Poker Etiquette Fail (shame on the entire table!)
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- Опубликовано: 27 май 2024
- In this video, the caller describes how a new player was not pushed a pot because he did not physically flip over his second card when it was clear the one visible card gave him a flush which beat the other tabled hand. No one spoke up to inform the new player that both cards needed to be turned over to win the pot and the dealer mucks the winning hand. The caller wants to know if it was ethical to not say anything and take the full pot.
Another call that dealing with very questionable ethics: • Player makes 4 Barrel ...
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0:00 - Intro
0:30 - Preflop
0:40 - Flop
1:08 - Hero Decision
1:56 - Turn
1:59 - River
2:36 - Reveal
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You should think of fun players as customers for your poker business. This is an example of poor customer service.
Quit being nice and trying to play Switzerland for these type of callers. Don't remail neutral these type of players should be admonished. Of course he should have given him the pot and he is a scumbag for not. Zero integrity and the dealer proceeded wrongly as well. Floor should have been called. The dealer had a duty to just say something simple like "Sir, I am not allowed to actually turn over your other card for you" That's all that was needed to avoid this.
That guy walks away thinking (sort of rightly) that the dealer/casino just robbed him. He's never coming back and he's telling others to stay away.
@@MyChannel439 if you have ever seen my reactions to similar type call-ins (for example 4 barrel bluff hand) you know that I don’t pull any punches with these types of calls. I think in this case I was more flabbergasted by the fact that no one at the table said anything. And looking back at it there must be more to this story I still can’t believe it went down this way. Bart
I tuned in to the live for this one. Hero knows the truth, he was the villain that night. Great work as always.
I respect your channel, but i think you are wrong by saying "shame on the entire table". I NEVER say anything if i'm not in the hand.
"Should I have split it with him?" No you should've given him the entire pot and said "I don't know what this dealer is smoking". He showed one heart card and attempted to show the other but it bounced and landed face down. I wouldn't drag that pot against my worst enemy, much less a new amateur player. That's the type of shit that makes a person never play again.
Dealers just following his employers rules, it's not on him...
@@dandychiggins9061may not be on the dealer, but as a player, you should act with integrity.
The OP is correct in saying that this is the type of stuff that makes people never want to play again.
I’m 100% keeping the pot against my worst poker enemy who is a miserable POS thst loves to berate bad players about how bad they play until they pick up and leave.
Yep. People won't give that guy much action unless they have the absolute nuts. Not to mention Karma is a thing.
@@dandychiggins9061 The dealer could ask the player if he was mucking his hand. He is not influencing action he's just asking a question to clarify the player's intent and letting the player salvage his own situation. The dealer did NOT do his job properly IMO
The “hero” is WRONG to keep that pot… he KNEW he was beat… and to keep that pot on a technicality like that is bush league. The “hero” did an Ass thing.
so scummy. and hes tryna call this in to what? justify it? lmao
Ya he fd up for that one for sure. Tight nit can't part with 140.. see it all the time.
He cheated the player out of the pot, he says it happened so fast yet he knew from the moment the other player showed the jack of hearts he was beat, and then held his breath hoping the dealer would muck his hand, he's a scumbag
@@googlegoogle1998 I don't say anything in that spot either. It's not my job.
Bart is playing this very politely. Hero is an absolute scumbag for this. He knows this is a douchebag move. Hero, if you read this, youre an asshole. It didnt happen so fast, even by your own account of the hand. You had 30 seconds to tell the rec to table his whole hand, and then another 15 seconds to give him the pot.
The dealer should've 100% told the player he needs 2 cards to win before mucking his hand. The caller is 100% a scumbag. He knew the pot wasn't rightfully his.
Yeah. I know the dealer doesn't want to influence the outcome by suggesting an action to a player, but the guy clearly did not fold his hand. If the dealer didn't want to continue sitting there waiting, he should have said "Show of fold." The dealer should at the very least be written up for deliberately mucking a live hand.
@@twiddlinbitsI don't think telling a player the rules is influencing the game.
As a player too honest for my own good, I would have given the winning player the pot, no hesitation.
Hero and the rest of the table are scumbags. Dealer is an idiot.
The fact the guy calls in and wondered if he was wrong tells me he knows it was wrong and just wants someone to say it was ok.
I cannot believe that a paid dealer would not ask the player to flip over his other card. Ridiculous
yeah i'm surprised the room doesn't try to take more responsibility to keep things straight. but it kind of makes sense too, i guess they want to be involved as little as possible to avoid accountability? especially an individual dealer might not want to get into any sort of argument. "these are the rules!"
Maybe the guy wasn't tipping, so the dealer felt no need to help him out.
Bad dealers will do crap at times to help locals who they know tip and disrespect tourists and newbies. They are as much the regulars customers as they are the dealers and shouldn't be cheated on technicalities.
Shared tips. Dealers are just trying to avoid write ups based on whatever Rivers is mad about that day. Usually it's if someone is holding a phone, in or out of a hand.@@sinatra222
The dealer and management should be more responsible, the casino and game lost a customer, If I knew where this room was I would definitely avoid playing there
There is 0% chance that I keep that pot. I would probably leave the game after seeing another player do this.
Yea I think it's a scummy move. The "it happened so fast" excuse is bullshit because you sit there playing for hours after and you know what you've done. Bart took it very easy on this guy.
No, I think Bart looks like he would do the same stuff.
Its obvious it was a scummy move and Bart should have told him so.
Not make excuses to what the Hero can do to make it right, you call him out and tell him to do the right thing.
No wonder Bart is called "El Weasel" behind his back.
I noticed the “it happened all very fast” thing too, but earlier he had said that they waited like 30 seconds with the one card exposed. And 30 seconds at that point would’ve felt like an eternity. Dude is full of shit.
Hate this call. I’m not happy with the table and really not happy with caller. Scummy dude, sorry. You should 100% have given him the pot. If you see him again, make it right and give him ALL of it. Not a partial. You lost and you know it.
If you really feel bad make it right.
Absolutely
The table is not really supposed to help the new player. It’s really up to the dealer and the caller to let the guy know.
@@arthritisankle if I’m at the table and not in the hand I’m physically reaching over and tabling the guys other card if the dealer and caller won’t. Period. This is fucking ludicrous. Coming from a professional player.
@@arthritisankle you shouldn’t be thinking about rules in such a literal sense in this scenario. You do what’s right for the integrity of the game FFS.
We only know about this odd situation because the hero felt guilty about his actions (or lack of them). He is questioning his own behaviour. And gets called scummy.
He might not have been honourable at the time but he's not scummy. Scummy people don't publise their scummy actions or ask a respected commentator to critique their behaviour.
Lack of integrity all around.
I saw this exact situation in a vegas hand I was not involved in. The winner was a rookie who then was very angry. I mentioned to the dealer that he would never receive another tip from me and reported the situation to the room manager. It's insane the hero didn't give the player the pot and the caller is a scumbag for not giving up the pot. The dealer is an idiot so instantly call the floor and give up the pot. You kept a pot YOU KNEW YOU LOST, have some integrity.
top shelf reply!
Caller knowing he's angling the player and has the losing hand but accepting the win out of a technicality: sHoUlD I hAvE gIvEn tHe pOt?!
4:23 "So I don't know if that's kind of an angle, on my end . . ."
bullshit, dude
100% bullshit
"I didn't even realize... I guess I did realize." Shady.
Everything happened so fast but it took 30 seconds for the dealer to turn over the jack. 🤔
Absolutely wild that anyone could possibly think keeping the pot is okay. The guy would have to be the most obnoxious douche in history, like constantly rude to the dealers and floor, for me to even consider not giving him the pot.
Pretty much this.
Being rude to the staff is like the point where I am going to do everything I can to get you.
Or if he smelled REALLY bad and refused to put on deodorant lmao
Did you have to spellcheck "douche"? I did!
Bart: Surprised you were so lenient to this guy considering you are an ambassador of ethical poker! Yes, what he did was a scummy move. Especially after the other player showed him his hand and was being friendly. The dealer, and the table, too should’ve said he needs to table both cards. But the caller, especially, has the highest moral responsibility in this scenario.
I've been the guy at the table that speaks up and tells the "new" player they need two cards to win and have gotten scolded by the losing player that it's none of my business to get involved. Based on what this caller said I feel the dealer definitely should have said something. Caller still shouldn't have accepted the pot regardless of the dealer failing to do this, in my opinion.
If you're sure that you should get involved don't worry about scolding, I've been scolded by these losers, I give it right back to them in an aggressive manner, you know their type, loud as a motorbike but wouldn't bust a grape in a fruit fight 😂😂😂
@@theadventuresofslim3057 This. 100 times this. Why would I care what some zero integrity scumbag says to me. I'm going to do what I think is right and anyone who doesn't like it can pound sand.
I definitely would not have said anything if I wasn't it the pot. The dealer definitely should have.
I’m trying to think of any scenario where you don’t give the guy the entire pot 🤔 Nope, can’t find one. Especially with the Jack of hearts tabled
I %100 would have spoke up to tell you that you're wrong.
To each his own, I’d consider him an scummy PoS
Hero called because he is guilty, and he should feel guilty. This is some top tier BS and to say "he left too quickly" is kind of ridiculous. More like "I was too busy stacking my chips"
Nothing to discuss here. Give pot to the flush guy 100%
As a dealer : if a player just flips one card over like put in on the face down card I'm mucking it. If a player goes to flip his cards over to table it and one card tumbles and lands face down I'm turning that card over because he attempted to show both cards.
As a player: if I know he's a new player I'm gonna tell him the rules and give him the pot. If it's a reg I'm taking the pot because they know the rules and are just tring to Angle you by not showing the other card.
Side note: we As reg players we need to stop scaring new players away. Stop telling players how to play, ect. There are to many poker rooms now and we are in shortage of players atm. Just be nice to new players
Most reasonable response
I have never seen a dealer not tell a guy he needs to show both to win when a player shows one card that would win it. I couldn't imagine being a dealer and not explaining the rule.
Pretty much how I handle it.
Regs: you know the rules, no we are not running it twice, we are here to kill each other ( in the game obviously).
Fish / new guy : you don't know the rules, we can run it twice, take your time making your decision.
@@MonkeyPunchZPoker it definitely screams the dealer knew what he was doing and probably had a reason for doing it. ive had the floor/dealers favor me in a decision even when it might not have been right to do so overall
@MonkeyPunchZPoker as a dealer you not suppose to tell a player anything pertaining to hand. After hand is over I would explain the rules.
You give the guy the pot, and explain why he effed up. Can't believe you kept it lol
I know why the guy kept it.
It is the only way he will ever win a pot.
Hero should be labeled a villain for life. Not only does he know he's beat, but he also said he saw the guys other card (Qh), and that he believes his opponent tried to show both cards and they just bounced funny.
If your opponent intentionally just shows one card that's one thing, but that's not what sounds like happened. Unlike Bart, I would call this guy a scumbag for this. Not only that, but now he's calling in hoping Bart justifies his actions. Caller knows damn well who won the pot.
That's the kind of thing that will turn someone off from poker. He may never play again after that, especially being a new player
I was a poker-only dealer for about a year. If a new player ever tabled one card I would tell him two to win and give the guy a chance. That said if a hand is ever advanced forward 100% face down I'm snap killing it before I do anything.
This is 100% the right thing to do, although you COULD be called for influencing the result by telling a player 'what to do' and Bart's caller (who is a scumbag for keeping the pot) could have got the floor called on you (hopefully the floor would back you up, but I could see this situation escalating). I think a better option would be "Are you mucking your hand sir?" and wait for him to fix his own mistake. This way it avoids you getting into any trouble with the dirtbag player.
Bart: "It's hard to give an overall answer to what you should do in this type of situation" Pretty easy really. Every person at the table is scummy, including the dealer and the caller. Someone just speak up and tell the noob the technicality so he can get the pot he clearly won. I get it's less clearcut for the caller in the awkward situation, but at least give him half the pot back after that. It's 1/3 for 50BB FFS, don't tap the glass.
He is full of sh*t, he makes it seem like it happened so fast. It takes 1 SECOND to say something to this guy, you really gotta protect yourself playing against these scumbags!!
Keeping the pot, in this situation, is a scum bag move!
When I'm dealing in spots like this I tell the player you have to show both to win, espessially when it is an obv winner with one card.
And especially if he clearly attempted to flip them up but just happens to land face down
That's ok caller. I hear Hell is nice this time of year. When you're there make sure to say hi to the dealer.😅
Probably not punishable by hell, on any account here, tbh. It’s not that serious.
@@ImDougieI mean, we're already in the world of gambling, if even by gamblers standards you're scummy i don't think you're a good person 🤣
How do you keep this pot?
@3:04 caller says the dealer took about 30ish seconds to muck the opponent's cards. That is a heck of a long time to just be sitting there. The guy didn't think...."hey dealer, why haven't you shipped the pot my way yet?
Barts being nice. Guy knew what he was doing and calling in to try and get bart to justify his move and rid him of guilt. Scumbag move
Bart is totally grandpaing this guy.
If he says the guy is a scum bag, the guy won't listen to anything else Bart is saying.
If he agrees that the guy isn't necessarily a scum bag, but you have a moral obligation to tell the new guy.
Then Bart can blame the dealer for not doing it right as well, but still throw in the moral obligation thing.
I like the way Bart handled it, I think he probably won't get through to this sick nit, but he can frame it so future listeners will think or at least consider that they have an obligation to new players.
My 2 cents.
Not only would I have spoken up, I would have even tried to turn his other card over whether I was in the hand or not. If you can’t handle losing to the point you’re Ok winning on a technicality you shouldn’t be playing
Hero frames this in a very strange way and I'm surprised Bart didn't ask the guy to clarify even further. Maybe Bart realized he would have to call this guy a liar and did not want to do that.
If the hand really played out like this I think The Caller/Dealer/All other players are absolute scumbag anglers, borderline cheating. It sounds like he even tried to table his hand and one just accidentally flipped over. I find it hard to believe the guy just sat there in silence and watched the pot get pushed away without saying anything. Shame on everyone involved.
At my local Hollywood, dealers aren't aloud to tell you to table both cards. in this scenario the dealer would have said" i see a pair of queens with A,9,8" They usually give plenty of time for the player to then table both of their cards. the rule they use is" the player is responsible for turning his or her hand over at showdown"
Unquestionably the caller is way out of line here, and I don't really buy his explanation of "everything happened too fast". I really struggle to imagine a decent person not just giving the guy the pot.
I think everyone’s looking at this the wrong way. A lot of houses the dealer aggressively tells you to show both cards to win a) because it’s the rule and it’s their job to facilitate the game b) because if you don’t it’s way more likely you get a Mexican standoff between two players scared to show they bet with air and seeing if they can win only showing one. I’d imagine the show two cards rule exist to prevent posturing, angling and BS and to speed the game up. It’s absurd people act like a BS procedure rule should win or lose someone a pot
I once called a big river bet with QQ against AJ on a jack high board, and when I flipped my cards, they bounced and both hit face down. I reflexively grabbed them and flipped them face up, and the dealer awarded the other player the pot. I get that this situation is extremely frustrating, and if it’s a cash game and I’m in the spot of the caller, I’m never not giving him the pot. He won it fair and square, and caller is absolutely angling a very inexperienced player here.
If I were hero, I'd 100% tell the newb villain that he needs to table both cards face up to win. And I'd never complain if the dealer or another player explained the rule to villain, even if the casino rules frowned upon that or even barred that, via "one player to a hand." My reasoning would be that I'd never, ever make that mistake myself, and I don't need to be freerolling for an edge that the opponent would never in a million years get to freeroll me with. Combine that with creating pleasant conditions for newbies and fish, and it's a no-brainer to just do the right thing as hero.
But as another player at the table, whether I'd say anything, really depends upon where I was playing. Some casinos take a pretty hard line on "one player to a hand" and might even suggest that because they have to now ship the pot to villain, you should ship the amount of the pot to hero, for having interfered and helped villain play his hand.
You can even take the fact that the dealer is trying hard to give villain a chance to table both cards, but not advising him to, as a sign that you may very well be in such a hard-ass "one player to a hand" casino where NO player errors should prompt anyone else to help them.
As a dealer, I've been in this situation before and been told it's okay to remind players "all cards play to win." I don't outright tell them to flip up their cards, but i do give them the chance to correct their mistake.
why not just say it?
"Bro it's either you show them both to call or your flip them both to muck"
?
These are the moments that continue to tarnish poker of being filled with liars, cheaters, and dishonorable people... cus it is
The villain clearly had a flush, cards speak at showdown. Just table the unrevelead card and move on. The dealer should be reprimanded and the caller should be ashamed. Scummy move.
This caller should be ashamed of themselves.
Grimey move, way to run new people out of poker
Making mistakes in poker is one of the ways you learn. Sometimes it's expensive but I bet that guy will never not table his hand again.
i see your bet, and i raise about the fact that he's not gonna play another hand for a long time after that.
The dealer was way out of line for not asking him to flip the other card over.
And the so called "hero" turned out to be a villian.
Once a player told me he had K10 and I flip over my hand and I flop 2 pair.
He throws his hand in the muck but goes runner runner for the win.
But since he didn't show me or the dealer I can't take his word because people misread their hand or they could be cheating.
He was already drinking so I bought him a couple of beers, he only lost $50 to me in that hand.
"it was probably about 2 or 3 weeks ago" - "i have not yet seen the guy I've been back several times" - "i go there once or twice a month".
this guy is just a lying scumbag. even thieves feel bad about the fact they stole. you stole dude.
If this wasn't a newbie I would have kept the pot since an experienced player knows that he needs to show both cards and to my eternal annoyance some just don't do that even if it is clear they have won the hand. Against one of these "special" players I would have gladly kept the pot and even insisted on the pot if the dealer had pushed the chips to my opponent. Against a newbie I would have advised him of the rules and suggested he turn over the second card if he wants to win the pot.
Trash player. He deserves a year of bad rivers for that bs move.
I was playing a $1/$2 hand once with QQ. I was out of position and an over card to my QQ came on the turn. I checked turn and the villain checked also. The river did not change much and instead of betting, I checked again. The villain bet $65 dollars. It was heads-up and I turned over my QQ to let him know I had a tough decision and to try to get a reaction. He was a new, young player and he tabled a lower pocket pair - thinking I had folded or mucked. My QQ was the winning hand. He hardly had anything behind, so I told him to pull back his $65 river bet and I dragged the pot.
Everyone is in the wrong here. I think calling the floor was mandatory, this is utterly insane considering he has 100% the winning hand from the dealer prespective. Cannot believe not one player intervine, especially hero just scamming this dude's money. The dealer should get fired for stuff like this - he is dangerous not just for rec - him not mentioning anything and just handing the losing hand the chips is a red flag that I cannot trust any action he does
Something like this happened to me before. I had a straight and beat the guys 2 pair. When i flipped my hand over 1 of my cards slid over the "muck line" and the dealer scooped my hand and passed the guy the pot. I argued with her that I was just showing my hand and it was an accident but she must've been having her time off the month and wouldn't even acknowledge anything. Everyone on the table was against me too and all i could do was file a complaint form against the dealer and thats it
You should have called the floor.
@@yoniker83 I did, they're the ones that told me all I can do is file a useless complaint
I love Rivers Des Plaines, but the angle shooting is Insane. But it is totally worth it, it is a very soft room.
What type of angels? High value Cherubim? Seraphim?
Or just regular ol’ archangels and Virtues?
And what type of gun?
@@jamespohl-md2eqGD AUTO Correct! 🤣
If anyone knows this caller (or any of the players in this hand, for that matter), they should be named, shamed, and shunned. This is one of the worst callers I've ever seen Bart talk to. Just absolutely disgusting.
I got scolded by another player when I (not in the hand) told a guy to show both cards. The only way I knew about that rule was because someone was nice enough to tell me once.
Yo!! That's 100% the dealers fault. I was a floor for 3 years before becoming pit boss and if the dealer never said "2 cards to win", they f'd up. They're not doing their job.
I see a lot of bad suggestions for the dealer here. I believe the proper question the dealer should ask the player is, "Is that a fold sir?" NOT the other things posted here.
The dealer taking forever to grab the cards was gracious enough. As a dealer, it's not your job to affect the action during the hand. He went super slow, to see if the guy was going to say "oops" and reach out to flip his card up. The guy didn't. that's on him.
1. He's been back several times since the incident.
2. He only goes there once or twice a month.
I'd love to know the real story of this hand.
Major D move. If a guy shows me the winner he’s getting the pot. Not to mention he turned over a winning hand. I’m sliding it right his way and if he starts to walk away I’m stopping him.
#1 Villian: Dealer - Come on. A simple "you gotta show both cards to win" gets this done 99% of the time.
#2 Villian: Caller - Have some integrity. He won the pot, ship it.
#3 Villian: QhJh new player - Get a clue man. I guess this was a learning experience and I appreciate he didn't blow a gasket.
I’m usually the person on these etiquette calls that says “screw the person that made a mistake”.
But even I’m going to say, unequivocally here, the hero should have given the guy the pot and is a jerk. The guy clearly intended to table his hand and wasn’t trying to be deceptive or get an angle (as is quite often the case in these calls).
I’ve seen this before. The table+dealer silently colluded against him because he was an outsider. They probably didn’t like something about him (arrogant, drunk, rich, hot wife) and they were all regulars “looking out” for eachother.
The hero and the dealer both showed their true colors here… a shady shade of grey
I would happily keep that pot forever and if any of the regs would've pointed out his mistake during the hand we might have gotten into a brawl ...
Found the hero.
Its one thing to punish a player DURING a hand for a mistake but its completely different when theres no edge to be gained after all action is completed. Not part of the game to win that way, the only reason that rule is intended is to prove he had the winner, but in this case, it was 100% without a doubt he had a winner.
Two things here. When the dealer makes a correct decision according to the rules, who is going to 'overrule' the dealer in a situation when it will cost another player their chips? Then there once was a situation in a cash game in which Doug Polk noticed that there were two queens of clubs on the board; so what should happen if the flush player held a second jack of hearts in addition to the one he showed, who would be the scumbag then?
“Hero????” This is just an outrageous.
as a beginner, I was told not to say anything if you are not in the hand. Let dealer do his job, or you will upset some players whether you are right or wrong. I understand why the table is quiet.
This is not true in some cases. Everyone at the table is is responsible for upholding the integrity of the game. If you saw someone put the wrong amount of chips in the pot or you saw the dealer pushing the pot to the wrong player when both hands have been fully tabled, then you should speak up. This situation is a bit different since the guy didn't fully table his cards.
If a hand is tabled and the dealer makes a mistake and reads the hand/board wrong it is 100% your responsibility as a player to correct them and make sure the winning hand is awarded the pot
This is crazy because I had an almost identical spot a couple of years ago.
All in with the guy next to me, he told me that he had a set, which was good. He went to turn over his cards but they spun out of his hand and fell face down basically in the muck. No one else heard him say anything or saw his cards. I saw them as they flipped over and knew he had it. Dealer mucked the hand and pushed me the pot. I did what this caller didn't do and tried to give the pot to the other guy but they wouldnt let me and the floor backed up the decision.
I agreed to keep playing with the benefit of a big stack and give him the money at the end of the game. It worked out because i didnt have enough on me to rebuy and he did. I still felt bad though because he should have had the big stack and i should have been gone.
Reminds me of a time I flopped top two pair while playing 2/5 and some kid who looked like they just turned 21 tried to bet $100 into me with a flush draw, but grabbed the wrong chip and accidentally bet $1000.
The floor was called and ruled that the bet stays, so I called and checked it down because I felt bad.
My hand held up and the kid went ballistic reaching across the table to knock over my stack of chips and calling me a scumbag before being escorted out.
I don’t feel guilty because I didn’t have to check it down and the kid had outs, but I still think about it sometimes because it’s the only time someone ever called me a scumbag…
I had this happen to me when I was new to the game and I didn’t realize I had to show both cards 🤦🏽I rivered the nuts and showed the ace thinking the guy would just muck but that didn’t happen, nobody said a word and the floor decided to chop the pot
I guess I got lucky to chop and learned a very valuable lesson
If I see anything similar I always speak up because I’ve been there. Its a dick move to keep the pot like that. We play poker and take each others money sure…but we can do that without being scummy
The other players were not in the position to rectify the situation. They did not want to be “that guy”. If anyone was to give the other guy a break, it would have to be the hero. The dealer should have said, “Two cards to win the pot” or something to that effect. I was in a similar situation in a tournament, where either one player who was all in against me would’ve been knocked out had I won or I would’ve been down half of my chips. My hand was “three pair” while her hand had two pair and a better kicker. The dealer was shoving the pot my way, and she thought that was correct also but I spoke up and made sure the pot went her direction. In the end I ended up in the final three in the tournament against her and one other person, and we chopped the prize money. Maybe I would have won more money if she had been knocked out but I’ll put it down as karma.
I even think Bart to be wrong for even saying half the pot. Its his money and no different than you seeing him drop $280, picking it up, and putting it in your pocket. Its no different and Hero's guilt is worse than such a small amount of $$$. I would go straight up give it all to charity and If I see the guy, give him back everything, including an apology.
Caller sat there for 30 seconds and didn't say, "turn your other card face up?" GTFO. He scum-bagged.
Hero is 100% wrong to keep the pot
A couple weeks ago, was in a small pot on the river with 1 other guy, nobody showed right away. I had 4th or 5th pair so I flipped up my paired 5, not expecting it to win. The other guy showed a paired Ace which clearly beat me so I put my other card face down. It took about 15 seconds and nothing had happened when the dealer clearly said "I need to see two cards to have a winner". I continued to wait another few seconds while both the dealer and I are looking at the guy and I say "gotta show two cards" (we were at opposite ends of the table so I don't know for sure if he heard me). He continues to do nothing, so I shrug and flip my 2nd card over. Nobody else said anything but both the dealer and I did , so I took the pot with no qualms at all. Guy had plenty of chances.
“ I did end up keeping the whole thing” lololol jfc
As a dealer you are supposed to tell the player he has the right to win the pot only if he shows both cards. Even if he refuses, the dealer is not supposed to muck the obvious winner but call the floorman.
Tbh all this is bullshit. In my 10 years of dealing such situation happened to me a lot of times and when i see the player is obviously tabling his hand but 1 card flips, i just flip it myself. I am not supposed to do that but it saves bunch of time wasted, which means money wasted for casino in rake, players in less hands per hour played and dealer in tips. This dealer deserves to be slapped.
No surprise considering the area. I stopped playing at the shoe in hammond cuz of the atrocious etiquette of the players. No one said a word, real classy chicago
If the caller sees this particular player in The Poker Room, he definitely needs to give this guy a rebate. But I am completely shocked at these stakes not a single player piped up and verbally told this guy that he had to show both cards. What I find more often than not at these tables is a lot of these players are always willing to talk about the rules and regulations right or wrong, as well as the absolute most tilting thing and talk poker strategy at the table. Why the dealer didn’t offer this information to the player is also a bit shocking to me. Obviously it’s up to us to know and understand the rules but the dealer should’ve picked up on the the fact that this particular player was fairly new to the game and offered some assistance. JMO
Any time I've played at Rivers Philly, the dealers always made all players in hand "flip em". No slow rolling, at least in Philly.
Per the situation: It was the SB's pot, dude knew it, and should have absolutely given him the pot....because it was HIS pot!
I read the comments before seeing the reveal and I was expecting a borderline decision regarding the ethics of the caller. After seeing the reveal, caller is indeed a pos.
This happened to me once, I flipped the card that gave me the low straight flush, dealer considered it a fold and mucked my cards. Villain took the pot and told me he had me beat (he didn't have to show because I had first action). I've never been to that casino since but I've heard the rules have changed.
Totally against the spirit of Poker to even say this dude has a right to the pot. I wouldnt even consider keeping that money. Insane..
Disgusting behavior. Playing 1/3 is one of the lowest stakes and people at these games could be beginners. How can you encourage people to play poker if you play like this? “Don’t be a jerk” is kind of the way everyone should play. Guy loses the hand and takes the money on a stupid technicality. Awful.😣
Where does "One player per hand" come into play? Can the dealer say "it takes two cards to win."?
Hey Bart, I have a question for you on another issue I saw come up that I thought was BS. There was a hand I witnessed where the guy to my immediate right that was calling a raise postflop and accidentally knocked over the chips from one of his stacks (had 2 $100 chip on top) and only the 2x $100 chips crossed the line. The guy already had his calling chips (exact amount needed, I think it was around $30 worth) in hand and was acting like he was going to call, but then the 2x $100 chips crossed the line and the dealer announced a raise to $200. Obviously, argument ensues and the floor is called. No one else did anything and the action actually froze while this was sorted out.
Floor comes over and says that since the chips crossed the line it's in play/live and was now the new bet. There were 3 other people in the hand (action went: SB bets the flop BB called, the 3rd person in MP raised and then the guy to my right who accidentally knocked the $100 chips in was on the CO). Now the SB folds, and the BB thinks and then raises all in forcing out the original raiser and it gets back around to the guy on the CO. He is VERY angry at the guy making the squeeze play b/c of the CO's misfortune, and he calls the all in. Both table hands and the BB actually runner runner sucks out on the guy for trips and the C/O had Top/top.
What would be YOUR ruling if you ran a casino and this situation happened? If the chip was accidentally knocked over and rolled across the line but the guy had calling chips in hand, would you allow him to take back the 2 x $100 chips if the action was still frozen and the game state had not changed? Or was the floor correct that the chip was now live and the bet was at $200?
The “hero” here is exactly what’s wrong with the game today. He should be to embarrassed to ever tell this story.
The dealers job is to run the game and they should inform the player before awarding the pot about the rules. Especially if they are new and don't know the house rules.
What is interesting and Bart referenced this, is the player revealed 1 card and it was enough to make a 5 card hand, which is all you really need, obviously since you only can have a 5 card hand. The technicality of having to show both cards is irrelevant in this case since the caller can't beat his hand.
Not really related to this situation, but I was in a home game poker tournament. And this guy was way beyond drunk and me and him were all in, and I asked him if he had a pair and he tables ak high thinking he won. I then table my hand right in front of me, but I was overly excited and they literally flipped and landed face down. I immediately grabbed them, flipped them back up right to show I had pocket 9s. They ended up awarding him with the pot because he insisted I mucked and they believed him. I'm like ok, why would I muck the winner? I asked if he had a pair, and he tables ak...so why then would I muck 99? Makes no sense. Mistake I'll never make again. I was furious tho
Gross. I once had a similar case where I obviously won but there was a problem:
I flipped over the winner towards the middle of the table. One card tumbled and ended up face down. Within half a second I put it face up again.
Now the recreational villain insisted that this was "a fold". Another rec chimed in.
The dealer seemed clueless and did not do anything.
I immediately called the floor. The villain and curiously the other rec kept bombarding him with shit about how I obviously mucked my hand.
I called for the poker boss. They both blatantly lied to him, too. It was hard for me to even get a word in.
At this point I had already given up on the money. The rulings at that casino had never been convincing.
But props to the boss - he finally went to see the recording and ruled that my motion and intention was obviously to flip over my hand.
Even now the other rec kept objecting and arguing.
So after >5min of wasted time I got my smallish (~40bb) pot.
I also do table my cards more carefully nowadays.
Same thing happened to a new player at the Flamingo a few years ago. I had a few drinks in me and said something, and two of the other regs at the table berated me for doing so.
Just curious: If this technicality/rule dictates that the caller is the winner of the hand, is the caller then actually allowed to give the pot to the villain (or split it with them)? As per the rules of the house (absurd as they may be), the caller has technically won the pot. It is now part of his stack. Now if he gives this money off his stack to another player, isn't that "going south"? How is it different than if my buddy who's sitting at the same table as me busts, and I give him half my stack so he can continue playing?
The dealer is never getting a tip from me in the future.
Bart would never say this. He’s having an off day. Caller is coming for a confession, hoping to get absolution and Bart shoulda told him it was the wrong move. His polite tone and Midwest charm must’ve got Bart confused? It’s 100% the wrong play and it’s not even close
This is on the dealer. Dealer should have asked, "Are you mucking your hand?" Hero will try to win within the rules.
I play to have fun at 1/3 or 3/5. I'm upper middle class. There's no way I'm going to take hundreds of dollars from someone based on their ignorance of a technicality. That's morally disgusting.