Ok, second rant incoming: The worst thing with Clive is that he's the symptome of NAMCO's greed. It has become so obvious that the devs want to sell more games. They want new players. Fine, that's understandable. But the way they're trying to get them is not by making a great, balanced game, but by giving newcomers a *clearly* _'cheap and easy'_ character. We've seen this since Leroy - Fahkumram days and even before. Remember Bob? Every release of a new DLC character is basically with some broken overpowered moveset. Clive is no exception. There's *no* reason for a character to have a full screen, mid mid heat engager that's also safe on block (f1+2). Not only that, he has *TWO* ; a 13-frames mid *safe* heat enganger (1+2). And this is just on top of all his other cheapness. Like a full screen powercrush with pushback so half the cast can't punish him (b1+2). Tell me how that's ok? How did the entire team of devs not think that's broken? It's because he's designed to get new players by being cheap, easy and overpowered. NAMCO has clearly shown us that they're willing to put out a game-destroying broken character in order to sell more. And that's the biggest issue here.
What are you rambling about, Clive is a cool character and tekken 7 had a FF character so it's not as if it came out of nowhere. Ff16 is far from the most popular FF and if you watched the dev docs you would see both teams have a lot of love for him. Clive is strong but he's not giga broken and the other 3 dlc have been mid tier to weak. If they wanted to sell games they could have made him way stronger or used a more popular character.
For me he's just too noisy visually. There's so much fire and lightning and flashing stuff covering the players during moves. It's hard to see what's going on
Bound, heat burst bound, heat dashes, and massive wall carry in compact stages make combos way WAY too long in this game. I hope season 2 reinvents heat dashes - either by removing their use in combos, removing all heat dash launchers, or by removing heat dashes altogether and rolling out an install mechanic for all characters instead. They're way too boring.
I think he only needs three nerfs: Making 1+2 -10 oB F1+2 either: -10 oB or obliterate the tracking on the second hit, this is supposed to be a whiff punish move not an option select in neutral. B1+2 nerf the pushback (see previously mentioned point). He's weaker at range 0 for sure but not as weak as he should be for all the strength his has at range (and his ease of being able to get to said specialist range). I don't mind him being strong or this different archetype at all per se, but give us an actual weakness to exploit. If 1+2 is punishable, he has less tools at range 0 and now it gets into more of a fair fight and dynamic.
Gotta disagree with you on somepoints phidx Playing with patience and movement has been a cornerstone of tekken since the beginning nothing wrong with that. People wanna speed the match and play single player and not every character has to play like that But f1+2 should have its tracking nerfed. There’s nothing wrong with defense and making the opponent actually have to think though.
I agree, Clive kinda forces some interaction from his opponents. My suggestion for F+1+2 is make it 1 hit with recovery animation(similar to Heihachis B4) and track maybe 1 side or even make it linear while keeping it safe at -8 on block.
First step with tuning Clive should be to make F1+2 and 1+2 unsafe and the armor not pushback so it can be punished. Personally I'd make 1+2 -14 ob and F1+2 make the second hit of F1+2 not come out if the first one wiffed, but also -12 ob.
-14 is too much. Just make like the other moves that are the same. Knockdown and -10. Also you cannot kill the character, all you have to do is make f1+2 linear. Also tune down the pushback in d1+2 and b2 shouldn't have all the options guaranteed. That should be enough
1+2 being -14 would be insane, its a worse version of kuma reina heihachi 1+2 which are all like -10, and doesn't knockdown. F1+2 should be -12 and have the push back in neutral where if you are against a wall, you are getting wall splat punished, but you can't parry after or move.
Just removing the tracking on f1+2 and the pushback/weird blockstun on b1+2 would be enough to make him balanced. Nerfing the frames on his safe moves just seems like a bad idea since he already stays at minus frames way more than most characters.
1+2 is completely fine as - 9. His close range is not that good, df1 is 14 frames with duckable string and it's mid string is completely punishable. 4 strings are 2 frame faster but also punishable. Every other move except b1+2's range and f1+2's tracking is fine and after that if it's still not enough nerfs nerfing parry's recovery would be enough. He also lacks good lows and has no high crush moves.
I totally agree that Clive should be allowed to be more aggressive. The reason you keep seeing f 1+2 is because the rest of his kit leaves him extremely minus. Clive should have more moves that are plus on block, that way he can play more aggressively rather than constantly playing keepout.
It’s so cool to see Knee after months of practice displaying so much expertise and optimization. Unfortunately Clive doesn’t really care that much what you’re doing. Just too much control.
i admit, his animations are sick asf, and i think hes cool. but hes just far too easy for how strong he is. theres no reason one of the easiest, if not THE easiest character can absolutely shit on most other characters that require more thought/skill to play. i feel this way in any game. harder should be more rewarding/better. easier should be a bit worse, but less taxing to learn/play.
When you sum up Clive's most powerful moves, he's not winning much by mixing you up (unless he's in heat). He prefers to get you to play the game, and then he punishes you for it with control options (f+1+2, parry, orbital, 1+2) By playing defensive, he invites the opponent to attack and interact. This is more effective than attempting to win damage with db+4 or d+1 alone. He'd rather interrupt you with 1+2 or clip your movement with f+1+2. He cannot aggress like Dragunov or Jin or Feng because-outside of stance and heat-he does not generate the same frame advantage and stacking advantage states. Exceptions for d+2 and db+4, although his "blow you up options" are notably not as advantageous as Drag WR2, Jin EWHF, or the partial string mind games that Drag and Jin have. Bryan is a defensive character for similar reasons, except he gets more rewards from CH specifically. Clive gets tons of reward from normal hit as well, but benefits a lot from remaining conservative with the move timing (again, outside of heat+stance). If you try f+1+2 and 1+2 on immediate timing every time, you often don't win the damage race because you keep giving up your turn
@@TheBigEmstos He kinda is tbh. Don't confuse "defensive" with "weak" or "hard to play". He's actually a defensive character that somehow works well against the T8 aggression meta and is piss easy to play (compared to other defensive chars like Heihachi or Bryan). He lacks rushdown poking tools and the pilot is required to understand spacing and movement to fully utilize the character. He's seen as an "aggressive" character because he's a relatively new character and most people don't know how to deal with him.
Clive has so many cool moves and its a shame that 2 of them are so good their invalidating them at the top level. Its weird saying this but I hope he gets nerfed so we can see people actually engage with the character.
As a Clive Player, f 1+2 tracks WAY too much and makes his other moves pretty redundant. PhD 3+4? Why put yourself at risk of getting hit out of it when you can just f 1+2 to the same effect. wr 3? f 1+2 tracks AND wallsplats so there's very situational reasons to use that. I don't think it should be unsafe, but it should definitely be sidesteppable
I picked the worst time to try and pick up a new main (who isn’t Clive). Absolutely abysmal online matches against 90% WiFi Clives. I dunno, maybe I’ll end up the better player for it after he’s balanced, but it’s miserable going out there to fight online right now.
Personally I think a lot of issues people have with Clive will be fixed if they simply made F1+2 unsafe. Other than that I think he’s fine. He has clear risk reward on his attacks and people who don’t take the -9 on 1+2 just need to learn about his frames.
While it does feel like Clive is playing Tekken 7, that's not exactly it imo. It's how strong his tools are and the range control. He can play a really disgusting offense while breaking game logic like yoshi. The only difference is that he has a lot more range.
He's similar to Bryan, but launches on normal hit. He's similar to Bryan, but has a 50/50 mixup. He's similar to Bryan, but start-up frames a better. He's similar to Bryan, but people are afraid of mashing against him cause of his parry, even when it's not his turn. He's similar to Bryan, but can be sidestepped and his range is crazy. So, is he really similar to Bryan?
I love clive, ff 16 is my fav ff but I need them to balance him, he is too overwhelming, most casual players want to turn off the game when they see clive.
I imagine the zan meter is gonna need a buff when the other nerfs come for Clive. Zan builders dealing 100% recoverable damage is such a huge flaw to have in this game, even if cashing out a level 2 bar deletes that grey health. I can't help but notice your notes only list one zan meter building thing, and we see mulgold use it zero times this match
Clive is a a char for the majority of the player base, im so sick of spammers, no matter the char, its just not fun having to deal all the time with the same broken shit. I dont even get how can a person get incentive enough to keep playing when they r only doing the same shit game after game. Players r turning the game into trash, we cant blame it all to bandai, although they r obviously the ones that give ppl this options, they got the money and they will keep getting more, nothing to worry about for the company. Clive might be the obvious representation of it but, as u said, he is not even top 3, there r chars from the very beginning that still works like that and ppl is abusing them even in quick play, so keep complaining while u support this policies.
With all due respect Knee lost here becuase he didn't know the matchup well. He has 2 moves that needs nerfing but he's not op at all and it's just a matter of matchup knowledge.
f1+2 definitely needs some type of hit (either make it slightly more unsafe or more linear) but i also suspect clive is the direction they're gonna take the game in season 2 for better or worse, more emphasis on movement and chs again instead of the button heavy style of season 1 and better access to damage on those big hits
Feel like if they just made it track less then it'd solve a lot of the problems that move has. That move should NOT track like it does when it does almost everything else.
@@HawkTeevs yeah i think it'd go a long way just to make it more linear, in theory the move does make sense with the rest of his kit especially if you keep the weakness of having bad small tekken intact in future updates
Sad seeing specialist character players that actually work on optimizing every little bit of a character lose to a pro picking the character up 2 weeks ago and beating him...
Me playing Clive against normal players: using most of his moveset and build up Zantesuken to win with it Me against people who only attack spam or try to do the same flowchart moves: f+1+2
I don't play Clive but what's the big deal with f1+2? It's just another demon paw type move that many other characters have. Jin, Kaz, dvj, Bryan, Lee...
It's safe... you can't side step it... it literally tracks... demon paw doesn't... it's instantaneous... barely any frames to get it to come out... the range is insane... the list goes on it's a stupid move
Clive actually not so good, in close distance, too risky moves and high rewards play style, make him to obvios to punish, for average tekken enjoyers atleast, but for pro players uses him carefully, and they now how to punish characters cuz know matchaps.
i love ff16 and i hope they nerf him so i can play him of clear conscience but i feel if you take away how busted f1+2 and 1+2, are what does he have? all his small tekken is really punishable, and i also think they need to do something about his phoenix stance mixups, he can easily spam mixups and feel like a nuisance
@@arvinsim I agree with you entirely, hence why I suggest they look into changing up his odin abilities a bit and making them more viable. FF2 is probably one of the most interesting moves in the game but I rarely see it get any use in higher level play
Even if 1+2 and F1+2 are nerfed, there is still the option of B2 (safe long range high) which on hit leads to multiple guaranteed moves in PHX stance. Since one of the moves available is a Heat Engager, this effectively makes B2 a Heat Engager too.
Clives problem is that he is a sword character..... they are almost always zoners by nature and they bring the type of range that other characters cant compete with... very easy for pros to turn that range into pseudo plus frames and pressure
I don’t regret buying the game as i put stupid amount of time into it while having fun, but i’m also not touching it until season 2 drops, because playing against 20 Clives in a row is everything but fun. Even 1 is annoying.
im enjoying these yaps
I enjoy the enjoyers
i enjoy you enjoying the enjoyers😏@@PhiDX
Ok, second rant incoming:
The worst thing with Clive is that he's the symptome of NAMCO's greed. It has become so obvious that the devs want to sell more games. They want new players. Fine, that's understandable.
But the way they're trying to get them is not by making a great, balanced game, but by giving newcomers a *clearly* _'cheap and easy'_ character.
We've seen this since Leroy - Fahkumram days and even before. Remember Bob? Every release of a new DLC character is basically with some broken overpowered moveset.
Clive is no exception. There's *no* reason for a character to have a full screen, mid mid heat engager that's also safe on block (f1+2). Not only that, he has *TWO* ; a 13-frames mid *safe* heat enganger (1+2). And this is just on top of all his other cheapness. Like a full screen powercrush with pushback so half the cast can't punish him (b1+2).
Tell me how that's ok? How did the entire team of devs not think that's broken? It's because he's designed to get new players by being cheap, easy and overpowered. NAMCO has clearly shown us that they're willing to put out a game-destroying broken character in order to sell more. And that's the biggest issue here.
What are you rambling about, Clive is a cool character and tekken 7 had a FF character so it's not as if it came out of nowhere. Ff16 is far from the most popular FF and if you watched the dev docs you would see both teams have a lot of love for him.
Clive is strong but he's not giga broken and the other 3 dlc have been mid tier to weak. If they wanted to sell games they could have made him way stronger or used a more popular character.
"He makes it look so easy." Thats because it is bro. Clive is by DESIGN easy.
Do you think Clive lacks "sauce"?
he is so easy to pilot it’s kind of boring to play him honestly
@@circa2008I find Sword Chars in Tekken a littel bit unfair because of the Range, hope we get a new Soul Calibur this where Swords belong
@@AljoschaW1993yeah at least with yoshi he doesn’t hit you from a mile away
I love your take. I played enough T7, I don’t want to play that game anymore.
Clive Smith
This game fuckin blows. They killed Tekken and the world is worse off for it. Love the yaps though Phi keep it up.
im having sooo much more fun on the older tekken games rn, wild how boring t8 gets after a little while.
Keep in mind Ulsan couldn't beat Clive with Drag. He had to resort to clive. That alone kinda proves clive is easily top 5
Knee's Tekken is a sight to behold.
Clive however.. lol
VF6 has never been more needed
buy VF5 R.E.V.O in the meantime 😉
Insane dragg lmaoo but yeah I feels
But they're planning to make VF easy tho????
VF is even more aggressive than Tekken. And people will be complaining about "stolen" rounds due to ring outs lmao.
@@wulf8889I feel like they gameplay are lot more basic compared to tekken. So It’s wouldn’t be hard to get into
🎉
For me he's just too noisy visually. There's so much fire and lightning and flashing stuff covering the players during moves. It's hard to see what's going on
Had matches with Clive, Lars, and Alisa last night. Was nearly nauseous with how the screen was flipping around.
Exactly, animations and particles so over the top
clive is easy, we should nerf devil jin
🎀
grab him
😢
Clyde 😡
Here to leave an emoji 😅
What is the input for Clive’s guard break
f+2,2>1
@ Thanks. Keep up the good content bro.
f2,2,1
I love these Phi, keep them coming 😎👍
Professional yapper PhiDX
Commenting for the algorithm even though I hate Clive.
❤
🐑
Hi phidx
8:07 Q: so what did mugold do?
A: hes using the new cheap dlc character..
15:18 ayo?
Clive looks sick maybe I'll come back to Tekken 8 after all...
He will get nerfed, or the game is ruined imo
Bound, heat burst bound, heat dashes, and massive wall carry in compact stages make combos way WAY too long in this game.
I hope season 2 reinvents heat dashes - either by removing their use in combos, removing all heat dash launchers, or by removing heat dashes altogether and rolling out an install mechanic for all characters instead. They're way too boring.
Why do "people" say (kill,dead)in knock out situation?
Why did "you" ask a stupid question
@michska53 because I'm mentally ill,and getting triggered by that all the time
what an awful character, bring back tag2
I average about 3 uninstalls a week
15:25 noice
!
He's extra easy.
I think he only needs three nerfs:
Making 1+2 -10 oB
F1+2 either: -10 oB or obliterate the tracking on the second hit, this is supposed to be a whiff punish move not an option select in neutral.
B1+2 nerf the pushback (see previously mentioned point).
He's weaker at range 0 for sure but not as weak as he should be for all the strength his has at range (and his ease of being able to get to said specialist range). I don't mind him being strong or this different archetype at all per se, but give us an actual weakness to exploit. If 1+2 is punishable, he has less tools at range 0 and now it gets into more of a fair fight and dynamic.
1+2 not being punishable fucks up my brain, it's Hei 1+2 but safe.
@@alondjecktoand you can use it from crouching...
@@alondjeckto Yes but no, Heis is 12f and wallsplatts and nets you 58 dmg in WI.
Agree man 100% I like Clive but the f1+2 the way it is, it’s too dumb
INSTANT CLICK love the vids phi when’s the next Steve video tho 😼🤨
I can’t wait for VF6!
Pls giveaway arcade stick
15:19 I could hear it but I was like please don't pause just ignore and keep movin it along
But the pause did make me cackle
i have not buy tekken 8 yet since it's still dumb af balancing wise. why not bring back every character to tekken 5 vanilla state at this point?
Gotta disagree with you on somepoints phidx
Playing with patience and movement has been a cornerstone of tekken since the beginning nothing wrong with that. People wanna speed the match and play single player and not every character has to play like that
But f1+2 should have its tracking nerfed.
There’s nothing wrong with defense and making the opponent actually have to think though.
I agree, Clive kinda forces some interaction from his opponents.
My suggestion for F+1+2 is make it 1 hit with recovery animation(similar to Heihachis B4) and track maybe 1 side or even make it linear while keeping it safe at -8 on block.
Cliff Holifield
Claude Rosberg
Clyde Hoffman
Idgaf I‘m clapping that fool green rank to GoD
First step with tuning Clive should be to make F1+2 and 1+2 unsafe and the armor not pushback so it can be punished.
Personally I'd make 1+2 -14 ob and F1+2 make the second hit of F1+2 not come out if the first one wiffed, but also -12 ob.
-14 is too much. Just make like the other moves that are the same. Knockdown and -10. Also you cannot kill the character, all you have to do is make f1+2 linear.
Also tune down the pushback in d1+2 and b2 shouldn't have all the options guaranteed. That should be enough
1+2 being -14 would be insane, its a worse version of kuma reina heihachi 1+2 which are all like -10, and doesn't knockdown. F1+2 should be -12 and have the push back in neutral where if you are against a wall, you are getting wall splat punished, but you can't parry after or move.
Just removing the tracking on f1+2 and the pushback/weird blockstun on b1+2 would be enough to make him balanced. Nerfing the frames on his safe moves just seems like a bad idea since he already stays at minus frames way more than most characters.
1+2 is completely fine as - 9. His close range is not that good, df1 is 14 frames with duckable string and it's mid string is completely punishable. 4 strings are 2 frame faster but also punishable. Every other move except b1+2's range and f1+2's tracking is fine and after that if it's still not enough nerfs nerfing parry's recovery would be enough. He also lacks good lows and has no high crush moves.
probably 1+2 -11 ob, is better, also history shows that people tend to forgot that x moves punishable ob after nerf, so it has its use
I totally agree that Clive should be allowed to be more aggressive. The reason you keep seeing f 1+2 is because the rest of his kit leaves him extremely minus. Clive should have more moves that are plus on block, that way he can play more aggressively rather than constantly playing keepout.
10:55 this part killed me lmao
love ur content phi, keep it up
🥰
Now all the losers will cry for dumb nerfs instead of actually good changes so the character can still be good but not dumb
That mid string is fucking annoying, he can carry you to narnia
It’s so cool to see Knee after months of practice displaying so much expertise and optimization.
Unfortunately Clive doesn’t really care that much what you’re doing. Just too much control.
i admit, his animations are sick asf, and i think hes cool. but hes just far too easy for how strong he is. theres no reason one of the easiest, if not THE easiest character can absolutely shit on most other characters that require more thought/skill to play. i feel this way in any game. harder should be more rewarding/better. easier should be a bit worse, but less taxing to learn/play.
Never thought i hate a character more than t8 Xiaoyu, but Clive proved me wrong.
My girl need buffs
The only language the community knows is upset lol
This comment section is why none of you are in fg dev
>spends life of T8 defending defensive options, defensive play
>defensive character comes out
>somehow needs nerfs🤷🏿♂
how is clive a "defensive" character lmfao. dumbest thing ive ever seen
Clive is everything he is not only a defensive character Mr. Dowplayer.
When you sum up Clive's most powerful moves, he's not winning much by mixing you up (unless he's in heat). He prefers to get you to play the game, and then he punishes you for it with control options (f+1+2, parry, orbital, 1+2)
By playing defensive, he invites the opponent to attack and interact. This is more effective than attempting to win damage with db+4 or d+1 alone. He'd rather interrupt you with 1+2 or clip your movement with f+1+2. He cannot aggress like Dragunov or Jin or Feng because-outside of stance and heat-he does not generate the same frame advantage and stacking advantage states. Exceptions for d+2 and db+4, although his "blow you up options" are notably not as advantageous as Drag WR2, Jin EWHF, or the partial string mind games that Drag and Jin have.
Bryan is a defensive character for similar reasons, except he gets more rewards from CH specifically.
Clive gets tons of reward from normal hit as well, but benefits a lot from remaining conservative with the move timing (again, outside of heat+stance). If you try f+1+2 and 1+2 on immediate timing every time, you often don't win the damage race because you keep giving up your turn
@@TheBigEmstos He kinda is tbh. Don't confuse "defensive" with "weak" or "hard to play". He's actually a defensive character that somehow works well against the T8 aggression meta and is piss easy to play (compared to other defensive chars like Heihachi or Bryan). He lacks rushdown poking tools and the pilot is required to understand spacing and movement to fully utilize the character. He's seen as an "aggressive" character because he's a relatively new character and most people don't know how to deal with him.
@@merkyofaycemfx2944 Clive is easily the lamest and most shallow character in the game also
boy... if you just knew whats gonna happen in winner finals..
Knee miss some -14 punish. It seems he is playing clive online these days.
Clive has so many cool moves and its a shame that 2 of them are so good their invalidating them at the top level. Its weird saying this but I hope he gets nerfed so we can see people actually engage with the character.
Prince Caspian is OP.😊😅
As a Clive Player, f 1+2 tracks WAY too much and makes his other moves pretty redundant. PhD 3+4? Why put yourself at risk of getting hit out of it when you can just f 1+2 to the same effect. wr 3? f 1+2 tracks AND wallsplats so there's very situational reasons to use that. I don't think it should be unsafe, but it should definitely be sidesteppable
This is the same guy that said Clive wasn't S tier...
🕋
I picked the worst time to try and pick up a new main (who isn’t Clive). Absolutely abysmal online matches against 90% WiFi Clives.
I dunno, maybe I’ll end up the better player for it after he’s balanced, but it’s miserable going out there to fight online right now.
Clive is a broken character....which leaves his opponent with no chance to retaliate. One wrong move, you are dead. 😅
Clive cannot retaliate at -8(F1+2) or -9(1+2).
So basically, Clive is carrying Tekken 7 spirits in Tekken 8. It's a win in my book!
Personally I think a lot of issues people have with Clive will be fixed if they simply made F1+2 unsafe. Other than that I think he’s fine. He has clear risk reward on his attacks and people who don’t take the -9 on 1+2 just need to learn about his frames.
I am only a purple rank reina and have nothing of value to add to this discussion here is my obligatory emote 👺
While it does feel like Clive is playing Tekken 7, that's not exactly it imo. It's how strong his tools are and the range control. He can play a really disgusting offense while breaking game logic like yoshi. The only difference is that he has a lot more range.
He's similar to Bryan, but launches on normal hit.
He's similar to Bryan, but has a 50/50 mixup.
He's similar to Bryan, but start-up frames a better.
He's similar to Bryan, but people are afraid of mashing against him cause of his parry, even when it's not his turn.
He's similar to Bryan, but can be sidestepped and his range is crazy.
So, is he really similar to Bryan?
Because of clive I am on complete break from ranking matches, makers should nerf clive asap before it kills the game
F1+2 tracking should get nerfed but someone actually managed to side step it somehow when I was playing online.
The regret in phi’s face at 15:21 after what he said got me weak LMAO, poor choice of words unfortunately but i see what you sayin😂
Phi as professional commentator?
I love clive, ff 16 is my fav ff but I need them to balance him, he is too overwhelming, most casual players want to turn off the game when they see clive.
I imagine the zan meter is gonna need a buff when the other nerfs come for Clive. Zan builders dealing 100% recoverable damage is such a huge flaw to have in this game, even if cashing out a level 2 bar deletes that grey health. I can't help but notice your notes only list one zan meter building thing, and we see mulgold use it zero times this match
Clive is a a char for the majority of the player base, im so sick of spammers, no matter the char, its just not fun having to deal all the time with the same broken shit. I dont even get how can a person get incentive enough to keep playing when they r only doing the same shit game after game. Players r turning the game into trash, we cant blame it all to bandai, although they r obviously the ones that give ppl this options, they got the money and they will keep getting more, nothing to worry about for the company. Clive might be the obvious representation of it but, as u said, he is not even top 3, there r chars from the very beginning that still works like that and ppl is abusing them even in quick play, so keep complaining while u support this policies.
With all due respect Knee lost here becuase he didn't know the matchup well. He has 2 moves that needs nerfing but he's not op at all and it's just a matter of matchup knowledge.
f1+2 definitely needs some type of hit (either make it slightly more unsafe or more linear) but i also suspect clive is the direction they're gonna take the game in season 2 for better or worse, more emphasis on movement and chs again instead of the button heavy style of season 1 and better access to damage on those big hits
Feel like if they just made it track less then it'd solve a lot of the problems that move has. That move should NOT track like it does when it does almost everything else.
@@HawkTeevs yeah i think it'd go a long way just to make it more linear, in theory the move does make sense with the rest of his kit especially if you keep the weakness of having bad small tekken intact in future updates
his small tekken isnt bad enough to warrant this kit@@floral2970
IT should be linear or it could keep the tracking but becomes slower like i19
Sad seeing specialist character players that actually work on optimizing every little bit of a character lose to a pro picking the character up 2 weeks ago and beating him...
yea clive is not top 5 he is top 1 xD
literally isnt
Me playing Clive against normal players: using most of his moveset and build up Zantesuken to win with it
Me against people who only attack spam or try to do the same flowchart moves: f+1+2
I don't play Clive but what's the big deal with f1+2? It's just another demon paw type move that many other characters have. Jin, Kaz, dvj, Bryan, Lee...
R u stupid?
It's safe... you can't side step it... it literally tracks... demon paw doesn't... it's instantaneous... barely any frames to get it to come out... the range is insane... the list goes on it's a stupid move
Clive actually not so good, in close distance, too risky moves and high rewards play style, make him to obvios to punish, for average tekken enjoyers atleast, but for pro players uses him carefully, and they now how to punish characters cuz know matchaps.
Riiiiigh, so like, Knee?
Cope
CLIVE IS THE FRAME PUNISH KILLER!! He was put in this game to undo the devs mistakes by making him the worst version of tekken 8 and i love it 😂
i love ff16 and i hope they nerf him so i can play him of clear conscience but i feel if you take away how busted f1+2 and 1+2, are what does he have? all his small tekken is really punishable, and i also think they need to do something about his phoenix stance mixups, he can easily spam mixups and feel like a nuisance
We'll have to experiment and find out! 😁
@@PhiDX Hopefully they lean further into Odin abilities, current Clive doesn't quite favor using them and getting that phat zantetsuken
If a character only has 2 viable moves, then it's a character design problem.
@@arvinsim I agree with you entirely, hence why I suggest they look into changing up his odin abilities a bit and making them more viable. FF2 is probably one of the most interesting moves in the game but I rarely see it get any use in higher level play
Even if 1+2 and F1+2 are nerfed, there is still the option of B2 (safe long range high) which on hit leads to multiple guaranteed moves in PHX stance. Since one of the moves available is a Heat Engager, this effectively makes B2 a Heat Engager too.
Season2 when man...
I like fighting clive tho as leroy 😂...
His gameplay is simple
We have t7 at home
Clives problem is that he is a sword character..... they are almost always zoners by nature and they bring the type of range that other characters cant compete with... very easy for pros to turn that range into pseudo plus frames and pressure
when specialists fight a an easy designed character, is what tekken 8 right now in general because thats what i see most of the time
TBH clive makes regret me buying tekken 8.
I don’t regret buying the game as i put stupid amount of time into it while having fun, but i’m also not touching it until season 2 drops, because playing against 20 Clives in a row is everything but fun. Even 1 is annoying.
Bro Phi your analysis has gone a step above of late 🙌🫡 was always really good but there’s just something better about it somehow 🙌🙌
If LTG sees this video he will yap the hell on why Clive is not a top tier character and just spam power crushes and grabs
❤