user. However, it isn't completely unstoppable. Snorlax's Defense stat is on the low side, meaning that despite its massive HP stat, Explosion from common OU Pokemon like Cloyster and Exeggutor is enough to take it out with minimal prior damage. It will usually be forced to use Rest if it gets poisoned, giving the opposing team a reprieve that they can use to gain an advantage. Defensive teams will nearly always have Skarmory for Snorlax and usually pair it with a semi-reliable counter to mixed Snorlax as well, which can sometimes leave Snorlax unable to do any meaningful damage by itself. However, make no mistake: these constitute but minor flaws among Snorlax's array of overwhelmingly powerful attributes."
Also it was in the top 3 best Pokemon in Gen 1.
The pinch berries weren't introduced in gen VII, they were just massively buffed to the point where they might as well have been new items. From gen III-VI they only gave a measly 12.5% when at/below 50% HP
Imagine either Regional Variant Rotom, or a Rotom Evolution that permanently locks the appliance in, but gives a stat boost and a Terrain/ Weather Effect as an ability
The largest single gen dropoff in singles is probably tauros gen 1->2 where it went from being the best mon in OU to unviable. This was mostly due to mechanics changes like the hyperbeam nerf and the splitting of the special stat.
Over time it might be snorlax. It went from being the best mon in ubers in gen 2, to decent in ou in gen 3, to bad in gen 5 and now its running around in zu.
I know he mentioned it got banned in singles but im surprised he didn’t mention how in singles Regieleki’s jump from gen 8 to gen 9 was the opposite of its VGC experience as it went from not being viable in OU to being almost instant banned to Ubers.
Why? Terastalization and coverage. Went from pretty much having no coverage outside of its electric attacks to having the best offensive combination of ice and electric if it terastalizes to ice.
In singles the greatest fall is probably tauros, thing went from king to absolute nothing. Ttar is also high up there
I like the point that Archaladon is such a good counter to palafin it just one shots it to oblivion with electro shot in the rain. Archaladon benefits a lot from urshifus absence and it is a case that even lower powered formats could not save the dolphin. In regulation h Archaladon is one of the greatest Pokémon in competitive history. One of the things I liked about urshifus different forms was that they effectively shut it down because without rain both urshifus out speeds it and every move always crits so it does not matter how many times it’s defenses get buffed. But without urshifu Archaladon runs rampant in tournaments as a result because now you have to respect its stamina ability or in the global challange always assume that it has stamina cause you don’t want to be wrong about a Pokémon’s ability on closed teamsheet.
What each Rotom form got a unique ability?
Rotom-Heat with Flash Fire/Well Baked Body/White Smoke, Rotom-Wash with Hydration/Storm Drain, Rotom-Frost with Refridgerate, Rotom-Fan with Wind Power/Wind Rider, and Rotom-Mow with Motor Drive/Seed Sower/Contrary/Sharpness/Harvest
I love your channel. It feels like my brother's and I just yapping about Pokemon together ❤
For singles, I would highlight Keldeo. That thing used to be so scary with Hydro Pump in the rain. In fact. Keldeo is usually one of the key mons brought up for why defense isn’t very strong in Gen 5 OU, trying to play a slow game against Keldeo is stupid. It is arguably defines rain as a playstyle more than politoed, the pokemon setting the rain.
Move to Gen 6 and literally nothing good happened to Keldeo. Rain was limited, fairies got introduced and a similarly powerful pokemon that could do its job, manaphy, got unbanned. It still hung on to OU but went from being THE threat to more niche.
Then Gen 7 happened and everything went to hell. If Keldeo got slowed by Clefable, the tapus and Magearna getting added to that eas just a cruel and unusual punishment. Not to mention, Toxapex. The defining defensive Pokemon that basically half of all viable teams wanted to use was outright impervious to Keldeo. And of course, we now have the second gen in a row where a banned Pokemon who competed with Keldeo got unbanned. Pelipper made Rain meta again in Gen 7 and you somehow never see Keldeo because Greninja and Manaphy outclass it ridiculously hard as special sweeper, punishing offensive and defensive teams respectively. Keldeo went from the main villain to sideshow really quickly.
My favorite Regieleki era was during the qualifiers for the Player's Cup 4 where all the Japanese players were using Scarf Regieleki. I used Scarf Eleki for the rest of the season
3:05 turns out, all it needed to be toxic in singles was Ice STAB, who knew?
11:10 Chieng Pao AKA Mega Weavile is just better
At least Chieng Pao is now banned
Bro that thumbnail is so funny I almost choked on my apple
This gen has had a lot of big falloff’s in singles. Toxapex is a notable one since it lost access to scald and knock off which makes it way more passive and it can become setup fodder.
Moxie Boosted channel is not a safe space for Aaron Zheng
Sonic Adventure 2 music during Rotom, nice!
Wow I can’t believe Delcatty had a massive fall off, I could never have predicted this
Arguably the biggest fall off is Thunderous, due to prankster in gen 5 being STUPIDLY busted as well as a lot of status nerfs coming in gen 6, gen 5 thunderous would just dominate the field as a support mon with taunt, thunderwave and basically any other status move it could run, but now thanks to the ridiculous nerfs that its toolkit took, it's the least used of the 4 genies by a wide margin
In Sword in Shield VGC, I had to run a Lightining Rod(Most of Regieleki's moves are electric) Raichu with Feint (to destroy Regieleki Focus Sash)
Please gamefreak give us a new PLAYABLE rotom appliance I need an electric steel levitating rotom car
I want an Electric/Poison Blender Rotom.
@UnchainedPandoran what about an Electric/Earth Drill rotom
Even a levitating hoverbike
@@nousername191 that’s also a good idea
@@nousername191 hover bike sounds sick! And it could be the ride Pokemon for gen 10
Mew is the poster child for singles meta falloff. Uber tiered for the first four generations of the game, only to go all the way into Underused. Between gens 5-8, it fluctuated between OU and UU, and then Gen 9 came around and dragged it all the way to NUBL.
In a similar vein, Deoxys-Defense was Uber for 7 straight generations, got dexited and then returned in generation 9 as another NUBL mon
For singles theres a couple of fall offs this gen, salamence, Magnezone, tyranitar, deoxys defense, toxapex, terrakion, staraptor and list could go on for long
Thumbnail goes so hard, especially on Black Friday week no less
Yo, the Sonic Rush music in the background! Love it.
Till this day, I still wonder why Rain and Sunlight gets to keep 50% boost still to water and fire type moves, respectively, after all this time. While most environmental sets (Terrains) and Transistor gets nerfed from 50% to 30%.
Best thumbnail I've seen in a long time🤣
GUILTY GEAR COUNTER AND SONIC ADVENTURE MENTIONED IN THE SAME SEGMENT WITH SPLATOON MUSIC RIGHT AFTER YAAAAAY
i think a funny (if kinda sad) contender for Singles would be Deoxys-Defense. it's been a slow one for sure, but that guy was the second best Deoxys in ADV and was slowly falling off in Ubers up until it got canned from Galar, and now in Gen 9 it's like RUBL or something
also Snorlax from Gens 1-3 to now but you mentioned that one
Another prime example I would give is Thunderus. It was the most nerfed mon in history. As of gen 9 Thunderus is considered a niche pick by many players
In Singles, Tauros was the first HUGE dropoff, i thought you would mention it
Biggest singles fall-off of all time has to be Weavile in BDSP. It lost its 2 best STABs in Triple Axel and Knock Off, plus its best coverage in Low Kick. Not to mention that the first year of Scarlet and Violet was rough for it with the addition of Chien-Pao as a direct upgrade to it
"Man powercreep has gotten too much I wish gamefreak would nerf some of these threats"
Gamefreak: Say no more *nerfs Snorlax*
Pokémon is that type of game where you have to constantly change your teams and the Pokémon on them to stay relevant and that’s what makes competitive Pokémon interesting. Nothing lasts forever as this list shows.
My favorite Pokemon of all time is Mow Rotom, but the one I have the most experience in using is Crobat. I remember the days when we could outspeed everything… now we’ve got stealth bomber salamanders and bouncy neurons hogging all the limelight.
Then again, it’s hard to outspeed anything when you’re not even in the ‘Dex. Couldn’t outspeed the cuts :,)
My mans missed lando-T (but tbf Wolfe already has a wideo all about it).
Snorlax probaly also has one of the highest single drop offs from being insanely good in gen 2 to being ni where in get 9
Ttar would probably be the biggest fall in singles, the loss of pursuit highkey gutted it and it has had drops to RU in gen 9
Sadly, Rotom Fan / Ice has been relegated to the clearance shelf from the very beginning
I’m surprised Zacian wasn’t mentioned here. It was an absolute monster back when Dynamax was a thing, but the nerfs it got coming into Gen 9 absolutely spiral Zacian down to irrelevancy.
In singles, Toxapex.
Clodsire is the more popular pick for that sort of stall mode now.
Hitmontop going from a top meta threat throughout all of Gen 5 to nobody even remembering it exists in Gen 6.. I miss him
Politoed, Kingdra and Ludicolo would have probably been a trio I'd throw on here.
Latios also tanked a ton over the years, especially considering it was nowhere near the same level of dominance it was in Gen V
Oh and Thundurus
Tornadus-Incarnate is in ZUBL now.
Staraptor is in NU after 4 straight gens of UUBL placements.
Suicun is NUBL.
Heatran is UU after 5 gens of OU dominance.
-Garchomp dropped to UU(BL)
-Tyranitar dropped to UU and even RU at some point
-Gengar, Salamence, Azelf, Hippowdon, Terrakion, and Slowbro are all RU now
-Togekiss and Scolipede also dropped further down to RU(BL), last time they were available
-The likes of Gyarados, Mew, Espeon, Swampert, Breloom, Infernape, Lucario, Reuniclus (at some point) all being NU(BL)
-Kingdra in ZUBL
@@goGothitaLOL man, Infernape in NU breaks my heart the most.
One of the best movepools of all time shackled by an ability that wants to use weak moves and offensive stats that just don't cut it anymore, even in RU.
Ironically, Snorlax had one of the biggest fall offs in singles too. It went from the best OU Pokémon in gen 2 to whatever it is now.
sure the low speed is one thing but Snorlax has good bulk to make up for it, the problem is his consistent lack of recovery, why he STILL cannot learn slack off is just stupid when it makes perfect sense for him to learn it unlike infernape
4:22
Hehe, blow-hole. Cause he's a dolphin
Someday in the future, we will get a 2 hour video on the fall of Sneasler and why it deserved to fall
Regieleki, along with every electric type, for some reason lost access to the TM Rising Voltage. Eliminating my favorite set.
Except for Raging Bolt for some reason
Where do RUclipsrs get their pokemon home models from as a gif I’ve been searching everywhere for them
The most extreme falloff in singles would probably be Tauros, but gen 1 is essentially a different game, don't think it's fair to count it. Speed boost Blaziken is a big one, ubers for multiple gens but is now UU I think; Deoxys speed and/or defense (can't remember which fully fell off) were also Ubers for many gens but are now UU or below. Weavile at the beginning of gen 9 went from being one of the best mons in gen 8 OU to being ok in like RU; lost its most important moves and was fully outclassed by chien pao in every way, luckily got its moves back and chien pao was banned, so I think it's solid now. I'm sure there are plenty more, but those are ones I could think of
Singles:
Talonflame - do I need to say it?
Gengar - do I also need to say it? + Dragapult existing the gen after
Greninja - isn’t it obvious? and also Ash-Greninja: the form is gone
Metagross (non-mega) - what Ghost and Dark being neutral to Steel does to a motherfucker, the buffed Knock Off and more broken ghost-types also didn’t help matters
Breloom - Power Creep, fairy-types like Tapus and Iron Valiant, 70 Spe and none-existent bulk being more and more of a eyesore over the years, and if all that isn’t enough the Gen 9 OU sleep ban (thanks Darkrai and Iron Valiant)
Blaziken - 3 words: Heavy-Duty Boots, 4 more words: Hidden Power is gone. Not even the additions of Close Combat and U-Turn can offset the drop-off from fucking Uber to UU(BL). And I didn’t even mentioned Uber power creep by gen 8.
Garchomp - Landorus-T and fairy-types are one thing, but lots of competition is another. Between Roaring Moon and Baxcalibur (pre-ban) from dragon side, Great Tusk, Ursaluna, and Ting-Lu from the ground side, and Iron Valiant (and pre-ban Flutter Mane + Iron Bundle) outspeeding it. Garchomp can’t take it anymore dropped to UU(BL) for the first time. Had a good run tho.
Blissey - Lost Toxic, Lost Teleport not long after gen 8, recovery max PP reduced in half from 16 to 8
Toxapex - Lost Scald, Lost Knock Off, recovery max PP reduced by half from 16 to 8 and General power creep across the boar. Surprise it hung in OU for as long as it did
Tyranitar - Between general power creep (again), competition from Kingambit, Ting-Lu, Chien-Pao (pre-ban), and even Garganacl, sand not being what it used to be, not being to Tera to anything but Rock/Ground/Steel, and the final nail in the coffin Great Tusk being one of if not the most used pokémon in gen 9 OU whiling also power creeping Excadrill in the process, it is beyond Joever for Tyranitar, had a good run tho
I may be missing a few but can’t pinpoint why they have fallen (mostly many Gen 4-6 OU mons that are now RU, if not NU or even PU), but these are the biggest ones from my head
What does Boots have to do with Blaziken’s drop-off?
Threw a like before the video started, because I know you finna give me some quality content.
Ill be honest, i think landorus therian could've made this list
GUILTY GEAR REFERENCE
(scrolling patchnotes in the first minute)
The worst falloff of all time in singles has to be Talonflame. It went from being the most dominant Pokemon in the metagame in early Gen 6 OU to being unable to even make UU in any subsequent generation. While other Pokemon have had larger falloffs overall, like Snorlax and Tauros, none has been quite as meteoric as Talonflame's.
Who would win in the Fraud Allegations Contest, Deku and his quirk All For Nothing or Palafin and its ability Hero to Zero
I think a good video idea would be the yugiohfication of Pokémon, in that as time goes on things get not only more powerful but more complicated (which isn’t necessarily a bad thing imo)
Hopefully Urshifu joins this list soon ♥️♥️
Ironic that in Gen 8, Regieleki dominated VGC but is UU in Singles
In Gen 9, Regieleki is no-show in VGC but got banned to Uber in Singles.
I'm waiting for all the regi's to assemble and become one giant megazord
A singles fall off has to be the tragic tale of terrakion.😢
The gradual descent of Lando-T tho 🐯☁️
Tauros and like, Starmie are probably worth mentioning for singles