bUt AnImE sUbS sHoUlD bE LiTeRaL! (feat. Retsuko)
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- Опубликовано: 7 май 2020
- In which I debate my former weeb-self about literal subs in anime! Think you want your subs literal? Like, REALLY literal? Be careful what you wish for...
So yeah, this took forever to edit. Would love to make more videos in this style, but unless I get like a million subscribers and get to do this full time, it'll have to be a once every few months kind of thing.
The release of this also wound up being rather timely as a game localization controversy exploded a few days ago on Twitter about someone translating "tsundere" as "fragile male ego." Read more about it here: boundingintocomics.com/2020/0...
I think it goes without saying that I totes agree with the translator and think "fragile male ego" is a great localization of "tsundere." I just might start using it myself now (there's a loooooot of male tsundere characters in the games I translate.) Anyway, I'll probably make a video response in a couple days.
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Sarah K. Thanks for your reply! Do you know where I can get a script and/or Japanese subtitled version of “The Seven Samurai” (for starters)? Even with English subtitles (contextually translated I think) I can only partly understand the spoken Japanese (and Toshiro Mifune not at all!).
Yeah, I'm the wrong person to ask on where to find Japanese scripts. 😂 I searched the Japanese internet for like a half hour for Sailor Moon scripts and found none, then someone in the community just emailed me all of them.
@@PrettyTranslatorSarahMoon Oh, wow. Can they be made available online?
@@PrettyTranslatorSarahMoon there's one that has Japanese subs for lots of anime series including dragon ball z and sailor moon, but not all episodes.
@@PrettyTranslatorSarahMoon are there any ... particularly good places to ask around in the hope someone will SEND SKRIPTZ PLZ? Asking for a friend ...
(... who would really like scripts for Non Non (which he thought had a pretty good sub))
Ok you immediately won me over with the 'の vs が' to 'your vs you're' joke
i was just gonna say that hahah
Japanese (and ALL foreign) movies should have the option in “settings” menu for English, Spanish, etc. subtitles. But there should be the option for subtitles in the movie’s source language. Why is this option not generally available?
Yep. Agreed. Basically "captions" at that point, which is pretty standard.
I heard a rumor that Japanese companies don't make captions for the def.
Not a translator, but after studying Japanese I cringe at my old weeb self preferring literal translations, too! Now I even smh at people who immediately dismiss dubs. There are some great dubs!
Yeah, nowadays most dubs are at the very least watchable. Back in the days, dubs were just not good. Kids these days have it good.
Did you watch the same video?
Thank you! I always get so tired hearing people say that a literal translation is the best kind of translation from people who can't even understand Japanese. It doesn't, a well localized translation is the best for native speakers. As like you showed localization isn't making it Americanized like 4kids dub, but tweaking the dialogue so it sounds natural to the language that you're translating to. As a literal translation while it can get the job done, the dialogue usually sounds odd and jarring.
the most important thing in translations is transmitting the feeling not the meaning
Yeah, but sometimes they can't convey the meaning well, for example if A tells someone's feelings indirectly, but the translator translates that it is A's feeling, and uses the word "i", even though it's B's feeling. I think maybe the solution is, sometimes need to use "literal", or like it or not to understand animeny more deeply 😂
Now apply this logic when translating a technical manual.
The editing was so clean in this, made the whole video very entertain and funny
This was so much fun! Loved the helpful hints in other videos, and explanations here are amazing for educating myself for various reasons. New subscriber, and don't forget your awesomeness!
This video makes some good points, but it's a shame that people are using it as as evidence for strawman arguments against more understandable translation criticism.
LOVE this skit!
The only thing that could make thus even better would be if weeb-sarah was holding the manga upside down or something, lol.
So I had been literally translating Japanese that is funny and then localizing it as best as I can.
I wish there was a shazam option to bring you up every time I watch anime and question the subs 😂😂😂
I hope more of these follow. Great stuff as always!
The only people that might get use out of literal translations are students learning japanese but even that I don't think it would be that effective. I've always kinda preferred dub over sub anyway so I could appreciate the animation instead of the bottom of the screen. For sub watchers I believe they are better off reading the manga as they can go at their own pace. Anyway, great video!
This is really awesome! It's fun and gets the point across!
I'm pretty sure literally no one in the world who prefers literal translations means it in this way.
They just mean that you should still express the same meaning as the source material without changing things. (Like jelly-filled donuts lol)
Sometimes when i watch anime, it is quite different between subtitle and what the character try to talk about. I learn Japanese so i realize about it. By the way, your explaination about it was awesome and i gonna take it as reference for my Japanese translation (just start translating).
This was brilliant! I hate when fans translate sayings/proverbs literally. One personal pet peeve is 焼け石に水. I've seen this translated as "water on hot rocks"... WTH!!? I've never heard that expression in English before.
All according to cake.
@@madlink3495 no idea what you're on about
@@Theman_3000 its a reference to good on the saying it, referencing the death note fans that didn't translate keikaku, so the line became, "all according to keikaku."
@@madlink3495 I see. I've never heard of all according to keikaku until I googled your comment.
great video! really funny and Im glad you chose Aggretsuko hahaha
Thank-You! Its good to finally hear a proper explaination on this subject.
Me @ the people currently complaining about the Twisted Wonderland localization (okay some stuff is understandable like the weird censorship of Sam’s tattoos but there was no way in hell they were gonna leave Tsunotaro untranslated)
We need more of this! You could make a good translation and compare it to the crappy one that was released for that media.
This was hilarious!
This is one of my favorite videos on RUclips 😂
I WON THE INTERNET!
This is very deceptive. I get that it's exaggerated for comedic purposes, but it completely dismisses the actual problem that most people have with localizing subs. Best example I can give, during Isekai Quartet season 2, the subs translated "Karaage" as "chicken wings". To me, that's unacceptable. Another problem I have is when they make up nicknames to characters, like when Lupin III calls Fujiko "Fujiko-chan" and the subs translate it to Fujicakes. Or in Chihayafuru with "Nikuman-kun" subbed as "Porky". Both of those instances change the meaning from an endearing term to a demeaning one.
The point of translating is to remove the need for the audience to learn the language. This drama however is what inspired me out of spite to learn japanese.
@@madlink3495 yeah, but the Karaage thing ... we translate "burrito" as "burrito" and "curry" as "curry", so ...
Tbf, how else would you translate 肉マン君?
@@WillCrawford0 buritto and curry have been part of common American english, so we don't translate those words into English. Maybe we use loan words?
And I haven't learned the word 肉マン君, so I'm guessing "meat bun (plus honorific thats usually written in hiragana)"? My stance on translating leans more on localizing on the parts that aren't exclusive to Japan, and maybe keep japan intact when its not reasonable.
@@madlink3495 The thing is, because they are japanese names or even terms is impossible to not use said names/terms without losing the meaning of the phrase, Persona 3 and 4 for example just embrace said things.
This was fantastic 😂😂😂
I don't need to be patronized in the subtitles by someone interpreting it in a twisted politically motivated way. I can extrapolate the meaning of broken English when its literal.
Hahahaha this is great!
Lol this is great! Watching this made me think of a question, because I am trying to self learn Japanese! Do you have any tips or tricks for when listening to anything in Japanese and then understanding in your native language? What I mean is...that just from watching this video you made it clear that Japanese will not directly translate to English so how do you, as someone who understands Japanese but it isn’t your native language, watch anything in Japanese and then quickly turn the information around in your head to make it understandable to you (ideally without using subtitles lol!) I hope my question makes sense...love your videos!! ありがとうございました！😊
The answer is, I don't translate things in my head into English to understand them. I just understand them in Japanese. When I was still learning, I'd have to take some time with each line to understand it, which is why manga is typically better than anime for beginners.
セラムーンSarah Moon thank you for your reply! That makes sense, I’m just struggling with that concept myself, how to just be understanding in Japanese instead of searching for the English translation in my brain! Reading more manga probably would help me bridge that gap! Thanks again! ☺️
I think that subs should usually try to convey the meaning rather than the literal translation, but I do wish that there were literal translations of some anime for learning purposes, as it helps one understand what is literally being said. There are a few very interesting clips on RUclips like this, but they are hard to find and there aren't even that many of them.
I mean......teaching Japanese with literal word-by-word breakdowns of anime is mostly what I do on this channel. 🧐
@@PrettyTranslatorSarahMoon But your channel itself is hard to find though, right? I only found your channel by chance. As far as I know, searching something like "anime with literal subtitles" doesn't give many results of video just translating anime literally. Also, there are no official literal subs made by streaming companies that can guarantee more accuracy, as well as full episodes.
I just want to see a middle point between literal and localizations. Not too literal to be unnatural, but not localized to the point where it's adding unnecessary nuance that wasn't there in the original Japanese version.
Well the real goal is to learn Japanese. Then I can bypass all this localization nonsense altogether.
I'm an aspiring Japanese>English translator and I love your videos! Sorry for asking this rather boring and academic question, but are there any Japanese grammar/linguistics books in Japanese that you would recommend for translators specifically?
I never know what books to recommend because I don't read anything academic. I've just learned by doing.
I want to see at least a clip of an anime dubbed but the script is the literal translation. I think that would be pretty entertaining to watch
Yeah, sadly I think I'd get a copyright strike if I used clips longer than 7 seconds.
The Evangelion dub on Netflix.
I feel like people who say this have literally never learned another language, Like my Japanese is rough but my spanish was pretty ok, and anyone who speaks another language could tell you that literally translating a sentence will sound really bad.
EX:
Como te llamas----- literally translates -----> What is name?
Como te llamas ----- translation----------> what is your name?
No the literal translation of como te llamas is
What is names.
Nothing in there Bout possesing anything.
Then I miss remembered thanks for the correction it’s been about 7 years since I cracked open a spanish text book
It's even more different, it's more like "What do you call yourself?", since the "te" is reflexive, like "yourself", and "llamas" is the 2nd person singular of "llamar" "to call".
actually, a literal translation together with the actual trnaslation would be really helpful if you seek to learn over to really watch the anime
haha. good episode. i'm not sure i follow your point about husband=master though. while the sexist overtones of the word are obvious, is this not a case of the same kanji being used for more than one purpose? the are plenty of kanji that have more than one meaning.
Yes, the words are nuanced. That's the point. danna-san, in modern Japanese, usually means "husband," but back in the day it was like "master" kind of like in old timey British English. Just like "okusama" means "wife," but it also means "mistress." It goes back to the "master of the house," and "mistress of the house" ideas. But it's not literally "husband" in Japanese.
"Shujin" definitely has more "master in charge of someone else" vibes to it. For example, my husband could be called my "shujin" (husband), but he would also be called "shujin" (master/owner) in reference to our cats.
@@PrettyTranslatorSarahMoon lol. master of the cats
This is so funny! Can't the dictionary form be asked as a question to have the meaning of "do you want to ____?" (like, 食べる？). I'm just curious cause I've heard people use it a lot like that. Thank you!💓
Yes, that's the point. It's literally "eat sweets?" But it really means, "would you like some sweets?"
Sarah K. Ya, totally! Thanks for clarifying☺️
I'm weirdly happy that The House in Fata Morgana is being talked about at all. It is just sooooo good, everybody who has any love for a good story should play it.
And I think "fragile male ego" describes Jacopo quite well :D
You dont even need to go so far, my native lenguage is spanish from Costa Rica. We have the phrase "pura vida" which means "doing well", "awesome" or, sometimes, "thank you" with a more casual tone. If I were to translate it literally for an english speaking audience, it would be "pure life" which would make no sense in any of the situations that "pura vida" is used.
I don't think a lot of people actually want literal translations, like with everything it's about finding a balance. The problem arises when translators start taking too many creative liberties around themes, political messages and even straight up preaching to the audience. Not to mention "punched-up" dialogue that injects dated memes, slang, pop culture references and puns which hurts the writing, and has the side-effect of changing the characters personality into the same smug wisecracking archetype we see everywhere in dubs.
Is the blue haired weeb Sarah a character you made, or is it a reference?
Just a character I made.
I personally think every show should be obligated to teach every language simultaneously otherwise they're being xenophobic
Original: I do not wish to marry Josuke-san for his family and mine have been at war for years
Localized: God, Josuke is such a Gamer Gater! I bet he probably voted for Trump!
. . .
Those damn commies...
I am just happy with subs/dubs that don't add SJW garbage into that is not in the Japanese (talking to you Crunchy Roll)
Can I have some specific examples? Like scenes/lines of dialogue from specific shows? I've been wanting to address this for a while, but the only example I know of where a clear agenda was being pushed that wasn't in the original was Miss Kobayashi's Dragon Maid...
@@PrettyTranslatorSarahMoon Konosuba s2e2 where Kazuma and Megumin are fighting over who gets to take the bath first. In both versions, Kazuma says he believes in gender equality. In the sub the joke is women want equality until it doesn't work out for them. In the dub, that joke is replaced with something about oppressed groups and etc. It takes an anti-political correctness joke and turns it into an SJW talking point...which is not funny.
I take it that CR does but the sub and the dub...not sure why they changed the dub like that.
I've worked for CR and their sub teams alone consist of like 5 people per series, so I wouldn't be surprised if they had a separate person/team writing the dialogue for the dubs.
@@PrettyTranslatorSarahMoon oh, so they in general don't just read the subs when they do dubs?
9:34 The Brat, vs. the Bitch, vs. the Metal!!
Seriously -- I loved how the tone of the dialog between the characters merged perfectly with the mood of the anime itself. I laughed so hard. I seriously need to stop watching these videos, this is too much.
5 minutes watching the video, and the old lady is clearly trying to make it bad (yes, its u Sarah xD). Also I agree that a good translator always try to make it as literal as possible and use (TL Notes: Keikaku means plan). I have a good example of the anime that if you dont translate it literally, all the meaning is lost: Seitokai Yakuindomo.
UUUh translate these words literary for me without context: حرم وٱللَّٰهُ أَكْبَرُ
(NOTE: no, I won't give a pronunciation guide, your only hint is that it's not Farsi ;D)
i know i'm replying to a two year old comment, but like bro. if keikaku means plan, then just write plan. i can't think of a single good reason not to translate "keikaku doori" as "all according to plan." like that is MEGA VILLIAN SHIT, and you automatically know that when you see it, because you speak english. and I just watched the first episode of that show and I don't think the subtitles were particularly literal. they certainly didn't change the meaning of anything, but most lines sounded like something a human being would saysomething
I think it should be as close as humanly possible. Obviously in English we use pronouns and SVO so that should be the only changes really. I saw a Terrace House fan sub recently that used the word “Thot” and thought that was ridiculous. Just say what it is.
Oh, my sweet summer child...
What was the source?
do your fcking job
she does, you just don't understand what her job is
@@toastyyyyyyyy 6 months for this lame a comeback uh