📢 Battle of the Sixes - What's the best inline 6? | MASS DEBATE
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- Опубликовано: 7 июл 2024
- Everyone's got an opinion right? For this Mass Debate we invited Adrian from Summernats and Kristian from Goleby's Parts to debate the topic of six cylinder engines - which one's the best and why?
Although this debate focuses on the usual suspects - Nissan's RB, Toyota's JZ and Ford's Barra, we also discuss some other, less popular sixes. Enjoy:)
What's your favourite six cylinder engine? Let us know in the comments section!
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I really don't see how "taxi engine" is anything but a compliment. Yeah shit, my engine can run for a million kilometres before needing a rebuild, poor me.
And I can find a replacement at any wrecker. And I can get spares at every servo, parts store etc...
Also,
-> two of these blokes are in the business of supplying the barra with aftermarket support
-> votes barra down on aftermarket support
Self roast?
we love the Barra. Kristian's love for the JZ clouds his objectivity though LOL
@@haltech No question! And of course we all thank you for contributing to the Barra aftermarket. I can get behind love for any inline 6, JZs and RBs absolutely deserve respect. But I think we agree in Australia, the Australian designed and made Barra is pretty unbeatable...
I really want one in the states, but we’ve got iron block LS truck motors found in all the fleet vehicles, so it doesn’t make sense to spend money trying to source a Barra. Still I’m a Inline 6 guy, and would love to get my hands on a big cheap 6 with a turbo.
Am I only one who see Beavis and Butt-Head here ?
No you're not. The only one with the brain is the guy in the middle !
And most likely the one that has had actual physical contact with the opposite sex
@@davwatto77 I'd say he's had physical contact with many!
He said bottom end.
Huhuhuhuhu hey Beavis
Mass-debate
Mass-Debate... I lol’d
Me too :D
Didn't mention Massey Ferguson MF 8600 4 valve six cylinder T2 engine.
because it was a bunch of wankers being filmed
Lmao. I had to check comment when he said that. Wasn’t sure what I heard.
Myself 😭 😭 😭 😂😂😂that accent doesn't help with it 😂
All great engines, barra is the new torque king , you can see how they both get very defensive when the barra is mentioned, its called fear.
Fear the 2jz is the king in every way,the barra is a open deck block the head is soft as butter...and are slow in top end runs,it's funny to even compare the 2 engines.the experts will tell you ford boys the jz is just better but you dreamers never listen funny as,
@@definitionmedia1130 the dynamite funny car u saw in this video is running the stock head u idiot. over 2000hp. the 2jz cant go over 2000hp without billet block
Barra, has proved itself across the board, no other 6 has, ever!
...look up the 6 cylinder engine that was used in tanks.. with a little stacking tho.. :-)
(Ended up with 30 cylinders combined)
Your on meth for sure
This video was brilliant! Definitely want this to be a series! As an American I love learning how you power mad Aussie maniacs think/do things.
Edit: Can you do more of these for other engines, power-adders, fuel types ect? This was so entertaining! Keep the same 3 blokes too (well maybe add some Tuning Fork)
As a built GTR owner, have to say the Barra is one of the best motors, they would be there battling for 1st place. They may be a little heavier, but they produce the torque to back it up. 1000nm of torque with a boost and tune on 98 on a FG motor. My GTR is still sitting at around 650-700nm. Barra produces more torque than most V8s today, they are just super responsive motors. Cant go wrong with them, lots of Americans are starting to import these motors from Aus and swap them into Mustangs.
This was really well paced. I'd love to see more of these
i feel like you guys should have some beers up there with ya, make if feel more like a kick back conversation
We are not opposed to this
*lemon squash
@@haltech fuck it might as well put a BBQ in there too
I have a 1jz and a 1hz but my dream 6cyl is a common rail Cummins!
pyrosrockthisworld same!
Barras are by far the most reliable and cheapest
Josh Baker $150 for a wrecker lpg barra engine, add valve springs and cams = 545rwkw
Not only that they will do it for 100s of thousands of kms too
@@nordic5490 you forgot to mention power adder, that'll blow out your $150 buy a couple of bucks....
Not everyone lives in Australia or New Zealand.
Heavy asf compared but great engine
Great interview and response from both guys 💪🏾
Two jdm fan boys too biased to see how good the Barra really is 💪🏼💪🏼
lol "it blows the tyres down the track" "dyno queen" ,thats a load of bullshit. he never heard of traction control and such.
The statement "Aussie is always better" is the definition of bias lol
Ruger33333 no, that’s ignorant
Best comment on here, spoilt little rich jd brats, no fukn idea beyond their realm
1st - being a taxi is a compliment means low maintenance high reliability.
2nd - Barra comes in a heavy car yes and the 2jz started in a Aristo which weighs the same as Falcon
3rd - The JZ series was developed by Yamaha
4th - The high powered JZs are Billett blocks of a yamaha design full of aftermarket parts.
5th - A 3.7 litre Barra block made 2200hp ATWs. No billet, no yamaha needed.
6th - "Blowing the tyres of it" means lots of power/torque.
7th - "keeps tyre shops in business" means lots of power/torque.
All the shit-talk about Barra’s, but at the end of the day, the XR6 Turbo is ALWAYS gonna have the torque and power to win a street race
The rice cookers are great, but good luck on the straight 🖕🏼💀
Great discussion!!! And awesome video!!!
Barra engine is one of the most underrated engines there is you guys bag it as much as you want but means they will still be around for the ones that want them. The amount of Barra swaps happening now prove that they are being used for motorsport and street now as well. They are proven in drag and in drifting. The benefit of the barra is it's solid and they have simple bolt ons and can make great power and still be reliable.
Haven't seen a single barra swapped car in US yet.
Supraman I’m ordering an engine this week from a shop in Clyde it will be going in a foxbody mustang I will start doing vids when I put the order in and when I receive it
@@txgunreview3598 Nice. Subscribed.
Took the words out of my mouth
Simon Millar Exactly
Christian the JZ fanboy lost the debate and a good deal of my respect when he said "Only slow cars go around corners." If reliability were the only criteria, the JZ might edge out the RB, but these engines were not designed around straight line drag cars. Toyota has never made a chassis anywhere near the GT-R's capability. For it's time, the GT-R was a true exotic lightweight supercar and it's racing success is legendary. Even with it's AWD and HICCA rear steering systems the 1994 R32 was 300lb lighter than the Supra. Sure, having a low revving cast iron block may improve it's ability to handle more power, but a heavy low tech engine doesn't belong in a winning GT car. In all reality, peak HP is a poor measure of an engines actual performance. Where the engine starts making torque and power, how flat the power curve is, and how long it continues to make power all ads up how fast a car is in a given application. Another massive factor is the power to weight ratio. The 840 horse Challenger SRT Demon may pull a 9.7 quarter-mile on 100 octane race gas and drag slicks, but 600+ HP R34 GT-Gs are doing that on pump gas and street tires. Then beat the snot out of a BMW M3 on a road course. All that on a 20 year old platform.
@Jeremy Robertson The R32 was introduced in 89, 94 was it's final and highest iteration before the R34. It was not designed specifically for Bathurst, rather it was for Japanese JTCC Group A series, FIA Group A and Group N touring. In fact, in 1991 the 2JZ was produced in an attempt to compete with the racing success of the RB26DETT, but failed miserably in the attempt. The R32 was totally dominant for three years before regulation changes excluded the GT-R in 1993.
I agree, for a drag car the Barra is a beast. Able to make over 2000hp on a stock block and cylinder head. what WHAT!!! Another in a long line of sick shit we never got here in the States. :o(
I think you may have the attributed of a 4WD vs AWD reversed. Nissan defines their ATTESA (Advanced Total Traction Engineering System for All-Terrain) as a four-wheel drive system. The E-TS (Electronic Torque Split) version in the R32 doesn't use a torsion gear transfer case like a traditional full-time 4WD, but rather uses an active center clutch, similar to the Porsche 959. It has the ability to vector as little as 15% power to the front diff, but can adjust to a max of 50:50 as needed. Tomato Tomoto I know, but I'm just going on Nissan's terminology for their equipment.
@Jeremy Robertson I know Australia has developed some great stuff for racing. I have a Datsun 1600 (called the 510 here in the states) that has an SR20det swapped in it. I'm running it on an Aussie Link G4 ECU. I helped build an R32 for my brother that also has a Link ECU and a bunch of PPG transmission upgrades. All of it top notch.
Well I double checked and according to Dennis Gorodji's book Nissan GT-R: Born to Race. the chief engineer of the R32, Naganori Ito, designed the car around Group A racing regulation, and it was further developed for racing at Fuji. The R32 GT-R dominated JTCC from 1989 to 1993. Although it gained most of it's "worldwide" fame there, the R32 wasn't introduced into Australian Touring Car Championship racing until 1990. Even then it was late in the season only helped the R31 take the championship. I don't know when it's first Aussie win was, but it didn't win the Bathurst 1000 classic until 1991. If you have other sources that differ, I be grateful to see them.
Thanks,
Ron M.
@Jeremy Robertson Good on ya mate. I grew up in San Diego and my first car was an old 68 510. Loved that little car to death and from then on I've been hooked. I've had a few over years, but the one I have now is my magnum opus. It's an open class autocross/solo race car with a licence plate. I'll paste a link to a few videos of it. They import lots of JDM motors and tranny to the states and there's lots of aftermarket support for the SR20 here. I got mine from a Canadian company and have built it up over the years. 330hp and stripped down to it's bare essentials. Very tight well sorted little pocket rocket with no indication of what's under the hood. Best part is, nobody suspects it can do what it does. Insane power to weight ratio and pulls 1.18 lateral Gs on soft street tires. This much fun should be illegal..
I've heard folks are just as crazy for them down under. Lots of great aftermarket parts being made for them both in AU and NZ.
ruclips.net/video/GZtp6PiFlTI/видео.html
@Jeremy Robertson We get the same whole front clip from Japan, but there are wrecking yards in North America that break everything down to sell and shipping off the individual components. When it's all said and done they scrap the shell then on to the next. They make more money and the consumer doesn't have to deal with half a car sitting in his driveway. I got the complete motor with all the peripherals, the trans and the upper and lower harness. Having to clear a space for all that motor, everything else was useless to me. In fact, because N American cars are LHD I wasn't able to use most of the stock turbo setup, because the steering linkage is in the way of the down pipe. I had to go top mont, but I'm not complaining, I love the look. Literally the only thing under the hood that's still stock is the POS wiper motor. It's there more for nestalgia and to cover the hole than anything else. Last year I replaced the crappy stock steering box and linkage with a custom built front crossmember and a Toyota MR2 steering rack. This tightened everything up and corrects all the bump steer geometry issues from lowering. Holy mother of god what a difference that made. Instant response, no negative feedback, and zero play in the wheel. Almost feels like I'm cheating on my wife. Check out that vid and click the "More Info" button. gives a list of all that's been done to the car. Are you still turning the spanners these days?
@Jeremy Robertson Hey Jeremy, My brother's GT-R is all turned up and on the road. Thought you enjoy this.
ruclips.net/video/fFIJwWuchOI/видео.html
You have for gotten the Atlas I6 4.2/3.5/2.8 and the AMC/Jeep 4.0/4.2 I6 (they are heavily raced in ACTC at 9000 rpm)
These guys really are Master-Debaters! Good content....
We used that name for our schools podcast
I run a built Toyota 1GRFE V6 that is boosted and managed by a Haltech elite 2500. Nice little combo for the street...
L28 carby at 9000rpm, not fast but the sound 👌
S20 with webbers
DATTO Z FTW
L67 Gen II Buick with ZZ Performance upgrades ...lol
bloodzkull might as well thrpw in the OS giken twin cam head...
L28 was fuel injected. Had one in my 280zx
265 Hemi
Hugh Jazz get it right mate,265 HEMI slant! Wtf has slant got to do with it?!!!!
A great motor in it's day. Probably the best pushrod six ever made.
As far as n/A six’s goes its one of the best
245-265 by far the most bulletproof
Oooooo I love a good mass debate!!!!
For old school low tech I enjoyed my old M20 in my E30. Tapped a fair bit and wasn’t massively fast, but had a good note to it and took a beating.
People are gonna look back at this in another 10-15 years and laugh, the Barra will be as prolific and as sought after as the 2J.
Most people in US (car enthusiasts) have never seen or even heard of barra. 2Js on the other hand, have been around for 20-30 years.
USA is land of the 2jz there everywhere here... rb.... not really
Barrack is just making its rep to the US
@@codyparker679 the gc8s are belting barras they have no top end it's all down low,the jz top end king
S58 out performance all of them
I was a big RB and I adore the 2J but I want the Barra in a mustang :-)
If I had the KAZILLION Dollars to get a couple of Barras to the U.S. - I WOULD!!! 😁😁😁
Barra Fox Body! FTW
Adam LZ has done just that..
@@tearorangimorgan3019 It's now my favorite sounding mustang and I'm angry at ford for not making this a thing
0:00-21:49 all in all, Barra wins. Thank me later
My 4.9L Ford 300 is better than the Barra due to cam gear and oil pump driven by gear, Barra is evolution of the 300
Barra wins hands down
XR6 Turbo dreams are free but JZ is better and always will be 😂
Monster5o I disagree
Barra’s makes more power for less boost and less money, have great torque, and are cheap as chips
I mean give someone a Barra, a 2JZ, and 30k to spend on each. The Barra would then wipe the floor with the 2JZ on drag day, and all with less aftermarket support.
In my book, that makes the winner quite obvious... but either way I love all three
being a mark 3 supra fan and owning multiple i was already thinking the 7m was the worst inline 6. I literally laughed when you guys said it was the worst haha. great stuff haltech and keep stuff like this coming.
I had a MKIII Supra with the 7M-GTE engine. When I bought it the head gasket had been changed. The crank pully fell off but was fixed thanks to JB Weld. The engine itself was OK once those common problems were fixed.
Mercedes m104 and bmw m50. Those are the unknown jewels.
Sshhhhh.......
I was literally fishing through here hoping someone said it.lol
M50b25 is a tank
don't tell em bro, keep them for the people who know about them.
M50 unknown? Not here in Sweden! Its the go to for everyone, to a point were they are starting to get expensive and People are starting to look for M54 instead.
Look up GZ Racing on youtube and you can see some Swedish project. ☺️
There are many cool 6-bangers out there in many configurations; I like them all in their own way!
One 6cyl engine (and car) that I'd really like to experience/own is the Audi RS4 B5 wagon, with the AZR 2.7 V6 30v Bi-Turbo engine. In the case of RB, JZ or Barra (to stay on the L6 topic) ; I'm not in any fan-camp - so manufacturer / model/type/configuration etc doesn't really matter. However; Reliability & engine+car character would be the biggest decision-factors for me, if money wasn't an issue (sad but true: money is an issue for me, but I'm working like a devil to solve that bit ;) )
Thanks for the video Haltech! Informative and entertaining! :D
This comment wins the internet for us today;)
2JZ all the way for me. Have you guys done one of these on 4 cylinder engines? if not you should.
I just bought a 1JZ for a swap into my HR Holden. This video just gave me goosebumps!
I love both the JZ and RB series of engines, both very iconic and beloved, but let's be honest here, out of the two, the JZ engines are far more reliable and produce much more power than its RB counterparts.
Ehhh I wouldn't say that the JZ is more reliable than the RB the issue was the ceramic turbine in the turbo was the main issue but that was an easy fix as well as the oil pump but you could replace both for around $400 but if you're trying to push power you're most likely going to replace both as well as most other parts. The main reason that the JZ can push more power is that is has a larger displacement then the RB and the only JZ's that do that are the 3.0L compared to the 2.6L RB26. I love both but comparing the power output of both is kind of stupid since one is already set to be able to hold more power plus ones AWD and the other is RWD so in turn if were going stock v. stock the RB is going to win since it will have a better traction from the very start. Both are really great engines and when tuning them it all comes down to how much money you want to throw at them to get high power cause even if you tune both to over 1500hp your most likely not going to get more than 5 runs out of the engine before you have to rebuild it.
@@Thebaconmurderer huh? the oil issues? and oil pump collar ? oil not returning from the head? i’m hearing the 1JZ with stock bottom end can push more power reliably then a stock rb26
RB series is my favorite straight 6
I think they're all good, use which ever fits in your car easiest and you have availability for, cubes definitely help no doubt
Yes! You didn't forget the Hemi six! Love the noise they make 😀😀
#barratheworld
If only! I want 2 or 3 for a few projects.. Crown vic, fox body and a ranger..
7mgte can be a good engine. It got a bad rep because Toyota screwed up the head bolt specifications so they blew head gaskets. But 7mgte with arp head studs and eagle racing parts could produce very respectable power. I own a 7m, the day I got it I took it apart and rebuilt it 😂 been running pretty good ever since 😁
amen to that!
Theres 1000 hp plus 7m. Every engine can be a "powerful" engine. The 7m like the ej20 and 25 have that legend that they come broken from the factory bassically lol but not all are broken. Like rb engines not all have oil issues etc. People over exadurate on things and a legend is born!
2jz ge is much much worse than the 7m
@@Fedethedangerous95 please explain?
@@Fedethedangerous95 The 2J is better designed, has more power, torque ,reliability and availability. what makes this motor worse than the 7M?
I love the way he says mass debate
There are a lot more good inline 6s than just those three.. like the M50, m52, m54, s50, S54, S38, m104, om606, TB48, N54, B6304 and probably much more.
I would not rank m52 up there but otherwise I agree. Especially m50 and m104
The S52 definitely belongs up there though. Euro engineering is simply superior.
@@ThaJay nein nein nein, not really ... but certainly german engineering is! :)
If nothing else - just for the sound. BMW 6s are just incredibly sonorous - even the 2l.
thepowerof9b lol why the M52 is forged internals
From factory what many people don’t know the M50 is famous of his iron cast block the M52 is the same way people think its not well it also depends on witch nation the engine was made us of Germany
I do love my rb25 combined with the gt3076r turbo tho...
To me, 1jz is the best sounding. 🎶
not going to say its a good motor but it may help others running one as am i - the 7m is missing a water gallery passage from the block to the head on the exhaust side of the block it forms a hot spot on the block and cooks the head gasket and head above it normally cly 5 and 2 on the outward sides closest to front and back easily fixed by drilling into the head gasket and block 3mm hole to copy the intake side of the block (ive done similar with 7age conversions and its been 100% fine) , the head has 100% compatibility with this mod as it is meant to pass water there!! as standard the cooled head and the hot block under it unable to pass water just creates a pretty bad temperature difference ive got a warped block here and melted expanded head gasket in this exact location on my old engine to prove it (also the GE cranks are mostly 6mge cranks and not really balanced well compared to any 7mge or gte stamped crank so if u lookign for a good 7m start there with one thats running the 7m type crank as 6m had bad harmonic my last 6m cranked one ate the bores out)
I like the EZs from subaru. Compact design, 5v per cylinder. Main issue is they need a lot of work and parts to make good power reliably and the after market just isnt there yet.
i like all 3 of these motors but im a bogan so its barra for me, tho i agree with pretty much the whole argument
You only have to read about the RB to know that it has its weak points compared to the 2/1JZ engines, AND this is coming from a GTR/RB fanatic! Doesn’t mean I’d rather own a Supra or even want a 2JZ in my car. I’ll always love my RB, some people will say it’s junk but I’d say it has charisma 👍😊
Lol im so biased in the comments haha still love my RBs but the 2J is the better option for reliability.
My rb26dett is still runnning not a single thing fone wrong with it makes 280kw. My friends 2jzs bearings failed it was surposed to be more reliable then my unreliable rb26😂😂
RBs are shit and a pain to make reliable but they sound nuts and come in all the good cars
@@gokuman63 280kw lol and I've heard of a couple rare bearing issues with the jz but I've raced them for 10 years hard to get a better motor that will take the abuse
Most that love the RB and body it comes in is the AWD part.
The Ford Barra may be Large but damn she's a lovely inline 6.
Best mass debaters I've ever seen
Subaru EZ30D"R"
245hp 290nm flat six non-Porsche therefore cheap with Porsche designed valve train. Just don't try to get more power without boost, or expect much more with it, but it's a great engine, timing chain lasts forever, smooth, powerful and did I say smooth? So smooth you wouldn't hear it running if it weren't for the timing chain whine, and Subarus have gearbox dipsticks so they win at life.
Didn't they used one of those in MCM for the supergramps?
1G-GTE! If you want to hear a sweet sounding engine listen to 1G at 9000rpm... if you can find one
100% that's one of the most underrated sounding 6 cylinders. One day I'd love to get my hands on a gz81 with a manual, don't care if they break and make less power than the jzx they sound better lol
100% the 1G is the best sounding i6 out there, it has such a good tone compared to the rest of the i6s
There are some great v6s out there if you want a v6 with good sound the es9j4 from a peugeot 406 is a good one almost no aftermarket support but make a about up to 390 to 400 stock if you change injectors, fuel pump and retune, only problem is they were used mianly in front wheel drive applications for reference it is the same engine used in the clio v6 and peugeot early 2000s formula series cars if im not mistaken. and a diesel straight six td42 and a petrol bmw straight six s55 and the original gtr engine are also pretty good.
Inline 6’s are legendary but some v6’s still can make so power I own z32 3.0 litre vg30dett and I wish it had a RB26 but built the motor and with the haltech runs low 600whp the platinum pro gave it an update in drivability best mod besides 6 piston brembos. In North America my first fast car was my 1986 Buick Grand national with a 3.8 s.f.i turbo intercooler. That car made power but that’s power from the late 80’s. Australia was spoiled with all those killer JDM cars.
The RBs can kick rocks. They were barely reliable stock. The only reason ppl liked them so much is because they were in GTRs. The JZ and the Barra are better because they can the take extra power on stock components. And as far as the barra beinga taxi engine, thats the greatest complement you can give an engine. Keep your webo fanboy RBs and JZs. Give me a good old Barra. And this is from a Yank.
Lol what? Rb30's are hardly a weak engine. 600hp and 7500rpm with nothing more than rod bolts, I'd say that was pretty decent considering they're a 30 year old engine now. How much power do you really need?
@@matthewallison7604 im not saying theyre weak just unreliable when adding big power to stock blocks. The barra and the JZ can handle big power on stock blocks. The VQ can handle more power on stock components
@Kevin Pope anything over 550 hp is what i consider a big power. If youre running 700hp on the stock block and internals on an r32 rb26, im impressed. Good for you guy. I tend to over build everthing i do so im more biased towards the JZ and the Barra.
@@Turshin For reference, when it wss on a smaller single turbo, my Supra made 800whp (900+ crank) on a bone stock, unopened longblock. And I mean bone stock internals, down to the cams, headgasket, oil/waterpumps, etc etc.
How about Mercedes M103 ( 12 valve from 80's / early 90's ) and M104 ( 24 valve all through the 90's ) ? This seems to be a popular engine in Euro countries and somewhat in the US. Are there many Mercedes in AU?
Prettiest 6 is either the Alfa V6 or the BME inline from the E24 635CSi/M1. Nostalgia for me is the Jag XK.
Good conversation. Im a driver of a Barra Turbo, but like all flat 6's.
I wish Subaru learnt from their past builds and improved on things instead of making the ej25 worse in so many ways than the EJ20
i really think the om606 deserves a spot on the list, a diesel engine very comparable to its petrol counterpart, they sound amazing
@7:50ish. There's more aftermarket parts available for an RB... Because they need them. Gold. Comedy gold.
I'd guess a 2JZ style block (without its oil pump seal popping out all the time) just with RB bore-spacing and a RB head... But I'm a Volvo B6284 guy, so...
Personally, my favorite inline-six is the Cummins 6BT. A diesel!
Couple of reasons. Strong as hell, easy as pie to modify, simple, reliable, durable, massive stock power potential, stratospheric fully-built potential. Only downside is the weight, but the amount of torque they can develop can easily overcome the weight penalty on the straightaways. You don't stick Cummins engines in handlers, but to be honest, with any engine pushing 1K HP; you're not building a handler. There's just too much power.
I do love me some RB, Barra and JZ action, but they're the obvious answers to any inline-six debate. I wanted to do something different.
Never mind the lot of those, TB48 all the way!!
1fz
Do a 4 cylinder debate next
265 Hemi six, triple Webers, stage 3 cam. Now that is a nice noise maker!
jimmyjimmy19702010 Had one years ago. Open it up and all you you hear is induction noise. Magic
Up
Completely new to this series, quite enjoyed it though. What are the guys opinions on the Subaru EZ30 engine? Neither a straight or V 6. :)
EG33 is probably a better example. Based on the EJ platform with all the aftermarket support that goes with 'em. EZ's are just now getting the aftermarket support but they're just not competitive on the money side of things.
not straight or v, its a trash 6.
@@dillonbmx16 So why is any 6cyl engine that aint a straight or V trash? I'm genuinely interested in your basis here...
@@jamjar91 its not any. its subarus flat engines, mainly the ej257 and the slightly more stout ej207. major headgasket issues, and shitty pistons, cracking ringlands. this isnt my opinion its from experience ive done probably 15 or more engine replacements on subarus even stockers that have been taken care of. built two ej257s both were tuned by reputable companies and didnt make insane numbers one blew headgaskets, replaced both and used arp studs it cracked ringlands, built another a little more mild about 375 wheel cracked ringlands again.there have been many people trying to start a lawsuit because their 10k mile engine shits the bed for no reason. now some do work some last but theyre few and far between, if you use a good set of aftermarket pistons theyre good little motors but stock and stock modified theyre pretty shitty
@@dillonbmx16 I'm 100% agree with you regarding the ej205/257, I have the misfortune of owning a 257 as a daily haha. Just waiting for the ticking bomb. But I never see or hear much about the flat6 from Subaru. It was never available in my country as far as I'm aware, so I know little about it, was just looking for more info about them from people who might know more.
one honourable mention i think is VW's VR6 (which is technically not a V6) particularly the R32 engine. Gotta be one of the greatest sounding NA 6 cylinders. no idea how they go in terms of power/reliability, but have seen some turbo'd examples, so i guess that's something.
Overrated.
It still is a V6, the cylinder banks are at 15*. An inline engine is defined as having all cylinders on the same plane. In the 50's / 60's there was another narrow angle / single head V6. I'm pretty sure it was an Alfa Romeo.
They can't make power for shit, because of the con rod spacing being so tight the rods are much narrower and weaker (same on the veyron obviously) I think compared to the i4T they went from like 18mm down to 12mm or something?
Also the cylinder head port lengths are unequal which might not be a huge issue.
Its technically good for packaging even if the resulting block is a bit of a tub of lard and you can fit a turbo on 1 side which is nice but in terms or performance the things a turd.
@@bobroberts2371 not a v6 there's one head cylinders are aligned at angles
Number of cylinder heads does not matter. Some large truck 6 cly inline diesel engines have 3 cylinder heads. What would we call this?
As for the VR6, cylinders aligned at angles = V configuration. Despite VW calling it a V / inline 6 for marketing purposes.
Even though it's a V , the VW VR6 12v is a tank that can make gobs of power turbocharged. I own both Vr612v boosted, and N55. The 12v boosted is by far the best sounding 6. Done right, sounds just like a monster v8.
Lots of vr6 are pushing 600hp on stock blocks with just bolts, and rod caps.
Really with Ford brought those Bara I6 engines to North America would have been tons of interesting fun
What about the flat 6 that Porsche use . 500 hp naturally aspirated Porsche gt3?
Not an inline 6.
@@bobroberts2371 they only discounted the v6 not flat6. 4ltrs and over 550bhp n/a, 9000rpm and that sound. This debate is pretty retarded tho. RB or JZ. Both those designs copied from the BMW M88 DOHC I6. For reliability, power and availability though, the Barramundi is the only way to go.
@@pokinacha Boxers are great but they are a bitch to work on and get it right.
It's the same issue with the Subbie vs Evo guys. You can ask anyone who likes both and they'll all say that the boxers are way more tougher to get it right and even working on it is a massive pain in the nuts while working on an Evo is way easier.
pokinacha True, they didn't say inline only.
The BMW motor is similar to the 90's Mercedes 2.8 / 3.0 / 3.2 M104 ( 24 V head on a 1980's M103 12 V block ) I don't know what brand came out first. I'm pretty the BMW / MB share timing chains and valve springs.
The engine costs like $30K alone, it's in a league of it's own and I'd hope it produces at least that much power for that much money.
you just can’t kill a JZ motor though that’s the thing
Dump sand in it and watch it blow dump sand in a Ford 300 and watch it chug along and shrug it off
Another materbate on 6 cylinder engines!
Fyi You can still buy OEM Toyota Shortblocks brand new today in USA and Australia. Also justjap sells N1 and OEM RB26 shortblocks too..
Tb48t big power big torque sounds good
the 7mgte is underrated
Buy them now, swap out the head bolts then sell them later
What do I do if I like both jz and rb?
Have a stock r32 gtst, stock intake stock exhaust, even with the stock exhaust sounds good straight through factory muffler has great burble at idle, also have an aristo, daily’d it for years, sounds great, now amidst a big build, noise...jz still wins for me, but it’s close, the 20 sounds great.
The Nissan has its quirks mechanically, jz has less in my experiences.
Jdm>adm
The one guy said that Barra is “vanilla like a LS”, as if that’s a bad thing?
Being that I’m in the US, 2Js and RBs are rare (stupid expensive) and Barras are nonexistent. If I’m swapping engines into a car, it’s gonna be a LS. People can complain about “cookie cutter” and “everyone does it”, but there’s a reason. It makes reliable, durable power while being readily available, cheap, and have massive aftermarket support. A small cam can bump power 50-100hp. Adding boost turns them into a monster.
I bet if Yamaha made the heads for the 7M like the did for the JZ engines they would have been........well not just as good but close.
just swap 7m shims and buckets with new yaris shim-less buckets (same diameter) and you can put on it pretty big cam...
downside to 7m is their stroke (its just 2.0L pushed to the limit)
MrBigblock78 they did it’s called a jz
eXViLs - 8B008B that was the cool thing bout the 7m, it made excellent torque, more than the jz, its downfall really was the incorrect head bolt torque due to the change of head gasket material last minute.
Why is no one talking about the 1.5JZ?
wobbly sauce because it a jz???
epic mustache guy just doesn't have the same ring to it :( love the table flip tho!!!
Power and Noise 2JZ > Barra
Price and Availability Barra>2JZ
Engine Swap ability 2JZ>Barra
my Personal Favorite 2JZ
What I would go with on a Budget Barra (If I can't get an LS)
@5:50 Sure is nice having a 2JZGTE short block manufactured and assembled by Toyota Japan in 2022
Didn’t mention the 250 xflow
These fuckwits would probably say there shit because the cheap and last long. Two JDM fanboys, not worth listening to their opinions.
As much as I'm a blue oval fan through and through, the 250 Xflow has some major issues. The heads are prone to warping, if you have a timing issue you end up with a 3 piece cam shaft, the Welsh plugs are prone to failure, the list goes on... Drop in a "taxi spec" Barra and make some bow-tie fanboy cry.
S38 old school king
Michael D M88
@@yuye117 M88 is the original I guess.
S38 with a turbo is nuts. Makes 700 easy
@@alexstromberg7696 plus the sound is amazing
Nicknamed Big Six the legend of them all
I like all jz's and RB26 engines. The only thing with the RB26 is that there is not as many as the 1jz and 2jz engines out there. So for availability I choose the jz engine range.
Let's assume all things are equal.
And the Barra was as old as the others.
And the same dollars had been spent on r&d.
And the same development as in billet blocks etc.
From a factory new standpoint,
From a cubic inch standpoint.
From a completely non bias standpoint..
WTF? , Barra will toast both of these boat anchors !!
When a Barra or RB hits 5s let us JZ boys know.
As if mate...as if
@@Leviathan431 yeeeeaaaaaahhh naahhh
Of course, that’s why Nissan has put it in the 2020 GTR
Umm... the Barra is an even bigger and heavier boat anchor
What about the Mopar 4.0L straight six or the Cummins 5.9L?
I going to go with the JZ engines on this from a long engine strength stand point, easy 600rwhp on stock internals. Yeah, you can do that with a barra, but not reliably. For outright built engine, barra for the cubes.. im guessing none of the panel have ever heard a 3.2ltr v6 honda NSX with a full system, not much sounds better
Guess daily driving a 580rwkw stock internal Barra daily for 5 years doesn’t mean much
18:33 “and if it sounds like a v6, I don’t like it”
SMASH CUT
MANG MANG MANG MANG
That fucking got me
mercedes-Benz OM606 3,0 liter diesel and BMW M50
Send me Barras I need them in the USA
Lots of love for the NIssan RB engine, I've owned/built over 20 of them, I've also destroyed nearly as many! I've also owned a few Toyota 2JZ engines, never destroyed one 2JZ, the 2JZ is a much MUCH stronger engine. I think I still prefer the distinctive sound of the RB over the JZ however.
Definitely a couple of mass debaters.
RB!
If you haven't heard a GTV6 Busso, you are missing out on perhaps the best exhaust note from a sub 8 cylinder engine
Weight and size are valid drawbacks, 'race cred', and 'desireability', are not important unless you are making a show car.
Given the popularity recently and features by major youtubers the Barra aftermarket should get better.
Realistically it should end up being a DOHC L6 equivalent of a LS... Which is a boring swap (more interesting outside of AUS), but a solid swap.
12:23 "all torque" haha thats a good one
Aussies probably don't even know the glory of the B6304 & B6324 sixes from Volvo, amazing engines
None knows the glory of those engines, even here in Sweden people overlook them, but build a 2.9l t6 with 2,5l block and crank from the 3 liter have t5 turbo pistons, then you have a good engine.
Alex Strömberg Indeed! Generally the Volvo modular engines are fantastic. Even to the point of other brands using them in their cars (like the Ford Focus RS mk2)
@@Doogleraia the t5 is a very good engine, really nice for a 500 hp daily
Alex Strömberg 500hp daily is nothing special in 2018
Pitty they've shit gearboxes.
The barra is never going to be as good at the track. That big capacity and resulting huge lump of low/midrange torque will toast your tyres, and good luck going quick after that. The engine is also physically huge and still iron block, heaps of weight that is going to be both high up and forward of the front axles so whatever its in will handle like a bucket of snot.
The barra is going to be a much loved engine by the kind of people who only ever do burnouts and compare dyno numbers. It will go competitively quick at the drag strip with enough development. But it's not going to make its mark on any kind of racing that involves corners, and that in my opinion is why it doesn't compare to the Japanese 6s. The JZ and the RB are still jack-of-all-trades weapons of choice decades after their development, and I don't see the barra ever having that kind of ubiquity in racing.
@ChrisHallett83 Some power bands aren't reasonably controllable by your foot. You either go too timid and lose corner exit speed, or push your luck and roast your tyres. A V8 supercar revs out to 7500 to make about 600hp, and they still require short shifting to keep the rear end in check all the time. Good luck keeping a big lump of 600hp all at once attached to the road.
As for the iron block business, yes you are right. But those engines are pushing three decades old now, and reaching the end of their competitive lives. What does it say about the barra that it has to pick its battles with 30 year old motors?
they did well in gtp racing
Was going to write the same but found this comment. The Barra is a cool, cheap engine that is great for drag racing and burning rubber, but if you want and track car is way to big and heavy. The RB and the 1JZ is the best over-all-use engine that can to everything.
I don't mind the sound of the Nissan VQ-35/37 engines.
I've seen and even drove a fair share of liner sixes (Which I like to call them) and even knew a few guys who had amazing cars with liner sixes.
The RB series of engine are nicer to hear and they're easier to work with with the huge amount of aftermarket parts and it looks the nicest of all liner sixes in the general market. JZs are the real indestructible engine from Japan. Aftermarket parts ain't lacking too but you don't have to do much in order to get crazy levels of horsepower from it and it would easily bolt on to many other cars like E36 M3s or E34 M5 or those Mercedes W124 and hoon it around like what many Arabs do. Meanwhile, the most underrated one would be the Barra. It could hold crazy levels of power like the JZ could and also sounds as nice as RBs and are also pretty easy to get across Australia and certain parts of New Zealand and also can be damn easy to work on. HOWEVER, same as it's easy to get in Aussie and NZ, it's totally non-existent outside of Australia and NZ coupled with close to 0 aftermarket support outside of these 2 place AND an superbly old design.
The underdog would have to be a M54 from BMW. They make amazing sounds and can give decent horsepower if it just doesn't break down so easily by adding more power and the stupid Vanos system doesn't knock out.