Coarse vs Polished - S110V Steel Edge Retention
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- Опубликовано: 15 окт 2024
- cedric-ada-sto...
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Reducing the angle increases the edge retention? I have my s110 sharpened 20 degree
Hey Pete, I've always wanted to know something. In between sharpenings like here do you just sharpening again or slide the edge across a stone to cut off weakened metal and start sharpening from there? Starting on fresh steel makes a big difference, it doesn't burr as much, it's tougher and will have better wear resistance. Let me know either way, love your tests and reviews.
Take care and stay safe.
Pete what is the name of this kick ass song 7:23 ?
Thank you kindly
dont work :D video private
video is private
S110V is great because it keeps me busy. I got a Native 5 last year and I'm hoping to be able to achieve a burr later this year. Fingers crossed everyone.
Did you form that burr yet or what?
How about now? 😄
How's that burr coming?🤪
BBBbbuuuuuurrrrrrrr it's cold out
100 years later, "how's it coming sonny!?"
That's a great result for both edges. Very interesting! Thanks for the plug too mate, appreciate it.
The store selling that rope is having a blast!
😂👍
I super enjoyed your presentation. And the rope paper testing was not only a fair assessment, but also hilarious as hell. Thank you from this 70-year-old fan!!!
Great test, thanks from America! I was jn the paper industry for 34 years, so there is a lot of difference in paper grain, thickness, weight, filler, acid comtent, humility, etc in an average piece of 20 pound paper. Some "cut" easier as I am sure you have noticed. Buy a standard lot of printer paper and keep it by your work area, that rules out another variable. All papers are not created equal (-:
Also, which edge did you prefer the "feel" of the best? Many enjoy the bite of a course edge for an EDC, while some enjoy the polished style feel. THANKS again !
What state ru from? Curious
@@jclar3565 yeah I was curious aswell cause I work at a paper mill myself.
11,12, and 20
If you understand that then you'll know where I am from.
Bring back these! I like them 😀
Actually your whole channel I've found awesome.
We need some cruwear and more! Please 🙏
Good test. I’ve been in the record for many years about how thinner angles give better edge retention for most of the EDC cutting that people do. I usually go 8-10 degrees per side with a tiny 15 per side microbevel.
I've always wondered what on earth you do with the piles and piles of rope cuttings. If you saved that stuff up you'd be able to insulate the walls in every house in your neighborhood.
Charcloth material, fire starter for backyard, and padding for shipping. Lots of uses for me at least!
I love your tests. They are honest and real world. A big Thank you from eastern Kentucky in the USA.
I have to confess, I thought I was paying more for the Blurple color with the PM2 and didn't realize I had upgraded my steel. Definitely a pleasant surprise and I felt less dumb for paying extra just for a color.
Beaverius similar to you man. I bought it because of the color, not the steel LOL but yea it’s nice to know the steel is premium
Thumbs up for the Emerson, Lake & Palmer sound-alike music!
I think it's Dancing Mad by Final Fantasy composer Nobuo Uematsu. A lot of Japanese composers were influenced heavily by classic prog rock bands like ELP or Pink Floyd.
Or Dixie Dregs, another ELP sound alike.
I'm a bit jealous. I've never gotten S110V to polish like that, it was always a very cloudy finish. Might have to do with me using an edge pro without any diamond involved in the sharpening.
Great data, Pete! Thank you.
Just ordered some chosera wetstones. Only a 400 and 1,000 grit to start. Also purchased a two sided strop with a 3,000 compound and 13,000 compound. I'll eventually get a few more higher grit stones.
After a lot of thought I finally decided to get stones over other sharpening methods. Your different sharpening methods video inspired me on top of DBK making it look super cool. I just want that mirror polish... that sweet sweet mirror polish... 🤤
Music selection perfect for Dr. Death of the rope world. Thanks for the last several videos checking out edge cutting capabilities at different grit sharpening levels with various metals. Entertaining and educational topics on RUclips.. who knew!
For 20+ years I've been using a Gatco diamond hone w/ angle clamp on all sorts of steels - course/medium/fine hones, and a pass or three on a strop.
I've found that the courser edge with little or no stropping cuts and slices better with less force than a finely polished edge. I'm talking about a course edge with no burr, no gritty feeling when pulled backward across my fingernail.
I dont care much for polished edges, just because an edge will push-cut paper doesn't mean its good for slicing fiberous materials.
A good demonstration of that is to strop a sharp edge into a micro convex... it'll pop hair and push through paper with ease, but wont cut rope, denim or meat worth a damn.
Hey. That’s my edc you’ve tested! Thank you. I have only just taken the angle back to 18 degrees. The blade often contacts copper wire or cuts hard plastic so I am conservative with the angle. Maybe because I commonly cut things tougher than cardboard, I haven’t found any advantage to polishing the edge or even refining it beyond the green DMY plate. Maybe I should get a KME and see if I can improve over my freehand edge. Maybe not though because it stays really sharp for a long time!
I would be really interested in seeing a video of M390, with a Paul Bos triple tempered cryo and heat treatment at 62 HRC.
The answer to your curiosity may hurt a mans shoulder!
Factory edge on Native 5 S110V got some sort of minor chips edge trimming some 5 mil Lauan plywood, about two feet or so. Easily found on a fingernail, not one little bit of catch on paper. First few days of this in rotation. I use polished edges on all my knives, because a very important use for me is cutting thin braided super fishing lines.
You should do the PM2 S110V with the new dual grit technique.
Because 650 seems pretty low compared to M4 1000+ cuts
Thank you much Pete, for your gift of pain!
I really do love, S110V. So much so, that I buy what I think, are ugly burple Spyderco knives, and swap out the scales, with some black ones, off of BD1 steel knives.
Makes me a happy camper!
: - )
I'm am now also subscribed, to the NJMS EDC Channel. Thanks for that tip.
I actually am sick of black everything anymore, the blue is kinda cool as a change. Metal would be a neat option too! I always wanted a knife with mogume gane scales. Thought that would be cool!
I'm on night shift now so i have an excuse to be up at 1:30 in the morning!
The paper test works pretty good imo, as long as you cut through at the same angle and same speed it will give you a good indicator how sharp a blade is, although I like thin magazine or catalog paper better.
In my experience stropping stuff like s110v with strop paste other than quality diamond paste is futile, the CBN emulsions I havent tried but im not surprised that strop did not bring the edge back.
Pete- I may be missing something. I think you have to resharpen the edge to 600 grit and then, without removing the blade from the clamp, proceed to a mirror polish in order to do a valid comparison. The finer polishing films by themselves are insufficient to repair a blunted edge and replacing the blade in the clamp however carefully offers too much variability.
Definitely missing something. After the first test I resharpened the edge again with the 600 stone and then all the way up to the films. The knife was replaced in the jaws the same way, thats what the coloring was for. I didnt show all this as it was a good 90 minutes of sharpening overall. Its not feasible to do the test with the jaws still attached. I am pretty happy that the sharpie on the edge and double checking the angle is the same is keeping it constant enough
you have absolutely the best background music I've heard on these videos! What was the organ solo at the beginning?
Do you agree with me? M4 and S110V like the toothy edge, ok to stop at 300 so grit even sometimes for near maximum effect as opposed to full mirror polish processes.
I did not expect to hear the FFVI Final Boss theme, well done sir!
Does Nathan still have a RUclips channel? Video is private now. Maybe there are other vids
Hey Pete , another great video. How about 9cr18mov "unleashed " , the new Civivi knives ( WE's budget line, in case you didn't know. ha, ha ) USE it, seems to be pretty good , I'd say about the same as Spyderco VG10 , I like it, but it might be an unfair advantage to use a Civivi knife because they are super thin behind the edge, just the thinness alone seams to push the blade through materials. The fit and finish on these knives is awesome, you can tell WE has their hand in it , and for $42.00 US , it's a great deal . Pete you should try to get a few , before they are gone .
I'm super curious about this too
I have a Civivi on the way, will defo do a test.
@@CedricAda GREAT !! Can't wait to see how it does . I've been waiting for someone to make some good 31/2"in. plus "slicer's" and Civivi (WE) knocked it out of the park with these .
Brian, Spyderco Stretch (3.50" ) and Endura 4 (3.81") are that, I might suggest. Not $42, but the Endura 4, especially, is easily found second hand in "new" or LN condition not far off that price. (My own Stretch is in ZDP-189, and my recently acquired Endura 4 is in V-Toku2, FYI.)
I agree that WE's new budget line holds promise. Keeping the weight down on circa 3.50" slicer knives priced meaningfully less than an Endura is a persistent buyer's issue, though. I have only one knife slotted into any regular pocket carry EDC role which, by personal preference, even gets to, or above, the carry weight of the lightest iteration of a Paramilitary 2 (as a familiar point of comparison)... and that one is of nearly Endura blade length, but with a strong 3.8 mm flat ground blade stock and titanium construction -- the super nice Two Suns Knife TS-51*1 in a slim body at 4.11 ounces, 50/50 balanced. It surprised me as a very stable slicer of firm apples, given the blade's powerful, but not too tall wedge cross section... but the blade's long continuous belly seems to really be a difference maker here. I call this big knife my 'poor man's D2 Spydiechef'. Flawless construction and operation on my example. Check out photos at eBay and you'll get it. In the Civivi price territory if won at auction on a good night. FYI.
@@frederickj.7136 - Not sure about the Stretch but I own 3 Endura 4's , 2 VG10 and 1 ZDP-189, and they are good slicers , but the Civivi Praxis and Baklash ( the two I own) are better , imo . And as far as price "forget·about·it", the Endura has been over priced for years , the ZDP model is a far better deal. But to each his own . The fit and finish on these Civivi knives is awesome for $42.00. It's a GREAT time to be a knife nut, the stuff we can get for under $50 is amazing, if we look back 2 - 3 yrs , the knife industry has made a HUGE jump, I mean D2 and g10, it's awesome , g10 was a $20 - $30 upgrade back them.
Awesome i got the same just 3 weeks ago and now you made a dedicated video
In another video you posted the same s110v and only got 290 some cuts. What’s the difference here and why was it so high ?
Really nice Cedric! I find your videos and tests very interesting. Nice to learn somethning new time after time. Keep go!! Thumbs up subscribed and notification on :-)
Thanks! Great video! I have been asking me the question,
if a mirror edge is always best for a long time! The organ music while you are talking is almost as confusing as my english grammar😉.
Great video. What is your overall favorite stainless? Ever think of mixing all that cut rope with some wax or pitch and selling it as fire starter?
spider5001 check my faq vid - it really doesnt burn!! ruclips.net/video/Soa5_HSDtgE/видео.html
@@CedricAda Wow, surprising!
Pretty much just sold a knife for spiderco, thanks for the test
I know you'll probably never see this but i want a pm3 so bad ive got loads of other knives and always wanted a pm3 and im so torn on which steel to get i thought about s110v because its easy to get but really would like it in magnacut especially with spydercos heat treat protocols
Hah yeah I used to always break out the japanese water stones for my Manix 2 s30v but then I started just maintaining it with my leatherman wave diamond file while on the job and it keeps the edge for a similar amount of time in varied tasks as when I had the waterstone +stropped finish and is still hair popping sharp if I strop on my boots after. Definitely less satisfying for wood carving but that's why I carry a GEC or Victorinox with a polished edge anyway.
Damn fixed systems and those beautiful polished bevels!!! As a freehander those perfect polishes are a gem. I prefer my s110v toothy DMT 600 and stropping.
@Magnum Mountaineer freehand is the way to go!!! I've been sharpening for about 10 years now, im perfectionist so while i can get a mirror polish, but a perfect one? 🤔. But that's not what I even gravitate towards to 9 times out of 10. Only certain steels that are usually low vanadium like Cts-xhp and zdp-189 and some carbon steels. Edge with teeth cuts so much nicer.
@Magnum Mountaineer DMT's and Spyderco stones are the way to go!!! And definitely get some diamond pastes/sprays i use them on firm leather. Just 1 micron and 0.5 will get you a long way. Michael Christy (PBUH) the jedi master!! the chosen one!!! 😂😂😂 he's the reason i talk like i cant sharpen for shit, i can put a face shaving edge on anything but im obsessed with that M.C level of silly sharp the guy puts an hair whittling edge on a knife and talks about how he feels it could get sharper 🤷🏻♂️ now that's passion!!! But if i could go back in time and teach myself one thing it would be the burr the burr the burr, i picked up from M.C that habit of looking for the burr with an flashlight, some times in a dark room or even with magnifying glass.
@Magnum Mountaineer i got em all on Blu-ray 😁 i have that Spyderco doubleStuff too great little pocket stone for touch up's. 👍 Have a great day.
Good shit. And that guitar instrumental took me right back to my metal days haha
hey pete sorry to bother you but do you plan on doing a VG-10 mirror vs toothy edge test anytime soon?
because i just purchased a nice camera and a wicked edge gen 3 system with a ton of stones and wanted to see if i could help pick up some data points just to get an idea of what amount of cuts i get. i just wanted to know the angle of degrees you do this test at and the name brand of sisal rope you buy so i can maybe purchase some.
no idea if ill even get around to this but i have quite a large knife collection and want to help out in some way
I know this comment is long after the fact, but the guy that invented Magnacut, and is often thought of as the most knowledgeable guy on the planet about knives, has stated that your tests correlate just fine with other laboratory tests. So, you have obviously made some consistent and conscientious decisions about your process that very few people could match.
#stuartedge FTW! I've recently got a KME on your recommendation. But I've always sent my knives to Nathan to get that mirror treatment. And will continue to until I'm better with the KME. LEGEND GUY, and crazy good knife sharpener.
Thanks for the video mate. Always dig your content.
love the high energy 2 bit videogame boss music
dang, it looks like you took of 2 to 3 mm off that knife over time !
I would have thought the polished would have won. I was surprised.
But the polished edge looks much nicer!!!
That's 13 per side right (26 total?) - Are the Tormek angle gauges marked for the total angle or per side?
Hey dude. Please put a link to his channel here. Link doesnt work
what steel was used to win the sharpest knife show ?
I appreciate the link and I'm one of your patreon supporters but what I like about you is you use tools at hand like rope, and mid-level hand sharpeners Etc. I don't want things to get too scientific ! Because that it will preclude more people getting on RUclips and testing more more knives copying your example . In fact I'm going to start doing some of my own rope test and I have some very exotic metals and I will put that on RUclips and keep you posted. I don't have any provision to fast forward my videos right now so I'm going to use 2in rope to keep things from dragging on LOL because I'm expecting some pretty amazing results from some of these metals that I'm going to be using some of which are not steel. I may also use some 500 year old Samurai Steel! So it should be interesting. If I can only find the time LOL
I am super stoked every time a new tester enters the fray, and if you make videos I will share them on my feed for sure!
What sharpener is that you use when you polished the edge?
Kme
Hello ! I love your videos ! I have a question to you : I know you got a tormek T4 system. Can we sharpen S110V with the tormek stone ? and polish the edge ? I have a worksharp Ken onion edition. I am interested by the Tormek, but it is a little pricy, so I would like your opinion (I have some many ESEEs knifes, some spyderco, ZT, benchmade with 1095, S30v, 20CV, and S110V steel) Thanks for the answer ;)
pyrosis08 tormeck doesn’t have any diamond cbn or sic abrasives so no
No joke, I think your right arm is buffer from doing all these cut test vid....oh wait......oh god.
Do you get a better edge with a sharpener or free hand? I’ve been using a stone or diamond stone for 20 plus years never tried a decent sharpener though so I’m curious.
I did notice a difference in the way that you're cutting. Maybe it's me, but it looks like it's a bit painful. Interesting how this steel performed though.
yeah still taking it a little easier. Im actually going way slower, breaking it i to 10-20 lot cuts and then resting a couple seconds. Then speeding the film to 1200% rather than the usual 1000% speed to still make it palatable to watch. It makes for a different appearance. Im thinking for april fools I’ll do Rex121 again at 10% speed, 10
hour video 😂😂
@@CedricAda Bwahaha! That would be different. Oh, I've subbed to Nathan's channel.
Pete, these faces you made during cutting made my day lil bit better))))
Just a suggestion….if you sit about a foot higher you will take the strain off your shoulder.
mirror edge on a not so shiny blade give em ultra sharp vibe to it
Can you tell me which steel, out of all your test and others you have read, is the best as far as taking an edge? In other words, which steel gets the sharpest? Thanks ahead of time.
theres a few which are about as good, in terms of how sharp I can get them. I think M4 takes a particulaly spooky sharp edge from my average skills. But XHP also, I’ve sharpened a lot of that and it stands out, too
Shane Scott
52100, 1095, CPM-4V, O1, A2, CPM-154 take excellent edges. As a general rule low carbide high carbon steels will always take a sharper/keener edge.
@@Wolf_K Thanks so much for that. I'm new to the sharpening game, so. Could you explain "low carbide" a bit more? Thanks in advance.
what is the upper limit would you say for a toothy edge? I mean the grit level?
Silent but Descriptive
Diamond- #1200
Waterstone- #700 max.
Silent but Descriptive diamond plate I would say 1500 but that’s pushing it if I go toothy I go anywhere from 300 to 1500 on diamond and strop
is this easier to strop back the edge with polished edge?
What angle finder app is that
I would love to see a coarse vs polished on S90V if you get time?
techwg
It’s about the same as S110V. Providing all factors are equal, no one can tell these two steels apart in actual use and if the same two blades were unmarked no one would see any difference at all. The biggest difference is the S110V has a higher Rockwell.
Also, S110V takes only slightly longer to sharpen, but not by much, than S90V. S110V takes only a bit longer than S30V; which itself only takes a little longer than 52100. The differences are minimal.
What is that you use to measure the angle of your edge?
What's the make and model of your sharpener . It looks really good . Especially compared to the ones I've been using . It probable isn't my sharpers just my hand : ) But I need something that clamps the blade down like yours .
You probably figured it out ages ago, but just in case. It's a KME sharpener.
nice to see you get the most out of the rope though :) good on ya
Are you a guitar player as well or do you simply have impeccable taste in music? That guitar solo in the backing track was on point.
Good content , Brutal background music/noise.
I did that same test and got 949 cuts on a coarse finish. I did slicing cuts too. How broad was the slice
How broad was the slice meaning how much of the blade did you use ex: 1 in from the tip towards the belly.
Also how many slices did it take to make one cut through the rope. Ex: two passes, or maybe 5 with even pressure
So its one slice using about an inch of blade, generally the belly portion. The slice incorporates a single forward/backward sawthrough motion with elements of a pushcut, being that here is a fair degree of downward force, too. I have an FAQ about how I cut in another video, I’ll link it to this comment.
Using more of the blade will make the test last longer as there is more edge to use up. Other things that could change the test are will cutting into a mat, or a different wood, or using a sawing type motion etc. Most important thing is for each tested to do it the same way every time, and try and just vary the steel or the edge or whatever they are trying to compare. I often say that my arm is just as big a part of the machine as the knife, the rope, the board. Its why I always encourage others to do testing too. Some guys will cut in a way that gets more, others in a way that gets less.
The results of interest are between what you get for s110v and what you get for other steels. For example, if I test S110 at 17° and it does 30% better than XHP at the same angle and finish, regardless of the actual numbers, and another tester gets that same variance or similar, the we are starting to get some synchronous data!
There are so many variables we really need about 100 different testers doing similar stuff, mapping their differences between steels and putting all the data into a hub somewhere.
FAQ - ruclips.net/video/Soa5_HSDtgE/видео.html
Cedric & Ada Gear and Outdoors thanks for the response. Sorry you had to send me the faq video! I literally watched it twice already, can’t believe I missed it!
Thanks Mate..can i ask what you fo with all the left over scrap rope?
compost it and grow potatoes under it at the moment. sometimes I make ada a dog bed with it too, but the cedric eats it and its in his poops for days
You mentioned getting physical problems from repetitive movements. Consider changing your seat and table height. You appear to to be working ot a table height that's too high.
So if I wanted to be an 8 pole, 2 arm, 10 finger, three kick, shoulin fighter, I guess its the 600 G?
Is this better than Rex 121?
No, not even close when talking about ware resistant and edge holding. Rex 121 is the king of knife world, not easy to work with or sharpen though. Try cpm 15v!
Dude do some cpm-154 please.You haven't done any expert the bark river that turned out to be something else.
What knife sharpener do you use?
KME
I had the exact same PM2 in S110V and I could never get it razor sharp like the rest of my knives. it was semi sharp at best.....and then it would lose it's edge in no time.
no matter what I tried it was never a super sharp knife. I could never understand what people were raving about this steel so much. I thought it was complete garbage and got rid of it as soon as I could
now I just stick to S30V and D2.....I don't even bother with any of the super steels. I'm a user, not a collector. I'm in Canada so knives are really expensive. whatever the price is in the US.......double or triple the price to get what we have to pay after the exchange rate, shipping, and all the taxes
Man Canada sucks dude.
Interesting but couldn't make it through with having to constantly turn the volume up and down when you blasted the Frankenstein castle music. Sorry this was supposed to be a constructive comment but it sure doesn't sound like one.
what is the sharpening jig/tool you are using?
KME SHARPENER
Para Military 2?
What's the music ?
Great video as always 👍🏼
Very valuable! Thanks!
17° or 12° please ? Verry super steel. Good jobs my friend.
I did 12 once and got chipping on s110v. Now i'm at 17-18 and no problems so far
already subbed and watching
You should try to get sponsored by your local paper store
Nice. Thanks mate
What’s that sharpening system?
KME
Nothing in the description my man
GutiTheJ all fixed!
Great Work!!!
But a quick strop would have a better chance of working on the polished edge.
I’ve got mine for personal defense. I’d like to know how many layers, & the thickness of clothing that it would penetrate, in one swipe of the blade. Otherwise a person has to go for the eye, neck or groin area. Really a very hellacious predicament to be in, trying to figure out ones chance of survival .
I’ve never felt threatened by paper or hemp, just saying.
Hello, could you test Busse mod 52100? Vs 52100?
What sharpening system is that?
KME
@@j.hardesty446 thanks for getting back with me 😂😂
@@elihedden6052 😂😂👌
lol i knew i heard ff6 music....subbed!
Does anyone know where he got the sharpener?
It was a gift from Nick Shabazz, another RUclipsr. You can buy a KME system from various outlets including the manufacturer directly.
@@ACitizenOfOurWorld I actually went and got one not long after making this comment lol. They're great, and I use mine to this day
Excellent work. The organ music not so much.
Test the rope! Compare to cardboard...
Did u video this in a funeral home ?
yes the family thought it was very odd
Yeaaaahhh my favourity steel nerd
BESS tester is not that great. often gives random results. i do already follow him. but i dont put faith in this bess sytem at all.