The west coast natives did "farm" but not in the European way. They grew shellfish in coastal ponds, they grew berry bushes and useful trees near their communities. In fact a lot of the forests in the Americas were managed.
that was the case in many areas. Looks like people in the amazonas region did gardening for thousands of years and left only the "terra preta" and some marks in the ground.
Lena, romans had fishponds and mussel farms, forest rasperry were managed, all forest were managed, north african oasis have a very complex managment. America was much later, isolated and suffered from genetic degenerative problems... America lacked the high IQ 1%. It doomed the natives
@@808bigisland America was doomed by guns and greed and pestilence. Just like the Europeans and Britons were doomed by the discipline and technology of the Romans. Maybe if they had had higher IQs the romans wouldn't have run them over? Bigotry is ugly.
same with Hazel in Britain. We started to coppice them several thousand years ago for the nuts and wood. Hazel is much like Ash in that it doesnt need to be dried and will burn straight after felling.
Before I forget, many tribes trained their women in defense of the village. Imaging the men leaving on the hunt, and an enemy attacked the village, the women wouldn't just run about scream and shout, like the movies portrayed. Everyone in the village trained in some fashion, including kids.
To help with our understanding of the transition from hunter-gatherers to sedentary farming might I suggest that we adopt the phrase Pre-farmers or perhaps proto-farmers to cover the period of the transition? Just a suggestion, it might help some people to understand that hunter-gatherers were not savages or unskilled.
Good gravy! Dr. Sheridan is a force of nature! She not only can add info on almost every topic in the show, she can also answer comments/questions from viewers unprompted by you guys, without skipping a beat. I don't doubt she can also change the oil in the car, read papers, and do this video chat simultaneously, without breaking a sweat. Amazing.
Shew is an old fashioned but very much legit word for show. Remember what TV personality Ed Sullivan use to say? "We have a really great shew tonight!"
Evidence of silk textile means there was weaving going on which implies a settled way of life where the weavers could set up and sit a while. Back strap weaving doesn’t require a weaving house, but I’d say expect that silk and silk spinning then weaving would. Book on the subject?
I lived in a Yupik village in Alaska for a couple years. This was on the Yukon River at the delta near the Bering Sea. The US government dedicated to building them modern homes in their villages some many years ago. The villages were already fixed locations however. The Yupik people are obligate hunter gatherers as agriculture is really impossible where they live. They don't pasture animals or cultivate any vegetables. Just pointing out that this situation happens, even in the modern world that has internet and Amazon shopping.
I am a hunter gather.. with fat fingers .I gather the best ingredients The only processed food is things like tomato passata from Italy and steamed beets from France . I shop in farm stores and stores that stock organic vegetables. This morning I listened to your podcast and now I see you on . RUclips ❤🎉❤ 🎉❤
If you wander into Toronto at any point, drop by the Bata Shoe Museum. The oldest shoe in their collection is dated at 5200 BP. I've met many people who were dragged into it reluctantly by a friend (usually a female friend), and emerged proclaiming it a wonderful experience ---- including myself.
I have only just come across your show. So sorry if you have you have already dealt with this but are you familiar with the work of Gammage ("The biggest estate") and or Pascoe ("Dark Emu"). The picture emerging in Australia seems to indicate that any idea of a hard and fast distinction between "hunter - gatherers" and farmers is (at best) misleading.
I don't know if the American celeb and TV variety show host, Ed Sullivan, was known in England back in the day, but after a brief intro he would lauch the happenings with "...and on with the sheeew!"😁 As an aside, in 1964 The Beatles did their first live U.S. performance on his show. It was, as one can imagine, a madhouse lol
Have visited many rock-cut tombs and dolmen in France and Spain: why don't they get more recognition? I guess the beauty of those in the Hebrides is that they have not been so ruined as those in the more populated areas of Europe ! Would love to hear more of the Archaeology around the Malaga area.
Alison is an absolute delight!!! You can hear the passion she has for her work when she speaks, and she shares her knowledge in such a clear and comprehensive way! Can't wait for her to come back :))))
Rupert, thanks for stating what has been true for a long time. If we study history ,no matter how far back we need to be aware of transposing our current Ideas about gender roles onto what we are seeing. Prior to the period of Paulinian Christianiity women and men had equal roles and contributed in society in the ways that best suited their talents in the magjority of societies.
Totally agree re sedentary hunting. Even today, we forage mushrooms, berries and nuts from the hedges and ppl in gun clubs hunt duck and cull deer every year and we are all living in permanent homes.
Dark Emu is a book by Bruce Pascoe about how the Australian Aborigines managed the land, aquaculture and just generally did their own version of 'farming'. I think you'd find the guys in Papua New Guinea would have similar stories.
I'm sorry I missed this month's live broadcast! I've been to the fantastic stones on Lewis....would love to go back! Look forward to seeing what they find in Stornoway Barb!
From the San Francisco Bay area in California: You guys are wonderful to listen to as i move around my home, cleaning and tidying. You're also great when I can sit here at my computer, relax and watch. Yay you guys! 🌻
In the American Southwest you can find small bowl shaped depressions in stone created by early people processing acorns. When the History Guys were visiting Gobekli Tepe you could see similar bowl shaped depressions all over the place. Add to that, I heard at one point that the area around Gobekli Tepe was an oak forest. I mention this because there is often a stress on how much meat the people there could harvest from the surrounding lands but I don't hear much about other foods and just how abundant the landscape actually was.
I love Twelfth Night and thought of the play when you mentioned Ilyria. Couldn't remember for sure if I remembered right so thanks for mentioning that.
I think the people of Göbleki Tepe were treating gazelles like modern Sami are doing reindeer. The reindeer live semi-wild out in the woods, but once a year they are all herded together and a number of them taken out.
The indigenous Australians were only ever hunter-gatherers: they managed fish and eel traps along the coast, and inland baked "bread" from ground seeds such as Spinifex (Aboriginal people used sophisticated fire-based techniques to manage grasslands and harvest grain. They collected the grain in bulk several times a year, then stored it in the off-season) or Wattle or similar, but they WEREN'T farmers !
Hello again from the SF Bay Area 6 months later, I'm still catching up. I love your conversations and I love Alison. She is like the Mary Beard of archeology, meant as a high compliment. I envy your access to these wonderful sites. In the US I have been to Chaco Canyon, Canyon Dechelly, and many of the national parks, but I have never been to the UK, much to my dismay.
This is may be as much of a mystery to our hosts as Flanders & Swann might be to an American, but there was a variety show presenter in the US during the sixties named Ed Sullivan. He played himself in the movie satirical musical "ByeBye Birdie", performing his number "Really Big Shoe": a self parody. So there is a precedent for this...
Notice the Australian version of the TV series "Alone" is not staged in Australia. This is because living off the land in Australia is incredibly hard. Pre European contact, Aboriginal people were ingenious beyond belief in scraping a living from the Australian environment. It is widely accepted that even "hunter gatherers" like Aboriginal Australians cultivated an environment to their advantage. "Firestick" forestry attracted wildlife to the tender green shoots of regrowth forest areas. More recently the floodplains of creeks are being studied to reveal they were cultivated to grow wild yam plants in specially constructed pits that trapped flood waters and fertile silt. Fishtraps made from loose rockwork barriers in rivers were also a means of securing a consistent supply of protein. The line between agriculture and hunting is very blurred.
Answering the title cold: Almost certainly. There are cartloads of assumptions I was taught about history as a child(60s-70s) that have fallen by the wayside. The biggest one is that ancient peoples were stupid or dim, 'primitive', not as smart as us modern folk. Whilst now it is more regularly recognised that they lacked knowledge. In his context its not a surprise that we constantly find archeology which surprises us about our ancestors. Gobleki Tepe being an iconic example.
I think Romeo and Juliet was set in Italy because then parents could say, "See. Look what happens when you act all disobediently! Nice English kids wouldn't ever act like that!" And Illiria is such a far off romantic name.
Come on Mike,sem..I. Really! Did David Wengrow sponsor this episode? His book is rather good on this subject...and RIP David Graeber while we're at it!
Çatalhöyük (pronounced shattle-hoyuk, not kattlehoyuk) became an agricultural city at its height (6500 BCE). It was only hunter-gatherer in the beginning.
Just found your channel and am really enjoying your videos! Thanks for highlighting such interesting discoveries! (And thanks for dismissing all this so called 'ritual burning' on sites!)
I console myself that I am a Hunter/Gatherer when I try to find food that my Coeliac, Gluten intolerant body will be able to eat these days without consequences!
Need to throughly read the Dutch paper. The recurrent problem with history and archaeology is that current points of view get inflicted on the past all too often. Its not surprising that an academic paper written in the current wokist times, might want to make such conclusions now in particular. In reality, all grave goods can tell you is what the people who buried the individual thought and what their (local) customs were at that time. Who knows how frequenctly or fast these changed in the past. You would need quite a large sample to do a statistical analysis of grave goods and even then it might be quite hard to draw any conclusions as its unlikely the society or all its members would have the same resources, ideas or even treasured possessions (something which we cant even try and identify with certainty). its all one bug hypothesis and that requires you use your imagination and make assumptions of what might have happened. If I was looking for evidence that gender roles were similar, the first place I'd look at would be skeletal remains, but even them it would be a guess because we'd have to assume how that socierty worked or assume it was similar to those few remaining today. The evidence left by muscles and weights on the skeleton would be very different from gathering and cooking. But even then would that be sufficent ? Hunting and tracking are skilled roles supported by a rather larger number of supporters to do the heavy lifting and carrying. Would the very skilled have to do the more menial work of bring water, collecting or chopping wood etc ? I suspect not.
In any small group people do what needs to be done. Patriarchal or matriarchal roll definitions are moronic in terms of survival mode. And even postulating stable living conditions, I doubt that talents were ignored in favor of (figurative) chest-thumping. As to being ‘woke’ remember ‘sticks and stones - ‘.
“Pushing back the boundaries…”? Nice to see you guys finally entertaining the possibility that what you were taught as inviolate history just MAY be riddled with giant fallacies.
Is there a link between the idea that pre- historic Hunter Gatherer societies were primitive and uncultured and the lies told by European slave traders, instigated I recently learned by the then King of Portugal, to try and justify the ill treatment of Black African slaves by representing them as less than human. This, I suspect, also fed into the misconceptions by early antiquaries about who built Stonehenge and Avebury etc. Any thoughts?
[Leibniz's contingency argument, clarified]: Ten whole, rational numbers 0-9 and their geometric counterparts 0D-9D. 0 and it's geometric counterpart 0D are: 1) whole 2) rational 3) not-natural (not-physical) 4) necessary 1-9 and their geometric counterparts 1D-9D are: 1) whole 2) rational 3) natural (physical) 4) contingent Newton says since 0 and 0D are "not-natural" ✅ then they are also "not-necessary" 🚫. Newton also says since 1-9 and 1D-9D are "natural" ✅ then they are also "necessary" 🚫. This is called "conflating" and is repeated throughout Newton's Calculus/Physics/Geometry/Logic. con·flate verb combine (two or more texts, ideas, etc.) into one. Leibniz does not make these fundamental mistakes. Leibniz's "Monadology" 📚 is zero and it's geometric counterpart zero-dimensional space. 0D Monad (SNF) 1D Line (WNF) 2D Plane (EMF) 3D Volume (GF) We should all be learning Leibniz's Calculus/Physics/Geometry/Logic. Fibonacci sequence starts with 0 for a reason. The Fibonacci triangle is 0, 1, 2 (Not 1, 2, 3). Newton's 1D-4D "natural ✅ = necessary 🚫" universe is a contradiction. Natural does not mean necessary. Similar, yet different. Not-natural just means no spatial extension; zero size; exact location only. Necessary. Newtonian nonsense will never provide a Theory of Everything. Leibniz's Law of Sufficient Reason helps a ton.
Hi Ken, Alison was saying that the evidence is unstable and the DNA is so well preserved that it seems more likely to be contamination. It will probably be a long time before we know either way with absolute certainty. Best wishes, Rupert
Does the presence of spears, knives, arrows etc in a grave necessarily indicate that the occupant used them in every day life? Could it be that these are gifts from their users? Perhaps an offering or sacrifice to the dead from the user and not actual evidence of female hunters or warriors? Maybe over time the tradition of including these items in the graves of men spread to all graves. Are these items ever found in the graves of children too young to use them?
One feature of arrows is that they are decorated with a purpose. In the hunt, there is often question as to who struck the fatal blow. Each warrior had a personal pattern of stripes, markings so that the score was known. If all the arrows in a tomb were identical, then it would be logical that they belonged to one person, the deceased. If all the warriors of the tribe contributed an arrow, then we'd expect none to be similar.
While fascinating on its own, this doesn't help. I'm trying to work out how anyone claiming to have found the grave of a female warrior or hunter can prove this without using grave goods.
@@ladoboyo5452 They usually study the bones for signs of appropriate injuries and muscle development. These techniques have been accepted when the bones have been assumed to be male...
The west coast natives did "farm" but not in the European way. They grew shellfish in coastal ponds, they grew berry bushes and useful trees near their communities. In fact a lot of the forests in the Americas were managed.
Wow that's awesome Lena your words is the words of wisdom.
that was the case in many areas. Looks like people in the amazonas region did gardening for thousands of years and left only the "terra preta" and some marks in the ground.
Lena, romans had fishponds and mussel farms, forest rasperry were managed, all forest were managed, north african oasis have a very complex managment. America was much later, isolated and suffered from genetic degenerative problems... America lacked the high IQ 1%.
It doomed the natives
@@808bigisland America was doomed by guns and greed and pestilence. Just like the Europeans and Britons were doomed by the discipline and technology of the Romans. Maybe if they had had higher IQs the romans wouldn't have run them over? Bigotry is ugly.
same with Hazel in Britain. We started to coppice them several thousand years ago for the nuts and wood. Hazel is much like Ash in that it doesnt need to be dried and will burn straight after felling.
Before I forget, many tribes trained their women in defense of the village. Imaging the men leaving on the hunt, and an enemy attacked the village, the women wouldn't just run about scream and shout, like the movies portrayed. Everyone in the village trained in some fashion, including kids.
To help with our understanding of the transition from hunter-gatherers to sedentary farming might I suggest that we adopt the phrase Pre-farmers or perhaps proto-farmers to cover the period of the transition? Just a suggestion, it might help some people to understand that hunter-gatherers were not savages or unskilled.
I’m at a loss that this channel doesn’t have 1.5M subs
Good gravy! Dr. Sheridan is a force of nature! She not only can add info on almost every topic in the show, she can also answer comments/questions from viewers unprompted by you guys, without skipping a beat. I don't doubt she can also change the oil in the car, read papers, and do this video chat simultaneously, without breaking a sweat. Amazing.
Prehistory News! Ha ha. That's exactly what I say when I visit my local antique shop. I run in and shout "what's new" and oh, how we laugh 😂
My ancestors lived in the great lakes area of North America and they farmed corn, squash and beans from the beginning. The are the Ho Chunk.
Shew is an old fashioned but very much legit word for show. Remember what TV personality Ed Sullivan use to say? "We have a really great shew tonight!"
Evidence of silk textile means there was weaving going on which implies a settled way of life where the weavers could set up and sit a while. Back strap weaving doesn’t require a weaving house, but I’d say expect that silk and silk spinning then weaving would. Book on the subject?
I lived in a Yupik village in Alaska for a couple years. This was on the Yukon River at the delta near the Bering Sea. The US government dedicated to building them modern homes in their villages some many years ago. The villages were already fixed locations however. The Yupik people are obligate hunter gatherers as agriculture is really impossible where they live. They don't pasture animals or cultivate any vegetables.
Just pointing out that this situation happens, even in the modern world that has internet and Amazon shopping.
Thank you for all you are and all you do.
btw, Alison is truly a treasure, a fount of knowledge...have her back again whenever possible!
As a hand stintch leather worker, I need a whole series of the Prehistory Shoe.
New listener as of today. Can't stay up for this live but will listen tomorrow.
Alison is amazing and has a sharp memory. You guys know some awesome people.
Most people, non archeology fascinated, would know Lewis for the Chessmen!
Alison is so clever and lovely… thank you all for a super show 🙏🏼🏴🥃🥃🥃🥃
I am a hunter gather.. with fat fingers .I gather the best ingredients
The only processed food is things like tomato passata from Italy and steamed beets from France . I shop in farm stores and stores that stock organic vegetables. This morning I listened to your podcast and now I see you on . RUclips ❤🎉❤ 🎉❤
How wonderful! An hour and 40 min! The marvels of video chat!
Ooops. Out visiting friends so missed live show. Good job its still here.
From Ottawa, Canada: Love you guys! Keep on keeping on!
If you wander into Toronto at any point, drop by the Bata Shoe Museum. The oldest shoe in their collection is dated at 5200 BP. I've met many people who were dragged into it reluctantly by a friend (usually a female friend), and emerged proclaiming it a wonderful experience ---- including myself.
I have only just come across your show. So sorry if you have you have already dealt with this but are you familiar with the work of Gammage ("The biggest estate") and or Pascoe ("Dark Emu"). The picture emerging in Australia seems to indicate that any idea of a hard and fast distinction between "hunter - gatherers" and farmers is (at best) misleading.
I don't know if the American celeb and TV variety show host, Ed Sullivan, was known in England back in the day, but after a brief intro he would lauch the happenings with "...and on with the sheeew!"😁
As an aside, in 1964 The Beatles did their first live U.S. performance on his show. It was, as one can imagine, a madhouse lol
Have visited many rock-cut tombs and dolmen in France and Spain: why don't they get more recognition? I guess the beauty of those in the Hebrides is that they have not been so ruined as those in the more populated areas of Europe ! Would love to hear more of the Archaeology around the Malaga area.
Alison is an absolute delight!!! You can hear the passion she has for her work when she speaks, and she shares her knowledge in such a clear and comprehensive way! Can't wait for her to come back :))))
NICE WORK BOTH OF YOU. PLEASE KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK ESPECIALLY 'NEWS IN THE WORLD OF ARCHAEOLOGY' PODCASTS. THANKS.
Rupert, thanks for stating what has been true for a long time. If we study history ,no matter how far back we need to be aware of transposing our current Ideas about gender roles onto what we are seeing. Prior to the period of Paulinian Christianiity women and men had equal roles and contributed in society in the ways that best suited their talents in the magjority of societies.
I noticed when I was 5 that when you
Spit watermelon seeds in the garden you will grow watermelons. I was 5 so hunter gatherers shurley knew this
Totally agree re sedentary hunting. Even today, we forage mushrooms, berries and nuts from the hedges and ppl in gun clubs hunt duck and cull deer every year and we are all living in permanent homes.
Dark Emu is a book by Bruce Pascoe about how the Australian Aborigines managed the land, aquaculture and just generally did their own version of 'farming'. I think you'd find the guys in Papua New Guinea would have similar stories.
Best yet! Again! I love that Rupert forms a cogent argument while delivering it with a "so f*!k you" tone. :-) 😀
Great show as always and thank you Alison for joining us.🙏 I can’t comment on my phone during a live show
I'm sorry I missed this month's live broadcast! I've been to the fantastic stones on Lewis....would love to go back! Look forward to seeing what they find in Stornoway
Barb!
Content begins at 10:20.
Thank ou.
A good deal of Appalacian Americans supplement their living with hunting and gathering and are quite settled.
Always love seeing Alison Sheridan. Thanks, Guys and Alison.
Excellent show as always, guys:) Alison is fascinating and a font of knowledge...would love to have her featured again:)
From the San Francisco Bay area in California: You guys are wonderful to listen to as i move around my home, cleaning and tidying. You're also great when I can sit here at my computer, relax and watch. Yay you guys! 🌻
Hunter gathering was probably the most successful lifestyle in human history.
Giggling is so contagious. 😂
Love your content love your interactions love your guests love the information I gain from watching..👍✌️
In the American Southwest you can find small bowl shaped depressions in stone created by early people processing acorns. When the History Guys were visiting Gobekli Tepe you could see similar bowl shaped depressions all over the place. Add to that, I heard at one point that the area around Gobekli Tepe was an oak forest. I mention this because there is often a stress on how much meat the people there could harvest from the surrounding lands but I don't hear much about other foods and just how abundant the landscape actually was.
I love Twelfth Night and thought of the play when you mentioned Ilyria. Couldn't remember for sure if I remembered right so thanks for mentioning that.
I think the people of Göbleki Tepe were treating gazelles like modern Sami are doing reindeer. The reindeer live semi-wild out in the woods, but once a year they are all herded together and a number of them taken out.
I have long insisted that we had to learn how to farm BEFORE we would settle down somewhere & farm!
The indigenous Australians were only ever hunter-gatherers: they managed fish and eel traps along the coast, and inland baked "bread" from ground seeds such as Spinifex (Aboriginal people used sophisticated fire-based techniques to manage grasslands and harvest grain. They collected the grain in bulk several times a year, then stored it in the off-season) or Wattle or similar, but they WEREN'T farmers !
I’m so sorry I missed the live , you guys have such a lovely guest as usual, and fun to boot !
All the best Jules
Love these shows guys. Fascinating and great fun. Thanks very much.
Delightful hearing you guys, and especially Alison!
Hello again from the SF Bay Area 6 months later, I'm still catching up. I love your conversations and I love Alison. She is like the Mary Beard of archeology, meant as a high compliment. I envy your access to these wonderful sites. In the US I have been to Chaco Canyon, Canyon Dechelly, and many of the national parks, but I have never been to the UK, much to my dismay.
This is may be as much of a mystery to our hosts as Flanders & Swann might be to an American, but there was a variety show presenter in the US during the sixties named Ed Sullivan.
He played himself in the movie satirical musical "ByeBye Birdie", performing his number "Really Big Shoe": a self parody.
So there is a precedent for this...
Love this format. Great show!
Thanks!
Thanks so much Kathleen!!
Notice the Australian version of the TV series "Alone" is not staged in Australia. This is because living off the land in Australia is incredibly hard.
Pre European contact, Aboriginal people were ingenious beyond belief in scraping a living from the Australian environment.
It is widely accepted that even "hunter gatherers" like Aboriginal Australians cultivated an environment to their advantage.
"Firestick" forestry attracted wildlife to the tender green shoots of regrowth forest areas.
More recently the floodplains of creeks are being studied to reveal they were cultivated to grow wild yam plants in specially constructed pits that trapped flood waters and fertile silt.
Fishtraps made from loose rockwork barriers in rivers were also a means of securing a consistent supply of protein.
The line between agriculture and hunting is very blurred.
You should have a talk with the Megalith Hunter channel some day. She specialises in Malta. Quite interesting place.
"Henge "is defined in the 1983 edition of Chambers' 20th Century Dictionary as having an internal ditch. So perhaps not Tim Darvell's fault?
Answering the title cold: Almost certainly. There are cartloads of assumptions I was taught about history as a child(60s-70s) that have fallen by the wayside. The biggest one is that ancient peoples were stupid or dim, 'primitive', not as smart as us modern folk. Whilst now it is more regularly recognised that they lacked knowledge.
In his context its not a surprise that we constantly find archeology which surprises us about our ancestors. Gobleki Tepe being an iconic example.
Great talk!
So. Lake Tahoe California, US. Just chiming in. Carry on.
I think Romeo and Juliet was set in Italy because then parents could say, "See. Look what happens when you act all disobediently! Nice English kids wouldn't ever act like that!" And Illiria is such a far off romantic name.
Love the interaction relaxed reality, next best thing to chatting in a pub.
Another wonderful time with Prehistory Guy’s and Alison! One of my favorite guests.❤
Looking forward to the Q&A on Aug 18th. Stay cool boy’s
Come on Mike,sem..I. Really!
Did David Wengrow sponsor this episode? His book is rather good on this subject...and RIP David Graeber while we're at it!
Çatalhöyük (pronounced shattle-hoyuk, not kattlehoyuk) became an agricultural city at its height (6500 BCE). It was only hunter-gatherer in the beginning.
You guys are hilarious and yet, informative!
Just found your channel and am really enjoying your videos! Thanks for highlighting such interesting discoveries! (And thanks for dismissing all this so called 'ritual burning' on sites!)
Perhaps specialists were developing. This would make the society more efficient and allow time for these other activities.
Woke it, Braddah! Tanks, e!
Atlanta, Georgia. Love your show!
As an American, you guys make me wonder if Midsomer Murders isn’t more reaslistic than than most Brits let on.
I console myself that I am a Hunter/Gatherer when I try to find food that my Coeliac, Gluten intolerant body will be able to eat these days without consequences!
nice you do the premil i didnt even get a notification lol
youtube has that happen too
Need to throughly read the Dutch paper. The recurrent problem with history and archaeology is that current points of view get inflicted on the past all too often. Its not surprising that an academic paper written in the current wokist times, might want to make such conclusions now in particular.
In reality, all grave goods can tell you is what the people who buried the individual thought and what their (local) customs were at that time. Who knows how frequenctly or fast these changed in the past. You would need quite a large sample to do a statistical analysis of grave goods and even then it might be quite hard to draw any conclusions as its unlikely the society or all its members would have the same resources, ideas or even treasured possessions (something which we cant even try and identify with certainty). its all one bug hypothesis and that requires you use your imagination and make assumptions of what might have happened.
If I was looking for evidence that gender roles were similar, the first place I'd look at would be skeletal remains, but even them it would be a guess because we'd have to assume how that socierty worked or assume it was similar to those few remaining today. The evidence left by muscles and weights on the skeleton would be very different from gathering and cooking.
But even then would that be sufficent ? Hunting and tracking are skilled roles supported by a rather larger number of supporters to do the heavy lifting and carrying. Would the very skilled have to do the more menial work of bring water, collecting or chopping wood etc ? I suspect not.
(Hopefully) I'm off to see the Ness of Brodgar next February.
We are still hunter gatherers, even if we don't follow the same customs.
Was watching live earlier but then missed it cause am toilet training my youngest and stood in his poo!💩
Best of luck on the training endeavor!😊💚
Been quite some time since I had to do that. I remember the celebrations upon success 😂
@@kariannecrysler640 thanks. I need all the luck I can get. It was simultaneously disgusting and hilarious 😂
lock into the Sami people and the Nenets if you wunder abour HG...
Hello from Japan
Anyone who tries to be rude to you when you call oat misogyny, speaks volumes to the backward and dangerous people we have to deal with.
prehistory shoe is a great idea - and a possibility to capitalise on occasional mistakes…
You can walk to Waylands Smithy from Ivanhoe beacon, there's a footpath all the way.
The Gravettian burial with the guy with his hand on others pelvis which has ochre on it may mean he can not or should not mate or dont mate with him
In any small group people do what needs to be done. Patriarchal or matriarchal roll definitions are moronic in terms of survival mode. And even postulating stable living conditions, I doubt that talents were ignored in favor of (figurative) chest-thumping. As to being ‘woke’ remember ‘sticks and stones - ‘.
And what shall I do in Illyria? My brother, he is in Elysium. Perhaps he is not dead. What say you, sailor?
5050Thanks!
Thanks so much Brownie!!!
“Pushing back the boundaries…”? Nice to see you guys finally entertaining the possibility that what you were taught as inviolate history just MAY be riddled with giant fallacies.
Is there a link between the idea that pre- historic Hunter Gatherer societies were primitive and uncultured and the lies told by European slave traders, instigated I recently learned by the then King of Portugal, to try and justify the ill treatment of Black African slaves by representing them as less than human. This, I suspect, also fed into the misconceptions by early antiquaries about who built Stonehenge and Avebury etc. Any thoughts?
59% WHG same dna profile almost as Cheddar man.. :) We still exist....
Dark isle Piper: Siubhail (Original) ☘️🚬☕️✌️
I’m sure that it wasn’t either or no doubt the hunters were farming too
Better woke than oblivious, eh. 😊
So only trilithons are actually 'henges'!
Pfft. They lived where the food was.. Hunter GATHERERS
[Leibniz's contingency argument, clarified]:
Ten whole, rational numbers 0-9 and their geometric counterparts 0D-9D.
0 and it's geometric counterpart 0D are:
1) whole
2) rational
3) not-natural (not-physical)
4) necessary
1-9 and their geometric counterparts 1D-9D are:
1) whole
2) rational
3) natural (physical)
4) contingent
Newton says since 0 and 0D are
"not-natural" ✅
then they are also
"not-necessary" 🚫.
Newton also says since 1-9 and 1D-9D are "natural" ✅
then they are also
"necessary" 🚫.
This is called "conflating" and is repeated throughout Newton's Calculus/Physics/Geometry/Logic.
con·flate
verb
combine (two or more texts, ideas, etc.) into one.
Leibniz does not make these fundamental mistakes.
Leibniz's "Monadology" 📚 is zero and it's geometric counterpart zero-dimensional space.
0D Monad (SNF)
1D Line (WNF)
2D Plane (EMF)
3D Volume (GF)
We should all be learning Leibniz's Calculus/Physics/Geometry/Logic.
Fibonacci sequence starts with 0 for a reason. The Fibonacci triangle is 0, 1, 2 (Not 1, 2, 3).
Newton's 1D-4D "natural ✅ =
necessary 🚫" universe is a contradiction.
Natural does not mean necessary. Similar, yet different.
Not-natural just means no spatial extension; zero size; exact location only. Necessary.
Newtonian nonsense will never provide a Theory of Everything.
Leibniz's Law of Sufficient Reason helps a ton.
Socks !
Ya, cause so many women have caught battles and hunted throughout history. Give me a break.rhumbs diwn
LPleas
So where DID the Isle of Wight grain come from? It was clearly associated with a Mesolithic site.
Hi Ken, Alison was saying that the evidence is unstable and the DNA is so well preserved that it seems more likely to be contamination. It will probably be a long time before we know either way with absolute certainty. Best wishes, Rupert
@@ThePrehistoryGuys thanks Rupert, great presentation by the way, look forward to more on the mesolithic, fascinating era for me.
Does the presence of spears, knives, arrows etc in a grave necessarily indicate that the occupant used them in every day life? Could it be that these are gifts from their users? Perhaps an offering or sacrifice to the dead from the user and not actual evidence of female hunters or warriors? Maybe over time the tradition of including these items in the graves of men spread to all graves. Are these items ever found in the graves of children too young to use them?
One feature of arrows is that they are decorated with a purpose. In the hunt, there is often question as to who struck the fatal blow. Each warrior had a personal pattern of stripes, markings so that the score was known. If all the arrows in a tomb were identical, then it would be logical that they belonged to one person, the deceased. If all the warriors of the tribe contributed an arrow, then we'd expect none to be similar.
While fascinating on its own, this doesn't help. I'm trying to work out how anyone claiming to have found the grave of a female warrior or hunter can prove this without using grave goods.
@@ladoboyo5452 They usually study the bones for signs of appropriate injuries and muscle development. These techniques have been accepted when the bones have been assumed to be male...
Yet whenever we hear about a female hunter / warrior being found only the grave goods are mentioned as proof. Weird no?
@@ladoboyo5452 DNA