Yeah, way more than other instruments I think. Weirdly drummers are more up for trying new stuff, and I think it's because we're already playing several different instruments at once, with limbs that have different ergonomics and abilities. So there is a natural progression to borrow and swap aspects of each instrument. You can hit so many things and get so many different responses... There's only so many ways a string can interact with a pickup at the end of the day. But even in terms of setup and technique... That is why drums stay fresh to me even though I'm professionally a bassist
These approaches all seem to come from hip-hop, and be an adaptation to the typical exceedingly busy, highly syncopated drum patterns. With so many notes, you want a really fast decay so the sounds stay distinct, and don't walk on each other or on anything else. The kits are also optimized for beats and fills that are all super-fast kick, snare and hi-hat, with very little in the way of toms or conventional ride or crash cymbals.
The hidden stack was used by Billy Ward over a decade ago. He used a crash cymbal and a ride on the top, and he used an x-hat attatchment to mount them. Realy cool sound.
There's a video of billy higgins doing something similar in the 70s. To his left, it looked like a stacked, riveted china and crash, sounded like a modern trash.
I switched my setup to a Bill Bruford style ambidextrous setup. Two toms on the left, hats in the center, two toms on the right (18/12/HATS/10/16) and it’s completely changed the way I approach the kit. I absolutely love never having to cross my hands over each other to hit anything, I can play right or left hand lead on a whim and I rarely ever have to reach super far for anything. I’d be hard pressed to ever go back unless I absolutely have to. I highly recommend trying it out!
I’ve used this setup as well and honestly it makes life so much easier. I started to put a ride a little higher above the central hi hat so I can play either hand.
@@ProfessionalsProfessional oh that’s wild! Was it comfortable? I have my China sitting above my hats (think Ray Luzier) but I never considered moving the ride! Might have to give that a go next time I’m feeling squirrelly 🤔
@@JRMelancona central ride and hi hat configuration has helped increased my ambidextrous technique, prevented me from ever crossing over for fills, and makes fills more creative. There’s a video of an extremely underrated drummer name Louie Palmer on RUclips. He experimented with the set up of a central ride and hi hat.
I have a combo set up of his UK era kit and a billy cobham style mega set but set in bills style. if you do what billy does and add a ride and china to your left arm it really makes life easy if you can swap lead hands
Cymbal stacks seem to emulate the classic electronic cymbal sounds - an acoustic alternative to the electronic original, which was itself the best those old electronics could do to imitate the acoustic original. It's kind of genius! Fads or not, I like seeing people experimenting outside the norms of kit setup. In my misspent youth, I played around with setups a lot trying to see if something other than the standards would work for me, and these drummers are taking it even further than I did. Good for them!
Peart did alla that in the 90s... floor toms on the left, timbales for snares, an extra half-closed high-hat on his right, splashes on top of chinas, de-tuned toms. Props to all of the artists you feature, mind blowing chops, esp Jarris at 11:50 cuz wow that's bionic Buddy level heat.
Clean would also have the flor tom between his legs next to his snare or his snare to the side the paper on toms/snare was definitely a thing from the 70s too in order to add some high end to the kit from the source instead of adding it via EQ in post especially on the snare.
The one I don't get, and I have seen it become more popular, is the tilting the crashes away from you. That's a good way to shorten their life and your sticks. I guess it's an extension of positioning crashes flat which was popular with rock drummers in the 80's.
The paper on toms sure looks like "everything old is new again." 45-50 years ago severely muffling your drums was mainstream. My method was tissue paper folded under a strip of duct tape, sometimes two of those on a drum. Dead city! Though for some I believe it was to cover for the inability to properly tune their drums (right here, dude). Neil Peart even said in an interview he used more muffling in the beginning when he wasn't as good at tuning, and less as time went on until he got to none. Also heard the "unfolded wallet to deaden snare" from my dad, who was a musician in the mid 60s to mid 70s. The smack stack sounds like a Simmons clap from the 80s to me. Finally a way to emulate that electric sound acoustically. And let's not forget the "set your ride cymbal insanely high and (nearly if not exactly) 90 degrees to the floor" fad. Tried for about five minutes one day, and that was that... 👍😗
None of these really do much for me, but I appreciate the innovative spirit. We wouldn't have hi-hats if it weren't for that. Who knows, maybe I'll like dead-muted toms in five more years.
I used to use the flipped rack Toms (a la Anika Niles) and used a popcorn snare as the high snom. It was a really fun setup that I only stopped doing to get used to shared back lines for gigs
I got into drum restoration/building a while back and ended up with about 6 different kits. At the time, I was in a band that gigged regularly and there was nothing more fun to me than first, deciding which kit to bring (my jungle kit with the converted floor tom bass; the Ludwig Vistalite "jellybean" kit; my custom-wrapped band-name branded kit, etc.) THEN deciding if I was going with a traditional 3-piece set-up or something with an offset tom or adding a snom, etc. THEN I also got to decide which cymbals I wanted (loud and bright, dark and "quieter"; how many stacks; riveted ride or 24" Oriental Crash of Doom, etc.). Experimenting with set-up is a great way to improve your coordination (things aren't where you've gotten used to them, so you have to build new muscle memory and maybe even change up how you play certain fills, etc.) and give yourself a fun challenge.
Great vid, Nate. When I put my kit together, in my zeal I bought multiple ride cymbals trying to find the one I liked. And then I just tried them on both sides of the kit. multiple rides... doubt it becomes a trend, but like multiple hats in the 80's/90's (replaced by the trash stack today), but it's definitely fun opening up opportunities to strengthen my off-hand by 'riding' on the wrong side of the kit.
@@SashraanMusic thank you for that. Great insight. Since I play traditional grip and am a rank amateur with a weak off hand, just using the 2nd ride for accents in trad. Hi-hat grooves is a lot of fun. Mine is a 20” paiste rude crash/ride which is much darker than my 900 series 22” ride. Great contrast in bells,etc. Drums are so much fun this way
I've got 4 dedicated rides on my kit 😂 and I just recently bought and fixed a sweet cracked 20" Zildjian projection crash. It's so heavy, I think it works better as a ride than a crash, so that might be number 5 🙄🤷♂️
@@ThomasLuongo 😂 I hear that.... I have a ton of cymbals and stacks on my kit, and they all sound different. If I had the room, I'd probably have all the tom sizes, too....
I love the sound of the hidden stacks, I have often wondered how they achieved that sound, so it is great to know how they did it. Thank you for that insight. Zach is a great drummer, and I enjoy the sounds he gets on his kits. With the deadened toms, I actually like that sound but I don't want to tape things to my drums so I will look at alternative ways to get that sound. The groove you did on the segment with detuned snares in place of toms was really spicy. All the grooves you played were really cool. Thank you for the transcription. I think the smack stack sounds amazing, and I do believe smack stacks are here to stay. While everyone may not use them, I believe they will be around for many years to come. Thanks for the great video and useful information Nate.
Tips for using smack stacks, tighten the wingnuts cause they solidify the sound of the stack. Also,with the snom or deep snare position it between your left rack tom and your floor tom. This coming from a kid who’s met JD, Cleon, and Mike and knows them all to well
i have a rather unsual setup myself. i play the bassdrum on the left with lefty double pedals. tucked in Hi-hats feet with a bassrum clamp. like this the bassdrum doesn't interfere with the toms setup. my toms are super close to each others and i have a nice reach. i have more space for my cymbals as well. so, instead of having the 10 in front of me i have the 12 (even slightly on the left). 16 floor tom is right on the right of the bassdrum. but it becomes more reachable as it is more at the front. so comfy. everything is packed tight and easily reachable. i'll never go back to conventionnel setup.
I used to put a piece of paper sometimes on my snare, when I first started on my westbury kit many years ago. It sounded fat and didn't ring at all. Kinda found it from putting my written sheet music on it. Awesome video!
Same here. 1978, 4th grade, first year of learning snare drum. Probably the first day I took it home. Seems like a natural instinct for any elementary school concert band drummer.
Hey, I did #3 when I was starting because some fills were too fast for me to move between the high tom (in the traditional position) and the floor tom... back then I didn't even know there was a "right" or "traditional" way of positioning the rack tom 🤷♂️
Nate, Well done as usual. After experimenting with playing open handed for a number of years, I bought a cable high hat and place it in between the rack tom & the ride. Game changer.
Great run through! The hidden stack, I love it. Not fully convinced by right skewed rack toms, unless toms are down prioritized in orchestration. Seems you get lots of torso rotation/ asymmetric ergonomics. Keep up the great vids!
The paper trick could be fantastic in the studio, I have a favorite set of crappy old kitchen aprons that absolutely nail the Ringo "tea towel" sound, but are big enough to cover my 16" floor tom and have built in tie downs!
Hey first time I saw one of your videos. You mentioned your "beloved Brady". I live in the town that Brady Drums come from (Perth, Western Australia) and I too have a beloved Brady snare drum. Mine is a she-oak (local timber) block 14 x 5.5. I got it about 15 years ago,
The set up that works best for you is what matters most The trend that works best for me is daily practice and discipline That trend will never go out of style
It would have been nice that you should have mentioned the inventor drummer Trevor Lawrence of the clap stack is where it started and then companies started to make a version of it with there brand and so it grew from there .....
I think some things are great from an odd sound aspect, but I also think that some of the trends are people trying to make the odd noises that we used to have on electronic kits way way back. Cymbal stacks are to me something that Terry Bozzio started, and have stuck. Love the white noise sound of them, and I use two old cracked cymbals (one old china, and an old hi-hat) as a great smash! AS far as some of the other objects, It's just a way to make an odd sound, and not a mainstream way of doing things... whatever floats your boat. MY issue is the trend of the cymbals with holes in them! I've tapped on them at drum shops, and see nothing musical about them! I LOVE the sound off a cymbal that has a tone to it, not a cymbal that has 10 holes in it, and is dead! Drum tuning will always be a personal thing, and to each his own! Great video, thanks!
Nice video, always interesting so think of different ways you could setup. I live in a large city and space is almost always limited, ideas are good. Also, Nate, your playing is now just getting better by the minute! I’ll try to pinpoint what I’m hearing : it’s more articulation, intent, so your grooves, fills, solos have more definition and clarity. Very cool!
News Paper was often used in the studio, mainly in the 50's. Good for a few tracks and then will need replacing. I would be interested in hearing different tunings on Diplomats.
While it's a nice way to open up non-jazz drummers as to what trends are going on there, as for drumming as a whole, my verdicts would as such: The hidden stacks: Trend, mainly as it's accessible enough for the drummer that can buy their own gear as it really depends on experimentation and preference. That, and stacks as a whole is more common nowadays where companies have been selling stacks as a whole instead of you finding each individual cymbal for your stack. Well, the Max-Stack can have the same applied. It's more common as it's a unique sound and sometimes front and center. Odd-Tom Mounting: Fad, mainly because it purely comes down to the drummer. It's definitely more common amongst experimental drummers, but there's trade-offs with this. It might get more popular later on, but for drumming as a whole, it's definitely niche. Toy-Toms: Fad, mainly because it's very niche and a very specific sound. Approachable, but it's too specific of a sound. Snoms: Fab, mainly because of its usage being very niche. But, I definitely would recommend Thomas Lang with his setups and him converting a 14" floor tom to a snom for that big thudy smack with the snare wires turned on. And, with all of these, these fads can eventually become more common as a lot of these are experimenting with the set, with some creating that unique sound/usage as I know I want some stacks and a snom for my set (and a mounted bass drum to act similar to a gong drum/play bass drum patterns with both hands and feet). But yeah, thanks for the video!
Haven’t listened to your playing in a while…DANG - you are improving quickly, in my opinion. That lick at around 4:30 was fat and meaty at the same time.
Made me think of and old trend of the floor toms that you could pitch change like a timpani. Also I remember that low muted sound was pretty popular in the early 80's.
The dead tom thing used to be a necessity when I was 13 playing in bands. Except, I jammed clothes or bed sheets inside. Think of it as a glorified laundry drum.
As long as it works while using other people to inspire creativity, then I'm all for it. No big harm but rather a benefit to drums and percussion overall.
I've been playing around with the Purdie setup lately, high tom being on the right side of the rack. It's definitely different but fun to keep things fresh!
I also tried the Purdie ride cymbal up high over the hats but it's not for me. It's fun to experiment. We'll never know what might work for us without trying it. Like two 16 crashes as hats and two bass drums, a 22 and a 20 because I have 3 standard drumsets. It cost nothing extra to experiment but that's rehearsal, I haven't gigged with this.Its a different thing.
another fad I’ve seen is drummers putting a small cymbal (maybe and fx or china? ) underneath their regular hihats, making for a slightly more trashy hihat sound altogether
Got a remote hat on the right side of my snare, operated with my left foot, because I was too lazy to learn to play left handed and didn’t want to cross over. Then sent my toms trailing to the left. Folks thought I was left handed.
I think any acoustic approximation of electronic drums is infinitely novel. Definitely want a meinl smack stack.. But have you tried the PST X DJ's 45 Hats? Daru Jones 12" interchangable hats but when you close them it sounds like that exact clap (Swiss cymbal as the top, black cymbal as the bottom). I have them right next to my regular hats. They are different cuz your foot has to create the sound, not your hand but its crazy how close they sound. You should try them out
I use Roots EQ pads on all my drums instead of paper. They’re made out of fabric so they don’t break, and they supply that super dead 70’s vibe. V cool stuff 🤙
Snoms...meh. I love toms and one can get scads of sounds out of one well tuned snare. I wouldn't want another snare lower ruining the tom sounds i adore, but rather piccolo and popcorn snares over on the left taking over no tom positions with tones substantially different for little melody things as I'm not just a drummer but all around musician and song writer and singer. I dig stacks, but as you I'd prefer a set of traditional cymbals with a couple of stacks one somewhere right and the other left. As Neil Peart and Danny Carey are two of my favorite drummers I dream of a kit with room for all the options, but it's perfect for my present training level to stick to the 4 piece Ringo style, Max Roach, Gene Krupa, Buddy Rich traditional kit with a few trashy things mixed in. The drum kit has the most diverse collection of instruments in the whole of the world of music at least in acoustic instruments. While music lives and breathes and calls our names to the party the search for new, or old but so long forgotten they're new again sounds never ends. I dig the adaptability of the drum kit for the space to try out all these ideas. Hand clap sound with acoustic instruments, hey why not? I just don't want a whole kit of snare drums cause I love the tom tom boom the most of all. I mean, the Peart Carey idea includes a gong drum in the right rear position...YEAH! and a real gong too! I dig that kind of thing. And then some digital pads, pedals and things cause I love the galaxy of different tones those drummers get from one person playing lots of objects.
I really dig diverse sounds and I really despise the use of backing tracks in 'live' music outside karaoke bars. Thus the options I dream of one day bringing into my kit so, like Carey and Peart I play or trigger the start of every prerecorded decoration, nothing fundamental like a bass line ever prefab so that it's actually live and not just humans miming to a robot master.
I'm like you, I play (jazz) on a Breakbeats 4-piece and 2 ride cymbals, but I do like LOOKING and hearing weird set ups. Whatever works for people. I like JoJo Mayer's current kit set up for Nerve.
How about putting tone controls back into drums to get all that dead? Most of us have used snares as Toms at some point, anyone ever used a Tom as a Snare? I converted my 14" FT into a deep snare! Does anyone still flip their cymbals? Chain on their Cymbals and Hats?
I use a 12" wuhan china combined with a 10" K splash stack and it does work great to mimic a hand clap type sound on the upbeat sometimes, as well as working in quick trashy accents for fills.
1: If you want a short china like attack with less sustain, and you don't want the classical overtones of a china, it works. It's a good idea. 2: Commonly used in reggae since the 70'es. Not a "new trend". I don't personally like it, but whatever floats your boat, I guess. 3: Not a "practical" set up if you want to use your toms freely, but it adds more space to cymbals, stacks and percussion in an easier accessible position. A lot of drummers don't use a lot of toms, so for them I guess it's okay. Not for me. 4: I don't see how a drum that's obviously not a tom and obviously not a snare could have any place in a kit. I don't like the sound of the snom and I don't see any practical use for it. But it is a flavor, just like the stack cymbals or the cymbal/tom stack. I personally hate it with passion. 5: Smack stacks / clap stacks are cool. I see and understand the implementation and the use. I think / hope they're here to stay. I usually don't like the sound of Meinl cymbals, but that stack that you have there sounds really good. Thumbs up! Conclusion: These "trends" or "fads" are often just personal preferences - like spices and herbs in your food. Some of them might be a little too inventive for the masses, but everything that can bring some extra life or flare into your drumming is good - if it's used musically.
The muted toms is totally the Jojo Mayer, the commercial version is probably Big Fat Snare Drum open centers for the toms. i have them for even a Bonham kit.
i made a snare/tom once when my friend took the snare without telling me, and i still wanted to play drums. i had an extra snare wire and duct taped it to the bottom of one of my two rack toms, and it worked great. so, yeah, i would do that again, but literally only out of necessity. never calling it a fucking snom, tho, that shit is silly.
Man everytime i play and other drummers see me, they get confused as fuck Im a righty, but i set the drums as a lefty. Hi hats get played with my right hand, snare with left hand, but cymbals (minus hi hats) are setup as a righty That, and i like to get an extra floor tom to the right of hi hats Oh yeah, bass drum with left foot - give it a go big pimpin!
you do know that this stuff is all about training the brain to pathways and patterns. In other words, it's not about most efficient or effective, it's about a learned pattern. As artists we focus on what works for us in our expression.
8:50 not the hippest drummer, but Joules Scott Key from Metric has had effectively the same set up since 2001 and I just don't get it. sometimes he has a sampler where a high tom would typically be for their newer stuff, but for the longest time he just didn't have anything there. and he still uses three cymbals. I don't get it, but to each their own I guess
interesting. i prefer the sound of the toms better with the paper taped on. if someone wanted to keep it like that, they could experiment with taping the paper to the underside of the head
One of the great things about our instrument is that it's continually evolving and changing physically.
Yeah, way more than other instruments I think. Weirdly drummers are more up for trying new stuff, and I think it's because we're already playing several different instruments at once, with limbs that have different ergonomics and abilities. So there is a natural progression to borrow and swap aspects of each instrument. You can hit so many things and get so many different responses... There's only so many ways a string can interact with a pickup at the end of the day. But even in terms of setup and technique... That is why drums stay fresh to me even though I'm professionally a bassist
and yet, not at all.
It’s the only instrument that does, isn’t it?
The irony of this incredibly simple instrument being so unlimited.
@@morbidmanmusicoh, very Zen! 👍
These approaches all seem to come from hip-hop, and be an adaptation to the typical exceedingly busy, highly syncopated drum patterns. With so many notes, you want a really fast decay so the sounds stay distinct, and don't walk on each other or on anything else. The kits are also optimized for beats and fills that are all super-fast kick, snare and hi-hat, with very little in the way of toms or conventional ride or crash cymbals.
We did a lot of this during the 60's when everyone and their Dog started a Band but couldn't afford descent gear.
The hidden stack was used by Billy Ward over a decade ago. He used a crash cymbal and a ride on the top, and he used an x-hat attatchment to mount them. Realy cool sound.
There's a video of billy higgins doing something similar in the 70s. To his left, it looked like a stacked, riveted china and crash, sounded like a modern trash.
I switched my setup to a Bill Bruford style ambidextrous setup. Two toms on the left, hats in the center, two toms on the right (18/12/HATS/10/16) and it’s completely changed the way I approach the kit. I absolutely love never having to cross my hands over each other to hit anything, I can play right or left hand lead on a whim and I rarely ever have to reach super far for anything. I’d be hard pressed to ever go back unless I absolutely have to.
I highly recommend trying it out!
It's like a first baseman not having to reach across the base runner's path.
His setup with King Crimson in the 80's was killer.
I’ve used this setup as well and honestly it makes life so much easier. I started to put a ride a little higher above the central hi hat so I can play either hand.
@@ProfessionalsProfessional oh that’s wild! Was it comfortable? I have my China sitting above my hats (think Ray Luzier) but I never considered moving the ride! Might have to give that a go next time I’m feeling squirrelly 🤔
@@JRMelancona central ride and hi hat configuration has helped increased my ambidextrous technique, prevented me from ever crossing over for fills, and makes fills more creative. There’s a video of an extremely underrated drummer name Louie Palmer on RUclips. He experimented with the set up of a central ride and hi hat.
I have a combo set up of his UK era kit and a billy cobham style mega set but set in bills style. if you do what billy does and add a ride and china to your left arm it really makes life easy if you can swap lead hands
Cymbal stacks seem to emulate the classic electronic cymbal sounds - an acoustic alternative to the electronic original, which was itself the best those old electronics could do to imitate the acoustic original. It's kind of genius! Fads or not, I like seeing people experimenting outside the norms of kit setup. In my misspent youth, I played around with setups a lot trying to see if something other than the standards would work for me, and these drummers are taking it even further than I did. Good for them!
Interesting take on that.
Peart did alla that in the 90s... floor toms on the left, timbales for snares, an extra half-closed high-hat on his right, splashes on top of chinas, de-tuned toms. Props to all of the artists you feature, mind blowing chops, esp Jarris at 11:50 cuz wow that's bionic Buddy level heat.
Rogers did it in the 60's, with the Timbale Twin kit. Double bass drums with a pair of timbales between them instead of toms.
The hidden stack is an old 80s thing of putting splashes under crashes... not exactly a new thing. We also did it in pit band.
Clean would also have the flor tom between his legs next to his snare or his snare to the side
the paper on toms/snare was definitely a thing from the 70s too in order to add some high end to the kit from the source instead of adding it via EQ in post especially on the snare.
The one I don't get, and I have seen it become more popular, is the tilting the crashes away from you. That's a good way to shorten their life and your sticks. I guess it's an extension of positioning crashes flat which was popular with rock drummers in the 80's.
Agree with you 100%, don't understand at all...
And the life of your crashes.
Benny Greb was the first person I have seen do the stealth stack thing.
The paper on toms sure looks like "everything old is new again." 45-50 years ago severely muffling your drums was mainstream. My method was tissue paper folded under a strip of duct tape, sometimes two of those on a drum. Dead city! Though for some I believe it was to cover for the inability to properly tune their drums (right here, dude). Neil Peart even said in an interview he used more muffling in the beginning when he wasn't as good at tuning, and less as time went on until he got to none. Also heard the "unfolded wallet to deaden snare" from my dad, who was a musician in the mid 60s to mid 70s.
The smack stack sounds like a Simmons clap from the 80s to me. Finally a way to emulate that electric sound acoustically.
And let's not forget the "set your ride cymbal insanely high and (nearly if not exactly) 90 degrees to the floor" fad. Tried for about five minutes one day, and that was that... 👍😗
Never really been a fan of clap/slap stacks before, but after hearing your tone, I'm completely sold! Just beautiful!
None of these really do much for me, but I appreciate the innovative spirit. We wouldn't have hi-hats if it weren't for that. Who knows, maybe I'll like dead-muted toms in five more years.
I used to use the flipped rack Toms (a la Anika Niles) and used a popcorn snare as the high snom. It was a really fun setup that I only stopped doing to get used to shared back lines for gigs
I got into drum restoration/building a while back and ended up with about 6 different kits. At the time, I was in a band that gigged regularly and there was nothing more fun to me than first, deciding which kit to bring (my jungle kit with the converted floor tom bass; the Ludwig Vistalite "jellybean" kit; my custom-wrapped band-name branded kit, etc.) THEN deciding if I was going with a traditional 3-piece set-up or something with an offset tom or adding a snom, etc. THEN I also got to decide which cymbals I wanted (loud and bright, dark and "quieter"; how many stacks; riveted ride or 24" Oriental Crash of Doom, etc.).
Experimenting with set-up is a great way to improve your coordination (things aren't where you've gotten used to them, so you have to build new muscle memory and maybe even change up how you play certain fills, etc.) and give yourself a fun challenge.
You're playing has definitely improved 👏
Great vid, Nate. When I put my kit together, in my zeal I bought multiple ride cymbals trying to find the one I liked. And then I just tried them on both sides of the kit. multiple rides... doubt it becomes a trend, but like multiple hats in the 80's/90's (replaced by the trash stack today), but it's definitely fun opening up opportunities to strengthen my off-hand by 'riding' on the wrong side of the kit.
@@SashraanMusic thank you for that. Great insight. Since I play traditional grip and am a rank amateur with a weak off hand, just using the 2nd ride for accents in trad. Hi-hat grooves is a lot of fun. Mine is a 20” paiste rude crash/ride which is much darker than my 900 series 22” ride. Great contrast in bells,etc.
Drums are so much fun this way
I've got 4 dedicated rides on my kit 😂 and I just recently bought and fixed a sweet cracked 20" Zildjian projection crash. It's so heavy, I think it works better as a ride than a crash, so that might be number 5 🙄🤷♂️
@@Pure_KodiakWILD_Power Brilliant! My real problem is splashes. I WANT ALL OF THEM!
@@ThomasLuongo 😂 I hear that.... I have a ton of cymbals and stacks on my kit, and they all sound different. If I had the room, I'd probably have all the tom sizes, too....
I love the sound of the hidden stacks, I have often wondered how they achieved that sound, so it is great to know how they did it. Thank you for that insight. Zach is a great drummer, and I enjoy the sounds he gets on his kits.
With the deadened toms, I actually like that sound but I don't want to tape things to my drums so I will look at alternative ways to get that sound.
The groove you did on the segment with detuned snares in place of toms was really spicy. All the grooves you played were really cool. Thank you for the transcription.
I think the smack stack sounds amazing, and I do believe smack stacks are here to stay. While everyone may not use them, I believe they will be around for many years to come.
Thanks for the great video and useful information Nate.
I love the lazy work arounds to older tricks that took a bit of thinking to make it work or sound good
Tips for using smack stacks, tighten the wingnuts cause they solidify the sound of the stack. Also,with the snom or deep snare position it between your left rack tom and your floor tom. This coming from a kid who’s met JD, Cleon, and Mike and knows them all to well
sorry your right rack tom
I used to have a rack tom on the right some 15 years ago because I had my ride centered. Man I loved that setup.
Elephant gym's drummer Chia-Chin Tu plays with a snare in the place of a high rack tom, you can see it in their audiotree session
i have a rather unsual setup myself. i play the bassdrum on the left with lefty double pedals. tucked in Hi-hats feet with a bassrum clamp. like this the bassdrum doesn't interfere with the toms setup. my toms are super close to each others and i have a nice reach. i have more space for my cymbals as well. so, instead of having the 10 in front of me i have the 12 (even slightly on the left). 16 floor tom is right on the right of the bassdrum. but it becomes more reachable as it is more at the front. so comfy. everything is packed tight and easily reachable. i'll never go back to conventionnel setup.
I used to put a piece of paper sometimes on my snare, when I first started on my westbury kit many years ago. It sounded fat and didn't ring at all. Kinda found it from putting my written sheet music on it. Awesome video!
Same here. 1978, 4th grade, first year of learning snare drum. Probably the first day I took it home. Seems like a natural instinct for any elementary school concert band drummer.
Hey, I did #3 when I was starting because some fills were too fast for me to move between the high tom (in the traditional position) and the floor tom... back then I didn't even know there was a "right" or "traditional" way of positioning the rack tom 🤷♂️
Nate, Well done as usual. After experimenting with playing open handed for a number of years, I bought a cable high hat and place it in between the rack tom & the ride. Game changer.
Great run through! The hidden stack, I love it. Not fully convinced by right skewed rack toms, unless toms are down prioritized in orchestration. Seems you get lots of torso rotation/ asymmetric ergonomics. Keep up the great vids!
Def not first overall, but first ‘snom’ video I saw was Larnell I think on Drumeo.
And he got it from Sput
I am not a kit drummer but noticed the smack stack being a staple of Nate Smith’s arsenal, and I am here for it. *subbed*
Used to use paper on my drums way back!! Multiple sheets most of the time!
The paper trick could be fantastic in the studio, I have a favorite set of crappy old kitchen aprons that absolutely nail the Ringo "tea towel" sound, but are big enough to cover my 16" floor tom and have built in tie downs!
Hey first time I saw one of your videos. You mentioned your "beloved Brady". I live in the town that Brady Drums come from (Perth, Western Australia) and I too have a beloved Brady snare drum. Mine is a she-oak (local timber) block 14 x 5.5. I got it about 15 years ago,
I mean...kudos to Zack but Benny Grebb is doing that for years
And Robert Searight
@@Rudare916right. I'd say less consistently though
@@decaftundra idk. The first time I saw him use it was 2012.
The set up that works best for you is what matters most
The trend that works best for me is daily practice and discipline
That trend will never go out of style
It would have been nice that you should have mentioned the inventor drummer Trevor Lawrence of the clap stack is where it started and then companies started to make a version of it with there brand and so it grew from there .....
I think some things are great from an odd sound aspect, but I also think that some of the trends are people trying to make the odd noises that we used to have on electronic kits way way back. Cymbal stacks are to me something that Terry Bozzio started, and have stuck. Love the white noise sound of them, and I use two old cracked cymbals (one old china, and an old hi-hat) as a great smash! AS far as some of the other objects, It's just a way to make an odd sound, and not a mainstream way of doing things... whatever floats your boat. MY issue is the trend of the cymbals with holes in them! I've tapped on them at drum shops, and see nothing musical about them! I LOVE the sound off a cymbal that has a tone to it, not a cymbal that has 10 holes in it, and is dead! Drum tuning will always be a personal thing, and to each his own! Great video, thanks!
One thing I’m glad I started doing was setting up my drums in a different array for every show
Nice video, always interesting so think of different ways you could setup. I live in a large city and space is almost always limited, ideas are good. Also, Nate, your playing is now just getting better by the minute! I’ll try to pinpoint what I’m hearing : it’s more articulation, intent, so your grooves, fills, solos have more definition and clarity. Very cool!
News Paper was often used in the studio, mainly in the 50's. Good for a few tracks and then will need replacing. I would be interested in hearing different tunings on Diplomats.
While it's a nice way to open up non-jazz drummers as to what trends are going on there, as for drumming as a whole, my verdicts would as such:
The hidden stacks: Trend, mainly as it's accessible enough for the drummer that can buy their own gear as it really depends on experimentation and preference. That, and stacks as a whole is more common nowadays where companies have been selling stacks as a whole instead of you finding each individual cymbal for your stack.
Well, the Max-Stack can have the same applied. It's more common as it's a unique sound and sometimes front and center.
Odd-Tom Mounting: Fad, mainly because it purely comes down to the drummer. It's definitely more common amongst experimental drummers, but there's trade-offs with this. It might get more popular later on, but for drumming as a whole, it's definitely niche.
Toy-Toms: Fad, mainly because it's very niche and a very specific sound. Approachable, but it's too specific of a sound.
Snoms: Fab, mainly because of its usage being very niche. But, I definitely would recommend Thomas Lang with his setups and him converting a 14" floor tom to a snom for that big thudy smack with the snare wires turned on.
And, with all of these, these fads can eventually become more common as a lot of these are experimenting with the set, with some creating that unique sound/usage as I know I want some stacks and a snom for my set (and a mounted bass drum to act similar to a gong drum/play bass drum patterns with both hands and feet). But yeah, thanks for the video!
Simon Phillips would be rolling in his grave with the dead toms 😂
Haven’t listened to your playing in a while…DANG - you are improving quickly, in my opinion. That lick at around 4:30 was fat and meaty at the same time.
Made me think of and old trend of the floor toms that you could pitch change like a timpani. Also I remember that low muted sound was pretty popular in the early 80's.
Will Kennedy and Abe Jr. have been doing some really weird shit with drum positioning too.
13:32 He looks ecstatic!
Evans EC2 for the dead tuning... I had it and didn't even know it was a thing. The G2 resonate more... my 2 cents
The dead tom thing used to be a necessity when I was 13 playing in bands. Except, I jammed clothes or bed sheets inside. Think of it as a glorified laundry drum.
Dig that quick decay. Like your playing. Hardy harrr….
Smack stack's basically emulating good olde drum machine "clap" sound... that's at least what I gather from it :D
How about floor toms left and right, no toms up top? Really makes you need to switch leading hands but opens up some different ideas.
As far as the muted drum sound. I like to use cotton fabric laid under the drum head across the bearing edge and tighten the head over it.
I've decided to drum open handed, thanks to Sput Searite and Louis Cole. Moved my ride to the left, and my crashes to the right. Such fun!
SNOMS are absolutely not a fad! 😎
As long as it works while using other people to inspire creativity, then I'm all for it. No big harm but rather a benefit to drums and percussion overall.
I've been playing around with the Purdie setup lately, high tom being on the right side of the rack. It's definitely different but fun to keep things fresh!
I also tried the Purdie ride cymbal up high over the hats but it's not for me. It's fun to experiment. We'll never know what might work for us without trying it. Like two 16 crashes as hats and two bass drums, a 22 and a 20 because I have 3 standard drumsets. It cost nothing extra to experiment but that's rehearsal, I haven't gigged with this.Its a different thing.
another fad I’ve seen is drummers putting a small cymbal (maybe and fx or china? ) underneath their regular hihats, making for a slightly more trashy hihat sound altogether
definitely feel like we’re circling history and getting back to that “traps” sound the modern drum kit was born from
I actually do that ;)
I switched my rack toms around, putting the 12" where the 10" would be, like Bill Bruford and really dig it
Got a remote hat on the right side of my snare, operated with my left foot, because I was too lazy to learn to play left handed and didn’t want to cross over. Then sent my toms trailing to the left. Folks thought I was left handed.
I think any acoustic approximation of electronic drums is infinitely novel. Definitely want a meinl smack stack..
But have you tried the PST X DJ's 45 Hats? Daru Jones 12" interchangable hats but when you close them it sounds like that exact clap (Swiss cymbal as the top, black cymbal as the bottom). I have them right next to my regular hats. They are different cuz your foot has to create the sound, not your hand but its crazy how close they sound. You should try them out
I use Roots EQ pads on all my drums instead of paper. They’re made out of fabric so they don’t break, and they supply that super dead 70’s vibe. V cool stuff 🤙
The hidden stack thing is something Benny Greb has been doing for over a decade 😂 (also a Meinl artist)
The smash stack at 10:00 should be renamed the Pringles Stack. Because it looks...like a stack of...Pringles.
Snoms...meh. I love toms and one can get scads of sounds out of one well tuned snare. I wouldn't want another snare lower ruining the tom sounds i adore, but rather piccolo and popcorn snares over on the left taking over no tom positions with tones substantially different for little melody things as I'm not just a drummer but all around musician and song writer and singer. I dig stacks, but as you I'd prefer a set of traditional cymbals with a couple of stacks one somewhere right and the other left. As Neil Peart and Danny Carey are two of my favorite drummers I dream of a kit with room for all the options, but it's perfect for my present training level to stick to the 4 piece Ringo style, Max Roach, Gene Krupa, Buddy Rich traditional kit with a few trashy things mixed in.
The drum kit has the most diverse collection of instruments in the whole of the world of music at least in acoustic instruments. While music lives and breathes and calls our names to the party the search for new, or old but so long forgotten they're new again sounds never ends. I dig the adaptability of the drum kit for the space to try out all these ideas. Hand clap sound with acoustic instruments, hey why not? I just don't want a whole kit of snare drums cause I love the tom tom boom the most of all. I mean, the Peart Carey idea includes a gong drum in the right rear position...YEAH! and a real gong too! I dig that kind of thing. And then some digital pads, pedals and things cause I love the galaxy of different tones those drummers get from one person playing lots of objects.
I really dig diverse sounds and I really despise the use of backing tracks in 'live' music outside karaoke bars. Thus the options I dream of one day bringing into my kit so, like Carey and Peart I play or trigger the start of every prerecorded decoration, nothing fundamental like a bass line ever prefab so that it's actually live and not just humans miming to a robot master.
I'm like you, I play (jazz) on a Breakbeats 4-piece and 2 ride cymbals, but I do like LOOKING and hearing weird set ups. Whatever works for people. I like JoJo Mayer's current kit set up for Nerve.
I’m def trying the hidden stack!
The muffled toms are reminiscent of the cardboard box sound of the 1970’s
How about putting tone controls back into drums to get all that dead? Most of us have used snares as Toms at some point, anyone ever used a Tom as a Snare? I converted my 14" FT into a deep snare! Does anyone still flip their cymbals? Chain on their Cymbals and Hats?
I use a 12" wuhan china combined with a 10" K splash stack and it does work great to mimic a hand clap type sound on the upbeat sometimes, as well as working in quick trashy accents for fills.
1: If you want a short china like attack with less sustain, and you don't want the classical overtones of a china, it works. It's a good idea.
2: Commonly used in reggae since the 70'es. Not a "new trend". I don't personally like it, but whatever floats your boat, I guess.
3: Not a "practical" set up if you want to use your toms freely, but it adds more space to cymbals, stacks and percussion in an easier accessible position. A lot of drummers don't use a lot of toms, so for them I guess it's okay. Not for me.
4: I don't see how a drum that's obviously not a tom and obviously not a snare could have any place in a kit. I don't like the sound of the snom and I don't see any practical use for it. But it is a flavor, just like the stack cymbals or the cymbal/tom stack. I personally hate it with passion.
5: Smack stacks / clap stacks are cool. I see and understand the implementation and the use. I think / hope they're here to stay. I usually don't like the sound of Meinl cymbals, but that stack that you have there sounds really good. Thumbs up!
Conclusion: These "trends" or "fads" are often just personal preferences - like spices and herbs in your food. Some of them might be a little too inventive for the masses, but everything that can bring some extra life or flare into your drumming is good - if it's used musically.
The muted toms is totally the Jojo Mayer, the commercial version is probably Big Fat Snare Drum open centers for the toms. i have them for even a Bonham kit.
Hey what snare you using
With skins brand and type of snare strand ?
Very nice 👌
Benny Greb has done the hidden stack for years now too
have you seen the snare set up for the West End (UK) or Broadway pit of Hamilton musical? 5 snares.
Snares off on the snob = killer
Daru Jones has the craziest setup around
#1: 👍🏼 #2 :🫤 #3: 👎🏼 #4: 🫤 #5:[I would use a sampler pad instead]
In section 1, are you using a 20” crash with an 18” crash underneath, or is it 16” on bottom? Thanks!
Your studio's drums sound nice with the paper mutes. Just sayin
Snoms are here to stay! Smack stacks? Not sure
Snoms will definitely be around as long as people are playing acoustic sets.
Try nr2 with the paper on the snare and do 80s pop songs......
i made a snare/tom once when my friend took the snare without telling me, and i still wanted to play drums. i had an extra snare wire and duct taped it to the bottom of one of my two rack toms, and it worked great. so, yeah, i would do that again, but literally only out of necessity.
never calling it a fucking snom, tho, that shit is silly.
A left and right ride cymbal is a necessity if you want ambidextrous freedom.
I liked them all apart from the snom, thanks for the great work.
what hi-hats are you using? they sound great
#2 Ringo and the Tea Towels, nothing new.
Man everytime i play and other drummers see me, they get confused as fuck
Im a righty, but i set the drums as a lefty. Hi hats get played with my right hand, snare with left hand, but cymbals (minus hi hats) are setup as a righty
That, and i like to get an extra floor tom to the right of hi hats
Oh yeah, bass drum with left foot - give it a go big pimpin!
What is your snare? It sounds awesome
you do know that this stuff is all about training the brain to pathways and patterns. In other words, it's not about most efficient or effective, it's about a learned pattern. As artists we focus on what works for us in our expression.
Hey, what about the third hi-hat cymbal, i mean second bottom, like Mr Spaven described in Nova video?
8:50 not the hippest drummer, but Joules Scott Key from Metric has had effectively the same set up since 2001 and I just don't get it. sometimes he has a sampler where a high tom would typically be for their newer stuff, but for the longest time he just didn't have anything there. and he still uses three cymbals. I don't get it, but to each their own I guess
Choppin' out...
I LOVE TREND 1!
guy with a cymbal endorsement trying to sell stacks, AKA buy two cymbals for the function of one
You should do the daru Jones set up
persosnally i love snoms
Aren't SNOM's just a new name for an old idea, namely Ballad Snares?
Man I'm cool with 4 on the floor, ride-crash-china-splash.
interesting. i prefer the sound of the toms better with the paper taped on. if someone wanted to keep it like that, they could experiment with taping the paper to the underside of the head
Would be interesting to divide the clap stack into a hi-hat and see if it sounds good loose and trashy. Idk. I don’t have one