What If We Fixed Super Saiyan 3?
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 3 окт 2024
- In Dragon Ball and #DragonBallSuper as well as #DragonBallZ , Super Saiyan 3 has become a bit of a joke in the fandom despite its immense power. So what can we do to bring this transformation back to relevance and popularity? We can do something without changing its look and feel and that is what we are discussing today! Goku's power revived! #whatif
MUSIC - Bruce Faulconer Medley/Dragonball Z - Rob Tando • Bruce Faulconer DBZ Pi...
Become a Member! / @masakox
Intro theme by Infinity Tone - / infinitytone
Want to send something to be featured? Then you can!
MasakoX, PO Box 372, Wallington, SM6 6DJ, UK
masakox dragon ball what if dbs masakox what if
That's certainly ONE way to do. I personally would go a slightly different way.
I feel like it should be about evolution. Super Saiyan 1 (And it's various grades) was all about Power. Accessing this deep wellspring of energy inside oneself, allowing you to convert the energy of emotions (rage, pride, etc) into energy and using that energy to amplify and intensify one's strength many times over.
Super Saiyan 2 was about Control. Increasing one's strength was a bi-product, but by controlling that strength, controlling that power, you could bring out far more strength without losing yourself (or your speed) in the process.
Super Saiyan 3 should be about Evolution. Each Saiyan should have their own separate individual Super Saiyan 3 form, that is unique to them. Some will be faster, some will be stronger, some will be better able to use ki-attacks, some might even gain new abilities like regeneration or the like. Goku's version could even do what you said, with Ki-Attacks that STOP their enemies from being able to regenerate, or do more damage more quickly than those with high-speed regeneration abilities are able to tank!
And the God & Blue forms should include this same process. Super Saiyan Blue is just Super Saiyan form + Super Saiyan God form, so naturally, there should be a Super Saiyan Blue 2 (Vegeta anyone?) and Super Saiyan Blue 3 which ALSO include the God Ki within them. These forms would be a further Evolution of the focus that each of these Saiyans have from their regular Super Saiyan 3 forms. Not just a blue colouration, but a more pronounced change for to their personality, and abilities, focusing and specializing in one area, but without the detriment of others.
Should they be temporary and very draining? YES! But I think that if they don't just give you "Moar Power!" but instead grant you some evolved version of your base abilities, it should be not just possible, but PLAUSIBLE that they would have lots of situational uses! But exactly that, situational. As they'd be very draining, it'd likely be the kind of thing you only bring out when it's really needed.
But that's my two cents. What do you think? Lets get this discussion going!
And this is why I love discussions - everybody has a methodology. Thank you for your contributions, Arthur!
@@MasakoX And this is why I love your channel! lol. (I just rarely comment, but I've been watching for the past year or so.)
ok if it's about evolution how come if god and blue are so high up there do they have eyebrows?
This is extremely well put, and I love this idea. It could make for much better plot, as well. Imagine Vegeta becoming a HUGE blast of energy, extremely blunt and punishing, while Goku becomes extremely fast, think instant transmission x100.
This could make for many different advantages and disadvantages to fights, and enemies could make use of the latter, and that could bring real tension, instead of the two guys yelling at one another while getting stronger and stronger.
I love it!
@@tommyblud I always wondered about the eyebrow thing.
It's like Toriyama's memory is a pokemon.
"Toriyama wants to have a new idea! But Toriyama can only learn 4 memories. Forget one to learn new memory?"
Good one 🤣
Toriyama forgot Launch....
And learned Vegeta!
ROFL that was a good one
Which memory should be forgotten?
▸ Dr. Slump Animal People
Launch Super Saiyan 2
Cannot forget Dr. Slump because it is an HM memory.
I before A except after K That is the best one! I can't stop laughing!
But his eyebrows were replaced with muscles! That's what makes the form so strong!
I love the no eyebrows look, gives it something significant besides the hair.
@@stevewyrick3400 yeah like other forms look mostly the same for me but different colours and super sayian 3 it looks so cool for me
It's not "no eyebrows", his brow bone grows and changes, to more closely resemble how they look in great ape form.
@@deanstewart2382 But the eyebrow itself does vanish. So it is, yeah, "no eyebrows"
personator907 he looks scarier too
Legend has it Raditz achieved SSJ3 in the after life and that is how Vegeta got pissed enough to go blue for the first time.
"hey, I got super saiyan 3. That's pretty cool."
"Oh you think your so better than me? Well guess what. I now have super saiyan blue hair dye."
Ssj3 IS one of my favorite forms
It feels like it's a form for brutal battles
I loved the way the hair moved when fighting against buu
And his attitude change while Goku is in the form💪🏾💯
i play xenoverse 2 with my older brother and ill admit i over use the form especially with original brolys souls where full ki right out the gate >.>
@@exiledhusky lol
I got the "this is a real kamehameha!!!" Skill
That ssj3 kaioken kamehame ain't no joke if u combo it right lol
Chris,now you are getting it.the form was supposed to bring out the great ape in super saiyan form and was supposed to seem like a tank form. Kinda like the classic ape form with all that brute force.
@@christophermerritte3176 thanks💪🏾💯
@@christophermerritte3176 u not just saying that cuz we got the same 1st name are u lol?
Honestly the reason I like it because my god did it get some good fights
Goku vs Kid Buu
Vs Janemba
Vs Hirudigarn
Those fights are an animation pleasure to watch
They were boring and Goku was ugly as sin.
Dark Enkil really , for me they have some of the best animation in Z
2 of those are movies, so they don’t really count.
jmac28211 why don’t they count?
So by that track you can’t like SSG because battle of gods , or SSB because of res F?
@@willchalloner6643 those were adapted into the anime.... O.o
Ssj 3 is cool for me, it look intimidating
There really isn't any inherent problem with SSJ3 that other SSJ forms don't have, which is just energy consumption due to not being used to the form, people forget that SSJ1 had the same problem it was incredibly draining which is why Goku aimed to stay transformed for days so that he could get used to it almost like it was his base form, apply the same means of training to SSJ3 and you will get mastered SSJ3, where you have the enormous power without it draining your energy so quickly, that's how you fix SSJ3, train in it! Some people dog on SSJ3 just because all we've seen of it is an untrained version, but they don't realize that we've never actually seen anyone train in that form and try to master it, Kaioken x3 was vastly more unstable than SSJ3, but Goku got the hang of that real quick and was able to use kaioken multiple times higher than 3, and I just wanted to add as well that no form actually gives you new powers, Gogeta hitting Omega Shenron with an air pressure type ki attack is nothing new, Goku has done that in his base form back in dragonball and early Z, its just something they do to show someone is way stronger than someone else, so the SSJ forms only give you more power not new abilities, the abilities have not changed since dragonball.
@@hyperrunner8531 actually I dont think it would work that way. Somewhere it was explained that ss3 uses ki energy to make that transformation possible. It physically changes the body hence the missing brows, bigger and toned muscles. Heavy increase in speed and power and let's not forget my favorite. The long ass gold hair! And as far as I heard ki is like ones life force. It would have a limit to it
@@droopyaguacat3185 But why is that a reason to why he can't simply get used to the form so it becomes less stamina draining like he's done with every single other form? You've talked about the body changes and all of that but how does that stop him from increasing his stamina in that form?
@@hyperrunner8531 because of the energy. A body can only withhold so much ki or output so much ki before actually afflicting the users life force. I will go back into my notes after work and check it out so I can give yall a link or picture to answer your questions better.
@@droopyaguacat3185 Is this something said in the show or guides or just a theory? Like perhaps SSJ3 is using vital life energy like Tien does, if that was the case then your premise would be correct but as far as I know this hasn't been mentioned in the show, I don't think we really know how SSJ3 works tbh, to my knowledge they haven't really explained it
That bit about "Super Saiyan if mastered can be stronger and more efficient than 2 or 3" thing really needs to be explored more. Future Trunks in the manga is the closest we got to that, where he mastered SSJ2 so much that he could supercharge it to be stronger than Goku at SSJ3 (which is huge since SSJ3 is a 400x multiplier).
I like the idea of SSJ2 and 3 turning out to be shortcuts or forced forms with drawbacks to them. 2 makes the user more aggressive and cocky, 3 has a massive amount of power but the stamina drain on it means you gotta be quick. So it leaves you with one of two situations: you try to master SSJ1 more than Goku and Gohan did when they clearly managed to push the power far beyond the original 50x multiplier, or you try to overcome the drawbacks of 2 and 3. Whichever is more worth your time.
As for the Ki Mastery effect of 3, it's worth noting all the characters enhance their physical combat with ki too. Goku's punches as a SSJ3 did a lot more damage to Buu than Vegeta did, and that's part of the reason Ultimate Gohan beat down Super Buu so hard without having to use a single ki attack. It would have been better if it was like you said and say, when Goku blows a hole in Buu it makes him hesitate for a minute because "Why hole not go away?"
Trunks supercharged SS2?
Is this in SUper? Because Trunks "Muscle form" was basically SS1 supercharged.
@@TheMetastasia it is. In the Manga when trunks spars with goku he shows him his mastery of ssj2 allows him to become so powerful he could overpower goku at ssj3. Goku had to go God to win.
Gohan and Goku never pushed Super Saiyan beyond the 50x multiplier.
@@onyxt3589 Goku did in the time chamber. He went grade 2 and 3. And it was implied he might have gone further than that against cell given he got so strong
@@redkingrauri3769 eh, while some people may say that grade 4 has a higher multiplier than grade 1, it doesn't appear to, its just that its much more energy efficient and so goku and gohan got alot more out of their training due to it.
Add sidebrows.
By Super, it should waste less energy.
Apply it to God and Blue.
Sidebrows? 🤔
@@DamianQualshy yes,side eyebrows
Eyebrows, but for your upper cheek bones. Obviously
@@IAmMightyMike So, like those things under Ash Ketchum's eyes?
Crisis Among Infinite Darths AC the f is a sidebrow? Also the eyebrows removed for muscle brow (that’s what I’m calling it) makes it look menacing
The way I'd fix SS3 is by having the form used so far to be an imperfect version it, hence the ki drain. I'd have the "actual" super saiyan 3 look pretty much the same, but maybe have the hair be shorter than "imperfect" 3, but still longer than 2 (to demonstrate that previously raging power had been brought under control)
Also eyebrows. Eyebrows are important.
That would actually be pretty good. Have the "perfected ssj3" be able to close the stupid wide power gap between its inferior form and super buu.
Then we wouldnt have to go down the kid buu path
It is an imperfect form. It's a partly transformed great ape. The perfected form is SSJ4.
@@ericstaples7220
No it isn't. SSJ4 isn't canon.
@@ericstaples7220 ssj4 isnt canon my dude
I don't know why people hate this form so much when I first saw it I thought it was super cool and intimidating but then super came alone. I guess I always has a place in my heart for ssj3
It looks dumb. Super saiyan 1 and 2 (as well as blue and god) don't look to be physical trandformations, just a surge of ki that causes a flaring golden aura that pushes the hair up and gives them a golden hue. It makes sense, it's genius, Super Saiyan 3, and 4, are physical, it implies the silly concept of the hair instantly growing and the eyebrows falling off, and when Goku reverts to his base form is even more silly, eyebrows regrowing and hair sucked back into the scalp!
ARX 351 Dumbass the Eyebrows are going to become the avengers after the end of infinity war that ki wipes it away from how flipping strong it is you PANCAKE
@@arx3516 SSJ3 is SUPPOSED to be a physical transformation. The show made it obvious that Goku was tapping into the great ape transformation to boost his power beyond SSJ2. The ape transformation is obviously a physical one.
Because it was a pointless transformation. It didn't defeat anyone
@@arx3516 Bro they literally are born with tails and turn into a giant GORILLA during the full moon
I always wanted to see Super Saiyan 3 Raditz... What an amazing golden hairball could that be... 🤩🤩
izanagi33 It officially exists in Super Dragon Ball Heroes
I always imagined what that would look like, would it be him growing 7 foot long hair down to the floor, or would his hair stay the same but just without eyebrows? 🤷🏿♂️ Lol
I always wanted to see Super Saiyan 3 Nappa.
@@Gnidel ITs just a small beard sadly, according to dragon Ball heroes of course.
@@Gnidel as a bald man ss3 napa is interesting
How to fix SSJ3
Step 1. shave some hair
Step 2. Go ssj3
Step 3. Glue shaved hair onto eye brows
Done ✅
Step 4. Power down.
Step 5. Power up again.
Step 6. Scream as hair retracted too far without the length you shaved off and gets stuck inside your scalp until it bursts out in a bloody mess of skin and hair.
Seconded
@Groisu This would also be acceptable.
Nappa was on the right track all along.
Omar that just makes it worse, cuz the hair would just grow back, and the putting the hair on the eyebrows is just terrible
The form doesn’t need fixing. The form did what it needed to do and show us how Goku always pushes himself to his limits and beyond. The form embodies everything that Goku is. Maybe when Goten and Trunks grow up they can use a better version of the form that doesn’t drain as much stamina.
Thought they mastered it as gotenks
I disagree it was never mastered and what they needed to do what the form is what they did for blue instead and everyone forgets blue had the same energy problem as 3
The lack of eyebrows symbolizes Goku being closer to his Oozaru transformation perhaps Super Saiyan 3 can be supercharged by moonlight.
That would be an interesting concept, perhaps make so that it drains less stamina under 3 full moon or at night time. Would probably allow us to get some night time fights or training scenes. I also think it would be cool to make it like the kaioken, except what I would do is have its physical strength be equal to ssj2 but have it be much stronger Ki wise, so beam attacks are much stronger as well as being faster during flight, i also think it would be awesome if upon transformation you obtain a Ki barrier that lessens damage from attacks, so it could be the reason why the form is so draining
Then why would SSJ4 have more hair when it symbolizes the same thing?
@@IAmMightyMike because it's Super Saiyan 4 it's a one step further than three LOL honestly Super Saiyan 4 is the best of both the base forum and oozaru.
@Jeffrey Scott You call it useless nostalgia, I call it utilization of a core aspect of the Saiyans that existed way before Golden Hair and was an emblematic aspect of how they did conquest of planets and as part of their heritage, and that merely disappeared because Akira couldn't be arsed to create anything with it or draw the tails because he found them annoying to do.
Major Lawliet thank you
The comparison to Jirens punches is exactly what I was aiming. Punching from a distance.
Why do people dislike the eyebrow thing so much? I think it makes SSj3 look pretty unique and awesome at the same time,
SS3 is completely fine. It was meant to be like this overdrive state where you become exponentially stronger, but the stamina drain would be equally as strong. It was always meant to be this legendary transformation that should only be used sporadically, or as a last resort when you just need that extra oomph.
The only reason people now suddenly think that it's trash is because SSG made it completely obsolete. Without it, SS3 would still be the definitive SS transformation.
Difinitive? That's not how you spell useless garbage
@@darkenkil4416 Chill, you don’t need to get triggered because he spelled it wrong
the problem was that it made goku stupid and made buu a joke.
How about it's an incomplete version of ss3. Leading up to the perfect super Saiyan. No ss1, 2 and 3. Just the true form of super Saiyan. Then no more transformation after that. Except mixing it with the god ki.
Exactly what I think about the super saiyan transformation lineup
Yay I’ve been waiting for this kind of video
I love ssj 3, it was the strongest in dbz and i love how cool it looks
Top 5 Transformations in the series IMO:
1. Super Saiyan (Goku/Trunks)
2. Super Saiyan 2 (Gohan)
3. (Super) Broly.
4. Super Saiyan 3 in Fusion Reborn
5. Ultra Instinct Omen
Sadly wasnt even that strong in DBZ, Fusion and Ultimate both surpassed it quickly.
@@Amardarial whats ultimate?
A form that loss meanwhile goku beat buu with SS1?+ spirtball
@@boltens4355 goku was only able to beat buu because they used the dragon balls to get all his energy back
WHAT DO WE DO WITH A BROWLESS SAIYAN?
WHAT DO WE DO WITH A BROWLESS SAIYAN?
WHAT DO WE DO WITH A BROWLESS SAIYAN,
EARLY IN THE MORNIN~
So make SS3 a kaioken style powerup that all of them can use. It burns energy two to three times faster, and applies a physical toll on the user's body which increases the longer they sustain it.
In return, you get an increase in speed and strength but less then what you get with the jump from SS to SS2. In addition you get the ability to turn all your melee attacks into ranged versions, allowing you to strike from outside your opponent's own attack range without fear of counterattack. Also add a "quick charge" to all ki attacks you do while in this form.
So no charging up that Final Flash to full over the course of 30s, instead just slam a full power one in their face in the middle of your combo, maybe give it a few seconds to come online and fire off but still while they're reeling from your assault.
With this you'd be trading off the greater speed/power increase from going Blue or God form for the equivalent of constantly holding down the charge button for all your attacks. I'm reminded of one of the PS2 era DBZ games where Tien's Dodon Ray had almost no cast time so you could spam it quickly and in the middle of a combo.
TLDR: no real power increase, shoot full power lasers real fast. Major power drain.
I agree make it like the kaioken, except what I would do is have its physical strength be equal to ssj2 but have it be much stronger Ki wise, so beam attacks are much stronger as well as being faster during flight, i also think it would be awesome if upon transformation you obtain a Ki barrier that lessens damage from attacks, so it could be the reason why the form is so draining
@@darrellsimon4462 if ssj3 actually had such a ki shield that could be one of the reasons why it is so draining to the user another reason is that the ssj3 we see is a incomplete form.
( in other words goku likes to get in close to his opponent and punch them rather than wear them down from a distance thusly why we never saw the shield in action. )
same, but I would jsut make it an absolute physical powerhouse made for quick bursts, darting around, throwing barrages, lifting gigantic pillars, that kinda thing.
Plus, I'd also have it give regen.
When you mentioned 3 being used for a quick burst of power, I realized that Dragon Ball FighterZ uses it pretty effectively. Goku's Lv3 Super has him going Super Saiyan 3 for a quick combo ending with a huge Kamehameha, he uses it for a quick burst of strength ending with a massive ki attack
the only improvement that could be made is having the tail grow back while in this form, and then they can use that fake moon technique to get a boost from the moon while in this form, perhaps draining less stamina and even getting a more powerful multiplier, which makes this form dependent on the moon.
That is brilliant ( it would also make it necessary to have achieved ssj3 in order to achieve ssj4)
So if you managed to master it like Goku did the OG Super Saiyan . Would that make you Super Saiyan Tree Fiddy?
A thought on the 'soul' strike theory, it doesn't hurt the 'body' at all but it immediately strikes the ki, limiting speed, stamina and recovery. To an extent 'gentle fist' from Naruto.
so you throw a punch, some cocky villain says that was nothing, and then they start panting and are incredibly exhaused.
Would've been the perfect counter to buu's regen and stamina, disabling them for a while so he can be hurt.
The problem would that it would also exhaust the user, meaning it's for very quick bursts, meant to end fights fast, while super saiyan 2 is just an all around good form for fights, and super saiyan is great for extremely long fights.
So turn it into a Hyper Combo, like Dragonball FighterZ: deadly, but punishable. ...and make it like the Akuma's Raging Demon.
I've always wondered why super Saiyan 3 is the only form without eyebrows. Then I thought maybe all the hair goes to his head in that one?
Here is what I always saw ssj3 be or what it could be:
Ssj3 seems to give a really huge boost to physical and and energy attacks but the latter being raised to a ridiculous degree, at the cost of burning up your ki reserves much faster. Kind of like an overdrive mode. Now the reason I think this is the case its because while in the afterlife goku must have noticed that physical bodies behave differently there, like when using the kioken wiht ssj.
Maybe seeing that in the afterlife you have near unlimited energy reserves he developed a form of ssj that takes advantage of such vast power. It would explain why he was so confused when he turned back to base during the buu fight. high normal physical body is not meant for that form entirely.
So essentially ssj3 is a form more useful in the other world than in this world.
Amazing concept tbh. Goku can shoot fist canons that could knock your spirit out of order?
Imagine if he could slowly stay in the form longer and longer throughout Super too. So come the Goku Black Arc that's his guaranteed second go-to form before God or Blue
Super Saiyan 3 should be a glass cannon form. If SS2 could be considered a refinement of Super Saiyan, SS3 can be breaking the limits of what that kind of power allows, running the risk of instability. Kind of like what we saw in the form that Goku took prior to going full Ultra Instinct.
Goku has embraced his ghostly nature and become the legendary Spooky Saiyan!
I like SSJ3 it looks brutal and powerful making Goku look more apelike only surpassed by SSJ4
I sort of like SSJGOD but SSJGODSSJ BLUE is just lame and lazy imo
What can be done is retconning the current form as “incomplete” SSJ3. The “complete” version having eyebrows, as well as a number of abilities not found in the later transformations. Like, as said in the vid, regeneration suppression, or ignore defense. That or a kaioken-like utility since Super Saiyan can’t use kaioken. With a maximum multiplier of 20.
Super Saiyan 3 is a really good form, I wish they would use it in a clever way in the anime.
All they have to do is train in the form and it will become more stable, I don't believe there is any form that can't be mastered.
@@hyperrunner8531 Well said, the both of you!
Hyperrunner finally someone smart
My take for super saiyan 3 :
First off , strength / durability differences :
This version be 200x stronger than the super saiyan 2 , the incredible strength makes it to be much more defensive and the durability increases abnormally , this is more of a defensive / kind of balanced form , sheer strength along with sheer durability , and to point out a siayan body cant handle this very easily , so the hair gets much heavier and stickier , not really that fluffy , and also adds weight , but the cool part is its much more sharper and pointer than the other super saiyan hair(s)
2nd , speed differences :
This is highly expected to be a very slow form , but now its my take , it is indeed slow , but not too slow , its only a bit slower than ssj2 , but overall , theres nothing really to it , the slowness can be cured by breaking out of the extreme weight and loosening the body to extreme forms that i will later inform you about.
3rd , Ki control :
Ki control is a bit confusing , it makes you feel heavy on the inside and outside , and then it makes your ki much more stronger , maybe even stronger than the super saiyan god form's ki , but the thing is it makes the ki blasts a bit slower , this can be loosened by sheer strength and will.
4th , and the last , secondary forms , of this form :
Now similar to super saiyan 4 how it can have a limit breaker full power form , this is the same like that , and to do this you can break out of it with increasing your ki with much more focus and extreme boosts so when one feels extremely overwhelmed by the power , they must continue and the continuation results in loosening and then finally shattering the air and the aura to then explode into a form with the hair being the complete same but evolved into a lighter and extremely fluffy and loosen hair but with an ultra instinct type yellow glowy outline / ultra instinct but yellow aura , with lightning appearing so frequent the eyes turns fully into a glowy light neon blue sort of like thor , and a japanese "S" symbol on the top of the head , meaning u broke ur limiter , kind of like the omni god limit breaker form in the OG anime war , but its yellow and extremely glowy , and then thats basically it , the 2 variants of my take on ssj3
Forms :
Super saiyan 3. ( extremely strong but lacks in speed )
Super saiyan 3 Limit breaker. ( extremely fast and also extremely strong )
Just make SSJ3 blue, and make it being an hyper offensive form where you can't dodge much, then give it to vegeta, so the vegeta can pull off the old trope of "distract him for 5 minutes while i charge up my super hyper mega final ultimate flash"
I’ll be honest I thought for the longest that trunks still had super saiyan and hadn’t learned how to go ssj2 until the end of the goku black arc
Keep the build up to and transformation but nix the design and problems with it for ssj 4. You know, the only good thing to come out of GT besides ssj 4 Gogeta.
@Jeffrey Scott The tail and ape thing were meant to combine all aspects of Dragon ball new and old at the time I guess, as its kinda cool that the transformation acknowledges that saiyans are just super apes, also him turning into an adult is a by product of the ape transformation that happens in the middle as even on kid form they turn to full blown great apes, so they grow then shrink back, in a way it shows that turning SS4 will always turn you into your prime no matter the age
How to fix it
-Goku teaches Caulifla how to do SSJ3 and after a while she learns the form
-Now to make it useful and important
Caulifla masters it where it doesn’t drain your stamina BUT wait how can Caulifla master the form when Goku couldn’t
“Universe 6 Saiyans Evolved differently than U7 Saiyans”
i've always loved ssj3 since the first time i saw it, though i recognised its limitations and "90s exaggerations" from the start. i thought it would be eventually mastered as were ssj1 and 2, but hey, toriyama xD
worth adding here, perhaps one of the only original move by goku, the "dragon fist explosion" ( 龍拳爆発 - Ryūken Bakuhatsu) was awesome to younger me's eyes back when i saw it with all the majesty of the ssj3's mane lol
*beerus/god ki enters the chat*
*SSJ 3 left the chat*
Such a shame
One thing I never understood about the Xeno characters and Cumber is that they can go SSJ3 without needing SSJ2
I think they can go Super Saiyan 2, but no cards were ever made in Super Dragon Ball Heroes.
its more like they can quickly skip it, so they go 2 and then beyond quickly.
How would Cabba, Caulifla and Kale grow in terms of power & personality if they trained with Vegeta, Goku and Gohan.
You can combine both their anime and manga counterparts and take the best from both parties involved.
This is my first MasakoX video. He is really good at changing his voice for goku.
I would have been so happy if the discussion ended with that opening bit and the rest of the video was just a black screen.
But Masako, if it had eyebrows how would you tell Goku from his SSJ brother in RnR?
I find SSJ3 the coolest form of all time.
I love the long hair that creates a very sharp and large silhouette that is very intimidating. I like how it deforms Goku's face because it's like "This form is so incomprehensibly powerful that it shouldn't exist and it deforms Goku's body for obtaining it"
It makes it feel so legendary. I feel they nerfed it afterwards because it was strong enough to stop Buu which is insane. If they didn't nerf it hard as they did, it should've opposed Beerus.
I read this as "What if we FLEXED super saiyan 3"
If I could change SSJ3, I would make it so the form could only be accessed through training with a Kaioshin and make it somewhat "mystical" by adding a potara earing to it, thought it wouldn't be like Gohans Ultimate form. To make SSJ3 look even cooler, I would bring back the golden tail from the early sketch but also make the tail twice larger in length and girth so it wraps around Goku's waist like a belt. This, mystical SSJ3 would go well with Spirit-attack techniques too
It's use as a Kaioken stand in and for most single strike and beam attacks is how Dragon Ball Multiverse uses the form. People have their issues with that webcomic, but at least they picked their rules and stuck with them throughout.
Each SSJ variant should have a niche
SSJ1 is the most efficient form. In a protracted fight, you should be using it.
SSJ2 should be the best all-rounder form. Its stamina usage is fine and its power is better than 1. If you're fighting an enemy and they're kind of an unknown, you use 2. Also, make SSJ2 Vegeta, Goku, and Trunks more distinct. Maybe make it so that their hair is the same as their Grade 3 forms. SSJ Grade 3 Goku can easily be told apart from an extra buff Mastered SSJ Goku.
SSJ3 should be a blaster form that specializes in quick finishes. It's draining, but it allows you to much more easily and efficiently ki into raw energy attacks. A SSJ3 Kamehameha hits much harder than a Kamehameha from a SSJ 1 that is eight times stronger at base. 3 can just better use that available Ki.
Meanwhile, SSJ4 is the opposite, focusing on condensing the physical strength of the Ozaru into a smaller package, making it a bruiser. Its ki attacks actually don't hit quite like SSJ3, despite technically having more ki power being available to the user. All of that goes to mobility and sheer power. If you want to batter down an enemy's defenses, or they can nullify energy attacks, SSJ4 is the way to go.
God Ki forms in general will be much better for fighting enemies that also have God Ki, and SSJ God won't actually be very useful against mortals. It's still stronger than base, but not as much as SSJ. It's really just opening the gates to let you fight beings that have god ki. God would be a more energy efficient form, and its slim physique would give it the benefit of agility. Basically, if you're fighting Future Zamasu, use God.
Blue would have much better power output, but is a bit slower and more draining, better for finishing off an opponent.
Blue Evolution, for once, could be a straight upgrade. Goku gets Blue Kaioken, so Vegeta gets Blue Evolution. Its power output isn't as high as Blue Kaioken, but Blue Kaioken is still Kaioken.
After learning of manga/animation producers insane work hours and lack of self care I understand how he can start loosing his memory.
after watching your video, there are a ton of things that could change or improve ...
1- Broly's next remake could make him a super Saiyan 3, but with his white eyes (no pupils), he is the first to achieve it, and probably the only Saiyan who can maintain it indefinetly because his power *IS RISING, OVERWHELMING*
- your mention of energy based melee attacks, I think something like the Susano from Narutu Shippuden, or the green ring energy from Green Lantern etc...... as in making objects from your energy and hitting people with it, would be ideal for your version of ssj3.
- energy residual burner, an energy technique that infuse your fists ir ki attacks with anti biological regeneration energy, would be amazing against Cell and Piccolo, but not Buu.
- Super energy residual burner, same as before, but cancels magical regenration as well.
- anti-magic ki, will hit the magic out of your magician target, each hit blows away a good chunk of his magical reserves, would be great against Moro or Buu.
- God ki and forms should be downgraded to ssj2 level or a bit below, I mean ssj blue is ssj1 + god ki, so going ssj2 or ssj3 while having that ki should be stronger.
what do you think ?
Talking about tails, what if Kami didn’t remove Goku’s tail and therefore all Saiyan tails, except Vegeta’s, remain attached, so the power of the Super Saiyan forms are easier to control.
The best way I've ever seen Super Saiyan used was in Dragonball FighterZ, where Goku uses it for a quick Super Combo to deal a lot of damage quickly, then revert back to Super Saiyan.
Ideally, a good strategy could be to lure in your opponent and whittle down your opponent's stamina, then finish the opponent off with Super Saiyan 3
Perhaps there are other versions of the form, similar to SSJ grades.
Also "super-dee-duper saiyan"
I can't be the only one who thinks the eybrows being absent is fine surely?
You're not; I like the more primal look that gives off
I dunno if I remember correctly but I thought the glare in GT meant goku moved so fast he was able to clock OS in the face and he just couldn’t see it showing how much faster he was?
You know something else about three I would shorten the hair you can still have a somewhat longer mullet but three as it is basically is just asking to be grabbed or get caught on something or get blown into the face (you can see Masako thought of this too maybe not for three but for Raditz the hairband he wears in his what ifs and r&r is meant to keep his hair out of his face)
For as cool and iconic as Goku's first SSJ3 transformation is, it is a sin against humanity that its first appearance was just to be a decoy for Fat Buu and Babidi to buy time so Trunks could retrieve the Dragon Radar.
I don't have a problem with Super Saiyan 3. IMO, it's Super Saiyan 2 that needs fixed. At a glance, the only way to tell the difference between Super Saiyan 1 and 2 is the lightning, and that's not even consistently present. With Super Saiyan 3, God, Blue, and Blue Evolution, the differences are immediately apparent.
I like plagueofgripes theory that no one actually ever got any stronger after master roshi blew up the moon.
Purpleboye_ How do you back that up? Considering all of the feats later on in the series
@@jmac28211 Destroying the earth isnt physically that much more significant than the moon. Destroying the universe or multiverse isn't really narratively more significant than destroying the earth.
His point was less that people didn't get stronger, but that it never felt like this was the case because we were just told they were, and shown that the dude that gave them trouble before was pretty much fodder now. But beyond that... nothing ever really indicated this actual increase.
In short, nothing ever really looked much different.
every time you mention how he forgot about ss2 i think of that gohan vs cell episode wich is a fan favorite and a turning moment for DBZ , and the damn episode was centered on gohan ss2 !!!!!
I've always understood it as you said, that SS3 cannot be achieved through any normal means. Training during death, a fusion, it's an unnatural extension of the Super Saiyan form.
My solution is more a headcanon, really. "What if SSJ3 is really just an imperfect SSJ2 grade, and Goku never realized it?" And then you got the potential of "what does SSJ2 perfect grade look like, and what does true SSJ3 look like?"
Here's another idea for a what if. What if there was an arc that has ACTUAL character development instead of putting in a new villain every single, repetitive arc?
Toriyama:"Super Sayan 3 was supposed to be a joke due to overcomplicated design!"
Dragonball GT: " Hold my beer!!!".
Super Saiyan 3 should have those finger gun ki utilizations that I think super Saiyan 4 Goku and super Saiyan 4 gogeta had. It'd be funny to watch a long power up followed by finger guns. But those finger gun blasts should be strong enough to blow up a planet
Ooooo, what if super saiyan 3 was using your full ki in order to push your full physical limits thusly severally limiting ones use of ki projectiles. Maybe they can on only punch and use ki blades and sheilds.
Don’t forget the very slight hair change from SSJ and SSJ2.
This may no be a popular opinion/solution but here goes.
Use everything we know of ssj3 and how it should be fixed and apply it to gohan (or even goten for that matter). If dragonball were to ever get yet another season (my ideas on what that should be based on is a different but equally interesting topic), they could have gohan going about with his martial arts training and reachieving his old powers. This would be a proper setup to allow gohan to achieve a ssj3 ability.
However!
Gohan, doing most of his training these days with the kais (or some equal or more appropriate alternative) combined with his great intellect could be used to come across a proper, more refined, and “true” form of ssj3. We have seen “prototype” forms before in the case of goku and gohan near the mid point of cell saga stuck in what is now called ssj stage 4 where they could not revert back to base form. Another example is clearly stated in goku black arc when trunks returns and spars with his dad using an out of date ssj2 form.
Knowing akira, (if he really cared or had the thoughts to do it) he could have gohan achieve a true ssj3 form and write off the form goku and vegeta had obtained as “prototype” forms. It would fall in place easy enough as gaining new levels of ssj seems to follow a “guess and check” method and gohan, being as smart as he is, had found the correct way to employ the ssj3 form.
I read in the comments that ssj3 should be specific evolutions depending on the person and the fighting style. So we can keep this in play, but lets cover our tracks real quick. What was wrong with goku and vegetas forms? You could say that they tried to maximize the form to its entirety and give huge increases to everything (evolving everything basically), which causes a honeycomb or degrading effect on the overall power of the form instead, but was not noticable to goku (cause hes not that smart) or vegeta (as he never used it to fight and maybe has only done it once just to say he did it).
This is a perfect way to bring ssj3 back into a useful and unique standard should another season of dragonball come into existence. By allowing gohan to achieve a perfected form of ssj3 and only “evolving” the stats that best suit his personal fighting style as mentioned in another popular comment. It would not be a stretch then to say gohan could hold his own and be part of the main fights in the next season with these changes. (This could all easily apply to the likes of goten but it works so much better with gohan). A further tease would be later in the season gohan could teach gotenks how to achieve this perfected form as well!
So what would gohans ssj3 form be evolved around? I would like to hear from you guys.
Buu Saga did cram a bunch of new stuff that didn't go anywhere really that would have been cool concepts if maybe spread out
Having SSJ3 make Goku look less like a neanderthal with those absent eyebrows
He's supposed to look like a partly transformed ape, because ya know, Saiyans have the ability to turn into apes.
The only thing that can supass my hate for DBS's transformations is Masako hate for SSJ3...
If anything, I've always felt that SSJ Blue is pretty much SSJ3 actually realized. They both pretty much have the same stamina draining, except Blue doesn't drain as much while keeping the overpowered and intimidation factor (and less hair).
Dude Super saiyan 3 was legit. Yeah it had its stamina issues among others but it's still awesome
I never understood how Goku could fight in this form without getting his hair caught or pulled.
I like the concept of the Ki Punch Projectiles, but I'd not attach them to a fixed SSJ3. I'd fix SSJ3 something like this:
.
1) SSJ3 only has a massive stamina drain when you first unlock it. With enough training to master the form, the stamina drain decreases. Now I'm not Saiyan it should go away completely with full mastery, but it should be minimized to where it doesn't make it a disadvantage to use the form unless you stayed in the form much longer than a single battle would require like maybe something in the vicinity of 24 hours.2) Upon taking damage in the form, the stamina drain increases a small amount though bigger with increased severity of the damage.
3) Using the form dramatically increase your PL, speed, reflexes, durability, etc (your overall combat stats), but comes with the huge downside that when you power down, you cannot manipulate your Ki for a minimum duration of 1 hour. This therefore means that while you will be far more powerful when you use the form, you will be unable to defend yourself OR help your allies in the battle for a period of at least 1 hour. Now this is different than running out of Ki; no this is being unable to use your Ki period including for things like flight, surpassing normal human capabilities, Ki attacks, and even Ki Sense (no detecting energy signatures of anyone friend or foe). This wouldn't be a situation that a Senzu Bean would even be capable of allowing you to recover from since a Senzu Bean heals injuries, restores your Ki to the full extent of your PL, and allows you to not need to eat for 10 days (though this seems to not necessarily apply to Saiyans &/or those with massive PLs; at least the duration seems to be lessened to a greater extent proportional to how high your PL).
Still easily my most favorite form. Sometimes you just need to indulge in a little bit of excess.
SS3 may be irrelevant today but that first transformation will always be badass and he gave buu a run for his zenny
My favorite SSJ form is a tie between SSJ and SSJ2
A pre roll, 4 mid roll and an end credit add. You are why add block was created
"Can you imagine an attack that attacks both the body and spirit?" I created one years ago and it's only to be used by my created character in my created universe as a last resort finishing move.
But I could see SS3 work like how you describe it.
10:10 That there is what is wrong with DragonBall overall. The focus is on the characters just getting stronger. But there should be a component where the characters gain or swap out powers. Every new form should be very different. This would also make Super Saiyan god more interesting if said forms were "stranger not stronger".
The funniest part of Goku vs. Jiren was when Goku completely skipped over SSJ3 when he was scaling Jiren's strength.
"1, 2, thre-... AH SCREW IT I'M GOING GOD."
Hey Masako, just had an idea, what if Goku took up Kami on his offer to become Earth's guardian after beating Piccolo Junior? He would still marry Chi-chi or Bulma or Launch or even Annin (from the filler I think she was Enma's niece), whichever you think would legitimately be with Goku and live up on the lookout completely removed from society for the most part and be okay with it. Also what if Goku and Raditz were hybrids (preferably 1/2 Saiyan 1/2 Tuffle)?
I would make super sayian 3 UNGODLY powerful, like, ssbe. But have it be WAY too taxing on the body, so you can only use it for like 5 seconds without dieing.
We could make the form more ridiculous by making it make Saiyan eyelashes and eyebrows just as ridiculously long as the hair, perhaps if the form isn't properly activated.
If goku ever mastered it...It would be fixed but goku didn't...even in 5 years of training...
Maybe goku could use God ki in ss3 form. It could reduce the stamina drain
@@JoshuaWilkesR maybe but he could easily use the god form or ssjb form they drain less stamina
SS3 is fine the way it is and for what it was back when it was the Pinnacle of Saiyan power. The he only "problem" is that it's been outclassed by God and Blue.
In that way it's much like how Kaioken got outclassed and fell by the wayside back when Goku discovered the original SS1.
Dragon Ball Heroes pretty much adores SSJ3. Just about every Saiyan and hybrid under the sun has achieved it now and in the case of Nappa and Raditz, it’s their first super Saiyan transformation.
I feel sorry for your lungs screaming all the time in dbza
I like your idea but I also had another thought on this. How about super Saiyan 3 1st stage is the ki draining one we know but with practice the body gets stronger like Goku and Gohan did during the Cell saga. Once mastered it would be on the borderline of Super Saiyan god. I always felt that if Goku and Gotenks just walked around and train in that form the base form would get stronger as well. It would also help with Super Saiyan blue.
Of course it is my favourite! It's the dopest form till now!
I think SSJ3 was fine in Z, it has some of the greatest fights in the later parts of Z and was an absolute joy to watch in the movies and when goku fought fat buu and kid buu. It served as an solution Goku could pull out when he needed firepower, it didn't really need to be anything special beyond that.
I think SSJ3 suffers from being introduced in the most convoluted arc the story has ever seen. and then having to compete with real life reasons. Battle of Gods was the return of dragonball after a huge hiatus, Akira wanted to wow everyone with SSG. Ever since then things have focussed around god ki and SSG based transformations, and eventually ultra instinct. base super saiyan is simply too iconic not to use and had the added benefit of not consuming that much energy so it could easily be used as a inbetween when goku wanted to conserve energy but still fight at a higher level than base.
I don't think its impossible we'll eventually maybe see like SSB2 and SSB3 or something.
It's certainly an underrated form, and I really wish it was given more love these days, it's absolutely one of my most favorite transformations. It really does scream pure 90's energy, lol.
what if goku went ssjb as a kid
Headband Cj XD
I prefer the eyebrows to stay the same. It would be a good way to identify someone like Nappa or Raditz in the form