Shania Twain v Don Henley Live in 2024 - Adapt or Mime if you can't hit the notes - which is best?
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 15 окт 2024
- Shania Twain at Glastonbury did all her big hits, but is no longer able to hit the notes she did on the recording. She contracted Lyme Disease which sadly affected her voice. She has adapted her songs to fit her changed voice.
As per my previous videos, despite this option being available to Don Henley and his having used it in the past, he mimes live with the Eagles.
However Shania seems to have been criticised for not being able to sing any more, while Don's fans deny his miming!
As a full time musician for 46 years I can honestly say lowering keys to suit my voice change extended my career by at least 10 years.
Did a gig last night with my sax player.
Half our set was down a whole step.
He’s 68 I’m 65.
Seems like a sensible route to take!
I would much rather hear the real vocal, uncorrected, and have no problems with the artist changing keys or getting help from the bgv's. I salute those that put their voice out there, aged or with imperfections.
agree
1st view. Good work here. Darryl Hall btw same lyme disease - big headache for him but got his (still) fab voice back in pretty great shape.
I didn't know that....interesting! Thanks for watching!
If I wanted to hear singing exactly like it is on the recording, I'd play the recording and save the couple hundred dollars in ticket costs.
This was my biggest walk away feeling when I saw the eagles 20years ago.
It's fraud in my opinion. Just put a note on the ticket to say what you hear may be pre recorded.
Indeed. Given the ticket prices I think we deserve to see them perform, not fake it.
It's a live show and not some lights and artist or artists pretending to perform. Bet if someone pretended to fix their car or house it would be a different story.
I totally agree with you and actually have some distain for the fake mimers
I’d rather hear it live than it be mimed. If the artist can no longer get close to their songs even pitched down, it’s time to hang up the mic. Otherwise, I’d might as well stay home and listen to the album with a nice glass of Scotch.
I don't want to go to see a live concert if the artist is not truly singing or playing their instruments. If I wanted to hear the studio version, I would listen to it at home. If you feel you cannot sing the way you want, you should not be touring. Henley takes himself to seriously. There is a different musical experience one discovers at a live event. We pay to experience that one of kind energy and showmanship.
I want that instead of lip syncing
Saw Shania at the Lytham Festival the week after Glastonbury. Her voice got notably better the further into the set she got and was good by the finale. It was also interesting how the backing singers were carrying the songs on occasion but it was quite seamless with Shania just dropping out when she couldn’t hit the notes. Great show.
Great to hear. I think they should adapt with age, and she has. I remember Lionel Ritchie at Glastonbury a few years ago asking the audience "I need your help with this one". An honest approach. We loved seeing him there, and he got the crowd involved. That's what it's all about, if you ask me.
I much prefer the Shania approach. You are also seeing her perform visually, which is a wonderful sight. It's more of an all round performance, I feel.
Another approach I've seen live is Al Stewart. As of autumn 2022, the timbre of his voice was remarkably similar to the way it always was. I'm not sure if he changed the key much but what I noticed is that on a few songs, he resolves down rather than up.
I saw The Eagles back in 2008 (Last Road Out of Eden tour in O2), first track was Hotel California immediately, but they'd dropped the key (of which i THINK, was live). So they were already singing lower then. For an artist to drop the key and for them to admit they can't hit the high register anymore usually takes a lot for them to do it as remember a lot of ego is involved, also them being infamous for some tracks and it being their career, they usually, as we've now realised, to our horror, fhat even from some of the more famous artists are resorting to miming instead. Though with The Eagles it literally felt like the 2001 Live At Melbourne DVD, in front of you, Frey was even doing the same jokes FFS ("here's another one of those new songs for ya" = Take It Easy), so i wouldn't be surprised if it was partially mimed back then. Another band that HAS dropped the key and it's worked well is The Offspring. They sound, amazing on a lower key (on the condition they DON'T use auto tune). One that BADLY needs to drop the key is Roger Waters. I'd say with a live set, the aim of the game is to actually hit it as close as possible to the studio recording, if they do, I'd consider it a good set, but for real, and certainly with no prerecord. I'd want to see it LIVE, no bullshit, no vocoders, LIVE, from scratch in front of you (you're not paying for famous people karaoke). If they drop the key, fine, but if they can't do it after THAT, they should retire. I have no issue with what Shania did, i noticed the vocal middleground from her as soon as she started the set. Though I've done Glasto 10 years running now, and this year, the festival and the lineup, it was, pretty unrecognisable, and not a patch on last year, the only time the lineup was that bad otherwise when they came back from COVID and Aerosmith cancelled. Luckily for this year, I managed to cancel my ticket and get most of my deposit back, thank GOD.
As far as The Eagles are concerned, the phrase "obtaining money under false pretences" springs to mind.
Id say people's expectations and preferences vary by genre.. the more pop you get,, the more prople want the version they know from the radio.
Live Freddie Mercury would often "dodge" high notes with altered melodies. He also would sing a lower harmony ( or even go an octave down) while Roger Taylor hit the higher notes. Noone ever seemed to have an issue with HIM doing it.
The majority of the time the lead vocalist will hold the mic out towards the audience and let them sing the high parts and also when using autotune, the part of the word that is stretched/extended is the vowel sound, so what happens is all the vowels sounds end up sounding identical every time they are extended, it dehumanises the voice but is what has become the norm in today's recordings. There is a note altering piece of software called Melodyne which is a lot more subtle and when used properly I g'tee you wouldn't know the notes have been manipulated, but at the end of the day a singer singing live, on stage, right in front of you, is 100 times better whatever the key of the song ends up being.
Agreed!
Shania had two voice surgeries
It was the trend back in the seventies and eighties for artists to sing as high as they can, Michael Bolton for one example, Age is not kind to the voice , but people still expect record quality , especially with the high price of tickets. The artists could change their song choices to adapt to their voice but the public want to hear the hits of the time as they were. Either just play the record or put up with miming unfortunately.
When i go to a live concert I want live vocals no matter how good or bad they are. I have more respect for a performer who blows the gig with bad singing over a performer who relies on lip synching.
In about 2018/2019 I paid a fortune foe VIP Eagles tickets for my 60th birthday. I was very close to the stage and certainly didn’t notice if anyone was miming. However, what I did notice was the performance was very flat. I’ve seen them several times years ago and this gig was far less engaging. It was like they were going through the motions. Previously at Eagles gigs you couldn’t take your eyes off Joe Walsh but this time he was strangely subdued. Also, Deacon Frey may as well have not been there. Sadly Don Henley didn’t sing that many songs yet we had to endure a number of non-Eagles songs by Vince Gill which I certainly wouldn’t pay to hear again. I’ve no idea if there was any miming but I’d stake money they were all playing their own instruments. This year I very much wanted to see the Doobie Brothers who were supporting the Eagles in the UK as I’d never seen them with Mike McDonald. I didn’t go though. Didn’t fancy paying Eagles prices and leaving after the support act.
Here’s a thought. When I’m having a rant a good rant about musical things, she says “dad…you’re not their target market”.
I think that’s true here. Don Henley seems to care about his income more than anything else. So I suspect those of us this bothers aren’t significant enough to affect his income. Same with the shania thing. Ie there’s people out there who want it photoshopped/perfect. In the clips she still sounds like shania to me. And that’s cool for me.
Pretty sure the original key on Man! I Feel Like a Woman is A, not Bb. (Too lazy to check right now).
Please let me know what you discover when you find the energy to check......
@@iamtjwalker 😊
Some can still do it. I’ve seen some live videos of recent Simple Minds gigs and Jim Kerr still sounds good. Don’t know whether he’s changed keys.
I used to be an average runner. I struggle to walk now. So I don't enter half marathons. Why do these singers who can't sing anymore keep doing it!!??
As you said Still the One was bad - she was solo on that and the two you said were ok basically the backing singers sang the main line!!!
I'm just glad I didn't pay to see her at BST the next day !
Elton John has adapted very well to his aging and well worn voice box. I love his old stuff, but he and others like Billy Joel have adapted.
He absolutely hates bands that lip sync and has made it well known.
I get mad thinking I paid good money, sometimes insanely good money, to hear something I've probably already got in my collection.
The Eagles and a lot of others should at least let their fans know.
Remember Milli Vanilli? What ruined their careers, is now considered common practice. We've fallen far indeed.
@@redneckcoder
Is this comment as rude as it sounds? I wonder what could possibly have caused Elton’s throat bruising. 😂
@@redneckcodermostly smoking weed noon till night for 30 years lowered and hurt Elton’s voice.
He dropped “Yellow brick Road” and “Someone saved my life tonight” a whole step in 1992 when he and Billy started touring together. I’ve seen him 41 times and regrettably his voice is done. Still my fav artist though!!
I don't get why people are so crazy about about high notes anyways. A voice changes over time, thats absolutely normal. Yes, they might not be able to hit the highs. But instead they might develop a grittier voice, that is interesting. Or they develop a darker but also warmer tone, that is by itself pleasant to listen to.
When I listen to Ann Wilson these days, sure, in her 70s she doesn't sound like in the 70s, it's frikkin 50 years later. But she sounds totally fine and there is something about her voice now, that is interesting and really pleasant to listen to. The live album she released with her band sounds great, there is no vocal acrobatics, but overall it's a good presentation, even of the Heart songs. And it's almost 100 minutes of music from one single show. And I'm fairly sure, they didn't tinker too much with the sound, cause you can hear the difference to the studio versions.
For the overwhelming majority of concertgoers, they wish to hear the material reproduced exactly as it existed on the official recording. For them, Henley has it right. For the more sophisticated crowd, improvisation is desired; if they wish to hear it exactly like the recording,they will simply play the recording. You know, instead of paying hundred$ per ticket to see Great Grandpa Don Henley mime the stuff he sang 50+ years ago.
What have you done to your arm Tom ?
Fell over playing tennis!! My leg is worse!!
changing the key of the song up or down has been a standard practice as long as people have been singing. I tune some of my guitatrs in standard pitch and some a half step flat.....big deal......even Steven Still did that in the late 60's/early 70's as well as differenent tunings... Even the Stones guitarist uses alternate tunings, same concept. As long as everything is live I don't have a problem with it. The moment prerecorded tracks are used it is no longer live and the ticket cost should be refunded or at a minimum reduced. You might as well listen to a DJ or just play the radio.....
People need to understand that voice ranges lower with age...
I watched a couple of the beagles vids could not see it but I've seen Kiss Crue join the fail army and really when you've guys and girls out into their 80's still at it the voice changes - I'm having a wail of a time with AI images (audio coming next) and with processing power these days it's pretty much real time to deep fake so what has ourboard effects will be your voice circa 20-30 years back - we're in intresting times
I saw Jethro Tull in May and Ian Anderson’s voice is now nowhere near what it used to be, due to him having vocal cord issues in the 1980s and being 76 years old.
Everybody who turned up knew this before they went, so I’m pretty certain that adapting songs, which he now does, is better than miming.
Have we reached a point where ‘seeing an artist live’ will be just that - seeing them, but not necessarily hearing them?
His issues stem from being basically a chain smoker for a large part of his career.
Keep music live!!
She may not be your cup of tea, but of all of the mainstream performers today, I believe the most guilty offender of miming in concert is Mariah Carey. Someone on RUclips has actually done a fascinating series on the evolution of her miming technique, which involves punching in single lines/notes here and there along with using alternate studio vocal takes and complete studio re-recordings of her old songs. As of 2024, her live singing voice has deteriorated to such an extent that she relies on pre-recorded vocals for the entire show, save for the occasional ad libbed note here and there. I think it would be great if she disappeared for a while and then came back in a new incarnation using her current voice to the best of its natural ability. Marianne Faithfull is a good example of someone who trilled like a bird in her early career, fell off the radar for a while, and then came back to huge critical acclaim with a completely different cigarettes-and-whiskey rasp.
Got absolutely no time for hooray Henley.... grotesque human being
Had my Desperado cover taken down - took 3 years tho!
That song he actually wrote though. Most other songs he had little or no input on. Desperado is cartoonish enough in it's theme to be mildly credible even though Henley/Frey wrote it. It's quite a boring song though like most Eagles songs are.
you do realize that Shania Twain's singing through an auto-tuner on her recordings don't you?
Got no issues with Shania watched the coverage fab i cant sing as high now as icould in my thirties but i can singmuch lower ( maybe i should start a Doo Wop band lol!)😅😅
I think she was having sound issues too
Yes, you could see her fiddling about with her earpiece
THE EAGLES: #MUSIC #FOR #GIRLS
Live, every time. Cyndi sang live, Dua Lipa had her album tracks mixed into the live so her pre-recorded voice was there as a crutch and she could be out of tune and no one would hear it anyway. Older artists vs corporate young artists. Having said that, sad that Dolly mimed, I never knew that, if you can’t sing live don’t come.
PS great *live* performance!
Thank you!
Don has got it wrong. If he wanted to make it perfect he should at least have made an album to accompany the "farewell tour". But since don hasnt written an interesting song for the last 50 years (if ever) that is about as redudant as a lipsync tour. He couldnt even manage to write his divorce song by himself.
Shame on artists pretending to be performing live. We wouldn’t tolerate a doctor faking their way through a surgery, would we ? Why should we accept that lack of professionalism from a singer? If they can’t sing one of their songs anymore, they should either adapt it to a certain extent (I mean, the song’s melody HAS to be recognizable!), drop it from their set list...or, if this is happening on most songs, retire from live performance. Period.
Regarding unknown country acts,i have all Martina McBride cds,and shes going as long as Shania,her effortless hi notes would embarrass the warbling grifter carey
Mutt Lange is pronounced LUNGAA
"Perfection" can never be achieved by autotune and locking to a clic, since that sounds like crap.
Just play if you can.
I hate autotune…I would rather hear missed note or slightly off notes than phony crap. I am not a big Shania fan but I commend her for SINGING not an artifice of it.
No.
If you can’t sing retire
I would rather Debbie Harry Blondie singing out tune than watch someone lip syncing. Total con job not singing live.
Has Henley poo-poo’ed on the Eagles legacy? Yep!
The people going to arena shows should be more pissed about the insane ticket prices instead. Anyone spending that kind of money to see those types of shows deserve the show they feel like they got either way, satisfied or disgruntled.