Yes it's possible! Married for 23 years now! I would like to share the 7 conditions for a lasting relationship (from NLP): 1. transparent and open communication 2. safety in the relationship 3. psychological independeny 4. support in personal develpment 5. being aware of each other's history 6. balance in giving and receiving 7. being able to set healthy boundaries and make your own choices You can always grow in your relation if you are aware of these topics and both are willing to talk and work on it.
All are very good examples, personally #5 is one that stands out to me. Most of my friends are people i've known for 20-23 of my 27 years, i know everything about them, I know their history, there's no surprises. In relationships though, you typically don't know someones history, their past, how they became the person they are today and it can really throw me off at times. Particularly, when I find out something about my partner that is maybe said in passing without a second thought by them it can completely shatter my perception of the person. It's not always a bad thing but there's times where it just completely throws me off balance and it feels like I have to readjust my perception of them. For me I think that's been one of the biggest struggles in relationships for me and I'm not entirely sure how to overcome it.
Hi beeman, I did make this respons to you and than I tryed to move it and now I lost the comment :( (I'm not so good at this) Maybe it is in your mailbox? Otherwise I’ll try again. Let me know! Sorry..
This is amazing advice. I’m taking a screenshot of this list. To find a safe person with whom I experience #5 would be incredible. I am finally ready. To say “I love you” you have to know who the “I” is. I know who I am now, which also means I know what I require, desire, and prefer. I also I love me enough not to enter into a relationship that doesn’t allow me to express myself authentically and doesn’t allow me to get to know someone else equally as deeply. I want to be “naked and not afraid” with my beloved and vice versa. I have to be real. Being inauthentic is exhausting.
Vulnerability is the key. Vulnerability attracts honesty. Honesty and authenticity aligns soul connections. Soul connections feel like home. You can’t love them if you are afraid of losing them. That’s not love, that’s fear. Often one mistakes trauma bonding and their attachment style as love. In truth, their entire relationship is based off the lack of the love for individuality and freedom of self, and instead based off fear. Make deep connections, not attachments. Excellent video! Absolutely love this topic with clients. Gets their mind thinking outside the structured box we are conditioned to believe is truth for all, instead of feeling into what is true to you.
Listening to you is giving me some little hope that there are still people that value authenticity in relationship. I wish it would be easier to find such people. Thanks Clay :)
Just the other day I thought about how absurd our wedding vows. There is not a word about how we are going to build our relationship. The main thing is to stay together….
@9 minutes, I agree, it's NOT suppose to be hard, it's suppose to be curious, anticipatory, enjoyable, maybe challenging but not hard, rather comforting, welcoming and much more.
I feel the same way. Hard though to find that deep emotional connection with some-one. Especially in a masculine driven world where showing vunerability is perceived to be a sign of weakness.
I love this video! As an INFJ who films weddings, I think about this topic a lot and what makes a good marriage or a good match romantically. Ironically my partner and I are business partners in this industry and best friends as well (He tests as INFP). When we first got together I constantly questioned whether or not it was supposed to be this easy because it was unfamiliar to me but 1.5 years later and it still is. I think we have a deep understanding for each other while also sharing so many likes and dislikes which makes things easy. We spend almost 24/7 together as we work side by side in our studio and out on shoots and we still never seem to grow tired of each others company. It's not all butterflies and heart racing passion filled moments all the time, but when I look at him I feel like I'm home and safe to be myself. We're individuals with our own freedoms but we chose to be a team. I feel like this type of partnership is ideal but I'm sure I'm also biased 😂 thank you for openly sharing your thoughts on this!
Thanks for being vulnerable with us, Clay... and mirroring back that thoughtful INFJ idealism. It’s really hard to feel our own feels thanks to Fe being so focused on making sure everyone else is alright with what’s happening. You’re doing good just by being yourself, and risking it not being popular: just. Real. 😊
I love what you said about freedom in relationships. It is not easy, but I would always want someone to be operating from their core desires and not based on rules I have set for them or restrictions. So in allowing that freedom, the relationship can be more organic in how we grow to know each other and work together. But yeah, I am so glad you have been sharing your thoughts on this stuff. I have shared a lot of very similar ideas to this and your other videos on my channel as well, so this is validating. I hope we can really help people change their perspective on relationships and how to have healthier ones.
Up until now I had some long-term relationships that never quite had an actual emotional intimacy. But now, as an INFJ with an INFP partner, things are different. We are openly share, argue, agree and disagree, give each other the freedom to pursue ourselves as individuals. He never gets in my way of wanting and doing something, I never try to change him or manipulate him. We challenge each other everyday. I believe that each one of us deserve to have a solid and healthy relationship. Regarding the "5 pillars of relationship", we are lucky enough to have 5/5. It's crazy that I've settled for less before, just because I couldn't believe such relationship really exists. I also agree about having controversial views about the nature of love. I've made a lot of people uncomfortable with the way I think (and not only about that topic, lol). To be honest, I'm glad that I'm an INFJ. It took me long enough to be grateful for the gifts we as a community of INFJ's share, each from his own perspective. You are such a wonderful person, Clay. Keep sharing yourself :)
I agree completely with everything you've said! But I don't know if we can experience the kind of "effortless" romantic love you describe until we have developed that kind of relationship within. People are looking to be rescued from themselves, instead of offering a healed heart for the "other" to enjoy and explore!
Staying in a dead relationship that satisfies other people’s expectations dishonors ourselves and robs the world of who we really are . Granted there are repercussions for movement- children split between two homes, death of an idealized future. But changing course when things are stagnant or destructive is courageous. Honoring ourselves is not for the weak.
Good to see that other INFJs have the same opinion across the board. I know it works for many but I can't get married or have children out of practicality. Some people are not intentional about their lives at all. I wonder if my all or nothing complex sometimes creates more harm than good. I often feel conflicted but I'm really trying in my current relationship. We're best friends but it's not without issues I'm afraid. It's so easy on most levels but on the ones there are problems, darn, it's very difficult and I don't know if I'd be able to compromise for much longer than I've already had.
Gah...you continue to speak the exact things I think and say. I’m blown away that another human could think exactly the same way I do about love and relationships. I’ve always said that a committed partnership seems better (in a sense of being more loving) than marriage because that person is consciously “choosing” you every day. They have the complete freedom to leave at any moment, yet they stay because, like you said, they just love being with you...just like choosing to have a best friend for your whole life. When people get married, it seems they end up feeling “stuck” and remain in unhealthy marriages/relationships because it’s just too hard or complicated to divorce. This legal contract of marriage makes things so much more sticky. I know this from experience because I stayed married for 21 years and over half of those years I only stayed because of the kids and the complex issue of custody etc. I couldn’t say it better than you did. I just can’t think staying married just to not be divorced is the goal. You aren’t successful just because you stay married. You are successful when you love someone unconditionally and allow them complete freedom every day. Also...you are so right about vulnerability. It’s the foundation of intimacy.😍❤️. Thank you for your videos. I’m an ENFP in love with INFJ’s because I just feel sooo connected in the way we think about life.
Great video Clay. You encouraged me to start a business btw but that is off topic haha. I highly suggest the book No More Mr. Nice Guy by Robert Glover. Especially for INFJ men and their partners. I went through a relationship recently where I lost control of who I am as an individual. It was my fault for not setting boundaries. My ex and I constantly hung out and did everything together. This thwarted her personal growth and mine also. It was bothering me more than her though because I think in her eyes she wanted to have a sense of control that I'd stay with her. Subconsciously she felt she was protecting me by being with me all the time. I lost my sense of self and my essence as a man. I could not think for myself anymore. It led to being sad and frustrated. I stayed quiet about it and built up an inner dark rage that I kept to myself and never expressed. I ended up talking another women via text and that's when she found out and she broke up. I am the villain in this scenario for many reasons. I have learned so much from this experience. I don't think I can get her back anymore but people PLEASE start living for yourself love is about wanting the other person to be the best version of THEM and not being with them to feel like you're there and end up not focusing on your growth. As clay said, Love is like the wind. You can not capture it in a jar but you can let it guide you and take you to larger gusts of wind. The wind representing the self. Do not cage yourself in a jar for anyone. Set boundaries. Be you. Love others through example. Know what you want in a partner.
Heavy topic for me. Most failed relationships for me have been about declining strange and demented invitations to step inside some tiny little box someone has arranged for me in their life. How do people delude themselves into thinking that's love or friendship? No thank you. Yet, I remember with each lost relationship what it felt like to love, that I was capable of that feeling. That gives me hope someone out there could reciprocate that wonderful feeling of understanding someone, yet always wanting to learn more.
Love your thoughts 😊 For myself- genuine love is adding to someone’s life. Not taking away from, not filling something that’s missing, not owning, etc...
Hey Clay, this is my take on a part of this subject. Hope you see my meaning. When I hear people say they love someone. it's silently insinuated that they also like them. And I find that there's a stark difference between liking and loving someone. To like some one is to act in kind, to act similar and share an aligned mannerism that mimics their behavior and thoughts. If someone walks into a social event and looks around the room for a familiar face, when they find them the person responds in kind and shows equal interest to be at the same event; they show they like each other. Or, when there's a contrasting behavior such as you come home and find an empty jug of juice left on the counter or dirty dishes in the sink. The person who dislikes that cleans it up instead of being appreciative or ignorant of it. To love someone is best described by Paul the Apostle, "Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth." And while he states that love is kind, he's saying that to love someone is to share their interests and values. My definition of love is, "To preserve all that it is; good, bad and indifferent." When we have a pet that misbehaves and barks or scratches at things, we love them and mildly correct their behavior in preservation to who their character is. Even though we may not like the characteristic, we permit it to a tolerable degree; we preserve and care for who they are. Just as if we love a car, house or object of affection. We do everything we can not to tarnish its original value and try our best to preserve its original state. That is how I see and understand the difference between love and like. "Love" the content by the way; please keep making more 🙏
I felt all of that. I’m not even sure sometimes anymore wether I want to be with anyone. In the past i was always the one bending over backwards and I feel like in today’s society there’s this unhealthy window shopping mentality where someone doesn’t choose you they just keep you controlled and/or attached but put in no effort for anything that has that balanced give and take Fundation. And Even expectations have such a grey area for me, because not having them is also an expectation so ultimately unless someone has an understanding that it’s a two way street on their own terms chances are you are in constant limbo. In fact id even go so far to say that nowadays you doing nice things are used as ammunition...how often I have heard “no one asked you to do this” or “it’s your own fault for being so nice and hoping that I’d return the favor but I’m grateful” when the whole statement is neither grateful nor appreciative or respectful. This happens so often that I’m scared to even put myself out there anymore. A relationship really isn’t that hard as long as u have a I water You and u water me mentality so both can grow - Individually and as a team. People are so broken it’s sad. I’m rather alone than having someone that doesn’t invest in me as I do for them, and then I also have no desire to hold the friendship because to me that’s disrespecting the entire connection.
Big big thank you for this video. I am a young infj so I feel like I have no damn opinion about things or that I feel how things are supposed to be but I can't quite translate it into words yet. I go to your channel and everything resonates with me. I appreciate your thoughts and I'm so happy I have this opportunity to learn from you 💛 I just started a relationship and it is unbelievable that I found a person who agrees on my attitude to love. So so so happy :)
I had a patch last year where understanding the nature of love obsessed me. I read everything I could about it, and I was fascinated by the Greek concept of eros. Love ties in to grief, body connectivity, spirituality, and so many other things. I was seeing the same thing you are, these half hearted relationships all around us, people settling for no intimacy. I'm forging ahead throwing convention to the wind now, love is how I define it. It's as individual as snowflakes, we're all on our own path with love if we're willing to give up control and follow where it's taking us. We only feel love as deeply as we let ourselves feel grief, something I finally learned when my grief work became unavoidable. My feelings started going to depths I didn't know existed in me and it's both terrifying and exhilarating. I hope more people start to see love like you do, we'd be so much more content in the long run.
I think vulnerability is the key not only in romantic relationships, but most relationships...friendship, work, ourself, etc. I know as an unfortunate, but recovering self-proclaimed perfectionist + people pleaser, I have always been quick to make sure others were happy and thus often times would be miserable myself, which seeped into the relationship. I feared being vulnerable, and potentially proven unworthy, so I would be untruthful to appease the person. Or with new relationships, I allowed myself to fail ahead of time (aka, not even give it a try) in order to avoid future failure. Silly, right? Being vulnerable allows you to to give and receive without judgement. With vulnerability there is less fear of shame and more of the honesty in which you speak of. :) If you haven't listened or read Brené Brown on this topic already, I highly recommend it! :)
If there is truth there will be freedom in relationships... most people are unfortunately coming from ego today, hence relationships seldom lasts... ego wants, needs, clings.. anything but freedom. Much appreciated videos, have listened first time all afternoon to you Clay, it has literally saved my day as I’m going through my own transformation, sober 10 months myself, but my x is deep in the bottle.. as an INFJ, I’m struggling and have been all my adult life with being codependent too, not just my own addiction. Becoming sober was the easy part. The hard work is diving deep to really understand who I am, and why “people don’t get me”, and why I certainly have had many days not understanding myself, to say the least... having 4 children, childbirth is so painful, but this is similar, not for the fainted hearted. Wish me luck, as I’m feeling quite lonely and alone at the time. Thank heavens someone like you can mirror me to the teeth, it all seems worth while knowing we are Not alone. Even my pain body is dormant right now. What a blessing to find likeminded human beings🙏
Wow!! The last 30 mins seemed like I am talking to myself. I totally agree with whatever you said. Even I too had this feeling and I was also feeling lost in my relationship when my partner wasn't emotionally invested, when I decided to break up. The main things we INFJs look for is Being Authentic as well as Vulnerable, expressing what we stand for and believing in the concept of putting the other first in order to achieve an infinite blossoming relationship. The problem with others is that they tend to fail while doing this, because they feel insecure to reach a state of vulnerability. That's why the society has put up some BS rules so that marriages will always revolve within the so called safe limits. But doing this, they will never tend to realize themselves, the true nature of love and the best side of being in a relationship. Thanks a lot Clay for throwing light on this.
YES. Thank you so much for this video Clay. It has really helped me gain so much needed clarity at the current relationship stage I am in. You have such a magnificent ability to translate thoughts to words. Much love as always
To be able to freely talk about what I’ve been through in my life without the fear of being judged. And yes, being completely joined spiritually and emotionally but completely free at the same time. I love it. I wish I could find that. ❤️
Hey Clay, ENxP female here, could listen to you all day and would love to talk about relationships and all the deep thoughts you bring up in other videos with you. I also feel that a lot of people avoid such topics and it frustrates me. After two very long relationships (ESFJ 4yrs, ESTJ 10yrs) I'm with an INFJ now and for the first time I have someone to talk to and also don't feel bored to listen for hours and hours. He and his thoughts are very interesting. I think he is the love of my life. Keep the good content coming!
So needed this message right now. Leaving a 13 year marriage. Narcissistic, controlling, with a huge age gap. Should’ve know better, but was young and scared to be alone. Now is time to take care of me.
From one INFJ to another, I found this video VERY insightful. I struggle with the concept allowing the other person to be "free". I don't know if it's a societal construct to want to almost "own" something/someone you love and feel jealousy as if they were an inanimate object. What I am taking from this video is the concept of mutually putting each other's interest first & granting them freedom. Thanks for sharing as always.
Hey, I would like to say something sort of intended as a thankyou. I found your channel at a time in my life that I think I really needed it in. I'm going through a sort of separation, myself. We're not married, but we were engaged and now have a baby together. While I know for a fact that she isn't currently trying to find meaning in this situation like I am, rather focusing more of her energy on grieving, I myself have received a significant amount of value from these discussions. I was going through a period of time where I felt like I was using every ounce of energy I had to keep the relationship together, but the problem was, I was the only one trying. We had an argument one day that started because I was trying to exercise a bit of freedom to go and indulge in an activity that I hadn't for a while and was frankly starting to miss. She had this handle on me, she had to negotiate with me to try and align my activities with her wants. That made me feel unappreciated and trapped, so I told her that I didn't understand why she couldn't just let me do something as simple as take some time for myself to do something I enjoyed so that I could recharge. Now she did this often, but she used the baby, almost as a weapon, a form of guilt-based manipulation. She was basically trying to tell me that I'm not a good father, and I think she intentionally chose this argument because she knows how much I value our daughter. I honestly felt so hurt by this, so discarded and misunderstood that it really just took everything I had left in me out. I suddenly was able to share my true feelings with her and express how hurt and betrayed I felt. I laid into her and almost cursed her for taking so much of my life from me. I was furious and I was expressing every bit of what I'd been holding back for so long in the hopes that the situation could be saved. So I left the house, I began thinking about my life, about our argument, about what I was going to do about this situation that I now had to deal with. She was back at the house packing my things and when she was finished, she called me and told me to come back and grab my belongings. In the brief amount of time I spent away, I was able to think clearly for the first time in what seems like my entire life. I was not going to waste the time I had left. I came up with a plan to go back home to Phoenix, go back to my friends and my hobbies, all of the things I had loved before my love for her ever outweighed any of it and I made a promise to myself that I would never give any of it up for anyone. This is my life, these are my friends, this is where my heart is. Or at least a majority of it, because I still have a daughter out there that's going to need her father, and I'll be damned if I won't do everything in my power to be the best father I can even if I have to spend the majority of the time doing it from a distance. I owe my daughter that much after all. But the real reason I had the strength and the emotional intelligence to survive this situation is because I had wise, caring people I could rely on; My friend, Nick, my sister Alyssa, and you with your insights and wisdom have all helped me make the closest to what I believe is the right decision, and while we're experiencing the growing pains that come with it, I feel like this is only a catalyst for things to improve, cause at the end of the day, that's all we can really hope for.
@@katlegomolokwane1611 It sure is Katlego, most people in SA don't do MBTI, I myself don't know any, you would be the 1st . You can communicate with me at: lifecoach8304@gmail.com
Freedom to choose each other, and the ability to leave each other. Then you have to work to keep the love real. If you lose the way you like to live your life, then you stop likeing the other person. You will always love them, but that's when people break apart. You have nailed it again.
It's so similar view being an infj listening to another infj. It's like there are more people who think and live in a similar mindset. This video cleared so many thoughts in my mind. Thank you..
It’s all about ‘Quantity’ for most in society in almost all aspects of life while for INFJs it’s about ‘Quality’. That is why lengthy arranged marriages are considered as more successful by many.
I couldn't agree more about balanced compromise, emotional intimacy, ease, authenticity, expression of appreciation, and a "setting one another free" in a healthy relationship. Control definitely kills relationships and is a sign of narcissism. Taking one another for granted is never acceptable. I do not believe love should be difficult and if it is, there's something wrong. It should flow and grow.
I agree with you in general. I think my understanding of love/relationships is one of the areas I've most struggled in divergence with other people. the standards I place on emotional engagement tend to be uncomfortable for many others. for one thing, when I see signs of a problem, I can't ignore them. I think the most common limitation I encounter in others is defensiveness which perfectly exemplifies my view that the opposite of love is fear (I don't believe in hatred/evil but rather perceive it as the consequence of fear from ignorance and/or damage). I absolutely agree with your assertion that love should support freedom of self. I think most relationships inspire shame/fear in people because people aren't realistic about human nature or are too closed off to understanding it. I think one advantage of Ni is having an innate understanding of the whys behind behavior. I think I'm often more accepting of the things people fear about themselves then they are themselves 😆 but my point is that openness is essential for INFJs in relationships because we will perceive causes and it's best if they can be discussed and understood together with others. I think true love is the kind that provides the safety to explore and understand oneself, together. I absolutely think the biggest error people make is in taking others for granted. I've always made a real effort to keep perspective on the things others do for me and people have often sited that as something they appreciate most about me. my biggest flaw has been a degree of emotional detachment or uncertainty but I think that mostly comes down to a lack of Fi because I am still deeply invested in others with sentiment. I think Fe represented a serious obstacle to finding the right romantic relationship for a long time. one way MBTI has helped is in giving me perspective on the whole Fe/Fi thing and I'm now in a very fulfilling relationship with an ISFJ who experienced similar problems before as well. It's interesting because I was married to an INFP for years and his emotionally reactive Fi was actually really constraining for me (we are still friends because he's a wonderful person but romance became toxic for us). my current relationship is so freeing and he takes real responsibility for understanding me, which helps me grow as a person. I think the only way relationships should be hard is due to the effort of growth together and not within the emotional connection and compatibility. healing from past trauma is difficult, learning how to grow past it can be difficult and learning about oneself can be difficult but loving someone else really shouldn't be the difficult part ☺️ nice video
I think the thing with compromising on core character traits is a very interesting point. I assume it happens because most people start out their relationships with an egoistic mindset. They want the person around because they make them feel good. When these strong first crush emotions start to fade they see the real person...and tend not to like the actual core. One could argue that people are blinded by their egoism. This then goes hand in hand with a cultural problem which is the obsession with being loved rather than building on your capacity to love. With that comes the egoism of trying to get something out of love rather than truly loving which I think is more related to giving rather than getting. Furthermore we have a problem with narcissism that creates the stark focus on perfectionism. I think people are often not capable of loving because they think they deserve "the best" (and the other person is just not lovable enough in their eyes). The problem is that a lot of people don't realise that "the best" doesn't actually fit their core either. So you have this mismatch between what you think you deserve and what is actually suitable for you.
I would have a lot to say about a lot of things you talked about! But I’ll go only with this: vulnerability IS the key. It is the only way of truly connecting with another human being. There is a great ted talk by Brené Brown about this called The power of vulnerability. I really enjoy your videos by the way, keep up the good work 😊!
These are some really interesting thoughts. I don't know that I agree with your definition of love being merely emotional intimacy however. Like with Greek, there are several different words for love in Hebrew. There's a really interesting word-"chesed," which essentially means "loyal kindness." It's this idea of "I'm not going anywhere. I'm here for you and always will be." It's the Sam carrying Frodo the last few steps to Mount Doom. This is a deep friendship. But it's also a kind of commitment in a way, or a "contract" as you say. I think this is really important in a romantic relationship. Of course, there are unhealthy extremes where narcissistic folk take advantage of this. But the healthy version is something really beautiful and valuable. I think this is what the idea of marriage is getting at. And from that root, there can grow some really beautiful things.
Very well done, Clay! 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻 So true! So many things you said jumped out at me in your video. Many of them I have had similar thoughts, but have not yet ran across someone else with similar viewpoints. So you really hit a lot of things accurately that I believe in. I believe local culture has a lot to do with the modeling of romantic relationships, as you mentioned. I lived 35 years on the west coast of the USA, now in the southeast USA. There are major differences in those two regions. I have seen more honest and happy romantic relationships in California, vs here in the Deep South. Here, there are culture and religious-determined "Obligations" and "Blind Conformity" that exist here. I can see the falseness in some of the relationships here. Also, you get divorced here and you can easily get a "shame" stamp placed on you, compared to other places. It is almost like, "If I can stay married, you can do". Sad. You mentioned the "fishing" analogy. This ties into the old phrase, "There are other fish in the sea". The truth is right there on that one. "fish", i.e. Fishing. I think some people are afraid of living their whole lives without someone, so they will try to "fish" one out so they can say that they "have someone". Or there is local and or cultural peer pressure. This comes at the expense of both people over time, because the initial goal was either "To Get" vs "To Live For", or to feel "normal" around others. I mentioned to you in an earlier video, that I get asked here in the south, "Why are you not married?" and my response is, "Because I don't want to get divorced". It is true, but what is more true is that I have not found someone that I can be totally free to be honest with, without breaking expectations with the other person. Total honesty, total openness, etc. and the freedom to be that way is where it is - because the truth comes out eventually. Like taking off a band-aid, it can be long and painful or quick and done. I believe, as you, that a true loving relationship should be relatively effortless, as one is focused on the other, and the other person is doing the same. Marriage or long-term relationships - without that - is another form of "mutually-assured destruction", given time. The collateral damage is mostly seen/felt on the inside, and you end up having a lot of "walking wounded" around. Cheers, Jeff
You are like a breath of fresh air. By that I mean I can relate to so much of what you say. It feels nice to know that there are others out there that feel the same way🙏 I'm so grateful to all of you for sharing so that we can all learn from one another, and know that there are others that can and do relate ♥️⚘
Compromise is all fine and good, but I prefer to think that commonality is the key to great relationships; common values, principles, lifestyle choices etc. Having an easy rapport is fundamental and interpersonal communication is essential, and I wish I could have had those things in my past romantic relationships. After so many disappointing attempts at finding an ideal mate, I just gave up on the whole idea. My INFJ cravings for intimacy and unrealistic expectations from my romantic interests have left me frustrated and confused. Typical INFJ dichotomy of love, I suppose.
I have a video on the 5 pillars of relationship, and two of the pillars are common values and shared interests. I agree those two things are important.
You are right, taking other people for granted is a big mistake and something that we all are guilty of because we, humans, adapt to the environment we live in. If there will be no impulse from outside pointing us to our error, we will rarely see it. This is why communication is so important. It provides a feedback and sheds light to areas we were oblivious of. Ideally the person who is a hurt by lack of acknowledgement will not wait too long to communicate the feeling and once he/she does it, it will be in a normal conversation form without guilt trips. The receiver of the message should hold his/her emotions in check as well and not try to fight back in first impulse of defense. If though the feeling was not communicated at all but rather held inside it often leads to sudden outbursts, rather uncontrolled as well. It grew inside so much that it can't be shared calmly. Still, even this is not an excuse to pick up a fight but take it in and wait until both parties can have a normal conversation. A simple 'oh wow, I have not expected that. I see that you are upset and I am as well with this. Please give me some time to think about this and let's talk about it later today.' A very simple and yet very powerful tool is an agreed in advance: 'are you ready to talk?' When something needs to be talked about both parties need to be in a calm state of emotions/mind and need to have time for a talk . When one is ready he/she asks 'are you ready to talk?' and if the other person is not and even if angrily says 'NO!' then ok, no hard feelings, we will try a but later. After hearing 'yes' you start conversation. There is a way of communicating your own feelings without guilt tripping other person but this post is already too long. You have touched on much more topics here... I agree, freedom is the key in a relationship but it does not come out without trust. It wouldn't work the other way around (in most cases). Thank you for being vulnerable and producing these videos. J.
Very insightful. I'm an INFJ-T and I was in a relationship for over 9yrs, the last 4 I wasn't happy, but I stayed because I felt bad and thought that I could stay in it unhappy, hoping things would change. I recently got out, but now I feel I have alot of work to find a meaningful relationship
I really hope you answer this, because I feel it's a valid point. I'm an INFJ male and like all of your videos, I agree with the sentiment and what your speaking here as far as freedom of the individual, being essential for a fruitful relationship or life in general (free to roam about growth in this realm without shackles). With that, what are the boundaries as far as the sexual freedom that will obviously present itself over and over again,for women 100 times over, compared to men (depending Ofcourse), and Ofcourse the freedom to indulge in that will be so because that is just Human nature. The negative Energy that brings into a relationship. In that, is it fair to say,that some form of "control" is necessary, In order to curb that unhealthy sexual deviancy that is ever so present and rampant throughout society and has been one of the main degredation factors of Beautiful relationships and ultimately the fall of man to a degree (Lust,power,greed). In this, preserving a Beauty so rare in today's relationships. Is it fair to say then that a hopeless romantic should seek out only another hopeless romantic,because the freedom that arises sexually with "freedom" in a relationship,only leaves true romanticism in a relationship,hopeless? What's the balance in this so that no hearts are hurt from feeling controlled and totally free to be the individual and self,in that ultimate growth;yet, Respecting the boundaries in that freedom of never crossing the Sexual line with others,not allowing negative energy or question to arise, which only destroys a beautifully committed relationship, and still feeling free and themselves? Is one doing a dis-service by trying to maintain some form of integrity and monogamous beauty to a relationship by implementing some form of "control?" I use quotations,because in a truly loving relationship, it seems highly inaccurate to say it's control to request through whatever means (marriage, a ring, whatever), "have your freedom to do whatever,but not as it pertains to the sexual crap...because I know that would destroy us,and I value US and remain true to protecting that." So weird,because while that may come off as controlling and attached,it's just truth. It's sad,because in that place of freedom,after the people in the "relationship", have sowed there wild oats in "Growth" being sexual with other people, they can stop after they are much older or whatever and say "ok,now I'm ready to solely be sexual with you"...just taints what true love and relationships are about. "Free love" is everywhere (I say this as a partial hippy but always frowned on this). Temptation is everywhere and why only choose one? Maybe you can make a video going into what that sexual reality of absolute freedom will do to a relationship,and therefore is not a relationship at all...better off just staying single and being ABSOLUTELY free right? Why be committed at all.
I think you misunderstand what I think freedom is. Freedom means you have the choice to choose each other or not. It means not forcing things and making people do things out of control. But of course there are still repercussions to doing things that hurt your partner. Like if you go sleep around and then say 'I'm a free person I can do what I want', then that isn't being free, that's just being a dick. Close relationships are built on communication, trust, acceptance and understanding. If you don't have those things, then you don't even have a relationship in my opinion. You're just faking it.
@@ClayArnall well said and sorry if you feel like I misunderstood you and my comment possibly felt heated. I did understand well the aspect of what you said as far as freedom and the extreme importance of that for a thriving relationship (Ofcourse) and Being Human in this realm in general. Just trying to possibly inject some form of counter thought to what a marriage or "control" contributes as far as keeping certain negative energies away from a beautiful relationship. Sure it will still find a way,but two are putting out there "I am committed to the person I'm with, via a marriage." I despise the traditional patriarchal marriage nonsense. I mean I deeply despised it because it goes against who I am as an individual and usually being totally against the grain when it comes to that of human conditioning,trends or mainstream facades;however, I do think there is a very healthy place for for two reasons. The first may sound bad and you spoke of it in your video,"but when married, remaining firm in getting through issues, and feeling more committed in doing so...then if two are just free to easily break up and go not being married. There is more of a foundation to work through issues and not just run";and, The other reason is because of what I already stated, showing the world you're in a committed relationship, In that, keeping temptations for others to pursue you via social media etc... Somewhat at Bay. And that energy or questioning being less likely to arise.
If two are married with a pre-numptual agreement it's not any more difficult than just breaking up, unless children are involved Ofcourse (depending on the people). So the idea that two are stuck and there is this long tedious process to end a divorce, is a myth.
I think the reason it's so "hard" to be in a relationship/marriage is because of the rigid definition of gender roles -- the culture has set up the adversarial relationship between men and women. I really like your best friends analogy -- effortless. I have it now and no, we're not the same person in all things, and we have spaces in our togetherness. It's very refreshing. I think it's only possible now because we both have been through so much that didn't work before. High five!
"so you take a box and you capture some wind and take it home, you cant capture the wind" me: looking confused to my portable air conditioner box next to me
In any relationship,when you get right down to it... people are basically the same. Put anybody in a situation of oppression and they will instinctively need to fight. Give a person freedom and the only outcome is growth.
I can't believe this video came up on my feed. Does RUclips read minds? Been thinking about this a lot and I agree with you. Personally I've found that less compromise makes my marriage happier :)
Thanks again for this thought-provoking video. It’s refreshing to hear you share your thoughts on the topic: none of what you said shocked or surprised me. I have also wondered about the « relationships require work » message that keeps being repeated; I never thought it made any sense. How can a truly loving relationship be so much work and so little joy?
Brilliant 👌 Thanks for creating it. Freedom, integrity, unconditional love and deep emotional connection is the real thing 🥰 You do sound a little 🤏 bit cynical 😄 And that's okay. My thoughts on marriage is that the papers doesn't make anyone create love, or emotional connection. But they make it a lot harder to split up, even if that's the best choice. And to be "stuck" in a bad relationship is painful. That need to control everything does not only regard relationships. The same control is used in friendships, gardening, pets, society, nature, diseases, pandemics... At least a lot of people try their best to control everything, and get anxiety when things, and people, doesn't go the way they want. I like the unknown, that's where the future and the opportunities are hidden. Letting go is a good thing to practise. It can result in finding unconditional love for yourself and others 🙏🥰
I agree IF you are already healed going into the relationship. Most of the time, people have unhealed (unconscious) wounds and thus will attract partners that will help them heal. For example, you might be attracted to narcissistic or emotional unavailable people, because you have a deep rooted feeling of unworthiness. Once you figure out what you need to integrate back into yourself (a feeling you rejected or repressed earlier on), you will attract different partners.
Thank you for great content. You inspire my brain and heart. I eat it raw. It makes me think of Erich Fromm. Have read a little bit in his book. Erich Fromm : the art of loving Love is a decision, it is a judgment, it is a promise. If love were only a feeling, there would be no basis for the promise to love each other forever. A feeling comes and it may go. How can I judge that it will stay forever, when my act does not involve judgment and decision. If a person loves only one other person and is indifferent to all others, his love is not love but a symbiotic attachment, or an enlarged egotism. Love means to commit oneself without guarantee, to give oneself completely in the hope that our love will produce love in the loved person. Love is an act of faith, and whoever is of little faith is also of little love
The reasons arranged marriages have fewer split-ups are: 1. More pressure from families to stay together; hence, more threat of ostracism if they separate. 2. Arranged marriages are typically between two people of similar background, class, caste, language, and local culture, and there is usually economic or social benefit to both parties; hence, highly compatible in the first place.
Especially when there are kids involved you cannot let them grow up in a toxic or indifferent household. Its better to split up respectfullly than to stay and create an unhealthy atmosphere. Unhealthy is also avoidance and not caring or in silence feel total disdain for eachother. If you dont feel love or some kind of friendship anymore, please dont pretent there is a marriage just live as friends next door and co-parent. Dont lie and go through the motions of love while you really dont want to be close. That is so toxic for kid. Its the air they breath in.
I hope this comes out right. I feel if a relationship, initially is all about the connection and friendship, and that the needed 'business' aspect will/should develop naturally. Like developing team work
Great video! I rarely comment, however due to your relatability, I find myself compelled to do so! I also really enjoy Brene Brown on the topic's of trust, vulnerability etc... you may find her helpful as well!
I have made the comparison between love marriages and arranged marriages before to discuss my beliefs on marriage and relationships, but in a different sense. Although, through your perspective, I can agree that the arrangement is closer to a business partnership, I have also argued that the difference is that both parties have to make the choice daily to put in work and effort. Western views of love, no thanks to the media. think of love as this all-encompassing feeling that overrides all difficulties, when in reality I believe love is a choice we make. It requires us to continually make that choice as we and our partners grow and change over time. It is admitting that sometimes we don't like each other, but we will still work towards each others' benefits regardless. And accepting each other, which ties into your idea of freedom.
Ugh, compromise. I feel like I am the only 1 compromising and considering the other person in any of my relationships. Everything becomes all about them and I completely lose myself. I definitely over give and have people pleasing tendencies. Which I am aware of, but struggle to have healthy boundaries. My most recent ex even told me that he may actually be happier alone so that he doesn't have to consider someone else's wants or needs. How selfish is that? I was just like WOW! Especially since he never considered mine. It was always about him. I'd rather be alone that to be in an unhappy or unhealthy relationship. Not because I don't want to compromise or consider the other person. I enjoy doing so, but not being taken advantage of or for granted.
You know you touch some important point that I never realized. God I think I can only love things, not people. You talked about catching wind into box. I am exactly that kind of person. For me instead of wind it is sea. I love sea, I love this big endless water, I love waves, I love sound of waves, I love smell of sea. And because I live very far from any sea, few years ago I started to collect seas. Every times I was going for holidays to places where sea is I was capturing it. I was taking sea water into bottles, I was recording sound of waves, I was taking pictures of sea, video recording of waves, taking sand to box and sea shell as well. And later on I was creating big collection at my home, I "brought" home part of many different seas, from different countries. And yes, of course it is not same, I cannot recreate sea from it in my home. But I am just that kind of person. When I think about what you were saying in your video, I am kind of person for who other people are too complicated, things are more simple. And yes, the main problem is to compromise, I hate and I think I am not able to compromise. Because I want to stay myself, not drastically change for anybody, even one that I love.
Dear Clay thank you for the insightful video. As said before, I do not know another INFJ, apart from the people on the net. How does it feel to have a relationship with another INFJ? In your previous video you mentioned you have a INFJ friend. Does it feel as you describe in this and your previous video. Do two INFJ’s appreciate each other the same way, as a single INFJ would normally act towards any other person no matter their personality type in a relationship? Have an amazing week
I've wondered about this myself. My INFJ friend (aka girlfriend) is the closest relationship I've ever had and it's hard to imagine anybody being closer. In our strengths we truly thrive. However, since we both share similar weaknesses and blindspots as far as personality, we can fall into predictable traps as far as disagreements. I think it took us a few years of being close friends first to truly work those things out and now that we've both identified them, we can navigate around those things better. I would like to do a video on this topic eventually because I think a lot of people might find these insights interesting.
Clay Arnall thank you, l wish you two only happiness, joy and peace, may your relationship grow and prosper. Looking forward to the video. Yes it’s a question I think all INFJ’s would find helpful. For myself (51) I don’t think I will meet another INFJ. Over the past 15 years after a horrible breakup (don’t know his MBTI just that he was a narcissist) I retreated more and more to the point where being by myself seem to be where I am most comfortable. I changed careers again from being a pharmacist to a very unpopular occupational health and safety officer. Suits my just fine 🙃 for I am left alone to just do my work and not have to interact with other people on any other level. Strangely at first I thought I missed interacting with people, now I get upset when people enter my space. Happy belated birthday, maybe 20 years ago knowing I am an INFJ, my voyage would have taken a different direction. Truly mean it every time I thank you for the difference you make. Have an amazing weekend
This was beautiful. Very inspiring and made me value myself so much more. (Side note: I think another wonderful topic would be sex/physical intimacy. ) thank you for this lovely video (:
Like a boss-employee relationship, a friendship, or romantic relationship, mutual appreciation is the fuel to loyalty or unconditional love. Either this, or I view the world through my primary love language so that can be biased... I am not a parent, so I do not know the emotions at play there, but I believe this is a unique case. To me it seems more of a biological force.
OMG yes yes yes I've always thought this in my head, but never getting this, 30 years I waited for my husband to bring something to the us, never did never would or could, again thanks for the validation 😊
Ok, a lot of eveyrything about everything. As I listen along. And I'm a heavily introvertic female. 1. I do accept the fact that my relationships with extravertic types suck. Big time. My bad. Sadly, I just love them the way the are and don't try to change them. But they always try to change me. So every time around things get messy. Sorry, I cannot fix it alone. It takes two to dance. No amount of discussions about it has ever made any difference this far, so I don't like to discuss it just because I have tried and tested that it's pointless. If I want to involved and I attract who I attract I acccept the fact that it's going to be messy. And it ends there. 2. In Spanish they have 60 different words for different levels of intimate/ romantic relationships. Doesn't make things any less messy or complex in my view. Quite the oppsosite, judging from experience of my fellow Spanish students and friends. This is not the problem with terminology. It's more complex. A sociologist Zygmunt Bauman has once written a book "Together, Apart. " It's more like this. Has to do with culturally induced expectations. Which well, are unrealistic. We are doomed to fail. 3. Yes, introvertic people idealize. But not people. Rather "ways of being with people", "ways of connecting with people", "ways of expressing emotions". So in a nutshell we do idealize abstract things, sometimes we do idealize people we care about what doesn't mean we don't see tham for who they are. It just helps us to accept their flaws and go on with the relationship regardless of circumstances. It's complex. I would never expect anyone who is not deeply introvertic- introspective to udnerstand. Extrovertic people, especially males hold many strange minsconceptions about this.
This is to all who are normal clear thinking people . Do to others what you would like done to you. Some people suffer from disorders so when this is brought into a relationship with those who are normal, it creates unhealthy , dysfunctional type behaviours. A healthy individual knows what will give them the almost perfect , beautiful, satisfying caring and fulfilling relationship. Try giving to others all these things that you are longing to receive from them. Whatever you send out, you get back in return.
Vows to always love your spouse : yes, I agree and actually it's why I could never marry. These vows seem like a lie to me, whatever deeply I am involved. I can promise something I have control on : my attitude and what I do. Feelings, whatever happens, whoever each one evolve to become ? How ? This is absurd !
That's true, it feels like more and more people get into a relationship for the benefits of it and expecting other person to give them things that they feel entitled to. If that's the case, one will eventually taken for granted and worn out. Because of that, it's difficult to tell who is genuine and actually care about who you are, or they are just here for what you have? Or is that just the nature of a relationship? 🙃 😢
I think the answer lies in emotional intimacy. People that are just there for what you have will naturally be bored by your true self. They might not be very interested in your thoughts, ideas and instead might just be interested in more shallow things like your skills, your image, your money, your connections, your social status etc.
I'm 62 and have been single all of my life, so at first glance it would appear I have nothing to say on the topic of love and romance....except for the fact that all the reasons NOT to be in a bad relationship apply...I have surprised myself recently by wanting to find a relationship for companionship and emotional intimacy...the only things that are important to me now...So, in kind of a backwards way of saying it...if a couple stays together until their children are grown and they retire and step away from many of their social obligations and responsibilities, and then they find they do not have the emotional intimacy they want or need...then, what do they have?
Clay I come to your RUclips channel for your amazing insight in the world of an INFJ. Take a look at the book 'Please Understand Me' vol. I by Keirsey and Bates p.74 on the topic of Mating and temperament. In the section on INFJs it says an INFJ is attracted to the ESTP (entrepreneur) or the ENTP (inventor). I am curious, how have these two archetypes played a role in your relationships and business ventures. I suspect many INFJs would also benefit from the wisdom you have gained from your experiences.
One of my good friends is ENTP. He's an amazing leader and entrepreneur. I have a family member that is an ESTP and it's been a very hard troubling relationship for me. So I might be a little biased on that particular personality. I find most of the people around me now are smart, having some intellectual ability but also carry some empathy. I'm not sure I believe in determining how good of a match somebody is based on personality alone.
Love is not complicated, people are. We need to stop trying to force things into other things that can't fit. Like trying to fit a square peg into a round hole. Some say opposite attracts, can someone explain to me , if am boring as hell and I love being who I am, how can someone who is exciting and adventurous enjoy each others company?
@@picklechip9621 Those most often do find love in each other, it's just not upfront as the first on the list. Eventually they fall in love because they work and cooperate together with mutual goals and values. At least that is to my understanding and what I have seen with my Indian friends. Thanks for the pickles
@zenongo8 yes, of course. Disordered people will abuse this cultural disposition in cruel ways. I am thoroughly averse to the Indian cast system, it's evil. But I love the people nonetheless.
“You must love in such a way that the person you love feels free” - Thich Nhat Hanh
Great quote!
@@ClayArnall indeed
Yes it's possible! Married for 23 years now!
I would like to share the 7 conditions for a lasting relationship (from NLP):
1. transparent and open communication
2. safety in the relationship
3. psychological independeny
4. support in personal develpment
5. being aware of each other's history
6. balance in giving and receiving
7. being able to set healthy boundaries and make your own choices
You can always grow in your relation if you are aware of these topics and both are willing to talk and work on it.
All are very good examples, personally #5 is one that stands out to me. Most of my friends are people i've known for 20-23 of my 27 years, i know everything about them, I know their history, there's no surprises. In relationships though, you typically don't know someones history, their past, how they became the person they are today and it can really throw me off at times. Particularly, when I find out something about my partner that is maybe said in passing without a second thought by them it can completely shatter my perception of the person. It's not always a bad thing but there's times where it just completely throws me off balance and it feels like I have to readjust my perception of them. For me I think that's been one of the biggest struggles in relationships for me and I'm not entirely sure how to overcome it.
Awesome! Congratulations!! I want to learn more about neurolinguistic programming too (NLP).
Thanks Barbara! NLP is really interesting. I have had my third day of class day now.
Hi beeman, I did make this respons to you and than I tryed to move it and now I lost the comment :( (I'm not so good at this) Maybe it is in your mailbox? Otherwise I’ll try again. Let me know! Sorry..
This is amazing advice. I’m taking a screenshot of this list. To find a safe person with whom I experience #5 would be incredible. I am finally ready. To say “I love you” you have to know who the “I” is. I know who I am now, which also means I know what I require, desire, and prefer. I also I love me enough not to enter into a relationship that doesn’t allow me to express myself authentically and doesn’t allow me to get to know someone else equally as deeply. I want to be “naked and not afraid” with my beloved and vice versa. I have to be real. Being inauthentic is exhausting.
Vulnerability is the key. Vulnerability attracts honesty. Honesty and authenticity aligns soul connections. Soul connections feel like home.
You can’t love them if you are afraid of losing them. That’s not love, that’s fear. Often one mistakes trauma bonding and their attachment style as love. In truth, their entire relationship is based off the lack of the love for individuality and freedom of self, and instead based off fear. Make deep connections, not attachments.
Excellent video! Absolutely love this topic with clients. Gets their mind thinking outside the structured box we are conditioned to believe is truth for all, instead of feeling into what is true to you.
Listening to you is giving me some little hope that there are still people that value authenticity in relationship. I wish it would be easier to find such people.
Thanks Clay :)
It's out there, darling. Stay open for it ❤
I had so vivid dream of nice, deep conversation with you 😅 This is what crazy INFJ mind is doing.
"Love is like quicksilver in the hand. Leave the fingers open and it stays. Clutch it and it darts away"
Dorothy Parker
Just the other day I thought about how absurd our wedding vows.
There is not a word about how we are going to build our relationship.
The main thing is to stay together….
@9 minutes, I agree, it's NOT suppose to be hard, it's suppose to be curious, anticipatory, enjoyable, maybe challenging but not hard, rather comforting, welcoming and much more.
I feel the same way. Hard though to find that deep emotional connection with some-one. Especially in a masculine driven world where showing vunerability is perceived to be a sign of weakness.
I love this video! As an INFJ who films weddings, I think about this topic a lot and what makes a good marriage or a good match romantically. Ironically my partner and I are business partners in this industry and best friends as well (He tests as INFP). When we first got together I constantly questioned whether or not it was supposed to be this easy because it was unfamiliar to me but 1.5 years later and it still is. I think we have a deep understanding for each other while also sharing so many likes and dislikes which makes things easy. We spend almost 24/7 together as we work side by side in our studio and out on shoots and we still never seem to grow tired of each others company. It's not all butterflies and heart racing passion filled moments all the time, but when I look at him I feel like I'm home and safe to be myself. We're individuals with our own freedoms but we chose to be a team. I feel like this type of partnership is ideal but I'm sure I'm also biased 😂 thank you for openly sharing your thoughts on this!
Thanks for being vulnerable with us, Clay... and mirroring back that thoughtful INFJ idealism. It’s really hard to feel our own feels thanks to Fe being so focused on making sure everyone else is alright with what’s happening. You’re doing good just by being yourself, and risking it not being popular: just. Real. 😊
I love what you said about freedom in relationships. It is not easy, but I would always want someone to be operating from their core desires and not based on rules I have set for them or restrictions. So in allowing that freedom, the relationship can be more organic in how we grow to know each other and work together. But yeah, I am so glad you have been sharing your thoughts on this stuff. I have shared a lot of very similar ideas to this and your other videos on my channel as well, so this is validating. I hope we can really help people change their perspective on relationships and how to have healthier ones.
Up until now I had some long-term relationships that never quite had an actual emotional intimacy. But now, as an INFJ with an INFP partner, things are different. We are openly share, argue, agree and disagree, give each other the freedom to pursue ourselves as individuals. He never gets in my way of wanting and doing something, I never try to change him or manipulate him. We challenge each other everyday. I believe that each one of us deserve to have a solid and healthy relationship. Regarding the "5 pillars of relationship", we are lucky enough to have 5/5. It's crazy that I've settled for less before, just because I couldn't believe such relationship really exists. I also agree about having controversial views about the nature of love. I've made a lot of people uncomfortable with the way I think (and not only about that topic, lol). To be honest, I'm glad that I'm an INFJ. It took me long enough to be grateful for the gifts we as a community of INFJ's share, each from his own perspective. You are such a wonderful person, Clay. Keep sharing yourself :)
I agree completely with everything you've said! But I don't know if we can experience the kind of "effortless" romantic love you describe until we have developed that kind of relationship within. People are looking to be rescued from themselves, instead of offering a healed heart for the "other" to enjoy and explore!
Staying in a dead relationship that satisfies other people’s expectations dishonors ourselves and robs the world of who we really are . Granted there are repercussions for movement- children split between two homes, death of an idealized future. But changing course when things are stagnant or destructive is courageous. Honoring ourselves is not for the weak.
I must say that I'm convinced you're one of the most brilliant minds on RUclips.
Good to see that other INFJs have the same opinion across the board. I know it works for many but I can't get married or have children out of practicality. Some people are not intentional about their lives at all. I wonder if my all or nothing complex sometimes creates more harm than good. I often feel conflicted but I'm really trying in my current relationship. We're best friends but it's not without issues I'm afraid. It's so easy on most levels but on the ones there are problems, darn, it's very difficult and I don't know if I'd be able to compromise for much longer than I've already had.
Gah...you continue to speak the exact things I think and say. I’m blown away that another human could think exactly the same way I do about love and relationships. I’ve always said that a committed partnership seems better (in a sense of being more loving) than marriage because that person is consciously “choosing” you every day. They have the complete freedom to leave at any moment, yet they stay because, like you said, they just love being with you...just like choosing to have a best friend for your whole life. When people get married, it seems they end up feeling “stuck” and remain in unhealthy marriages/relationships because it’s just too hard or complicated to divorce. This legal contract of marriage makes things so much more sticky. I know this from experience because I stayed married for 21 years and over half of those years I only stayed because of the kids and the complex issue of custody etc. I couldn’t say it better than you did. I just can’t think staying married just to not be divorced is the goal. You aren’t successful just because you stay married. You are successful when you love someone unconditionally and allow them complete freedom every day. Also...you are so right about vulnerability. It’s the foundation of intimacy.😍❤️. Thank you for your videos. I’m an ENFP in love with INFJ’s because I just feel sooo connected in the way we think about life.
Great video Clay. You encouraged me to start a business btw but that is off topic haha. I highly suggest the book No More Mr. Nice Guy by Robert Glover. Especially for INFJ men and their partners. I went through a relationship recently where I lost control of who I am as an individual. It was my fault for not setting boundaries. My ex and I constantly hung out and did everything together. This thwarted her personal growth and mine also. It was bothering me more than her though because I think in her eyes she wanted to have a sense of control that I'd stay with her. Subconsciously she felt she was protecting me by being with me all the time. I lost my sense of self and my essence as a man. I could not think for myself anymore. It led to being sad and frustrated. I stayed quiet about it and built up an inner dark rage that I kept to myself and never expressed. I ended up talking another women via text and that's when she found out and she broke up. I am the villain in this scenario for many reasons. I have learned so much from this experience. I don't think I can get her back anymore but people PLEASE start living for yourself love is about wanting the other person to be the best version of THEM and not being with them to feel like you're there and end up not focusing on your growth. As clay said, Love is like the wind. You can not capture it in a jar but you can let it guide you and take you to larger gusts of wind. The wind representing the self. Do not cage yourself in a jar for anyone. Set boundaries. Be you. Love others through example. Know what you want in a partner.
Heavy topic for me. Most failed relationships for me have been about declining strange and demented invitations to step inside some tiny little box someone has arranged for me in their life. How do people delude themselves into thinking that's love or friendship? No thank you. Yet, I remember with each lost relationship what it felt like to love, that I was capable of that feeling. That gives me hope someone out there could reciprocate that wonderful feeling of understanding someone, yet always wanting to learn more.
As long as you stay open for it, it'll come❤
Love your thoughts 😊
For myself- genuine love is adding to someone’s life. Not taking away from, not filling something that’s missing, not owning, etc...
Hey Clay, this is my take on a part of this subject. Hope you see my meaning.
When I hear people say they love someone. it's silently insinuated that they also like them. And I find that there's a stark difference between liking and loving someone.
To like some one is to act in kind, to act similar and share an aligned mannerism that mimics their behavior and thoughts. If someone walks into a social event and looks around the room for a familiar face, when they find them the person responds in kind and shows equal interest to be at the same event; they show they like each other. Or, when there's a contrasting behavior such as you come home and find an empty jug of juice left on the counter or dirty dishes in the sink. The person who dislikes that cleans it up instead of being appreciative or ignorant of it.
To love someone is best described by Paul the Apostle, "Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth." And while he states that love is kind, he's saying that to love someone is to share their interests and values. My definition of love is, "To preserve all that it is; good, bad and indifferent."
When we have a pet that misbehaves and barks or scratches at things, we love them and mildly correct their behavior in preservation to who their character is. Even though we may not like the characteristic, we permit it to a tolerable degree; we preserve and care for who they are. Just as if we love a car, house or object of affection. We do everything we can not to tarnish its original value and try our best to preserve its original state.
That is how I see and understand the difference between love and like.
"Love" the content by the way; please keep making more 🙏
I felt all of that. I’m not even sure sometimes anymore wether I want to be with anyone. In the past i was always the one bending over backwards and I feel like in today’s society there’s this unhealthy window shopping mentality where someone doesn’t choose you they just keep you controlled and/or attached but put in no effort for anything that has that balanced give and take Fundation. And Even expectations have such a grey area for me, because not having them is also an expectation so ultimately unless someone has an understanding that it’s a two way street on their own terms chances are you are in constant limbo. In fact id even go so far to say that nowadays you doing nice things are used as ammunition...how often I have heard “no one asked you to do this” or “it’s your own fault for being so nice and hoping that I’d return the favor but I’m grateful” when the whole statement is neither grateful nor appreciative or respectful. This happens so often that I’m scared to even put myself out there anymore. A relationship really isn’t that hard as long as u have a I water You and u water me mentality so both can grow - Individually and as a team. People are so broken it’s sad. I’m rather alone than having someone that doesn’t invest in me as I do for them, and then I also have no desire to hold the friendship because to me that’s disrespecting the entire connection.
Big big thank you for this video. I am a young infj so I feel like I have no damn opinion about things or that I feel how things are supposed to be but I can't quite translate it into words yet. I go to your channel and everything resonates with me. I appreciate your thoughts and I'm so happy I have this opportunity to learn from you 💛 I just started a relationship and it is unbelievable that I found a person who agrees on my attitude to love. So so so happy :)
I had a patch last year where understanding the nature of love obsessed me. I read everything I could about it, and I was fascinated by the Greek concept of eros. Love ties in to grief, body connectivity, spirituality, and so many other things. I was seeing the same thing you are, these half hearted relationships all around us, people settling for no intimacy. I'm forging ahead throwing convention to the wind now, love is how I define it. It's as individual as snowflakes, we're all on our own path with love if we're willing to give up control and follow where it's taking us. We only feel love as deeply as we let ourselves feel grief, something I finally learned when my grief work became unavoidable. My feelings started going to depths I didn't know existed in me and it's both terrifying and exhilarating. I hope more people start to see love like you do, we'd be so much more content in the long run.
I think vulnerability is the key not only in romantic relationships, but most relationships...friendship, work, ourself, etc. I know as an unfortunate, but recovering self-proclaimed perfectionist + people pleaser, I have always been quick to make sure others were happy and thus often times would be miserable myself, which seeped into the relationship. I feared being vulnerable, and potentially proven unworthy, so I would be untruthful to appease the person. Or with new relationships, I allowed myself to fail ahead of time (aka, not even give it a try) in order to avoid future failure. Silly, right? Being vulnerable allows you to to give and receive without judgement. With vulnerability there is less fear of shame and more of the honesty in which you speak of. :) If you haven't listened or read Brené Brown on this topic already, I highly recommend it! :)
I have read some stuff from her actually. I almost added a quote from her book ‘daring greatly’ into this video about vulnerability. She’s great.
If there is truth there will be freedom in relationships... most people are unfortunately coming from ego today, hence relationships seldom lasts... ego wants, needs, clings.. anything but freedom.
Much appreciated videos, have listened first time all afternoon to you Clay, it has literally saved my day as I’m going through my own transformation, sober 10 months myself, but my x is deep in the bottle.. as an INFJ, I’m struggling and have been all my adult life with being codependent too, not just my own addiction. Becoming sober was the easy part. The hard work is diving deep to really understand who I am, and why “people don’t get me”, and why I certainly have had many days not understanding myself, to say the least... having 4 children, childbirth is so painful, but this is similar, not for the fainted hearted. Wish me luck, as I’m feeling quite lonely and alone at the time. Thank heavens someone like you can mirror me to the teeth, it all seems worth while knowing we are Not alone. Even my pain body is dormant right now. What a blessing to find likeminded human beings🙏
Wow!! The last 30 mins seemed like I am talking to myself. I totally agree with whatever you said. Even I too had this feeling and I was also feeling lost in my relationship when my partner wasn't emotionally invested, when I decided to break up. The main things we INFJs look for is Being Authentic as well as Vulnerable, expressing what we stand for and believing in the concept of putting the other first in order to achieve an infinite blossoming relationship. The problem with others is that they tend to fail while doing this, because they feel insecure to reach a state of vulnerability. That's why the society has put up some BS rules so that marriages will always revolve within the so called safe limits. But doing this, they will never tend to realize themselves, the true nature of love and the best side of being in a relationship. Thanks a lot Clay for throwing light on this.
YES. Thank you so much for this video Clay. It has really helped me gain so much needed clarity at the current relationship stage I am in. You have such a magnificent ability to translate thoughts to words. Much love as always
Communication, communication, communication!
To be able to freely talk about what I’ve been through in my life without the fear of being judged. And yes, being completely joined spiritually and emotionally but completely free at the same time. I love it. I wish I could find that. ❤️
Hey Clay, ENxP female here, could listen to you all day and would love to talk about relationships and all the deep thoughts you bring up in other videos with you. I also feel that a lot of people avoid such topics and it frustrates me.
After two very long relationships (ESFJ 4yrs, ESTJ 10yrs) I'm with an INFJ now and for the first time I have someone to talk to and also don't feel bored to listen for hours and hours. He and his thoughts are very interesting. I think he is the love of my life.
Keep the good content coming!
So needed this message right now. Leaving a 13 year marriage. Narcissistic, controlling, with a huge age gap. Should’ve know better, but was young and scared to be alone. Now is time to take care of me.
Take care Sandy!
Take care and much love to you!
Thank you ☺️.
From one INFJ to another, I found this video VERY insightful. I struggle with the concept allowing the other person to be "free". I don't know if it's a societal construct to want to almost "own" something/someone you love and feel jealousy as if they were an inanimate object. What I am taking from this video is the concept of mutually putting each other's interest first & granting them freedom. Thanks for sharing as always.
Hey, I would like to say something sort of intended as a thankyou. I found your channel at a time in my life that I think I really needed it in. I'm going through a sort of separation, myself. We're not married, but we were engaged and now have a baby together. While I know for a fact that she isn't currently trying to find meaning in this situation like I am, rather focusing more of her energy on grieving, I myself have received a significant amount of value from these discussions. I was going through a period of time where I felt like I was using every ounce of energy I had to keep the relationship together, but the problem was, I was the only one trying. We had an argument one day that started because I was trying to exercise a bit of freedom to go and indulge in an activity that I hadn't for a while and was frankly starting to miss. She had this handle on me, she had to negotiate with me to try and align my activities with her wants. That made me feel unappreciated and trapped, so I told her that I didn't understand why she couldn't just let me do something as simple as take some time for myself to do something I enjoyed so that I could recharge. Now she did this often, but she used the baby, almost as a weapon, a form of guilt-based manipulation. She was basically trying to tell me that I'm not a good father, and I think she intentionally chose this argument because she knows how much I value our daughter. I honestly felt so hurt by this, so discarded and misunderstood that it really just took everything I had left in me out. I suddenly was able to share my true feelings with her and express how hurt and betrayed I felt. I laid into her and almost cursed her for taking so much of my life from me. I was furious and I was expressing every bit of what I'd been holding back for so long in the hopes that the situation could be saved. So I left the house, I began thinking about my life, about our argument, about what I was going to do about this situation that I now had to deal with. She was back at the house packing my things and when she was finished, she called me and told me to come back and grab my belongings. In the brief amount of time I spent away, I was able to think clearly for the first time in what seems like my entire life. I was not going to waste the time I had left. I came up with a plan to go back home to Phoenix, go back to my friends and my hobbies, all of the things I had loved before my love for her ever outweighed any of it and I made a promise to myself that I would never give any of it up for anyone. This is my life, these are my friends, this is where my heart is. Or at least a majority of it, because I still have a daughter out there that's going to need her father, and I'll be damned if I won't do everything in my power to be the best father I can even if I have to spend the majority of the time doing it from a distance. I owe my daughter that much after all. But the real reason I had the strength and the emotional intelligence to survive this situation is because I had wise, caring people I could rely on; My friend, Nick, my sister Alyssa, and you with your insights and wisdom have all helped me make the closest to what I believe is the right decision, and while we're experiencing the growing pains that come with it, I feel like this is only a catalyst for things to improve, cause at the end of the day, that's all we can really hope for.
As a person coming from a marriage that didn't work out. I fully agree... A deep rooted global problem which you explained in detail.
Excellent message.
Hi Musa, good to see another RSAn who knows about the MBTI personalities and is a fellow INFJ
@@katlegomolokwane1611 It sure is Katlego, most people in SA don't do MBTI, I myself don't know any, you would be the 1st . You can communicate with me at: lifecoach8304@gmail.com
Freedom to choose each other, and the ability to leave each other. Then you have to work to keep the love real. If you lose the way you like to live your life, then you stop likeing the other person. You will always love them, but that's when people break apart. You have nailed it again.
I am an INFJ female and your message is the only one that I can relate! Thank you!
Clay, this is one of your best videos ever!
It's so similar view being an infj listening to another infj. It's like there are more people who think and live in a similar mindset. This video cleared so many thoughts in my mind. Thank you..
It’s all about ‘Quantity’ for most in society in almost all aspects of life while for INFJs it’s about ‘Quality’. That is why lengthy arranged marriages are considered as more successful by many.
I couldn't agree more about balanced compromise, emotional intimacy, ease, authenticity, expression of appreciation, and a "setting one another free" in a healthy relationship. Control definitely kills relationships and is a sign of narcissism. Taking one another for granted is never acceptable. I do not believe love should be difficult and if it is, there's something wrong. It should flow and grow.
I agree with you in general. I think my understanding of love/relationships is one of the areas I've most struggled in divergence with other people. the standards I place on emotional engagement tend to be uncomfortable for many others. for one thing, when I see signs of a problem, I can't ignore them. I think the most common limitation I encounter in others is defensiveness which perfectly exemplifies my view that the opposite of love is fear (I don't believe in hatred/evil but rather perceive it as the consequence of fear from ignorance and/or damage). I absolutely agree with your assertion that love should support freedom of self. I think most relationships inspire shame/fear in people because people aren't realistic about human nature or are too closed off to understanding it. I think one advantage of Ni is having an innate understanding of the whys behind behavior. I think I'm often more accepting of the things people fear about themselves then they are themselves 😆 but my point is that openness is essential for INFJs in relationships because we will perceive causes and it's best if they can be discussed and understood together with others. I think true love is the kind that provides the safety to explore and understand oneself, together. I absolutely think the biggest error people make is in taking others for granted. I've always made a real effort to keep perspective on the things others do for me and people have often sited that as something they appreciate most about me. my biggest flaw has been a degree of emotional detachment or uncertainty but I think that mostly comes down to a lack of Fi because I am still deeply invested in others with sentiment. I think Fe represented a serious obstacle to finding the right romantic relationship for a long time. one way MBTI has helped is in giving me perspective on the whole Fe/Fi thing and I'm now in a very fulfilling relationship with an ISFJ who experienced similar problems before as well. It's interesting because I was married to an INFP for years and his emotionally reactive Fi was actually really constraining for me (we are still friends because he's a wonderful person but romance became toxic for us). my current relationship is so freeing and he takes real responsibility for understanding me, which helps me grow as a person. I think the only way relationships should be hard is due to the effort of growth together and not within the emotional connection and compatibility. healing from past trauma is difficult, learning how to grow past it can be difficult and learning about oneself can be difficult but loving someone else really shouldn't be the difficult part ☺️ nice video
I think the thing with compromising on core character traits is a very interesting point. I assume it happens because most people start out their relationships with an egoistic mindset. They want the person around because they make them feel good. When these strong first crush emotions start to fade they see the real person...and tend not to like the actual core. One could argue that people are blinded by their egoism.
This then goes hand in hand with a cultural problem which is the obsession with being loved rather than building on your capacity to love. With that comes the egoism of trying to get something out of love rather than truly loving which I think is more related to giving rather than getting.
Furthermore we have a problem with narcissism that creates the stark focus on perfectionism. I think people are often not capable of loving because they think they deserve "the best" (and the other person is just not lovable enough in their eyes). The problem is that a lot of people don't realise that "the best" doesn't actually fit their core either. So you have this mismatch between what you think you deserve and what is actually suitable for you.
I would have a lot to say about a lot of things you talked about! But I’ll go only with this: vulnerability IS the key. It is the only way of truly connecting with another human being. There is a great ted talk by Brené Brown about this called The power of vulnerability. I really enjoy your videos by the way, keep up the good work 😊!
These are some really interesting thoughts. I don't know that I agree with your definition of love being merely emotional intimacy however. Like with Greek, there are several different words for love in Hebrew. There's a really interesting word-"chesed," which essentially means "loyal kindness." It's this idea of "I'm not going anywhere. I'm here for you and always will be." It's the Sam carrying Frodo the last few steps to Mount Doom. This is a deep friendship. But it's also a kind of commitment in a way, or a "contract" as you say. I think this is really important in a romantic relationship. Of course, there are unhealthy extremes where narcissistic folk take advantage of this. But the healthy version is something really beautiful and valuable. I think this is what the idea of marriage is getting at. And from that root, there can grow some really beautiful things.
Very well done, Clay! 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻 So true!
So many things you said jumped out at me in your video. Many of them I have had similar thoughts, but have not yet ran across someone else with similar viewpoints. So you really hit a lot of things accurately that I believe in. I believe local culture has a lot to do with the modeling of romantic relationships, as you mentioned. I lived 35 years on the west coast of the USA, now in the southeast USA. There are major differences in those two regions. I have seen more honest and happy romantic relationships in California, vs here in the Deep South. Here, there are culture and religious-determined "Obligations" and "Blind Conformity" that exist here. I can see the falseness in some of the relationships here. Also, you get divorced here and you can easily get a "shame" stamp placed on you, compared to other places. It is almost like, "If I can stay married, you can do". Sad.
You mentioned the "fishing" analogy. This ties into the old phrase, "There are other fish in the sea". The truth is right there on that one. "fish", i.e. Fishing. I think some people are afraid of living their whole lives without someone, so they will try to "fish" one out so they can say that they "have someone". Or there is local and or cultural peer pressure. This comes at the expense of both people over time, because the initial goal was either "To Get" vs "To Live For", or to feel "normal" around others.
I mentioned to you in an earlier video, that I get asked here in the south, "Why are you not married?" and my response is, "Because I don't want to get divorced". It is true, but what is more true is that I have not found someone that I can be totally free to be honest with, without breaking expectations with the other person.
Total honesty, total openness, etc. and the freedom to be that way is where it is - because the truth comes out eventually. Like taking off a band-aid, it can be long and painful or quick and done. I believe, as you, that a true loving relationship should be relatively effortless, as one is focused on the other, and the other person is doing the same. Marriage or long-term relationships - without that - is another form of "mutually-assured destruction", given time. The collateral damage is mostly seen/felt on the inside, and you end up having a lot of "walking wounded" around.
Cheers, Jeff
This one was really fantastic, Clay. Such a clear insight. This actually answered questions about things I have been grappling with.
You are like a breath of fresh air. By that I mean I can relate to so much of what you say. It feels nice to know that there are others out there that feel the same way🙏 I'm so grateful to all of you for sharing so that we can all learn from one another, and know that there are others that can and do relate ♥️⚘
Compromise is all fine and good, but I prefer to think that commonality is the key to great relationships; common values, principles, lifestyle choices etc. Having an easy rapport is fundamental and interpersonal communication is essential, and I wish I could have had those things in my past romantic relationships. After so many disappointing attempts at finding an ideal mate, I just gave up on the whole idea. My INFJ cravings for intimacy and unrealistic expectations from my romantic interests have left me frustrated and confused. Typical INFJ dichotomy of love, I suppose.
I have a video on the 5 pillars of relationship, and two of the pillars are common values and shared interests. I agree those two things are important.
You are right, taking other people for granted is a big mistake and something that we all are guilty of because we, humans, adapt to the environment we live in. If there will be no impulse from outside pointing us to our error, we will rarely see it. This is why communication is so important. It provides a feedback and sheds light to areas we were oblivious of. Ideally the person who is a hurt by lack of acknowledgement will not wait too long to communicate the feeling and once he/she does it, it will be in a normal conversation form without guilt trips. The receiver of the message should hold his/her emotions in check as well and not try to fight back in first impulse of defense.
If though the feeling was not communicated at all but rather held inside it often leads to sudden outbursts, rather uncontrolled as well. It grew inside so much that it can't be shared calmly.
Still, even this is not an excuse to pick up a fight but take it in and wait until both parties can have a normal conversation. A simple 'oh wow, I have not expected that. I see that you are upset and I am as well with this. Please give me some time to think about this and let's talk about it later today.'
A very simple and yet very powerful tool is an agreed in advance: 'are you ready to talk?' When something needs to be talked about both parties need to be in a calm state of emotions/mind and need to have time for a talk . When one is ready he/she asks 'are you ready to talk?' and if the other person is not and even if angrily says 'NO!' then ok, no hard feelings, we will try a but later. After hearing 'yes' you start conversation.
There is a way of communicating your own feelings without guilt tripping other person but this post is already too long.
You have touched on much more topics here... I agree, freedom is the key in a relationship but it does not come out without trust. It wouldn't work the other way around (in most cases).
Thank you for being vulnerable and producing these videos. J.
Very insightful. I'm an INFJ-T and I was in a relationship for over 9yrs, the last 4 I wasn't happy, but I stayed because I felt bad and thought that I could stay in it unhappy, hoping things would change. I recently got out, but now I feel I have alot of work to find a meaningful relationship
You're on the right track, Clay,
I really hope you answer this, because I feel it's a valid point. I'm an INFJ male and like all of your videos, I agree with the sentiment and what your speaking here as far as freedom of the individual, being essential for a fruitful relationship or life in general (free to roam about growth in this realm without shackles). With that, what are the boundaries as far as the sexual freedom that will obviously present itself over and over again,for women 100 times over, compared to men (depending Ofcourse), and Ofcourse the freedom to indulge in that will be so because that is just Human nature. The negative Energy that brings into a relationship. In that, is it fair to say,that some form of "control" is necessary, In order to curb that unhealthy sexual deviancy that is ever so present and rampant throughout society and has been one of the main degredation factors of Beautiful relationships and ultimately the fall of man to a degree (Lust,power,greed). In this, preserving a Beauty so rare in today's relationships. Is it fair to say then that a hopeless romantic should seek out only another hopeless romantic,because the freedom that arises sexually with "freedom" in a relationship,only leaves true romanticism in a relationship,hopeless? What's the balance in this so that no hearts are hurt from feeling controlled and totally free to be the individual and self,in that ultimate growth;yet, Respecting the boundaries in that freedom of never crossing the Sexual line with others,not allowing negative energy or question to arise, which only destroys a beautifully committed relationship, and still feeling free and themselves? Is one doing a dis-service by trying to maintain some form of integrity and monogamous beauty to a relationship by implementing some form of "control?" I use quotations,because in a truly loving relationship, it seems highly inaccurate to say it's control to request through whatever means (marriage, a ring, whatever), "have your freedom to do whatever,but not as it pertains to the sexual crap...because I know that would destroy us,and I value US and remain true to protecting that." So weird,because while that may come off as controlling and attached,it's just truth.
It's sad,because in that place of freedom,after the people in the "relationship", have sowed there wild oats in "Growth" being sexual with other people, they can stop after they are much older or whatever and say "ok,now I'm ready to solely be sexual with you"...just taints what true love and relationships are about. "Free love" is everywhere (I say this as a partial hippy but always frowned on this). Temptation is everywhere and why only choose one? Maybe you can make a video going into what that sexual reality of absolute freedom will do to a relationship,and therefore is not a relationship at all...better off just staying single and being ABSOLUTELY free right? Why be committed at all.
I think you misunderstand what I think freedom is. Freedom means you have the choice to choose each other or not. It means not forcing things and making people do things out of control. But of course there are still repercussions to doing things that hurt your partner. Like if you go sleep around and then say 'I'm a free person I can do what I want', then that isn't being free, that's just being a dick. Close relationships are built on communication, trust, acceptance and understanding. If you don't have those things, then you don't even have a relationship in my opinion. You're just faking it.
@@ClayArnall well said and sorry if you feel like I misunderstood you and my comment possibly felt heated. I did understand well the aspect of what you said as far as freedom and the extreme importance of that for a thriving relationship (Ofcourse) and Being Human in this realm in general. Just trying to possibly inject some form of counter thought to what a marriage or "control" contributes as far as keeping certain negative energies away from a beautiful relationship. Sure it will still find a way,but two are putting out there "I am committed to the person I'm with, via a marriage." I despise the traditional patriarchal marriage nonsense. I mean I deeply despised it because it goes against who I am as an individual and usually being totally against the grain when it comes to that of human conditioning,trends or mainstream facades;however, I do think there is a very healthy place for for two reasons. The first may sound bad and you spoke of it in your video,"but when married, remaining firm in getting through issues, and feeling more committed in doing so...then if two are just free to easily break up and go not being married. There is more of a foundation to work through issues and not just run";and, The other reason is because of what I already stated, showing the world you're in a committed relationship, In that, keeping temptations for others to pursue you via social media etc... Somewhat at Bay. And that energy or questioning being less likely to arise.
If two are married with a pre-numptual agreement it's not any more difficult than just breaking up, unless children are involved Ofcourse (depending on the people). So the idea that two are stuck and there is this long tedious process to end a divorce, is a myth.
@@ClayArnall "close relationships are built on communication,trust, acceptance and understanding." I agree 💯 .
I think the reason it's so "hard" to be in a relationship/marriage is because of the rigid definition of gender roles -- the culture has set up the adversarial relationship between men and women. I really like your best friends analogy -- effortless. I have it now and no, we're not the same person in all things, and we have spaces in our togetherness. It's very refreshing. I think it's only possible now because we both have been through so much that didn't work before. High five!
I think it comes down to a convenent relationship vs a contractual relationship- what do you want, what can you live with.
🌬💞 "NAMSTAE " 🙏🏾 Clay, thank you for being a good human. 👌🏽 Keep up the good workz💐 Clay. 🇺🇸💯🇨🇦☮
"so you take a box and you capture some wind and take it home, you cant capture the wind"
me: looking confused to my portable air conditioner box next to me
while useful, it's still a shallow imitation to the real thing :)
I feel like you are inside my head. I have worked through these same thoughts and drawn the exact same conclusions and view points
In any relationship,when you get right down to it... people are basically the same. Put anybody in a situation of oppression and they will instinctively need to fight. Give a person freedom and the only outcome is growth.
I can't believe this video came up on my feed. Does RUclips read minds? Been thinking about this a lot and I agree with you. Personally I've found that less compromise makes my marriage happier :)
Thanks again for this thought-provoking video. It’s refreshing to hear you share your thoughts on the topic: none of what you said shocked or surprised me. I have also wondered about the « relationships require work » message that keeps being repeated; I never thought it made any sense. How can a truly loving relationship be so much work and so little joy?
Brilliant 👌 Thanks for creating it.
Freedom, integrity, unconditional love and deep emotional connection is the real thing 🥰
You do sound a little 🤏 bit cynical 😄 And that's okay. My thoughts on marriage is that the papers doesn't make anyone create love, or emotional connection. But they make it a lot harder to split up, even if that's the best choice. And to be "stuck" in a bad relationship is painful.
That need to control everything does not only regard relationships. The same control is used in friendships, gardening, pets, society, nature, diseases, pandemics... At least a lot of people try their best to control everything, and get anxiety when things, and people, doesn't go the way they want. I like the unknown, that's where the future and the opportunities are hidden. Letting go is a good thing to practise. It can result in finding unconditional love for yourself and others 🙏🥰
Uhh yes, truth! This is the driving force for me, I don't mind ups and downs but just be honest 100% of the time or no deal!! Good chat, thanks
Great video Clay, I think you've really hit the mark here.
I agree IF you are already healed going into the relationship. Most of the time, people have unhealed (unconscious) wounds and thus will attract partners that will help them heal. For example, you might be attracted to narcissistic or emotional unavailable people, because you have a deep rooted feeling of unworthiness. Once you figure out what you need to integrate back into yourself (a feeling you rejected or repressed earlier on), you will attract different partners.
Thank you for great content. You inspire my brain and heart. I eat it raw. It makes me think of Erich Fromm. Have read a little bit in his book.
Erich Fromm : the art of loving
Love is a decision, it is a judgment, it is a promise. If love were only a feeling, there would be no basis for the promise to love each other forever. A feeling comes and it may go. How can I judge that it will stay forever, when my act does not involve judgment and decision.
If a person loves only one other person and is indifferent to all others, his love is not love but a symbiotic attachment, or an enlarged egotism.
Love means to commit oneself without guarantee, to give oneself completely in the hope that our love will produce love in the loved person. Love is an act of faith, and whoever is of little faith is also of little love
The reasons arranged marriages have fewer split-ups are:
1. More pressure from families to stay together; hence, more threat of ostracism if they separate.
2. Arranged marriages are typically between two people of similar background, class, caste, language, and local culture, and there is usually economic or social benefit to both parties; hence, highly compatible in the first place.
This channel is underrated.
Especially when there are kids involved you cannot let them grow up in a toxic or indifferent household. Its better to split up respectfullly than to stay and create an unhealthy atmosphere. Unhealthy is also avoidance and not caring or in silence feel total disdain for eachother. If you dont feel love or some kind of friendship anymore, please dont pretent there is a marriage just live as friends next door and co-parent. Dont lie and go through the motions of love while you really dont want to be close. That is so toxic for kid. Its the air they breath in.
I hope this comes out right. I feel if a relationship, initially is all about the connection and friendship, and that the needed 'business' aspect will/should develop naturally. Like developing team work
Great video! I rarely comment, however due to your relatability, I find myself compelled to do so! I also really enjoy Brene Brown on the topic's of trust, vulnerability etc... you may find her helpful as well!
That's a very interesting vow: I promise to be truthful with you.
Very thoughtful video as always. Love your content. Big hug and thx.
I have made the comparison between love marriages and arranged marriages before to discuss my beliefs on marriage and relationships, but in a different sense. Although, through your perspective, I can agree that the arrangement is closer to a business partnership, I have also argued that the difference is that both parties have to make the choice daily to put in work and effort. Western views of love, no thanks to the media. think of love as this all-encompassing feeling that overrides all difficulties, when in reality I believe love is a choice we make. It requires us to continually make that choice as we and our partners grow and change over time. It is admitting that sometimes we don't like each other, but we will still work towards each others' benefits regardless. And accepting each other, which ties into your idea of freedom.
That's a good point
" some are trying to force the fruit"
Ugh, compromise. I feel like I am the only 1 compromising and considering the other person in any of my relationships. Everything becomes all about them and I completely lose myself. I definitely over give and have people pleasing tendencies. Which I am aware of, but struggle to have healthy boundaries. My most recent ex even told me that he may actually be happier alone so that he doesn't have to consider someone else's wants or needs. How selfish is that? I was just like WOW! Especially since he never considered mine. It was always about him. I'd rather be alone that to be in an unhappy or unhealthy relationship. Not because I don't want to compromise or consider the other person. I enjoy doing so, but not being taken advantage of or for granted.
You know you touch some important point that I never realized. God I think I can only love things, not people.
You talked about catching wind into box. I am exactly that kind of person. For me instead of wind it is sea. I love sea, I love this big endless water, I love waves, I love sound of waves, I love smell of sea. And because I live very far from any sea, few years ago I started to collect seas. Every times I was going for holidays to places where sea is I was capturing it. I was taking sea water into bottles, I was recording sound of waves, I was taking pictures of sea, video recording of waves, taking sand to box and sea shell as well. And later on I was creating big collection at my home, I "brought" home part of many different seas, from different countries. And yes, of course it is not same, I cannot recreate sea from it in my home. But I am just that kind of person. When I think about what you were saying in your video, I am kind of person for who other people are too complicated, things are more simple. And yes, the main problem is to compromise, I hate and I think I am not able to compromise. Because I want to stay myself, not drastically change for anybody, even one that I love.
Dear Clay thank you for the insightful video.
As said before, I do not know another INFJ, apart from the people on the net.
How does it feel to have a relationship with another INFJ?
In your previous video you mentioned you have a INFJ friend. Does it feel as you describe in this and your previous video.
Do two INFJ’s appreciate each other the same way, as a single INFJ would normally act towards any other person no matter their personality type in a relationship?
Have an amazing week
I've wondered about this myself. My INFJ friend (aka girlfriend) is the closest relationship I've ever had and it's hard to imagine anybody being closer. In our strengths we truly thrive. However, since we both share similar weaknesses and blindspots as far as personality, we can fall into predictable traps as far as disagreements. I think it took us a few years of being close friends first to truly work those things out and now that we've both identified them, we can navigate around those things better. I would like to do a video on this topic eventually because I think a lot of people might find these insights interesting.
Clay Arnall
thank you, l wish you two only happiness, joy and peace, may your relationship grow and prosper.
Looking forward to the video. Yes it’s a question I think all INFJ’s would find helpful.
For myself (51) I don’t think I will meet another INFJ. Over the past 15 years after a horrible breakup (don’t know his MBTI just that he was a narcissist) I retreated more and more to the point where being by myself seem to be where I am most comfortable.
I changed careers again from being a pharmacist to a very unpopular occupational health and safety officer. Suits my just fine 🙃 for I am left alone to just do my work and not have to interact with other people on any other level.
Strangely at first I thought I missed interacting with people, now I get upset when people enter my space.
Happy belated birthday, maybe 20 years ago knowing I am an INFJ, my voyage would have taken a different direction.
Truly mean it every time I thank you for the difference you make.
Have an amazing weekend
Relationships are a distraction and can take away from who you are if you’re always compromising yourself.
BTW negative behavior in young children is an expression of their emotions; fear, insecurity and/or frustration.
This was beautiful. Very inspiring and made me value myself so much more.
(Side note: I think another wonderful topic would be sex/physical intimacy. ) thank you for this lovely video (:
Like a boss-employee relationship, a friendship, or romantic relationship, mutual appreciation is the fuel to loyalty or unconditional love. Either this, or I view the world through my primary love language so that can be biased... I am not a parent, so I do not know the emotions at play there, but I believe this is a unique case. To me it seems more of a biological force.
OMG yes yes yes I've always thought this in my head, but never getting this, 30 years I waited for my husband to bring something to the us, never did never would or could, again thanks for the validation 😊
You look like a very cool guy. Love your videos. Keep it up!
-INFJ
Ok, a lot of eveyrything about everything. As I listen along. And I'm a heavily introvertic female. 1. I do accept the fact that my relationships with extravertic types suck. Big time. My bad. Sadly, I just love them the way the are and don't try to change them. But they always try to change me. So every time around things get messy. Sorry, I cannot fix it alone. It takes two to dance. No amount of discussions about it has ever made any difference this far, so I don't like to discuss it just because I have tried and tested that it's pointless. If I want to involved and I attract who I attract I acccept the fact that it's going to be messy. And it ends there. 2. In Spanish they have 60 different words for different levels of intimate/ romantic relationships. Doesn't make things any less messy or complex in my view. Quite the oppsosite, judging from experience of my fellow Spanish students and friends. This is not the problem with terminology. It's more complex. A sociologist Zygmunt Bauman has once written a book "Together, Apart. " It's more like this. Has to do with culturally induced expectations. Which well, are unrealistic. We are doomed to fail. 3. Yes, introvertic people idealize. But not people. Rather "ways of being with people", "ways of connecting with people", "ways of expressing emotions". So in a nutshell we do idealize abstract things, sometimes we do idealize people we care about what doesn't mean we don't see tham for who they are. It just helps us to accept their flaws and go on with the relationship regardless of circumstances. It's complex. I would never expect anyone who is not deeply introvertic- introspective to udnerstand. Extrovertic people, especially males hold many strange minsconceptions about this.
This is to all who are normal clear thinking people . Do to others what you would like done to you. Some people suffer from disorders so when this is brought into a relationship with those who are normal, it creates unhealthy , dysfunctional type behaviours. A healthy individual knows what will give them the almost perfect , beautiful, satisfying caring and fulfilling relationship. Try giving to others all these things that you are longing to receive from them. Whatever you send out, you get back in return.
Vows to always love your spouse : yes, I agree and actually it's why I could never marry.
These vows seem like a lie to me, whatever deeply I am involved. I can promise something I have control on : my attitude and what I do. Feelings, whatever happens, whoever each one evolve to become ? How ? This is absurd !
That's true, it feels like more and more people get into a relationship for the benefits of it and expecting other person to give them things that they feel entitled to. If that's the case, one will eventually taken for granted and worn out.
Because of that, it's difficult to tell who is genuine and actually care about who you are, or they are just here for what you have?
Or is that just the nature of a relationship? 🙃 😢
I think the answer lies in emotional intimacy. People that are just there for what you have will naturally be bored by your true self. They might not be very interested in your thoughts, ideas and instead might just be interested in more shallow things like your skills, your image, your money, your connections, your social status etc.
This is fantastic
Thank you for the awesome videos ❣️
I very enjoyed your video and I totally agree. Greetings from Germany :)
I'm 62 and have been single all of my life, so at first glance it would appear I have nothing to say on the topic of love and romance....except for the fact that all the reasons NOT to be in a bad relationship apply...I have surprised myself recently by wanting to find a relationship for companionship and emotional intimacy...the only things that are important to me now...So, in kind of a backwards way of saying it...if a couple stays together until their children are grown and they retire and step away from many of their social obligations and responsibilities, and then they find they do not have the emotional intimacy they want or need...then, what do they have?
Infj here. Your thoughts are exactly mine.🤯🤯
You translate it with just the exact words
I just whoo ing and clapping during the video. I'm not down on marriage, but I'm down on the fake concept of marriage.
Clay I come to your RUclips channel for your amazing insight in the world of an INFJ. Take a look at the book 'Please Understand Me' vol. I by Keirsey and Bates p.74 on the topic of Mating and temperament.
In the section on INFJs it says an INFJ is attracted to the ESTP (entrepreneur) or the ENTP (inventor). I am curious, how have these two archetypes played a role in your relationships and business ventures. I suspect many INFJs would also benefit from the wisdom you have gained from your experiences.
One of my good friends is ENTP. He's an amazing leader and entrepreneur. I have a family member that is an ESTP and it's been a very hard troubling relationship for me. So I might be a little biased on that particular personality. I find most of the people around me now are smart, having some intellectual ability but also carry some empathy. I'm not sure I believe in determining how good of a match somebody is based on personality alone.
@@ClayArnall That is what I have observed. The ESTPs seem to be a poor match for the INFJ. Thanks again for sharing your personal insight.
Awesome video
Love is not complicated, people are. We need to stop trying to force things into other things that can't fit. Like trying to fit a square peg into a round hole. Some say opposite attracts, can someone explain to me , if am boring as hell and I love being who I am, how can someone who is exciting and adventurous enjoy each others company?
Totally agree! ❤
Sigh, we infj's want depth in everything in a shallow culture. Maybe there's a healthy enfp out there for me somewhere.... ❤
arranged marriages have a huge commitment component that modern ones don't
yes, they are submitting to societal, cultural, and familial expectations geared towards commitment, economic advantage, and tradition.
@@picklechip9621 Those most often do find love in each other, it's just not upfront as the first on the list. Eventually they fall in love because they work and cooperate together with mutual goals and values. At least that is to my understanding and what I have seen with my Indian friends. Thanks for the pickles
@zenongo8 yes, of course. Disordered people will abuse this cultural disposition in cruel ways. I am thoroughly averse to the Indian cast system, it's evil. But I love the people nonetheless.
Have you read any the books by the Gottmams?
Exactly let them go and if they come back it mean to be