@@AnastasioCostaMeno Another interesting angle would have been Hell Fighter 17 attacking and taking 17's family as hostage, forcing him to fuse with the deal being to spare them. Maybe even have 17 beating Hell Fighter 17's ass until he pulls out the hostage card to...well...just give 17 some more characterization while showing how cool he is.
-Singles out Giru as being kept in the story -never mentions him again -gives no time or logical reason as to when he would enter the story -refuses to elaborate further
I remember some girl playing the violin in Buenos Aires' subway, and she was playing Dan Dan so beautifully. I genuinely feel bad for Americans who grew up with some bootleg guitar riff instead of Dan Dan Kokoro Hikareteku. Latin America? We won the Dragon Ball lottery. Both Spanish and Portuguese localizations had some baller versions of Cha-La, We Gotta Power and Dan Dan, and also the outros. And the OG JP soundtrack and no censorship. Fuck yeah, awesome childhood.
I feel like the other Shadow Dragons could be used as a way for the side characters to actually get major story-relevant fights with some actual consequence. Maybe Adult/Teen Gotenks, Gohan, Piccolo, Uub, Pan, Tien, etc. could get some time to shine for once.
The Shadow Dragon arc in this version would be: Main villain gets born, goes to Earth, beats up the earth defenders and then gets beat. That is not a story, that's a filler episode. So yea, I agree that we need a far bigger arc with more moving parts and characters to make a final arc the series deserves.
I was so mad when Trunks and Goten offered to fuse, only for the show to tell me Goku was the only character who mattered. We got too much time with Trunks who was boring for no reason, and everyone loved Goten in the short time we saw him. I would also have the original Dragon Balls trying to escape the solar system as a last ditch effort to avoid being over used, but have a two or three different crews fetching them, because the show was a slog only seeing the same two or three character 100% of the time. It could lead to an interesting dynamic if Baby finds a group completely unaware of what happened earlier, perhaps infecting/possessing them on the way to Earth, only to steal the wish before revealing itself and taking over.
because subconsciously even mark knows what toriyama figured out years ago: gohan simply isn't a "main character" archetype and thus is oftentimes difficult to slot into roles that *aren't* reactive in nature. he fights *in response* to things. that doesn't make for a compelling aggressive character who always wins (like goku). gohan doesn't really have a passion to fight *unless* there's something looming overhead that he has time to prepare for. thus: reactive. people don't want to hear it or believe it due to nostalgia, but when you take blinders off and just look at gohan's character traits, progression, etc., you can see that he's had a complete character arc that cannot develop further no matter what by GT. there's no more his character can give or offer *besides* nostalgia; he will *always* be reactive. so mark is clearly subconsciously slotting gohan into roles that fit the archetype despite what he says he wants for the character itself. everyone wants gohan to be *more* than he is, but he frankly just *isn't* and people gotta live with that.
@neonhalos I agree with pretty much everything you said. I do think Gohan can be developed into a main character, but that is absolutely not his natural characterization. He would have to undergo some seriously transformative event.
@@SeisoYabai yeah, exactly, and we've kind of seen that a little bit in canon already. like if you look at what he went through in the future timeline (the original one), what gohan experiences is exactly the type of chain of events that would need to occur for Gohan to become a main character in the main timeline. *everyone* he cares about has to die, just about, for Gohan to convert from a reactive character to a proactive character. even if Gohan himself isn't weak at all, he's still mentally and emotionally dependent on those around him to gauge just how serious of a situation is. but when the androids kill everyone, Gohan has no choice anymore. he doesn't get the opportunity to train with goku in the time chamber, nor anyone else really. it's a rapid succession of loss and it hardens him quickly. and as such, he just as quickly and rapidly develops to rise up to the occasion not just for one fight but for *all* subsequent fights there could theoretically be. because after him, it's no one else until trunks gets old enough to learn to fight. and that's kinda why I wish we got more of a fleshed out manga or spin off anime about future Gohan that chronicled his development after that point because that would satiate a bit of people's desire to see Gohan just be an unmitigated badass lol. oh well 😔
Mann and here I was thinking Mark was gonna post "Every Pointy Ears in Dragon Ball. What it means and why it changes everything" But GT is a good substitute
@@ThelronFjord I think in daima the new demon king said to dende something along the lines of his pointy ears meaning someone in his family tree was a demon or something
@@CORNZILAAyeah and considering mr popo was right behind him in that shot with pointy ears too, they also basically confirmed that popo and everyone else with pointy ears are also descended from the demon realm
Pointy ears? Since Shin and the core people have pointy ears, it is better to treat it as a otherworldly treat, instead of a demonic one. Also we should keep in mind what Elder Moori told to the other namekians in the Granola Arc.
Honesty i do not mind how vegeta got ssj4 in the original show as it shows that vegeta now can move past his pride and ego in order to protect the planet and family, plus asking goku to fuse shows that even more.
I don't wanna be harsh but I don't think this is good. The way you're describing it, after the whole debacle with the black star dragon balls nobody on Earth does anything until Baby shows up except asking for info from the namekians. There's no grand tour, no looking for a solution, nothing. That's a lot of passivity and a lot of empty space until Baby shows up to kick the plot back up again. There's also no timer to the Earth's destruction so there's no rush to get things solved. Also, why is Baby's lab the only thing that gets resurrected by the corrupted dragon's wish? Why not the whole Tuffle civilization? Also, the problem with the shadow dragons, in my opinion at least, wasn't that there were too many, it's that only Goku and Pan were allowed to fight them. The solution would've been to have each member of the cast to fight an individual dragon at the same time. One for Goku, one for Vegeta, Gohan, Piccolo, Uub, Pan, hell you could even throw adult Gotenks in there I don't wanna throw shit but this really feels like it needed more time in the planning phase and more beta readers
Damn right you are. The shadow dragons show up and most of the cast are like "Yeah ok, have fun with that. We are just gonna sit back eating movies and watching popcorn."
There's a lot of weird holes and problems in this that I think end up feeling worse off than even the original was. First off, we're keeping Giru... But the way this story is laid out, he wouldn't even exist, so saying we're keeping him is pointless. Second, while I understand that a video like this would be meant to convey a severely stripped back skeleton of what would be a much longer set of events than what a 38-minute video would go into detail on, it still feels like it's really lacking in content for 75% of the cast. Goten is mentioned once, Gohan seems to really only be there as a plot device for Pan, Trunks just doesn't do anything anymore because we swapped him out for Uub, and even then Uub doesn't do much more than Gohan does. Piccolo gets one moment, Vegeta gets a transformation before Goku that doesn't really amount to anything because nobody gets to finish off Baby. Super Saiyan 4 now lacks a lot of the weight it had, no longer really being tied to embracing the Great Ape form as the Saiyan's heritage and merging it with the legend of the Super Saiyan, creating something wholly new in what could probably be described as the epitome of the Saiyan Race. We spared Baby in this, which is an interesting idea because that's kinda what Goku is all about (See Tien, Piccolo, Vegeta), but he only gets mentioned one other time at the end. Reducing the Shadow Dragon(s) to just being Omega certainly a choice that cuts down on a lot of the fluff and unnecessary parts of the original arc and just takes it right to the big action points, but it all happens so suddenly with Omega showing up and then everyone suddenly having to fight the Big Bad and then it's over. That's not really an Arc, that's just one really big fight scene. If I were to make any change, I would personally keep the seven dragons, but have everyone split up to fight them because Dragonball NEEDS to utilize its cast of characters more rather than simply reducing it to Goku and whoever he decides to work with that day. Have Goten and Trunks go off together and have Gotenks return, have Piccolo and Gohan team up again, Vegeta takes one on himself, Goku takes on Nuova, etc. Or if you want Goku in all the fights, just have him team up with someone different idk. TLDR I feel like there are a lot of missed opportunities in cutting down the series into the parts you like without actually filling in the gaps of what missing them would entail. I don't think a single video would do a rewrite justice. But what does a random commenter know anything about dragonball compared to the expert?
Yes, exactly! I thought some of the ideas here are interesting like swapping Trunks for Uub and making Pan more than a damsel in distress. But I wasn't convinced on many of the ideas and you summed it up perfectly
I would have kept the original frame as it is, since the first arc is a call back to the RR Arc, besides all those encounters serves the purpouse of the Universal Genki-dama, so trim the fat of useless characters and villains and more challenges for Pan to get the SSJ and Trunks to SSJ2 or SSJ3?, major change will come with Baby infecting Goku instead of Vegeta, so that would give more sense of Baby attaining the Golden Ozaru (surprise to all unlocked with SSJ) from the traumatic extintion of the tsufuru at the hands of that transformation and finally give Vegeta the shine to save the day, here I loved the idea of Vegeta getting the SSJ4 first since he is more expert than anyone, for Super 17 Arc all resurrected Saiyans get at least SSJ level, Frieza showing Cooler's like transformation, Cell's improved techniques, etc. So good matches for all side characters and a love letter to fans for abandoned them for the saiyan cast after getting SSJ, and finally BD Arc the concept is great what failed here was the execution so I just a re-work of the Saint Seiya formula where the cast fights their respective "counterparts" or maybe alligning the wish origin with the specific character or someone close who made the wish.
I do like the fact that Baby while growing more in more saiyan like accentuates all their negative traits while SSJ4 has the Saiyans draw even more on their roots to use in a positive manner
Though he should have been included in the ending as an addition, having survived the prior arc realizing what DROVE the tyrannical saiyans in a quest for power in the first place fighting Omega Shenron after he and Buu giving Uub enough strength needed to launch a counterattack, with Vegeta making amends for his race's misdeeds to the very people his race once oppressed. It will be a slow process, but gradually the tuffles in spirit aid in the advancement of earth's technology thanks to Baby's knowlidge of tuffle technology, now working alongside a simmered-down Hatchiyak as the new protectors of the Dragon Balls alongside Uub, so they will never be abused again (my version swaps Super 17 for Plan to Eradicate the Saiyans).
So to be critical of this, I did not like how Mark handle SSJ4 at all in this. Let me explain: While Vegeta taking control of his own body and becoming an SSJ4 makes sense him being the first one to do it and not having a fight makes the form feel a bit hollow, like it is just there for no reason other than to be used in the next arc... and then Vegeta loses in said form making it feel like it was a pointless transformation that did nothing. Goku getting it off screen and no SSJ4 Gogeta also make it feel like a nothing burger. If this how SSJ4 was handled at the time it would have been remembered as the disappointing GT form who's only redeeming quality is that it looks cool.
I can see what your issue is. In my mind I wanted to make this a moment where Vegeta finally achieved something Goku hadn’t and it was because of what made him different to Goku. Looking back, while I stand by my creative decision, I should have just bit the bullet and made the video 5 or 10 mins longer to flesh it out and explain my thought process more thoroughly
Personally, the way I'd do it is like this: While Golden Great Ape Baby is going rampant in that city (they're not on Planet Plant in this one, right?), Goku, while still very tired, looks up and sees the moon as well, causing him to transform into initially just a great ape now that he's got a tail but powering up to a golden great ape shortly after. As he has no control over the form yet he just instinctively goes after Baby but takes quite a beating from him, until Pan and maybe his sons come near him to try and get him to go back to his senses after an emotional speech. We then get that same classic SS4 transformation sequence and Goku, now gifted with the energy of the other half-saiyans, gets the upper hand in the battle and after a while knocks GGA Baby to the ground. It is then, while he's getting up, that he sees his reflection and that of the ravaged city in that crumbled building that he stars to feel remorseful and the following events go just as Mark tells them.
Yeah, I thought that's where this was going as well. Since he talks about how GT squandered the only redeeming portion of the SA17 arc, I thought this was going to be his way of fixing it... by bringing back the villains killed on Earth and giving that arc a more prominent role in developing Uub and Pan while showcasing how the other Z fighters are doing when compared to their old enemies and *possibly* even allowing for interactions between Raditz/Nappa and Goku/Vegeta (or basically any other member of Goku's family). It would not only allow room for at least one villain to reform (say, Raditz, after witnessing the Super Saiyan transformation deciding that Goku could maybe teach him something after all), but would also allow us to get the King Cold fight the original series never allowed for.
@@FreeViewBlog I agree that in place of the Super 17 Arc, should be a kind of a "Anti-Z Fighter Arc." Much like how 1st Form Cell is in the background of the Android Arc, I think Omega Shenron should arrive on Earth from the remains of Namek well before the start of the Shadow Dragon Arc. I think it's in character for him to believe that the villain resurrection is a fitting punishment for the abuse of the dragon balls, only for him to step in when the old villains are dealt with (seeing at least 1 redemption would be crazy, I like what you're thinking). "If you want something done right, do it yourself." This arc may be a good point to allow SS4 to claim some victories, as well as a better way to explain the drain of Senzu beans before the Omega Shenron drama. Hell, nothing saying that SS4 Gogeta could slot in here. If the Buu Saga filler showed everyone watching the Z Fighters against Buu, why wouldn't they try and copy the fusion technique from watching Gotenks over the years?
Imma be honest I’m not the biggest fan of this rewrite. It has a lot of good elements especially baby that’s pretty top tier but cutting out two major arcs, all the shadow dragons and ssj4 not winning a major fight kinda makes this video feel half done.
@@wxchief6737 imo it isn't. It has a lot of good ideas, bad execution. I do feel like this rewrite cuts out a lot of the cool stuff that could've been improved, especially in terms of the 1st and 3rd arcs, but it kinda makes sense considering TNM hated those arcs.
That made borderline no sense the longer it went on. The original inciting wish makes no logical sense of its impact and what it actually did (at first it seemed like you were implying it undid EVERYTHING from DB history, but apparently not), and the fact the Namekian balls also have black stars, I really don't get. I thought you said they only appear when overused? Earth's, yes, but Namek's wouldn't be. The details are not here. And then the Namekian dragon just gets restored at the end during the final fight? How? Why? I thought it and Shenlong were merged together as the villain? It started off kind of neat, but as it progressed, the entire thing just made less and less sense to the point of rivaling the real GT or Super.
@@NoneofwhatDisagree to some extent. Sure some sagas had some plot holes or concepts thrown in that seemed random, but you had some genuinely good sagas and a few that were good but came up short in the end. Examples, DKP Saga, Frieza Saga, Saiyan Saga, Baby Saga, Moro Saga, and Superhero Saga.
yeah man, im ngl this rewrite was kinda buns. I feel like hes trying TO hard to go into the philosophical side of dragon ball but it winds up being so bare bones and strips 90% of the meat of the series.
That rewrite of the SSJ4 transformation is everything Mark complained about in his GT review except 10 times worse, just a new transformation out of nowhere for it's own sake, at least the original had a lot of symbolism, from Earth being what triggers the transformation instead of the moon and Pan begging him to stop being what brought Goku back, the fight with Baby being between everything bad and brutal about the saiyans against a more pure form that managed to let go of his anger, to Vegeta giving up his pride using science to get it to save what he now considers HIS planet. As for reducing the Shadow Dragons to a single one, while I understand the point made I feel like there was another way to use multiple dragons, and it was to use the whole cast to fight them, like, what if instead of Goku fighting them all one at a time... the whole cast separate to take on each dragon? Since the ending of GT was about celebrating the story of all of Dragon Ball having the entire cast having a sort of last hurrah where each take part in the final arc would help it, it can still end with Omega Shenron absorving the others and being defeated by Uub/Pan with the Genki-Dama .
Everything after the beginning addition making the story a even better connected , is making baby arc as a separate story a massive downgrade , Ssj4 as its done has awesome introduction while bringing so many things full circle and Goku is the perfect character to get it first , he's the saiyan who grew up on earth from the start the one who stood for being more than he was born with Vegeta fitting way better with the Bulma method cuz she's the one who primarily made him who he is now before earth itself . Before mentioning the new form instantly ending the arc with no more twists is very lackluster execution for any dragon ball arc , let alone to replace it with what we already have the kais carrying even more than they already did for Ssj4 with everyone coming back in the end to save an exhausted Ssj4 Goku , restore his power while holding off baby for them to finally win . As well as shadow dragons being a good decision which u can add other characters to since the start without reducing them to one removing the several ways of nature itself giving them a second chance in each of the fights to win before it came to spirit bomb in the end. Although i haven't been a big fan of the GT review in the first place , had several complaining for the sake of complaining points , Ssj4 is the perfect final one and clear cut best transformation especially for summing up Goku the best other than being a fitting end to the journey of saiyan forms themselves . All transformations are for the sake of being one by that logic . The scenes Toei put in the anime since dbz add even more to it i wonder if they had the idea in mind already .
The bit about the Shadow Dragons was something I brought up in my own comment. Instead of just one, still have 7, but flesh them all out more. And have all the Dragon Team split up and take some on. You could've had Goten and Trunks go after one or two, but needing to fuse to defeat the stronger one they face, thus planting the seed of Goku and Vegeta doing it later. Have Buu and Uub go after another, and have that be the way to intro Majuub if we aren't doing that vs Baby. Gohan and Piccolo could run a good fade with another one or two. Vegeta could go solo and beat one, etc. There would've been more to do, and then you have Syn Shenron be the one Goku runs into, and while he can match him in SS4, he's no match for Omega. This fixes the entire arc, and also lets you see some of the more unique fighting styles of the other fighters. Gotenks could have a fun, but still serious fight with one, Gohan and Piccolo could use coordinated attacks to defeat their opponent, Vegeta could do a Vegeta and utterly humiliate one solo, etc.
@@Zac_Frost Basically youngjijii's dragonball AF comic. That arc was all I wanted out of GT, and it still baffles me that they were so into their Goku glazing they couldn't let anybody else join in on fighting the 7 shadow dragons.
On the note of having the Z Fighters fight the Shadow Dragons separately, why not make an specific character fight the Dragons who's wish their responsable for, Have Vegeta fight Naturon Shenron, as the Wish that made him was to resurrect the people Vegeta killed when Babidi took over him. Or have Uub fight Eis Shenron, and where learns where Buu really comes from, or Piccolo fight Nuova Shenron
5:58 Mark dunking on the Super 17 arc will never get old 😂 But seriously the idea of our heroes facing and confronting past villains is a pretty good one
With the changes Mark made to the story, maybe the old foes could get revived thanks to the corrupted wishes and have their spotlight until Omega Shen arrives.
The build up to Super 17 was done well. Super 17 himself was a bit dull. He was powerful & dominant but was merely only focused on killing Goku like any other red ribbon army
I love what you are doing with the Tuffles backstory. It fleshes out a somewhat tragic civilization that GT really should’ve looked into more. Not to mention how your rewrite introduces them much much earlier in the story. The potential here is great Mark. Keep it up!
I still would want to see the original Dragon Balls trying to escape the solar system as a last ditch effort to avoid being over used, but have a two or three different crews fetching them. Pace each section better and let more characters get some screen time. It would be an interesting dynamic if Baby finds a group completely unaware of what happened earlier, perhaps infecting/possessing them until the Dragon Balls are together again.
Rewatched his rewriting of the Buu Saga, and found a lot of similarities between that and this. His writing style hasn’t particularly changed much in 5 years, one of the big glaring weaknesses I’ve seen between both is that Mark cuts out every bit of fluff he can and focuses only on the important story beats, not allowing any moment to really breathe or resonate. Cutting filler is one thing, but it does allow you to spend some time with characters more and really get a feel for them. Another similarity is that he centers around key characters, but doesn’t really offer much for them to DO. In his Buu Rewriting, Gohan was his main character, but he spent over half the arc unconscious, and the other half needlessly traumatized. In this, he moves focus to Pan and Uub, but neither of them do anything of worth throughout the rewriting.
"Gts arcs dont lead into eachother" The baby arc into the super 17 art has a great connection, killing the arcs villain and then in the next arc having him open hell up to come back teaming up with a great counterpart from z is a really smart bridge. it means that, indirectly, sending him to hell caused a bigger problem which is a crazy twist Arc 1 into 2 and 3 into 4 dont have much to connect them but i mean in Z what leads the namek arc into the android arc has just as complex a connection with trunks as gt does with giryu, they kinda just like yknow introduce themselves outta nowhere and thats that. And s17 arc into the shadow dragons has just as much of a connection as cell to buu, bit of a time skip and then suddenly new villain(s) just turn up.
I like most of this at first, but cutting the shadows dragons down to one. Kinda kills the potential towards creativity. We could've had a group of complete individuals with their own beliefs in "balance". Some targeting specific characters for their actions, or reversing wishes that had caused more harm than good. Sin/Omega = Mark's basic, but necessary concept. Nova = The revival of warriors in general. Creating the personification of the perfect fighter. Taking the positive aspects from the Z-Fighters. Ize = On the other hand personifies their worst aspects in fighting. Oceanus = A vain deity born to give life. Representing the constant resurrection of the dead, but for a price. As she can resurrect one person at a time. She feeds off the lives of several others too, just restore nature. The other dragons can be left for the imagination of the fans.
There are 7 shadow dragons and 6 saijans + Oob (not counting Bra, since she does not know how to fight), you don't have to be a genius to figure this out.
Thumbnail: "Fixing GT" -Vegeta is the only Ssj4 (no Ssj4 Goku) -No Ssj4 Gogeta -removes Nouva Shenron and the interesting Dynamic he and Goku had (a poetic dynamic given Nouva was the 4 Star ball) -Goku doesn’t have the conclusion and death against Omega's Karma Ball, leaving his departure with less of a mystery and less room to make sense of it. -less consequences overall, making the final fight feel less tense given the context of what we've dealt with before in the franchise, and arguably making the consequence of misusing the DragonBalls less tense aswell. What is this?...while i admire the attempt you made, i feel the changes are way to drastic in a lot of areas and even unnecessary. Really, no Ssj4 Goku? The most iconic thing within GT? You know, some things dont have to be completely perfect. Gogeta whilst ultimately not beating Omega, had a purpose within the context he had, and also was like the most hype thing ever. Sometimes it's ok to just have hype moments like that. Even Baby's redemption, it makes his fall a lot less impactful imo, Baby's death showed how his views were wrong and that going down that path leads to the worst, the redemption felt shoehorned in tbh. I do agree with a lot of changes, like replacing Trunks with Uub, and giving some characters more moments. But ngl, a lot just feels like change for the sake of change.
I really like the idea of old Pan finding the 4 star ball confirming goku’s presence and the return of the dragon balls. I can even hear her calling the 4 star ball “grandpa”. A beautiful final call back to how young Goku prayed and referred to the ball in early dragon ball. Hits right in the feels. Good job with this TNM.
12:26 …So, I’m a bit confused. How does Goku get wished into a kid again if the only wish was “Undo the damage our fighting has caused”? Doesn’t that mean that Pilaf wouldn’t have the opportunity to wish him into a kid? Am I missing something?
@@Choppydplug but how is him turning into a little kid a consequence of using the dragon balls...? wouldn't then bulma, yamcha, krillin, oolong or anyone else who has used or helped use the dragon balls be affected by that, if that were the case? ...though now that i think about it, an arc where the OG dragon ball cast is singled out would have been super interesting, especially in a post-Z story lol
Mid rewrite honestly, I'm not sure it can be even considered an improvement. Out of all of this, the take on SSJ4 is probably the most unnecessary. The presentation in the original works fairly well, with Goku becoming golden ozaru and then into SSJ4 after achieving control. Vegeta could also do that, but the first introduction via a blutz waves machine is brilliant because it makes Bulma relevant again and a cool support to his husband, and further shows the maturity and understanding the couple reached at this point in the story, after years living together with two children.
BRO! AHHH! This lame ass fanfic went over the top about certain not that cool parts. BUT FUCKING UUB LEARNING THE ABILITY THAT KILLED HIS EVIL SELF?! And using it to save the world?! And you don't have Goku holding the bad guy off because he trust his dicisple and knows that his wish that one time was correct? Isn't the entire point that they abused the wishes? Wasn't the whole "ooh, gt was bad to uub, i'll do it better" and proceeded to treat him like Piccolo gets treated in Z (get beaten up by the enemies, so goku and vegeta can stand out)?
In hindsight, I am so mad nobody who trained with King Kai learned anything besides Goku. Tien and Yamcha should use Kaio Ken, Chiaotzu given instant transmission and/or Spirit Bomb, not sure about Piccolo.
@@alexanderrobins7497Tbf, instant transmission was learned on Yardrat, not King Kai’s planet, so it makes sense why Goku is the only one who knows that
@@cleanupguy3934 I think King Kai mentioned he could have taught it to Goku when he returned to Earth, but I could be misremembering. The Supreme Kai used it too.
IMO, I don’t want to sound harsh because I liked your finale to Baby’s story, but I feel that the moment you neglected to rewrite the adventures out into space (the entire point of GT’s existence when it was first made) and the Super 17 arc, which had some things people did like (all the villains coming back and, unironically, Super 17) you failed at making the original any better. I feel like a single video to rewrite all of it in as short of a time as you made this (37 minutes short? Yeah I know, but you’ve really up’d your time on some of these videos) really made you tunnel vision on the only two ideas you seemed to love to the point you said “screw everything else, let’s focus on this”. I feel 100% in the right to say this btw, because although you mentioned keeping Giru around, YOU NEVER MENTION HIM AGAIN! Also, I feel like you drastically oversimplified the Shadow Dragon (no s because one dragon is enough apparently) just to get past everything else you found boring when, again, I feel rewriting the story should be taking what is there and making it better. You erased half of GT in order to do this, which I feel is a Failure. Take the time with each arc to try and make them good (because just saying their bad and making fun of them before ignoring their existance isn’t a good look in this instance) and I feel like it’d be an overall better product.
Yes, Mark is not a good writer. Bro, you noticed the Giru thing as well! The last "arc" is literally "the bad guys shows up, he beats up gohan, uub, piccolo, vegeta and goku in less than 20 minutes and it ends". That's your arc? That's not how you write a FULL story.
Cutting out the other dragons is way too much cutting imo. Every arc needs to have more enemies than just the final boss. This is one of the reasons the Goku Black arc was lacking. The final boss having subordinates gives the side characters a chance to shine, and keeps the story from becoming repetitive.
Agreed. I don't see why he completely cut out the space search for the Dragon Balls and hunting down the dragons either. I could see the original Dragon Balls trying to escape the solar system as a last ditch effort to avoid being over used, but have a two or three different crews fetching them. That way we could see Trunks and Goten fuse at least once. It could lead to an interesting dynamic if Baby finds a group completely unaware of it, perhaps infecting/possessing them until it was time to make a wish. I would have them to fight the corrupted Shenron before it split off into the different dragons, with different groups going after each one instead of just Goku and Pan again.
@@Goobious_Maximusyeah I was thinking why not 2 to 4 dragons (3 being the golden number) The 3 dragons can represent “3 something” The different sides of gokus character the selfishness, the selflessness the naïveté Mind body and spirit Past present and future The different sides of humanity The different perspectives of how a god may view mortals etc curiosity, animosity, apathy etc The justice system or something I kinda interpreted the namekian statement that champions needing to undergo trials meaning that the dragons would be those trials to actually test Goku’s resolve, ethics, morals etc
I liked this video, but there are a couple of problems I have with it that I wanna voice. 1. While it makes sense, I'm not entirely sure how to feel about Vegeta's obtainment of Super Saiyan 4 first. It feels like it takes away from Goku's transformation. That scene was really cool, and Pan's part in it was great, but it's all sacrificed here, and it ends up leading into the second issue. 2. It's never explained how Goku obtained Super Saiyan 4 here, if he did at all. From the looks of things, he didn't even have time to learn it from Vegeta, so I can't help but feel like it leaves a big hole in this outline. Now, outlines aren't meant to be fully fleshed out, but I still wanted to give my thoughts on it anyway.
yeah I actually agree lol. did Goku even obtain ssj4 in Mark's retelling? that was the first question I had at the end, I wasn't sure if I missed it lol I dont mind Vegeta being the first and how he got it, but losing Goku's emotional and epic ssj4 transformation as a result is a bummer. anyway it was a great retell tho
While I agree with your second point, I disagree with the first one. The emotional throughline with Gokū and Pan were sufficiently replaced with Pan's Super Saiyan transformation and her bouncing back the Genki Dama.
- Goku changes to Kid form out of nowhere as consequence of the Dragon Balls somehow and we are left to wonder how and why ? No thanks I rather a silly wish from Pilaf - Why assume that the "Perfect wish" of "Undo the damage our fighting has caused" will be limited to only objects and not also reviving others that died due to fights - What happens in th time betwen Goku's wish and Baby appearing in the Earth - Gohan is killed out of nowhere after barely any screentime and looking irrelevant ? That's like early DBS Gohan VS Frieza - Skipping the whole Goku SS4 Transformation arc and the amazing fight just so Baby is simply defeated mentally ??? Vegeta getting a transformation first is cool and all but compared to what it takes away, absolutely not - 1 Dragon only ??? most of the Z Fighters did nothing in the show anyway and in your version too, you can easily make use of them by having each few Z fighters fight a specific dragon, with each dragon being threatning and a serious meaningful fight for the Z fighters - Pan deflecting the Spirit Bomb will not given even half the vibes of the moment kid Gohan did it, it just doesnt work. Also Uub's regular spirit bomb killing the strongest villain ever is a joke, the one of Goku that was powered by many Planets and Galaxies makes sense at least - Your Super Saiyan 4 version got hard shafted and is no longer the transformation everyone loves, comes out of nowhere and is only used in a short fight once against Shenron and loses hard...Goku got hard shafted, focused too much on his character/dialogues and left him completly irrelevant, he only fights as a weak kid vs Baby and gets beaten by Shenron later (and I cant tell if he fights him as kid too or somehow becomes SS4) ... Congrats you managed to make GT 10 times worse !
I'm sorry, Mark, but I believe that you actually made it worse. You retained the good parts but diminished their impact, especially SS4. That transformation was what carried the series, and you stripped it of all its thematic and emotional value. You treated it like just another power boost, but this transformation was meant to be unlocked by Goku, and only him. In the original GT, Goku transforms by seeing the Earth, a beautiful way to show how it “thanks" him for saving it countless times by granting him this new power. The scene where Goku rages as the golden Oozaru made sense. He struggled to control it at first because he had never learned how, and it was amplified by his weaker child’s body. But when he finally calms down by looking at and reminiscing about the Earth, remembering his love for his world, his family, and especially his granddaughter, gaining full control of the form that had once taken his grandpa away it’s perfect. Giving this transformation to Vegeta threw all of that away. There was zero emotional payoff. Maybe he could have unlocked it, as you suggested, during his training with Trunks, which would align with the theme of love for his newfound planet and family transforming the Saiyans' old destructive power into something new, but he couldn’t be the main focus, but I digress. The final nail in the coffin was unlocking the form and then not using it against Baby. That would be one of the lamest wastes of a power up introduction in anime history. Another issue is that you tried to give every character their moment in the spotlight, but it felt too cluttered. I think the decision to combine the dragons into one was the worst. With seven dragons, it would have been easier to give each character their moment to shine, as well as a thematic wish to confront (Piccolo vs a dragon made by the wishes of Daimao, Uub vs the wish of restoring the plant after Boo’s fight, etc.). And this last part is just a nitpick, but what happened to Giru? I don’t know how he was incorporated into this new plot.
"Another issue is that you tried to give every character their moment in the spotlight, but it felt too cluttered" "With seven dragons, it would have been easier to give each character their moment to shine" You wrote these 2 sentences in the same paragraph like they're not contradictory.
And? He's still right. Sure, maybe the "clutered" comment is a miss or hit, but? The essay was still lmae. There was literally no point to SSJ4's existence at that point.
@@kylegonewildYeah , I see your point, my bad, what I was trying to say was that I felt like there were too many characters fighting the same villain, and that using more villains instead would have been better. But I admit that is a nitpick.
@@kylegonewildCause they're not , it felt cluttered cause there was only one dragon to fight , separating the Z fighters and giving them chances make up for their mistakes on their own would feel right
Our heroes feel very reactive in both of your new takes of the two arcs... They don't seem to have a goal or something they want to prevent like in Namek where there's multiple parties seeking the dragon balls or searching for the Black stars while Baby looms over them in the Black stars arc
They aren't even aware of the coming of Baby and Omega and preparing for battle like in the Saiyan arc they kind of just get jumped by a really big bad guy, twice.
"I don't like Transformation for Transformation sake," says the only guy who's hyped for Black Freeza Also, out of all the post-SSJ transformations, SSJ4 actually has plot significance for both Goku AND Vegeta. -Goku finally embraces his full Saiyajin Nature by confronting the Trauma he has been running away from this entire time. The Oozaru that brought nothing but tragedy is now the key to saving everyone. - Vegeta meanwhile, it's Him finally accepting Help from others, Bulma literally completes him.
Black frieza was for the end of an arc symbolizimg the strength everyone in that arc was fighting for as thhe stro gest in the universe, it quite litterally was crucial for the arc
@@seankock7649 considering you could stablish the exact same point with Golden Freeza... nah, that was just a new form for the sake of throwing new forms a form that even the Marketing Team couldn't care less if they tried
@@Artista_Frustrado except golden frieza was used before and defeated before, golden frieza was abaolutely destroyed by broly, no a new form was needed to show he reached a new level that far outclassed everyone there
I would've been happier with Bulma making some device that would regenerate Vegeta's tail on it's own rather than making him a Great Ape outright. He could still be getting help from someone, and having that lead him to greater heights in strength. I agree with your other points, though.
i still tink each dragon ball should have been a individual dragon, removing the whole 4 star one being attached to goku because of his grandpa was a nice plot point in my opinion, so they can all just be doing their own things and have different personalities and the omega shenron is trying to consume all of them to get their powers, so instead of having to beat all of them they have to save most of them from the omega shenron
I had an idea that maybe each Z fighter takes on an individual dragon. Vegeta could counter the energy draining one by using forced spirit fission, for example.
My main issue with the rewrite of the Baby arc is that it ends up being extremely similar to the themes of the Goku Black arc. Baby obviously goes through a similar character arc as Zamasu, in which he harbors this deep hatred that ends up consuming him until he becomes the thing that he hated, i.e. fused with a mortal and a great ape, respectively. Baby's possession of the entire world mirrors the destruction of the entire world by Zamasu, and the only ones left on the planet are the main cast with only a handful of supporting cast. The thing that 'solves' the issue is a sudden spontaneous glow-up in power, i.e. trunks with deus ex spirit bomb sword and SSJ4 Vegeta. There's a lot of teasing with different forms and transformations that ultimately don't matter in the end, like Pan's Super Saiyan form obviously doesn't end with a win, but neither does Vegito against Zamasu. Uub more or less flies around saving people in your rewrite, which doesn't do wonders for showcasing his ability, but it wouldn't have mattered since the villain was stopped without his input anyway; unfortunately the most dire comparison I could make is to that of Mai and the gang, in which they just stood around waiting for the camera to be on them for a bit before going back to the people actually fighting.
" wouldn't have mattered cuz the villain was stopped without his input anyway " he's literally the key contributor right behind Goku in it lol , everyone would be dead without him holding off Golden ozaru baby after revealing he purposefully got hit by his chocolate beam to wait and strike at the right moment , long enough for Goku to get his ssj4 power restored and mocking Baby saying he really thought Uub would be done in by his own technique , and this is exclusive to him cuz Buu could never reverse it on himself. Before mentioning idk what this video is on about with Goku being too strong stopping Uub from showcasing his abilities, cuz Ssj3 Goku literally got bullied by ssj baby while Uub after returning from his training equally clashed a holding back Super baby 2 , caught him off guard and slammed him into a wall even before pushing around his full power state as Majuub and giving him a run for his money before Baby goes even further inflating his muscles like the grade 3 forms to win the beam clash . Brother literally degraded him by removing him from doing anything important against Golden ozaru baby in this rewrite . Before mentioning a new transformation instantly ending the fight is pretty lackluster in general . Let alone the idea to replace Ssj4 Goku with Vegeta itself being a massive downgrade already . I absolutely wanted his ssj4 to have a more climactic introduction with Omega interrupting and to not be so late or either way get more cool scenes in the fight , but the placement itself wasn't bad at all and bulma being involved the way she was fit well as she's the one who turned him into the man he is now , before earth itself which fits Goku's Ssj4 introduction better . Baby arc is overall one of those where u simply don't mess with Goku's position , it's just a well done story where Vegeta being the ssj4 over Goku doesn't work by a mile. Goku is THE character for ssj4 as well as to go against Baby in the play of love vs hate. And Baby shouldn't be some good to vengeful character but as he is vengeful to maniacal rage , because that makes a better parallel with Goku who isn't " good " by default himself but rather selfish . Baby arc doesn't need any " fixing " , one thing that makes it even better is the idea to integrate his origin with the dragon balls themselves , but otherwise should be left as it is .
@@IncognitoActivado It's still pointless. If you write something into your story, then do absolutely nothing with it, then there's no point in it being there. I would've been fine with Baby being the Tuffles' contingency against the Saiyans and be pure evil. Nothing wrong with that at all.
@@IncognitoActivado It's called "Chekhov's Gun." If you write in a book that there's a gun hanging on a wall, and by the end of the story no one is shot, then there was no point in writing that.
I like how he says in the Super rewrite that this was well received, but the top comments are all nothing but blasting this rewrite and pointing out its many flaws.
OK but 3 things: 1. Vegeta becoming SSJ4 seems anti-climactic. There's a lot to criticize with the goofiness of how Goku regrew his tail and became SSJ4, but the sequence of events that led up to the transformation made it feel like somewhat of a training session that yielded results. There was some preperation and pre-establishment of SSJ4 before its reveal, which made the eventual reveal all the more satisfying. In your rewrite, it just comes out of nowhere. SSJ, SSJ2, SSJ God and UI all had pre-establishments (heck, even SSJ Blue had some of that). SSJ3 didn't have any pre-establishment, but you know Goku has been training for 7 years in the afterlife (so it still made some sense), and it wasn't treated as that big of a deal at the moment. SSJ4, with it's radically different design and unique requirements to be earned, SHOULD be treated as a big deal. You made SSJ4 seem like a much smaller deal than it really is. 2. I think it's a bit disappointing you didn't give Vegeta the opportunity to showcase the power of SSJ4 on Baby. I know it would've been inappropriate at that moment, But each new transformation always gets a moment to shine immediately after being achieved for the first time. SSJ Goku VS Frieza, SSJ Trunks VS mecha Frieza, SSJ Vegeta VS android 19, SSJ2 Gohan VS Cell, SSJ3 Goku VS Majin Buu, Gotenks Vs Majin Buu, SSJ3 Gotenks VS Super Buu, Mystic Gohan VS Super Buu, Vegito (both forms) VS Super Buu, SSJ God Goku VS Beerus, SSJ Blue Goku/Vegeta VS Golden Frieza... You see what I mean? Having Vegeta become SSJ4 before Goku is one thing. Not giving time for Vegeta to use that form until some time later where he fights Omega Shenron is just robbing the new form from its intended spotlight. This gap from the reveal to the moment of utilization ruins the moment. 3. When and where does Goku earn SSJ4? I'm OK with Vegeta earning it first, but give Goku SSJ4 too at some point. How Would I solve these issues? Quite simply actually! While fighting baby, Goku is defeated and nearly dies. But just when Baby is about to finish him, Supreme Kai instant transmissions himself and Goku to his planet. Supreme Kai heals Goku, Goku thanks him and plans on returning to fight Baby some more. However, Supreme Kai begs Goku to stay because he can't beat Baby at his strength. That's whan Elder Kai interrupts and informs Goku about a special form he can attain that no other sayian ever could: Super Sayian 4! The requirements for this form is for a sayian who achieved SSJ3 to retain his tail, transform into a golden great ape and control himself. No one else could've done that because A. Most sayians were killed by Frieza many years ago, and B. Sayians naturally lose their tails once they become strong enough (this detail is actually already canon to DB lore, go check), and because of that can't turn into apes. Goku however, despite growing strong enough, regrew his tail when becoming young. Therefore, he can still turn into an ape. Considering he still posesses the power to become SSJ3, he meets all the requirements to become SSJ4. All that is left for him to do is learning how to control the ape transformation. That's exactly why Supreme Kai brought Goku to their planet. Elder Kai wants to train Goku to fully control the great ape transformation. Goku is afraid they don't have enough time to train him until Baby kills/posesses everyone, but than Supreme Kai creates a giant aura around them that acts like a hyperbolic time chamber so they can train for an extended amount of time without risking everyone who fights Baby for too long.
While your idea of Dende suffering the same fate with the Dragon Balls is unique and sounds great...I am afraid it doesn't really work. Remember, King Piccolo kills Shenron and Kami was completely unaffected by it. I have seen people arguing about the connection and I am going to explain why I don't think it would work. I view the creator with the Dragon Balls being a more Puppet and Puppet Master. The creator gives the puppet life and if they die, so does the puppet, but if the puppet dies, the creator is unaffected and can make a new puppet.
eh. the dragon balls have always been inconsistent (think the dragon balls reactivating in 8 months the first time they were used). there could probably be some exposition about how "the negative energy was too much for dende" or something
While that's true, you can also say the rules changed with the upgrades, maybe exactly because Dende upgrades the dragon balls it means they have a higher link to him
@@enanomalley9986 remember Dende is linked now to the dragon balls restored after the cell saga, that's why they still work even after Piccolo died when Buu blew up the earth, as Kami no longer exist
Certainly an interesting rewrite. I like giving Uub and Pan more purpose with the whole new generation taking a bigger role. But SSJ4 felt extremely random and given very little purpose. Vegeta still doesn’t seem to do much in this rewrite so him being the one to obtain the form 1st is rather weird. Goku also randomly gaining the form is arguably even worse than how Vegeta gained the form in the original telling with the whole Blutz Wave Machine. Baby while certainly given a more unique role, him just disappearing then reappearing at the end with little context just feels so off. And since Baby was the cause of the most recent wish, maybe having him directly confronting Shenron would’ve been better considering how Shenron’s power works in the rewrite. Shenron is fine I guess but the original concept was much better having a Dragon being born from specific wishes. It’s just the Dragons were awfully executed in terms of character and threat.
I think so, he said he'd let the Baby arc play mostly the same, though he didn't mention that part specifically, so I don't know (though I would headcanon that it did).
Can we get rid of Uub instead? I hate how everyone pretends this guy has insane potential and must absolutely be important. He's just a side character at best.
@@kindlingkinghe is though, whether it's Super, GT, or the end of the og series. Uub is usually portrayed as the strongest human and Goku's ultimate goal, a fighter for him to go against head to head
@@young_shaad5227 is he? Half of the cast is or were "strongest Z of Y". It's not compelling nor interesting. And I honestly don't care how big his power level is - he's boring. What's his deal? His goals? His personality? His role in the story? Why is Goku suddenly interested in abandoning his family to train this kid? What for? In reality, most of the hype about Uub is built by community itself. Neither Toriyama, nor Toei nor Toytaro ever did anything with this character, because, frankly, they have no idea what they're supposed to do with him and why should he be important at all. Uub is a nothing character that actually offers nothing for the story or characters related to him. You have to put great effort to make something out of him and actually shift the spotlight away from Goku, which never going to happen.
Honestly it feels incredibly forced to have the wish turn Goku into a kid & give him his tail back. Theres not even any monkey's paw interpretation of the wish that would cause that. If anything, maybe take a page from JJK and have the initial wish seal Goku away or otherwise incapacitate him. Without their heaviest hitter, the main cast can be like, Pan, Uub, Trunks and Goten. Also feels weird to just have the dragon balls explode instead of needing to be gathered back up out in space. We still gotta have a Grand Tour in GT Also, the wish restoring everything destroyed by Saiyans actually gives a decent hook for a version of Super 17; Goku destroyed a ton of RR army tech as a kid, Vegeta destroyed Android 19, Trunks blew up Gero's lab, and Cell killed 16. Hell, the mechanical components of Mecha Freeza and Cell could also have been restored. Maybe 19 has some sort of emergency protocol that he can activate at Gero's lab. Its still pretty half baked as a concept, but having the Freeza and Cell rematches instead being half-formed mechanical abominations could be cool! And everyone loves 16!
Honestly this is a great idea! Plus we can make the final fight to be against bojack and pan so she can learn that goku won't always be there for her, (similar to gohan in that movie). Gives her a better reason to unlock ssj and a chance to flesh out her character!
Eh you’re inciting incident doesn’t make any sense to me. Wishes were never so general. “Undo all the damage our fighting has done” I think people would ask a lot of questions as to why it doesn’t basically bring back every villain ever experienced in the story so far to begin with. Or Dr. Gero’s lab. Etc. unless I am mistaken I don’t think wishes have been so general so I don’t think folks we get onboard so easily. But just my two cents.
Agreed. It would: Bring back _all_ of the Red Ribbon Army. What Goku destroyed in Dragonball, all of Dr Gero's Androids, old Namek, the majority of the Frieza force (Literally Resurrection F again), Raditz and Nappa, probably Cell. Hell, the only villain that might not return would be Buu. Worse, Cell has Saiyan genes, as do the Saiyans, if Buu _were_ resurrected and absorbed more powerful beings it would be even more dangerous than in Z. It would be far too open ended.
Good lord that Baby arc, you know what you missed? You turned the dragon balls into an infected monkey's paw. Baby's arc could have been so much better. Imagine him defeating the entire cast, triumphant over the saiyans. Before outright killing them he's going to show them what they destroyed in the past. He brings out Red Shenron, demanding the restoration of planet tuffle and all of it's inhabitants. Shenron complies, but something feels amiss. He looks up, instantly realizing it's not planet tuffle. Not the tuffle he wanted, shenron instead brought back planet Vegeta. EVERY single Saiyan from Bardock to Raditz back in an instant. At that moment Baby's arc concludes with him having a mental breakdown. You literally had it right there, imagine it. One of the first instances of the villain winning since Beerus. His revenge foiled by his own actions, and in the worst way imaginable. He didn't destroy the saiyan race he restored it.
I’m surprised you didn’t talk about Ledgic from the Black Star Dragon Ball Saga. He was an interesting beginning antagonist. The one thing I wish GT did was Goku fighting him one more time, or help Goku defeat Baby. Since Baby is a parasite who could have conquered the entire universe, Ledgic wouldn’t be on board with being controlled by Baby. He should have had one more outing.
Why did the namekian dragonballs get corrupted and explode? You literally made it a point to say that they specifically DON'T abuse their dragon balls. I know that's not really an important part of this whole thing but it really threw me off after you explained how little they use their dragon balls
partway through the video it seemed like he was rushing it out to publish because there's a spot where he repeats a line read and it was clear it was meant to be edited out but was left in by accident. he also said giru stays but didn't explain why or what he's used for lol
So, how did goku turn young? You say he just makes a normal wish but it does one extra and fixes everything destroyed by the Saiyans, so where did the goku turning young part enter. And honestly I think that the baby arch just got completely ruined.
Dude removes the aspect of Emperor Pilaf wishing for Goku to be a child again by accident, and instead says it should be "Goku just turns into a child for no reason at all" and then says "Monkey paw" as if that makes up for it.
“Daima…that didn’t involve creating new, McGuffin balls” Episode one of Daima: here are some new, McGuffin balls and a McGuffin namekian demon thrown in for good measure.
Respectfully, while I appreciate the Uub and Pan parts, I don't think your rewriting is any better than what we originally got. The Baby stuff you had just seemed meh and the Shadow Dragon arc you proposed seemed all over the place
I gotta ask, what happens to Baby in the end? Feels he doesn't really get a conclusion, does he join with the earth or goes off on his own after the shadow drafon arc..
I liked this overall, but there are some pros and cons I could list to it: Pros: - I like the fact that you focused more on the newer gen characters rather than just sticking with the old characters. It makes it feel like time is actually moving forward in the series rather than stagnating. - I like how you used the regular Dragon Balls, but just turned the stars black from overuse, even though I have cons to that later. - I really like how you made Pan an actual character in this, rather than just a "meh" character that kinda hangs around. - Having the Dragon Balls getting corrupted affect Dende, as well. That's just pure genius. No Dragon Balls. No Healer. No backup plans. The fights all instantly have higher stakes. Cons: - Vegeta getting SS4 before Goku, but doing nothing with it. As the old adage goes, "If you write something into your story, but do nothing with it, then there's no point in it being there." I get the idea that you probably wanted Vegeta to get something before Goku, but if Vegeta isn't going to actually _use_ it, then why introduce it at that point? - Keeping the bit where Goku gets turned into a kid, and also de-powering him. As much as I enjoy GT for what it is, I always thought that was a terrible idea. And sapping his powers is a bad trope of action/fantasy stories that almost never works. - Trying to make Baby a more complex character. Black and White "Pure Evil" villains are perfectly fine. Having the Tuffle Scientist make Baby have the sole purpose of destroying the Saiyans, maybe as an act of posthumous revenge would have worked just fine. Maybe the Saiyans could've won the battle, but not the war in his mind, and Baby was a contingency to ensure that the Saiyans' victory wouldn't last. - Goku getting SS4 off screen. That's the thing everybody hated about SSBlue. It came out of nowhere and we didn't see Goku earn it. - Including the Namekian Dragon Balls into the Shadow Dragons bit. I like the idea of it just being focused on the Earth's Dragon Balls alone. - Having there be only one Shadow Dragon. I would've more enjoyed the idea of there still being 7, but you flesh them all out a bit more. You could even have the Z Warriors all split off into teams to handle some of them, giving other characters more to do. Maybe have Goten and Trunks pair up, as well as Piccolo and Gohan, Uub and Buu (that'd be a perfect spot of introduce Majuub if you're not gonna do it against Baby, IMO), Vegeta going solo, etc. Overall, I enjoyed this as a fun writing experiment, and I do think you introduce some great ideas, but figured I'd give my thoughts and some constructive criticism. Thanks for the video. 🙂
Honestly, I would have had Baby kill off Giru, and create a solid conclusion to the Black Star DB Saga, and also create a two way fight between Goku and Pan working together, and Baby.
Will say some of this is done well, other bits… not so much First of all the good. Actually giving Baby some bonus characteristics was AMAZING. Genuinely having him self reflect, realize the monster he had become versus what he wished to destroy, was exactly what the character needed. I always loved Baby as a villain and the idea of him becoming actually complex is GREAT Secondly, Pan actually getting to do anything is a chef’s kiss. Like, even if I do find how it was handled being lackluster with her grand moment being bouncing back a spirit bomb, I do think having her go Super Saiyan AND STILL FAIL is a great concept Finally, Omega Shenron feels a lot more complete with the sense of karmic consequence being intensified as someone who acts as the big finale to it all especially tying it back into the destroyed homeworld of Namek This is where things fall apart though First of all, Uub somehow feels more underwhelming here. He just kind of gets dog walked again and again and even the reunion of Buu’s two halves with their fusion is left out cutting away the one link he really had as the reincarnation of Kid Buu Secondly, Vegeta SSJ4 feels… unearned in this rewrite. It could have taken a more active route, have him confront Baby in his mind, confront the horrors that his people and himself have caused. Make him the final nail in the coffin in Baby’s change and delete the purposeless nature of this SSJ4 by making up for the lack of battle to cement its power with meaning. Make it be the representation of Vegeta not just conquering the beast inside, but his very past and all that it means. Make him quite literally redefine a Saiyan not as a rampaging monster but as the more humanoid SSJ4. Thirdly, with Baby, at least GIVE him some extra purpose in the end if he’s going to be kept around. Him making Goku stand up as a final contribution is just weak lol Finally, and I know this probably will hurt the narrative, but the lack of SSJ4 Gogeta or Goku is just painful. Hell, could have Goku gain SSJ4 with Baby’s help. Have someone who used to know the Saiyans as only monsters help Goku connect with a meaning he never understood, a primal side never truly conquered since it killed Grandpa Gohan so long ago. As for Gogeta, I say have them fuse but NOT have it be a stomp. Make it so Omega Shenron is going neck and neck with the two Saiyans and maybe even a remerged Uub with some assistance from the now far weaker Baby who wishes to atone for his sins as a protector the same way the Saiyans did. Then, have Omega Shenron reveal that he isn’t even his final form by drawing on the wish that defines his own existence as a last resort, burning at his own life force. The wish to bring back the namekians killed by Frieza. In a desperate bid, the Saiyans are forced to fuse to try and combat Omega Shenron at his own level, a question of which would run out first on everyone’s mind: Omega Shenron’s last resort or their fusion? In the end, this could serve as the opening for Uub to charge up a final spirit bomb, to prove the earth is plenty strong with the same move that killed his previous self with a larger focus on it being what fully showcases the world isn’t reliant on the dragon balls anymore.
Toyotarou take on GT in a Super aligned manga would be really fun, especially since he has shown a love for specifically the anime & GT in his work Especially now that he has shown a really solid take on Trunks + Goten & he hopefully would continue from the WAY way better characterization Pan got in Super Hero (and generally his layouts have much improved)
I understand if you think Uub was mishandled in the original series, but shoehorning him in to replace trunks just because you believe he’s boring doesn’t work. Pan doesn’t just want to be a fighter in GT, she is on a self-discovery journey just as Goku was in original DB, which is why GT itself aims to focus more on exploration like DB did. Pan wears colors we’d attribute to Goku, while Goku dawns more calming colors; Goku is overall much more relaxed in GT as well, as his journey has largely ended, and he doesn’t desire anything. Point is, a major part of Pans journey is constantly clashing with Trunks, someone she sees as an ideal adult with a job, and who has a pretty good life all things considered. Pan is learning from the different generations before her (Goku and Trunks), taking things from each of them to become her own person. Eventually she comes to appreciate things about both of them during their journey; attributes she then applies to herself. Pan sees Giru as being an annoying nuisance, while Trunks unironically calls robots, equal to humans in many ways; this is a form of empathy Pan later latches onto and agrees with. Pan doesn’t appreciate how Goku is basically a child in body and mind, and is so relaxed he seemingly doesn’t take anything about the journey seriously until Rildo pulls up. However, Goku is always reliable when it counts and will never turn his back on his friends and family, something Pan greatly admires. Trunks is there to fill a roll for Pans journey of self discovery, as is Goku, and Uub being shoved into this trip to substitute Trunks just fundamentally breaks why the group exists in the first place. Uub pushing baby to go Oozaro is lame because Goku doing it, as a saiyan, is a much better metaphor. Baby going full-on Saiyan-going OOZARO (the very thing that he has PTSD about in the show) to crush Uub is way more lame then him doing it against Goku, since Goku himself is a saiyan. Baby was created to protect his people from the Saiyans, and instead, he’s been twisted by revenge and quite literally became what he hated the most about the saiyans, in order to go and murder good hearted people. This works much better as baby vs goku, since Goku is basically in baby’s place, the one to protect innocent people, but he’s a saiyan, which is a contradiction of what baby believes is even possible. Vegeta pushing out Baby and becoming SSJ4 is also just so out of left field; why didn’t he push him out earlier when Gohan died? Did that not affect Vegeta enough within Baby to be able to push him out? Baby needs to be shown that even with all of the Saiyan power at his disposal, he still isn’t powerful enough to just take over earth and kill anyone he wants. Goku is the manifestation of this for baby, skipping over this beat entirely is such an odd decision to make. What lesson is there at this point in the story, don’t go full mask off with your plans if you can’t subdue vegeta within you? That’s not a way to defeat a villain and demonstrate why they were wrong. Goku can go SSj4 because he isn’t a saiyan that baby thinks he is, his loved ones bring him back from a mindless Oozaro, transforming him into an SSJ4, the ultimate power up until this point. The reason baby can’t combat goku here is because he has shut out the possibility of love in his life entirely, strictly to focus on killing the saiyans, he lacks the love and understanding to harness his power and become a SSJ4. Goku transforming and defeating baby shows this. There’s so much more with the how the Shadow Dragons are handled, why would Omega shenron want a “natural order” yet claim that they’ve been abusing the dragon balls? Wouldn’t a natural order involve no dragon balls whatsoever? Why is this walking talking contradiction what manifests from the dragon balls the one to go full anarchy when the dragon balls are the least “natural order” things within the entire series? It feels like there was literally no thought into this whatsoever, and it was just dramatic for the sake of being dramatic. Omega Shenron, along with all of the other dragons (which you deleted from this arc) all serve a purpose to show how each wish and the negative energy spawned from those wishes have manifested. At the end of GT, shenron asks Goku if he knows why the shadow dragons appeared. Notably it’s not just because Omega wanted to wreck shit because of previous wishes, or some natural order. Omega is very clearly present not to just mindlessly kill, because he could’ve done that from the very start. Not only could he have easily done that, but Shenron himself at the end of the arc asks Goku if he understands why the shadow dragons appeared, and Goku says yes. Without narrating the entire arc, there was a lesson to be learned, that’s why Omega appeared, you basically just turned him into a bad guy with a motive that doesn’t even make sense in the context of the series. You monologue for so long about why GT fumbled because it “went backwards instead of going forwards”, yet you retread character arcs that have already completed regarding Vegeta and Piccolo?? This is the exact nostalgia bait you shit on 3 minutes ago 😭😭 The ending and lesson you try to portray, is pretty much the exact same conclusion of GT, being that people need to rely on each other rather than the dragon balls (hence the spirit bomb in the original series being the literal manifestation of that idea); overall it’s just a much messier way to get to somehow the same conclusion, but I will say the idea of Goku fighting Omega while Uub charges a spirit bomb is kinda dope, but still so many focal points of the series are seemingly lost in this rewrite, blatantly misunderstood then disregarded, things are contradicted, character arcs retreaded, and it just doesn’t fit well very much at all to me. Maybe I just like GT a lot, or am just a bonified hater, but this rewrite accomplishes nothing and actively deletes many parts of what made GT significant and resonate as a story. Honestly shocked this went on for so long, as I played the video more and more there was just more to say.
Yes, bro. It was literally bad. It makes GT tame in comparison. I don't think Mark has that good writing skills. He did the same for another one and it hurt me. He also wrote a fanfic about Gon's feelings to his dad early on the series, out of projection, in his review; when Gon doesn't care about Ging. He thinks its okay he walked out if that's what Hunters do.
Also, why does Baby show up in the finale without any setup and what happens to him? Like it feels random and doesn't add to the story. I think this premise is really bad and doesn't acknowledge the issues people have with GT. Instead it creates more issues.
Dude, I was legit writing my Dragon Ball Super rewrite just as this video popped up in my notifications. This is gonna be good. I'd love to show you what i have too if you're at all interested. Would love some pointers.
my problem with the rewrite is you took the "Tour" part out of Grand Tour. Regardless of the quality of the execution, the idea behind GT was to marry the adventure of Dragon Ball with the Action of Z. You kinda complete removed the adventure part and solely made it a continuation of Z. While I like the new ideas, I think you need to find a way to incorporate the adventure back into it. There is a lot of empty space and waitng for villains to fly to earth; like 2 back to back saiyan sagas. Really after the Baby arc The crew needs to a reason to leave earth and find Syn or leave earth and have Syn chase them down. A race against the clock sort of mirroring the Frieza saga in the same way you rewrote the Baby saga to mirror the Saiyan one. Maybe the story has Syn collecting Dragon Balls and continuously grow stronger as the GT fighters try to get to Dragon Balls before he does. idk
This is stupid. Shenron and Ultimate Shenron are not the same being..... Goku needing to repair the lookout with a wish is dumb. Mr. Popo is the caretaker AND he can do it with magic himself..... Moreover, Goku being randomly changed into a kid with tail makes no sense.... (I get it. Consequences of overuse) but it makes zero sense why specifically THAT is the consequence...
@@TheMissingLink2 i thought maybe he was going for a "fusion" of porunga and shenlong more than that they themselves were "the same" entity. if that was his goal, he explained it poorly. or maybe he did mean they were "the same" because the dragon balls are namekian in nature (or at least they were) and it was thought prior to GT and super that there were only two sets: earth's and namek's. i can kind of see the logic there since at the time DBZ ended, the only dragon balls were those two sets and both had been derived from namekian sources. if his goal was to basically retcon any further sets of dragon balls that existed at that time, it would be simple to assume that shenlong and porunga were thus two parts of a split entity, potentially. but the dragons and the dragon balls were never really explained outside of "this is a thing that namekians do" to my recollection during DBZ. i could be wrong there. either way, i don't like the rewrite either lol it makes GT more confusing than it already was for me.
5:21 I will never understand or support that they turned Goku into a kid so that the new transformation would have him as an adult again. This is like trying to have your cake and eat it too. Never liked that. I mean, I would have made it so that once Goku got to SSJ4 then he would not revert back to kid again. It is fun to have kid Goku when they are exploring the galaxy and whatever, but when they are trying to be serious or emotional, having a kid Goku makes it silly.
Actually Goku didn’t get weaker when he became a kid, it’s just that his stamina dropped and it’s kinda implied that his control over his power also dropped as well, which is why couldn’t use techniques like Instant transmission.
Now that you mention it...both characters are very similar to each other! And also now that you mention it...I like both characters a lot! Like a lot a lot! You might be onto something here! :O
The reason super 17 got skipped was because it wouldn’t make since for all the Z fighters to lose and die before the final arc, after all, no one can beat him when he’s super 17
That final illustration of Pan holding the Dragon Ball choked me up in a way I did not expect. Incredible deep-dive that shows respect for the material and keeps GT's best aspects. Thank you so much for this!
@@zojirushi1Yep with Goku telling him to remember it was his effort not the dragon ball that made him succeed to encourage hard work and less reliance on dragon balls .
9:46 Trunks, as a whole, is trash. He was only cool when he cut down Frieza. After that, he catches all L's. Trunks in Super and Trunks in GT. Just weak. Oh Kid Trunks is annoying too.
9:15 pan is also a kid bro. tf do u expect? have u never been a kid before? do you need a lesson on how kids act? especially kids with super powers? and a female kid at that. do you need a tutorial on how females behave? and um hmm maybe trunks isnt a kid anymore and has his own personality? i think this is why i stopped watching this dude. he doesnt touch grass or knows how real life is and thinks everything has to be super serious and nobody can have fun and nobody can behave like a real person. everyone has to behave like they wanna fight and dont want anything else.
Word. Like, think of it as a slightly different Pokémon, where Goku is Ash, Pan is Misty and Brock is Trunks (and Giru is Pikachu because why not). Picture if GT was just that except in space, I would have loved it. Goku is kind of a Luffy figure and comic relief, Pan is an immature girl but still full of ambition, while Trunks is supposed to be the adult voice of reason. Why is bringing up drama and hardcore fights the first thought some people have when writing a DB series?
The super 17 arc has so much potential.. old villains coming back could give up new matchups and meetings. I've always wanted to see King Vegeta see his son be alive so many years later. Show him sacrifice himself against super 17 causing Vegeta to go super Saiyan 3 and actually win that fight.
Mark decided to spare Baby… so he would be alive during the Super 17 arc. What if we had all the saiyans come back when the gates of Hell were broken open? King Vegeta, Bardock, Nappa, Raditz… come face to face with Baby, the supreme Saiyan-hater. Potential for drama there, no? Potential for some character development? 🤔
@@Goobious_Maximus i like how you think. that would have been best, especially since goku's family (raditz and bardock at that point since gine wasn't a character yet) was so criminally under-utilized in the series. usually the long-lost-brother reveal isn't squandered in an introductory arc or it's at least explored with more interest than it ever was in any subsequent dragon ball media, aside from the video games lol
Not bad, it feels a little empty in some areas (SSJ4 didn't do much and some other character could benefit if they fight to more dragons) but I really really like the Spirit Bomb bounce back with Pan, as a reminisce of Gohan in the Saiyan Saga. That make me really emotional just imagining something like that.
Killing Gohan is an interesting choice, but I like it. His arch is done, he became a scholar, he started a family, so there is no more story to tell. Using his characters death to elevate another characters especially his own daughter is an amazing choice. I which this was how the show was made.
I love how GT makes their galaxy feel so lived in and occupied, whereas Super makes it clear there's only 20 planets with liveable life, and is so dead and empty. Remember, GT only shows one galaxy out of the millions out there making up their universe.
I do want to give my ideas on a re-write of GT as it is something I thought of. First, Goku not becoming a child is an option and to mainly build up Pan more, show that it feels like they are looking down on her because she is weaker, when really, she hasn't been in any serious fights and doesn't know the dangers and that has a minor ego to her that we see slowly break down as the series goes on. A minor moment where we see shots of Pan and Bra, that comes after Goku asking how come Pan doesn't want to see Bra, Pan saying Bra wasn't a fighter, and we get a scene going on that Trunks explains that Pan and Bra were friends but had a falling out when we cut to Bra going Super Saiyan, Trunks saying that Pan felt insecure since she trained and never transformed while Bra who doesn't train could easily achieve it. And we see Pan's growth from a more overconfident and arrogant character into a reliable fighter, watching as she stands on her own two feet shoulder to shoulder with the other Z-Fighters. Second, the beginning, with Goku, Trunks, and Pan traveling across space, we see them encounter movie villains and that is the minor threats leading up to the Tuffles and Baby. Seeing Cooler trying to reform the Empire, Lord Slug hunting Dragon Balls, Turles raiding the team as a mercenary, getting the Dragon Ball from Hirudegarn, and a fight with Bojack. Third, is the Baby Arc, having this for the plan. Baby takes over the earth, Piccolo is believed to be dead as Baby Vegeta spreads his control. Goku falls to Baby Vegeta as Uub steps up, but isn't a match for Baby Vegeta and the Tuffle Saiyans, leading to the birth of Majuub and he owns Baby Vegeta, where Baby Vegeta goes Super Saiyan 3 and defeats Majuub. We see Goku return as a Super Saiyan 4 with the fight happening the same way. Pan and Kibito Kai trying to help but are stopped by Gohan and Gotenks, where Majuub and Piccolo show up to prevent them from helping Baby Vegeta, and events happen the same. Fourth is Super 17, where it tends to be the same, but in Hell, the reason they escaped was the birth of Janemba, which Goku, Piccolo and Pikkon fight as Majuub and Vegeta battle Super 17, leading to the death of Gohan, Krillin, and 18. This way, Majuub and Vegeta get a win while Goku does as well. Fifth is the Shadow Dragons, where each dragon range in strength, but their threat is the elemental powers they possess, going more on that for destroying the world. Goku, Trunks, Goten, Pan, and Majuub heading out to fight and defeat the dragons. During their encounters, they have their own scenes with other characters. Trunks gets help from Tien as an Easter Egg to the Bojack movie fight, Master Roshi and Bra help Pan, Goten gets Yamcha to kind of play-off Goten getting dating advice from Yamcha, and Chiaotzu helping Majuub. We see Majuub getting angry in his fight, unable to hit his Shadow Dragon, showing more of an Evil Buu side that he regains with help from Buu, and with his psychic powers, Chiaotzu helps Majuub to defeat the dragon. Now, the big one with Pan. We see Pan struggling, getting mad that Roshi and Bra are helping her, but it is Roshi who yells at her, telling Pan that she is her own worst enemy, that the adults think highly of her and it is herself that is the one saying she is weaker and needs saving, that Pan herself is the only one saying she isn't good enough. Doing something like that to have Pan realize that her overconfidence and arrogance was because she felt like she wasn't good enough. And this is her point of turning Super Saiyan, and winning her fight. Changing Ice and Nova fights would be an injustice with how Nova is and the Dragon Fist. Now, Omega Shenron as the sixth and last point. Instead of just getting a power boost, Omega Shenron gets all of the other dragons' elemental powers and that is why he is so powerful, the versatility he possesses. The ending plays the same from that. I like to see people's thoughts on this, and what changes they want.
You need to change Super 17, please go back and watch that arc it's absolute trash. It's a prime example of bad writing, making known characters not Goku just become omega jobbers. Hell you had Frieza and Cell teaming up and get defeated by basically an ice machine. There's a bit where Goten and Trunks sense Android 19 was near, ya know the character that can't be sensed? Like completely goes against the point.
@@dylansetright3359 Um...I wasn't going to go for a bit by bit change. Just a more general change to make it better while keeping it similar. And honestly, bringing back old villains for the current cast to fight can give good fights or rematches. Of course there would be changes to the fighting and not having stupid stuff like that ice machine.
Okay, Super 17 arc...what would make for the villain/new villain? I personally like the idea that Goku fights Janemba as the reason why hell is open, like in Fusion Reborn. But who would be the threat on Earth that the others must overcome? I can't think of a good reason as to why someone else would be the powerful villain on Earth. Using Frieza is just a copycat of Super. Cell isn't a threat, and Superhero used him for Cell Max, so another copycat. Buu isn't in hell since he is reincarnated. Using Baby is just repeating the last arc. So, who would be the new villain? Just having Cell absorb Frieza and other major threats? I brought up Super 17 because i liked the idea of energy absorption that Android 19 and 20 possessed and got scraped, take away Ki attacks that granted the Z-Fighter their wins.
@@enanomalley9986 yeah issue was GT made the matches terrible in that arc. Legit the only one from that arc who came back and put up a fight was already from GT. Outside of Super 17 himself of course. But I've seen people who just haven't seen the show in a while try to act like Super 17 was actually not a bad arc and it's just no. That arc would be far need the most changes to actually make it even a decent arc. Possibly worst DB arc as it stands
Admittedly I really didn't like your story, it removed many wonderful things from GT like the ascension to heaven in broad daylight and your new plot point made no sense to me at all. HOWEVER, like you said in your GT review "I totally respect and kind of love that." So if you enjoy this version of the story "that's awesome"!! I'm glad Mark is learning in is own way to appreciate GT and I'm glad some people got enjoyment from this video. Thanks for sharing!!
Yeah Mark, I think a better idea for this would have probably been to keep the same basic plotlines the original GT had, including their setups, and just changing the finer details of the journey to where the most major plot points of each arc still happen as they did in GT, but with better execution on how they get to said plot points. I don't agree with throwing out the Black Star Dragon Balls because they have a lot of interesting lore potential for the Nameless Namekian that split into Kami and Piccolo, plus their planet destroying side effect does create a good amount of tension to rush to collect them. The Super 17 Saga actually is happening mainly because the Dragon Balls being used to bring back the dead so many times has weakened the barrier between the living and the dead which is stated by Shenron at the end of the Shadow Dragons saga, so they could emphasize on that a bit more as well as putting more emphasis on the brainwashing being done to the Android #17 of Earth to make him become an unwilling pawn to Dr. Myuu and Dr. Gero's plans to create Super #17 using him and Hell Fighter #17, making the fight with Super #17 have plenty of moments of them trying to coheres #17 back out of his brainwashing which could have a hand in putting the finishing blow on Super #17. There's a lot of stuff you can do with the preexisting stuff while still making it work better in the long run.
Let's be honest with ourselves... if GT was considered as beloved as the Z anime, Toriyama would've made it canon via some random interview 20 years ago.
That plot twist where Porunga was NOT used in the final fight was fantastic, setting up that it looked like they used him, but in reality Baby came in clutch instead.
There are some things that I'm missing: 1. The Grand Tour of the first arc: yes, the execution of it in GT itself isn't particularly good; but you rather need it: a. how is Baby going to know to get to Earth? In the original they met Beby and his creator in space; but that's not happening here, but there's also no one in space to know where any Saiyans are, except for the Nameks but they're just as isolated as Earth is. The best chance Beby has is remnants of Frieza's planet trade organization; either way this is going to take him a lot of time if you don't send Goku and co. to space. What are Goku and co. going to do in the mean time, twiddle their thumbs? If you think GT's first arc was boring, this is going to be very boring; if they just sit on Earth, waiting. Also, you said you were going to keep the robot; where do they get the robot? I propose this: if this wish restores everything shouldn't it also restore the Saiyans; not just the Tsuffles let alone only their Baby? And also Namek; and possibly the Ginyu Force and Frieza; hell, you could even restore the Cell Games ring and Cell. Anyway, now we have several good reasons for Goku and co. to go to space; Frieza is wrecking havoc; trying to restore his organization and capturing planets to sell to the highest bidder again; not to mention the reignited war between the Tsuffles and the Saiyans. You can have Goku and Vegeta force a peace between the Tsuffles and Saiyans who are now no longer simple barbarians like they were at the time they destroyed the Tsuffles. Baby can go to Earth to deal with the Saiyans there first after the Tsuffles try to shut him down/destroy him; and he refuses and perhaps even learns to hate his creators because of this; and he realizes he can only fight and kill the Saiyans if there is no more peace; so he needs to destroy the people who brought the peace; the Saiyans of the Earth. (You could even give Frieza his golden form not by a mere month of training but because some of the evil wish power centered on him and that's what's allowed him to access that form.) 2. Where did Goku achieve SSJ4? You didn't mention it at all; and he doesn't seem to get an opportunity for it at all. 3. Although I like most of the Shadow Dragon arc, especially the last arc, there is one issue with it you don't solve in yours. Why would wish-granting orbs made for wishing corrupt by wishing? This doesn't make sense. You might go with; you use them to often; except the dragon balls have a mechanism to prevent that; they turn to stone for a year after using them. Now you might go with; you made bad, self-serving wishes; but most of the wishes on Earth's Dragon Balls haven't been that; let alone the Namekian balls that you have corrupting as well. The panties might have been a self-serving wish, the wiping people's minds of Buu was one; but how many other wishes were self-serving? Removing 18s self-destruct mechanism certainly isn't; restoring people's lives isn't; unless perhaps you casually let people die for a good/better fight because you can bring them back anyway, maybe; but you really need to establish / have them do some self-serving/bad/evil wishes in the GT stories to explain why the Dragon Balls corrupt in the first place. Restoring the lookout would probably classify, but that's just one. A better thing would be; to have the Black Star Dragon Balls still be separate balls; and have THEM corrupt; you could still do it with the same wishes as in the original GT; since the Black Star Dragon Balls are created by Piccolo the Shadow of Kami the creator of the standard Dragon Balls; you can have it that every wish upon the Standard Dragon Balls; further power up and corrupt the Black Star Dragon Balls. This would also explain why the Dragons are so powerful; the Dragon can only grant wishes within the power of his creator; but the Shadow Dragons, even the weaklings are a lot more powerful than that.
I really do love the changes made up till the shadow dragon arc. I understand you weren't going to go out of your way to make up entirely new segments but that arc now sounds really rushed as it looks to shoehorn everyone in as a hero (except goten?). Honestly having multiple shadow dragons would work better to give everyone a chance to shine up until omega Shenron (though you did say you were only using one to make it easier on the editor). Also it felt too vauge on what Baby's future was and I may or may not be sad that ss4 gogeta doesn't happen has one last hoorah between Goku and Vegeta. Still loved the video and really enjoy you taking on the large process of redoing these arcs.
DBGT is my favorite. I grew up watching it as it aired in Japan. Despite it getting cancelled, nobody was so aggressively anti-GT back then. The GT hatred felt like something that came from the western audience and then cultivated through RUclipsrs to impressionable audiences who mirror those points. If you watched DB to DBZ to DBGT, DBGT felt like a return to form and an honoring of the original series, but also mixing the hardcore fighting elements of DBZ. It mixed the adventure and the combat, had the greatest soundtrack in anime history, fantastic character designs and characters, voice acting, etc.
DBGT hate is mostly from English speaking countries, because of the bad dub, In LatinAmerica you could ask most people if they like DBGT and they would say yes, that they love it
You can’t have GT without SSJ4 Gogeta. His appearance alone gives such a positive and hopeful vibe no matter what the situation is and has been a staple of Dragon Ball media for years despite only having one appearance
I've always enjoyed SS4's concept and how Goku's harnessing of it was a call back and just as emotional for that character as it would be Baby in your rewriting. Goku killed his own grandfather in that form because he could never control it; most sayians couldn't with the exception of the elite's like Vegeta, and they'd just blindly destroy anything and anyone in their way. Goku's ability to harness, control, the form was a full circle moment where he'd never again hurt anyone with the form (Like he had in the past) while still accepting it as part of himself. I think in your retelling that should be highlighted as well, but even with this new form and with Vegeta in the same it's still not enough. It would go to show that endless power ups, upgrades, aren't enough to best an enemy like your Omega; because he'd keep growing stronger each time they abused the balls again and again, hence really drive home the need to not abuse them. With that realization, it plants the seed in goku that there has to another way, giving your ending much more merit and an earned feel. Also, I believe the SS4 transformation should have been one exclusive solely to full blooded Saiyans; as the full embracement of their origin, story, and shouldn't become accessible in future stories in continuation of this one. It's an homage, unique, to our original two heroes that pays tribute to who they are, were, and who they become. In Super, if you followed this, the main focus of the show should have been Vegeta Jr & Goku Jr. Allowing character development for these new heroes that open the path to the SSGod transformations (Because they have to RELY on the power of other's to harness it, and that goes with what Goku brings up in your ending. How that strength allows them to go even beyond our original heroes.) Another thing that needs to change is how Pan looks older at that age, to that extent, when we know the Saiyan DNA even in Halflings will slow down their ageing. Not saying she should look young, but I think it's ridiculous that Bulma can look like she does at her age but Pan looks like she's near her deathbed. Also Vegeta should die in his battle, giving up his life, giving another call back to the time he sacrificed himself but this time with some moderate success by buying time or slowing down Omega. If you did a continuation into Super you could keep Piccollo's transformation as well, as a call back from Omega in GT, and how he's harnessing that power to defend the planet without having to abuse the balls. It would be a nice way to see our "Demon King Piccollo" once evil (Maybe have a backstory of how he became evil? Maybe he was outcasted originally from Namek, rather than leaving, because of his abuse of the balls that corrupted him. In his last attempt to spare his people he fled.) who could now harness his original strength without the selfish nature he once showed. This would make him a power house in the Super story arcs to come. I would have loved to see a scene in GT, after his training with Vegeta, where he's given the broken Z sword to be reforged giving him a full circle moment of becoming something parallel to Future trunks. Hell, I think you could still incorporate a Super 17 arc after the Dragons maybe in super. Where there's an older Trunks now, with the sword, that encounters a new android threat to the planet. Him and Goten handle the threat together (Giving goten some love, because he got none) where Vegeta and goku are gone at this point. Maybe Uub is elsewhere and Piccollo is going through his finding himself arc. If you wanted to give another full circle moment you could say Gohan at this point starts training Goten and Trunks, as their master, and this new Android kills Gohan. With them not having the dragonballs this would fuel Goten, Trunks, and Pan into a frenzy and maybe have to do something akin to the Kamehameha used in the Bio broly movie with Goten, Trunks, and Pan. A nice call back that gives these three characters with little love a little more screen time. I'd say before the last paragraph I mentioned, maybe bring in Broly. In this time we give Gohan a reason to fight again and finally give him that glow up he's been neglected since the cell arc. Maybe this after Piccollo does his new powerup, and he trains gohan one last time before deciding to stay with the Nameks for good? We see a glimpse of what the half saiyans are capable of in the future; like SSG Blue and Red. Gohan taps into his beast transformation, pure rage, that rivals and over powers the rage of Broly. Maybe we get an ending where our two hot heads, after beating each other to near death, come to the realization that they need to learn to control this after looking in a mirror - each other. This gives Broly a happy ending as well, where he starts a new life elsewhere and is appreciative of this new-found perspective and context. Important thing I'd note is that Gohan's new transformation wouldn't be at like SSG level but like his version of SS4? That these unique, new transformations in Super, were only accessible to the half saiyans because their mastery over there emotions. Hell, this transformation could have been the result of the "Potential unlock" for guru and that which Elder Kai gave "Mystic" gohan. That gohan, because he was undisciplined and gave up fighting, never really tapped into it till now. And that the form is unique to him for that reason.
The introduction to Beatrice comes after all these events where our heroes learn of this transformation; maybe sensing a "flicker" or the power of gohan in that moment against Broly is what tipped him off to our planet. However, by the time he arrives Gohan is dead, throughly unamused he leaves for the day the SSGod could appear after telling our heroes of that possibility. Maybe we see a new frieza arc at this point? Where he becomes Golden, in the future, and begins terrorizing the universes from afar (Hesitant to show up on earth because he doesn't know our original heroes are dead/gone) over the course of those years we get the tournament of power/universes where our Earth forces are nowhere near the potential they once were without Gohan, Vegeta, and Goku. We get to see Uub step up, Krillian, and a few other favorites we've neglected over the years make a come up. Our heroes that could once just rely on endless power ups are forced to act smarter, engage in Martial arts, and just barely scrape by. Maybe it's Frieza, of all people, that clutch this to save the universe only to realize his adversaries are nowhere near his potential that sparks the new Frieza arc. Realizing this our heroes are forced into nonstop training. You could also include Baby in this tournament as well, by the way, if we go off your continuity. Rather than "future trunks" having the part he does from that timeline, it's our Trunks coming into that new role. With all of his training, under Vegeta at SS4 and later Gohan with his new form, that allows Trunks to access that form exclusive to Future Trunks? Thus making him as strong or near the level of Uub, that gives him more power or merit in that tournament of power? This would give a real sense of passing off the mantel to the new generation who begin to develop into their own. As for Goku black, maybe it's Goten that's taken instead? Once he regains his body, hell you could say Baby jumps into Goten Black to fight off the other mind, he has access to that transformation as well? Maybe it wouldn't feel as earned, but maybe there's like an internal battle where Goten and Baby fight off the Kai; through their combined efforts they're able to best him, and giving some sense of having earned this new form. Now in the Tower of power arc you have another contender that allows this universe to even have the chance it had. Frieza arc occurs and he tries to take over earth realizing Vegeta and goku are gone, but only to face off Goten and Trunks who are acting on behalf of their fathers much like Vegeta and Goku had done previously. Individually the two struggle to best frieza, but using the Fusion dance they are able to best frieza forcing him to retreat. A disgraced Frieza begins to train once more, increasing his influence across the cosmos, where we encounter new enemies that continuously barrage earth with new fighters trying to take down the new Z fighters. Also meanwhile Frieza's forces are causing chaos around the universe, causing Piccolo to make a reappearance to defend Namek. We now get the original GT feel, of space ships, travelling around space to new worlds trying to fight off the galactic tyrant. However, our main heroes of Trunks and Goten must stay on earth to defend, just in case Frieza were to arrive, and Uub with his experiences of travelling space with Pan (Who joins up with him again) and Baby try to save planet after planet from Frieza's clutches. I think it would be fitting to have Baby with them, because of what happened to his world and how where the Saiyans were wrong to do what they had; he learns of Frieza's part of that, and living up to his original purpose, vows to stop frieza. So that no other world goes through what his creators had. It's also fiting that a young saiyan, a new generation, in pan is atoning for the mistakes of past Saiyans that took over planets. Uub acting as the backbone, power house, and acts as a mentor to Pan who help shape her into a more capable fighter. Where Uub is the physical mentorship our young saiyan needs, Baby acts as a mentor of tactics and battle strategy to Pan that helps forge her new-found desire to redeem the sins of her species. Later on as our Heroes age and pass the baton, it's given to Pan, who continues to grow stronger and stronger into her own. Her desire to do right is what makes her into the memorable hero, a North star if you will. Maybe we include a story element of Beatrice who when he arrived gave the Earth 100 years to find that untapped potential, or he'd destroy the planet. Trunks is taken to be part of the role of time protector, so he's gone from the planet now. Maybe in the final clash between Frieza and Trunks + Goten, goten perishes; with a sudden power up from the Kai's, in exchange for his service, trunks is indepted to the Kai's and must leave earth. Uub and Pan act as the last line of Defense for the planet, against the remnants of Frieza's forces seeking retribution, but as the attacks become fewer and fewer our Pan (now in her late teens) settles down to focus on school and an every day life. That's where she encounters a love interest, finds happiness, and maybe there's an arc where she's pregnant and is unable to defend the planet. (For safety of the child) And Uub is forced to defend the planet solo against a last ditch effort of Frieza's forces. Uub completely exhausts himself, dies, but is able to fend off the attack. This leaves Pan, alone, with only a handful of fighters to defend the planet. Rather than Goku Jr or Vegeta Jr, down the road, of becoming the first SSGod it's Pan surrounded by the spirits of Goku, Vegeta, Trunks (Who is allowed a brief window out of his service), Goten, Gohan, & Uub (though not a saiyan) arrive as ghost (Much like Goku could in the buu arc) to give their energy to Pan who becomes the first SSGod. She's able to fend off against Beatrice, just barely, but enough to impress him to leave the earth alone for a time. This buys time for Pan, with her child, to grow as warriors. Then she has her grandson Goku Jr fight against Vegeta Jr (As we saw) they go super saiyan. She begins to train both of them, where they become the first SSG Blues and continue to train to surpas the legacy of fighters who came before. And that's how I'd end Super, with your story in mind.
Here is HOW TO FIX SUPER ANDROID 17 ARC:
We just get to see him getting a job as a park ranger.
And keep the 10X Kamehameha red and big bang Kamehameha rainbow
It'd be a 4 episode arc. Losers would call it Filler
What about also introducing his family, or at least wife and first kid/adopted kid?
that and a throwaway line about training or upgrades or smth and yeah i dont think anyone would complain nearly as much
@@AnastasioCostaMeno
Another interesting angle would have been Hell Fighter 17 attacking and taking 17's family as hostage, forcing him to fuse with the deal being to spare them. Maybe even have 17 beating Hell Fighter 17's ass until he pulls out the hostage card to...well...just give 17 some more characterization while showing how cool he is.
-Singles out Giru as being kept in the story
-never mentions him again
-gives no time or logical reason as to when he would enter the story
-refuses to elaborate further
Honestly Giru was stupid, so I'm glad Mark didn't give the random robot a light.
@@Johten no
@@Johten I agree, Giru was really obnoxious. Cute at first but my goodness.
I guess you could assume Giru isn't an alien robot but more like an AI developed by Bulma and Pan is testing it
Disagree but yea
One undoubtedly beautiful thing that GT showed us Dan Dan Kokoro Hikareteku. That song is just…has that goodbye feeling
it makes me so nostalgic
That song is a beauty.
I remember some girl playing the violin in Buenos Aires' subway, and she was playing Dan Dan so beautifully. I genuinely feel bad for Americans who grew up with some bootleg guitar riff instead of Dan Dan Kokoro Hikareteku. Latin America? We won the Dragon Ball lottery.
Both Spanish and Portuguese localizations had some baller versions of Cha-La, We Gotta Power and Dan Dan, and also the outros. And the OG JP soundtrack and no censorship. Fuck yeah, awesome childhood.
That song was actually licensed. It existed before GT and was a popular song.
@@TheDalekCaan_ Me dê a mão, pra fugir desta terrível escuridão... Sdds...
I feel like the other Shadow Dragons could be used as a way for the side characters to actually get major story-relevant fights with some actual consequence. Maybe Adult/Teen Gotenks, Gohan, Piccolo, Uub, Pan, Tien, etc. could get some time to shine for once.
That’s what I was thinking as well
The Shadow Dragon arc in this version would be: Main villain gets born, goes to Earth, beats up the earth defenders and then gets beat. That is not a story, that's a filler episode.
So yea, I agree that we need a far bigger arc with more moving parts and characters to make a final arc the series deserves.
Tbh that’s kinda how it went in the Young JiJi DBAF
I was so mad when Trunks and Goten offered to fuse, only for the show to tell me Goku was the only character who mattered. We got too much time with Trunks who was boring for no reason, and everyone loved Goten in the short time we saw him.
I would also have the original Dragon Balls trying to escape the solar system as a last ditch effort to avoid being over used, but have a two or three different crews fetching them, because the show was a slog only seeing the same two or three character 100% of the time. It could lead to an interesting dynamic if Baby finds a group completely unaware of what happened earlier, perhaps infecting/possessing them on the way to Earth, only to steal the wish before revealing itself and taking over.
@@MalevolentFaea filler arc? Nah dude, that’s a filler MOVIE 💀
Bro what is it with you and saying Gohan needs more agency and then the only thing he ever does in your rewrites is get knocked tf out and die lmao
Obviously he means Gohan needs agency to gtfo this damn story.
because subconsciously even mark knows what toriyama figured out years ago: gohan simply isn't a "main character" archetype and thus is oftentimes difficult to slot into roles that *aren't* reactive in nature. he fights *in response* to things. that doesn't make for a compelling aggressive character who always wins (like goku). gohan doesn't really have a passion to fight *unless* there's something looming overhead that he has time to prepare for. thus: reactive.
people don't want to hear it or believe it due to nostalgia, but when you take blinders off and just look at gohan's character traits, progression, etc., you can see that he's had a complete character arc that cannot develop further no matter what by GT. there's no more his character can give or offer *besides* nostalgia; he will *always* be reactive.
so mark is clearly subconsciously slotting gohan into roles that fit the archetype despite what he says he wants for the character itself. everyone wants gohan to be *more* than he is, but he frankly just *isn't* and people gotta live with that.
@neonhalos I agree with pretty much everything you said. I do think Gohan can be developed into a main character, but that is absolutely not his natural characterization. He would have to undergo some seriously transformative event.
@@SeisoYabai yeah, exactly, and we've kind of seen that a little bit in canon already. like if you look at what he went through in the future timeline (the original one), what gohan experiences is exactly the type of chain of events that would need to occur for Gohan to become a main character in the main timeline. *everyone* he cares about has to die, just about, for Gohan to convert from a reactive character to a proactive character. even if Gohan himself isn't weak at all, he's still mentally and emotionally dependent on those around him to gauge just how serious of a situation is.
but when the androids kill everyone, Gohan has no choice anymore. he doesn't get the opportunity to train with goku in the time chamber, nor anyone else really. it's a rapid succession of loss and it hardens him quickly. and as such, he just as quickly and rapidly develops to rise up to the occasion not just for one fight but for *all* subsequent fights there could theoretically be. because after him, it's no one else until trunks gets old enough to learn to fight.
and that's kinda why I wish we got more of a fleshed out manga or spin off anime about future Gohan that chronicled his development after that point because that would satiate a bit of people's desire to see Gohan just be an unmitigated badass lol. oh well 😔
@neonhalos My brother you understand Dragon Ball more than most people
"Atoning for the sins of his life" **Vegeta's Bingo dance flashes onscreen** actual cinema
thats gotta be one of the most evil things he did
Bingo Dance marked an entire generation of alpha males for life lol
Mann and here I was thinking Mark was gonna post
"Every Pointy Ears in Dragon Ball. What it means and why it changes everything"
But GT is a good substitute
doesnt it mean that theyre descendants of demons or someshit
@@CORNZILAA Dodoria was a demon all along. How else can he jam his pointy ear into his scouter? Demon magic.
@@ThelronFjord I think in daima the new demon king said to dende something along the lines of his pointy ears meaning someone in his family tree was a demon or something
@@CORNZILAAyeah and considering mr popo was right behind him in that shot with pointy ears too, they also basically confirmed that popo and everyone else with pointy ears are also descended from the demon realm
Pointy ears? Since Shin and the core people have pointy ears, it is better to treat it as a otherworldly treat, instead of a demonic one. Also we should keep in mind what Elder Moori told to the other namekians in the Granola Arc.
Honesty i do not mind how vegeta got ssj4 in the original show as it shows that vegeta now can move past his pride and ego in order to protect the planet and family, plus asking goku to fuse shows that even more.
bingo, though I can see how others may not like it
I disagree. I thought that firing moon beams to hope it transforms was stupid
@@CJ-111 yeah i agree too
I agree, it's literally an evolution of his development from the End Of Z
@@CJ-111all it did was give him the ability to unlock ssj4 vegeta did that on his own
I don't wanna be harsh but I don't think this is good. The way you're describing it, after the whole debacle with the black star dragon balls nobody on Earth does anything until Baby shows up except asking for info from the namekians. There's no grand tour, no looking for a solution, nothing. That's a lot of passivity and a lot of empty space until Baby shows up to kick the plot back up again. There's also no timer to the Earth's destruction so there's no rush to get things solved. Also, why is Baby's lab the only thing that gets resurrected by the corrupted dragon's wish? Why not the whole Tuffle civilization?
Also, the problem with the shadow dragons, in my opinion at least, wasn't that there were too many, it's that only Goku and Pan were allowed to fight them. The solution would've been to have each member of the cast to fight an individual dragon at the same time. One for Goku, one for Vegeta, Gohan, Piccolo, Uub, Pan, hell you could even throw adult Gotenks in there
I don't wanna throw shit but this really feels like it needed more time in the planning phase and more beta readers
True felt as if Mark was too excited to make this video and forgot about all of that and Giru 🤫
@@DeathBoster Or about the fact that he made Pan a SSJ.
Damn right you are. The shadow dragons show up and most of the cast are like "Yeah ok, have fun with that. We are just gonna sit back eating movies and watching popcorn."
BE HARSHER
how i interpreted that, the planet and cities where restored, but not the people. so a empty planet
There's a lot of weird holes and problems in this that I think end up feeling worse off than even the original was.
First off, we're keeping Giru... But the way this story is laid out, he wouldn't even exist, so saying we're keeping him is pointless.
Second, while I understand that a video like this would be meant to convey a severely stripped back skeleton of what would be a much longer set of events than what a 38-minute video would go into detail on, it still feels like it's really lacking in content for 75% of the cast. Goten is mentioned once, Gohan seems to really only be there as a plot device for Pan, Trunks just doesn't do anything anymore because we swapped him out for Uub, and even then Uub doesn't do much more than Gohan does. Piccolo gets one moment, Vegeta gets a transformation before Goku that doesn't really amount to anything because nobody gets to finish off Baby.
Super Saiyan 4 now lacks a lot of the weight it had, no longer really being tied to embracing the Great Ape form as the Saiyan's heritage and merging it with the legend of the Super Saiyan, creating something wholly new in what could probably be described as the epitome of the Saiyan Race.
We spared Baby in this, which is an interesting idea because that's kinda what Goku is all about (See Tien, Piccolo, Vegeta), but he only gets mentioned one other time at the end.
Reducing the Shadow Dragon(s) to just being Omega certainly a choice that cuts down on a lot of the fluff and unnecessary parts of the original arc and just takes it right to the big action points, but it all happens so suddenly with Omega showing up and then everyone suddenly having to fight the Big Bad and then it's over. That's not really an Arc, that's just one really big fight scene. If I were to make any change, I would personally keep the seven dragons, but have everyone split up to fight them because Dragonball NEEDS to utilize its cast of characters more rather than simply reducing it to Goku and whoever he decides to work with that day. Have Goten and Trunks go off together and have Gotenks return, have Piccolo and Gohan team up again, Vegeta takes one on himself, Goku takes on Nuova, etc. Or if you want Goku in all the fights, just have him team up with someone different idk.
TLDR I feel like there are a lot of missed opportunities in cutting down the series into the parts you like without actually filling in the gaps of what missing them would entail. I don't think a single video would do a rewrite justice. But what does a random commenter know anything about dragonball compared to the expert?
well put. 100% agree.
Very well put mate, very well put. This would need to be a longer, more in depth writing project
👍
Yes, exactly! I thought some of the ideas here are interesting like swapping Trunks for Uub and making Pan more than a damsel in distress. But I wasn't convinced on many of the ideas and you summed it up perfectly
I would have kept the original frame as it is, since the first arc is a call back to the RR Arc, besides all those encounters serves the purpouse of the Universal Genki-dama, so trim the fat of useless characters and villains and more challenges for Pan to get the SSJ and Trunks to SSJ2 or SSJ3?, major change will come with Baby infecting Goku instead of Vegeta, so that would give more sense of Baby attaining the Golden Ozaru (surprise to all unlocked with SSJ) from the traumatic extintion of the tsufuru at the hands of that transformation and finally give Vegeta the shine to save the day, here I loved the idea of Vegeta getting the SSJ4 first since he is more expert than anyone, for Super 17 Arc all resurrected Saiyans get at least SSJ level, Frieza showing Cooler's like transformation, Cell's improved techniques, etc. So good matches for all side characters and a love letter to fans for abandoned them for the saiyan cast after getting SSJ, and finally BD Arc the concept is great what failed here was the execution so I just a re-work of the Saint Seiya formula where the cast fights their respective "counterparts" or maybe alligning the wish origin with the specific character or someone close who made the wish.
I do like the fact that Baby while growing more in more saiyan like accentuates all their negative traits while SSJ4 has the Saiyans draw even more on their roots to use in a positive manner
Though he should have been included in the ending as an addition, having survived the prior arc realizing what DROVE the tyrannical saiyans in a quest for power in the first place fighting Omega Shenron after he and Buu giving Uub enough strength needed to launch a counterattack, with Vegeta making amends for his race's misdeeds to the very people his race once oppressed. It will be a slow process, but gradually the tuffles in spirit aid in the advancement of earth's technology thanks to Baby's knowlidge of tuffle technology, now working alongside a simmered-down Hatchiyak as the new protectors of the Dragon Balls alongside Uub, so they will never be abused again (my version swaps Super 17 for Plan to Eradicate the Saiyans).
So to be critical of this, I did not like how Mark handle SSJ4 at all in this. Let me explain:
While Vegeta taking control of his own body and becoming an SSJ4 makes sense him being the first one to do it and not having a fight makes the form feel a bit hollow, like it is just there for no reason other than to be used in the next arc... and then Vegeta loses in said form making it feel like it was a pointless transformation that did nothing. Goku getting it off screen and no SSJ4 Gogeta also make it feel like a nothing burger. If this how SSJ4 was handled at the time it would have been remembered as the disappointing GT form who's only redeeming quality is that it looks cool.
I can see what your issue is. In my mind I wanted to make this a moment where Vegeta finally achieved something Goku hadn’t and it was because of what made him different to Goku. Looking back, while I stand by my creative decision, I should have just bit the bullet and made the video 5 or 10 mins longer to flesh it out and explain my thought process more thoroughly
Yeah I agree, how SSJ4 is handled in this rewrite is the only thing that feels like a downgrade from the OG series.
@TotallyNotMark i love that callback with Pan bouncing back the spirit bomb, almost made a grown man cry.
Personally, the way I'd do it is like this:
While Golden Great Ape Baby is going rampant in that city (they're not on Planet Plant in this one, right?), Goku, while still very tired, looks up and sees the moon as well, causing him to transform into initially just a great ape now that he's got a tail but powering up to a golden great ape shortly after. As he has no control over the form yet he just instinctively goes after Baby but takes quite a beating from him, until Pan and maybe his sons come near him to try and get him to go back to his senses after an emotional speech.
We then get that same classic SS4 transformation sequence and Goku, now gifted with the energy of the other half-saiyans, gets the upper hand in the battle and after a while knocks GGA Baby to the ground. It is then, while he's getting up, that he sees his reflection and that of the ravaged city in that crumbled building that he stars to feel remorseful and the following events go just as Mark tells them.
That's literally what it's already known for, ssj4 literally does nothing cool lmao. Just looks nice
Mark: "Please Bring back and restore everything and everyone that was destroyed on earth"
Me (foolishly): Radditz and Nappa are coming back?!?!
Yeah, I thought that's where this was going as well. Since he talks about how GT squandered the only redeeming portion of the SA17 arc, I thought this was going to be his way of fixing it... by bringing back the villains killed on Earth and giving that arc a more prominent role in developing Uub and Pan while showcasing how the other Z fighters are doing when compared to their old enemies and *possibly* even allowing for interactions between Raditz/Nappa and Goku/Vegeta (or basically any other member of Goku's family). It would not only allow room for at least one villain to reform (say, Raditz, after witnessing the Super Saiyan transformation deciding that Goku could maybe teach him something after all), but would also allow us to get the King Cold fight the original series never allowed for.
@@FreeViewBlog
I agree that in place of the Super 17 Arc, should be a kind of a "Anti-Z Fighter Arc."
Much like how 1st Form Cell is in the background of the Android Arc, I think Omega Shenron should arrive on Earth from the remains of Namek well before the start of the Shadow Dragon Arc. I think it's in character for him to believe that the villain resurrection is a fitting punishment for the abuse of the dragon balls, only for him to step in when the old villains are dealt with (seeing at least 1 redemption would be crazy, I like what you're thinking). "If you want something done right, do it yourself."
This arc may be a good point to allow SS4 to claim some victories, as well as a better way to explain the drain of Senzu beans before the Omega Shenron drama. Hell, nothing saying that SS4 Gogeta could slot in here. If the Buu Saga filler showed everyone watching the Z Fighters against Buu, why wouldn't they try and copy the fusion technique from watching Gotenks over the years?
@@Cloveinti_Uno59232fusion reborn canon to gt so ss4 gogeta was their second time using metamoran fusion
I recommend you split town, Nappa
Additional Line: Except anyone who is evil!
Imma be honest I’m not the biggest fan of this rewrite. It has a lot of good elements especially baby that’s pretty top tier but cutting out two major arcs, all the shadow dragons and ssj4 not winning a major fight kinda makes this video feel half done.
Gt is great the way it is .
@@wxchief6737 imo it isn't. It has a lot of good ideas, bad execution. I do feel like this rewrite cuts out a lot of the cool stuff that could've been improved, especially in terms of the 1st and 3rd arcs, but it kinda makes sense considering TNM hated those arcs.
That made borderline no sense the longer it went on.
The original inciting wish makes no logical sense of its impact and what it actually did (at first it seemed like you were implying it undid EVERYTHING from DB history, but apparently not), and the fact the Namekian balls also have black stars, I really don't get. I thought you said they only appear when overused?
Earth's, yes, but Namek's wouldn't be.
The details are not here.
And then the Namekian dragon just gets restored at the end during the final fight? How? Why? I thought it and Shenlong were merged together as the villain?
It started off kind of neat, but as it progressed, the entire thing just made less and less sense to the point of rivaling the real GT or Super.
@@Burns_RED When you think about it, the story making no sense makes it fitting for a DB story...
@@Noneofwhat Agreed
@@NoneofwhatDisagree to some extent. Sure some sagas had some plot holes or concepts thrown in that seemed random, but you had some genuinely good sagas and a few that were good but came up short in the end. Examples, DKP Saga, Frieza Saga, Saiyan Saga, Baby Saga, Moro Saga, and Superhero Saga.
@@Noneofwhat ye lol
yeah man, im ngl this rewrite was kinda buns. I feel like hes trying TO hard to go into the philosophical side of dragon ball but it winds up being so bare bones and strips 90% of the meat of the series.
That rewrite of the SSJ4 transformation is everything Mark complained about in his GT review except 10 times worse, just a new transformation out of nowhere for it's own sake, at least the original had a lot of symbolism, from Earth being what triggers the transformation instead of the moon and Pan begging him to stop being what brought Goku back, the fight with Baby being between everything bad and brutal about the saiyans against a more pure form that managed to let go of his anger, to Vegeta giving up his pride using science to get it to save what he now considers HIS planet.
As for reducing the Shadow Dragons to a single one, while I understand the point made I feel like there was another way to use multiple dragons, and it was to use the whole cast to fight them, like, what if instead of Goku fighting them all one at a time... the whole cast separate to take on each dragon? Since the ending of GT was about celebrating the story of all of Dragon Ball having the entire cast having a sort of last hurrah where each take part in the final arc would help it, it can still end with Omega Shenron absorving the others and being defeated by Uub/Pan with the Genki-Dama .
Everything after the beginning addition making the story a even better connected , is making baby arc as a separate story a massive downgrade , Ssj4 as its done has awesome introduction while bringing so many things full circle and Goku is the perfect character to get it first , he's the saiyan who grew up on earth from the start the one who stood for being more than he was born with Vegeta fitting way better with the Bulma method cuz she's the one who primarily made him who he is now before earth itself . Before mentioning the new form instantly ending the arc with no more twists is very lackluster execution for any dragon ball arc , let alone to replace it with what we already have the kais carrying even more than they already did for Ssj4 with everyone coming back in the end to save an exhausted Ssj4 Goku , restore his power while holding off baby for them to finally win . As well as shadow dragons being a good decision which u can add other characters to since the start without reducing them to one removing the several ways of nature itself giving them a second chance in each of the fights to win before it came to spirit bomb in the end.
Although i haven't been a big fan of the GT review in the first place , had several complaining for the sake of complaining points , Ssj4 is the perfect final one and clear cut best transformation especially for summing up Goku the best other than being a fitting end to the journey of saiyan forms themselves . All transformations are for the sake of being one by that logic . The scenes Toei put in the anime since dbz add even more to it i wonder if they had the idea in mind already .
The bit about the Shadow Dragons was something I brought up in my own comment. Instead of just one, still have 7, but flesh them all out more. And have all the Dragon Team split up and take some on. You could've had Goten and Trunks go after one or two, but needing to fuse to defeat the stronger one they face, thus planting the seed of Goku and Vegeta doing it later. Have Buu and Uub go after another, and have that be the way to intro Majuub if we aren't doing that vs Baby. Gohan and Piccolo could run a good fade with another one or two. Vegeta could go solo and beat one, etc.
There would've been more to do, and then you have Syn Shenron be the one Goku runs into, and while he can match him in SS4, he's no match for Omega. This fixes the entire arc, and also lets you see some of the more unique fighting styles of the other fighters. Gotenks could have a fun, but still serious fight with one, Gohan and Piccolo could use coordinated attacks to defeat their opponent, Vegeta could do a Vegeta and utterly humiliate one solo, etc.
@@Zac_Frost Basically youngjijii's dragonball AF comic. That arc was all I wanted out of GT, and it still baffles me that they were so into their Goku glazing they couldn't let anybody else join in on fighting the 7 shadow dragons.
@@Paur For real. It would've been such an easy way to make the arc incredible.
On the note of having the Z Fighters fight the Shadow Dragons separately, why not make an specific character fight the Dragons who's wish their responsable for, Have Vegeta fight Naturon Shenron, as the Wish that made him was to resurrect the people Vegeta killed when Babidi took over him. Or have Uub fight Eis Shenron, and where learns where Buu really comes from, or Piccolo fight Nuova Shenron
5:58 Mark dunking on the Super 17 arc will never get old 😂
But seriously the idea of our heroes facing and confronting past villains is a pretty good one
Like actually facing and not marring it with dumb humor
Still funny that bandai actually cut super 17 from Sparking Zero too lol
With the changes Mark made to the story, maybe the old foes could get revived thanks to the corrupted wishes and have their spotlight until Omega Shen arrives.
The build up to Super 17 was done well. Super 17 himself was a bit dull. He was powerful & dominant but was merely only focused on killing Goku like any other red ribbon army
@@JoshuaLowe-ci3wohe is still very cool tho
I love what you are doing with the Tuffles backstory. It fleshes out a somewhat tragic civilization that GT really should’ve looked into more. Not to mention how your rewrite introduces them much much earlier in the story. The potential here is great Mark. Keep it up!
I still would want to see the original Dragon Balls trying to escape the solar system as a last ditch effort to avoid being over used, but have a two or three different crews fetching them. Pace each section better and let more characters get some screen time. It would be an interesting dynamic if Baby finds a group completely unaware of what happened earlier, perhaps infecting/possessing them until the Dragon Balls are together again.
Rewatched his rewriting of the Buu Saga, and found a lot of similarities between that and this. His writing style hasn’t particularly changed much in 5 years, one of the big glaring weaknesses I’ve seen between both is that Mark cuts out every bit of fluff he can and focuses only on the important story beats, not allowing any moment to really breathe or resonate. Cutting filler is one thing, but it does allow you to spend some time with characters more and really get a feel for them.
Another similarity is that he centers around key characters, but doesn’t really offer much for them to DO. In his Buu Rewriting, Gohan was his main character, but he spent over half the arc unconscious, and the other half needlessly traumatized. In this, he moves focus to Pan and Uub, but neither of them do anything of worth throughout the rewriting.
it's more of a loose synopsis to build out from.
He kinda told us he was specifically not focusing on that and sticking to the important plot bits in the beginning.
@@endersisus tbf, that's not a "rewrite" then lol. that's not really even an outline. that's a beat sheet.
"Gts arcs dont lead into eachother"
The baby arc into the super 17 art has a great connection, killing the arcs villain and then in the next arc having him open hell up to come back teaming up with a great counterpart from z is a really smart bridge.
it means that, indirectly, sending him to hell caused a bigger problem which is a crazy twist
Arc 1 into 2 and 3 into 4 dont have much to connect them but i mean in Z what leads the namek arc into the android arc has just as complex a connection with trunks as gt does with giryu, they kinda just like yknow introduce themselves outta nowhere and thats that.
And s17 arc into the shadow dragons has just as much of a connection as cell to buu, bit of a time skip and then suddenly new villain(s) just turn up.
Truly a don't mess with us DB fans we haven't watched the show moment from Mark
I like most of this at first, but cutting the shadows dragons down to one. Kinda kills the potential towards creativity. We could've had a group of complete individuals with their own beliefs in "balance". Some targeting specific characters for their actions, or reversing wishes that had caused more harm than good.
Sin/Omega = Mark's basic, but necessary concept.
Nova = The revival of warriors in general. Creating the personification of the perfect fighter. Taking the positive aspects from the Z-Fighters.
Ize = On the other hand personifies their worst aspects in fighting.
Oceanus = A vain deity born to give life. Representing the constant resurrection of the dead, but for a price. As she can resurrect one person at a time. She feeds off the lives of several others too, just restore nature.
The other dragons can be left for the imagination of the fans.
There are 7 shadow dragons and 6 saijans + Oob (not counting Bra, since she does not know how to fight), you don't have to be a genius to figure this out.
Thumbnail: "Fixing GT"
-Vegeta is the only Ssj4 (no Ssj4 Goku)
-No Ssj4 Gogeta
-removes Nouva Shenron and the interesting Dynamic he and Goku had (a poetic dynamic given Nouva was the 4 Star ball)
-Goku doesn’t have the conclusion and death against Omega's Karma Ball, leaving his departure with less of a mystery and less room to make sense of it.
-less consequences overall, making the final fight feel less tense given the context of what we've dealt with before in the franchise, and arguably making the consequence of misusing the DragonBalls less tense aswell.
What is this?...while i admire the attempt you made, i feel the changes are way to drastic in a lot of areas and even unnecessary. Really, no Ssj4 Goku? The most iconic thing within GT? You know, some things dont have to be completely perfect. Gogeta whilst ultimately not beating Omega, had a purpose within the context he had, and also was like the most hype thing ever. Sometimes it's ok to just have hype moments like that. Even Baby's redemption, it makes his fall a lot less impactful imo, Baby's death showed how his views were wrong and that going down that path leads to the worst, the redemption felt shoehorned in tbh. I do agree with a lot of changes, like replacing Trunks with Uub, and giving some characters more moments. But ngl, a lot just feels like change for the sake of change.
COOKED HIM
I really like the idea of old Pan finding the 4 star ball confirming goku’s presence and the return of the dragon balls.
I can even hear her calling the 4 star ball “grandpa”. A beautiful final call back to how young Goku prayed and referred to the ball in early dragon ball.
Hits right in the feels. Good job with this TNM.
I agree.
That would’ve been perfect honestly
Goddamn. The whole series ending with Pan calling the 4-star ball Grandpa would’ve been absolutely perfect. 😭
Yoooooooo THAT WOULDVE BEEN PERFECT and that would've made GT a 9/10 and leagues above super in the thematic department
12:26 …So, I’m a bit confused. How does Goku get wished into a kid again if the only wish was “Undo the damage our fighting has caused”? Doesn’t that mean that Pilaf wouldn’t have the opportunity to wish him into a kid? Am I missing something?
It’s a consequence of using the dragon balls to much
@@Choppydplug but how is him turning into a little kid a consequence of using the dragon balls...? wouldn't then bulma, yamcha, krillin, oolong or anyone else who has used or helped use the dragon balls be affected by that, if that were the case?
...though now that i think about it, an arc where the OG dragon ball cast is singled out would have been super interesting, especially in a post-Z story lol
@@neonhalos I can see it as him being brought back to the point before he started his training and fighting, as a kid.
Mid rewrite honestly, I'm not sure it can be even considered an improvement. Out of all of this, the take on SSJ4 is probably the most unnecessary. The presentation in the original works fairly well, with Goku becoming golden ozaru and then into SSJ4 after achieving control. Vegeta could also do that, but the first introduction via a blutz waves machine is brilliant because it makes Bulma relevant again and a cool support to his husband, and further shows the maturity and understanding the couple reached at this point in the story, after years living together with two children.
Uub learning how to use the Spirit Bomb would be hype as hell
BRO! AHHH! This lame ass fanfic went over the top about certain not that cool parts.
BUT FUCKING UUB LEARNING THE ABILITY THAT KILLED HIS EVIL SELF?! And using it to save the world?! And you don't have Goku holding the bad guy off because he trust his dicisple and knows that his wish that one time was correct? Isn't the entire point that they abused the wishes? Wasn't the whole "ooh, gt was bad to uub, i'll do it better" and proceeded to treat him like Piccolo gets treated in Z (get beaten up by the enemies, so goku and vegeta can stand out)?
In hindsight, I am so mad nobody who trained with King Kai learned anything besides Goku. Tien and Yamcha should use Kaio Ken, Chiaotzu given instant transmission and/or Spirit Bomb, not sure about Piccolo.
@@alexanderrobins7497Tbf, instant transmission was learned on Yardrat, not King Kai’s planet, so it makes sense why Goku is the only one who knows that
@@cleanupguy3934
I think King Kai mentioned he could have taught it to Goku when he returned to Earth, but I could be misremembering. The Supreme Kai used it too.
IMO, I don’t want to sound harsh because I liked your finale to Baby’s story, but I feel that the moment you neglected to rewrite the adventures out into space (the entire point of GT’s existence when it was first made) and the Super 17 arc, which had some things people did like (all the villains coming back and, unironically, Super 17) you failed at making the original any better.
I feel like a single video to rewrite all of it in as short of a time as you made this (37 minutes short? Yeah I know, but you’ve really up’d your time on some of these videos) really made you tunnel vision on the only two ideas you seemed to love to the point you said “screw everything else, let’s focus on this”. I feel 100% in the right to say this btw, because although you mentioned keeping Giru around, YOU NEVER MENTION HIM AGAIN!
Also, I feel like you drastically oversimplified the Shadow Dragon (no s because one dragon is enough apparently) just to get past everything else you found boring when, again, I feel rewriting the story should be taking what is there and making it better. You erased half of GT in order to do this, which I feel is a Failure. Take the time with each arc to try and make them good (because just saying their bad and making fun of them before ignoring their existance isn’t a good look in this instance) and I feel like it’d be an overall better product.
Yes, Mark is not a good writer. Bro, you noticed the Giru thing as well!
The last "arc" is literally "the bad guys shows up, he beats up gohan, uub, piccolo, vegeta and goku in less than 20 minutes and it ends". That's your arc? That's not how you write a FULL story.
Cutting out the other dragons is way too much cutting imo. Every arc needs to have more enemies than just the final boss. This is one of the reasons the Goku Black arc was lacking. The final boss having subordinates gives the side characters a chance to shine, and keeps the story from becoming repetitive.
Agreed. I don't see why he completely cut out the space search for the Dragon Balls and hunting down the dragons either.
I could see the original Dragon Balls trying to escape the solar system as a last ditch effort to avoid being over used, but have a two or three different crews fetching them. That way we could see Trunks and Goten fuse at least once. It could lead to an interesting dynamic if Baby finds a group completely unaware of it, perhaps infecting/possessing them until it was time to make a wish. I would have them to fight the corrupted Shenron before it split off into the different dragons, with different groups going after each one instead of just Goku and Pan again.
@@Goobious_Maximusyeah I was thinking why not 2 to 4 dragons (3 being the golden number)
The 3 dragons can represent “3 something”
The different sides of gokus character the selfishness, the selflessness the naïveté
Mind body and spirit
Past present and future
The different sides of humanity
The different perspectives of how a god may view mortals etc curiosity, animosity, apathy etc
The justice system or something
I kinda interpreted the namekian statement that champions needing to undergo trials meaning that the dragons would be those trials to actually test Goku’s resolve, ethics, morals etc
He just made it into DBZ, whilst ironically saying it should look into the future
I liked this video, but there are a couple of problems I have with it that I wanna voice.
1. While it makes sense, I'm not entirely sure how to feel about Vegeta's obtainment of Super Saiyan 4 first. It feels like it takes away from Goku's transformation. That scene was really cool, and Pan's part in it was great, but it's all sacrificed here, and it ends up leading into the second issue.
2. It's never explained how Goku obtained Super Saiyan 4 here, if he did at all. From the looks of things, he didn't even have time to learn it from Vegeta, so I can't help but feel like it leaves a big hole in this outline.
Now, outlines aren't meant to be fully fleshed out, but I still wanted to give my thoughts on it anyway.
My question is, if Goku gets turned young because of Shenron undoing the sayains' carnage, why doesn't Vegeta changge as well?
yeah I actually agree lol. did Goku even obtain ssj4 in Mark's retelling? that was the first question I had at the end, I wasn't sure if I missed it lol
I dont mind Vegeta being the first and how he got it, but losing Goku's emotional and epic ssj4 transformation as a result is a bummer.
anyway it was a great retell tho
I think it's implied Goku never ends up attaining SSJ4 despite the footage used
Vegeta being able to obtain SSJ4 is not a bad thing, especially since "thanks to Babby's intervention", he got his tail back.
While I agree with your second point, I disagree with the first one. The emotional throughline with Gokū and Pan were sufficiently replaced with Pan's Super Saiyan transformation and her bouncing back the Genki Dama.
- Goku changes to Kid form out of nowhere as consequence of the Dragon Balls somehow and we are left to wonder how and why ? No thanks I rather a silly wish from Pilaf
- Why assume that the "Perfect wish" of "Undo the damage our fighting has caused" will be limited to only objects and not also reviving others that died due to fights
- What happens in th time betwen Goku's wish and Baby appearing in the Earth
- Gohan is killed out of nowhere after barely any screentime and looking irrelevant ? That's like early DBS Gohan VS Frieza
- Skipping the whole Goku SS4 Transformation arc and the amazing fight just so Baby is simply defeated mentally ??? Vegeta getting a transformation first is cool and all but compared to what it takes away, absolutely not
- 1 Dragon only ??? most of the Z Fighters did nothing in the show anyway and in your version too, you can easily make use of them by having each few Z fighters fight a specific dragon, with each dragon being threatning and a serious meaningful fight for the Z fighters
- Pan deflecting the Spirit Bomb will not given even half the vibes of the moment kid Gohan did it, it just doesnt work. Also Uub's regular spirit bomb killing the strongest villain ever is a joke, the one of Goku that was powered by many Planets and Galaxies makes sense at least
- Your Super Saiyan 4 version got hard shafted and is no longer the transformation everyone loves, comes out of nowhere and is only used in a short fight once against Shenron and loses hard...Goku got hard shafted, focused too much on his character/dialogues and left him completly irrelevant, he only fights as a weak kid vs Baby and gets beaten by Shenron later (and I cant tell if he fights him as kid too or somehow becomes SS4)
...
Congrats you managed to make GT 10 times worse !
I agree with the criticisms totally not mark said but his rewrite created more issues than fixed
I'm sorry, Mark, but I believe that you actually made it worse. You retained the good parts but diminished their impact, especially SS4. That transformation was what carried the series, and you stripped it of all its thematic and emotional value. You treated it like just another power boost, but this transformation was meant to be unlocked by Goku, and only him. In the original GT, Goku transforms by seeing the Earth, a beautiful way to show how it “thanks" him for saving it countless times by granting him this new power. The scene where Goku rages as the golden Oozaru made sense. He struggled to control it at first because he had never learned how, and it was amplified by his weaker child’s body. But when he finally calms down by looking at and reminiscing about the Earth, remembering his love for his world, his family, and especially his granddaughter, gaining full control of the form that had once taken his grandpa away it’s perfect.
Giving this transformation to Vegeta threw all of that away. There was zero emotional payoff. Maybe he could have unlocked it, as you suggested, during his training with Trunks, which would align with the theme of love for his newfound planet and family transforming the Saiyans' old destructive power into something new, but he couldn’t be the main focus, but I digress. The final nail in the coffin was unlocking the form and then not using it against Baby. That would be one of the lamest wastes of a power up introduction in anime history.
Another issue is that you tried to give every character their moment in the spotlight, but it felt too cluttered. I think the decision to combine the dragons into one was the worst. With seven dragons, it would have been easier to give each character their moment to shine, as well as a thematic wish to confront (Piccolo vs a dragon made by the wishes of Daimao, Uub vs the wish of restoring the plant after Boo’s fight, etc.). And this last part is just a nitpick, but what happened to Giru? I don’t know how he was incorporated into this new plot.
"Another issue is that you tried to give every character their moment in the spotlight, but it felt too cluttered"
"With seven dragons, it would have been easier to give each character their moment to shine"
You wrote these 2 sentences in the same paragraph like they're not contradictory.
And? He's still right. Sure, maybe the "clutered" comment is a miss or hit, but? The essay was still lmae. There was literally no point to SSJ4's existence at that point.
@@kylegonewildYeah , I see your point, my bad, what I was trying to say was that I felt like there were too many characters fighting the same villain, and that using more villains instead would have been better. But I admit that is a nitpick.
@@kylegonewildCause they're not , it felt cluttered cause there was only one dragon to fight , separating the Z fighters and giving them chances make up for their mistakes on their own would feel right
cook that bitch
The spirit bomb bounce back moment actually made my heart throb, I'm a huge Gohan fan in all his iterations
So like, do Goku, Uub and Pan just dick around in Earth till Baby shows up? Why is Pan training exactly what's going on there
Our heroes feel very reactive in both of your new takes of the two arcs... They don't seem to have a goal or something they want to prevent like in Namek where there's multiple parties seeking the dragon balls or searching for the Black stars while Baby looms over them in the Black stars arc
They aren't even aware of the coming of Baby and Omega and preparing for battle like in the Saiyan arc they kind of just get jumped by a really big bad guy, twice.
Thank you for putting my thoughts into this coment, %100 agree with the things you point out.
"I don't like Transformation for Transformation sake," says the only guy who's hyped for Black Freeza
Also, out of all the post-SSJ transformations, SSJ4 actually has plot significance for both Goku AND Vegeta.
-Goku finally embraces his full Saiyajin Nature by confronting the Trauma he has been running away from this entire time. The Oozaru that brought nothing but tragedy is now the key to saving everyone.
- Vegeta meanwhile, it's Him finally accepting Help from others, Bulma literally completes him.
Black frieza was for the end of an arc symbolizimg the strength everyone in that arc was fighting for as thhe stro gest in the universe, it quite litterally was crucial for the arc
@@seankock7649 considering you could stablish the exact same point with Golden Freeza... nah, that was just a new form for the sake of throwing new forms
a form that even the Marketing Team couldn't care less if they tried
@@Artista_Frustrado except golden frieza was used before and defeated before, golden frieza was abaolutely destroyed by broly, no a new form was needed to show he reached a new level that far outclassed everyone there
he said this then wrote ssj4 to be this
I would've been happier with Bulma making some device that would regenerate Vegeta's tail on it's own rather than making him a Great Ape outright. He could still be getting help from someone, and having that lead him to greater heights in strength.
I agree with your other points, though.
Is it just me but they way he rewrote and explained the baby arc sounds kinda like how Goku black arc was
i still tink each dragon ball should have been a individual dragon, removing the whole 4 star one being attached to goku because of his grandpa was a nice plot point in my opinion, so they can all just be doing their own things and have different personalities and the omega shenron is trying to consume all of them to get their powers, so instead of having to beat all of them they have to save most of them from the omega shenron
I had an idea that maybe each Z fighter takes on an individual dragon. Vegeta could counter the energy draining one by using forced spirit fission, for example.
My main issue with the rewrite of the Baby arc is that it ends up being extremely similar to the themes of the Goku Black arc.
Baby obviously goes through a similar character arc as Zamasu, in which he harbors this deep hatred that ends up consuming him until he becomes the thing that he hated, i.e. fused with a mortal and a great ape, respectively. Baby's possession of the entire world mirrors the destruction of the entire world by Zamasu, and the only ones left on the planet are the main cast with only a handful of supporting cast. The thing that 'solves' the issue is a sudden spontaneous glow-up in power, i.e. trunks with deus ex spirit bomb sword and SSJ4 Vegeta. There's a lot of teasing with different forms and transformations that ultimately don't matter in the end, like Pan's Super Saiyan form obviously doesn't end with a win, but neither does Vegito against Zamasu. Uub more or less flies around saving people in your rewrite, which doesn't do wonders for showcasing his ability, but it wouldn't have mattered since the villain was stopped without his input anyway; unfortunately the most dire comparison I could make is to that of Mai and the gang, in which they just stood around waiting for the camera to be on them for a bit before going back to the people actually fighting.
" wouldn't have mattered cuz the villain was stopped without his input anyway " he's literally the key contributor right behind Goku in it lol , everyone would be dead without him holding off Golden ozaru baby after revealing he purposefully got hit by his chocolate beam to wait and strike at the right moment , long enough for Goku to get his ssj4 power restored and mocking Baby saying he really thought Uub would be done in by his own technique , and this is exclusive to him cuz Buu could never reverse it on himself. Before mentioning idk what this video is on about with Goku being too strong stopping Uub from showcasing his abilities, cuz Ssj3 Goku literally got bullied by ssj baby while Uub after returning from his training equally clashed a holding back Super baby 2 , caught him off guard and slammed him into a wall even before pushing around his full power state as Majuub and giving him a run for his money before Baby goes even further inflating his muscles like the grade 3 forms to win the beam clash . Brother literally degraded him by removing him from doing anything important against Golden ozaru baby in this rewrite . Before mentioning a new transformation instantly ending the fight is pretty lackluster in general . Let alone the idea to replace Ssj4 Goku with Vegeta itself being a massive downgrade already . I absolutely wanted his ssj4 to have a more climactic introduction with Omega interrupting and to not be so late or either way get more cool scenes in the fight , but the placement itself wasn't bad at all and bulma being involved the way she was fit well as she's the one who turned him into the man he is now , before earth itself which fits Goku's Ssj4 introduction better . Baby arc is overall one of those where u simply don't mess with Goku's position , it's just a well done story where Vegeta being the ssj4 over Goku doesn't work by a mile. Goku is THE character for ssj4 as well as to go against Baby in the play of love vs hate. And Baby shouldn't be some good to vengeful character but as he is vengeful to maniacal rage , because that makes a better parallel with Goku who isn't " good " by default himself but rather selfish .
Baby arc doesn't need any " fixing " , one thing that makes it even better is the idea to integrate his origin with the dragon balls themselves , but otherwise should be left as it is .
Wait so Vegeta goes ss4 then just doesn’t fight baby and let’s him run the second he gets the new form?
Goku told Vegeta to let him go since he was no threat to anyone, and the former agreed because of that.
Baby: *Takes Vegeta’s body, Takes all of Vegeta’s friends, Takes over the world, Fucks Vegeta’s wife*
Goku: Let him go, Vegeta.
Vegeta: ok
@@IncognitoActivado It's still pointless. If you write something into your story, then do absolutely nothing with it, then there's no point in it being there.
I would've been fine with Baby being the Tuffles' contingency against the Saiyans and be pure evil. Nothing wrong with that at all.
@@Zac_Frost And what you say doesn't make sense.
@@IncognitoActivado It's called "Chekhov's Gun."
If you write in a book that there's a gun hanging on a wall, and by the end of the story no one is shot, then there was no point in writing that.
I like how he says in the Super rewrite that this was well received, but the top comments are all nothing but blasting this rewrite and pointing out its many flaws.
OK but 3 things:
1. Vegeta becoming SSJ4 seems anti-climactic. There's a lot to criticize with the goofiness of how Goku regrew his tail and became SSJ4, but the sequence of events that led up to the transformation made it feel like somewhat of a training session that yielded results. There was some preperation and pre-establishment of SSJ4 before its reveal, which made the eventual reveal all the more satisfying. In your rewrite, it just comes out of nowhere. SSJ, SSJ2, SSJ God and UI all had pre-establishments (heck, even SSJ Blue had some of that). SSJ3 didn't have any pre-establishment, but you know Goku has been training for 7 years in the afterlife (so it still made some sense), and it wasn't treated as that big of a deal at the moment. SSJ4, with it's radically different design and unique requirements to be earned, SHOULD be treated as a big deal. You made SSJ4 seem like a much smaller deal than it really is.
2. I think it's a bit disappointing you didn't give Vegeta the opportunity to showcase the power of SSJ4 on Baby. I know it would've been inappropriate at that moment, But each new transformation always gets a moment to shine immediately after being achieved for the first time. SSJ Goku VS Frieza, SSJ Trunks VS mecha Frieza, SSJ Vegeta VS android 19, SSJ2 Gohan VS Cell, SSJ3 Goku VS Majin Buu, Gotenks Vs Majin Buu, SSJ3 Gotenks VS Super Buu, Mystic Gohan VS Super Buu, Vegito (both forms) VS Super Buu, SSJ God Goku VS Beerus, SSJ Blue Goku/Vegeta VS Golden Frieza... You see what I mean? Having Vegeta become SSJ4 before Goku is one thing. Not giving time for Vegeta to use that form until some time later where he fights Omega Shenron is just robbing the new form from its intended spotlight. This gap from the reveal to the moment of utilization ruins the moment.
3. When and where does Goku earn SSJ4? I'm OK with Vegeta earning it first, but give Goku SSJ4 too at some point.
How Would I solve these issues? Quite simply actually! While fighting baby, Goku is defeated and nearly dies. But just when Baby is about to finish him, Supreme Kai instant transmissions himself and Goku to his planet. Supreme Kai heals Goku, Goku thanks him and plans on returning to fight Baby some more. However, Supreme Kai begs Goku to stay because he can't beat Baby at his strength. That's whan Elder Kai interrupts and informs Goku about a special form he can attain that no other sayian ever could: Super Sayian 4!
The requirements for this form is for a sayian who achieved SSJ3 to retain his tail, transform into a golden great ape and control himself. No one else could've done that because A. Most sayians were killed by Frieza many years ago, and B. Sayians naturally lose their tails once they become strong enough (this detail is actually already canon to DB lore, go check), and because of that can't turn into apes.
Goku however, despite growing strong enough, regrew his tail when becoming young. Therefore, he can still turn into an ape. Considering he still posesses the power to become SSJ3, he meets all the requirements to become SSJ4. All that is left for him to do is learning how to control the ape transformation. That's exactly why Supreme Kai brought Goku to their planet. Elder Kai wants to train Goku to fully control the great ape transformation. Goku is afraid they don't have enough time to train him until Baby kills/posesses everyone, but than Supreme Kai creates a giant aura around them that acts like a hyperbolic time chamber so they can train for an extended amount of time without risking everyone who fights Baby for too long.
While your idea of Dende suffering the same fate with the Dragon Balls is unique and sounds great...I am afraid it doesn't really work.
Remember, King Piccolo kills Shenron and Kami was completely unaffected by it.
I have seen people arguing about the connection and I am going to explain why I don't think it would work. I view the creator with the Dragon Balls being a more Puppet and Puppet Master. The creator gives the puppet life and if they die, so does the puppet, but if the puppet dies, the creator is unaffected and can make a new puppet.
eh. the dragon balls have always been inconsistent (think the dragon balls reactivating in 8 months the first time they were used). there could probably be some exposition about how "the negative energy was too much for dende" or something
While that's true, you can also say the rules changed with the upgrades, maybe exactly because Dende upgrades the dragon balls it means they have a higher link to him
Also, Dende didn't create Shenron, Kami did. Dende just restored Shenron, thus he shouldn't suffer the same fate of the Dragon Balls.
@@enanomalley9986 remember Dende is linked now to the dragon balls restored after the cell saga, that's why they still work even after Piccolo died when Buu blew up the earth, as Kami no longer exist
@@SakuraHarumin I view that more as Kami made them and now Dende uses them.
Like a master passing their equipment to their student.
Certainly an interesting rewrite. I like giving Uub and Pan more purpose with the whole new generation taking a bigger role. But SSJ4 felt extremely random and given very little purpose. Vegeta still doesn’t seem to do much in this rewrite so him being the one to obtain the form 1st is rather weird. Goku also randomly gaining the form is arguably even worse than how Vegeta gained the form in the original telling with the whole Blutz Wave Machine. Baby while certainly given a more unique role, him just disappearing then reappearing at the end with little context just feels so off. And since Baby was the cause of the most recent wish, maybe having him directly confronting Shenron would’ve been better considering how Shenron’s power works in the rewrite. Shenron is fine I guess but the original concept was much better having a Dragon being born from specific wishes. It’s just the Dragons were awfully executed in terms of character and threat.
Do we still get Buu’s tearful goodbye with Hercule and fusing with Uub?
I vote no, let them be separate.
I think so, he said he'd let the Baby arc play mostly the same, though he didn't mention that part specifically, so I don't know (though I would headcanon that it did).
Can we get rid of Uub instead? I hate how everyone pretends this guy has insane potential and must absolutely be important. He's just a side character at best.
@@kindlingkinghe is though, whether it's Super, GT, or the end of the og series. Uub is usually portrayed as the strongest human and Goku's ultimate goal, a fighter for him to go against head to head
@@young_shaad5227 is he? Half of the cast is or were "strongest Z of Y". It's not compelling nor interesting. And I honestly don't care how big his power level is - he's boring. What's his deal? His goals? His personality? His role in the story? Why is Goku suddenly interested in abandoning his family to train this kid? What for?
In reality, most of the hype about Uub is built by community itself. Neither Toriyama, nor Toei nor Toytaro ever did anything with this character, because, frankly, they have no idea what they're supposed to do with him and why should he be important at all. Uub is a nothing character that actually offers nothing for the story or characters related to him. You have to put great effort to make something out of him and actually shift the spotlight away from Goku, which never going to happen.
Honestly it feels incredibly forced to have the wish turn Goku into a kid & give him his tail back. Theres not even any monkey's paw interpretation of the wish that would cause that.
If anything, maybe take a page from JJK and have the initial wish seal Goku away or otherwise incapacitate him. Without their heaviest hitter, the main cast can be like, Pan, Uub, Trunks and Goten. Also feels weird to just have the dragon balls explode instead of needing to be gathered back up out in space. We still gotta have a Grand Tour in GT
Also, the wish restoring everything destroyed by Saiyans actually gives a decent hook for a version of Super 17; Goku destroyed a ton of RR army tech as a kid, Vegeta destroyed Android 19, Trunks blew up Gero's lab, and Cell killed 16. Hell, the mechanical components of Mecha Freeza and Cell could also have been restored. Maybe 19 has some sort of emergency protocol that he can activate at Gero's lab. Its still pretty half baked as a concept, but having the Freeza and Cell rematches instead being half-formed mechanical abominations could be cool! And everyone loves 16!
Sparking Zero devs had the same reaction to Super 17 😂
I'd replace the Para Brothers with the Bojack Pirates (Like how Super re-told Broly) And have them become the focus of the first / Space Ark
Honestly this is a great idea! Plus we can make the final fight to be against bojack and pan so she can learn that goku won't always be there for her, (similar to gohan in that movie). Gives her a better reason to unlock ssj and a chance to flesh out her character!
5:51 spike when filling out the roster for sparking zero
banger comment
Eh you’re inciting incident doesn’t make any sense to me. Wishes were never so general. “Undo all the damage our fighting has done” I think people would ask a lot of questions as to why it doesn’t basically bring back every villain ever experienced in the story so far to begin with. Or Dr. Gero’s lab. Etc. unless I am mistaken I don’t think wishes have been so general so I don’t think folks we get onboard so easily. But just my two cents.
Agreed. It would:
Bring back _all_ of the Red Ribbon Army. What Goku destroyed in Dragonball, all of Dr Gero's Androids, old Namek, the majority of the Frieza force (Literally Resurrection F again), Raditz and Nappa, probably Cell. Hell, the only villain that might not return would be Buu. Worse, Cell has Saiyan genes, as do the Saiyans, if Buu _were_ resurrected and absorbed more powerful beings it would be even more dangerous than in Z. It would be far too open ended.
The crazy thing about GT is that so many elements of modern DB are concepts from GT
Yea modern DB is legit recycled ideas Toyotaro used when making AF mixed with refinement by Toriyama of old non canon ideas
Good lord that Baby arc, you know what you missed? You turned the dragon balls into an infected monkey's paw. Baby's arc could have been so much better. Imagine him defeating the entire cast, triumphant over the saiyans. Before outright killing them he's going to show them what they destroyed in the past. He brings out Red Shenron, demanding the restoration of planet tuffle and all of it's inhabitants. Shenron complies, but something feels amiss. He looks up, instantly realizing it's not planet tuffle. Not the tuffle he wanted, shenron instead brought back planet Vegeta. EVERY single Saiyan from Bardock to Raditz back in an instant. At that moment Baby's arc concludes with him having a mental breakdown.
You literally had it right there, imagine it. One of the first instances of the villain winning since Beerus. His revenge foiled by his own actions, and in the worst way imaginable. He didn't destroy the saiyan race he restored it.
I like this ending.
I’m surprised you didn’t talk about Ledgic from the Black Star Dragon Ball Saga. He was an interesting beginning antagonist. The one thing I wish GT did was Goku fighting him one more time, or help Goku defeat Baby. Since Baby is a parasite who could have conquered the entire universe, Ledgic wouldn’t be on board with being controlled by Baby. He should have had one more outing.
Another fellow Ledgic enjoyer? I see you're a man of culture
0:16 EVERYONE HE SAID IT HE SAID IT!!!! GT FANS THIS IS OUR TIME!!!
Sure the 5 of you are buzzing
@@Jmatongo777hey! you don’t have to disrespect the community of GT lovers.
@@Rockstar_Bonnie_Gaming I do
@@Jmatongo7776*
@@themarkerchannel3170 my bad 6
Why did the namekian dragonballs get corrupted and explode? You literally made it a point to say that they specifically DON'T abuse their dragon balls. I know that's not really an important part of this whole thing but it really threw me off after you explained how little they use their dragon balls
partway through the video it seemed like he was rushing it out to publish because there's a spot where he repeats a line read and it was clear it was meant to be edited out but was left in by accident. he also said giru stays but didn't explain why or what he's used for lol
So, how did goku turn young? You say he just makes a normal wish but it does one extra and fixes everything destroyed by the Saiyans, so where did the goku turning young part enter. And honestly I think that the baby arch just got completely ruined.
Dude removes the aspect of Emperor Pilaf wishing for Goku to be a child again by accident, and instead says it should be "Goku just turns into a child for no reason at all" and then says "Monkey paw" as if that makes up for it.
“Daima…that didn’t involve creating new, McGuffin balls”
Episode one of Daima: here are some new, McGuffin balls and a McGuffin namekian demon thrown in for good measure.
Ikr
Nah, it's an origin story for namekians. Now piccolo is a demon again.
@@samuelsmith9582 So what I said.
You sir don’t seem to know what a macguffin is
Yeah you don't know what mcGuffin means.
Respectfully, while I appreciate the Uub and Pan parts, I don't think your rewriting is any better than what we originally got. The Baby stuff you had just seemed meh and the Shadow Dragon arc you proposed seemed all over the place
36:00 .....NO FUSION?!?! BOOOO
I gotta ask, what happens to Baby in the end? Feels he doesn't really get a conclusion, does he join with the earth or goes off on his own after the shadow drafon arc..
I liked this overall, but there are some pros and cons I could list to it:
Pros:
- I like the fact that you focused more on the newer gen characters rather than just sticking with the old characters. It makes it feel like time is actually moving forward in the series rather than stagnating.
- I like how you used the regular Dragon Balls, but just turned the stars black from overuse, even though I have cons to that later.
- I really like how you made Pan an actual character in this, rather than just a "meh" character that kinda hangs around.
- Having the Dragon Balls getting corrupted affect Dende, as well. That's just pure genius. No Dragon Balls. No Healer. No backup plans. The fights all instantly have higher stakes.
Cons:
- Vegeta getting SS4 before Goku, but doing nothing with it. As the old adage goes, "If you write something into your story, but do nothing with it, then there's no point in it being there." I get the idea that you probably wanted Vegeta to get something before Goku, but if Vegeta isn't going to actually _use_ it, then why introduce it at that point?
- Keeping the bit where Goku gets turned into a kid, and also de-powering him. As much as I enjoy GT for what it is, I always thought that was a terrible idea. And sapping his powers is a bad trope of action/fantasy stories that almost never works.
- Trying to make Baby a more complex character. Black and White "Pure Evil" villains are perfectly fine. Having the Tuffle Scientist make Baby have the sole purpose of destroying the Saiyans, maybe as an act of posthumous revenge would have worked just fine. Maybe the Saiyans could've won the battle, but not the war in his mind, and Baby was a contingency to ensure that the Saiyans' victory wouldn't last.
- Goku getting SS4 off screen. That's the thing everybody hated about SSBlue. It came out of nowhere and we didn't see Goku earn it.
- Including the Namekian Dragon Balls into the Shadow Dragons bit. I like the idea of it just being focused on the Earth's Dragon Balls alone.
- Having there be only one Shadow Dragon. I would've more enjoyed the idea of there still being 7, but you flesh them all out a bit more. You could even have the Z Warriors all split off into teams to handle some of them, giving other characters more to do. Maybe have Goten and Trunks pair up, as well as Piccolo and Gohan, Uub and Buu (that'd be a perfect spot of introduce Majuub if you're not gonna do it against Baby, IMO), Vegeta going solo, etc.
Overall, I enjoyed this as a fun writing experiment, and I do think you introduce some great ideas, but figured I'd give my thoughts and some constructive criticism.
Thanks for the video. 🙂
Mark, why do you do me like this? 37:16 makes me cry
That got me so good.😭
He got my ass too 😭😭😭
In my opinion the fact that Pan never got her super epic, character forming and epic SSJ transformation moment is still a riddle
There was so many moments she could’ve gotten it too. You could’ve given to her at any point during the baby saga
Damn.
Which is weird since her strongest feats put her on par with buu saga level enemies.
It's literally just because Toriyama and TOEI couldn't figure out how to draw SSJ Pan.
Honestly, I would have had Baby kill off Giru, and create a solid conclusion to the Black Star DB Saga, and also create a two way fight between Goku and Pan working together, and Baby.
Will say some of this is done well, other bits… not so much
First of all the good.
Actually giving Baby some bonus characteristics was AMAZING. Genuinely having him self reflect, realize the monster he had become versus what he wished to destroy, was exactly what the character needed. I always loved Baby as a villain and the idea of him becoming actually complex is GREAT
Secondly, Pan actually getting to do anything is a chef’s kiss. Like, even if I do find how it was handled being lackluster with her grand moment being bouncing back a spirit bomb, I do think having her go Super Saiyan AND STILL FAIL is a great concept
Finally, Omega Shenron feels a lot more complete with the sense of karmic consequence being intensified as someone who acts as the big finale to it all especially tying it back into the destroyed homeworld of Namek
This is where things fall apart though
First of all, Uub somehow feels more underwhelming here. He just kind of gets dog walked again and again and even the reunion of Buu’s two halves with their fusion is left out cutting away the one link he really had as the reincarnation of Kid Buu
Secondly, Vegeta SSJ4 feels… unearned in this rewrite. It could have taken a more active route, have him confront Baby in his mind, confront the horrors that his people and himself have caused. Make him the final nail in the coffin in Baby’s change and delete the purposeless nature of this SSJ4 by making up for the lack of battle to cement its power with meaning. Make it be the representation of Vegeta not just conquering the beast inside, but his very past and all that it means. Make him quite literally redefine a Saiyan not as a rampaging monster but as the more humanoid SSJ4.
Thirdly, with Baby, at least GIVE him some extra purpose in the end if he’s going to be kept around. Him making Goku stand up as a final contribution is just weak lol
Finally, and I know this probably will hurt the narrative, but the lack of SSJ4 Gogeta or Goku is just painful. Hell, could have Goku gain SSJ4 with Baby’s help. Have someone who used to know the Saiyans as only monsters help Goku connect with a meaning he never understood, a primal side never truly conquered since it killed Grandpa Gohan so long ago.
As for Gogeta, I say have them fuse but NOT have it be a stomp. Make it so Omega Shenron is going neck and neck with the two Saiyans and maybe even a remerged Uub with some assistance from the now far weaker Baby who wishes to atone for his sins as a protector the same way the Saiyans did.
Then, have Omega Shenron reveal that he isn’t even his final form by drawing on the wish that defines his own existence as a last resort, burning at his own life force. The wish to bring back the namekians killed by Frieza. In a desperate bid, the Saiyans are forced to fuse to try and combat Omega Shenron at his own level, a question of which would run out first on everyone’s mind: Omega Shenron’s last resort or their fusion? In the end, this could serve as the opening for Uub to charge up a final spirit bomb, to prove the earth is plenty strong with the same move that killed his previous self with a larger focus on it being what fully showcases the world isn’t reliant on the dragon balls anymore.
Toyotarou take on GT in a Super aligned manga would be really fun, especially since he has shown a love for specifically the anime & GT in his work
Especially now that he has shown a really solid take on Trunks + Goten & he hopefully would continue from the WAY way better characterization Pan got in Super Hero (and generally his layouts have much improved)
20:56 "The master's tools will never dismantle the master's house." - Audre Lord
I understand if you think Uub was mishandled in the original series, but shoehorning him in to replace trunks just because you believe he’s boring doesn’t work. Pan doesn’t just want to be a fighter in GT, she is on a self-discovery journey just as Goku was in original DB, which is why GT itself aims to focus more on exploration like DB did. Pan wears colors we’d attribute to Goku, while Goku dawns more calming colors; Goku is overall much more relaxed in GT as well, as his journey has largely ended, and he doesn’t desire anything.
Point is, a major part of Pans journey is constantly clashing with Trunks, someone she sees as an ideal adult with a job, and who has a pretty good life all things considered. Pan is learning from the different generations before her (Goku and Trunks), taking things from each of them to become her own person. Eventually she comes to appreciate things about both of them during their journey; attributes she then applies to herself. Pan sees Giru as being an annoying nuisance, while Trunks unironically calls robots, equal to humans in many ways; this is a form of empathy Pan later latches onto and agrees with. Pan doesn’t appreciate how Goku is basically a child in body and mind, and is so relaxed he seemingly doesn’t take anything about the journey seriously until Rildo pulls up. However, Goku is always reliable when it counts and will never turn his back on his friends and family, something Pan greatly admires.
Trunks is there to fill a roll for Pans journey of self discovery, as is Goku, and Uub being shoved into this trip to substitute Trunks just fundamentally breaks why the group exists in the first place.
Uub pushing baby to go Oozaro is lame because Goku doing it, as a saiyan, is a much better metaphor. Baby going full-on Saiyan-going OOZARO (the very thing that he has PTSD about in the show) to crush Uub is way more lame then him doing it against Goku, since Goku himself is a saiyan. Baby was created to protect his people from the Saiyans, and instead, he’s been twisted by revenge and quite literally became what he hated the most about the saiyans, in order to go and murder good hearted people. This works much better as baby vs goku, since Goku is basically in baby’s place, the one to protect innocent people, but he’s a saiyan, which is a contradiction of what baby believes is even possible.
Vegeta pushing out Baby and becoming SSJ4 is also just so out of left field; why didn’t he push him out earlier when Gohan died? Did that not affect Vegeta enough within Baby to be able to push him out?
Baby needs to be shown that even with all of the Saiyan power at his disposal, he still isn’t powerful enough to just take over earth and kill anyone he wants. Goku is the manifestation of this for baby, skipping over this beat entirely is such an odd decision to make. What lesson is there at this point in the story, don’t go full mask off with your plans if you can’t subdue vegeta within you? That’s not a way to defeat a villain and demonstrate why they were wrong. Goku can go SSj4 because he isn’t a saiyan that baby thinks he is, his loved ones bring him back from a mindless Oozaro, transforming him into an SSJ4, the ultimate power up until this point. The reason baby can’t combat goku here is because he has shut out the possibility of love in his life entirely, strictly to focus on killing the saiyans, he lacks the love and understanding to harness his power and become a SSJ4. Goku transforming and defeating baby shows this.
There’s so much more with the how the Shadow Dragons are handled, why would Omega shenron want a “natural order” yet claim that they’ve been abusing the dragon balls? Wouldn’t a natural order involve no dragon balls whatsoever? Why is this walking talking contradiction what manifests from the dragon balls the one to go full anarchy when the dragon balls are the least “natural order” things within the entire series? It feels like there was literally no thought into this whatsoever, and it was just dramatic for the sake of being dramatic. Omega Shenron, along with all of the other dragons (which you deleted from this arc) all serve a purpose to show how each wish and the negative energy spawned from those wishes have manifested. At the end of GT, shenron asks Goku if he knows why the shadow dragons appeared. Notably it’s not just because Omega wanted to wreck shit because of previous wishes, or some natural order. Omega is very clearly present not to just mindlessly kill, because he could’ve done that from the very start. Not only could he have easily done that, but Shenron himself at the end of the arc asks Goku if he understands why the shadow dragons appeared, and Goku says yes. Without narrating the entire arc, there was a lesson to be learned, that’s why Omega appeared, you basically just turned him into a bad guy with a motive that doesn’t even make sense in the context of the series.
You monologue for so long about why GT fumbled because it “went backwards instead of going forwards”, yet you retread character arcs that have already completed regarding Vegeta and Piccolo?? This is the exact nostalgia bait you shit on 3 minutes ago 😭😭
The ending and lesson you try to
portray, is pretty much the exact same conclusion of GT, being that people need to rely on each other rather than the dragon balls (hence the spirit bomb in the original series being the literal manifestation of that idea); overall it’s just a much messier way to get to somehow the same conclusion, but I will say the idea of Goku fighting Omega while Uub charges a spirit bomb is kinda dope, but still so many focal points of the series are seemingly lost in this rewrite, blatantly misunderstood then disregarded, things are contradicted, character arcs retreaded, and it just doesn’t fit well very much at all to me. Maybe I just like GT a lot, or am just a bonified hater, but this rewrite accomplishes nothing and actively deletes many parts of what made GT significant and resonate as a story.
Honestly shocked this went on for so long, as I played the video more and more there was just more to say.
Thank you *so* much for this.
Yes, bro. It was literally bad. It makes GT tame in comparison. I don't think Mark has that good writing skills. He did the same for another one and it hurt me. He also wrote a fanfic about Gon's feelings to his dad early on the series, out of projection, in his review; when Gon doesn't care about Ging. He thinks its okay he walked out if that's what Hunters do.
Cook
Also, why does Baby show up in the finale without any setup and what happens to him? Like it feels random and doesn't add to the story.
I think this premise is really bad and doesn't acknowledge the issues people have with GT. Instead it creates more issues.
His rewrite literally creates more holes and issues lol
Dude, I was legit writing my Dragon Ball Super rewrite just as this video popped up in my notifications. This is gonna be good. I'd love to show you what i have too if you're at all interested. Would love some pointers.
no
Please make the video of your rewrite DBS!
Subscribed
8 second gang y'all gotta lock in
I was 39 second gang. Can I still join?
Oh yes
ong
3 minute gang… can I lock in too 🥺
@@tylersworld1227 if they don't accept you, I will!
my problem with the rewrite is you took the "Tour" part out of Grand Tour. Regardless of the quality of the execution, the idea behind GT was to marry the adventure of Dragon Ball with the Action of Z. You kinda complete removed the adventure part and solely made it a continuation of Z. While I like the new ideas, I think you need to find a way to incorporate the adventure back into it. There is a lot of empty space and waitng for villains to fly to earth; like 2 back to back saiyan sagas. Really after the Baby arc The crew needs to a reason to leave earth and find Syn or leave earth and have Syn chase them down. A race against the clock sort of mirroring the Frieza saga in the same way you rewrote the Baby saga to mirror the Saiyan one. Maybe the story has Syn collecting Dragon Balls and continuously grow stronger as the GT fighters try to get to Dragon Balls before he does. idk
This is stupid.
Shenron and Ultimate Shenron are not the same being.....
Goku needing to repair the lookout with a wish is dumb. Mr. Popo is the caretaker AND he can do it with magic himself.....
Moreover, Goku being randomly changed into a kid with tail makes no sense.... (I get it. Consequences of overuse) but it makes zero sense why specifically THAT is the consequence...
the point was that they are the same being in this version
@@dankerbell His version sucks. Every set of dragonballs have their very own dragon. Why would a second set summon the same dragon as another?
@@TheMissingLink2 i thought maybe he was going for a "fusion" of porunga and shenlong more than that they themselves were "the same" entity. if that was his goal, he explained it poorly.
or maybe he did mean they were "the same" because the dragon balls are namekian in nature (or at least they were) and it was thought prior to GT and super that there were only two sets: earth's and namek's. i can kind of see the logic there since at the time DBZ ended, the only dragon balls were those two sets and both had been derived from namekian sources. if his goal was to basically retcon any further sets of dragon balls that existed at that time, it would be simple to assume that shenlong and porunga were thus two parts of a split entity, potentially. but the dragons and the dragon balls were never really explained outside of "this is a thing that namekians do" to my recollection during DBZ. i could be wrong there.
either way, i don't like the rewrite either lol it makes GT more confusing than it already was for me.
5:21 I will never understand or support that they turned Goku into a kid so that the new transformation would have him as an adult again. This is like trying to have your cake and eat it too. Never liked that. I mean, I would have made it so that once Goku got to SSJ4 then he would not revert back to kid again. It is fun to have kid Goku when they are exploring the galaxy and whatever, but when they are trying to be serious or emotional, having a kid Goku makes it silly.
they forgot how to make emotional situation with kid characters.
Actually Goku didn’t get weaker when he became a kid, it’s just that his stamina dropped and it’s kinda implied that his control over his power also dropped as well, which is why couldn’t use techniques like Instant transmission.
so... he got weaker
@@Artec619 not in terms of power level, that’s what I’m saying.
@@maximillianoorosco-randhaw9336kind of dumb, he didn’t drop his power level yet he lost his technique and stamina?
@@Deathmare235 I’m just the messenger. I don’t make the rules.
@@Deathmare235 yeah, in terms you can get: His ATK is still 10k. He just can fight for an hour instead of 3.
The way you characterized Pan reminds me of Jade from Jackie Chan Adventures.
Now that you mention it...both characters are very similar to each other!
And also now that you mention it...I like both characters a lot! Like a lot a lot!
You might be onto something here! :O
She is even in the original
The reason super 17 got skipped was because it wouldn’t make since for all the Z fighters to lose and die before the final arc, after all, no one can beat him when he’s super 17
21:56 The best rewrite ever! This sold it!
That final illustration of Pan holding the Dragon Ball choked me up in a way I did not expect.
Incredible deep-dive that shows respect for the material and keeps GT's best aspects. Thank you so much for this!
Man I was just enjoying the video as a nice "what if" fanfic but the four star dragon ball at the end made tears instantly rush to my eyes, thank you
That’s how it was in the dragon ball Gt movie with Goku Jr.
@@zojirushi1Yep with Goku telling him to remember it was his effort not the dragon ball that made him succeed to encourage hard work and less reliance on dragon balls .
Using a Spongebob clip to ask the audience to use their "imaginaaation" to think of Pan as a Super Saiyan @19:48. Love it.
9:46
Trunks, as a whole, is trash. He was only cool when he cut down Frieza. After that, he catches all L's. Trunks in Super and Trunks in GT. Just weak. Oh Kid Trunks is annoying too.
Thats true Trunks doesnt do much after slicing up Frieza besides give Goku medicine and train with Vegeta.
I was hoping when GT premiered back in the day that Pan would inherit gokus old tools like his power pole and nimbus 😢
9:15 pan is also a kid bro. tf do u expect? have u never been a kid before? do you need a lesson on how kids act? especially kids with super powers? and a female kid at that. do you need a tutorial on how females behave? and um hmm maybe trunks isnt a kid anymore and has his own personality? i think this is why i stopped watching this dude. he doesnt touch grass or knows how real life is and thinks everything has to be super serious and nobody can have fun and nobody can behave like a real person. everyone has to behave like they wanna fight and dont want anything else.
Word. Like, think of it as a slightly different Pokémon, where Goku is Ash, Pan is Misty and Brock is Trunks (and Giru is Pikachu because why not). Picture if GT was just that except in space, I would have loved it. Goku is kind of a Luffy figure and comic relief, Pan is an immature girl but still full of ambition, while Trunks is supposed to be the adult voice of reason. Why is bringing up drama and hardcore fights the first thought some people have when writing a DB series?
@@zummone Because Z
The super 17 arc has so much potential.. old villains coming back could give up new matchups and meetings. I've always wanted to see King Vegeta see his son be alive so many years later. Show him sacrifice himself against super 17 causing Vegeta to go super Saiyan 3 and actually win that fight.
Carbon copy of fusion reborn
@@fredy2041 K? Has nothing to do with what I established regarding Vegeta. Plus, this would be an arc of it.
I think Super Saiyan 4 Vegeta vs Super 17 would be a better ending for the saga
Mark decided to spare Baby… so he would be alive during the Super 17 arc. What if we had all the saiyans come back when the gates of Hell were broken open? King Vegeta, Bardock, Nappa, Raditz… come face to face with Baby, the supreme Saiyan-hater. Potential for drama there, no? Potential for some character development? 🤔
@@Goobious_Maximus i like how you think. that would have been best, especially since goku's family (raditz and bardock at that point since gine wasn't a character yet) was so criminally under-utilized in the series. usually the long-lost-brother reveal isn't squandered in an introductory arc or it's at least explored with more interest than it ever was in any subsequent dragon ball media, aside from the video games lol
Not bad, it feels a little empty in some areas (SSJ4 didn't do much and some other character could benefit if they fight to more dragons) but I really really like the Spirit Bomb bounce back with Pan, as a reminisce of Gohan in the Saiyan Saga. That make me really emotional just imagining something like that.
Killing Gohan is an interesting choice, but I like it. His arch is done, he became a scholar, he started a family, so there is no more story to tell. Using his characters death to elevate another characters especially his own daughter is an amazing choice. I which this was how the show was made.
I love how GT makes their galaxy feel so lived in and occupied, whereas Super makes it clear there's only 20 planets with liveable life, and is so dead and empty. Remember, GT only shows one galaxy out of the millions out there making up their universe.
The Moro Arc nuff said
I do want to give my ideas on a re-write of GT as it is something I thought of.
First, Goku not becoming a child is an option and to mainly build up Pan more, show that it feels like they are looking down on her because she is weaker, when really, she hasn't been in any serious fights and doesn't know the dangers and that has a minor ego to her that we see slowly break down as the series goes on. A minor moment where we see shots of Pan and Bra, that comes after Goku asking how come Pan doesn't want to see Bra, Pan saying Bra wasn't a fighter, and we get a scene going on that Trunks explains that Pan and Bra were friends but had a falling out when we cut to Bra going Super Saiyan, Trunks saying that Pan felt insecure since she trained and never transformed while Bra who doesn't train could easily achieve it. And we see Pan's growth from a more overconfident and arrogant character into a reliable fighter, watching as she stands on her own two feet shoulder to shoulder with the other Z-Fighters.
Second, the beginning, with Goku, Trunks, and Pan traveling across space, we see them encounter movie villains and that is the minor threats leading up to the Tuffles and Baby. Seeing Cooler trying to reform the Empire, Lord Slug hunting Dragon Balls, Turles raiding the team as a mercenary, getting the Dragon Ball from Hirudegarn, and a fight with Bojack.
Third, is the Baby Arc, having this for the plan. Baby takes over the earth, Piccolo is believed to be dead as Baby Vegeta spreads his control. Goku falls to Baby Vegeta as Uub steps up, but isn't a match for Baby Vegeta and the Tuffle Saiyans, leading to the birth of Majuub and he owns Baby Vegeta, where Baby Vegeta goes Super Saiyan 3 and defeats Majuub. We see Goku return as a Super Saiyan 4 with the fight happening the same way. Pan and Kibito Kai trying to help but are stopped by Gohan and Gotenks, where Majuub and Piccolo show up to prevent them from helping Baby Vegeta, and events happen the same.
Fourth is Super 17, where it tends to be the same, but in Hell, the reason they escaped was the birth of Janemba, which Goku, Piccolo and Pikkon fight as Majuub and Vegeta battle Super 17, leading to the death of Gohan, Krillin, and 18. This way, Majuub and Vegeta get a win while Goku does as well.
Fifth is the Shadow Dragons, where each dragon range in strength, but their threat is the elemental powers they possess, going more on that for destroying the world. Goku, Trunks, Goten, Pan, and Majuub heading out to fight and defeat the dragons. During their encounters, they have their own scenes with other characters. Trunks gets help from Tien as an Easter Egg to the Bojack movie fight, Master Roshi and Bra help Pan, Goten gets Yamcha to kind of play-off Goten getting dating advice from Yamcha, and Chiaotzu helping Majuub. We see Majuub getting angry in his fight, unable to hit his Shadow Dragon, showing more of an Evil Buu side that he regains with help from Buu, and with his psychic powers, Chiaotzu helps Majuub to defeat the dragon. Now, the big one with Pan. We see Pan struggling, getting mad that Roshi and Bra are helping her, but it is Roshi who yells at her, telling Pan that she is her own worst enemy, that the adults think highly of her and it is herself that is the one saying she is weaker and needs saving, that Pan herself is the only one saying she isn't good enough. Doing something like that to have Pan realize that her overconfidence and arrogance was because she felt like she wasn't good enough. And this is her point of turning Super Saiyan, and winning her fight.
Changing Ice and Nova fights would be an injustice with how Nova is and the Dragon Fist.
Now, Omega Shenron as the sixth and last point. Instead of just getting a power boost, Omega Shenron gets all of the other dragons' elemental powers and that is why he is so powerful, the versatility he possesses.
The ending plays the same from that.
I like to see people's thoughts on this, and what changes they want.
PEAK, for Super 17, I want goku to assist vegeta/ vegeta unlocks ssj4 to defeat Super 17
You need to change Super 17, please go back and watch that arc it's absolute trash.
It's a prime example of bad writing, making known characters not Goku just become omega jobbers. Hell you had Frieza and Cell teaming up and get defeated by basically an ice machine.
There's a bit where Goten and Trunks sense Android 19 was near, ya know the character that can't be sensed? Like completely goes against the point.
@@dylansetright3359 Um...I wasn't going to go for a bit by bit change. Just a more general change to make it better while keeping it similar. And honestly, bringing back old villains for the current cast to fight can give good fights or rematches. Of course there would be changes to the fighting and not having stupid stuff like that ice machine.
Okay, Super 17 arc...what would make for the villain/new villain?
I personally like the idea that Goku fights Janemba as the reason why hell is open, like in Fusion Reborn.
But who would be the threat on Earth that the others must overcome? I can't think of a good reason as to why someone else would be the powerful villain on Earth.
Using Frieza is just a copycat of Super.
Cell isn't a threat, and Superhero used him for Cell Max, so another copycat.
Buu isn't in hell since he is reincarnated.
Using Baby is just repeating the last arc.
So, who would be the new villain? Just having Cell absorb Frieza and other major threats? I brought up Super 17 because i liked the idea of energy absorption that Android 19 and 20 possessed and got scraped, take away Ki attacks that granted the Z-Fighter their wins.
@@enanomalley9986 yeah issue was GT made the matches terrible in that arc. Legit the only one from that arc who came back and put up a fight was already from GT. Outside of Super 17 himself of course.
But I've seen people who just haven't seen the show in a while try to act like Super 17 was actually not a bad arc and it's just no.
That arc would be far need the most changes to actually make it even a decent arc. Possibly worst DB arc as it stands
8:44
In Xenoverse 2 they expanded on Uub a bit by having him get the same cravings as Majin Buu
a sort of consequence for refusing with Buu
Like cravings for sweets?
@@thecringekid1929 Yup!
Admittedly I really didn't like your story, it removed many wonderful things from GT like the ascension to heaven in broad daylight and your new plot point made no sense to me at all. HOWEVER, like you said in your GT review "I totally respect and kind of love that." So if you enjoy this version of the story "that's awesome"!! I'm glad Mark is learning in is own way to appreciate GT and I'm glad some people got enjoyment from this video. Thanks for sharing!!
GT was horrible, just accepit it dude. Your a grown up adult
@@fredy2041
It’s called an opinion. Just because it’s different from yours doesn’t mean it can hurt you, so why not leave well enough alone?
@@fredy2041Grown ass adult speaking like a toddler
@@miky9504 Yeah, im the adult, you guys are not
@@RedKing12000 yet you cannot admit you like trash
Man, none interaction of Omega Shenron recognizing Kami inside Picollo??
Yeah Mark, I think a better idea for this would have probably been to keep the same basic plotlines the original GT had, including their setups, and just changing the finer details of the journey to where the most major plot points of each arc still happen as they did in GT, but with better execution on how they get to said plot points. I don't agree with throwing out the Black Star Dragon Balls because they have a lot of interesting lore potential for the Nameless Namekian that split into Kami and Piccolo, plus their planet destroying side effect does create a good amount of tension to rush to collect them. The Super 17 Saga actually is happening mainly because the Dragon Balls being used to bring back the dead so many times has weakened the barrier between the living and the dead which is stated by Shenron at the end of the Shadow Dragons saga, so they could emphasize on that a bit more as well as putting more emphasis on the brainwashing being done to the Android #17 of Earth to make him become an unwilling pawn to Dr. Myuu and Dr. Gero's plans to create Super #17 using him and Hell Fighter #17, making the fight with Super #17 have plenty of moments of them trying to coheres #17 back out of his brainwashing which could have a hand in putting the finishing blow on Super #17. There's a lot of stuff you can do with the preexisting stuff while still making it work better in the long run.
Let's be honest with ourselves... if GT was considered as beloved as the Z anime, Toriyama would've made it canon via some random interview 20 years ago.
That plot twist where Porunga was NOT used in the final fight was fantastic, setting up that it looked like they used him, but in reality Baby came in clutch instead.
>Gives Vegeta SSJ4 first
>Doesn't have him fight in it?
Mark, it's time to stop these kinds of videos.
There are some things that I'm missing:
1. The Grand Tour of the first arc: yes, the execution of it in GT itself isn't particularly good; but you rather need it: a. how is Baby going to know to get to Earth? In the original they met Beby and his creator in space; but that's not happening here, but there's also no one in space to know where any Saiyans are, except for the Nameks but they're just as isolated as Earth is. The best chance Beby has is remnants of Frieza's planet trade organization; either way this is going to take him a lot of time if you don't send Goku and co. to space. What are Goku and co. going to do in the mean time, twiddle their thumbs? If you think GT's first arc was boring, this is going to be very boring; if they just sit on Earth, waiting. Also, you said you were going to keep the robot; where do they get the robot?
I propose this: if this wish restores everything shouldn't it also restore the Saiyans; not just the Tsuffles let alone only their Baby? And also Namek; and possibly the Ginyu Force and Frieza; hell, you could even restore the Cell Games ring and Cell. Anyway, now we have several good reasons for Goku and co. to go to space; Frieza is wrecking havoc; trying to restore his organization and capturing planets to sell to the highest bidder again; not to mention the reignited war between the Tsuffles and the Saiyans. You can have Goku and Vegeta force a peace between the Tsuffles and Saiyans who are now no longer simple barbarians like they were at the time they destroyed the Tsuffles. Baby can go to Earth to deal with the Saiyans there first after the Tsuffles try to shut him down/destroy him; and he refuses and perhaps even learns to hate his creators because of this; and he realizes he can only fight and kill the Saiyans if there is no more peace; so he needs to destroy the people who brought the peace; the Saiyans of the Earth.
(You could even give Frieza his golden form not by a mere month of training but because some of the evil wish power centered on him and that's what's allowed him to access that form.)
2. Where did Goku achieve SSJ4? You didn't mention it at all; and he doesn't seem to get an opportunity for it at all.
3. Although I like most of the Shadow Dragon arc, especially the last arc, there is one issue with it you don't solve in yours. Why would wish-granting orbs made for wishing corrupt by wishing? This doesn't make sense. You might go with; you use them to often; except the dragon balls have a mechanism to prevent that; they turn to stone for a year after using them. Now you might go with; you made bad, self-serving wishes; but most of the wishes on Earth's Dragon Balls haven't been that; let alone the Namekian balls that you have corrupting as well. The panties might have been a self-serving wish, the wiping people's minds of Buu was one; but how many other wishes were self-serving? Removing 18s self-destruct mechanism certainly isn't; restoring people's lives isn't; unless perhaps you casually let people die for a good/better fight because you can bring them back anyway, maybe; but you really need to establish / have them do some self-serving/bad/evil wishes in the GT stories to explain why the Dragon Balls corrupt in the first place. Restoring the lookout would probably classify, but that's just one. A better thing would be; to have the Black Star Dragon Balls still be separate balls; and have THEM corrupt; you could still do it with the same wishes as in the original GT; since the Black Star Dragon Balls are created by Piccolo the Shadow of Kami the creator of the standard Dragon Balls; you can have it that every wish upon the Standard Dragon Balls; further power up and corrupt the Black Star Dragon Balls. This would also explain why the Dragons are so powerful; the Dragon can only grant wishes within the power of his creator; but the Shadow Dragons, even the weaklings are a lot more powerful than that.
I really do love the changes made up till the shadow dragon arc. I understand you weren't going to go out of your way to make up entirely new segments but that arc now sounds really rushed as it looks to shoehorn everyone in as a hero (except goten?). Honestly having multiple shadow dragons would work better to give everyone a chance to shine up until omega Shenron (though you did say you were only using one to make it easier on the editor). Also it felt too vauge on what Baby's future was and I may or may not be sad that ss4 gogeta doesn't happen has one last hoorah between Goku and Vegeta.
Still loved the video and really enjoy you taking on the large process of redoing these arcs.
DBGT is my favorite. I grew up watching it as it aired in Japan. Despite it getting cancelled, nobody was so aggressively anti-GT back then. The GT hatred felt like something that came from the western audience and then cultivated through RUclipsrs to impressionable audiences who mirror those points. If you watched DB to DBZ to DBGT, DBGT felt like a return to form and an honoring of the original series, but also mixing the hardcore fighting elements of DBZ. It mixed the adventure and the combat, had the greatest soundtrack in anime history, fantastic character designs and characters, voice acting, etc.
DBGT hate is mostly from English speaking countries, because of the bad dub, In LatinAmerica you could ask most people if they like DBGT and they would say yes, that they love it
You can’t have GT without SSJ4 Gogeta. His appearance alone gives such a positive and hopeful vibe no matter what the situation is and has been a staple of Dragon Ball media for years despite only having one appearance
1:02 how do i find this version of the song?
Look up Dan Dan lofi remix probably
pretty sure its by rifti beats on youtube
I've always enjoyed SS4's concept and how Goku's harnessing of it was a call back and just as emotional for that character as it would be Baby in your rewriting. Goku killed his own grandfather in that form because he could never control it; most sayians couldn't with the exception of the elite's like Vegeta, and they'd just blindly destroy anything and anyone in their way. Goku's ability to harness, control, the form was a full circle moment where he'd never again hurt anyone with the form (Like he had in the past) while still accepting it as part of himself. I think in your retelling that should be highlighted as well, but even with this new form and with Vegeta in the same it's still not enough. It would go to show that endless power ups, upgrades, aren't enough to best an enemy like your Omega; because he'd keep growing stronger each time they abused the balls again and again, hence really drive home the need to not abuse them. With that realization, it plants the seed in goku that there has to another way, giving your ending much more merit and an earned feel.
Also, I believe the SS4 transformation should have been one exclusive solely to full blooded Saiyans; as the full embracement of their origin, story, and shouldn't become accessible in future stories in continuation of this one. It's an homage, unique, to our original two heroes that pays tribute to who they are, were, and who they become. In Super, if you followed this, the main focus of the show should have been Vegeta Jr & Goku Jr. Allowing character development for these new heroes that open the path to the SSGod transformations (Because they have to RELY on the power of other's to harness it, and that goes with what Goku brings up in your ending. How that strength allows them to go even beyond our original heroes.) Another thing that needs to change is how Pan looks older at that age, to that extent, when we know the Saiyan DNA even in Halflings will slow down their ageing. Not saying she should look young, but I think it's ridiculous that Bulma can look like she does at her age but Pan looks like she's near her deathbed.
Also Vegeta should die in his battle, giving up his life, giving another call back to the time he sacrificed himself but this time with some moderate success by buying time or slowing down Omega.
If you did a continuation into Super you could keep Piccollo's transformation as well, as a call back from Omega in GT, and how he's harnessing that power to defend the planet without having to abuse the balls. It would be a nice way to see our "Demon King Piccollo" once evil (Maybe have a backstory of how he became evil? Maybe he was outcasted originally from Namek, rather than leaving, because of his abuse of the balls that corrupted him. In his last attempt to spare his people he fled.) who could now harness his original strength without the selfish nature he once showed. This would make him a power house in the Super story arcs to come.
I would have loved to see a scene in GT, after his training with Vegeta, where he's given the broken Z sword to be reforged giving him a full circle moment of becoming something parallel to Future trunks. Hell, I think you could still incorporate a Super 17 arc after the Dragons maybe in super. Where there's an older Trunks now, with the sword, that encounters a new android threat to the planet. Him and Goten handle the threat together (Giving goten some love, because he got none) where Vegeta and goku are gone at this point. Maybe Uub is elsewhere and Piccollo is going through his finding himself arc. If you wanted to give another full circle moment you could say Gohan at this point starts training Goten and Trunks, as their master, and this new Android kills Gohan. With them not having the dragonballs this would fuel Goten, Trunks, and Pan into a frenzy and maybe have to do something akin to the Kamehameha used in the Bio broly movie with Goten, Trunks, and Pan. A nice call back that gives these three characters with little love a little more screen time.
I'd say before the last paragraph I mentioned, maybe bring in Broly. In this time we give Gohan a reason to fight again and finally give him that glow up he's been neglected since the cell arc. Maybe this after Piccollo does his new powerup, and he trains gohan one last time before deciding to stay with the Nameks for good? We see a glimpse of what the half saiyans are capable of in the future; like SSG Blue and Red. Gohan taps into his beast transformation, pure rage, that rivals and over powers the rage of Broly. Maybe we get an ending where our two hot heads, after beating each other to near death, come to the realization that they need to learn to control this after looking in a mirror - each other. This gives Broly a happy ending as well, where he starts a new life elsewhere and is appreciative of this new-found perspective and context. Important thing I'd note is that Gohan's new transformation wouldn't be at like SSG level but like his version of SS4? That these unique, new transformations in Super, were only accessible to the half saiyans because their mastery over there emotions. Hell, this transformation could have been the result of the "Potential unlock" for guru and that which Elder Kai gave "Mystic" gohan. That gohan, because he was undisciplined and gave up fighting, never really tapped into it till now. And that the form is unique to him for that reason.
The introduction to Beatrice comes after all these events where our heroes learn of this transformation; maybe sensing a "flicker" or the power of gohan in that moment against Broly is what tipped him off to our planet. However, by the time he arrives Gohan is dead, throughly unamused he leaves for the day the SSGod could appear after telling our heroes of that possibility. Maybe we see a new frieza arc at this point? Where he becomes Golden, in the future, and begins terrorizing the universes from afar (Hesitant to show up on earth because he doesn't know our original heroes are dead/gone) over the course of those years we get the tournament of power/universes where our Earth forces are nowhere near the potential they once were without Gohan, Vegeta, and Goku. We get to see Uub step up, Krillian, and a few other favorites we've neglected over the years make a come up. Our heroes that could once just rely on endless power ups are forced to act smarter, engage in Martial arts, and just barely scrape by. Maybe it's Frieza, of all people, that clutch this to save the universe only to realize his adversaries are nowhere near his potential that sparks the new Frieza arc. Realizing this our heroes are forced into nonstop training. You could also include Baby in this tournament as well, by the way, if we go off your continuity.
Rather than "future trunks" having the part he does from that timeline, it's our Trunks coming into that new role. With all of his training, under Vegeta at SS4 and later Gohan with his new form, that allows Trunks to access that form exclusive to Future Trunks? Thus making him as strong or near the level of Uub, that gives him more power or merit in that tournament of power? This would give a real sense of passing off the mantel to the new generation who begin to develop into their own. As for Goku black, maybe it's Goten that's taken instead? Once he regains his body, hell you could say Baby jumps into Goten Black to fight off the other mind, he has access to that transformation as well? Maybe it wouldn't feel as earned, but maybe there's like an internal battle where Goten and Baby fight off the Kai; through their combined efforts they're able to best him, and giving some sense of having earned this new form. Now in the Tower of power arc you have another contender that allows this universe to even have the chance it had.
Frieza arc occurs and he tries to take over earth realizing Vegeta and goku are gone, but only to face off Goten and Trunks who are acting on behalf of their fathers much like Vegeta and Goku had done previously. Individually the two struggle to best frieza, but using the Fusion dance they are able to best frieza forcing him to retreat. A disgraced Frieza begins to train once more, increasing his influence across the cosmos, where we encounter new enemies that continuously barrage earth with new fighters trying to take down the new Z fighters. Also meanwhile Frieza's forces are causing chaos around the universe, causing Piccolo to make a reappearance to defend Namek. We now get the original GT feel, of space ships, travelling around space to new worlds trying to fight off the galactic tyrant. However, our main heroes of Trunks and Goten must stay on earth to defend, just in case Frieza were to arrive, and Uub with his experiences of travelling space with Pan (Who joins up with him again) and Baby try to save planet after planet from Frieza's clutches. I think it would be fitting to have Baby with them, because of what happened to his world and how where the Saiyans were wrong to do what they had; he learns of Frieza's part of that, and living up to his original purpose, vows to stop frieza. So that no other world goes through what his creators had. It's also fiting that a young saiyan, a new generation, in pan is atoning for the mistakes of past Saiyans that took over planets. Uub acting as the backbone, power house, and acts as a mentor to Pan who help shape her into a more capable fighter. Where Uub is the physical mentorship our young saiyan needs, Baby acts as a mentor of tactics and battle strategy to Pan that helps forge her new-found desire to redeem the sins of her species. Later on as our Heroes age and pass the baton, it's given to Pan, who continues to grow stronger and stronger into her own. Her desire to do right is what makes her into the memorable hero, a North star if you will.
Maybe we include a story element of Beatrice who when he arrived gave the Earth 100 years to find that untapped potential, or he'd destroy the planet. Trunks is taken to be part of the role of time protector, so he's gone from the planet now. Maybe in the final clash between Frieza and Trunks + Goten, goten perishes; with a sudden power up from the Kai's, in exchange for his service, trunks is indepted to the Kai's and must leave earth. Uub and Pan act as the last line of Defense for the planet, against the remnants of Frieza's forces seeking retribution, but as the attacks become fewer and fewer our Pan (now in her late teens) settles down to focus on school and an every day life. That's where she encounters a love interest, finds happiness, and maybe there's an arc where she's pregnant and is unable to defend the planet. (For safety of the child) And Uub is forced to defend the planet solo against a last ditch effort of Frieza's forces. Uub completely exhausts himself, dies, but is able to fend off the attack. This leaves Pan, alone, with only a handful of fighters to defend the planet. Rather than Goku Jr or Vegeta Jr, down the road, of becoming the first SSGod it's Pan surrounded by the spirits of Goku, Vegeta, Trunks (Who is allowed a brief window out of his service), Goten, Gohan, & Uub (though not a saiyan) arrive as ghost (Much like Goku could in the buu arc) to give their energy to Pan who becomes the first SSGod. She's able to fend off against Beatrice, just barely, but enough to impress him to leave the earth alone for a time. This buys time for Pan, with her child, to grow as warriors. Then she has her grandson Goku Jr fight against Vegeta Jr (As we saw) they go super saiyan. She begins to train both of them, where they become the first SSG Blues and continue to train to surpas the legacy of fighters who came before. And that's how I'd end Super, with your story in mind.
You might address later in vid, but atm, why did it make goku a kid still????? That doesn’t make since outside “it happened in gt” 15:15
This is amazing!